![1463545781893[1].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/hHVsrvn.jpg "1463545781893[1].jpg")
New thread last one hit bump limit
Old thread >>17704013
What we need:
>The characters to be cataloged and assigned letters and numbers (arbitrarily)
>The transcoded letters and numbers to be assembled into sentence-like strings based on various arrangements of the original book (front to back, back to front, forwards, backwards, various spacing, various fragments/chunks)
>These strings to be fed into various automated decrypting programs until something brings back some kind of readable bits
Post any and all progress on these fronts to the thread to allow other anons to verify your findings and build on them
![1463589954838[1].png](https://i.imgur.com/gES6VsC.png "1463589954838[1].png")
Anon's hard text-based work can be found at pastebin.com/DwbRwjey for those who prefer to work with text (our current goal) pic related is Reddit's graphical representation for those who prefer to scribble but again our current goal is for these to be converted to letters and arranged precisely as they appear in the book. Various arrangements can be attempted from there.
>>17705781
Use a file sourcing site and dump all the pages in order
>>17705791
/x/'s archive will hold them for a month even after the old thread falls off the board. I'm sure they'll be reposted ITT as well (hopefully in the right order)
its probably overly simple but if their are indeed 35 unique characters that 26 letters plus 1-9. i doubt this thing contains both q and z though or either of them so possible 0 and . ?
I usually try to use arrays for sectioned stuff like this, the pictures in the old thread are difficult to relate.
>>17705803
Look Everyone! I'm contributing!
>>17705812
never mind im dumb, no way all the other letters and numbers are probably used as well.
>>17705817
How about a little joke you have probably heard before...
>>17705822
A young boy goes up and asks his jewish dad for 50 dollars...
i dont know if op is here but what was your grandfathers name? possibly one of these letter groupings isa signature and we could work backwards trying to fit it in someplace?
>>17705787
This is garbage, because he's putting the pattern in a square lattice when the pages are clearly hexagonally patterned.
>>17705812
>>17705818
Don't be too hard on yourself it's actually pretty unlikely that a 120ish character long message would contain every letter of the alphabet as well as every numeral unless it was intentional i.e. if it contained them all in alphanumeric order as a key of sorts, possibly this book is simply a key to deciphering other codes found elsewhere plus maybe info on where these codes are to be found and/or how they're to be used
Are all the characters that appear only once located entirely in the beginning or end of the sequence? That's a good question to raise.
>>17705824
And the dad's head turns all the way around without moving his body and the boy becomes very nervous and begins to sweat.
The dad says to the boy, "My work is finally completed little one, I have torn open a hole to the nether realm within my own mind, the flood gates of eternal torment are open"
suddenly a third snake eye opens in the forehead of the father. "the time has come... to make the first sacrifice"
The boy says....
>>17705839
Go on..
>>17705839
"that's very nice dad but I want my 50 dollars"
>>17705834
We've already established that the characters are representable as a 3x3 grid or more precisely as pastebinanon discovered as a 3-2-3 matrix because of the offset you're erroneously calling hexagonal. That observation made the book itself much easier for me to "see" the patterns in but it really doesn't effect the decoding effort. What matters is for each character to be consistent and for them to be transcoded accurately into an alphanumeric form that decrypting programs are able to parse.
>>17705842
The father says "your petty obsession with money can do nothing to stop my overwhelming power!!!!" Then there is a knock on the door, it's the boys mom, the fathers weekend custody is up. The boy is saved by the bell. The father, visibility frustrated can only grit his teeth as the boy turns back and says, "pssshhh nothiin personnell"
>>17705816
The rings (being rings) are all circular. The only reason the top and bottom lines appear to be facing right and the middle line appears to be facing left is that they're interwoven. It's impossible for them to face the other way unless you look at the "back" of the pages, in which case everything is reversed. The order of the characters may need to be flipped and/or inverted for sense to be made but that's a later step. The characters are consistend regardless of how they're looked at so they can be assigned alphanumeric values. Then those alphanumeric values can be more easily rearranged. We'll cross that bridge when we come to it.
no symbol is followed by the same symbol. I.E there are no ee aa 11 00, if indeed these are words.
>>17705863
So then is it like a binary code?
>>17705843
its a 3x3 grid the problem is only 1 character uses the first column middle row
) _ _
( _(
) _ )
this character appears only 2 times.
>>17705868
i just mean that in the english language there are lots of words that have double letters in them. like the word letter, or deer, or butthole but these dont appear in this text. it could mean nothing im just saying.
It's a nice chainmail book, but the horseshit story you tried to feed us leaves me mistrusting you. Your grandfather did not own this and you did not find this in an attic. There is no patina on the metal at all. Try harder next time.
>>17705878
Please show me exactly where you find a character that has a gray link between two gold links in the middle row.
More of these are going to pop up soon. The have to do with a code that focuses on despair.
>>17705899
sorry that didnt come out right look at, page 2 line 1 last character.
>>17705905
>page 2 line 1 last character.
>>17705822
_ ) _
( (
_ ) )
>>17705916
Damn left justification on 4chan
>_ ) _
> ( (
>_ ) )
okay so im starting to think its a letter thing, here is why
the most frequently occurring symbol im going to assume is an E because that is the most frequent letter in the alphabet.
on page 2 line 3 there is a 3 letter word that end with this letter. the same is true on page 3 first word.
the second most occurring letter in the alphabet is t.
but on page 2 we see that their would be a t all alone on line 4 if we count the space. T is not a word. but A the third most occurring letter is. so lets say thats an A ( im not sure about this hold on a sec)
okay so if thats an A, then T must be the next most appearing letter, unfortunately the third most apearing letter is tied with like 5 things, no problem because TH is pretty common its the most common accuring digraph. in english with THE being the most common trigraph. their apear to be 2 places that have 3 letter groups that end in E. one on page 2 and one on page 3. wouldnt you know it both of the are preceded by the same symbols. SO we know what the symbols for E T and H and possible A are.
>>17705922
>>17705916
) (
( ( )
>>17705942
I appreciate that you're trying to solve it like a cryptoquote but if you could just assign consistent letters to each shape then format the letters to match the arrangement of the book then a computer program can do what you're trying to do much faster than you can - although if you do form sort-of words the program will find better solutions faster. Just get as close as you can as long as your letters (and numbers) are consistent throughout. We know there are more than 26 letters so it's not exclusively letters.
>>17705954
It's physically impossible for the direction of a ring on a line to be reversed.
>>17705954
>_ ) _
> ( (
>_ ) )
>>17705942
who told you it's english? Could be morse code or latin. How old is the book? Where did Grandpa got it in the first place? Is OP story true or are we solving a mysteria from CIA?
>>17705969
It's definitely not Morse code. It could be any language we'd need to move through them one by one if the presumption that it's English fails and we'd need people fluent in each language to check it. It could even be double-encoded or a phonetic code which would make it much harder to solve. Have you ever seen Windtalkers? During WW2 the Axis used a machine to encode their communications and we cracked it. We used Navajos.
>>17705898
>nice chainmail book
Not really, the maille configuration is how a normie would think maille would be configured. Literally looks like someone bounded a bunch of rolo chains together.
>not using rivited links
Fucking casuals.
>>17705969
no one, its the easiest place to start. i do agree though, more info would be very helpful.
>>17705994
i bet you are this fat guy i saw in hooters one time sitting by himself making chainmail bikinis and trying to get the waitresses to go over to his house and model them for him. ive never see hooters waitresses unable to hide their disgust of the gross dudes that go in there but this guy was getting pretty close.
Could be decimal numbers in binary.
263 274 283 286 285
283 266 285 341
196 193 194 205
is the first page
>>17706002
>more info would be very helpful.
this
>>17705781
I would suggest assigning words to the symbol groupings. Like japaness these could be whole words/meanings not just letters.
op is your grandfathers name ed or edward?
>>17706014
That (kanji style) would be literally impossible to decipher in such a short message without a key. If they represented phonetic elements kana style it could but it would be hard.
>>17705898
Still having daddy issues, Peter?
>>17706061
How did we ever decipher asian character based languages?
>>17706072
Native speakers taught them to us
>>17705781
Not to get all /x/ about this but... in the previous thread an anon mentioned they'd had a dream about this book. (see >>17705279 )
I don't remember dreaming about the book per se but... I've been going all day thinking "come on, where have I seen this thing before?" As soon as I saw the book my FIRST reaction was "Oh that thing. Cool it's been awhile." But............ honestly I'm drawing a blank. I really, really feel like I've seen it but... it's just not coming to mind.
I've been trying to shake this feeling all day. Anybody else feel like this is familiar somehow?
>>17706149
Never go full RP
>>17706149
get this garbage out of here, the ops grandpa probably just made it in his spare time. its not gonna be anything spooky.
>>17706169
>>17706301
Listen dipshits, this was my experience. Kiss my ass if what I experienced distresses you. No RP, just is what it is... and I wasn't the only one.
I'm not saying the thing is "haunted" or "ancient" or whatever... it looks like something someone in the SCA made. But... this is what I felt. And I don't think the other anon with the dream was lying either.
>>17706338
yeah actually it is, your feelings add little to nothing to solving this.
it's not a 3x3 grid, it's 3-2-3
2nd page
3rd page
>>17705961
(._Y_.)
_)_._(
(__v__)
4th page
5th page
>>17706641
>>17706644
>>17706646
>>17706651
>>17706657
I made a table with frequencies (pic related)
I wrote T, H and E cause there's a 3 char string that repeats, but now I'm not sure the word is the, maybe is ARE, maybe is AND, maybe the cyphered message isn't in english, so don't pay too much attention to it.
>>17706679
.)
(__(___)
>>17706679
Fucking tourist. No wonder this board is shit by now.
>>17706649
>>>/b/
Stay there.
>>17706670
Now assign them all letters, you can use your current theory and now that you've coined them just assign them letters according to the descending frequency of use to the rest of the alphabet then you're the letters on top of the corresponding characters in your graphical representation of the pages.
>>17706690
There's something weird about this:
There are 37 different characters
There are 113 characters total
From A to Z plus numbers from 0 to 9 there're exactly 37 characters.
I mean, 113 chars isn't long enough to cover every char in the alphabet plus numbers...
>>17706701
Why does the text have to include every letter in the alphabet and the numbers 0-9?
>>17705787
The very first character in that is wrong. The top right corner should be black. There might be other errors too but that's the only one I see.
>>17706641
I think it doesn't matter if it is ( or )
I think about it as vertical chains making a 3x3 grid
So >>17705961
would be
100
110
110
or
010
011
011
depending on its positioning
OP here. Sorry it took so long to get back, wish I was still NEET. I'll try to make my way through all the questions in this thread and the last one.
I discussed this with my friend today and we came up with an idea.
We've been discounting the left pages as a meaningless mirror of the previous ones. It's totally possible that this is even more cryptic than we thought and the cipher was designed in a particular way, and the right words were chosen to have the mirrored text also say something.
>>17706670
this is starting to remind me of the I-Ching
( . Y . )
( ._. )_/
>_<
>>17706730
It doesn't, that's why I think it's weird, and maybe I'm not in the right direction.
>>17706764
>I think it doesn't matter if it is ( or )
>I think about it as vertical chains making a 3x3 grid
It matters. It isn't 3x3, the second line with the golden ( just admit 2 (, so it's pointless to have a 3x3 grid, it's more like:
) ) )
( (
) ) )
>>17706764
It being 3-2-3 actually is important for the very reason you're asking. It all but eliminates the possibility of column shifting
>>17706790
No it couldn't. I was actually kind of staring at the left hand pages earlier and the reason they look funny is that since they're both mirrored because they're seen from the back and reversed because we're seeing the opposite side of each link, it shifts the top and bottom rows quite far away from the middle rows nagging the whole thing borderline nonsensical.
I'm fairly positive we are looking at the correct side of the pages at the very least.
>>17706799
===(_o(__)
_o_
>>17706832
8===D~~~ O-:
I'm surprised this ended up being so popular. Thanks for all the hard work so far.
>>17705091
He was born here in a small town in Illinois (not going to specify for obvious reasons.
He didn't travel much, no.
He was a banker before the "big bank" era.
>>17705196
I know a couple of Masons in town I can ask. I'll let you know what they say.
>>17705200
It's just a piece of posterboard I had lying around.
>>17705362
I can't stand reddit desu.
>>17705388
That was my frist impression too, but like Hebrew I think that's just because of the curvy lines.
>>17705604
No, the reverse of each page isn't the exact mirror of the opposite side because the rings cross each other with a certain direction. It shifts some of the rings one way and some the other way depending on which way they lean.
>>17705624
>OP said much earlier in the thread that he planned to put up reverse pictures today, but he had to go to bed.
Do you still need me to do this or will those flipped pics anon posted work?
>>17705889
>>17705898
it was in a wooden box with a bunch of packs of silica gel. I think that kept it pretty fresh.
>>17706270
I didn't find anything else like this.
>>17706060
no, why?
>>17706869
I still wanna know how this ends
>>17706869
Do you know anybody you could call who might know what it is, family wise? An uncle or your dad or something?
>>17706888
My mom was there when we found it but she just chalked it up to Grandpa being weird. I figured I'd see what /x/ thought.
>>17706904
your mom's a cunt
>>17705781
Es el libro del diablo!
>>17705781
it's the nipple rings of every freshman he banged in college. grandpa is legend.
()()
(oo)
(><)
(")(")
>>17706701
I agree.
For such a short length of text, it's almost not possible to use all available characters. Someone also pointed out that there are no repeating characters throughout. This too is strange.
I think it's quite likely that, if this is English, some characters stand for combinations of letters. For instance you could have one character that stands for 'o' and one that stands for 'oo'.
Do the gold links appear on the next page as a reverse pattern or are the pages 2 links thick?
you're reading it backwards and upside down you fucking idiost
>>17706950
I analyzed 38 different characters, and there were many repeating, so whoever said that is fucking retarded and didn't even bother to check
>>17706991
We're not reading it at all yet
>>17707001
They mean consecutively. I don't see any do you?
>>17707002
Your mom's reading it.
>>17706933
cute. CUTE!
() ()
(._.)
(><)
(")(")
The book is sideways, it's meant to read like an Asian scroll.
It's the simplest way to firewall your code without too much extra effort, since it's hardwired into our brain to read stuff in books like it where a book.
page back front and page 2 back
page 3 front and page 4 back
page 5 front and page 6 back
or something like that
>>17706915
rude
>>17706978
The pages are one layer thick and the back of the page is almost a reverse of the front but not really because of the directions the rings lie. You can see this if you compare the right page here
>>17705822
to the left page here
>>17705824
After you super sleuths have broken the code on this book maybe you can take a crack at this one.
>>17707089
SHIT
FOR FUCKS SAKE OP
>>17706807
no its a 3 by 3 there is only 1 character that appears 2 times that has the middle column first row used.
see
>>17705878
>>17705905
>>17707117
Where does this character appear? Please be specific.
This is why I love coming to /x/ occasionly.
I probably can use this pictures in my PnP roleplay group.
I found this in my great-grandma's bomb-shelter, hidden in a Nike shoebox. What could it be?
>>17707117
Are you sure it just doesn't use the first two rings in the top and bottom rows so it looks like the middle row starts further over?
like
001
.01
011
or whatever, I don't know which character you're talking about.
>>17707117
I don't know what characters are you seeing. Because of how it's made is impossible a 3x3 configuration. It's 3-2-3 and there are just 37 unique characters, and the book is composed of 113 total, that means that they repeat, I uploaded a pic where I show you the frequency, that means how many times a char repeats.
See >>17706670
>>17706670
It does roughly follow zipf's law at least.
>>17706670
Has anyone noticed that all these letters use either 5 or 3 links to form the characters? I'm not sure what that means, but it's interesting. It also means that if you invert the links, they might form an existing character.
>>17707218
nice find anon. Thanks for being competent and not a loser
>>17707207
I just isolated every char and looked if they repeated, then I wrote down how many times they repeated.
I'm not following any algorythm, so I just don't fucking know what you're talking about
>>17707248
>>_ ) _
>> ( (
>>_ ) )
3
2
3
>>17707263
okay but there are characters like this
>) _ _
>_ _ _
>_ ) )
thus 3 x 3
>>17707272
please show me that char
>>17707249
zipf's law is a linguistic/probability law that roughly states that in any given natural text in any language the Nth most frequent character appears about 1/nth of the time the most frequent character appears. With a small test sample size as only ~100 characters it's not gonna follow it very accurate, but the trend certainly is there.
>>17707272
>) _ _
> _ _
>_ ) )
3
2
3
>>17707278
look at literally the first character
then look at the last character on the first line of the second page the ( has so the first part of the char not the middle otherwise there would be no space.
>>17707272
You would need to show a character that either has three gold links consecutively in its middle row or two gold links with a gray link between them and there aren't any. You can choose to think of it as a 3x3 grid in which the first column of the second row is never used if that helps you. The reddit image either chooses to represent it that way or the creator of that image didn't notice it but to me at least it helps "read" it to know it's 3-2-3 sort of a "double cross" if you will.
>>17707218
This is definitely an interesting observation and odd that it's close to even. Care to count them throughout to see if that ratio stays consistent? It might be something like numbers vs letters, or capital letters. >>17706670 could be a quick way to generate a total count.
>>17707278
page 2 line 4 first char
>>17707218
Eg; if that last part didn't make sense
I really hope that whatever artist created this is laughing his as off right now.
>>17707323
>) _ _
> _ _
>_ ) )
3
2
3
>>17706641
>>17706644
>>17706646
>>17706651
>>17706657
>>17706670
Has anyone proofed these already?
>>17707330
There are some mirrored chars as well
Has the possibility that the blank spaces surrounding the colored chain hold the message been discussed?
>>17707348
Working on that now. Doing my own transcription, while proofing those. That way we have a second set of eyes on it, and go from there.
>>17707322
> It might be something like numbers vs letters, or capital letters.
With 17 5-ring characters and 20 3-ring ones letters vs numbers aren't very likely. Maybe if they also incorporate punctuation, but even then it would be very varied punctuation used for such a short text.
Capital vs lower case seems more sensible at first, but there would then be multiple capitals seemingly randomly thrown around.
>>17707338
no its more like
>_ ) _ ) _ )
>_ _ _ _ _ _
>_ _ _ ) _ )
because the space between letters is
>_ )
>( _
>_ )
now look at page 2 line 1 last character after the space it starts with a middle gold (
the letter below it doesnt start with it this "letter" is the only one that is like that.
someone ealier mentioned that the space between letters might be important i believe this is true because it could potentially mean more characters
like this
oox
oxo
oox
would be different from
oxo
xoo
oxo
>>17707374
There are way more than 37 characters. Poll all available data before you draw conclusions. The pages you analyzed might be a table.
>>17707376
The more you try to explain the less sense you're making. We have determined that every character is plotted on a 3-2-3 matrix. If you can show any character that cannot be described by a 3-2-3 matrix please cut it out and post it. I already did Page 2 line 1 last character >>17705961 here
>>17707381
I meant with 17 vs 20 unique characters, letters vs numbers would be difficult to imagine as long as the numbers correspnd to the basic arabic numerals.
I am going to look into upper VS lower case a bit more deeply and actualy count all of them.
>>17707395
What he's basically saying is "B-BUT IT COULD BE MORE COMPLEX THEN YOU MIGHT THINK!"
He's rushing too much
>>17707363
I don't think so. There's no point inverting the symbols to solve, because they're just symbols. They have no intrinsic meaning beyond the letters we assign. Their form doesn't matter, just so long as we're being consistent. Which is why this whole 3x3 vs 21212 argument is invalid.
It's possible that once the cryptic is solved, there may be a second message within the inverted characters, but that won't be revealed until we've solved the first half of this.
>>17707322
There are;
69 x3's
45 x5's
>>17706644
1st line last character is wrong and offset by 1 too much.
should be
>(--
>))
>((-
Line 2 3rd character is also wrong and should be offset one more than it is.
I was gonna use them as base material, but they seem to have some glaring errors.
>>17707395
look at the spaces between the characters
>>17707458
Different anon here, but it doesn't seem wrong to me. There is a padding of exactly one black ) between every symbol.
As far as I can tell, the symbols you've highlighted here are still:
> ) - - ) - -
> ( - ( (
> - ) - ) - )
so the 3-2-3 pattern still holds true.
>>17707397
Were you basing these numbers off one of these colored charts here >>17707330 ?
If so, I noticed the 2nd row, 4th character is the same as the 9th row, 2nd character. If this is the case wouldn't that make a total of 36 characters which could possibly 26 letters, 10 numbers?
>>17707458
>) _ _
> ( (
>) _ )
>>17707055
ooooooooooooo
>>17707485
Yes I was and I have checked briefly and already found two errors in this chart making basically all counting that's done based on them meaningless.
Me and another anon are proofing those charts right now.
>>17707487
>) _ _
>_ ) )
>) _ )
>>17706670
Did you have any meaning behind the colors or were they assigned arbitrarily for better reading?
>>17707499
If you would prefer, but in no character is line 2 row 1 ever used and it's simpler to view the characters if you ignore it and it reduces the possibility of column shifted characters - eliminating completely from the character set we've established.
At least the RPfags don't actually hinder our efforts.
>>17707441
>1st line last character is wrong and offset by 1 too much.
>should be
>>(--
>>))
>>((-
No, I have it right, because of the 323 paradigm it has to be
- ) -
( (
- ) )
Line 2, 3rd char has to be:
) - -
( -
- - )
>>17707534
i know its simpler but im just saying its something to consider. because if it is a 3x3x3 grid then their are more possible combos
look at things i circled on this if its 3x2x3 grid then the circled colors are the same if its a 3x3x3 they could potentially be different.
>>17707504
better reading
>>17707546
Trying to recreate things I am running into problems with page 2 line 1.
If we follow the 3-2-3 paradigm, there are sometimes 2 and sometimes only 1 iron ring between characters in the second line of rings.
I am actually starting to think 3x3 is actually a better way to consider things.
I bet government crypyologists would have had this decyphered yesterday. It seems weve made no progress besides making it easier to read
>>17707558
Screw it, I am gonna actually count rings now.
>>17707561
They would also be paid, work around the clock and be actually trained.
>>17707561
>I bet government crypyologists would have had this decyphered yesterday
yeah, no shit. Having access to huge fucking computers with top-of-the-line algorithms as well as multiple experts would make it a bit easier to solve.
>>17707558
I'm firmly in the 3-2-3 camp, but I would love if someone did this just to see if anything came of it.
>>17707558
I saw this different spacing all over the book, so I don't think it matters, but if you think you should consider another paradigm, go for it, I gave up already.
Just hope something I did worth something
>>17707569
see
>>17707548
pretty much everyone in the first thread and the shitty thread on reddit was in the 3x3 camp
>>17707566
I mean are there any famous cryptologists online? On twitter? Tgis has to be one of the most interesting items even theyve seen. Feels out of indiana jones. Maybe they would give it a look
>>17707569
a quick count gives us 22 rings per line, no matter if going right or left.
By going for a 3-2-3 paradigm ther cannot ever be a fixed amount of rings between characters, meaning in some cases where ther is only one brass ring in the second line we actualy can not know if it's a
>(-
or a
>-(
We HAVE to go with a 3x3 even if the cahracters themself only could be represented by a 3-2-3.
>>17707575
With a 3x3 theres always 3x3 for one character. one column of rings, then 3x3 for antoher character.
The only exception are when there is ine 3x3 left blank as a space.
>>17707602
Ok, so I tried to verify what you're saying and I see this (pic)
Am I getting wrong the 3x3 thing?
>>17707628
I'm having the same problems with the spacing on line 2 of page 2. Without the perfect spacing I don't think the 3x3 method is any more definitive than the other one.
>>17707638
I'm thinking that the spacing gets different when there's a "short" char, for stetics I guess. I'm sorry I cant explain this better, I'm not fluent in english.
>>17707628
i see it as
>-)
>(-
>-)
is one
so
> )))
>(((
> )))
would be a
xxx
xxx
xxx
on a 3x3 grid
> ) _ _
>( ( _
> _ _ )
would be
xoo
xxo
oox
etc
>>17707581
I think it's safe to say 323 is more likely. It has fewer characters, making it closer to the English language, and it's also got the 5:3 rule going for it. This second point alone shows that whomever developed the language, did so with care, order and pragmatism.
If we're going to solve this, our best chance is in the 323 camp, but also, if we're going to spend the whole time arguing over 3x3 vs 323, no one is going to solve anything either.
>>17707628
I just ran into the same problem.
I basically means that 3-2-3 AND 3x3 simply are not sufficient and with BOTH systems one can not 100% determine characters that only have 1 gold ring in the middle.
>>17707658
The problem with 3-2-3 is that some characters could look transcribed into it the same while they differ in the book.
>>17707654
I don't understand why your first grid is 2-2-2, in fact i don't understand anything what you're saying
>>17707665
Do you have an example of this, cause I'm not 100% sure of what you're saying?
>>17707658
the 5 3 thing still holds true in a 3x3 grid. if you think its stright english the might appear twice in the message.
page 2 line 3
and page 3 line 1 first word
its probably the because the last character is the character that appears the most. e is the most common letter in the english language
the is the most common trigram in the english language
th is the most common bigram in the english language
e is the number letter to end a word.
t is the most common start of a word
>>17707687
3x3 or 323 everything you said apply
>>17707687
also the characters the represent t appears second or third most frequently.
>>17707687
5:3 does not hold in a 3x3 as it is gold:silver. So it would become 5:4 and 3:6
>>17707687
also if we take the strange spacing on page 2 there is a character thats by itself on line 5. possible a 1 letter word? if so its probably A or I and since that character appears more frequently its probably.
but this is all assuming its just 1 to 1 characters which i dont think it is because there are like 37 unique characters whats all this other crap gonna be?
>>17707706
>but this is all assuming its just 1 to 1 characters which i dont think it is because there are like 37 unique characters whats all this other crap gonna be?
This.
I think one symbol is more a syllable or a word
>>17707698
i was referring to the fact that all the letters would have between 3 and 5 gold chains only.
>>17707055
Somebody, get on this!
>>17707717
if thats true this shit just got WAY WAY harder and would probably require a key or something
>>17707674
If the spaces between characters is random we don't know if a character with only 1 gold ring in the middle line is actually (- or -).
That said, it just might still work if you take the upper ringline as a character start. Still there is value in having the ringcount method as well as a fallback.
>>17707719
Yes I know what you were referring to. I was making it known that the 5:3 ratio isn't about the gold chains it has, but the ratio between those gold chains and the silver chains.
>>17707706
Currently we work under the assuption that linebreaks do not indicate something. If they do things get a LOT more complicated as >>17707724 stated.
>>17707706
If there is 37 characters that's true; however, until those Anons get back on proofing, does anyone have confirmation that its 37 unique characters? Cause I haven't seen consistent evidence to prove that. If its 36, for example, it may be 26 letters and 10 numbers.
>>17707745
But, 37 or 36 different chars (a to z + numbers + Ñ maybe?) are too much for a 113 chars long text, obviously just if i got the chars right in first place. I'm doubting that these 36/37 different chars are alphabet + numbers, and actually i'm starting to doubt about the isolation of symbols I did.
>>17707745
someone in the first thread said 37 i believe, i counted it my self earlier and its somewhere around there.
but even if its 26 the odds of it containing every letter in the alphabet and number 0-9 in only something like 127 characters seems not likely. unless this itself is some kind of key.
![254[1].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/eIb05gu.jpg "254[1].jpg")
>>17707561
This. This thread has absolutely gone to complete shit I'm extremely disappointed in /x/ right now the dreamers have completely taken over and nobody is actually putting in any work toward getting this deciphered they're just arguing over inconsequential bullshit.
>>17707566
It wouldn't matter how great the algorithms were. You people have fucked around all day today and no one has transcoded the data into alphanumerics that can even be understood by a computer.
You're all too busy arguing over if the characters are 3-2-3 or 3-3-3 when it literally doesn't matter other than making it easier to read. There are still 36 discrete characters which is a very workable amount, representing letters A-Z and numerals 0-9.
My opening post for this thread clearly expressed what needs to be done and no one is doing it. There's no arguing about the correct steps to approach this problem. Occam's Razor. We pursue the simplest hypothesis until it is eliminated then we consider the next simplest hypothesis that hasn't also been eliminated from testing the first hypothesis. If this thread was my classroom there would be a lot of people getting extra homework.
>>17707773
>>17707769
I was thinking it was in fact more along the lines of a key as its too short to say anything important anyway. Since it doesn't seem to have a string longer than 5 symbols. That was why I was figuring that it had all characters and numbers.
And this is all assuming it's anything at all and not a lesson in futility.
>>17707780
Oh I'm sorry Sir Master Cryptographer, we should have all just followed your instructions while you jacked off and came back to insult us. As the rest of us aren't cryptographers, the most useful thing we can do is iron out important details like character structure. So if you know exactly what needs to be done do it your fucking self or shut up.
>>17707780
so why dont you do something, if you know the steps.
also its stupid to assume the characters represent a-z and 1-9 because there are about 36.
every tweet on twitter is around the same length and doesn't have every number and every letter in it.
>>17707796
>>17707780
>Oh I'm sorry Sir Master Cryptographer, we should have all just followed your instructions while you jacked off and came back to insult us. As the rest of us aren't cryptographers, the most useful thing we can do is iron out important details like character structure. So if you know exactly what needs to be done do it your fucking self or shut up.
This is the second page counted ring by ring, where every 20x20 pixel square represents one ring.
So far it seems there is one irregularity in line 1 where the last character seems to have been shifted 1 ring to the left.
If there are no irregularities like this on the other pages I could chalk this up to a mistake in making the book and the 3-2-3 or 3x3 (it actually does not matter which one we use) would still work. I there are other instances like this though, I highly doubt that we are ever going to find out anything.
>>17707818
maybe is just a mistake of the maker, we should move on
>>17707797
I'm not assuming that although I may be tentatively presuming it. It'll be the job of the deciphering software to work that out but it needs to actually be given the data which it can't be since no one has transcoded it.
How do you know you have the book upside right?
Could you not hold the book like you would with any normal book you're about to read and vertically flip it so the back cover becomes the front.
Does that not change how the
))
((
..)
links appear?
Maybe you need to take that into account too, like maybe one page is both deciphered upside right and upside down backwards.
>>17707818
Actually the second row of that last character seems shifted left by one square. On the page itself there are only 3 rings after it. Everything else in your image is correct though.
https://www.reddit.com/r/codes/comments/4jwrg3/coded_chain_link_book_found_in_grandpas_attic/
Link to the reddit forum about this. Not much in it but i thought i'd provide the link for if someone comes up with anything
>>17707818
You omitted a ring right here. You only show four blanks and there are five can we please move on now?
Why are all the pictures with a white background ? Looks fake to me . . .
>>17707840
not only the last character, the second to last as well, my bad, ther is no problem actually, sorry to stir things up.
>>17707835
please explain how i do this and i will do so tomorrow.
>>17707859
The object exists, it is unique, OP is actually in possession of it.
>>17707854
I should not count when it's that late
>>17707859
read the bread. its on a large piece of foam board.
Just got home and finally got a chance to catch up with the thread. Sounds like you guys didn't get much farther than last night :(
I can take what I have in the pastebin link and get you symbols for it. I have no idea how to do the dicphering, though.
>>17707780
And you too, hard at work I see
Do we have a full transcription to anything in a nice linear form? Like:
XOO
OOO
XXX
to
100000111
I don't wanna re-do it if someone's already done it (someone should have by now)
Well this still didn't prove anything as it still leaves a spacing problem for the 3x3 method with a space in-between. And once you start trying to explain it with special rules you hit another problem as the fifth row follows the 3x3 with a single space pattern correctly.
By the way, those links are 4 in 1 chainmail if that matters.
>>17707780
>It wouldn't matter how great the algorithms were.
If I had access to a good algorithm I would run the transposed A-Z,0-9 translation and, finding nothing, have the program substitute a number for one of the letters and reiterate this substitution until every permutation has been tried. This is still assuming it's a 1-1 English substitution cipher, but if the code contains numbers or punctuation then one of the substitution combinations would possibly reduce those symbols out, so that only coded letters have transposed letters and coded numbers/punctuation had only transposed numbers/letters. That would make it much easier for the deciphering algorithm to function, but doing all those substitution permutations is extremely time-intensive.
>>17707878
i dont think so.
>>17707878
Yes, that's what I did last night, at pastebin.com/DwbRwjey. It's using the 3-2-3 method, which was apparently in hot debate tonight? Looks like it isn't the answer though, judging by replies I'm seeing...?
the message is totally gonna be
DRINK MORE OVALTINE
corrected version if anyone cares.
>>17707866
Step One: Take the collection of characters Anon has established here >>17706670 and assign a letter or number to each one. You can use some method if you want but it can be arbitrary.
Step two: Go back through using your temporary key and type out the letters corresponding to all the symbols in the book in the same arrangement they appear, either using the actual photos (more accurate) or the catalogs Anon made here >>17706641 >>17706644 >>17706646 >>17706651 >>17706657
That's literally all I expected to get done today but it didn't and that's disappointing. Once that's done, Anons can start independently plugging the data into various decryption programs and they can independently rearrange the input however they want and see if they get results from the software that make any kind of sense. If they think they do then they can come back and post what they got, how they arranged the data to get it, and why for additional peer review and brainstorming. THAT'S when it's worth it to start debating what's currently being debated.
>>17707897
Okay now I do see what everyone is actually focusing on about that last character in the first line of that page seemingly breaking the rule of (to use the 3x3 nomenclature) row 2 column 1 always being blank. I believe this is a simple error in spacing made by the craftsman.
>>17707897
RSTLN and E for a vowel please
_ _ _ _ _
_ _ _ _
_ _ _
_ _ _ _
_ __
_ _ _ _ _
>>17707898
Well problem 1 is that that image is currently incorrect as one symbol is shown twice plus whatever else these >>17707498 anons are proofing for.
Problem 2 is again you expect others to do work for you. Offer your opinions on what needs to be done, but if you can't do it yourself don't expect others to do it just cause you think you are right.
>>17707907
so much for alt code spacing . . .
_ _ _ _ _
_ _....._ _
_ _ _
_ _ _ _
_ _ ....._
_ _ _ _ _
Observation:
(Using the 3-2-3 system) there are only 7 characters that do NOT have a gold ring in the upper left corner.
Those are:
- All 4 characters in the last line of page 1
- P.2 L.1 last character
- P.5 L.1 character 3
- P.5 L.3 last character
>>17707906
I am done halfway with page 3 and there is a similar problem
Hey guys, I'm back with a list based on the pastebin I made last night (pastebin.com/DwbRwjey).
## Page 1
ABCDE
CFEG
HIJK
## Page 2
LDMNO
FP BE
QRF
STFU
DV S
CSGFJ
## Page 3
QRF
WBAF
XYFZ1
2YQ
EFUFZ
3YPNF
## Page 4
GFAQ
S2DYQ
LBVF
MSE
9FU
PFS7
## Page 5
QR6A
WSZ1
XYSLO
CA4ND
3D5FJ
TLS18
>>17707923
So ... what does that tell us ?
>>17707895
BE SURE TO DRINK YOUR OVALTINE
>>17707923
Forgot to mention, it uses A-Z and 1-9. So, 35 characters.
>>17707924
Dude, I don't know, just listening to what >>17707780 said to do. I personally have no idea what the next step is
>>17707916
are any of those characters the same?
maybe numbers? four numbers in a row could be a date?
Okay guys. I'm the one working on proofing that guys first one, while transcribing my own to eventually assign numbers and letters to.
I have also devised an alphabet for the ring characters. It is formulaic and easy to create the symbols once I devised the proper rules. I was having trouble translating the grid to a cohesive letter format, but I've got it now.
His first page checks out and is 100% proofed.
Ignore the notes at the bottom, they are old news now. Will finish more tomorrow.
Holy shit I just translated it! But it's Russian.
ÐÑ‚o пpocÑ‚o шyткa, бpaÑ‚aн.
>>17707936
none of them are the same
>>17707917
It may be consistent then when you run into characters with completely blank columns at the beginning or end. It is very unlikely to hold any meaning in and of itself and even if it did it would add complexity to the problem that there's no need to add at this point.
>>17707911
Which symbol is shown twice? If you've discovered that the image needs refined then either refine it or at LEAST specifically state the revision that needs to be made. Or fuck it you can just ignore me, even intentionally do the opposite just because "I think I'm right" but this whole project probably wouldn't have even gotten off the ground to start with if I hadn't laid down the fundamentals at the very beginning last night. I'm not looking for any recognition here, I just want for Anonymous to solve this before some douchebag on Reddit does and Anonymous is SUPPOSED to be a collective where everyone does what they can and works together not a bunch of defiant children that cut off their noses to spite their faces.
As it is, I'm truly concerned that when I get up in the morning this will have spun completely out of control. I don't actually have any spare brain-time until Friday night and if I have to actually do all this shit myself then I swear to fucking God I'm going to make a Reddit account just to take credit for the whole damn thing.
![2407724_orig[1].png](https://i.imgur.com/OWPiDmt.png "2407724_orig[1].png")
>>17707947
You get a gold star because you're like the only Anon doing what needs to be done.
>>17707948
fuck off, Anon
op, if you are here, can you tell us about your grandfather? Where he was from, some background?
Based on 3x3 I've come to
ABCDE CFEG HIJK LDMNO FP QE RSF TSFU DV T CTGFJ RSF WBXF YZFab cZR EFUFa VZPdF GFXR TcDZR LQVF eeE fFU PFTg RShX WTab YZTLi CXjdD kDNFl mLTbn
>>17707982
he answered this earlier
![gold-star-clipart-ncXnGRBcB[1].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/wRgUgLp.jpg "gold-star-clipart-ncXnGRBcB[1].jpg")
>>17707923
Oh wait this looks good too. I'm actually willing to spend a little time right now messing with this..
>>17707984
oh shit it all makes sense now!
Page 3 seems to be all over the place with spacing irregularities.
It almost seems that wenever a character is only 2 rings wide the author did not make the space towards the next character 2 empty rings as well and instead shifte the line toward the left 1 space.
Page 2 suggest further that ending with a 2 ring wide character or starting with one does not cause a shift toward left though.
This basicaly confirms that the space between characters is meaningless and that the actual start of a character is only signified by the visual start and relative position toward it's own start. This would also explain why nearly all characters have the top left ring golden.
>>17707992
Interesting find anon. Good work!
>>17707992
I only quickly skimmed through page 4&5 looking for said pattern of a leftshift of the rest of a line whenever there is a 2 ring wide character and this is consistent throughout the book.
I apologize for the unneccessary distraction and my findings basically only confirming the working theory, but I am someone who is easily put of by what seems small irregularities.
>>17708010
It's all good anon, I'm sure your OCD will get another chance to save the day farther on in this puzzle
>>17707923
I am beginning to have some success with Page 2 on quipqiup
Pic related...
>>17708037
Oh shit, that's actually awesome. Keep the thread updated as it progresses
>>17708026
At least (after figuring out how to read it) I could basically proof
>>17706644 and
>>17706646
I'm still unsure about 2 characters, but for the moment those characters are unique anyway and if read like I'd suggest don't suddenly correlate with other characters, thus not mattering as long as on stays consitent in it's use.
As lecturing Anon said, now it's basically assigning numbers/letters to the characters and running it through algorythmsa couple of times and seeing what comes around.
>Various possible solutions that fit the pattern on page 2
>Pick one that seems particularly meaningful to you, create a partial key, assign the key letters to the symbols appearing on other pages to check if it adds meaning to them as well
MIGHT DE UP OLD ANDY IF A WARDS
MIGHT DE UP OLD ANDY IF A CARDS
LIGHT DO BE MUD ANDY IF A WARDS
MIGHT DE UP OLD ANDY IF A BARDS
LIGHT DO WE MUD ANDY IF A CARDS
LIGHT DO BE MUD ANDY IF A CARDS
MIGHT DE UP OLD ANDS IF A BAWDY
MIGHT DO BE CUD ANDY IF A WARDS
LIGHT DO WE MUD ANDY IF A BARDS
MIGHT DO UP BED ANDY IF A WARDS
RIGHT DO WE MUD ANDS IF A BALDY
RIGHT DE UP OLD ANDS IF A BAWDY
MIGHT DO UP BED ANDY IF A CARDS
WITCH DR ME OLD ANDS IF A GAUDY
MIGHT DO WE CUD ANDY IF A BARDS
WITCH DR MY GOD ANDS IF A LAUDE
WITCH DO MY BUD ANDS IF A GARDE
LIGHT DO BE CUD ANDY IF A WARDS
QUICK DR ME OLD ANDS UP A BAWDY
LIGHT DO UP BED ANDY IF A WARDS
RIGHT DO WE MUD ANDY IF A BALDS
WITCH DO BY MUD ANDS IF A GARDE
MIGHT DO WE CUD ANDS IF A BALDY
WITCH DE UP OLD ANDY IF A BARDS
MIGHT DO UP LED ANDY IF A WARDS
LIGHT DO ME BUD ANDY IF A WARDS
LIGHT DO UP BED ANDY IF A CARDS
LIGHT DO WE CUD ANDY IF A BARDS
LIGHT DO MR PED ANDS IF A BAWDY
RIGHT DO WE CUD ANDS IF A BALDY
MIGHT DO WE BUD ANDY IF A CARDS
MIGHT DO UP LED ANDY IF A CARDS
TOUCH DR WE MID ANDS OF A BALDY
LIGHT DO ME BUD ANDY IF A CARDS
WITCH DR BE OLD ANDS IF A GAUDY
BUTCH DE OF MID ANDY UP A WARDS
WITCH DO MR BED ANDS IF A GAUDY
LIGHT DO ME CUD ANDY IF A WARDS
MIGHT DO UP RED ANDS IF A BALDY
WITCH DR BY GOD ANDS IF A LAUDE
MIGHT DO WE CUD ANDY IF A BALDS
MIGHT DO UP RED ANDS IF A BAWDY
>>17708067
Nah, I am going to sleep now.
It's 7:30 am here.
If nothing comes up during my sleeptime I will try to get a bit further behind this when I wake up.
>tfw I am still worried because it's 37 unique characters and that's almost too many to appear in such a short text
ABCDE
CFEG
HIJK
LDMNOFP BEQRF
STFU
DV SCSGFJ
yielded
F THIS HE S MY WORKIUBJECTS PLEAVED IN AHAME O
Which seems interesting...
LDMNOFP BEQRF
STFU
DV S
CSGFJQRF
WBAF
XYFZ12YQ
F SUBJECT MOVE I NEW SAILIKE GOVED THEY REP12RO
ABCDE
CFEG
HIJK
LDMNO
FP BE
QRF
STFU
DV S
CSGFJ
QRF
POSIR SERGYLDQUICK BEFORT HEAVEN I WAS AGED THE
LDMNOFP BEQRF
STFU
DV S
CSGFJQRF
WBAF
BUTCHER OVINE AGES UP A MADELINE WOKE
BUTCHER OVINE AGES UP A MADELINE JOKE
BUTCHES OVINE AGER UP A MADELINE WOKE
BUTCHES OVINE AYER UP A MADELINE WOKE
BUTCHES OVINE AGER UP A MADELINE JOKE
BUTCHES OVINE AYER UP A MADELINE JOKE
BUSTLED IMAGE OXEN UP O COVERAGE WIFE
BUTCHER OVINE AXES UP A MADELINE WOKEHUNTLEY IMAGE OWED UP O COVERAGE FIXE
BUTCHER OVINE AXES UP A MADELINE JOKE
BUTCHER OVINE AGES UP A MADELINE YOKE
HUNTLEY IMAGE OWED UP O COVERAGE SIZE
BUTCHER OVINE AYES UP A MADELINE WOKE
HUSTLED IMAGE OBEY UP O COVERAGE FINE
HUNTLEY IMAGE OXES UP O COVERAGE WIFE
BUTCHES OVINE AGER UP A MADELINE YOKE
BUTCHER OVINE AYES UP A MADELINE JOKE
BUTCHER OXIDE ANEW UP A LAKESIDE MOVE
HUNTLEY IMAGE OXES UP O COVERAGE WIDE
HUSTLED IMAGE OBEY UP O COVERAGE WIFE
WITCHED RUBLE OPES IN O MOVEABLE FRYE
HUSTLED IMAGE OBEY UP O COVERAGE FIXE
COUGHER TWINE APEX OF A MADELINE STYE
BUTCHER OVINE AXES UP A MADELINE YOKE
HURTLES IMAGE OWED UP O COZENAGE FIVE
HUSTLED IMAGE OXEN UP O COVERAGE WIFE
WINKLED USAGE OBEY IT O COVERAGE FUME
HUSTLED IMAGE OBEY UP O COVERAGE WINE
HUNTLEY IMAGE OXES UP O COVERAGE FIDE
BUSTLED IMAGE OVER UP O COZENAGE WIFE
HUNTLEY IMAGE OWED US O COVERAGE FIXE
JURYMEN OXIDE ABET UP A LAKESIDE HOWE
BUCKLEY AMIDE OXEN UP O FORESIDE HAVE
BUSTLED IMAGE OVER UP O COZENAGE FIXE
COUGHED TRIKE AMEN OF A WAVELIKE STYE
HURTLES IMAGE OWED UP O COZENAGE FIXE
WITCHED RUBLE OPEN IS O MOVEABLE FRYE
SUBTLER IMAGE OWED UP O COZENAGE FIVE
WITCHED RUBLE OXES IN O MOVEABLE FRYEHUNTLEY IMAGE ODES UP O COVERAGE WIFE
This is almost certainly something...
>>17708111
>>17708126
>>17708146
>>17708184
these are all assuming line breaks mean nothing, right?
>>17707984
Okay, I'll compare with you so far. I have the same thing as you up to Q...sort of.
The last character on the first line of the second page is bizarre. It might be a mistake by the author, a character that just doesn't fit in with the rest. So, you see in my image I have it accounted for as O or possibly D.
On the second line, second page, first character after the gap is another strange one. If you look at the image of the book outlined in red that i also postwd yesterday, you'll notice that the character directly above it seems to indicate that it is a new character, taking up the Q position now. However, it could be debated. The guy who I am proofing right now who posted the colored graphs earlier has it as a previously seen symbol, in this case, B.
I'm done for the night for real now. Have a look over this guy's and see if you see any issues with it, or disparities between mine and the other that I may have overlooked. Specifically, the character after the gap in line two page two.
cant wait to find out what this means even if its nothing it still is mysterious and spooky
i know nothing when it comes to decoding and all this, where can i learn?
>>17708189
No, actually the spacing is what's currently giving me a headache. Different spacing yields different results and I could definitely use help.
I've been using quipquip for these but there's also a site that uses Silverlight here I'm sure a lot of you have it installed http://esmithy.net/software/cryptomatic-an-automatic-cryptogram-solver-silverlight/
Basically what needs to be done now, assuming that >>17707923 is an accurate transcoding of the data (proofers please proof) is for anons to start mucking with the spacing and plugging various portions in to see if they can get some results that seem to their quantum-minds like what they expect to see and if they do then working backwards to see if that particular key also lends meaning to parts they DIDN'T plug into the program.
This is the opportunity for people who think that the book should be read right to left or top to bottom or whatever to rearrange the text of >>17707923 in those ways and see if they get results then check those results against the rest of the text.
This should be the most exciting part of the project but it's getting way late for me to be doing it myself.
>>17708239
Based on my proof I just posted, I'm not sure that the B on the second line is correct. It might be Q, but I need second opinions. This would change that ordering quite a bit.
That's why I pasted what I fed the decryption program at the top of the results that I got so Anon could see the way I changed the spaces/line breaks.
>>17708256
Yes, any revisions to the accuracy of the transcoded data would be enormously useful. My brain's way in a different mode right now and starting to heat up from rushing to get results that might excite other anons to also attempt to re-space and decrypt or to take any fragment they liked that I found and backward-extrapolate to see if they like any effect it might have on the rest of the text.
>>17708266
I wonder where this will be when I wake up tomorrow. Keep at it, anon. If no one else is proofing tonight, I'll be back tomorrow afternoon to finish.
Part of my problem is that quipquip seems to completely ignore numerals. I may have to switch to a Windows computer and install Silverlight to see if cryptomatic does any better with them.
Good thing I don't believe in purely arcane magic or else I might be afraid of accidentally casting a spell in the process of deciphering this...
>>17706072
>Navajos
legendary natives that helped us during ww2
>the enemy of my enemy
>>17707796
Kill yourself.
>>17706921
>Es el libro del diablo!
>It is the book of the devil!
he thinks its Codex Gigas
>>17707924
>>17708226
Contribute or shut the hell up.
>>17707127
>Current year
>Not knowing what chain mail is
>>17706072
>we
You did shit, faggot.
