Big Guns Get Sleepy Edition
>Rules databases
https://mega.co.nz/#F!pFgm0RKR!J06C1gVYcjzNGsF8YNLsjQ
https://kat.cr/warhammer-40k-pdf-library-t9575373.html
>FAQs
http://www.games-workshop.com/en-GB/Rules-Errata
>40k 7th edition quick reference sheet(s)
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/4104995/Games/7edRef_V7.pdf
>Forgeworld Book index
http://www.dakkadakka.com/wiki/en/Forge_World_and_Apocalypse_Rules_Index
>White Dwarves
https://www.mediafire.com/folder/tx4hcy4u487pv/WD
>Novels (Working link as of 02/02/2016)
https://mega.nz/#F!wx4BiKhD!YhnAf1BqSmAB8dO6xDM56Q
What would be an appropiate point cost for a Wraithknight? I love the miniature and want to use it.
400? 450?
>>47265652
700
And it's still better than a stompa
>>47265716
How do we make the Stompa better? More appropriate point cost, or more stuff?
Also same thing for Sir Khorne-A-Lot.
How I Chaos Thunderhawk in CSM Emperors children 1850pts?
Reposting from the last thread because I didn't know it was dying:
So I already have two fair sized armies and my LGS is active and everything has been going great.
Now I have managed to rope two friends in but I have a few questions as when I started it was horrible, I was playing a ta GW against net lists, and for the most part I had to sink or swim.
My friend is a vet and as such wants to play IG, specifically Mech Heavy.
Would 2 Start Collectings and 2 Chimeras be a good start towards that at 1000 points?
My other friend wanted to play Ad Mech but is a bit spooked by the dual codex. His plan is to get their Start Collecting, a box of Kataphron and a box of Kastelan Robots. Again hoping to get to 1000 points.
Also I don't have a 6x4 table and have the biggest apartment out of all of us, can you really play on a 4x4 table? We don't want to play on the ground but are looking at those mouse-pad kind of mats. How are those?
I already have another friend using my 2nd army and it would be easier (and probably better, not that my LGS isn't awesome) if we could play at a house or better yet, whichever house.
Is it worth givings the space wolves cavalry plasma pistols ?
>>47265752
It isn't worth giving anyone a Plasma Pistol, ever.
>>47265763
Noob here, they dont help deal with vehicles and the like ? or I should have a better answer for those problems ?
>>47265734
Probably more appropriate point cost, since the Kustom Stompa from IA:8 is so popular.
>>47265747
We've had a lot of luck on a 4x4 for games under 1500 points.
>>47265716
That's more of a matter of the Stompa being utter shit.
Which Dynasty should I make my Necron army?
>>47265887
Meynarkh
>>47265887
Tell me your personality traits and the purpose that drives your undying legions, first.
>>47265788
Better answers everywhere. Shit even a melta bomb for 5 points will do more work against vehicles than a shitty plas pistol.
Anyone here ever played with the Thousand Sons codex on 1d4chan? How was it?
>>47265905
I'm hoping to make them similar to the Beast Planet / Beast drones from Shadow Raiders. A seemingly endless unbeatable army destroying worlds with unknown motives aside from perhaps the hunger for destruction.
>>47266004
Then the Destroyers Cults are your thing. The Destroyer Cults are formed from numerous dynasties and are not tied down since most of the time they are exiles.
However, they do tend to flock to the most bloodthirsty of dynasties. The ax-crazy Maynarkh dynasty has a large following of Destroyers within their armies.
There is also Novokh known for being savage and bloodthirsty even in their undead state.
Can you use CSM properly without transports?
A squad needs to be 10 man strong to get two special weapons,
and a Rhino has a transport capability of 10 men.
I really wanna have my slaanesh sorc running with my slaanesh marines but it seems to without the metal bawx, are there other good ways to get them across the table without all of them dying?
Also where do I find lash of submission and warptime?
>>47266090
No, it is best to play CSM with as few Chaos Space Marines as possible tbqh.
Shitty boxes, bigger shitty boxes and deciding to run bikes are kind of your only options.
I think FW makes a CSM drop pod that eats its occupants. Not sure though.
>>47266114
>shitty boxes
>only shitty because of the undercosted high str low ap weaps that brutalize them
Boy, they should make lascannons and meltas cost as much as a rhino to take.
>>47266132
>That being said with 'all weapons that fulfill a similar role' of course.
That guy again, so with just the units and not counting weapons, upgrades, etc I calculate the CSM points from Dark Vengeance at 360 base (100 from the 2 cultist squads, chosen 90, 105 helbrute, 65 chaos lord). I'm getting the Blood Angels battleforce and the SM side of the Dark Vengeance. What should I field for a fair fight? The terminators alone are 200 points, a captain is 90, the librarian is 65, tactical squads are 140 each 10 man, dreadnought is 125, bike squad is 63, oh I get ANOTHER captain\chapter master? so that's another 90 leaving me around 913 points if they come as they are. What would be a fair fight? (I'm rolling Blood Angels and going to convert all the DA shit over.. aka paint them red and do what I can to change the insignia or w/e)
THINGS SHALL GET LOUD NOW/What is cover?
HQ:
>Lord, MoS, Burning Brand, Steed of Slaanesh, Power Sword - 130
Troops:
>5x Noise Marines, Blastmaster, Rhino, Havoc Launcher - 125 + 47
>5x Noise Marines, Blastmaster, Rhino, Havoc Launcher - 125 + 47
>9x Noise Marines, Doom Siren, Meltabombs, Blastmaster, Close Combat Weapons, Icon of Excess - 252
Fast Attack:
>Helldrake (Hades Autocannon) - 170
Heavy Support:
>5x Havocs - 4x Melta, Rhino, Dirge Caster, Havoc Launcher - 167
>5x Havocs - 4x Melta, Rhino, Dirge Caster, Havoc Launcher - 167
ALLIED DETACHMENT - Renegades and Heretics:
HQ:
>Command Squad: Banner of Hate, Flamer - 60
Troops:
>Infantry Platoon: 3 x 15 (180), 9x Flamer (45) - 240 (+ Free Arch-Demagogue + Command Vox Net)
>Infantry Platoon: 3 x 15 (180), 9x Flamer (45) - 240 (+ Free Arch-Demagogue + Command Vox Net)
Heavy Support:
>Renegade Strike Battery (3x Wyvern) - 165
Inb4 no anti-air/10.
>>47266305
Same Guy, 1850 total points.
>>47266305
Also the Platoons should be 190 each not 240, I forgot that I took out 15 men + 3 flamers from each.
>>47265747
I mean it seems like you have one good thing going for you, you're really thinking about things a lot. Maybe too much...but at least no one will be unprepared or let down in the long run. Hopefully.
The good news is, if these guys are your friends, and if you started off in the hobby in a sink or swim environment, well now you have a chance to actually enjoy the "fun" part of the hobby. As far as buying a starting force is concerned I always tell people to get what they're guaranteed to paint...what interests them. If it ends up not being competitive in your friend group you can add units or modify rules/army costs/etc later. Not sure how something is going to go? Test it with your buddies! Then you'll have fun learning and you can come back here and tell us, with first hand experience, if this stuff works. This is the nice part about getting friends into the hobby. Then you can gently ease them in to a more competitive scene at the LGS, once they understand the core of the game.
>>47266305
Why aren't you running a baleflamer for that drake?
Lord should have a lightning claw too, since he won't get +1a anyways
>>47266418
Because I have no AA - is the Baleflamer better either way because the Drake can Vector Strike anyway? I've never made a CSM list before.
Good shout on the claw, thank you.
>>47265809
Thats good to hear. The only real problem I think would be scouting but I will probably use my Deathwing in our learning games as not to wreck things.
>>47266381
How are Ad Mech at dealing with dealing with Leman Russes?
I am really the mastermind behind this so I am overthinking it. Everyone choose the army they liked the looks of and I don't think any are too far ahead of the others besides perhaps my friend that will use the Necrons.
Show me some cool fluffy lists.
>>47266513
The Emperor's Barbeque.
-CCS, 60 points.
+3 flamers, 15 points.
+Heavy flamer, 10 points.
Total, 85 points.
+Chimera, 65 points.
+2 heavy flamers, free.
-Infantry platoon:
-PCS, 30 points.
+3 flamers, 15 points.
+Heavy flamer, 10 points.
Total, 55 points.
+Chimera, 65 points.
+2 heavy flamers, free.
-Infantry squad, 50 points.
+Flamer, 5 points.
Total, 55 points.
-Infantry squad, 50 points.
+Flamer, 5 points.
Total, 55 points.
-Special weapons squad, 30 points.
+3 flamers, 15 points.
Total, 45 points.
-Special weapons squad, 30 points.
+3 flamers, 15 points.
Total, 45 points.
-Special weapons squad, 30 points.
+3 flamers, 15 points.
Total, 45 points.
-Infantry platoon:
-PCS, 30 points.
+3 flamers, 15 points.
+Heavy flamer, 10 points.
Total, 55 points.
+Chimera, 65 points.
+2 heavy flamers, free.
-Infantry squad, 50 points.
+Flamer, 5 points.
Total, 55 points.
-Infantry squad, 50 points.
-Special weapons squad, 30 points.
+3 flamers, 15 points.
Total, 45 points.
-Special weapons squad, 30 points.
+3 flamers, 15 points.
Total, 45 points.
-Special weapons squad, 30 points.
+3 flamers, 15 points.
Total, 45 points.
-Hellhound, 125 points.
+Heavy flamer, free.
++TOTAL POINTS++
-1,000 Exactly.
>>47266513
85-Renegade Commander-Mutant Overlord, Covenant of Tzeentch, Refractor Field
70-2XEnforcer, combat drugs
240-Ogryn Brutes-6 Hounds, Packmaster
240-Ogryn Brutes-6 Hounds, Packmaster
170-Mutant Rabble-50 models, Champion, Covenant of Nurgle
170-Mutant Rabble-50 models, Champion, Covenant of Nurgle
55-Spawn
55-Spawn
55-Spawn
55-Spawn
80-Renegade Sentinels-4 models, Heavy Flamers
79-Rapier Laser Destroyer Battery-3 gun models, militia training, 3 extra crew
79-Rapier Laser Destroyer Battery-3 gun models, militia training, 3 extra crew
79-Rapier Laser Destroyer Battery-3 gun models, militia training, 3 extra crew
How to use-run everythingexcept the artillery and, barring great mutation rolls, the demagoguescreaming at the enemy lines, keep one mutie blob bubblewrapping the rapiers and demagogue
if I decide to cast a 1 warp charge spell using 2 charges to make sure, does the enemy have to deny the witch only one charge or both?
>>47266702
Ok, you roll your two dice. If both of them are 4+, then your opponent has to deny twice. If one is 4+ and one isn't, they need to deny one charge. If neither are 4+, then it doesnt go off and they neednt bother
Why would anyone do this? It's not even an amazing paintjob
Noob question here: If I have a unit made of psykers, do I only need to pass one warp charge roll to have them all cast, or do I need enough successes for every model in the unit?
>>47266722
That's what I expected. Thank you.
>>47266826
You need to reread your Big Rule Book because that is explicitly explained.
I have seen some confusion with >>47266702's question but yours is too simple for you not to educate yourself.
>>47266746
>BT termie Libby
What black magic is this?
Valkyries for renegades and heretics, Y/N?
>>47266305
You should get a Sonic Dread
So what's the interaction between existing aircraft formation and the new aircraft wing rules? Can you use the old formations in the new attack patterns? What happens with formations that have 5+ flyers?
Do you have to use the Allied Detachment or can you just bring a formation from another faction?
>>47266909
>He is using that shit-tier flying DLC.
>>47266702
Pretty sure they now have to deny every single successful die. So if you cast a spell that costs 3 wc and you get 4 successes, they have to make 4 denials.
>>47266928
You can do both, you don't need one for the other if that is what you are asking.
Normal ally rules still apply.
>>47266929
>DLC
I want /v/ to leave.
>>47266929
>Not taking a free 4+ invul save without bothering to jink
Why would you not? It even explicitly says that you don't have to bother with the dogfight bullshit unless everyone agrees that they want to do it.
You guys can do you, glad I don't play with it and my entire LGS collectively said "Hell No" to it.
>>47266948
Fine, if DLC triggers you how about completely unnecessary supplement.
>>47266951
>Why would you not?
Why make things more unbalanced and bulky, Dogfight phase or not .
>>47266928
According to the base rulebook, you can take any number of any detachment (combined arms, faction specific, allied, or formation). The only restrictions are that your warlord can't be from the allied detachment, the allied detachment can't be the same faction as the primary detachment, and I don't think you can take multiple allied detachments from the same faction.
>>47266836
>You need to reread your Big Rule Book because that is explicitly explained.
I'm not seeing it. And various other forums regarding this question are torn on the topic because of uncertain wording. I'm gonna say that every model in the unit passes with a single roll. That is, 2 successful warp charges allows my 5-model unit to fire off 5 attacks.
>>47266305
The Demagogues for platoons are technically not free. The rules say one sergeant per platoon may be upgraded for free and sergeants cost 10pts.
>>47266980
Why do you hate free shit, anon? It even makes provisions for taking up to 4 dakkajets in a single FA slot so you can still take an assload of deffkoptas and warbikers. All we have to do is houserule dakkajets into ground support aircraft and it's a solid buff for orks.
>>47266992
The entire unit is a single psyker. Any ability that affects a psyker affects the entire unit, and any damage that a psyker would take is allocated randomly. If you manifest a psychic power with that unit, it's manifested once, and the unit can't manifest that power again that turn. That's the intent of the rulebook; if you find a loophole and can convince other people that it means that you can cast 15 vortexes of doom for 3 warp charges, good for you.
>>47266992
>I'm gonna say that every model in the unit passes with a single roll. That is, 2 successful warp charges allows my 5-model unit to fire off 5 attacks.
Then you are wrong and should feel bad. Warp Charges are used on a power by power basis.
>Have 6 Dice in Psyker Pool
>Use 3 for a 2 Charge power
>All 3 succeed
>Attempt at Deny
>Empty Warp Charge pool.
>Next Power, 3 Dice left
>Use 2 towards Force
>Goes off with 1
>Attempt at Deny
>No more Powers, 1 Dice Left. Oh well!
>Move on to shooting
>>47266826
Don't a unit of individual psykers become brotherhood of psykers per 7th edition? I'm 99% sure they do because there's an argument on 1d4chan debating whether this buffed or nerfed Zoanthropes.
Is the death from the skies supplement not in the mega link? There is just so much shit in it I can't really find it.
>>47267081
2 different rules
>>47266090
There's not a lot of armies that work without transports or highly mobile units. One of the many reasons why Tyranids suck ass.
Even foot Eldar can be beat by mid tier armies.
>>47267081
Librarius Conclave is a pile of individual psykers, though I guess that's not a normal unit, and doesn't necessarily have to be a single unit. I can't think of a unit that has individual psykers rather than BoP, but that doesn't mean it doesn't exist.
>>47266501
AdMech can kill Russes, no problem, since they can take haywire out the ass. The problem is that Russes can kill AdMech that aren't T5 or more pretty easily too.
>come back to 40k
>turns out my army is gamebreakingly overpowered and nobody wants to play with me
>>47267100
It's not. There's a link to it posted a couple of threads ago, the one that had the mosaic of all the OP images. Check the archive.
>>47267200
How did your army become massively OP? All the OP-shit is pretty much new models, not old.
>>47267246
He probably had two dozen crisis suits or anything necron.
What happens when the Imperium gets off it's ass and pulls out all the really dangerous handheld shit?
Stuff like Rad weaponry and the like.
>>47267245
Thank you!
>>47267274
No problem. Post it here when you find it for anyone else that needs it. It should probably get added to the archive or the copypasta.
>watching two friends go at it, one tyranid, other necron
>tyranid friend uses biovores to wreck his warriors
>necron player complaining about how broken tyranids because of AP4 artillery are while he JSJs with fucking destroyers
>an unit that for 40 points comes with stock preferred enemy, jetpacks, T5, W2, 2shot S5AP3 guns, 3+ save and 5+ fnp
>>47267306
Ask him to play a game as the other guy's 'nids and see how quickly that shuts him up
>>47265734
More Dakka. Either cut the cost by 100 points and give it a couple more Supa-rokkits or just make it a "Build your Stompa" like the Kustom one.
Problem with it is that GW mentality the second option will never happen so we can just hope for the first one.
>>47267053
the only exception to this is Zoanthropes with Warp Blast, and they specifically say they are an exception to this with warp blast.
Only currently viable Ork list:
>...
>>47266929
>He thinks this is just a supplement
>>47267273
The Mechanicus uses it all the time.
Lots of people die.
>>47267142
Seers Council has to be a single unit, with two IC psykers that can't leave the unit of warlocks who are BoP with special rules about mastery level and warp charges. But the individual psykers do not join the BoP
>>47267501
>notblitz Brigade
>notnobz in a naut
The FAQ hit hard...
>>47267266
>crisis suits
>OP
Unless you play Orks or something, you are the highest tier of scrub in existence if you think Crisis Suits are in any way a problem.
>>47265734
>khorne superheavy
>600 points
>ws5 i4
it's not a bad unit, just not worth 888 points or 2 knights or a daemon lord
>>47267200
unless your army was particularly dickish before you can probably still run it as a good but not super OP version now.
Worst I could think is if you had a bunch of scythe wraithguard, in which cas just say they're cannon wraithguard. Or a ton of warp spiders, which is dickish, but why did you have more than 2 units of those?
>>47267575
He said viable, not slightly less shit
>>47267575
>>47267501
50 mek gunz with grots in front for cover.
>>47267527
> Fuck it, let's just set space on fire and leave
>>47267585
Dunno, people always bitch at me when I JSJ with dozens of missiles.
>>47267616
>mek gunz with grots in front for cover
FAQ'd
Why are Predator Tanks so lame?
>>47267655
Was it? Can you post the ruling for me?
>>47267656
Because for the same cost as one Predator you can get two Razorbacks
>>47267656
They are hardy, but no too hardy wit decent fire power, but not too good, wrapped up in a price tag thats about 10/15 points too high. its a recipe for mediocrity
>>4726770
TBF 2 razor backs arent that hot either, being both relatively fragile and with even less firepower to show for it
Whats /tg/'s opinion on the ork fandex? Id love to give my orks not completely terrible rules but im also kinda new and unaware of its total bullshit or not
What's your favorite Leman Russ variant, and how do you like to kit them out?
>>47267673
Intervening models don't grant a cover save if you can see over them.
>>47267630
that not a 'now OP' thing. Crisis suit have always been able to do that.
>>47267757
But if I'm covering grots with grots, can't I just snug them up close? I get that I can't cover a stompa with a nob, and that very tall models can over the top of one blob to shoot at another blob, but what if I have my cover dudes 1" away from the guys behind them and lined up perfectly?
>>47267246
I'm guessing Iyanden Eldar.
>>47267745
Eradicator. Heavy bolters are solid, but at lower points levels lascannon/multimeltas can work for the versatility.
>>47267745
the fast attack options for Solar Auxillia.
Or am I limited to IG.
I really like the Crimson Fists, they're the only loyalists I enjoy and their muted blue color scheme greatly appeals to me. I love them on the front of the old Rogue Trader and 3rd ed books, and I want to get a load of beakies and old-school bolters from Forge World, maybe even a Land Raider Proteus or two.
However, I've not really paid much attention to the fluff or crunch for many years, but heard lots of complaints about power creep. Presumably there's no real way to make an effective army using predominantly old-school marine units like tactical squads, land speeders and land raiders, is there? I get that there's one that just let's you spam free Rhinos, but that sounds weird to me, and the people I've talked to locally admit that formations are a little silly and they often play with normal force org charts.
I was thinking a core consisting of Pedro Kantor with a posse in some Land Raider variant, 20-30 tacticals with appropriate transports, and then one of each of a Land Speeder, Predator and Dreadnought. I can magnetize everything, no problem, any variant of the above is doable. How badly would I get smoked at around 1500 points against standard force org?
This is assuming I use the Imperial Fists rules. Crimson Fists don't have their own thing, right?
>>47267745
Leman Russ Exterminator with Camo Netting, Multi-Melta sponsons, and a Hull-mounted lascannon.
All that dakka, and always having a 5+ cover save for only 175 points.
>>47267724
True. Especially since you can take two rhinos for the cost of one razorback :^)
How odd or fluff-breaking would it be to represent different parts or focuses of a Space Marine Chapter using different Chapter Tactics?
>>47267745
I find the Vanquisher fun and interesting. Something really speaks to me about the gun on it, though its probably not the most effective option.
>>47268011
Unless it's a mixed regiment like the Deathwatch, generally the chapter tactics represent the Tactics of the entire Chapter. Hence the name.
>>47267737
One of the few fan codexes that isn't wank
Ichor or chainflails on Talosi?
ID is nice, but surely rerolling to wound is nicer?
Haven't been keeping up with 40k for a while now (iirc I stopped before 5th edition came out).
So you can field any combination of factions now or is there a limit?
Isn't that a little broken?
How do all Aspect Warrior Eldar armies fare these days?
>>47268222
>"Hey little neighbour girl, how do I equip my Talos Pain Engines?"
I find this funnier than I should.
>>47267839
That FAQ is bad for orks but not in the way he thinks. You can cover grots with grots but ork boyz are too tall to get cover saves from grots now.
Comments/concerns from the other page:
> Looking over it, it looks like he just went silly with and buffed it up to absurd levels.
>nobs are I6 on the charge
>Warbosses are I8 on the charge
>everything has fleet and hatred
All this is EXACTLY how 3rd ed Orks were, and these aren't nearly as powerful. You must be using an old version; Nobz are I5, Bosses are I6, & even then, only on the charge.
Nothing has Hatred unless you buy the upgrade for 1 pt/model, & it's only available on Slugga Boyz. Fleet is exactly what Orks had in the last codex, but then someone decided that an assault army needed even more nerfing after nerfing assault for three game editions.
Additionally, WBs & Nobz have to be softer targets (not wear MegaArmor) & not use PKs to even take advantage of higher initiative.
Next:
>10 points for a S3 T4 model with 2 attacks , furious charge, fleet, additional charge distance, hatred with a 4+ save and I4 50% of the time
Additional charge distance? Fleet only means re-rolls of 1 or more dice on run & on charge, & unlike Wulfen & the CSM formation & the Start Collecting: Space Wolves formation, Run+Charge is once per gamenever mind that it used to be the army's whole schtick, and unique.
Considering making Boyz 7 points, since they're like they were in the last codex but have nades now.
But consider all their boosts & bonuses are totally conditional (except re-rolls to hit in the first round).
Orks vs. Marines should be a dead heat, not a foregone conclusion in favor of an army with BS4 & Rapid-fire AND assault from a Deep Strike AND better formations AND universal 3+ saves AND can't be Sweeping Advanced AND Drop Pods AND Objective Secured everywhere AND consistent I4/S4 AND Battle Brothers everywhere AND better psykers & psychic powers plus more of them AND Chapter Tactics.
Don't want to deal with I5 Nobz & choppy I4 Boyz? Don't get charged. Or, use your superior shooting in The Shooting Edition to shoot them until they die.
>>47268349
So youre the writer?
How the fuck did you justify to yourself a hatred(everything) upgrade for one point?
>>47268349
>Orks vs. Marines should be a dead heat
Marines need to be nerfed, all these suppliments and formations gave them too many toys for too few points.
>>47268304
It always fits oddly well
>>47268312
Wait what? What's the wording on this new FAQ?
I look at the top tournament lists and I can't help but think that although these lists are technically within the rules of the game, it doesn't really feel like the game was meant to be played this way.
>>47268349
Out of curiosity, how does the new stats work out crunch-wise on Ork boys against a marine squad?
>>47268294
Really well
Not Scatbikes well, not Wraithspam well, but you've got a counter for pretty much any situation, your troops are much better than any army's equivalent, and you're damn mobile for a mainly infantry force.
>>47265716
700? I mean it's pretty crazy but 700 seems a bit insane. You could get a Cobra or Scorpion for that pricetag.
What changes would fix Blood Angels?
>>47268456
This game isn't meant to be played competitively. If everyone actually created fluffy lists the game would be 50% better.
>>47268456
Nope. It really isn't. The game was designed with lots of infantry with a few larger models at a relatively low points count.
There was a time when two tactical squads, a captain, and a dreadnought was basically a full army.
>>47268456
This is the case with most non-competitive games that somehow end up being played competitively, anon.
>>47268449
You'd have to look through it for the exact wording as I'm on my phone but they basically said the 25% rule is for terrain only and if you can shoot over a unit it doesn't confer a cover save.
>>47268478
>your troops
By which I mean units, obviously, not as if Aspect Warriors are all troop choices.
>>47268493
Give them some of the new toys from the vanilla book. Let them get assault marine troops again. Have Furious Charge give +1 Initiative on the charge
>>47268493
Dreadnoughts 4A. Death Company Dreadnought 5A.
Scouts to BS4
Assault marines as troops.
Lamartes as an HQ
Death Company I5 and WS5 but BS3.
Vanguard Vets fix.
All in all through its an assault army in a shooting edition.
>>47268304
>>47268434
While oddly amusing, is there anyone who can answer my question?
>>47268493
Access to the same toys as regular space marines, updated stats for dreads and scouts and options to buy storm shields on more units aka sang guard.
>>47268528
They basically have the +1I on the charge with their "special" CAD.
>>47268493
Assault out of Deep Strike if you've got jump packs
Jump Packs for Dreads
Are Eldar OK as long as I stay away from Wraith units and bike spam? What I like about them is psychic fuckery and their vehicles, and a friend is offering to sell me a neat bunch of minis at a rather good price (farseer on bike, 10 dire avengers, 5 howling banshees with exarch, falcon, wave serpent and prism).
Would anyone find it cheesy if I decided to field a unit of 3 Fire Prisms? I love versatile things, fast tanks, and blasting shit from afar and Prisms fit all three.
People say assault sucks on paper. But they always forget the unknown variable of terrain. The more terrain, the better for an assault army.
I'm glad BA drop pods are exclusive to them now. I was pretty pissed that people were just using our book for taxi service.
>>47268417
Hatred clearly isn't that expensive of a special rule.
I mean, Black Templars could easily stick a Chaplain in a 20 man crusader squad, and then they're effectively paying 3 points per model for hatred AND fearless.
>>47268568
Fire Prisims are worse than Hammerheads and Hammerheads aren't cheesey.
Wraith blades are perfectly acceptable by the way.
>>47268553
>>47268575
>the more terrain the better
He says as my Tyranids go at I1 when charging through it.
>>47268575
>The more terrain, the better for an assault army.
Unless of course your enemy can ignore cover
>>47268222
ID is always better than simply re rolling to wound.
>>47268502
Any example of a good, fluffy, battle report / video?
I dunno if those MiniWarGaming videos count.
>>47268556
I don't think BA needs grav. The new fliers would be nice but BA's thing is choppy fast marines.
There's certainly an argument to be made that if you want a specific play style there's a marine variant for that.
If every marine book has the same stuff then there's really nothing distinguishing them.
I'm not willing to give up the few good things BA have in order to get things that SM have.
I sort of enjoy being the crappiest SM variant because it means only dedicated BA players want to stick it out and not just jump ship to the "more competitive" variants.
>>47268625
Better than not getting to charge at all because you were blown up from across the map
>>47268648
I'm not talking about cover, I'm talking about line of sight.
>>47268625
>WAAAAAAAAAAAAH THERE ISNT ENOUGH TERRAN MY NIDS GET SHOT UP
>WAAAAAAAAAAAH THERE IS TOO MUCH TERRAIN, I GOT AT I 1
nid players folks
>>47268601
what about wraithbladeswith fortune farseer and forceshields
>>47268667
Miniwargaming usually does fluffy/fun bat reps. More fun than fluffy. Everyone but Matt and Josh is pretty shit at the game and the rules though. Striking Scorpion is usually pretty damn fluffy but still good at the game.
Table Top Tactics is WAAC.
>>47268702
That's kind of the problem with nids tho. Damned if you do, damned if you don't. They're bad at shooting because they can't deal with armor/high T, they're bad at assaulting because assault army with no grenades.
>>47268615
Shut up Dorn you big tub of sassy sauce
>>47268700
Does it matter in the end.
>>47268702
>says the smug Marine player with assault grenades on every unit.
I think something that would help orks is making extreme gimmicyness a viable strat like having equal to or over 100 boyz gives them all +1 strength (troops only)
and having over or eaqual to 20 warblikers
allows normal shooting while going flat out
(f attack only)
having a gorkanaght and a morkanaught
gives both+2HP and each 50pts cheaper
things like this would be benifcial for DA ORKS
>>47268738
>he thinks i play marinesi like my marines spiky or 10,000 years in the past
>>47268701
>using line of sight blocking terrain.
Why don't you find a fucking unicorn while you're at it.
>>47266746
>Black Templars
>librarian
It seems like people just parrot what they've heard until some out of the box thinker comes along and shifts the paradigm.
Something everyone thinks is crappy suddenly becomes amazing.
>>47268729
There is no such sauce product
I want to play Orks. Should I just give up on winning and pick whatever I like?
>>47268417
Would a custom rule that only re-rolls To-Hit rolls of 1 be better?
Keep in mind, we live in a world where paying 550 points for Badrukk's Flash Gitz offers 3 VP when it dies, even if kill points aren't a part of the mission, and taking this formation lets each Flash Git re-roll a single shot--not Twin-linked, like common sense & ease of game-flow would dictate. Ork player has to roll each of 20 models separately for Master-crafted.
>>47267266
>tfw I've killed about two dozen crisis suits with my fearless 50 conscript blob
nah orks can be good but you have to be as good as mork (or gork) at stratergy
>>47268701
New LOS rules mean even a single toe makes you targettable. Hope you didn't put your dudes in "dynamic" poses.
>>47268425
>Marines need to be nerfed, all these suppliments and formations gave them too many toys for too few points.
+1
Except "too few points" is sometimes "for free", because fuck balance.
The fact that Decurion Necrons, Tau MC/GC spam and Eldar-anything is at the same level, doesn't change that they need to be hit with the nerf bat just as hard as the other 3.
People keep bitching about my Tau, because they are /tg/ faggots who buy into the whole TAUFAGGOTS OMG meme, missing entirely the fact that Tau has:
1. Powerful MCs and GCs.
2. Markerlights
And little else. The rest aren't "gaming breakingly good", it is "this is necessary to not be CSM tier"
Powerful guns? Sure, on a 50 point model with T4 2W and a 3+ save that will be auto-removed extremely easily - JSJ is their ONLY defense, and isn't even a Crisis Suit exclusive thing, just a regular Jet Pack infantry thing, not to mention that Marines (Of course) also gets a formation that lets gives all models in it shoot and run, except also on Jump Infantry, which makes them Jet Pack 2.0
>>47268477
If the Boyz get the charge, they'll win a good 75% of the time; they'll get shot to shit in the meantime, since Marines stay at full forces while they footslog.
If Marines shoot & charge, they usually wipe the squad in a turn or two with bolter fire & S4 I4 vs. S3 I2. Everyone also forgets Marines have 3 attacks on the charge since they all carry bolters, bolt pistols, & a CCW.
>>47268456
I have no idea what you're talking about.
>>47268860
Marines don't have a CCW base.
>>47268790
That's probably the best idea.
>>47268790
Yep.
>>47268860
Not all marines have CC weapons default. Just a bolter and pistol. Some tactics give them CC weapons, but they're at 2 on the charge by default.
So just i just got an army of a friend who was quitting and now have two armies to return to the hobby with,I still have my good old 3800 point chaos list,mostly marines,few of each cult trooper type ,large numbers of rhinos.
However i also now have 3 knights and lots a few mechanicus models,my friend says its around 2400 points.
My question is ,which one will do better for me,i haven't played in around 3 years ,so i haven't really kept with the meta.
>>47268850
The problem is /tg/ and everywhere are filled to the brim with marine players. Even if marines were the very top tier of armies, there would still be complaining about tau and eldar.
>>47268918
mechanicus by far
>>47267628
Nids can't eat you if everything's covered in phosphex.
>>47268850
Yep. Tau are good, but without their power units they're Mid tier. Probably a bit better than Sisters of Battle.
Marines are in the same boat, just that rather than a single model or unit they have a handful of strong weapons and formations.
>>47268222
Reroll to wound is kinda meh as a talos has S7 and there are not many things he does not wound on 2+ or 3+. But there are many T4;T5;T6 models with more than 1 wound.
Think about it.
>>47268881
Whichever SMs my meta uses most has a good mix of bolters & CCW/bolt pistols for maximum fuck-uppage.
>>47268417
Hatred only grants re-rolls to hit (no To-Wound) on the first round of combat. I'm also considering adding the caveat that a successful charge is required to trigger it, desu, but it didn't seem to break anything in any of my games or reported games so far.
>>47269065
Black Templars
>>47268659
>>47269009
Thanks
1 more question:
>1 VR bomber vs 2 stock Ravagers?
>>47268943
>>47268943
My local store is running a 1500 point list campaign later in the summer,i was thinking of signing up.Do any of the below units go well together then,im reading the codex right now but i want so advice.
I have 2 squads of k-destroyers,1 squad of rust stalker,1 squad of infiltrators,1 ironstrider,1 dunecrawler,2 squads of skitarii,a magos,a knight errant and two knight paladins.
What we as orks kinda need is some of the themed HQ's need to be charcter upgrades that give a buff like kaptin badruk gives +1 shot to any flash git but they can leave the squad and mabie instead of gazbag's blitzbike he should be an "upgrade charecter" as I am now coining this them but he could give +1 strength to dakkaguns this would be a game changer but EVRY ARMY COULD USE THIS IT WOULD HELP SO MUCH FOR THIS TO BUFF BAD ARMIES
>>47269098
1 Ravager is better than a voidraven. because the voidraven can come in late, has only 2 lances and no vector dancer so without the new DeathFromTheSky you have to move at least 18' with only 1 90°turn. Which means a lot of stuff will not be in your firing field for long. With the book you can try to roll against its agility for a second turn. The ravager is more firepower, but pretty fragile and if you jink you will snapfire (meh)
A Razorwing has the same problems as a voidraven, but you get slightly weaker lances, 4 free S6 large blast missiles (that can all be fired in one turn HUR HUR) and no bomb for less points. And a splinter cannon, if you are into that.
>>47269309
what about orks paying 140 pts for a base AV10 flyer I mean come on isn't that "a bit too OP"
>>47267100
www.mediafire.com%2Fdownload%2F1w7bwdw8l093jl7%2FDerps_from_the_Skiez.pdf
>>47266181
The helbrute is 100p, check the errata/faq
>>47269309
Interesting, most of my army is in reserve anyway (2 of which are Razorwings) and i'm just trying to figure out what to fill my currently empty HS slot with.
I mean the 2 stock Ravagers are nice with effectively 18 S5 AP2 shots, but i don't know
>>47266427
The autocannon on a drake is beyond awful. Want aa? You dont need it desu, but a hell blade is your friend there. Always go baleflamer drake. Idk how death from the skies now affect it though, admittedly
>>47265763
Bullshit. I give my captain two plasma pistols and he wrecks shit pretty well. I'm also planning on taking him with a command squad of all plasma rifles. The risk is outweighed by the reward and the awesome factor.
(looks round the corner) space mahren talkes to sister of battle "helo baby" ork come swag walking round corner SPHEES MAHREN IV'E BEEN LOOKIN FER YEW
>>47269427
>sister of battle
Who?
Female space marine?
>>47268222
I ran some calculations, and against T7+, Death company (or other fnp models) and big monsters, Injector is better (Don't forget it only IDs on 6s), while the flails are better against everything else.
>>47269436
Yes' Yes they are you sphees mahren
>>47267081
No, no they dont. You are 100% wrong.
>>47269437
Thanks a lot m8, will have to make the change to Ichor
Wonder if you can answer >>47269098 as well?
>>47269436
yes they are
>>47269423
Nobody's complaining about plasma gun, it's plasma pistols that suck. 15pts. for one shot is crap. 30 for 2. Combi-plasma gives you two shots with pistol range for 10pts. and you get to use it as a bolter as well.
>play orks in killteam thinking the smaller scale will do them better
>My first game was against tau
>>47269451
>>47269467
You mean the ones that never get updated?
Any reason not to give the howling banshee exarch a triskele?
>>47269472
Now points wise, I do agree. I find it worthily for the captain, but it would be nice to see plasma pistols brought down to 10 points. Hell, rifles are just as expensive, which really doesn't make sense now that I think about it...
>>47268285
Most tournaments limit the amount of sources. It can be broken with super death Star units like superfriends thunderwolves dark Angel WS librarius conclave units, but in most cases you need tax units for everything which evens it out a little.
So aside from rapid firing weapons and deep striking what can prevent me from charging?
>>47269531
On the captain you miss out on close combat weapons, though. And with 12" range guns...
Old IG plasma pistols were 10pts. and I remember way more people using them. Even I put plasma pistols on my plasma squad sergeants, because fuck it, balls to the walls. Not that they're 15pts. for a BS3 pistol on a 5+ save model...
Only model I'd use a plasma pistol on is a 30k Legion Moritat, since his Chain Fire rule lets you fire that thing as many times as you like, until you roll a 1 or a 2. I gave mine a plasma pistol, a bolt pistol and a volkite pistol with holsters all over his armour like a proper gunslinger.
>>47269569
Death
>>47268927
My meta is full of Necron, IG and Marine players, and really nothing else, after the Ork player decided to quit the hobby.
The IG player stomps me super hard, because unless I get some good deepstrikes in, he'll wipe out my squishy crisis suits pretty much instantly. By turn 3, we have the results of the game, and in most cases, it is with me on the losing end. IG apparently have a lot of options in terms of S8 AP3 blasts or better.
Marines... oh dear god.
Bikes, Grav, drop pods, and literally any formation, especially skyhammer. Or psyker heavy with their crazy psychic powers I cannot defend against, turn one assaults...
At least I enjoy my army, and field fully painted and based models. The local marine players don't paint their marines, so they are either based in white or black, or just grey. Chapter tactics are up in the air too, and can change from game to game quite easily.
>>47269569
Infiltrate and scout on turn 1, arriving from reserve in general, disembarking from a non-assault vehicle
>>47269472
Plasma pistols are good on a guy with precision shots and good melee.
Being able to take out a model pretty much guaranteed before assault even happens is very useful.
![latest[1].png](https://i.imgur.com/IrYrvQS.jpg "latest[1].png")
Does Death From The Sky Valkyrie dataslate replace the one from IA3E2 for the Elysian army lists ? Or do I use only the material included in their book unless a new FW book updates rules for their units ?
I've bought for an Anvil Strike force a Predator, A Whirlwind and a Vindicator, a Techmarine on Bike, a Dread in a Drop Pod and a Contemptor.
Where should I go from here? I was thinking of scaling to three of each tank for the squadron bonuses.
>>47269756
Counter-question: Why do Valkyries look so god damn sexy?
>>47269576
That's the thing; gunslinger and pistols allows me to fire both of them and count them both as Melee weapons for that extra attack. Power weapons would be nice. Now I wish we could have power-bayonet plasma pistols for 15 each.
>>47269774
More predators, just one is pretty puny.
A trio of vindicators is pretty brutal
>>47269808
Yeah, like I said I'm inclined to go for three triads of tanks for the squadron bonuses.
Mostly I'm wondering what else'd fit into the army and work well with it.
>>47269778
Those are Vultures.
>>47269848
Sniper scouts to pick heavy weapons out of a squad and hold objectives.
Librarian Conclave with Technomancy
Bought the Imperial Knight Renegade box set and I'm going to build them both as Gallants (with leftover bits from my old Warden). Can somebody convince me that this is retarded, because right now it seems like a fun idea. 650 point allied detachment ain't two bad for 2 superheavies...
>>47270111
Well, there is the small problem that you only get 1 fist in the set.
>>47270111
Magnetize them
>>47270111
Magnetize them. Don't think it's hard or not worth it because you'll regret it down the line.
Also it depends on what you play. For orks Gallants are quite useless, for chaos it depends on your list, for Imperium it varies even more.
>>47270138
>>47270148
>>47270151
I have an unbuilt chainsword and fist from the crusader I built last year. but yeah magnetizing seems like the smartest option...
>>47269783
+1 Attack at User Str. and zero AP isn't anything to write home about, especially when it's your HQ and a plethora of close combat options to choose from.
>>47267898
1. could be alright if you're not fighting cheesemasters
2. yes use the IF rules
3. Kantor begs the use of Sternguard and as a progression of that: Drop Pods.
>>47268866
I threw up in my mouth a little
>this looks less like an army and more like someone dug through a kid's toy box for the largest action figures
>>47269668
Honestly SM are perfectly fine if you don't run formations or spam bikes.
>>47265734
Make it so the Blasta only runs out of ammo on a double one for starters.
And shave off about 300-400 points from it's fully upgraded price like Forge World did with Buzz Gob's Stompa.
>>47270240
Or spam grav.
So the list becomes:
Space marines are fine if:
-They don't use bikes
-Don't use formations
-Don't use Grav
Hey, there goes 95% of all of the lists in my local area.
Tau are fixed if:
-They don't use Riptides
-They don't use Stormsurges
Tau don't have a lot of really good formations, and most of them are good because people abuse "RAW" WAAC faggotry.
>>47268866
Is that a void shield generator? What is it made from? A vengeance battery bottom with some sort of a top? Is the battery base that big?
>>47268866
I've never seen a more obvious display that shouts "I'm a faggot" before
Would not play.
>>47269892
I can't say I'm too sure about a Librarius Conclave, isn't that a fuck ton of points sunk just to try to buff units you coulda taken more of if you'd not sunk 4-500 points into space wizards?
>>47268866
>>47270275
The other "problem with Tau" that triggers a lot of people is that fighting Tau really only goes one of two ways:
>gunline
or
>JSJ
There isn't really that much "interaction" compared to fighting other armies since it's basically "roll, roll, alright pick up those dudes" and then hope you can shot the other guy better.
idk they're just so goddamn boring to fight...
>>47270371
The frree movement in the assault phase is what really grinds my gears.
>>47270371
I chose to collect Tau because of mechs, and the more I play the more I realise the army is incredibly stationary and just blasts everything from one side of the table
Kinda wish I'd played something else but the only other armies I was interested in are CSM *(lol) and Eldar (which I heard where maximum cheese)
>>47269486
Just put heavy armor on them.
Then you don't have to cry that hard.
>>47268882
>>47268898
Kay. Thanks!
>>47270340
It's 195 points minimum, 270 points for 3 ML2 psykers, but they'd be footslogging it like that.
>>47270340
Yeah but they Harmess on 2+
>>47268866
But why?
>>47270407
You dont understand his list was literally tailored to destroy 4+ armor saves, and he brought a broadside for penning 3 and below so he can instagib my nobs
Worse still ive got 250 points of footsloggers. I literally couldnt catch his suits if i wanted to
>>47270423
>>47270427
Would 3 ML1 on bikes joined to the Techmarine biker be a useful unit?
>>47270400
Just set all the objectives on one side of the table and pick the side that's empty.
Boom, moving tau.
>>47270509
I know that feel.
How I delt with the small game tau guy with nothing but suits, used a KFF. The saves help out, but the jet pack moves will keep killing you.
>>47270516
Not really, the FAQ nerfed Librarius Conclave pretty hard so they can only cast one power per mastery level.
Before that they could just cast as many powers as they had, manifesting them on a 2+.
>>47270516
Depends, how are you planing on using them/ what powers are you rolling on? If you're looking to pewpew witch fires and run away giggling, it's a waste. But rolling up those sweet buffs and then delivering a force weapon straight into some snowflake's ass is very useful
>>47270570
Not a clue mate, I hadn't even considered a Librarius Conclave until someone in this threat suggested it as an option.
Technomancy, probably given the entire rest of the army is currently AV.
>>47270509
>his list was literally tailored to destroy 4+ armor saves
That's about the reason I prefer Walker and Biker Orks.
Trying to get anywhere with Boyz, especially now that the Green Tide is gone, is almost an effort in futility.
Anyone have a link to this new FAQ?
Been under a rock.
>>47266746
>>47266844
>>47268767
It's called getting more hits when people search for specific terms.
>>47268799
>Conscript Blob
>Rending Power
>Azrael
Enjoy!
The other fun stuff is the getting the ML8 formation and bunging a Culexus in range to launch lots of stuff at.
>mfw Tactical CSM have been out of stock for 2 weeks now
W-we aren't getting squatted, right ?
>I'll never run a Librarian Dreadnought
>Get The Quickening
>Get Electroshield
>Get Warpmetal on another Librarian
>14/13/11 with 3++
Shame.
>>47270836
Nope. You guys have to suffer for the Iron Warriors and Word Bearers' sins for about maybe anywhere from a week to five years now.
>>47270814
warhammer 40k facebook page
>>47270836
Yes. Now commit sudoku.
They're squatting Orks as well. Every single army that has lost models has been squatted.
Even Tau, which lost the Forge World Barracuda and already has the new model leaked. They've been squatted too.
That's the kind of fucking logic that /40kg/ keeps making me come back for.
>>47270878
>still
>an extra week to five years
Fixed.
>>47270521
>>47270901
>Losing main Troop choice is the same thing as losing FW shit
>>47270836
It could also mean new molds.
>>47270936
Yes because they're squatting FUCKING ORKS AND CHAOS SPACE MARINES.
See, this is the shit that blows my mind.
You do realise that GW has removed ALL IT'S FAILCAST MODELS FROM SALE, RIGHT? Plus old as fuck models.
Are Orks and CSM's so fucking battered that they don't think ANY new units could be released for them? If that's the case, did hundreds of Ork players die when they released those great Flash Gitz?
