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>Latest News
The Kickstarter for Beckett's Jyhad Diary is live!
http://theonyxpath.com/the-deluxe-becketts-jyhad-diary-kickstarter-is-now-live/
This week's Monday Meeting Notes:
http://theonyxpath.com/hacky-coughy-edition-monday-meeting-notes/
>Question
Can you guys not shit up the thread like last time?
>>47993824
You're right. Let's start off with a nice, neutral topic. Why is Dirty Secrets of the Black Hand the best book to come out of either WoD or CofD?
>>47993952
i prefer the new version for v20.
those familiar mages are where its at.
Can an oWoD vampire become host to a Bane?
[Insert Jokes about Brujah Formori here]
>>47994048
yes. although most banes cant actually control a vampire they are in. there are i believe 2-3 types of banes that specifically can go into vamps and take over. they've got stats somewhere.
I kind of do want to do a WoD dating sim, but I know it would be too time consuming and I'd flake out. I still haven't gotten up the courage to send my submission in. I believe in my ability to write a submission more than my ability to write an email.
>>47994321
Send the submission out. They straight up give you a format with which to send the e-mail. Just follow that and you're fine. Finish what you start.
>>47994357
Yeah, but it's the part about selling myself. I don't have anything that unique about me. "I'm totes a tranny" isn't really the same as "I'm a woman with Italian-American heritage who knows quite a lot about Italy and writes alt-history fiction".
Admittedly I also worry my reputation will proceed me, but then again ArcaneArts has a job.
>>47994443
Oh for the love of...just submit the damn thing!
Literally everyone has some kind of experience worth writing about, just write whatever comes to mind. You live in some part of a country rich with history, you've spent time as part of some kind of financial class, whatever. Put it down. Put it down and send the thing. The worst they can do is not give you a call-back. It's a submission, not a judgement of you as a person. It's not the end of the world if you don't get to write for Hunter. What's important is that you at least try.
And in the event someone bites, no one gives a fuck about your stupid reputation as long as you can:
1. Write words.
2. Write words fast and to a decent quality and size.
3. Listen to dev redlines and use them to write words better.
ArcaneArts gets to write things because he can make deadlines and listens to his client. He is capable of putting dumb forums bullshit behind him when it's time to actually do work. If you consider yourself a better writer than ArcaneArts, I assume you are also capable of this.
>>47994984
But what they explicitly want is people with diverse character traits. In a tiebreak I will always lose, and this shit is always a tie.
>>47994443
>ArcaneArts has a job
You'll do fine.
>>47995029
You have no way of knowing that unless you actually do it, and even then you're still in the pool for potential writers. Fucking submit your shit, or stop talking about wanting to submit your shit. It's that simple.
This is far too much inner fucking turmoil for a gig that (if Rich Thomas wasn't drunk when he wrote that comment in the Changeling the Dreaming Open Call) pays 1 cent a word minimum. There is no loss or fail state out of this. Just write the e-mail and send it.
>>47995333
That wasn't actually me. My problem isn't about "I don't have diverse traits so I shouldn't try", it's more the "how do I make my resume look good without outright lying" problem.
>pays 1 cent a word minimum.
Holy Jesus, they better give Devs the book for free.
>>47995751
It's better to be honest than to needlessly puff up your resume. You've never published anything before, that's fine. There's a reason they're looking for new blood. Just be straight with them, talk about what you have to offer (and everyone has something to offer), and let your submission do the rest of the talking.
When does a Malkavian stop a Prank that has gone off in the wrong direction? Especially if it has gone from "Hidden Camera" to a Sam Pepper-style "Social Experiment"?
>>47996712
If Camarilla, as soon as it stops being funny. If Sabbat, never because it will always be funny.
>>47996712
>>47997035
The kind of Malk that does so fannay pranks is the kind of Malk that shouldn't be played
Is it possible the have a mage that use a blob of animated liquid metal for attack and protection?
And how is that 2E? Did the fix the ridiculous OPness of 1E mages?
>>47997256
Yes.
If anything easier.
2e Mages >>> 1e Mages.
>>47997256
Mages are less "OP", but they're still going to be Mages.
>>47997080
>>47997035
The problem is that, staying with the "Hidden Camera" analogy, the pranked went away grumbling seconds before the presenter would have pointed out the camera and is now plotting against the actor who actually did the interactions...
>>47997256
The balance is kind of weird if you compare.
Some of the most bullshit silliness of 1e has been removed (near infinite success Rituals) and starting mages have more trouble casting spells on unwilling targets. Masters on the other hand rock even harder (but it is also harder to become one).
Paradox has more bite.
Mechanic question for Mage.
It costs a reach to change the primary spell factor, and the default potency of a spell is the number of dots you have in an arcana. Each point of potency heals two points of bashing damage.
Say a master of life spends reach to convert a spell that heals bashing damage from primary factor potency to primary factor duration. And then spends an additional reach to make it last for a scene. By default the spell will heal 10 bashing damage in a turn. Does this mean that the spell will now heal 10 bashing damage every turn for the duration of the scene or does the spell last until it's healed 10 points of bashing damage and then end?
>>47997528
If you change Primary Factor with Reach, the original Primary Factor is back to 1 (though technically the factors aren't ranked, so it's "one step up the chart"). You get default Primary Factor, not simply Default Potency. That's *why* spells have a Primary Factor in the first place. If something says the Primary Factor is Duration, you get [Arcanum] steps of Duration.
If you increase a spell to Advanced Duration that would have an immediate or single effect, it repeats the effect every interval of your Gnosis based casting time. At Gnosis 5, that means twice in an hour. But since you're changing Primary Factor, you'd only be healing 2 Bashing.
>>47997826
Thank you. I got another question about withstand.
If a spell can be withstood does that mean the appropriate resistance is subtracted from the number of success dice like it is with defense?
what practice of life do i need to make a dickgirl
>>47998305
Probably Life 4
>>47998070
No, it's subtracted from the final total.
So stuff like Degrading the Form, where the Primary Factor is Duration, *requires* you to add Potency through Spell Factors. If someone has Stamina 3, you'll need to take -6 in Spell Factor penalties just to have your spell treated as Potency 1.
>>47998305
>>47998326
Mutable Mask allows you to change physical features as a Veiling spell, though it's treated as being only a 'mask', not an actual real change. Many Faces (a Weaving spell) provides real changes that aren't illusory. So Weaving is what you'll want if you want someone who's, to quote Many Faces "entirely physical and functional" (which includes fertility).
The Primary Factor is Duration, but you won't need but one Potency to give a willing woman a dick. Depending on how the ST rules (there's no mention of Potency) it might require a little more to change a male, but I'm sure you'll be fine.
The main problem is that unless you *only* want it for sexy times--which is fine, but let's be honest, dicks are fun and useful--you'll want to Reach, and even then that's only a Week. I don't know why it bothers me in this fictional game but I always groan and sigh when it comes to "you have to re-up your power in X time units" stuff. Not like there isn't plenty of that in real life. Eating meals, taking showers, taking medication, etcetera. But "routine" stuff is always so boring to me, even if I don't personally have to sit through it.
Although unless you have Gnosis 5, performing a ritual to change your gender (or boost your stats, or whatever) is a lot more time consuming than taking a shower.
>>47998516
Totally worth it though.
Which pitfalls should i watch out for if i wanted to make a young character and wanna avoid being an annoying burden on the group? The concept of a gangrel neonate recently embraced and at a rather young age keeps coming back to me. Very enthusiastic about being a scary monster that goes bump in the night, but fails entirely at being scary, knows nothing about vampire society and is generally pretty naive. Habbit of being a bratty little shit, but likely to look up to older group members and place a lot of stock in their opinions. Just worried a character like that might be annoying.
>>47998726
>knows nothing about vampire society
Anything but this
You can either be young or ignorant, not both
>>47998726
How young is young? If you are under 12, watch out for having a bad memory of how kids at that age act. Kids in media are typically either hyper competent, or incompetent. In reality, kids know what they know, don't always act on it (even if you know X is wrong, you think you can get away with it), and are completely ignorant of stuff outside of what they do know.
If you are just like 14-17, I don't know if it is worth worrying about. You'll probably listen to too much Taylor Swift, but otherwise you are a normal human who is too worried about romance and belonging with no idea how to make either work.
>>47998726
I just wanna pinch your cheeks.
Although, what >>47998869 said. I think "randomly embraced by this one vampire who I never met again" is a bit overdone, and should only be used with characters who are new to the system and setting so that they can learn it as their character does. Most of the time you'll at least have been a Ghoul for a while.
>>47998879
No such thing as too much Taylor Swift.
>>47998692
But anon, that's clearly one and done, not a ritual that needs to be repeated!
Man, I could never go through with transitioning. I'd have trouble taking a pill, which is far, far less time consuming than a three hour ritual. It's like that Richard Hammond clip about malaria pills and birth control.
>>47998921
>>47998869
Noted on the young+ignorant part, my main idea was being new to the WoD and likely to believe most of what she's told, partially also because all my own WoD knowledge comes through vtmb and reading through character creation and such at a friend's place. Mainly, being
>cheek pinching
that was what i was going for, thinking of dumping composure in favor of manipulation, to emphasize easily buckling under pressure and mostly getting her way by appealing to parental instincts, whether on purpose or not. One less serious idea, was in case of OWoD, having the first trait to manifest from frenzy to be wolf ears or something, futher ruining any ability to be scary.
>X wants to be hardcore but Y won't let her
>>47999638
>believe most of what she's told
You might think that's merely an inconvenience for you, but honestly it's also going to fuck with the rest of the group, in that they're going to have to mitigate all your fuckups.
Or they won't care, and you'll be miserable as everyone and their mother will be messing with you.
Monday Meeting Notes when
>>47999871
Not them, but it doesn't seem like they'll have to mitigate much, especially if they're training her. In fact, that could be a good reason for her to be part of the coterie, she's being trained.
Quick! I need supernatural artifacts to throw at my Hunter group.
>>48000996
clay tablets recovered from south america (or, clay tablets in south america that your hunters are sent to retrieve).
those deciphering them go insane, not like lovecraftian horrific knowledge, but more like infected 28 days later RAGE insane.
preface- strange crimes and assaults in a metropolitan museum district - missing museum staff
or
humanitarian mission to the amazon basin runs afoul of strange jungle flu that causes hysteria (super rabies?), old tribal legends, etc. you can even insert the jungle adventure into the ongoing urban chronicle with a flashback oneshot using pregenerated characters if you know your players well enough - or else have different hunter compacts handling different sides of the problem
>>48000996
Lets have some not totally evil items then.
A goblet that makes everyone who drinks from it think they have a divine right to rule. It grants an additional vice and restores all willpower on killing in the name of building your kingdom. Obviously an elementary school teacher has it.
A 4 ton contraption that functions as a camera(big and heavy so players don't run off with it, also can hide a special surprise). It takes pictures of the "future". Unfortunately the future is turned into what ever it shows. This wouldn't be so bad, if the damn thing wasn't powered by all those dead children. Oh well, "in the name of science" and all that. Everyone say cheese.
A religious pamphlet that are handed out by insanely elderly men(like so old the guys in the old folks home remember when they were a kid and these guys were still old as hell). The old men give the pamphlets out to the homeless and those in need, usually with a wad off cash. The pamphlets read like a car add, never actually telling you what you will get by joining said religion, but insisting it is a good thing(has celebrity sponsorships!). After being read those who took the gift are stalked by small goat men with clip boards who run this religion and want nothing more then to force their victims to preform 'miracles' on their behalf in an attempt to steal favor from the other more popular religions. Unfortunately for everyone, the goat men are incompetent, don't understand human morals/motivations and are immortal. Worse, they make all their devotes immortal and wise. Immortal means even if your body dies you are still around and wise means you are old as hell. However if you pass out 100 pamphlets you might be allowed to go to 'heaven'. Obviously the players are told 'its a cult'.
http://theonyxpath.com/beckett-is-live-or-something-like-that-because-he-is-a-vampire-monday-meeting-notes/
Looks like there's a new Onyx Path job position up.
Whatever happened to Hurt Locker? It's been a few months since I've seen anything about that.
Any good pbp games? And not The Final Cuckroads that game is retarded
>>48002325
Nope. Gotta make your own.
>>48002325
>The Final Cuckroads
No idea what you are talking about.
>>48002407
I'm not linking to it because he's been spamming it every time I ask about pbp games. But it's just a really bad pbp game
>>48000996
http://forum.theonyxpath.com/forum/main-category/main-forum/the-new-world-of-darkness/806809-curios-relics-and-tomes
These items are all well made, balanced, and each have a small plot hook to go with them.
I myself plan to use these for for my demon, hunter, mage games.
I was told there's "Decent" rules for generating normal animals in changing breeds for CoFD, what page would this be on? I truly do not wanna look through the entire book for this.
>>48000996
https://vindae.tumblr.com/post/11116798525/a-list-of-curious-objects
>>47994048
Yea but its notably difficult for it to happen or not go by unnoticed. Also they only can only be possessed by a bane durring a frenzy if I recall
>>48002407
Guy who keeps trying to create a living world communally STed playbypost but has only like eight players.
>>48002325
No such thing.
>>48003032
What? Do you mean the book "Changing Breeds" from 1e nWoD?
You shouldn't really need to look through the whole book, just look at the Introduction. They tell you what's in which chapter. Changing Breeds doesn't have good mechanics, though. You making up new shifters with its guidelines won't really do much.
>>48002687
Looks like some really neat stuff. Thanks.
>>48001373
I'm not sure I want to work a camera that takes pictures of the future into my current game, but it's a damn cool idea. I'll have to find a chance to use it at some point.
>>48003078
The thing is, I don't need shifters. I need NORMAL animals.
>>48003078
>Guy who keeps trying to create a living world communally STed playbypost but has only like eight players.
I'm the guy who runs it. To say we have like eight players is generous, assuming of course player count is how you measure quality. I'm looking to have between five and ten right now, because I don't want to administrate more than that at the moment.
Currently we have three, myself included, so we're tiny. Naturally, I'm looking for players and ST's alike. If you're interested, the URL is http://thefinalcrossroads.com/
>>48003120
Sorry, I forgot. We have four, but one of them is so quiet I forgot about him and only posts IC stuff.
>>48003111
Oh. Honestly you shouldn't really have trouble making that yourself. There's a CofD animal stat list that Rose put up on a blog, but I can never find it when I need it. I don't really know why you'd need them. It really shouldn't be that hard. Just use the corebook. Most of them won't really have Dread Powers or anything, but they're available if you need them.
>>48003120
But the problem is that no one really likes what you're doing. I've repeatedly explained that to you. You've been talking about this for like six months now, and it amounts to you making a thread and then bumping it yourself because no one wants to join.
>>48003082
Always glad to help someone.
So, my local gaming store is having a writing competition. We have to write about a tabletop game character (anything from 5ed to Maid RPG) in ether a TV or Animu series.
I chose a Mage (2nd ed Awakening) in Naruto. I'm having trouble keeping him alive, conceptually, because every time he does a thing he gets stabbed by those fucking vampire-esque cheaters.
>>48003186
>But the problem is that no one really likes what you're doing. I've repeatedly explained that to you. You've been talking about this for like six months now, and it amounts to you making a thread and then bumping it yourself because no one wants to join.
Whoah there, buddy. You can dial down the condescending tone because you're making an ass of yourself. That said, if you're not interested in joining my game, that's fine. To each his own.
>>48003263
Nobody cares. Kill yourself.
>>48003263
He's really not, your threads are eyesores.
>>48003371
>>48003263
The problem is that you've been repeatedly told "no one is really interested in this, please stop trying to force the issue".
I mean, I know I do similar, but at least a few people like what I've done. You're asking for people to help make your thing take off. You don't have any incentives, though. Generally you need to have people willing to join your thing BEFORE you start begging for new blood on forums.
The format you're trying also just really isn't conducive to anything people would typically want.
>>48003458
>yfw you realize you can just scroll past recruitment threads you're not interested in
>>48003263
>>48003445
>>48003483
Jesus fucking christ
When you have to keep bumping your own threads because nobody else is posting in them, that's usually a sign that nobody gives a shit, and you should stop trying.
You're getting NO support. You've been trying to recruit for half a year, and by your own admission you only have three people. Let me guess, all of them were part of the group before you started posting here, or joined from somewhere else, right?
/tg/ doesn't give a shit about your shitty game, get the fuck over it
>>48003458
>>48003483
He's got a point. I don't give a shit about his game but you're making a huge stink about how not interested you are and it's recently cringey.
>>48001716
New Monday Meeting Notes has art from it, so something is happening.
>>48003526
>Jesus fucking christ
Jesus fucking Christ is right. Why are you having a conniption over not wanting to play a game?
>>48003254
Why not just continuously do that luck spamming thing? It's not like it's a real game so exploit the fuck out of that system.
>>48003533
I really just told him to knock it off, that's it. He got salty that I did.
>>48003579
The issue is that you're annoying us. That's the problem. You're frustrating us by constantly posting about your game that no one is interested in. Please stop.
>>48003254
What?
>>48003533
Honestly it seems like everyone's problems would be solved if it just got turned into a MUSH. I don't think there's a CofD 2e MUSH yet.
>>48003603
>The issue is that you're annoying us. That's the problem. You're frustrating us by constantly posting about your game that no one is interested in. Please stop.
And I should give a shit that I'm annoying you because... why, again? I occasionally get someone off of /tg/ who is interested. Like the guy who is making this vampire dude who I didn't count yet. So these threads that you're REEEEEEEing about serve my purposes just fine.
>>48003603
What's this "us" crap, Aspel? Stop backseat modding. He's not gonna stop so just ignore him.
>>48003583
>>48003603
The idea is that the top, like, tw or whatever have to actually run a session of their idea, and whoever runs the 'best' session wins a box of stuff
sounded weird, but I wanted stuff. Which is why I need a decent reason why a Mage wouldn't get stabbed to death the second he crossed a Ninja.
>>48003603
You are striking me as a bit butthurt m8
>>48003652
How do you know this is Aspel?
>>47997256
Mages are a lot less dangerous in terms of the maximum level of bullshit they can accomplish, but assuming you are concerned with street level issues like someone snapcasting a nasty curse onto you or turning you into a chicken, rather than blowing up a planet, 2e Mages are a fair bit stronger.
>>48003669
Posting style, mostly. No one ever really changes them up so it's not hard to make educated guesses, even when they post anonymously. One of the benefits of my not-a-joke-or-hyperbole autism, I guess.
>>48003790
Lel, well, if that's the case, then Aspel is a confirmed turbocunt. Are you Touhoufag?
>>48003623
There actually are. I know TheReach was 2e where possible, though it closed down.
>>48003661
I still don't understand. What are the rules here. What is the contest. What are you writing?
Start from the beginning.
>>48003790
It is me, but I'm far from the only one. There's at least one other person. It's not "back seat modding" it's "seriously I don't want to hear about this shit".
Also I more or less said it was me earlier. It's not like it takes super detection to know who it is when I say "at least a few people like my shit"
>>47996712
Nothing. Malkavians being assholes who fuck everything up for everyone is an important part of the setting.
>>48003814
>>48003668
>>48003636
We can tell you're samefagging.
>>48003827
>There's at least one other person.
I've made one post in response to this guy, so there's at least 3 of us, total.
>>48003846
Oh no, I've been found out.
any of the fan games besides Genius worth looking at?
>>48003070
Interesting, so would the Bane have control over them when they next frenzied, or what?
>>48003892
>Only TWO of those were me!
Okay, look. Let's just >>47993824
>Can you guys not shit up the thread like last time?
So does anyone know whether we have enough ̶S̶a̶r̶d̶o̶n̶y̶x̶Storypath mechanics to do any homebrewing? I've been on an Eva kick lately, but Adeptus Evangelion is kind of a clunky system.
How much do you bend the rules? One of my players on the Crossroads is making a vampire who was a pharaoh and i decided he can have his heart in a jar because it's a cool idea.
I'm not sure if anything to that effect exists in 2e yet
>>48004154
>How much do you bend the rules?
Not at all.
>>48004207
Ouch. I only stick to the rules insofar that they're fun
>>48004154
>Image
Which Splat could best capture Pleasure Island?
>>48004207
Agreed. They gave us rules and everyone in my games will fucking well play them to the letter
>>48004326
Mage. They can use their magic to create beautiful luxury... for a price
>>48004230
Rules are rules are rules.
Break or bend them and your players will be uncertain about how the game is run.
Run the game strictly by the rules, and mitigate assholery through dialogue with players and in-universe responses, and they'll have a firm grip upon the underpinnings of the player/GM relationship.
So Abyssal entities don't cause Quiescence?
Trying to determine how important cover-up after a sudden Gulmoth attack should be.
>>48004326
>>48004351
It's literally a Durance.
>>48004411
Page 298, in bold:
>Sleepers witnessing an obvious manifestation of the Supernal or Abyssal always experience a breaking point against Integrity
On 300, also bolded:
>In the scene directly following exposure to the Supernal or Abyssal, a Sleeper forgets what she saw, or else changes how she remembers it toward the mundane.
>>48004092
>Can you guys not shit up the thread like last time?
Actually impossible.
>>48004436
Thanks man, don't have the book at hand.
So SOMETHING went down, but strangely nobody coherently remembers what it was.
Great, the PCs will want to cover it up quick as most other Mages would see it as a Mystery.
Have you ever had a Gerald in your games /wodg/?https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S2yNZbA3JEk
So. My group is really disappointed in Mage 2e.
On the upside, I might now convince them to try the Dresden Files RPG.
>>48004859
In what way?
>>48004879
Apparently, it's too much "shoot first, win", now with magic.
>>48004890
How're they liking all the Wisdom hits from unprovoked assault on others?
>>48004022
If I recall the Bane can only take root during a Frenzy and then after that its a done deal as they slowly get fucked and turn into a literal giant maggot that drinks blood. That said I'm still fairly certain that the Curse of Cain will stop all but the strongest or most persistant banes.
after that he still only has so much time to become a threat before some one sees that something is wrong and gibs the bastard be it by a local vampire or something else entirely.
They proboly would only manage to mature into something either in bublefuck nowhere were there arent any supernatural creatures asside form the vampire to fuck with it. or in sabat or anarch citys where they may get passed over due to both groups not caring as much about overall vampire upkeep. That said if the sabat finds out one of theirs is slowly mutating into something i'm sure he will end up on the door step of a local tzimisce's haven so he can play with it some. which could lead into some dwarfortress level horror
I'm still hyped as fuck that the new V20 timeline will be including characters from VTMB.
>>48004921
Eh. I don't know how that factors into stuff.
Anyhow, I think their logic goes like this; It's practically impossible to Withstand a spell.. (Yes. I've tried to reason with them, their argument is then "But exceptionals ignore withstand." And they stop listening).
There are spells that instantly shuts down people (such as instant kills, shapeshifts, coma spells and stuff like that).
Ergo, whoever shoots a shut-them-down spell first wins. Always.
And when I try to argue with them I just get a lot of "no, you are wrong", and even if I argue them down, they just return to the same arguments a few hours later anyhow. It's really disheartening.
>>48005001
If you're the DM, tell them 'fuck you /you're/ wrong'
>>48004967
>which could lead into some dwarfortress level horror
But what if it's a Formori Tzimsce?
>>48005006
How should I phrase that? They feel like the game is too much 1-hit-kill now. Just saying "You are wrong" will not help that.
>>48005019
How do you tell the difference?
>>48005001
1. They're talking white rooms
2. Every lethal shutdown is a Wisdom breach
3. It's not hard to Withstand when you use Willpower, and an Exceptional success is extremely unlikely
4. Enemies can counterspell
5. If a single spell solves all of your problems, then you're running into some really simple problems
Your players are idiots
>>48005028
One of them is fleshcrafting Bane-infused fuel rods into his creations and Ghouls and the other one isn't?
>>48005040
They are mostly complaining about how low-wisdom assholes can shut down their characters. But sure.
>>48005074
Then play up that fear.
Counterspelling, Dispelling, the Wards and Sigils spell.
Have every encounter with a neutral Mage be at a knife edge, uncertain if he's going to turn and snap.
All Mage negotiations are effectively at gunpoint.
>>48005086
>Wards and Sigils spell.
Yeah. I've seen this one used. Yes.
One of the players started with it as rote, now that he's up at Gnosis 3 he managed to pull of Potency 16 on it.
>>48005098
>Potency 16
Using Fate bullshit I assume.
>>48005055
Thats still no different from you run of the mill fleshcrafter who knows his salt.
or is inspired by 80's ultraviolance anime ova's
>>48005103
No, just Prime bullshit.
Stacked a bunch of Yantras, took max benefit from extra intervals, and a bunch of extra stuff.
I was surprised at how he'd got it that high, but when I checked it, it was legit.
>>48005118
Ah nuts.
>>48005123
That's still a whopping -22 modifier, assuming Advanced Potency
>>48005123
>No, just Prime bullshit.
speaking of prime bullshit, can a mage use prime to boost the equipment modifier of yantras?
>>48005118
Well... how about the fact that the Formori Tzimsce lives in Chernobyl and regularly exposes his ghouls to the Elephants Foot (this will either make them suitable hosts for Banes, or it will kill them, either way, the Tzimsce in question isn't really affected by the Foot)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corium_(nuclear_reactor)#Chernobyl_accident
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chernobyl_disaster
>>48005167
From a literal reading, probably.
But given game balance issues (pffff) I would have said no.
>>48005151
I think you misread what Advanced Potency does.
It doesn't add any potency.
>>48005190
Fun fact: A few of the reactor rods of the Chernobyl plant smacked down into a graveyard.
Radioactive zombies, anyone?
>>48005194
It would seem I did, thank goodness.
>>48005190
Again this sounds like a flesh crafter with inspiration, not necessarily one that is possessed by dark otherworldly spirits
>>47994048
It would be extremely painful.
>>48005123
So Prime 3 gives 3 base Potency.
To get to 16, you have a -26 modidifer.
Assuming Prime 3, Gnosis 3, and +5 casting Periods (6 hours), and the 3 highest Yantras of Mundra (+5), exotic Sacrament (+3), and a high rating Persona (+3). If you're using your Order's rote skill, that's another die.
That's 23 dice.
I guess you could feasibly do so with a -3 modifer resulting in a chance die. What other shit was he using?
>>48005206
Maybe he doesn't even know he's been Baned? the explosion at the reactor could have happened while he was in Topor, launching a Balefire laced fuel rod into the crypt when his coffin was located and infecting him with the Banes therein, now he's woken up and is wondering where his castle went, why he's glowing, and why all these weird spirally people are worshiping him and not doing something about the drafts.
>>48005200
Something tells me the BSD's would love this place, in fact,the explosion itself was most likely cause by them in some fashion.
>>48005228
>I guess you could feasibly do so with a -3 modifer resulting in a chance die. What other shit was he using?
I don't recall exactly right now. I checked it and it was legit when he did it.
No that I do think of it, he might've ended up at potency 13 instead. I have a bit of a mental blind spot when it comes to mixing up 3, 6, and 9.
So, I realize it's a huge waste of time trying to make something from Geist workable, but I need to do so anyway for the sake of a character in my Hunter game. How exactly do you put together a keystone for a Geist? I understand picking the item, but from there the whole...threshold and Key importance is lost on me.
Is archery atjletics or firearms?
>>48004890
>>48005001
Can your group read? Like, words and stuff?
>>48005024
"The scenarios that you're arguing about don't happen as often as you think, require a character to be sufficiently high level, are generally Hubristic, are mechanically untrue, and even then you can't just solve all your problems with magic or murder".
>>48005074
>>48005249
>I checked it and it was legit when he did it.
You checked wrong. Also, why do your players even care that they might get killed by "low wisdom assholes"? It's not like a crazy vamp wanting to diablerize you while you sleep hasn't always been an incredible threat that most people can't actually deal with.
>>48005368
You're running a Hunter game. You don't need to know Geist, you just need to know Hunter. Create a Sin-eater using Hunter mechanics. The CofD corebook and Mortal Remains provide many Dread Powers for you to use.
The Keystone is also literally just an item important to the death of the Geist or Sin-eater. One Key is technically for the Sin-eater and one is for the Geist, though in actuality you just pick one of the Keys from the Threshold (Passion/Stigmata for Torn, Industrial/Pyre-Flame for Forgotten, etcetera) and then pick the second.
>>48005678
Either or, though I've always preferred ruling it as Athletics.
Whens signs of sorcery coming out?
>>48005711
Well, I think we'll have to wait, considering the development time of the vampire supplements.
>>48005694
The thing is, I'm not making a sin eater. I'm just making a geist. Y'know, a ghost who isn't a rank 1 pissant and whom operates on different principals(Not the least of which is that they have a keystone instead of an anchor).
And Rory, for the record? People would like you more if you were less self important.
>>48005746
If you're not running Geist, then you don't need to make the Geist exactly like it is in Sin-Eater. Use Hunter's rules and make a strong ghost. Bam.
>>48001373
>After being read those who took the gift are stalked by small goat men with clip boards who run this religion and want nothing more then to force their victims to preform 'miracles' on their behalf in an attempt to steal favor from the other more popular religions. Unfortunately for everyone, the goat men are incompetent, don't understand human morals/motivations and are immortal. Worse, they make all their devotes immortal and wise. Immortal means even if your body dies you are still around and wise means you are old as hell. However if you pass out 100 pamphlets you might be allowed to go to 'heaven'.
True Fae concept acquired
>>48005746
>I'm just making a geist.
Then you should be using the rules for Ghosts. That's all a Geist is, a Rank 3 Ghost, maybe with some Dread Powers as well as Numina (Geists in the Geist book don't have Bans, but honestly that seems like an accidental oversight, isn't something that is listed in how they differ from ghosts, and is likely to change). They don't necessarily even have Keystones. You're running Hunter, not Geist. You never even need to use the word "Geist" except as fanservice to players. Even if one of the players dies and becomes Bound to the Geist, you don't need any of that because you're running Hunter, and they could become a Ghostwalker with only the material found in the Hunter books. (in fact, I'm a big proponent of using Hunter to run supernaturals, if your players end up becoming them; it creates a much different feel than if you just pull out the real book).
Also, I'm not sure who you are that you're calling me Rory, but giving you game advice when you asked for it isn't being "self-important", it's answering the question that you asked. Telling someone that their group is made up of idiots also isn't self-important, and is a time honoured /tg/ tradition.
>>48005832
As previously stated, geists do have some differences between them and ghosts. Not the least of which is; Geists lack anchors and instead get a keystone. Also Geists in Geist lack bans and they also lack rank. Why? These things weren't given to ghosts in 1E.
>>48005731
I'm honestly surprised that the Pack came out far before any new Vampire book did, even though vampire had like a year or two head start compared to all of the other lines.
Oh well,I'm probably not going to end up playing Vampire ever again now that Mage is out and Promethean is on the way.
Delver of Secrets Thyrsus Legacy when?
So what's the final verdict about Mage 2e?
As much of an improvement as Vampire and Werewolf 2e?
Is Mana sensitive merit any good?
>>48005916
Geist is a mess. Technically speaking there's nothing that says they don't have those things, other than the fact that they're missing from the stat blocks. It's not actually listed under the differences (though I'd argue it's true). They don't have Keystones, though. Except for when they do, as is the case for the Burned Woman, who has a Keystone for her Sin-eater when they bond. But again, Geist is a mess.
Even then, you're playing 2e from the sound of it, since you do talk about Geists having Ranks. Even 2e only says that Cthonians don't have Anchors (Kerberoi, it can be assumed, are anchored to their Dominion... which is now called a Deep Dominion, though I seriously hope that was a typo). Sidenote: They also change how Old Laws work, suggesting they're physical laws instead of dictates. But either way, you're running 2e, and you're running Hunter:
You should follow the advice listed in Mortal Remains before you use anything from the actual Geist (or even Mage) book. As far as you're concerned, a Geist is just a Lare--a Rank 4 or 5 Ghost (or Cthonian, as the Rank system applies to both). It might have Dread Powers and it might not have an Anchor (or it might have an ephemeral anchor that it carries with it and can use as a weapon). You call the shots here.
>>48006019
Yes, though some people will tell you that it's horribly horribly broken. Also, we can't really have a *final* verdict yet; we're still waiting on the post-edit copy, and this one's editing requirements seem to be a doozy, as Dave admits fans are right about certain mechanical concerns (Practices being the big one).
>>48006003
Goddamnit stop trying to turn yourself into a bug. Also, if he was Legendary that would be so great. The fact that we've seen this story keep going in the background really says he should be Legendary. Fuck you, I'm going to run him as my Commander anyway
(I don't even play Blue)
>>48005916
Also, just as a coda to address these points directly:
>Geists lack anchors and instead get a keystone.
They don't get Keystones; The Horned One, Ithma, and Mother don't have ones, neither does The Family Man. Or even La Diabla Blanca. A lot of the ones in NY also have Keystones from the Binding, not from the Geist. It's also never said in the listed differences that they don't have an Anchor, but it is admittedly a reasonable assumption.
>Also Geists in Geist lack bans and they also lack rank.
Again, they don't necessarily lack Bans, and here I'd say it's not reasonable to assume otherwise, especially with 2e's sparse treatment. They also do have Rank, it's just Psyche instead. Although literally none of the three sample Geists has one, because Geist is a mess. The book says it's an "effective rank", by the way, since 1e ghosts didn't have Rank (probably due to coming first creatively)
>Why?
To make them feel different, and also because Geist is a mess. If you really want the most up to date info, the best you'll get is Mage page 245. But "Ghost, Rank 4, No Anchor, Dread Powers as well as Numina, seeks to bond with a mortal necromancer" is a very good guideline for what you (seem to) want.
I forget, aren't Geists ghosts that have fused with a spirit? So 'logically' it feels like they should have a Ban and Bane like a spirit does.
>>48006068
So are mages as ridiculously OP as before or not?
>>48006087
They are stated to have ban and bane in 2E material, I believe. Same with Rank, which of course didn't exist in 1E for ghosts
>>48006068
>Goddamnit stop trying to turn yourself into a bug.
Haven't you heard the news? He's turning other people into bugs now.
>>48006106
Mages are still king of the mountain because doing crazy shit is fundamental to the game and impossible to totally stamp out.
That said, Mages have been nerfed. Getting big spellcasting pools is difficult without Fate abuse, so it's harder to do the really big effects. Lower-Gnosis mages also have very harsh caps on how many spells can be active at once.
>>48006087
They're not Spirits anymore, they're Lares.
Anything beyond that is up in the air and left to the ST.
>Chthonians use the same rules as ghosts, but don’t possess Anchors or an Integrity trait and may be any Size and appearance. They usually have disgusting, unsettling appearances, merging vaguely human characteristics with other traits like maggot-like bodies or insectile legs.
I'd say this is true for Geists as well.
>>48006109
That's even worse!
>>48006210
>That's even worse!
Surely you meanbetter?
Yeah, a Legacy based on the Delver would most likely be Left-Handed.
How strong are Vamps and Werewolves compared to the other 2e gamelines?
>>48006245
Mages and Demons fuck with reality in ways that Vamps and Werewolves can't hope to touch. Beasts are stronger than Vamps or Werewolves on the whole, seeing at they can get away with using skyscrapers as baseball bats at a certain point or use nightmares for various effects.
As for the other supernaturals, it seems like Prometheans and Changelings will probably be more on the Vampire and Werewolf level, but since those games aren't fully released yet, that is just speculation.
>>48006245
Well that's a hard question to answer as there aren't very many 2E gamelines. But from what I've seen, Vampires get pretty damn powerful eventually and start out fairly strong. Werewolves start out with the ability to, at will shift into their war-form(and if they don't mind losing the ability to think rationally, can stay in it indefinitely) within which they get some cool abilities and regenerate all lethal/bashing every. single. turn. Compared to demons, both sorta fall flat, and a properly attuned mage can do many of the things either of the pair could do using magic bullshit. All in all, they're nothing to scoff at, but their inherant weaknesses do provide a bit of a handicap compared to demons/mages who's weaknesses are more...abstract.
>>48006285
Beasts throwing skyscrapers requires a bit of minmaxing and a high Lair trait.
Werewolves are out of the gate murder death machines.
>>48006288
>there aren't very many 2E gamelines
Vampire, Demon, Werewolf, Beast, Mage. Changeling has shown enough to get a sense of their power. Hunter, too, if you want to count that.
>>48006245
Considering that high level vampires shit on high level werewolves, it's unfair to lump those two together.
>>48006364
>minmaxing
>getting a basic power is now minmaxing
>>48006364
They're pretty swole out of the gate, but they plateau earlier than other supernaturals and it's a bit less easy for them to get more powerful due to the way gifts work. They start strong and can get a fair bit stronger, but I would say their overall growth is far less than what you see with other splats. I would probably say the same thing about Demons, to a lesser extent.
>>48006364
>Werewolves are out of the gate murder death machines.
Yeah. And don't get that much better.
Vampires get higher defence, and can scale their attacks (and if ordo, defence and health too) with Blood Potency.
>>48006446
Welcome to the Elemental Facets, or Firestorm the size of a city
Of course if we consider only the physical side, Gift of Full Moon, Gift of Strenght and Gift of Rage pack an impressive power, considering that most of the Facets are activated reflexily and for free during Basu-Im. Werewolves are terrifying in melee combat, the only way i see a Kindred fightining one on par is with Claws of the Unholy or the 5 dot Crùac ritual.
>>48006505
The Elemental, and Weather gifts are the only real advantages werewolves have over vampires.
A combat-vampire is going to have more health, defence, attack dice, and +damage than an average combat-werewolf.
This is simply because the werewolf shit is based on their Renown, and only one fifth of all werewolves can even get all the +health power.
Add to that, vampires can use weapons and still get +damage benefits.
Shapeshifting you say? Yes. It's superior to Frenzy, until the vampire reaches Blood Potency 3, at that point they have an equal damage output, and after it vampires pull away.
Going to be running V:tR 2E in a couple of months and I'm wondering: What houserules do you guys use and why?
>>48006574
I actually run without house rules.
Although, if someone were to max out Animalism, We'd house rule some limits on that one.
>>48006106
>>48006158
Of course if they do abuse Fate it gets really fucking ridiculous. Any ST worth their salt should come down hard on Fate or Time abuse because otherwise they can get pretty broken.
>>48006423
You need like two powers and high Lair to get ridiculous with that "throwing skyscrappers" thing.
>>48006444
>>48006446
Why do you say they plateau earlier? What about Gifts makes it less easy for them?
>>48006539
Werewolves can do Aggravated damage and cause tilts without issue. Vampires can't really do that. Their combat potential is just "big dice pools".
>>48006574
Defense is [The lower of Dexterity or Wits] + [the lower of Athletics or Brawl]. With a 1 dot merit you can use lower of Weaponry instead of Brawl.
All Out Attack only removes your Skill to Defense, not all your Defense.
Not really a houserule, but be liberal with Conditions, Tilts, and making Social Maneuvering have more or less Doors.
>>48006622
Keep in mind some of those don't even work the way Touhou suggested.
>>48006646
>The beast needs to buy TWO powers and has to have a high power stat to throw buildings!
The difference is minimal, and having a high Lair (or any other power stat, across any supernatural template) is a given.
>>48006646
>Werewolves can do Aggravated damage and cause tilts without issue. Vampires can't really do that. Their combat potential is just "big dice pools".
Yeah. Doing Agg as a vampire takes more effort; Protean and a merit, or silver weaponry.
But Werewolves can't reach the same attack dice pools, or the same Defence levels, as vampires.
>>48006646
Primarily the way gifts are setup. The ones we were given in the book are balanced with the assumption that a werewolf can start with any of those gifts at generation or obtain them with equal ease through play, and more importantly they're not cheap. If it's out of your auspice/tribes favored gifts? They cost 5xp to get, and then something like 3xp per facet you want to unlock.
>>48006680
I've always felt that power stat peaks around 4.
>>48006698
Don't most of them scale pretty well based on Renown? Although I suppose "+Renown to damage" is a lot different from, say, Animalism or Obfuscate's capstone abilities.
>>48006590
What's wrong with Animalism?
>>48006720
Some scale decently, gifts of weather as already stated gets incredibly powerful at ranks 3-4 renown.
>>48006765
I wonder why it wasn't included thatHeavens Unleashed causes the Heavy Rain/Flooded tilt, I house ruled that after the CofD core came out
>>48006646
>Werewolves can do Aggravated damage and cause tilts without issue. Vampires can't really do that. Their combat potential is just "big dice pools".
Eh? It's exactly other way round.
Werevolves: that tilt causing gift is only when fighting multiple opponents, aggravated damage against vampires only through gift of elements and that is gonna be partially resisted by resilence or it might not be aggravated at all if the vampire is Dracul with Coil of the Ascendant.
Vampire can cause agg to werevolves through Feeding the Crone, Claws of the Unholy or any silver weapon.
So what' a good frame of judgment to tell when my vampires are sufficiently set to have me throw a wereshark at them?
>>48006996
Werewolves do Aggravated damage when they RIP AND TEAR huge gobbets of flesh from the bones (and the bones along with it) of their prey, and they have several ways of crippling opponents, I'm not even sure which one you're talking about, but I meant the innate ability of the Urshul form. Also, Vampires lose skill to Defense against Gauru.
And, most important of all: You're never fighting just one Werewolf. The same can't really be said of Vampires.
>>48007141
They do aggravated yes, but only when they're eating the thing they're ripping and tearing, and annoyingly this is usually a breaking point and a huge no-no as it violates the oath.
Are the old covenant books still useful? The Invictus seem way more feudal in the 1E books than in 2E.
>>48007253
And? "B-but the law!" isn't going to stop you from getting eaten.
Also, don't they have other options for Agg as well? Easier ones than a vamp, even.
>>48007141
Oh boy. Urshul form can cause single tilt in scene, so nothing strong, and attacking in Urshul means you are not attacking in Gauru, which means it's comparatively even weaker. And that ripping and tearing you get from where? Gauru causes +2 lethal, bites are considered magical, so they do lethal to vampires, unlike claws which do only bashing. There is nothing in rules which would say, that they can rip and tear flesh that way or that it would cause agg damage to vampires.
And you fight single werewolf or vampire whenever you try to ambush one, because it's best to cull the herd one by one.
>>48007253
The eating thing for essence is against humans or wolves, vampires are neither, it's hard to imagine it's possible to get essence from vampire's dead flesh, it's not considering vampiric resistance and last but not least, it's not very smart to bite vampire unless you want to get blood bonded.
>>48007523
>Attack in Urshul to cripple them
>Go to Gauru because they're still crippled and at all but the extreme of Harmony you can reflexively
Claws also do lethal.
Vampires don't make it a habit to work together in tightly knit family units. Werewolves are also pretty damned difficult to sneak up on in the first place.
>The eating thing for essence is against humans or wolves, vampires are neither
You're quibbling
>>48007310
There are some good mechanics and some good ideas, but you do have to read them with some discretion and eye towards 2e.
>>48006087
They haven't "fused with a spirit" but they do take on some Spirit-like traits.
They're still technically ghosts as >>48006210
said but IIRC from a Mage perspective they still require Death and Spirit to effect with magic.
>>48007560
>Claws also do lethal.
Not to vampires, they have kinetic resistance. That's why there is the sidebar on page 98 in WtF 2e
>Werewolves are also pretty damned difficult to sneak up on in the first place.
That is true, but Obfuscate makes vampires pretty damned good at sneaking
>You're quibbling
And you are inventing your own rules; what I wrote is exactly RAW
>They can eat the flesh of wolves and humans. For every point
>of damage caused by an Uratha’s bite, they can choose to
>ingest the flesh and gain a point of Essence. This is a stark
>violation of the Oath of the Moon, and always a Harmony
>breaking point toward the spirit. When devouring flesh for
>Essence, the Uratha causes aggravated wounds.
Vampires are just as susceptible to Spirit influence as normal people, right? Or does Blood Potency resist it?
>>48007992
Supernatural Advantage only applies when two supernatural powers contest one another
>>48007992
>>48008047
Most ephemeral effects that are resisted are with (attribute + attribute + tolerance). Just so they have a fighting chance.
>>48007964
A Vampire is human for the sake of the breaking point, unless the Werewolf knows they aren't.
>>47993824
You're in the club and this vamp slaps your girlfriend's ass.
What do you do?
>>48007681
They don't require Spirit at all. They're just Ghosts.
>>48007964
Would you argue that Mages don't take Aggravated from being bitten? I'm pretty sure a werewolf's claws would also do lethal damage to vampires in the forms they have them, since they'd also have the same properties, but it's not like it matters since mechanically a bite or claws are the same.
So, I finally got around to reading the 2e Duel Arcane rules and I don't even.
Can someone explain to me how the fuck it progresses?
Like, you abstract your spells (as supported by the description + lack of ability to use yantras) and just say what you're doing, and yet somehow NOT ONLY withstand, but *spell factors* matter.
They refute the notion of a SIMPLE spell, but don't actually rule out the notion of having the effects based component of your spell be an attack spell, which wouldn't contend with any kind of defense or withstand and thus would be most likely to succeed. Does that get you a door?
Is there actually any incentive to pull off flashy spells like combined or area effects? It seems like there's way too much at stake given the consequences for the loser for anyone to do this, but if you don't then why are spell factors even mentioned beyond getting a potency over their withstand? Is that what you aim for? Hitting them with some save or die or save or turn into a newt equivalent?
Is there actually any incentive to taking the defend action other than a chance of screwing your opponent out of the use of their best arcanum for like, the turn you defend + 1 turn?
I like some of the stuff that was done with Duel Arcane but I cannot for the life of me figure out how you are supposed to operate the mechanic from the starting line to the finish line at this point.
>>48009654
>yet somehow NOT ONLY withstand, but *spell factors* matter.
You do realize that to get passed Withstand you would inherently need Spell Factors, right?
Although I think the spells are treated as 'thrown'. Honestly I feel like they've made them more complicated than they need to be.
>>48009757
Okay sure, but lets be clear, it SEEMS like, or at least I'd assume, that shielding spells, or attribute buffs or whatever cannot be used inside the duel arcane. Which means you are just contending with their base withstand. Which, at least if you're using your best arcanum and being intelligent enough to trigger an effect that does not target their strongest resistance attribute (Generally feasible even if you don't know them really well), it is very unlikely you can't overcome without the use of spell factors.
The attack spell issue is a lot more distressing though.
>>48006087
No. In 1e, they were ghosts with spirit-like traits (actual ghost-spirit hybrids were in Shadows of the UK). In 2e, they're just mid-Rank Ghosts, and if/when we get around to doing Geist 2e, making the Bargain to create a Sin-Eater will be a special Manifestation.
>>48009649
I woud argue, that Mages take lethal as do everybody else, I would allow the eating meat for essence only on unconscious or similar victim, because otherwise it doesn't make sense to explicitly state, that werewolves cause lethal damage by both jaws and claws. And claws and teeth aren't mechanically same, look for instance at Urshul stats. RAW might not always make very much sense, but in this case it's pretty clear it for whatever reason makes the distinction.
>>48009939
Why are Platonic Forms obviously supernal?
That means you can never carry Tass out in public surely
>>48009992
I feel like you're treating "only mentions" for "EXPLICITLY ONLY MENTIONS".
Absence of evidence and all that jazz.
>>48009800
You're assuming the Mages doing the duel are always going to have Arcanum 5. Either way, the Duel Arcane is one of those things Dave's likely going to make clearer.
>>48009939
Hey, Dave.
Actually, both Geist and Book of the Dead strongly imply that Geists are Spirit, and Book of the Dead makes it more or less explicit with talk of Ghosts and Spirits merging, as well as the fact that Geists require Spirit 3 and Death 3 if a Mage wants to effect them with Arcana.
If they weren't actually Spirit-like, they *really* don't make that clear, since they talked about ghosts or spirits eating each other to become Geists, at least as a possibility.
>>48009280
So? Where does it say Vampires give Essence?
>>48009649
>I'm pretty sure a werewolf's claws would also do lethal damage to vampires in the forms they have them, since they'd also have the same properties, but it's not like it matters since mechanically a bite or claws are the same.
Nope. The reason the jaws do Lethal is because the god-killer thing Werewolves have going. The jaws have metaphysical properties, the claws are just claws.
>>48010098
Ah I see, by that logic werewolves can also fly, because there isn't written they can't, right?
>>48010087
You could still put your tass in something else, m8
Platonic Forms are objects made *purely* out of tass. *Purely* out of solidified mana. Do you honestly expect solid magic to be able to pass as a mundane object?
Channel Mana, on the other hand, would let you pour some mana into something not made out of Tass; an artifact or imbued item, for instance, and/or pull it back out. Thus letting you carry mana around in public.
>>48010194
>>48010259
You act like "god-killer" only applies to their teeth. The reason their claws should also count as a supernatural attack is because they're supernatural creatures. Hell, I'm pretty sure Vampire actually lists Werewolf claws as things that would do Lethal to them.
>>48010087
>>48010370
Also you can do generic tass stuff like what solidifies at hallows. That stuff just isn't platonically formal.
>>48010387
>You act like "god-killer" only applies to their teeth.
It does you moron.
>>48010415
>I'm pretty sure a werewolf's claws would also do lethal damage to vampires in the forms they have them, since they'd also have the same properties, but it's not like it matters since mechanically a bite or claws are the same.
It's like you weren't able to follow along with the discussion. (As an aside, "godkilling" has nothing to do with anything)
Even then, I'm not really sure why it matters, since Gauru can do bites just as easily as claws. This started by me pointing out that Werewolves are able to tear huge hunks of flesh from their enemies and do Aggravated damage, with another anon saying Vampires don't count (and that somehow *Mages* also wouldn't be able to have huge chunks of flesh ripped from their bones).
Whatever, fine, this is a stupid pedantic argument anyway. Sure, a vampire can totes take on a werewolf in single combat because bigger dice pools.
>>48010150
It doesn't need to. You eat a human being, you get essence; probably essence aspected to Life, or Humanity, or something. You eat a Vampire, logically you're also going to get essence, probably aspected to Death.
The core werewolf book doesn't have explicit rules for handling other splats. None of the core books do. They don't need to, because you're buying the book to play one game, not all of them.(And they don't have the word count, as Mage 2e says)
>>48010474
There are reasons you don't want to bite vampires.
Vitae addiction and vinculum, to be precise. It is a bad idea.
And I apologise. God Killer was from Dark Eras.
>>48010512
As long as it doesn't mean that you tear out the life energies. Because, you know, vampires being undead don't have those.
>>48010536
If it were life energies that mattered, you probably wouldn't get essence from eating Spirits, either.
Because, y'know, being Spirits, they aren't exactly alive either.
So I've been looking around and apparently everyone hates the Storyteller/Storytelling systems to death. Is there any actual reason for that?
>>48010474
Mages would be able to have chunks of meat ripped from their bones as would have anyone else, but stats say that werewolf teeth cause lethal, therefore it seems to be unreasonable to use the essence/meat eating as standard combat action and just like that suddenly change teeth from lethal to agg. In my games I would allow it only against unconscious/restrained enemy or at very east victim who is denied defense. After all just biting and devouring a ripped out chunk of flesh isn't same.
>>48010550
But.. you don't. You have to pin them with a Sacred Hunt to get Essence from them.
Devour for Essence is for Werewolves, Humans, Wolves.
Wanted to use some hunters for a Mage game that I am storytelling, but I think that between dissonance and breaking points they won't be a serious menace to my players. Are some tier 3 hunters somehow immune to the Lie/naturally sleepwalkers?
>>48010662
All with powers, so there's the Lucifuge, Malleus Maleficarum, and the Knights of st. George, for instance.
The Cheiron Group might count.
>>48010536
Chris (and maybe Stew) has clarified that biting doesn't mean drinking blood, and doesn't risk vinculum.
>>48010572
It's a specific maneuver to deal Aggravated. It even mentions this in the ST section.
>>48010662
>>48010740
Even some groups that aren't Hunters do.
Although, again, "I've repeatedly been exposed to the supernatural and oh shit my ability to blissfully sleep has been disturbed" isn't just a perfect excuse to buy Sleepwalker, it's literally the Fitful Slumber merit.
>>48010780
>Chris (and maybe Stew) has clarified that biting doesn't mean drinking blood, and doesn't risk vinculum.
Ah. It does when vampires bite each other, even in combat, just to deal damage.
>>48010662
>>48010740
The issue I foresee is that anything that allows them to evade Quiessence also probably removes their ability to generate paradox, which is really one of the main advantages they have going for them.
>>48010780
>It's a specific maneuver to deal Aggravated. It even mentions this in the ST section.
Interesting. Would you know where exactly is that written?
>>48010820
I had this argument on the forum and I found it silly too. Werewolves, depending on shape, have much bigger teeth but somehow never swallow any blood unless they want to.
Doesn't Platonic Form let you be a walking mana battery if taken as a Praxis? You can just shove all your mana into an item, and then refill it all with an Exceptional Success, thereby effectively doubling your supply.
>>48010370
1e didn't feel the need to gimp Prime
What exactly did Prie do to deserve the "get rekt lmao" treatment in CofD?
>>48011036
It's always been like that. That's why you can use your teeth against another Uratha and not suffer a Breaking Point.
From "Themes in Werewolf: The Forsaken"
>CANNIBALISM
>The thing about cannibalism for the Forsaken is — it’s not always so cut and dried. What if you’re really hungry? What if you know your friend will ultimately regenerate the injury? What if your friend might die if you don’t have the juice necessary to keep fighting? Feasting on your friend can be tempting with Forsaken variables in play.
>Another important time cannibalism can come up is in a battle between werewolves. If two Uratha face off in Gauru form, they’re highly unlikely to cause any lasting harm, until one of them can no longer maintain the form. The first to fall out of Gauru loses. Cannibalism offers a trump in that argument. Since eating from another Uratha causes potentially deadly aggravated damage, that’s one way to stop a rampaging Gauru. Particularly for the less potent Uratha, taking a bite out of her enemy could turn the tide of battle completely.
I love that. "What if you're really hungry?" as justification for cannibalism.
>>48011142
>What if you're really hungry?
Well lot's of people get hungry.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tS_Xq7gSCBM
>>48011043
Yeah. I just assumed it applied to werewolves as well, because it did with vampires.
>>48010556
It shows its age in a lot of ways, in a way that other systems that its contemporaries or even older do not. That's not really a "hateable" thing but it's enough for some people.
>>48010556
>>48012071
Most of the time I've seen people hate on nWoD or CofD, it's because of absurdly high (or low) dice pools, and a misunderstanding of what can and can't be done (i.e. the "clearly you have to roll everything, so office workers with average stats will fail all the time forever" argument). oWoD on the other hand has a lot of bullshit that makes it swingy due to the dual fiddling of Difficulty and necessary Successes.
>>48012266
I find the idea of someone failing a lot in the system kind of funny. With just 2 dice you are already at a 50/50 chance! And that is not a hard dice pool to get!
In some other systems a 50/50 chance already marks you as special.
>>48012473
To be fair, a lot of systems like that (Dark Heresy is one that came up earlier today) you're assumed to have huge bonuses when doing simple mundane tasks with no pressure. But people more readily assume penalties than bonuses (probably because STs more readily give out penalties than bonuses), so low stats means high failure to most people.
Question regarding successes: If I achieve an exceptional success using an ability, do I only use the Exceptional Success portion of that ability or am I allowed to use both the Exceptional Success and regular Success aspects at the same time?
>>48013242
Exceptional Success is explicitly "that, plus this".
>>48013292
Do you know where can I find this explicitly said in either Demon of CofD core? I'm trying to figure out how Merciless Gunman works inside normal combat,
>>48011043
Are blood bonds from biting a 2e thing? I don't think that's mentioned in the 2e book.
"Vampires do not naturally bleed when cut. The Vitae is possessive; it pulls the blood back to the body in the way a drop of mercury absorbs back into a pool. When exhibiting the blush of life (see p. 90), vampires will bleed normally, but still not lose Vitae. Some heinous injuries can cause limited Vitae loss. For example, if the vampire loses a chunk of flesh or a limb, the blood will remain with the lost part, and pour
out as the tissue and bone decays. Only in these terrible cases would blood loss equate with Vitae loss. "
Since blood bonding comes from the ingestion of vitae, it sounds like it might not be a thing at all. (Biting as opposed to feeding, which I think might be the same thing when frenzying (or just hunger frenzying?), but not otherwise)
And since Uratha quite specifically don't swallow huge chunks of flesh as it's often a violation, and there is a literal different mechanical effect (read:agg damage), I imagine it as more as a bite and tear away thing than a bite and chew thing (except where applicable), and so the amount they ingest may or may not be negligible on any given bite.
>>48007523
Dead-flesh doesn't apply to any source of aggravated, my dude.
One of my players (mortal character, no contact with the supernatural yet) was on his way to a charity event/party, got interrupted by a mage destroying his method of transport, and then found out a lot of people who went to it have started vanishing. Like, not just disappearing, people forgetting they ever existed, parts of their lives going with it, or simply not seeing anything wrong with their seemingly being wiped from the face of existence that night (Oh Jim? Yeah, he is a great guy, we'll have to hit the bowling alley again once he gets back in town.).
I'm trying to tie this to the GM, but I'm not sure to how to drop some clues at the scene that point to its machinations. I'm supposing that the party and location was some sort of infrastructure, and the people going missing have either been conscripted into serving it somehow or outright destroyed for fueling its plans. Does anyone have any good suggestions for clues and signs to leave behind that something big is at play here?
How exactly do you determine what concepts are too alien for a spirit to have both? I had a vague idea of spirits of technology and violence, but I wasn't sure if those two things were too different to not just be maggath.
Anyone have the WoD power level chart comparing different things in the setting?
>>48018342
Why do you need it, it's all hogwash
>>48018342
If you're talking 2e power levels, its largely unknown at this point and depends greatly on very specific instances of cheese. Also, the fact you are even asking suggests you'd be a bad GM and a worse player.
nWoD power levels were, despite the white room questions that arise when even considering power rankings as a possibility, traditionally well cemented in the hierarchy of:
Mages
Sin-Eaters
-
-
Changelings (If you cheese pledges and use splatbook contracts)
Prometheans
Vampires/Werewolves (Hotly argued over, IMO Vampires are decently stronger in a straight fight but can't deal with attacks from twilight without Blood Tenebrous which is obscure as hell, and it isn't very hard for Werewolves to do that)
Tier 3 Hunters
Changelings (With normal powersets)
I've been wanting to run a Werewolf game set in the Appalachian mountains, and I've been reading the little source book for it but how would you guys describe the relationship between the Fae and the Werewolves? Are they servants, or at the very least children of Gaia similar to spirits and werewolves?
Doing a write up of a Fortitude Virtue Mage standing up against the Abyss in a pbp game. How's this sound?
"I..." you begin, lungs swelling with power and conviction and purpose. "I will not yield. I will not yield to any man...not against what's right, even if it kills me..."
[blah blah stuff]
"You might exist, you might have the ability to kill me without trying, you might be able to grind down my soul to dust...BUT I WILL NOT YIELD!"
Does that work, or should I phrase it differently to not sound like a tard?
>>48020354
It's pretty cliche is all I can really say. Also, the abyss vs. an annunanki (abyssal realm/god entity) vs. a specific abyssal entity makes a world of difference. For instance, I can see some good potential to replace the former line with something along the lines of "I would not yield to any man, and nor will I yield even to an entire world that stands against what is right!"
Another thing to keep in mind is that refuting the abyss really is a matter of beliefs. It is an anti-reality. It isn't punching you in the face because it *isn't* right, its punching you in the face because its own entire system for determining what is right is totally antithetical to any mortal system of morality. Therefore, something along the lines of "Even if you kill me without trying, even if you grind my soul to dust, I will make you KNOW that I stood for a truer righteousness, that I opposed you ABSOLUTELY TO THE END." or something like that.
>>48020941
Actually, the Mage is standing up to an Aswadim. He thought he had this interaction in the bag with some mind control/coercion, but the Mage shook it and is now telling him to fuck off.
>>48019788
>1st ed werewolves
>Over changeligns
Even without exploiting shit werewolves are pretty badly challenged. I feel like you might be giving them too much when the one thing they do well is attacking from twilight when they don't even do that well, it's just the one thing they have that others don't.
>>48021132
I realise that the conventional white room arguments are that werewolves are weak shits, and THEY ARE, but that's still enough for them to tear the average Changeling a new asshole.
Like this is going to sound ridiculous but I've seen actually randomly assorted two groups of players who hadn't touched either put into a kind of extended versus one-shot ala the ole D&D tourneys, which means in theory the Changelings had all the setup time they needed, there were social encounters etc. to gate overoptimised parties etc.
It was a fucking blood bath, completely average werewolves killed the Changeling's "tank" in 1 round, followed by every single other Changeling the next round except for an autumn courtier who was MERELY 2 lethal off incapacitated and managed to turn into leaves and fuck off before he was killed. The werewolves meanwhile were largely unharmed, and CERTAINLY not dealt anything that would be permanent damage for them.
Sure, it's anecdotal, but when I looked at it after the fact, normal Changelings simply do not have anything in core that *can* make them as killy as a Werewolf who isn't even trying.
Also, when I said attacking from twilight I was also rolling in other non-whiteroom strats like having a combat effective totem or diplomancing spirits, which also effectively results in attacks coming out of twilight. Not that either of those are necessary to kill Changelings.
>>48021053
Oh. So it's oWoD. My condolences.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hP6rXX0VLiU
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WkuSZ-8pNCY
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9vvf-Dld9uM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1zlxivR2s3Q
Blitzwing is best Malk/Grangrel/Ventrue.
Are you a bad enough wolf to save Luna?
>>48021470
Um. No. Aswadim are nWoD. They are abyssal archmages.
Can't imagine who'd pit a starting character against an archmage though...
>>48020354
>"I..." you begin,
Why is it in second person? When you say "pbp" do you really mean you're writing a quest?
Is that you,Oros?
Also, that sounds cheesy.
>>48020354
Which pbp game?
>>48020354
Too many fucking words.
Less is more.
>>48021460
The default assumption with werewolf really should be that a totem /sprirt allies won't do the fighting for them.
Beyond that, CtL 1 had a lot of garbage levels you had to climb to get good things, but with a dozen XP under their belt had a lot of nasty tricks and a universe next door every bit as useful as the Shadow is for werewolves.
Just something as obvious and simple as a summer-court ogre is a hell of a hammer and in many ways the least dangerous thing a werewolf faces. A spring fairest can turn a pack on itself and shut down a fight while there's plenty of options for them to go 404 Changeling Not Found. 1st Ed Werewolves are surprisingly bad at tracking.
The real problem with 1st ed werewolves is that a werewolf that isn't even trying is going to lose a fight to a goddamn policemen.
>>47992701
They're a bunch of nice guys when you get to know them
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gNL1RN4eRR8
So could you use Space+Forces to make a Kugelblitz?
>>48022047
They're also oWoD: http://whitewolf.wikia.com/wiki/Aswadim
>Their Nephandic counterpart are the Aswadim, who are masters of the Qlippothic Spheres instead and strive for all-encompassing Descension.
When in doubt, an obscure Mage the Awakening term is probably a Mage the Ascension shout-out somehow.
>he plays Vampire the Requiem
