Cliff Racer Edition
>Tabletop/P&P RPGs
[Scrollhammer - Tabletop Wargame] http://1d4chan.org/wiki/Scrollhammer_2nd_Edition
Discussion in #Scrollhammer (irc.thisisnotatrueending.com (port 6667))
[UESRPG 1e + other TES RPGs] http://www.mediafire.com/uesrpg
Discussion in #UESRPG (same server)
>Lore Resources
[The Imperial Library] http://www.imperial-library.info/
[/r/teslore] http://www.reddit.com/r/teslore/
[UESP/Lore] http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Lore:Main_Page
[Pocket Guide to the Lore] https://docs.google.com/document/d/1AtsWXZKVqB4Q825_SwINY6z4_9NaGknXgeOknOCDuCU/edit
[Elder Lore Podcast] http://www.elderlore.wordpress.com/
[How to Become a Lore Buff] http://forums.bethsoft.com/topic/1112211-how-to-become-a-lore-buff/
>General Rules
No waifus except Therana please.
Keep the MK/Lady N related squabbling to a minimum.
Previous Kalpa >>47350765
SQUAAWK
>>47371477
FIRST FOR TALOS
>>47371496
You like to dance close to the fire, don't you?
>>47371594
Are they roasting a skeleton without meat?
Also perspective seems kinda screwed in this image, amazing as it may look.
I'm really fond of Adam Adamowicz' artwork and I wish Skyrim lived more up to it. Notice how the imperial armor intended for legionnaires in Skyrim has nordic influences aswell. The furs and dragon on the helmet look great.
>>47371676
Skewed perspective gives a better view of the hall.
>>47371518
They're explicitly not of this kalpa, that's unavoidable.
What contemporary documents say about these cosmic events are, one, colored by bias (IE the Nords only ever knew Nords so of course Alduin eats the Nords first), and two, aren't inherently accurate themselves. That doesn't mean that we can't trust them, but it also doesn't mean we always should at face value.
When I say, "this is the purpose of kalpas," I'm not sourcing it from one document. It's a pastiche of every available source and viewpoint.
Kalpas are not an intended part of Lorkhan's Nietzschean struggle, Velothi cutting your self into better shapes, or whatever. Otherwise it would just be done in one, simple. The reason why things like the Leaper Demon King and the Makhurati Selectives are important are because these are the Lorkhanic events that slowly, over the kalpas, erode at Aka to the point where he'll do things like send a Dovahkiin to stop Alduin. That's why this is the last kalpa. It's all built up until now. Akatosh is Lorkhan.
Anyone read any of the TES novels?
I'm about to start with The Infernal City.
I'll be running a one-shot (and maybe a campaign if I can actually get enough players that work well together) in the TES universe with the Savage Worlds system. There is a guide for it and it's not extremely good, but I can work with it.
Now my question is what would be a fun adventure in Tamriel? My thought was that I basically let them play through the Arena storyline, with some subtle changes that makes it the players, instead of Talin Warhaft, that saves the day. The thing is that it's likely more suitable for a campaign rather than a one-shot, since the players probably won't be able to find 8 pieces of a staff in one session. Another thing is that I need ideas for making it less of a dungeon crawl and more RP-like
Anyone done this before? Or got any ideas/advice?
>>47371802
Is there a reason you aren't using the UESRPG?
>>47371790
Please let us know how it is, I'm interested as well.
>>47371838
My friend, whos is more experienced in GM business than I am, recommended me the savage world version because 1: I'll have access to a physical book, lended to me by him, and 2: It's less detailed and more free form than the current Runequest and Dark Heresy inspired UESRPG
My plan is, once UESRPG 2nd edition is complete, to switch over to that, if I feel like I need more detail.
>>47372291
You could focus on one piece of the staff and flesh that out into a full oneshot.
>>47371740
>They're explicitly not of this kalpa, that's unavoidable
And that still makes no fucking sense whatsoever, and does not explain why you seem to think at one point the Kalpas affected the universe and now they only affect Mundus.
>When I say, "this is the purpose of kalpas," I'm not sourcing it from one document. It's a pastiche of every available source and viewpoint
Then how about you actually bring out those documents and piece it together for me, because so far you are just saying 'it is this way because it is.' There is very little actual lore on the Kalpas. I can confidently tell you I've read all of it, I can't think of anything that implies the purpose you seem to believe in.
>Kalpas are not an intended part of Lorkhan's Nietzschean struggle, Velothi cutting your self into better shapes, or whatever. Otherwise it would just be done in one, simple
You say these things without even explaining yourself. In what manner would it be 'done in one.' How are you making sense of this? Life and Death are a cycle designed to be broken, they are a cycle to reflect the Kalpas, the trap of the Aurbis.
>The reason why things like the Leaper Demon King and the Makhurati Selectives are important are because these are the Lorkhanic events that slowly, over the kalpas, erode at Aka to the point where he'll do things like send a Dovahkiin to stop Alduin
So not only are you implying that Lorkhan is behind the Selectives, but you are implying that Lorkhan has just been messing with Akatosh so that Akatosh would just say fuck it and break the cycle? There is no reasoning behind this whatsoever.
>>47371802
Do one piece of the staff. Start with waking up in the dungeons of the Imperial City, and try to get all the way to Fang Lair.
>Talin Warhaft
Talin probably isn't the Eternal Champion.
Today while playing Morrowind the game kept freezing whenever the music changed (happens mostly when combat begins and ends), it has to do with a Microsoft Security Essentials update. Make sure your Morrowind folder is exempt from real-time scanning and everything will work again.
Just incase any fellow anons are having the same problem. Try playing some Morrowind to check if you have it.
>>47372559
>Talin probably isn't the Eternal Champion
Talin is three people
Uriel Septim's general, who got locked away with him and curiously disappears (even from later versions of Arena).
The Eternal Champion according to the Arena manual
http://tes.riotpixels.com/arena/files/arena-manual.pdf
The Eternal Champion's father according to the Character creation
>One summer afternoon your father, Talin, gives you a choice of chores
http://en.uesp.net/wiki/Arena:Character_Creation
It's all very odd (perhaps a mistake on Bethesda's part). Doesn't stop me from revolving a few headcanons around it.
>>47371790
I read it a while back before Skyrim.
Can't say I was to happy with it at the time I'm afraid. I remember disliking the Mede empire and the whole floating island concept.
Actually I guess I was butthurt more than anything by stuff like the destruction and invasion of Morrowind and the introduction of the Mede dynasty. At the time I felt the author was trying to reduce the Elder Scrolls settting to his personal generic fantasy playground. Some of the characters had real charm though, and although I forgot his name the male Dunmer mentor type was really cool. I didn't care for the female protagonist though. My ex called my misogynistic but at the time I really felt that the author was pushing the 'strong independent girl' trope in an already cliched novel.
Despite all that I still enjoyed it and would recommend it if you'll find it cheap. It's also rather short so that's a bonus I guess.
>>47372811
It's probably just a blunder, or just a case of careless naming.
In terms of Talin being the Eternal Champion, let me explain why I find it to be unlikely. Or, at the very least why it's not Warhaft.
The only reference to Talin being the Eternal Champion are the three introduction pages to the manual, which is written like a story of the game's opening moments. His name is never used again in the manual, or in the Codex Scientia, or any other text.
In the manual, Talin ask's Ria "Why not go to General Warhaft, or the Imperial Guard?". So Talin is clearly not Warhaft. In fact, he's supposedly a younger man sent to study magic under Ria.
The Daggerfall Compendium says that the Eternal Champion was 19 when his quest started, so that would mean he wouldn't hold any senior military position.
The most likely explanation is just that whoever wrote the manual went with the name Talin for the intro pages. It's very much made clear by the manual that you're supposed to create your own hero. It's probably just poor usage of the same name which led to confusion.
Character creation clearly doesn't matter, but it's interesting that they used the same name there.
>>47372525
I'll make this quick.
Redguards are not from this kalpa. This is not up for debate.
Kalpas never effected anything but the Mundus. That does not mean other cycles do not effect the Aurbis.
Alduin is a fragment of Aka. Aka is at odds with Lorkhan. Lorkhan wants to create the Mundis so someone on it can achieve Amaranth. Aka creates the cycle of kalpas to try and prevent that.
Without the kalpa cycle, events would just continue endlessly until someone achieved Amaranth. With it, these events have to slowly degrade Aka's integrity, like STRIPPING HIM OF HIS ALDMERI ASPECTS until the kalpa is allowed to continue to the point where someone can achieve Amaranth.
Not this it's relevant, but even the daedra have a cycle of life and death. Reforming in the waters of Oblivion isn't all that different than reincarnating in Aetherius. Remember, Mankar called Nirn the plane of Lorkhan.
This is very simple.
>>47373496
>This is very simple.
Not the guy that you are quibbling with but you've got to admit that it is a fair bit more than simple.
>>47371790
I really liked them more than i should. They have grammatical errors and its kind of fanfictiony but god damn it i had a great time with them.
THIS THREAD IS NOW OFFICIALLY A KHAJIIT THREAD
>>47372986
To be honest i cant remember her name either but i remember liking her. The whole chef stuff was hella interesting
>>47373887
10 septims to the brave game master that can sneak in that line in your next game.
>>47373698
>>47373887
I-is it finally out?
>>47373937
>>47373997
>>47373496
>Kalpas never effected anything but the Mundus. That does not mean other cycles do not effect the Aurbis
So you are admitting that Satakal is in fact a force that eats the universe over?
>Aka is at odds with Lorkhan. Lorkhan wants to create the Mundis so someone on it can achieve Amaranth. Aka creates the cycle of kalpas to try and prevent that
See this is where I draw the line. Yes the idea is that the Time-God and Space-God are kind of sundered, but never is it ever implied that the Time-God is actively working to sabotage Lorkhan's plans.
All you are doing is using circular reasoning to reach this idea. 'Oh, Kalpas exist, this is proof that Akatosh is trying to stop Lorkhan!' but how do you know that's true? 'because Akatosh is trying to stop Lorkhan.'
>With it, these events have to slowly degrade Aka's integrity, like STRIPPING HIM OF HIS ALDMERI ASPECTS
Well let me start first off by saying we have no idea if the Selectives succeeded in their goals to begin with. Second off they were not editing the overall idea of time, but rather Akatosh alone. It's not like they fucking killed Auriel, they were just trying to make Auriel and Akatosh not the same thing. The Time-God and Akatosh aren't necessarily the same thing. Akatosh is just one interpretation of Time, one that includes a lot of Lorkhanic aspects.
>but even the daedra have a cycle of life and death
The Daedra are basically always dead, though the same thing can pretty much be said of living mortals.
>>47373234
>the manual, Talin ask's Ria "Why not go to General Warhaft, or the Imperial Guard?". So Talin is clearly not Warhaft
Oh no, I definitely wasn't implying the Eternal Champion was necessarily Warhaft, I'm just noting the fact that the EC and others are referred to by that name.
What I do feel is most odd is Warhaft's disappearance.
>>47374482
I rather think Warhaft's appearance is more mysterious. Only the Emperor being rescued at the end sounds like an oversight, and in the version currently being distributed you also save Warhaft.
But the thing is, the guy who goes away in the intro is only ever called Talin, commander of the Imperial Guards. The guy you save at the end is only ever called General Warhaft.
They're obviously intended to be the same person, and they look the same, but it's very weird to first only refer to him by one name and one title, and secondly only ever refer to him by a different name and title.
It really seems that there was some blunder somewhere here.
>>47374624
>and in the version currently being distributed you also save Warhaft
Are you sure about that? In my version, which I got from Bethesda's website, Warhaft was not present at the end.
Here is an image of a text display not included in the final game. It refers to Warhaft as "Talin Warhaft" and not only that but calls him your guardian. I have to wonder whether he is actually intended to be your character's father.
>>47373496
How is Aka's integrity being degraded? I doubt that there's a Maruhkati Selective every kalpa, or someone mantelling Shezzar and stealing some of Akatosh's aspect.
>>47374172
No, I don't put a lot of stock into the Yokudan worldview. It's unexplained at this point, sort of like the Get.
Aka is the chief of those who got pissed and, in the traditional worldview, had Lorkhan's heart torn out. So yeah, he would be pretty opposed to the whole thing. At least, until this kalpa, where part of him obviously isn't. Aka did kalpas. An aspect of Aka enforces them.
The further Aka is fractured, the further this prevents him from acting out his will. In your post you say Akatosh is only a fragment. He is. With his creation shit is even more fucked up, which is why things like dragon breaks, the Numidium, and CHIM happen with more frequency.
If Alduin ate the world when he originally came, these events would not have transpired. In past kalpas (if such a thing can be said) they presumably haven't. Because he was stopped, they did happened. Because they happened, someone achieved Amaranth. This was Lorkhan's goal, and kalpas actively work against that.
>>47375043
I can only really point to the examples we have in this kalpa as evidence, but things like the LDK point to an overarching effort.
>>47375043
Oh, but basically it's like this: http://www.imperial-library.info/content/etada-eight-aedra-eat-dreamer
>>47375606
>No, I don't put a lot of stock into the Yokudan worldview. It's unexplained at this point, sort of like the Get
How is it unexplained? The myth is all the explanation you need, the Aurbis was always a trap, hence why Lorkhan was driven to escape it, how is this so hard to believe? You literally just said in your last post that the Aurbis has cycles.
>Aka is the chief of those who got pissed and, in the traditional worldview, had Lorkhan's heart torn out
You mean, Auriel, right, or even Trinimac? Even the Nords state it was specifically Elven gods who killed Shor. Akatosh is inherently a mannish design, and likewise aligns with men. Aka is just the overlying idea of all Time Gods and has no inherent ideology, it doesn't even actually exists anymore. Aka is basically the Aldmer of Time-Gods.
>The furher Aka is fractured, the further this prevents him from acting out his will
>With his creation shit is even more fucked up, which is why things like dragon breaks, the Numidium, and CHIM happen with more frequency
>If Alduin ate the world when he originally came, these events would not have transpired. In past kalpas (if such a thing can be said) they presumably haven't. Because he was stopped, they did happened. Because they happened, someone achieved Amaranth
Once again, there is no source for any of this, other than blind speculation.
This entire theory his based on the assumption that Time is actively trying to stop the Amaranth for whatever reason, and then used as your explanation for why Time is actively trying to stop the Amaranth. Hell, you are actually disqualifying an entire creation myth to support your theory.
>>47371714
Iunno I don't think EVERYTHING has to be super nordic it seems silly. The imperials should seem more cyrodilic like how they were in oblivion.
>>47377487
I really wish they had kept the Imperial Templar armor. It would have been amazing in Skyrim.
>>47376724
You're overcomplicating this a little.
Why do you think there are kalpas?
>People are actually trying to make sense of Arena.
Kek. Good luck.
>>47379204
Isn't arena basically just a dungeons and dragon crpg and not much else? You won't find much about arena except in the later games that refer to arena
>>47379651
Its more that Arena is inconsistent with itself
>>47379651
>the later games that refer to arena
Any examples?
>>47379721
Lots of references to Shinji, for one. Some in-game books still mention Tharn.
What would you call a class that has these skills?
Destruction
Conjuration
Light Armor
Blunt
Block
Archery
Restoration(?)/Alteration(?)
(?) Is undecided
>>47380076
Battlemage, maybe?
>>47380076
Shaman?
>>47380076
If I remember correctly, that's pretty close to Witchhunter
>>47380076
Probably a witchhunter or a spellsword. You might be able to get away with saying pilgrim.
>>47380076adventurer
>>47371790
>>47371790
I finished reading that last week. The middle drags a bit, but the last quarter really picks up. Ends on a huge cliffhanger, so I need to hunt down the second one.
>>47372752
Thank you! I thought I had gotten a virus or something.
>>47377487
Nords always have been a large part of imperial legion, i'd expect nordic influences.
Fuck Men, fuck the rest of Mer and the beast races.
Dwemer ftw
>>47381413
Why are these fucking gray.
>>47381431
Dwemer are grey skinned. Somewhat similar to Dunmer.
>>47381231
From an in-universe standpoint, that makes sense. Legions, especially legions actually drawn from local populations, should have some local influences.
But from a game standpoint, I can see why they drastically toned it down - they wanted the Imperials to feel more foreign and out of place in Skyrim, to make the Stormcloaks seem more like people fighting for their homeland and traditions.
>>47381478
>citation needed
>>47381574
Are you retarded? Have you never fucking played Morrowind?
Why do people who have never played the games even bother coming into this thread?
>>47381596
>Dead ghosts look grey
Not the same thing at all
>>47381596
Aren't all the dwemer we see in Morrrowind ghosts? That picture looks surprisingly un-ghosty.
>>47381596
These are fucking ghosts. You might as well say that Dunmer are all floating Mr. Skeletals without legs.
>>47381596
Have you?
>>47381615
>>47381617
That's the model without the ghost filter geniuses.
>>47381633
He has corprus, he's not a reliable look for dwemer
>>47381643
Neither are ghost, the "filter" you are talking about is just transparency and they have no reason to be grey from a lore perspective. They would most likely be a shade of aldmeri gold.
>>47381634
So? Think about it: the player was never meant to see them without the ghost filter. How do you know that they didn't make them grey just because it worked better for design purposes?
>>47380076
Fights with clubs in close, with touch spells. Can alterate how arrows work. Restoration to heal self. Blocking is good too, prefers light armor to move quickly. Conjuring to summon stuff.
It is not a spellsword, or battlemage. I would say Daemonhunter.
>>47381720
You can't really be sure what he's going to do with those skills, anon. For all we know he uses destruction magic from a range before closing with an axe, using alteration to defend himself and restoration to drive away the undead, relying on magic more for defense than armor alone while using conjuration to summon weapons to aid him in battle. That could be a battlemage or spellsword fairly easily.
>>47381764
Why not? Dagoth Ur was referred to as The Devil.
>>47381764
Marukhati called Daedra "daimons".
>>47381810
>>47381720
Anon who posted class here. Conjuration is for conjured weapons as well summoning, but mostly the latter. Restoration, if used would be for healing, alteration would be for protection. Destruction is a support skill more so used at close range instead of distance. I also have minor skills in mind such as Mysticism and Sneak.
>>47381914
Demons are referred to in lore at times, and some Daedric princes are called demons in a few texts. Specifically I recall Hermaus Mora being one of them.
And then you get things like items and armor called "demon [whatever]".
It's likely that it's not meant to be literal, that demons don't exist per se, and it's just a confused instance of language being directed at the end-user in a way that breaks the rules of the setting. A narrative seam, so to speak.
>>47381880
Sneak seems like an interesting choice, considering summoning and most of your other skills wouldn't do much to help be sneaky assassin type. Not much like a Nightblade.
>>47382148
Sneak is mostly so I can utilize my archery skill at later levels and get a sneak bonus. And mysticism is for detect life spells, and reflect damage(because I actually never used those before).
>>47381478
>>47381596
>>47381687
More to the point dunmer are only grey because of Azura, who turned them grey right after the dwemer Amanaranth'd. So it's pretty unlikely she did it to the dwarves too.
Still they'd probably be pasty on account of living underground.
>>47381634
The model obviously has subdued colors and empty eyes to make it look ghostly. The artist>>47381413
seems to have taken this depiction too literally.
>>47382194
If they were grey, it probably wouldn't be because of Azura. In fact, it could've been fitting to make them look just like the people that they'd had a hand in destroying, and that the Tribunal had misused the tools of.
Still, now that we have a non-ghosted version of the dwemer to look at, is there any chance of translating the writing on his robes?
>>47382269
I think it's just dwemer-looking scribbles. Some look like letters from the dwemer alphabet, some are unrecognisable.
>>47374050
>>47381596
>is pale yellow/pale gold
>all these people saying its gray
Are you guys monochromatically colorblind, or did you not open the thumbnail?
>>47382716
Yellow-gold is the banner on his hat.
Are you colorblind by any chance
>>47381880
Yeah, basically a Witchhunter
>>47382874
>tfw the ES classes cover so many bases it's easy to be compared to other classes
>>47382753
Lets turn up the saturation. Wadda you know, he's yellow, just like all the aldmer.
>>47382753
Not him, but there is a slight yellowish tinge to the grey. I wouldn't call it anywhere near gold, but I can see where he's coming from.
>>47382889
On one hand, they're so specific that there can be a serious difference between a pair of classes just based on if they use one type of weapons or the other, and on the other hand they're so vague that it's really up to the player to decide any differences, since NPCs will all pretty much use the same tactics anyway.
>>47382753
Don't patronize me you shit. I only looked at his face and hands. And lo and behold >>47383025.
Get /your/ eyes checked.
>And yea, let it be heard that in this general, thou shalt not bear false witness to lore and information, whether by choice or by inability.-Autismous 4-15
-Amen
That sermon was more fun to write than it had any right to be.
![compare[1].png](https://i.imgur.com/VvNVnd0.png "compare[1].png")
>>47383025
>Hey let's make the image have more color
>I told you guys it has this color
I'm not making fun of you, I doubt many people on 4chan understand how colors work.
>>47383061
It wouldn't make sense for them to not be gold. Altmer and chimer are gold, that is the original skin color of mer race. Mer that are not gold are changed by daedric curses.
>>47383179
They probably lost the color from spending all their time underground.
>>47383179
>Maormer are changed by daedric curses
>Falmer are changed by daedric curses
>>47383209
Well falmer were changed by shrooms
>>47383188
Nirn's only a few thousand years old, there isn't enough time for dramatic evolution like that to take place
>>47383209
>falmer
got shroomed
>maormer
Aren't they gold? Orgnum might not be, but he's got all sorts of other weird shit going on.
>>47383083
It has less color because it is a model of a ghost, not an actual dwemer.
>>47383212
Not these Falmer, the original ones.
>>47383214
>there isn't enough time for dramatic evolution like that to take place
With all the magicka literally pouring into the world, evolution could probably quite literally happen at the drop of a hat. Or it could take a billion years to do anything.
Also, nirnroot.
>>47383214
>Aren't they gold?
They are colorless.
>>47383179
What about Bosmer? They tend to have more fleshy tones, or brown. The falmer are white, and they didn't do anything daedra-related as far as I know.
The main reason that the Chimer are gold is because they actually were descended from the Aldmer, who were also the progenitors of the Altmer. The Summerset Isles have had a history of sending away anyone who doesn't agree with the mainstream view, and that's what the Chimer did when they started worshiping Daedra over Aedra. So there is a definite Chimer and Altmer connection, that as far as we know does not exist with the Dwemer, Falmer or even the Bosmer.
The argument you're making here is sort of like saying that pale skin is the default human skin because that's the original skin color of the man race, and that men that are not pale are from a different kalpa. While in at least one case that's definitely true, most men are only pale because of Nedic descent, and the Imperials are noticeably tan and there are the Kothringi who are a now-extinct human tribe with uniquely white skin and hair. And no, ESO did not make them up - they had been mentioned in in-game books as old as Morrowind, and described as being silver-skinned.
>>47383256
>bosmer
>actually elves
>>47383260
Fuck off, furball.
>>47383256
The dwemer originated from the same group as the dunmer, so closely related they were considered a tribe and great house at one point by the xenophobic dark elves.
>>47383304
This is bullshit. "War of the First Council" is the only source that names Dwemer a Great House and it was written by a filthy Imperial n'wah Agrippa Fundilius. What does he know.
>>47383333
>hey disregard this written contradiction to my point and look at this spooky ghost texture
>>47377487
Legionnaires in Skyrim are mostly nords though, cause they're actually open to local recruiting. Dunmer not as much, which is why you don't see them in Morrowind.
>>47383360
PGE3 says that Dwemer were there before Chimer came.
"Before the Ages of Man" says the same.
The thing about "Dwemer being a tribe of Dunmer" is most likely because of First Council legal reasons.
Also, my quints >>47383333 confirm.
>>47383214
>>47383234
From what we know about them maormer have cuttlefish-like color changing skin, that defaults to jelly colorless.
>>47383304
>they were considered a tribe and great house at one point by the xenophobic dark elves
Dwemer disappeared before chimer became dark elves.
>>47383304
One lore source states that Dwemer are the remnants of Aldmer who had settled the northern coasts of Morrowind. So they were considered cousins of the later coming Chimer who came from the Summerset Isles, so they did not originate from the same group as the dunmer and were not that closely related aside from geographical area. They even spent much of their time fighting and had widely different cultural differences. However, another lore source says that there's no real source for information on where the Dwemer came from, since there was no real records of them until contact with the Chimer - they were not one of the exiles from Summerset, At the same time, they were considered one of the Velothi tribes in their early history, though I think making them a Great House was more a matter of later convince for Imperials who didn't know the details of Dunmeri history and probably couldn't tell the races apart. However, there are myths that treat the Dwemer as one of the Velothi tribes and treating them as Dunmer, though this seems to be due to later retellings and rewritings of the stories.
>>47383333
Quads more or less has it right.
Though I'd still recommend actually digging into the lore on this, because it is honestly confusing and half of it seems to be forum posts around the time of Morrowind.
![[Greg_Keyes]_The_Elder_Scrolls_The_Infernal_City(Book4You).pdf](https://4chanarchives.com/image/image-404.png "[Greg_Keyes]_The_Elder_Scrolls_The_Infernal_City(Book4You).pdf")
>>47371790
>>47372154
>Please let us know how it is, I'm interested as well.
You could always read it yourself.
http://www.strawpoll.me/10278317
>>47383475
I didn't even know you could upload pfds to 4chan
thanks anon
To be honest f'lahpaitachi, I don't get why people even try to trace every elven race's origin to Summerset. Do you really buy into Salache "Aldmeris" hoax? Altmer are just a branch: mer, like men, originated on the mainland.
>>47383516
>f'lahpaitachi
kek
>>47383529
Has anyone ever actually experienced someone clapping in a movie theater?
>>47383529
>>47383538
Please don't post off-topic shit.
>>47383548
Sorry, I'll post elder scrolls related memes then.
>>47383554
That's the spirit.
>>47383563
this one's for (you)
>>47383548
Isn't complaining about people posting about off topic stuff also off topic?
![(Imperial Library) [Remanite Scribe] My Star-Made Knight Can't Be This Shezarrine [Elnofex].png](https://i.imgur.com/T3X9BiM.png "(Imperial Library) [Remanite Scribe] My Star-Made Knight Can't Be This Shezarrine [Elnofex].png")
>>47383574
Yes, but at least I sage when I do so.
>>47383585
Maybe I wanted to bump the thread
>>47383422
Those would be quads my lad.
>>47383606
The thread is not that deep to warrant bumping for bumping's sake.
So what pointless bullshit do you guys want to argue about next?
>>47383516
Altmer are the purest mer, the image of the original Et'Ada, unlike those wandering Ehlnofey that have degenerated into all sorts of beastly forms.
>>47371714
Being well equipped for the cold climate doesn't necessarily mean Nordic influence.
Is it pronounced dee-dra or day-eh-dra?
>>47383713
The latter
I took latin in highschool
>>47383703
Altmer are just an offshoot that crossbred with Et'Ada the most.
>>47383721
Latin is irrelevant
>>47383713
Day-druh
>>47383747
>irrelevant
okay kid
>>47383721
>>47383747
That's what I thought. There are a couple of voice actors who pronounced it the other way but I just can't see how dae would be a hard e.
So, where did Snow Elves come from? On one hand their complexion differs strongly from Altmeri, but on the other they venerate Altmeri gods like Phynaster, Auri-El and even fucking Trannymac. Do they descend from Old Ehlnofey or Altmer colonists?
>>47383710
But nords were a big part of the legion, even in Cyrodiil. They would've probably added some nord elements, like wearing wampa fur cloak.
>>47383780
Not irrelevant in general, but Latin pronunciation rules won't help with words that aren't actually derived from Latin or any other real language.
>>47383809
the snow elves came from mundus, some time after it was created
>>47383827
>Latin
real language
okay kid
>>47383725
That's a tautology, every entity in Aurbis is an Et'Ada.
>>47383713
Either is canonicly fine.
>>47383890
I meant 'The' Et'Ada, like Trinimac or Xarxes. The most powerful ones, god-tier.
>>47383891
with the caveat that dee-dra sounds dumb as hell. I wish Bethesda would spring for more/better VAs, Oblivion and Skyrim's voice acting was agonizing.
>>47383906
ESO's VAs were ok, except for the dunmeri cockney meme accent.
>>47383906
I think it would be much better if Bethesda just stopped using voice actors in general.
>>47383937
Crikey, mate! Take a look at this kagouti!
>>47383833
They came from Aldmeris, them worshiping the same gods as Altmer proves that.
>>47383988
>dark elf Steve Irwin
>gets stung by a netch
Crickey
You can say what you want about Skyrim but the Dragonborn DLC was fantastic, especially Apocrypha and everything associated with it. Hunting down black books is the shit.
>>47383941
>mfw this will never happen because mainstream audiences demand them.
>>47383906
I don't know, Dee-dra sounds exotic.
I would love to see it used, for example, by Dunmer but not any other races. Creating pronunciation discrepencies due to geography would be fun as hell in TES.
If the Imperials pronounced it as Day-dra and the Altmer pronounced it as Day-a-drah, it would be cool as hell.
>>47384044
I really like how uncanny the statue looks.
>>47384056
idk man, it sounds like the name deirdre to me. Not so much exotic as walmart-manager
>>47384056
Dee-druh is how the Dunmer are supposedly supposed to pronounce it.
>>47382194
Is there any concrete evidence that Azura caused Chimer to turn into Dunmer? To me it always seemed that Azura (being even worse egoist than Vivec) took to the blame, but real cause of Dunmer turning grey was usage of Kagrenac's tools and thus it makes sense that Dwemer would have turned grey too. I know their ghosts aren't (because those became flesh/skin for nihilistic edgelord fedora robotics), but Kagrenac's tools manipulate mythopoeic forces, so their effect transcends Akatosh and can go back to history.
>>47384070
I'm kinda sad that Hermaeus Mora is the only god TES that gets Lovecraftian intepration even though the other gods are quite Lovecraftian too.
I'd post a picture of Mephala here, but I'm kinda scared to get banned for having too much penis and vagina.
>>47383710
>Nord
>equipped for cold climate
Am I the only one who though that having elemental (100% frost resist) Nords in Morrowind era lore was good idea?
>>47384235
Lovecraftian became a simple buzzword lately. You can pull and twist pretty much any divinity to be a lovecraftian horror. I'm okay with having one blatant Old One and not any more tbqh.
>>47384255
I'd personally cap it around 70-80%, but agreed.
>>47383890
You're forgetting the Hist there. Also, entities descended from Et'Ada (basically every living thing on Mundus) are called Ehlnofey to distinguish them from original spirits.
>>47384255
>Morrowind Nords had 100% frost resistance
>Oblivion Nords had 75% frost resistance
>Skyrim Nords had 50% frost resistance
Pottery
>>47384264
Agreed that Lovecraft has become very mainstream these days, but really I think gods are more interesting when they're alien and beyond mortal comperehension. TES already does this in lore though, so it doesn't matter if Sheogorath (for example) likes to larp Victorian gentleman even if it's cheesy.
>>47384321
Nords losing their elemental affinity due to degeneration from their Ehlnofey ancestors would have made some good lore, but of course Bethesda didn't bother.
>>47384014
Aldmeris is the fragment of original elven ancestral world that became Tamriel on Mundus, so it's more like that they didn't come from anywhere, but rather were already there when non-elven races came from other contitents. Just read Annotated Anuad.
>>47383568
I'd like to honestly know what creates gravity on Nirn. I know Aedra are the cogs of the metaphysical and physical machinery that makes Nirn, but which one of them maintains gravity? Kynareth/Kyne?
>>47384344
Some people here would disagree but I don't mind how Skyrim as a region was 'retconned' to have some biome diversity instead of being all cold, icy, snowy and uninhabitable in general.
Why did Ada'Soom Dir-Kamal attacked Skyrim first instead of Morrowind? Does that mean that Akavir is located north of Tamriel?
>>47384538
I don't mind that either, but I still can't get why there's Dwemer ruins in Skyrim despite there being zero lore behind that before Skyrim came out. I know they had to because people were pretty mad about Dwemer not being in Oblivion despite that it made sense.
Guess Nords were too dumb to notice the ruins, but I'd figure Imperials would have written something about it.
>>47384563
Akavir is east of Tamriel. No idea why Skyrim got attacked first.
>>47384579
The dwemer being in Skyrim ties in with the whole Falmer degenerating story but it does seem kinda odd to me that Falmer, Dwemer and Nords would share a province. We know the Falmer and Nords battled eachother, but what about the Dwemer?
>>47384579
Eh, I dunno, there are dwemer ruins all over. You get them in morrowind, you get them in hammerfell, why wouldn't you get them in the space in between?
>>47384563
I think this is most accurate map of Nirn and as you can see Akavir is to east. Dir-Kamal attacking Skyrim first might have something to do with fact that they're snow demons and there's plenty of snow to go around.
>>47384614
Here we go.
>>47384614
>I think this is most accurate map of Nirn
Do we know anything at all about the shape of Akavir, Yokuda or Atmora?
>>47384614
what the fuck is a lyg
>>47384635
Completely irrelevant lore.
>>47384391
>>47384014
Aldmeris doesn't exist.
>>47384614
>I think this is most accurate map of Nirn
There is nothing accurate about it. It was only made to show relative sizes of the continents.
>>47384563
Because if Nirn is spherical like our earth and if Akavir is in the east, the shortest path to be taken to Tamriel would be from the North.
pic related
>>47384563
You are a snow demon. Where do you want your invasion's foothold on the alien continent to be?
[ ] Volcanic waste
[ ] Swamp
[ ] Tundra
>>47384700
Didn't Kamal hibernate in winter and waited for summer to attack monkey islands? Pretty strange for a snow demon.
>>47384603
That story was added in Skyrim. There was nothing on it before. Bloodmoon mentioned that Rieklings were fallen snow elves, but it was never explained why and no connection to Dwemer there. Interestingly back then there weren't Dwemer ruins (or even a mention of them) in Solstheim either.
Also, nords vs. elves dynamics is one of those things what always felt odd about Skyrim adding Dwemer into Skyrim. Why wouldn't the Dwemer have just exterminated primitive elf-hating people opposing them just like they easily stopped same people from invading Morrowind? I can see Nords being too scared to attack Dwemer though, but find it kinda hard they could co-exist peacefully. Then again there's nothing to suggest Dwemer were very warlike and certainly they didn't have much interest in conquering new territories. Still, it's kind of odd how they were always there, but apparently nothing much happened.
>>47384635
http://en.uesp.net/wiki/Lore:Lyg
>>47384725
First Empire Nords have beaten Dwemer though.
>>47384725
Nords live in tiny settlements (remember Solitude?) above the ground.
Dwemer dwell underground.
There's no reason to fight. Extermination is just a waste of resources.
>>47384724
Winter is chillin time.
>>47384605
Dwemer really weren't supposed to be some empire that had holdings all over Tamriel. Hammerfell ruins were specifically there because of Rourken clan that self-exiled from Morrowind due to ideological reasons that are unknown.
>>47384670
Yes it does just not in the way that most Altmer think because they fail to realize that Aldmeris = Tamriel.
>>47384740
ohhhhh, crabland
gotcha
Hey guys, I have a question for you:
If the main elder scrolls races were based off of real peoples, what race would they be?
Here's what I've gathered thus far:
>Imperials - Romans obviously
>Nords - Nordic peoples
>Redguard - Probably Moors
>Bretons - Britons or actual Bretons
>Wood elves - They remind me of Southeast Asians, with their stature, environment and their "green pact" reminds me a tiny bit of Buddhism
>Dark elves - They remind me of Israelites, with their religious exodus from summerset isles, their prophets, and then their exile from morrowind and conquest by another race (argonians). Also, the way that they were cursed at Red mountain reminds me of the Golden calf story.
>High elves - in earlier games, their art was very Japanese inspired. And now they seem to be a strong imperial power, so I would say they are akin to Imperial Japan.
>Khajiit - they remind me of gypsies, desert nomads and perhaps some semi exotic central Asian peoples?
>Argonians - amazonian tribes perhaps
>>47384808
Apparently it's more like some mirror dimension connected to Tamriel where everything is same, but opposite. Kinda like parallel "evil" worlds seen in many sc-fi stories.
>>47384791
Just like Kahjiit deny that their pantheon is shared with other races.
>>47384821
>doesn't even divide into cultures
Why even bother?
>>47384821
Dunmers resemble Israelites historically, but in terms of culture and art they more similiar to the far east countries.
The khajiits you see in Skyrim indeed resemble gypsies, but I think the Elsweyr itself is based more on South-East Asia countries.
As for Altmers and Bosmers, although the influences you pointed out are obviously true, I think they are more based on a modified general fantasy elves image than any real world culture.
>>47383433
I haven't played, but the Maormer who appear in ESO have a pallid tone.
>>47384914
>mers
>>47384821
I would've preferred Nibenese to have more eastern inspiration and Colovians to be more mediterranean.
>>47383793
Both pronunciations are present in different accents.
>>47384056
Like how "DUN-mer" is a Colovian pronunciation.
>>47384332
There's also the Hist and [unnamed insect god].
>>47384821
>equating fantasy cultures to real world ones
>>47384672
If I remember correctly, it's been okay'd by active devs. Hey, see where it says "projected"?
>>47384634
Only what's left of Yokuda.
>>47385016
fuck off
>>47384332
>even if it's cheesy
>cheesy
I see what you did there.
>>47385040
But he's right
>>47384821
Not this shit again.
>>47384821
Good ones are white, bad ones are not. Now go back to your hole.
>>47384821
I think the Dunmer are the hardest ones to compare.
>>47384836
Evil crabland from another mother's kalpa
got it
>>47384821
This is always completely pointless, but I do have to wonder.
Why do people always insist that Redguards are Moors? There's really nothing particularly Moorish about them. Moors aren't even really one people.
>>47384700
"The ignorant think it is only a place of ash and lava. It had rolling green plains and swamps and verdant hills too."
>>47384725
Nords would get slaughtered if they'd attempt to raid underground dwarven cities, Dwemer would get slaughtered if they'd attempt to raid surface nord cities.
>>47385016
>>47385053
>>47385099
Gotta agree.
Too often do discussions about elder scrolls on /v/ end up in shit-flinging about which race is supposed to be real-life black people
>redguards are niggers cause they act like niggers
>no, khajiit are niggers cause they act like niggers
>you're both wrong, dunmer are the niggers of tamriel
glad there's no /pol/ shitposting here though
Tell me about the Nordic shamans
what do they do?
>>47384821
Imperials = mix of Romans, British Empire and Americans
Redguards = mix of nothern-african peoples, arabs, Atlantis myth and pirates also Black Panthers (atleast according to MK)
Argonians = native americans
Nords = pretty much same as nords in real life
Bretons = mix of traditional fantasy half-elves and real life people that are actually called Bretons (think of how Nords are nords)
Nedes = neolithic europe
Altmer = Tolkien's high elves with nazi eugenics
Ayleid = same as above with nazi eugenics replaced by bloody Aztec rituals
Dwemer = sumerians and fedora atheists
Bosmer = Kender from Glorantha mixed with traditional fantasy treehugger elves
Chimer = jews
Dunmer = jews, mongols, japanese and 19th century occultism
Orcs = mongols with samurai armor
Falmer = yet another Tolkienic high elf clone, this time in SNOW
Khajiit = furries
Sload = Deep Ones
Imga = nod to "cargo culture" phenomenon and intelligent apes of chinese legends
Giants = stone age/cavemen
Goblins = goblins (duh)
Dragons = dragons (also time machines)
Ka Po' Tun = Rakshasa from D&D with chinese culture
Tang Mo = intelligent apes from chinese legends
Tsaesci = Naga with japanese culture
>>47385257
As far as I know only the Skaal have shamans.
>>47385281
There were also Nord shamans, I remember them from some dwemer or dunmer story where nord shamans conjured snowstorm(and I say conjured because it didn't mention shouting) so they could attack in secrecy or something
>>47385269
Imperials are super Chinese.
>>47385326
I think you meant to say Japanese because that's what their Akaviri influence technically is (Katanas aren't very Chinese or are they?) and still that influence is pretty much only visible in aesthetics. Otherwise they're far more like Romans if anything.
>>47385308
I think that was from Sermons and could well have been Skaal. Skaal are Nords anyway (outsiders wouldn't be easily able to distinguish them from other Nords since their monotheism is only thing that separates them from rest of their race) and they likely were part of the army that invaded Morrowind.
If we are equating real world cultures to tamrielic ones then:
Imperials : Romans+ 'Merica
Dunmer: Early Jews+Russians+Mezopthamian peoples
Khajeet: Egyiptians+Gypsies+Hindus (they kinda took the Brittish misconception about Gypsies being from Egypt and played it up to 11)
Argonians : Pree-Islamic Persians with added jungle flavour
Nords : Vikings+Scots(Picts?)
Wood elves: American natives ?
Altmer : Imperial Japan+ Jews + Nazis
Redguards : Arab pirates + Jap pirates + black people
Orsimer : Mongols + black people
Brettons : Brittish people + South slavs
I can't wait for a game set in Akavir tho.
Especially want to see the monkey people and snow demons.
No this shit again.
>>47385308
>Nords in Skyrim shun magic
TODD REEEEEEE
I know nords love axes and mead but there could atleast be some affinity for frost magic
>>47385385
What makes Dunmer Russian? Also, Bretons exist in real life and they're pretty much like Bretons except for not being half-elves.
In case of Argonians is the persian thing how their ancient civilization is in ESO? If that's so then I can understand it, but in older lore they're pretty much native americans with noble savagery and all.
>>47385409
Not thisHello.again...
>>47385438
Ancient argonian architecture is pretty much mayan/aztec.
>>47385461
ESO ISNT CANON REEEEEE
>>47385436
Nords in Bloodmoon had lots of affinity for magic. Skaal were heavily into nature type magics and also seemed to like skill fortification magic. There were also Berserkers that used magical weapons and Fryse Hags that were extremely aggressive Kyne worshipping witches utilizing elemental magic.
Guess it was just lost in time and Fryse Hags got turned into birds for some reason.
>>47385005
>[unnamed insect god]
What is that?
>>47385633
Ada-Mantis
>>47385633
>>47385722
>>47385482
There were Hagravens in Bloodmoon too, they were full-on ravens.
>>47384747
The Aetherium Wars book mentions that the Dwemer and Nords had been fighting for many years.
>>47385729
Moths are not gods. They're nanomachines made by gods (Aedra) that are used in reading Elder Scrolls (blueprints of Mundus) among other things.
>>47385793
You mean that Raven witch in Werewolf questline?
>>47385326
This is more a meme than anything else, really.
>>47385850
Never heard of it? Some kind of /v/ thing I guess, but I'd like to know what's the story behind it. I can see Akaviri influence (Katanas, Cloud Ruler Temple), but it's clearly more like Japanese. Then again asia=all the same is very common thing especially in jokes (see: chinese cartoons) and has some basis in reality, but is it so simple?
>>47385898
There is some Akaviri infleuence mentioned in PGE1. That is it.
>>47385964
PGE1 Cyrodiil best Cyrodiil.
>>47385358
No, Chinese. In the Niben, in the dragon motifs, and in the emperors.
>>47385850
It's extremely blatant. Like, overtly Chinese.
>>47386008
They're still clearly Romans though and have been atleast since Morrowind.
>>47386050
I never said they weren't.
>>47373887
What is this?
>>47386107
Prequel? Some webcomic.
>>47380174
Nah, battlemage is destruction focused (see Response to Bero's Speech)
>>47386107
Prequel
A webcomic/Quest about a khajiit immigrating to Cyrodiil just before the events of Oblivion
She's the other khajiit in that flash and she fails
at life and everything else
>>47386107
I guess it's fanmade mockup of those Oblivion for mobile games.
>>47386151
I'm not denying that Battlemages aren't destruction focused (because they are), but I don't think that book is very good example of Battlemagery. Read Art of War Magic instead.Battlemages are basically generals and that matters more than magic
>>47386218
That depends on which definition of "Battlemage" you take. There is "The Imperial Battlemage", the (Shadow) Legion Battlemages and a Battlemage class.
>>47386008
>House Guards hold exceptionally long daikatanas crossed at intersections
http://uesp.net/wiki/Lore:Pocket_Guide_to_the_Empire,_1st_Edition/Cyrodiil
oh wow SO blatant
>>47386369
Also, those would be exclusively Japanese weapon (not really called daikatanas though, but nodachi or field swords) since Chinese don't use anything resembling a katana nor have they ever used.
>>47383568
>>47384424
Probably the Ehlnofey. We had an Ehlnofey of Air, Water, Earth, and Fire in ESO (yah I know, ESO sucks, blah blah blah, lets not get into this again) http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Lore:Ehlnofey#Gallery
>>47384670
It might, it might not. It's still up for speculation
>>47386369
What exactly do you think this proves?
>>47386418
Who said they did?
>>47386467
That's pretty much the only line that hints at Eastern culture in PGE1, and it's not even Chinese.
