Gary Stu
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You are currently reading a thread in /a/ - Anime & Manga
You are currently reading a thread in /a/ - Anime & Manga
Who else would be in this game besides this two obvious fucks?
Touma from Index.
>>119345137
From these season alone Kanya and Maybe the juice man, hes got his issues though
Would you, playing as either Gary Stu, be able to date the other option? This is important.
>>119345163
>>119345194
No I'm no homo
>>119345137
Chirico
>>119345163
Every fucking time. At least it's not OP this time.
>tfw no otome dating sim featuring mary sue
>>119345137
I already played it and all I did was stare at boys & ignore all the females.
>>119345173
The Juice has massive fucking emotional problems from what I remember, but his character design and how he acts from time to time would probably lead you to think he might be a gary stu.
But I think this guys deserves a honorable mention.
>>119345217
Now I've really lost it
>>119345173
DR CLAW
W-what about Shirou?
>>119345137
The one and only
>>119345325
Not attractive enough
>>119345276
>Hated by everyone
>Hitler
>Gets fucked up in every orifice
>Gary Stu
I don't think you know what a Gary Stu, faggot
toufag
mondaiji MC
ngnl MC
>>119345173
The VN bored me to death but I must admit he is an interesting MC and the girls are top notch. Maybe someday I'll finish it.
>>119345344
Well neither is Tatsuya.
>>119345348
but ngnl mc is a piece of shit without his sister
Totally this guy
>>119345360
>The VN bored me to death
get passed the common route spin the mouse wheel if you have to
>>119345325
Shirou has to many issues to be a Gary Stu. He's got plot armor and hax aplenty, but he's pretty fucked up to compensate for it.
Where's the webm of onii sama cleaning dirty gooks
dude from no game no life
Final Boss / Unlock
Rain
>>119345398
I did, I got to where Makina's sister almost dies or something.
Just wasn't in the mood for a VN at the time.
Anyone who thinks this is bait should be permanently IP range banned from /a/.
It's actually sickening that there are people here who not only don't understand that this guy is the worst self-insert possibly, they actually think he's an original character.
Do you autists not understand that all autists fantasize about being this autist? Everyone who wasn't popular sees themselves as the straight man and fantasizes about being dragged into social situations why wacky and eccentric people.
>>119345574
wait you wanna ban a character because you don't like him?
man, let me ban free threads then, i hate fujo scum
>>119345298
Does anybody have the updated one where all of the angels faces were also replaced?
>>119345173
He could be a contender if we took his issues to mean he has EXTRA EDGE.
>>119345574
This is a gary stu thread.
>>119345137
>>119345217
What is this based on?
>>119345605
No, I want to ban everyone who said Hachiman is an original and unique character.
I want to ban everyone who thinks that he isn't a wish-fulfillment self-insert.
You can like him only if you're able to see how dime a dozen and pandering he is.
>>119345137
>featuring dante from devil may cry
on a neptune gamestation im sold where can i preorder
>>119345668
newfag detected
>>119345614
A Gary Stu is a wish fulfillment self insert, and he's the worst one Japan has ever created.
>>119345660
You might have thought he was just a Gary Stu, but what you do not know that that wasn't even his final form
>>119345722
All Gary Stus are Self Insert. Not all Self Inserts are Gary Stus, you retarded moron
>>119345747
INB4 hes actually the soul king
>>119345722
>>119345574
8man isn't a Gary Stu. Gary Stus are self-inserts by the authors, and by default have to have the world centered around them. That isn't the case for 8man, even though 8man is meant for people to self-insert (meaning to put themselves in the MC shoes) he isn't a Gary Stu.
>>119345890
He is a self-insert by the author as well.
>and by default have to have the world centered around them
It does. The fact that you can't see that is bothersome.
Why can't you idiots understand THAT EVERY FUCKING LOSER IN THE WORLD SEES THEMSELVES AS THE STRAIGHT MAN? THERE IS NOT A SINGLE
>virgin
>autist
>unpopular guy
>asocial person
in the world who doesn't see themselves as a clever straight man surrounded by eccentricities?
He's the most low effort, bargain bin character you can find in anime. There are thousands of him out there, and he is made to pander and for self insertion fantasies.
>>119345699
YOU CAN GET THE LE FOR ONLY 200 DOLLARS MORE!
![[Triad]_Akagi_-_13.avi_snapshot_18.52_[2014.01.04_16.20.49].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/CChFDRp.jpg "[Triad]_Akagi_-_13.avi_snapshot_18.52_[2014.01.04_16.20.49].jpg")
Akagi
>>119345973
>>119345722
>>119345574
Seconding. Not saying i dislike him. But the fact people try to deny he's a cheap self insert for your average anime viewer bothers me.
>>119346601
He is Gary Stu done well.
Man I remember the Mahouka threads when it was airing and people were saying Tatsuya wasn't a self-insert or a Gary Stu
>>119346887
If anything in Mahouka I was self-inserting in Miyuki while chanting Sasuga Onii-sama.
>>119345574
Gary Stus are flawless. 8man has flaws
1. He's gross
2. No friends
3. Ugly laugh
4. Ugly eyes
5. Ugly hair
6. Rude
7. Selfish
>>119345137
Interested in Mahouka for the misaki bitch. At all worth it?
>>119345217
My sides
>>119346887
Not surprising.
SAOfags actually believe that Kirito isn't a Gary Stu.
>>119346973
Everything is worthless tease.
>>119347019
I think Kirito is pretty bad at MMOs.
>>119346963
You're making me embarrassed to be on /a/.
Everything you listed isn't actually a flaw. It's plays into his character type. He's supposed to be unpopular, rude, and friendless. That's the whole point of the wish-fulfillment. He's the straight man who's NOT LIKE THOSE OTHER PEOPLE, who marches to the beat of his own drum. He's what gross otaku idealize themselves as. His flaws are the Japanese equivalent of Hollywood flaws.
All this thread proves is the overwhelming amount of new kids on /a/ now.
>>119347044
This is a gary stu thread, not a self insert thread. Get that through your thick skull.
>>119347100
A Gary Stu is a self insert. You shouldn't use terms without understanding them.
![Kaze-no-stigma2[1].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/9VnuutY.jpg "Kaze-no-stigma2[1].jpg")
>>119345137
yes/no?
A Gary Stu and a Villain Sue in the same picture.
>>119347100
>>119347136
Also, you seem to be misunderstanding the main point here.
You seem to think that Hachiman is a self-insert, as in he's there for the audience to "relate to".
He's not.
He's a self-insert in the sense that he's there for the audience to fantasize about being. He's a perfect, immaculate character type. He is perfect in his own way, you just can't see it.
>>119347136
Are you retarded or what? Yeah sure Garu stu is a self insert but that doesn't mean that all self inserts are Gary Stu.
>>119347136
All Gary Stu are self inserts, but not all self inserts are Gary Stu.
>>119347143
Kaze no Stigma was the best, shame the author died.
>>119347158
see >>119347183
Again, people like you make me embarrassed to be on /a/. You don't understand the concept of Hollywood flaws.
>>119347136
Your definition is so broad it is meaningless. It's pretty common for the protagonist of any work of fiction to be the target of self-insertion by readers, regardless of how well they are written.
>>119347199
A gary stu has a set definition, 8man does not fit that definition. He's a self insert but not a gary stu.
>>119347152
Tatsumi had his ass handed to him too many times. Also,
>dead corpses
I think some of you are confusing a "gary stu" with the typical protag/self insert.
The gary stu is supposed to be awesome invincible liked/feared/lusted after by all and have the entire world bend to them in their way.
Yes even in ways that make them feel ways that suck, like angry sad etc etc.
Wishfulfilment period.
DA PINCHI
>>119345344
He definitely is in the current anime
>>119345574
8man is the kind of person who would complain about the MC of his actual favorite series being a Gary Stu in the first place but continue to read it because he's a giant faggot
>>119347244
>>119347228
>>119347214
>>119347196
You guys aren't really getting it, which is really sad.
You think that Hachiman is just some loser guy, so you're assuming that we think that "Gary Stu" equals "someone you relate to".
Hachiman is a Gary Stu in the purest sense of the word, in that he's a perfect fantasy that most people who watch anime in Japan fantasize as being.
>BUT HE HAS FLAWS
As explained above, these are Hollywood flaws that create the fantasy. If he were captain of the Judo team, he wouldn't be a Gary Stu. It's BECAUSE he's a loser that he's such a fucking perfect character.
>>119347143
Yeah defiantly a Gary, pity the author died before he finished it, I really enjoyed KnS
>>119347340
Yes, we get it.
Stu's oft have "flaws" that are just flaws that build the character up.
Flaws are no different from actual positives however.
>Tatsuya
>Gary Stu
Half the school hates and the other half wants to use him. Not even his own sister truly loves him, she's just obsessed with him.
How in the blue blazes is Tatsuya a Gary Stu?
>>119345574
>a character some actual people relate to is a Gary Stu ONLY because some actual good things happen to him
What exactly is Hachiman so good at in an unbelievable way, again, anon? Talking to girls while actually being a shithead?
>>119347375
If you get it, then it shouldn't trip you up that he's such a fucking Gary Stu, it's not even funny.
>>119347198
>>119347356
If an author dies halfway through a series, can another artist pick it up after they're gone, or is it in bad taste? Wonder what the copy write laws are like in area 11, would love to see it finished.
>>119347340
Holy shit you are dense. If he was captain of a judo team, the only way to be a gary stu is if you were an undefeated national champion that is still undefeated throughout the anime. Being a loser is not perfection.
>>119347199
Since when is being extremely unpopular a Hollywood flaw? His flaws are extremely negative in the real world, and while it's true that he's a self-insert for other outcast types, very few people want to be like 8man, and most of the people who tell themselves they prefer to be that way are only doing it as a defense mechanism and are usually in a lot of pain. 8man himself is in a lot of pain which is the actual point of the 8man as Batman scene and every flashback that explains why he thinks the way he does.
>>119347426
>Being a loser is not perfection.
YES IT IS YOU OTAKU FAGGOT
You don't want Hachiman to be a Gary Stu, because you're in love with him. That alone should let you know what a fucking Gary Stu he is.
He's a loser, yet he retains his dignity and doesn't embarrass himself by pining after the "normalfags" and their social lives. He's this incredible straight man who just wants to be left alone, but instead all the WACKY female characters keep trying to drag him away from his comfort zone.
He is an unrealistic, unattainable power fantasy that every otaku in Japan wants to be.
>>119347487
You obviously have not read the recent volumes
>>119347473
>Since when is being extremely unpopular a Hollywood flaw?
When the audience idealizes being unpopular.
But seriously, are you trying to be stupid? One person's Gary Stu might be a prince. Another person's Gary Stu might be a low-born man. Each can be a fantasy to different people. To otaku, being someone popular and well loved is a negative trait.
>His flaws are extremely negative in the real world
Not to otaku.
>very few people want to be like 8man
Factually wrong.
>and most of the people who tell themselves they prefer to be that way are only doing it as a defense mechanism and are usually in a lot of pain
Well, yeah.
>8man himself is in a lot of pain
And that's a Hollywood flaw. Being in pain is not a negative.
A realistic character is someone like Tomoko. She has no dignity. She is an absolute bottom feeder of a person, who fails at everything. Hachiman is a Gary Stu fantasy character for losers, who fantasize about being outcasts, but retaining their dignity and value nonetheless.
>>119347487
>YES IT IS YOU OTAKU FAGGOT
[citation needed]
This faggot.
![(G_P) Votoms (Remastered) 20(x264)(FD73036E).mkv_snapshot_15.30_[2014.07.26_01.40.21].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/IBemPwP.jpg "(G_P) Votoms (Remastered) 20(x264)(FD73036E).mkv_snapshot_15.30_[2014.07.26_01.40.21].jpg")
>>119347487
Goddamn anon, he can be whatever the fuck he wants, but in the state he is in, it does not make him a gary stu because he's not perfect in his world. He has not done anything incredible or impossible. Having girls around him does not make him a gary stu either, that is optional for a gary stu, being a self insert is too. This is a gary stu, Tatsuya is, Kirito is. 8man is not, he's a self insert but NOT a gary stu.
>>119345217
>still keep seeing new bait images
Whoever makes them, please never stop.
>>119347487
>He's a loser, yet he retains his dignity and doesn't embarrass himself by pining after the "normalfags" and their social lives.
Being a pretentious cunt and the closest anime has gotten to portraying a trenchcoat+fedora wearing faggot makes you a Gary Stu now? Hachiman is fucking insufferable
>>119347555
>Gary-stu relativism
>>119347590
This. While 8man may be entertaining to watch, I would hate the bastard if I were to actually meet him.
>real life loser
-fat, ugly, sweaty, has acne, looks like a toad
>gary stu fantasy loser
-in shame, relatively good looking, clean skin, has "sharp eyes"
>real life loser
-desperately wants to be popular and accepted and do normalfag things
>gary stu fantasy loser
-just wants to be left alone in his own world and do his own personal hobbies
>real life loser
-constantly says retarded, awkward things and makes a fool of himself
>gary stu fantasy loser
-straight man who sighs and has a witty internal monologue, while other wacky people say wacky things around him
>real life loser
-sexually frustrated
>gary stu fantasy loser
-only has the slightest interest in romance and almost none at sex
>real life loser
-has no dignity
>gary stu fantasy loser
-has dignity
>real life loser
-nobody cares about him or notices him
>gary stu fantasy loser
-for whatever reason has people pestering him, preventing him from leading his quiet life
>>119347567
this.
rain easily beat keyritoh, onii-sama, touman, etc.
>>119347571
He IS a Gary Stu by several orders of magnitude more than the Mahouka protagonist is. You don't even know what a Gary Stu is, you fucking newfag. A Gary Stu isn't someone who shoots beams out of his face and wins fights all the time, you fucking idiot.
![[Commie] Mondaiji-tachi ga Isekai kara Kuru Sou Desu yo - 10 [BADBEC9D].mkv_snapshot_19.13_[2013.05.27_01.32.58].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/yM6Il8y.jpg "[Commie] Mondaiji-tachi ga Isekai kara Kuru Sou Desu yo - 10 [BADBEC9D].mkv_snapshot_19.13_[2013.05.27_01.32.58].jpg")
>>119345367
team stu
>>119347555
So basically, every male character ever written is a Gary Stu because someone somewhere wants to be him
>>119347674
A perfect person is a gary stu, it doesn't even have to be from an action show.
>>119347645
>real life loser
-desperately wants to be popular and accepted and do normalfag things
>gary stu fantasy loser
-just wants to be left alone in his own world and do his own personal hobbies
Are you fucking retarded?
>>119347555
By that logic Tomoko would be a Gary Stu fantasy character for losers who fantasize about being an absolute bottom feeder of a person who fails at everything
>>119347693
>>119347687
Are you fucking retarded shitposters serious?
Do you think everyone sees Sakamoto as a perfect person? Do you think everyone sees James Bond as a perfect person?
One person sees the former and thinks, "What a loser, he's not even fucking all the girls at school". Another person sees the latter and thinks, "What a loser, he can't even be happy and get married".
There is no such thing as a Gary Stu for everyone. Characters like Hachiman are Gary Stus for losers, especially otaku. He is a perfect character for the people who love him.
This guy:^)
>>119347645
>>119347717
Let me explain why I think that's retarded. Not every loser want to join with society, this can be in fact be part of their special form of loserdom. There are many types of losers and you can not separate it into "Loser" and "Gary Stu Loser".
>>119347487
If maintaining dignity and self-confidence instantly makes one a Gary Stu, I fucking love them all.
The alternative is Mirai Nikki or something, from your awful definition.
>>119347748
So I'm retarded, and then the whole rest of your rant was restating what I said only serious.
>>119347726
No, you idiot. Tomoko is not a Gary Stu, because she lacks dignity and is worse than everyone in every way.
Characters like Hachiman are Gary Stus because they idealize being a loser and make him a dignified straight man, rather than the awkward, stuttering, absolute failure he is.
>what you think losers fantasize about
-"ONE DAY I'M GOING TO BE A SUPER STRONG HERO AND GET THE GIRL AND KNOW EXACTLY WHAT TO SAY TO MAKE EVERYONE LOVE ME!"
>what losers actually fantasize about
"Ha ha, I'm not like those normalfags with their wasted expenditures. I can see that life is all about going with the flow and not putting in too much effort. Ah, I can't wait to go home and work on my puzzles and play chess. Ha ha, I'm just like an old grandpa, aren't I? Yep, my ideal world is just to be left alone and do quiet things".
Jesus this dude is hell bent on proving hikigaya is a gary stu
Now, lemme ask this man
why you don't like him?
>>119347748
>There is no such thing as a Gary Stu for everyone
It's pretty evident when you see a gary stu. 8man is not. You have to be trolling, but you actually believe he is flawless.
>>119347783
>The alternative is Mirai Nikki or something, from your awful definition.
Shinji and Yukiteru are slightly better characters than the Hachiman archetypes. They're effeminate losers who desperately crave friendship and acceptance, but always fall flat on their fucking faces. But what mucks it up is the fact that they both have special abilities and have girls fawning all over them.
They're not Gary Stus, but they still fall under the umbrella of wish-fulfillment archetypes.
>>119347748
>There is no such thing as a Gary Stu for everyone.
Do you have a single fact to back that up?
>Characters like Hachiman are Gary Stus for losers, especially otaku.
Where is the evidence?
>He is a perfect character for the people who love him.
Proof?
>>119347805
>>119347847
But 8man somehow is?
>>119347487
>He's a loser, yet he retains his dignity and doesn't embarrass himself by pining after the "normalfags" and their social lives. He's this incredible straight man who just wants to be left alone, but instead all the WACKY female characters keep trying to drag him away from his comfort zone.
You're reading things on the surface. Just look at this shit. It isn't gospel; it's what most anyone would see it as, the pathetic musings of some bitter loser.
On the surface, Hachiman is the ideal loner and people of course identify with him or want to be in his place, since this is set up like the average LN romcom. But what disqualifies Hachiman as a Gary Stu isn't that he's a loser, but that his loser mentality has a negative impact on his life. He really isn't satisfied being alone and he isn't as smart as he thinks he is. But he's going to keep lying and digging deeper into a hole.
This isn't what the otaku and anon want to be. Like Shinji, this is who they really are.
>>119345137
Swagamoto
>>119347748
>Implying that whenever someone considers a character to be perfect that automatically becomes a "Mary Sue" or "Gary Stu" in his eyes.
You just don't get it.
Self-insert/wish-fulfillment, overpowered and Gary Stu do not have the same meaning, although most of them have element of the others that play into their meaning.
Tatsuya is overpowered and badly written, but I don't know if he's a gary stu(self inset of the author), as that title goes to Miyuki
8man is mostly self-insert for readers
Kirito is probably a combination of all 3
>>119347815
This is the reason: >>119347826
I have no particular hatred for Hachiman other than the fact that idiots gravitate towards him, without seeing what a cheap Gary Stu he is. I've seen threads where people have gone as far as to call him an original character.
It doesn't take an intellect to understand how perfect characters like Hachiman are. A fifth grader could point out that his "flaws" are what make him desirable.
Saying he isn't a Gary Stu is like saying someone like, say, Hawkeye from Last of the Mohicans isn't a Gary Stu, because he's a homeless wanderer. The whole reason Hawkeye is so idealized is that he's a noble savage who's "above" material things, like castles and land ownership.
>>119347855
I proved it in the comment you're responding to. See >>119347748
Read it a couple times before responding again.
>>119347893
Tats is nothing more than a tool on his own story really
Nigga got his emotions taken way to become a chink killing machine
>>119347890
It's hilarious watching you go back and forth.
>You don't understand, a Gary Stu isn't a self-insert.
>You don't understand, a Gary Stu isn't a perfect character.
Just admit that you don't know what a Gary Stu is.
>>119347898
Did you read the LN to get a more in depth or this is based on his anime version?
Not trying to start shit here, just asking questions
>>119347866
Yes, because he has dignity. In real life, nearly all losers lack dignity. If you want to write a realistic loser, the first step is to take away his dignity.
Hachiman is what losers fantasize about being: a dignified, disinterested straight man living in his own little world.
>>119347914
That's not proof. That's you saying this without proof.
>>119347914
That is not a gary stu at all. Being a lose is not being a gary stu. Liking a character for the purpose of self insertion is not either.
>>119347951
Hachiman has no dignity, it's a sham. He's very hypocritical in his ways.
>>119347999
He even went the white album 2 route in order to keep the girls in the club
>>119347873
>this is who they really are
It isn't, though. That's the point.
Hachiman is NOT who otaku really are. Tomoko is who they really are. Hachiman is who they want to be.
Yes, deep down inside he wants to be accepted. Yes, his personality is something of a facade. That's not really the point. Nobody in real life can be Hachiman. You can't be as disinterested as him. You can't be as cool-blooded as him. You can't enter into situations like he gets dragged into without making an absolute fool of yourself.
In real life, losers are awkward and ignored. In the fantasy world, losers are kind of cool in their own way and always have someone trying to drag them out of their hole.
>>119347999
He's also not disinterested. He says to himself that he's disinterested and then meddles nonstop in other people's problems.
>>119347930
Are you really that retarded? Since when Mary Sue character are liked by those who read them?
Mary Sue characters are totally and utterly despised by readers, while they are totally revered in the story they are in.
You are trying to make a point that Hachiman is a Gary Stu because he's the perfect model for Otaku (who watch the anime) while he is a loser in the story he is in. Which is the POLAR OPPOSITE of what happens with any Gary Stu character.
>>119347951
>Yes, because he has dignity.
[citation needed]
>In real life, nearly all losers lack dignity.
[citation needed]
>If you want to write a realistic loser, the first step is to take away his dignity.
[citation needed]
>Hachiman is what losers fantasize about being
[citation needed]
>>119347961
>>119347969
People would say that Sakamoto is perfect, but others would disagree.
People would say that James Bond is perfect, but others would disagree.
What you consider perfect is dependent on your own values. Some people might see royalty as part of perfection, while others still might consider being self-made as part of perfection. Some people might consider wealth part of perfect, while others might consider a lack of possessions as part of perfection.
>>119348045
Do you really think he will back anything up with facts?
All he's doing is saying the exact same thing over and over again.
>>119348045
>>In real life, nearly all losers lack dignity.
>[citation needed]
Stopped reading there.
>>119345137
Every main character from a light novel. Especially if it's one of those "person from the normal world gets transported to another world" types.
>>119348074
But James Bond is perfect, he is an evident gary stu. Nobody would disagree.
>>119348044
>Mary Sue characters are totally and utterly despised by readers
Then I guess Kirito isn't a Gary Stu, since he's fairly well beloved. He's hated on /a/, sure, but by legitimate fans of SAO, he's well-liked.
See, you're just going back and forth on the definition of Gary Stu. You honestly don't know what it means.
>>119347769
I don't know why, but I have a hard time considering the Major a Mary Sue. She fits most of the usual criteria, far better than any other Shirow female, but it just feels wrong.
>>119347152
>Villain Sue
>>119348094
Not every loser is a depressive wreck, constantly looking for validation, even if there are moments--but just who isn't that true for? If you truly believe this, I think you just lack empathy, experience with losers, and/or observational skills.
>>119348109
Lots of people would disagree. For most people, finding a soulmate is the ultimate pursuit. James Bond is basically a manwhore who has to go from girl to girl because he can't commit. And remember when Goldfinger had him in the laser and James had to lie like a bitch to get out of it? That's not very Gary Stu-ish.
>>119348118
>but by legitimate fans of SAO, he's well-liked.
All "legitimate fans" of SAO I know are retarded kids who keep denying that Kirito is a Gary Stu.
Anyone who states that Kirito is a Gary Stu while claiming that SAO is a good show, clearly doesn't understand the implication of what "Gary Stu" character means: bad writing.
>>119348094
Most popular people have no dignity at all. They gave it up to become popular. Sasha Gray is a popular porn star. Do you think she has any dignity though? I highly doubt it.
>>119348158
In this thread you have defined being in pain because of rejection by society/peers as a hollywood flaw and fucking every hot chick you see as an actual flaw. This is why no one is buying your definition of Gary Stu
>>119348147
You're in denial. You're like everyone else, trying to romanticize loserdom.
>>119348025
Underneath the bullshit, Hachiman is who they really are. Sure Tomoko is more explicit case but Watamote is of a different nature anyway while this is presenting itself as an anti-romcom.
I think this series shows how losers can be their own problem and the 'cool' is just a covering. Losers get their fantasy self but it's still unpleasant.
>>119348094
Not having dignity or self respect is the first step to loserdom. No dignity means you are capable of letting things spiral downward in the first place
>>119348189
Didn't you hear? Sasha Gray is one of the most dignified, intelligent women alive.
She only did porn because her boyfriend lied about being in the CIA and told her she needed to do porn and eat jizz off of toilet seats as part of his cover story.
>>119348189
Dignity doesn't exist in a vacuum. How much dignity you have is dependent on how people see you.
If some fratboy is running naked across the frat house with his pants down, trying to get to the bathroom, and accidentally poops his pants, everyone would think it was hilarious. All his bros would slap him on the back and laugh at him, and he'd laugh with them.
If a loser was running with his pants down, trying to reach the bathroom, and accidentally pooped his pants, it'd be a soul crushing moment that would scar him for life. Nobody would let him hear the end of it and he'd probably end up committing suicide.
If you say that by having notable social flaws, you can't be Mary Sue, then why /a/ always blames Sora from NGNL for being a Mary Sue?
Inb4 HURRR always wins. He doesn't win alone. It's actually Shiro who does most of the work always inside the games and he's there just for the meta-strategy, and in the LN there was already a case of Shiro doing that part as well.
>>119347390
>How in the blue blazes is Tatsuya a Gary Stu?
>>119348211
Also, there are different kinds of losers. Hachiman is in a similar class to Holden Caulfield.
>>119348207
What you're doing is creating this idea of a loser and trying to force everyone you define as a loser into it, and it just doesn't work that way. I'm telling you that not every piece of shit stinks the same.
>>119348200
>In this thread you have defined being in pain because of rejection by society/peers as a hollywood flaw
Are you actually trying to say that isn't?
Holy fuck, you people will go to any lengths to defend your delusions. Even among normalfags, that kind of thing is a Hollywood flaw. Everyone idealizes a character who is mistreated by popular people. That isn't even something unique to otaku.
>ucking every hot chick you see as an actual flaw
I love catching you idiots in contradictions. As I've already pointed out, Sakamoto doesn't fuck anyone, yet he's still called a Gary Stu.
How do you rationalize that? I'm waiting.
>>119348309
>Everyone idealizes a character who is mistreated by popular people. That isn't even something unique to otaku.
That's pity, not idolization. You pity 8man, you don't want to be him or in his situation, especially when the girls are complete bitches.
>>119348265
How would he poop his pants if he was naked? Also, why would he be running with his pants around his ankles?
>>119348211
>Underneath the bullshit, Hachiman is who they really are
No, it isn't.
No loser is a straight man.
No loser is that disinterested in sex and romance.
No loser "just wants to be left alone".
No loser has wacky, attractive people who need him for some reason.
No loser retains his dignity.
Tomoko isn't a special case; she's nearly every loser.
>I think this series shows how losers can be their own problem and the 'cool' is just a covering.
Hachiman isn't just pretending to be cool. He's cool in a very unrealistic way.
I know you fantasize about being Hachiman, but you can't actually be him. You're Tomoko. You just want to be Hachiman.
>>119348347
He's running and his belt comes loose. The poop falls and hits his pants.
>>119345574
>>119345722
Under that logic, Nozomu Itoshiki is also a Gary Stu
Hell, that would even make Tomoko a Mary Sue
>>119347674
"The term "Mary Sue" comes from the name of a character created by Paula Smith in 1973 for her parody story "A Trekkie's Tale"published in her fanzine Menagerie The story starred Lieutenant Mary Sue ("the youngest Lieutenant in the fleet — only fifteen and a half years old"), and satirized unrealistic Star Trek fan fiction. Such characters were generally original female adolescents who had romantic liaisons with established canonical adult characters, or in some cases were the younger relatives or protégées of those characters"
Taken from wikipedia but the point is that origin of the word comes from a flawless and invincible character written by a third-rate writer. The term is used NOT used to mock general self-insert but rather the perfect, two dimensional characters. Now that we're clear with the definition of "gary stu", I think the problem is not the term "Gary Stu" but the term "self-insert" which is too broad. Gary stu is a character that is perfect and have the world in their hands; far from relatable. Self- insert in this context is someone everyone WANTS to be. As for hachiman, he is your typical edgy teenager on puberty; far from a gary stu. Now, self- insert in this context is someone relatable to most people, you can UNDERSTAND where they are coming from.
>>119348344
>That's pity, not idolization.
No, it really is idealization.
Harry Potter is idealized because he's a mistreated orphan. If he didn't have that background, his character wouldn't be as special.
Going through hardships and having a low birth is something a lot of people romanticize.
>>119345668
Looks like blade wolf from revengeance
>>119348348
Why even encourage people into telling themselves they're like anime characters? They're unrealistic in a way that is entertaining (to enough people, at least). If anything anons here need to realize they don't even reach the level of 'loser' characters. They're no one and they have no value outside of what their poor mothers might feel for them. I'm not claiming to be different, either.
>>119348409
>Self- insert in this context is someone everyone WANTS to be.
That's the fucking point. Everyone who watches anime wants to be Hachiman.
>As for hachiman, he is your typical edgy teenager on puberty; far from a gary stu
I don't want to keep copypasting the same things, so stop this shit alright. He's not even close to being typical. He's more unrealistic than a character that can blow up planets with his mind.
>>119348412
You feel sorry for him, you are not idolizing. You idolize powerful people, not losers. Your definition is too warped.
>>119348309
I'm talking about how you characterized James Bond. You can tell because I was responding to your post that talked about James Bond.
People don't want to be in emotional pain. People are empathetic towards others in pain. But people don't want to be in pain themselves.
>>119348348
>No loser is a straight man.
His delusion.
>No loser is that disinterested in sex and romance.
Did you even watch it? Hachiman is actually interested in both. He's full of shit.
>No loser "just wants to be left alone".
Just another lie on his part.
>No loser has wacky, attractive people who need him for some reason.
Even if they did, their mentalities would push them away.
>No loser retains his dignity.
Hachiman has no dignity to retain.
>Hachiman isn't just pretending to be cool. He's cool in a very unrealistic way.
For you because you clearly buy into the lies, since you're not a smart viewer.
Here's your reply, you won't be getting another.
>>119347487
>WAAAAAH! I'M THE ONLY ONE RIGHT AND ALL YOU OTAKU FAGGOTS ARE WRONG!
>>119348429
>If anything anons here need to realize they don't even reach the level of 'loser' characters
They don't. That's the problem.
/a/ is full of delusional idiots who think that Gary Stus are battle shounen heroes and that characters like Hachiman are original, well-written characters who accurately paint the human condition.
/a/ needs to realize that it's easier to be Kirito than it is to be Hachiman.
>>119348412
Harry Potter is a normal boy living in unfortunate circumstances who is suddenly told he is in fact magical Jesus. Without the magical Jesus part he would just be someone you feel sorry for.
>>119348490
I'm telling you for a fucking fact that that's wrong.
This isn't up for debate.
This isn't something that can be disagreed with.
If Harry Potter was royalty, he would be less perfect, not more perfect. You don't seem to realize that certain weaknesses are actually strengths. This is where the idea of "Hollywood flaws" comes from.
>>119348490
He's making perfect sense, it's the concept of the underdog. They come from humble or unfortunate circumstances but don't submit to them the way most people do (ie being a shit person that blames their past for their lack of success in x y or z). Fiction displays this stuff as noble.
>>119348499
>People don't want to be in emotional pain. People are empathetic towards others in pain. But people don't want to be in pain themselves.
What the fuck are you even talking about? What people want in real life is vastly different from what they want in fiction.
In real life, most people want to live a quiet life, with their wife and kids, while having money in the bank. In fiction, a character like that would not be called a Gary Stu.
So yes, having a tragic background and being in emotional pain can make a character more perfect. People love to see dark, brooding characters. That doesn't make the characters less flawed. It's a fake, Hollywood flaw that makes them look better.
>>119348568
>If Harry Potter was royalty, he would be less perfect, not more perfect
Where did you even learn the definition for gary stu anyway?
>>119348580
That's character development, not a gary stu.
Does a Gary Stu count as a Gary Stu if said Gary Stu died super fucking hard?
>>119348520
>BAWWWWW IM LIKE HACHIMAN I REALLY AM IM NOT A LOSER LIKE TOMOKO HACHIMAN IS SO COOL AND UNIQUE HES MY FAVORITE CHARACTER AND IM TOTALLY LIKE HIM SO HE ISNT A GARY STU
>>119348514
That's the trick, he maintains his facade WAY better than any real person would do in his place, that's what it means to "retain its dignity", in the sense that he can effectively make people buy into his charade.
>>119348640
would you fags stop this shit already?
>>119348612
Oh I thought we were talking about Gary Stus but apparently what you thought we were talking about "How to write a character that people would be interested in reading"
>>119348640
But nobody thinks he's cool or unique. Quite the opposite in this thread.
>>119348520
>>119348640
You both smell and are dumb.
>>119348544
/a/ doesn't need to realize anything. /a/ needs to discuss anime and manga
>>119348554
>Without the magical Jesus part he would just be someone you feel sorry for.
It's the opposite.
Without the living in unfortunate circumstances part, he'd just be some random guy who gets super powers.
The whole reason people gravitate towards him is because he's a diamond in the rough type. He was mistreated and knows hardship, but "still knows how to love" and all that garbage.
Seriously, you guys aren't thinking. This is elementary stuff. If you can't understand how hardship and low birth make characters more perfect, then you've been living in a bubble too long.
>>119348616
NO IT'S FUCKING GARY STU-ISM
WHY THE FUCK IS THIS SO HARD FOR YOU IDIOTS
SOME PEOPLE THINK THAT ROYAL BLOOD MAKES A CHARACTER MORE PERFECT
BUT JUST AS MANY PEOPLE DON'T
HOLY FUCK, ARE YOU ALL FUCKING STUPID?
200 YEARS AGO AN IDEAL BRITISH HERO WOULD PROBABLY BE SOME PRINCE WHO DIDN'T KNOW HE WAS A PRINCE
BUT 200 YEARS AGO THE IDEAL AMERICAN HERO WAS A DIRT POOR HERO WHO DIDN'T CARE ABOUT WEALTH OR POLITICS AND JUST WANDERED THE LAND
>B-B-B-B-B-B-BUT A GARY STU IS SOMEONE EVERYONE WANTS TO BE LIKE
THERE
IS
NO
ONE
THAT
ALL
PEOPLE
WANT TO BE LIKE
PERFECTION IS NOT AN OBJECTIVE CONCEPT HOLY FUCK YOU PEOPLE ARE FUCKING STUPID
>>119348638
>Super swole
>Always does whats right
>Ungodly strength
>Takes down a vampire without even knowing the Ripple
>When he does learn the ripple it just so happens he has the PERFECT ripple
>dies like a bitch
I actually think Jonathan might be one of the biggest Gary Stu's
>>119348683
Prove it
>>119348683
I guess Riki from Little Busters is perfect then. He's exactly like Harry Potter besides the magic.
>>119348659
It's the fact that they think he's cool and unique that's causing people to deny that he's a Gary Stu.
Hachiman is an ordinary wish-fulfillment Gary Stu, but /a/ has been worshiping him since the series began.
>>119345217
What is this, a bait for ants?
>>119348646
Most everyone sees through it. They either know he's just a nice guy underneath the edgy loner stuff or see him as a loser and don't give a shit about him. Both are right.
>>119348731
>caps lock
Is this satire?
>>119348664
How can you discuss anime and manga if you're not even smart enough to grasp grade school level concepts? I'm not asking you rhetorically. Answer the question.
For instance, let's say we were discussing One Punch Man and someone said, without facetiousness,
>Guys, I think Saitama is lying about how he got his power. It's not realistic that basic training like that would give him ultimate power. Why do you think he's making it up?
Does that constitute discussion?
Is that the type of /a/ you want to have?
We need intelligence here. We need self-awareness.
>>119348731
Nah
You're wrong
>>119348731
I actually agree partially with you (not on everything), but your ass is so ravaged your posts could be tagged as scat doujins.
>>119345276
>Gary Stu
>Ends up blind, crippled and alone because everyone in the entire fucking world is a selfish dickbag in one way or another.
>Especially his friends
>Especially his adopted brother and sister
>Especially his one girlfriend
To be honest, I'm surprised there isn't an OVA of Guilty Crown of him being sad in the three year interval. It can be funded by beating up orphans, collecting and selling their tears to keep in the spirit of things.
>>119348640
>implying anybody thinks 8man is cool and unique
>implying you're not the biggest loser for trying so hard
>implying your own opinion is more correct than an opinion of dozens
>>119348776
No it's cancer
>>119348731
>BUT 200 YEARS AGO THE IDEAL AMERICAN HERO WAS A DIRT POOR HERO WHO DIDN'T CARE ABOUT WEALTH OR POLITICS AND JUST WANDERED THE LAND
That's just an underdog, not a gary stu.
HE'S STILL GOING
HOLY FUCK
>>119348735
Prove what? That it's the hardship stuff that makes Harry Potter Gary Stu-ish?
Okay, ever heard of American Gods? I'm sure you have. It's a popular novel. Now, do you know anything about the protagonist? Of course you don't. He's a fucking normal, uninteresting faggot. Sure, he goes through some hardships, but at the same time, they don't lay it on thick, like that he was whipped by his evil aunt and forced to live in the cupboard underneath the stairs. And even though he's a fucking god at the end, nobody gives a shit.
Same thing with Peter Parker. He didn't get popular because of his powers. He got popular because being a super hero caused everything to fall apart for him in his personal life.
>>119348801
>How can you discuss anime and manga
By discussing anime and manga. We've been doing it before you got here and we'll be doing it after you leave
>>119348120
He is.
It just feels wrong because "she's" the least popular part of "her" own show.
>>119345574
>"In fan fiction, a Mary Sue or, in case of a male character, Gary Stu is an idealized character, often but not necessarily an author insert and/or wish-fullfillment.[1]"
>>119348876
>american
opinion discarded :^)
This is like watching two kids have a verbal fight and you thinking heh what fags, then the one kid pulling a knife and you thinking how this was your future considering you ate some damn good corn flakes. You did nothing wrong and now you know that this happened.
>>119348894
Answer the question. Is this discussion:
>>Guys, I think Saitama is lying about how he got his power. It's not realistic that basic training like that would give him ultimate power. Why do you think he's making it up?
Is that discussion?
>We've been doing it before you got here and we'll be doing it after you leave
I've been here longer than you and will be here long after you fuck off back to middle school.
>>119348850
He does have a point in a way. Many Gary Stus are underdogs, that's an immensely common way to write them. The difference between a normal underdog and a Gary Stu is that a Gary Stu will probably be an underdog that's also secretly the key to everything with everyone crawling on his dick including the villain by the time the story is over. He seems to be implying that just being an underdog alone makes a character more Gary Stu-ish, which is untrue.
>>119348902
>I can't think of a Counter Argument :^)
>>119348918
No this is like watching a WWE match with undertaker on it
you know some bullshit will keep it going
>>119348947
>undertaker
>relevant at all ever since he lost to cena
>>119348961
>cena
what
Undertaker never lost to Cena
>>119348919
I've been here longer than you
No you haven't
>>119348930
Then why didn't he say that instead of looking like a headless chicken? Jesus, I'm effectively tired of typing.
>>119348482
Never-mind my previous argument, I was typing it pretty late. Seeing your arguments, pointing out Tomoko, your definition of loser; the problem is not the word gary stu or self insert but rather the depiction of a "loser" in the show. In other words, you just want a real loser - someone lowest of the low with no room for redemption-, according to your definition.
Well if you want something "real" then fiction is not for you. If you want see a loser then go look in the mirror, or the streets. I can see why you hate hachiman idolized as some ideal loner or god of loners by some people, I must I say I hate that too. I think you simply hate loner and cynical characters, but for me the charm of those character is a more satisfying character development. Hachiman may not become sociable person but at least he become more willing to have friends in the LN.
On topic: Those two fucker from Grisaia something and Amagi brilliant something.
>>119348961
>cena
>not rigged
>>119345137
Where's Touma? Cause, you know, he is always right no matter what.
Guys, I'm going to write a Harry Potter fanfic with my own personal character who is TOTATLY NOT A MARY SUE GUISE.
>One day Harry Pootter when to school and then Professor Dimbledob introduced a new character, Sable. Sable was a slender girl with a slash of pink hair that covered one eye and she wore fingerless gloves.
>Sable went over to Harries Potter and said, "Hi Harry Pottle my name is Sable and I'm the new girl at school and I'm a half-wearwolf/half-animagus: form of the wolfe. I can do silent spell and also I feel connected with you. You see my step parents beat me
>and then they made me stay in the cupboard underneat the cupboard underneath the stairs nad my step brother Doobley wouldnt give me his third bedroom and he raped me once."
>Then Harold Powder said, "Sable you are really cool I want you on my Quoudish team we need your help to stop Voldimorth!"
I added in the flaw about being mistreated because I didn't want my character to be too perfect. Gotta add in those flaws, right guise?
>>119349052
Yuuji ain't that bad
now his fucking sister is
jesus fuck that dr claw bitch
>>119349031
Realistic losers aren't even that rare. Again, Shinji and Yukiteru are both fairly realistic losers, from the standpoint of their personality. They're insecure, desperate, and socially awkward.
I don't mind characters like Hachiman existing as long as people recognize how unrealistic and idealized they are.
>>119349092
God bless the USA
>>119349143
>>119346887
SAO and Mahouka fags will always say that their character are deep, complex and not Gary Stues.
>>119349226
>mahoukafags not going islam
nigga the threads are all ONII-SAMA AKBAR
and best girl sp posting
>>119349226
I don't think that SAOfags anywhere have ever said Kirito is deep, and people just watch Mahoka for the wincest.
>>119349143
>I don't mind characters like Hachiman existing as long as people recognize how unrealistic and idealized they are.
Go tell /r9k/ they're being unrealistic and idealized losers and get back to this thread, anon
Toru.
But Toru is actually tolerable character since he doesn't really asspull much.
>>119349284
>implying anyone on /r9k/ is as perfect as Hachiman
>>119349143
Not saying 8man isn't unrealistic or idealized, but losers come in different colors and stripes. It isn't all about showing weaknesses so vividly.
>>119349320
Hachiman is a shit
A big gay shit
Mahouka had the best OC
>>119349344
Don't you get it? Hachiman doesn't care what you think. He doesn't need to fit in. He doesn't have the energy to keep up with you hot blooded youths.
>>119349384
Was the ninja part ever explained or was it just "Super ninja training from hell"?
>>119345447
I feel if 5 was average human level, 7 would be if a particular stat was trained by an athlete, and 8 by one of those "greatest of all time" 6x gold medalist athletes in one or two particular stats, while typically coordinator newtype would straight 8s.
Straight 9s being superman and 10 being goku
>>119349565
His mentor is a legit ninja yeah
His traning was so hardcore, all his natural specs are on almost magic level
>>119349609
Did he finally fuck his father then?
Dude has some obvious daddy issues.
I know who's a Mary Sue: Kirino. Love seeing her fans deny it.
>>119349542
Hachiman isn't a mere self-insert. It's a perfect, idealized self-insert.
Kyon isn't quite as bad, because he isn't supposed to be a loser. Keima, however, is definitely a Gary Stu.
>>119349630
His father just made a cameo and never came back.
>>119349264
You weren't here for the LNfaggots of yesteryear. SAO is well-written I tell you, just not the parts that have been adapted yet.
>>119345276
Shu is my favorite anime character.
I'm serious.
>>119349652
>It's a perfect, idealized self-insert.
[citation needed]
>>119349658
Just like in real life then.
>>119349731
>[citation needed]
The citation is an anime called Yahari Ore no Seishun Rabu Kome wa Machigatteiru.
>>119348638
>>119348733
You're looking at the wrong JoJo.
>>119349806
>Anime
Yep
The funniest part is that Komatsu is even bigger Mary than Toriko who has the manga named after him
The autism is strong in this thread
Jesus fucking Christ
Gary-stu: Perfect character without flaws.-Kirito
Self-instert: Character without personality so the viewer can relate to him- Kyon
Hachiman has personality and flaws as a person, the only reason why people bitch about it is because he gets the pussy.
Welcome to the Wish fulfillment industry everybody!
>>119350512
Gary-stu: Perfect character without real flaws.-Hachiman
Hachiman has only Hollywood flaws. Meanwhile, he has a devil may care, straight man persona that is not only unattainable, but is sought after by every otaku on the planet.
Hachiman is objectively a Gary Stu, and this cannot be argued. People who don't see this are underage shitposters.
