Where would you hide the one ring if you were unable to destroy it?
on my finger
>>47117698
I would go into the woods.
Shit on it, and put a rock on top of that shit pile on the ring.
>>47117698
Up my AAAAAAAAAAAAAASSSSSSSSSSSSSS
>>47117698
Inside another ring.
In my butthole, of course.
Launch it into deep space
>>47117698
in sauron's butt
>>47117789
You're probably hiding it because you're waiting for someone to come along with the means to destroy it. If you drop the one ring off into the deep ocean or space you just made Sauron that much harder to put down.
>>47117736
That's actually terrible idea, considering how frequently does OP's hiding space have... visitors.
>>47117817
That's a shit idea.
Leave it in tom's land
There's nowhere you could hide it that would be 100% safe, also the options are greater for modern day setting.
Middle-Earth: Take it to Valinor, leave it with one of the Valar.
Earth: Stick it in a safety deposit box in Switzerland.
>>47117765
>>47117774
>>47117817
Buttmind
Using only technology and magic available Free Peoples of Middle Earth in the Third Age, would it be possible to launch the ring into outer space?
>>47117841
well he have to dig it out of his own butt if he wants to wear it.
>>47117843
They go over that in the book. Tom Bombadil would either lose it or throw it away, because he doesn't give it any value beyond it being shiny. Not the best of ideas when dealing with the One Ring.
I'd put it on one of the great eagles claws. If the eagle goes mad and just starts flying around then Barad Dur will become akin to a lighthouse as Saurons eye just spins around and around and around and around
>>47117843
They literally talk about that during the council meeting and say it would be a shit idea
Tom would just forget about it in a drawer somewhere leaving middle earth fucked, or worse just lose it. Bombadil is literally so powerful this petty shit is below him.
>>47117896
Only if you petition the Valar to do it. They've already set Earendil and his ship to cross the sky each night, complete with Silmaril to light the way, so it would be easily possible for them. For anyone else it'd be impossible, however.
>>47117896
>>47117836
You'll also need to get it back when you have the means to destroy it otherwise Sauron wins.
In another volcano. Probably wouldn't kill it, but it would be prohibitively difficult to obtain even if figured out where it was
>>47117698
>>47117929
You're forgetting that the One Ring's ultimate goal in corrupting people is to get back to Sauron. So if it drove the Eagle mad, it would likely try to drive it in the direction of Mordor, then fall off its claw at the most opportune moment.
>>47117891
If a turd passes through it, will they be invisible?
>>47117698
Either the earth, sea, or sky.
Worked with the Silmarils.
>>47117965
The real houdini poop.
>>47117899
That wouldn't be the first asspull in the story. Not by far.
>>47117950
That's why Yavanna invented sticks.
>>47117698
Use ring to combat forces of Sauron, hire a suitable replacement to assasinate me at a time he deems I've compromised the securiry of the ring. He then uses the ring, but I've proactivley hired another man to kill and replace him after he has been corrupted enough. Ad naseum, eventually choose a bottom candidate to choose the next line.
Better than dumping it in the fucking ocean
>>47117940
What are the Giant Eagles up to?
I'd just give it to Tom Bombadil with a note tied to it reminding him not to give it away should he forget what it was a millennia or two from now.
>>47117933
What about a slingshot?
A slingshot forged by the dwarves and elves, held between two mountains?
>>47118122
They mind their own fucking business and try not to interfere with the affairs of men and elves. Consider them a third "nature" faction in Middle-Earth. They have their own agenda and shit to do.
This is why they help Gandalf but make sure to let him know that he has used up his favors and should not expect much more from them.
>>47118176
One does not simply slingshot the ring into space.
Besides, they haven't invented rubber yet.
>>47118098
Why does this seem like the sort of plan that ends with a dark lord ruling over all of middle earth?
>>47117698
In a different volcano. It might not be destroyed but good luck getting it out again shitlords.
>>47117736
I came here to post this.
Good man.
So...the Ring has a bit of Sauron's soul, right?
What happens if you fuck it? With sex magic?
Are you sodomizing Sauron?
Put it on an arrow.
Find a dragon.
>>47118122
>>47118191
They're the eyes of Manwë in Middle Earth, so they're a bit busy doing what he told them to do. One of the reasons they help Gandalf out is because he was the Maiar chosen by Manwë to help Middle Earth deal with Sauron.
They also fuck with the goblins of the Misty Mountains a lot too, when they get bored.
>>47118261
When you sodomize Sauron, he sodomizes right back.
>>47118222
volcanoes erupt eventually
put it with Morgoth
>>47118291
By then it will be buried in rocks somewhere and become someone elses problem.
Cock ring.
>>47118265
The dragon would be able to use the ring or at the very least would know what it is and know who it belongs to. This was one of the major reasons Gandalf pushed Thorin and his dwarves toward Smaug, because he feared an alliance between Smaug and Sauron.
>>47117698
>Unable to destroy it
Bullshit, I can ruin anything. Here, watch me do it to this thread.
Penis bone.
>>47118305
>master stretches out sauron's ring
>>47118376
nice try skeleton, there's no such thing as a penis bone
Off topic but here:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cc6yzxcv0Ps
Best thing in any of the books concerning Middle-earth.
>>47117698
Uranus.
>>47118361
Nice try, but everyone knows skeletons don't exist
>>47118221
Because it assumes you can outsmart corruption. That guy is the exact sort of person Sauron wants in possession of the ring.
>>47117698
Second page of google.
>>47117698
The Challenger Deep.
High Earth Orbit.
At the bottom of the Kola super deep borehole.
>>47118203
Speaking of slingshots ...
>>47117698
inside a needle, which is in an egg, which is in a duck, which is in a hare, which is in an iron chest (sometimes the chest is crystal and/or gold), which is buried under a green oak tree, which is on the island of Buyan in the ocean.
>>47119458
Koschei, pls.
>>47118284
>>47118261
Sauron went amongst the elves for a time as Annantar, "the giftbringer". He took on the fairest form he could, and brought joy to many of the elves.
But they were all deceived.
Trust me, if you fuck with Sauron he fucks you right back.
>>47117698
Give it to one of the elves that are leaving Middle Earth to give it to Aule to destroy.
>Hmmm, my apprentice Sauron made this? I will keep it as a memento.
Bad idea, very bad idea.
>>47117902
>>47117931
He didn't say give it to Tom, he said leave it in his land.
They DID say during the council that Tom's land would be the last to fall to Sauron, if it came to it.
>>47117698
A small town in North Dakota.
>>47117698
Simple. I give it back to Gollum and let him go back to his cave. Sauron's forces couldn't find Gollum for 500 fucking years, they only ever got him because he went out hunting for Bilbo. I give it back and we'll have at least another 500 years to make a plan to collect it from him again and destroy it.
>>47117896
Great idea jackass!
What then when it hits Kars?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i1YcJkYBAxQ
>>47118398
>nice try skeleton, there's no such thing as a penis bone
>>47117698
On my dick/through my dickflesh
>>47121331
you win this round skeleton
I'd keep it on me cause if I lost it it would be whilst being killed for it and if I was dead I wouldn't give a shit what happened afterwards
>>47121337
Jack Black, plz go.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Uztj3vp-RI
>>47117698
in a FATAL book.
>>47121315
Statistically highly unlikely. Assuming Middle Earth really is just an older version of our Earth, then they would have been launched from the same point in the universe at different times and possibly in different directions (assuming the Ring's launch point is not near the site that would become Kars' volcano).
I'd be more worried about the Ring falling into the hands of the Klingons or the Covenant.
>>47121230
>tfw you're actually from a small town in North Dakota
Did you have one in mind? Fryburg would work well.
>>47119067
Winner here
>>47121315
We bow down to the Aztek gods of Fitness.
>>47121380
>An invisibility ring
>A race of aliens with cloaking space ships
IT ALL MAKES SENSE NOW!
In the bottomless chasm that is your mom's snatch
Not even Smeagol could find the Precious in her.... Precious.
>>47121230
he would never even think to look
>>47119023
There is one right inside you, though.
>>47119235
That gif is older than most of the posters on this board.
>>47119235
My fucking sides
I'd put it on then go into my teleporter.
>>47117698
Inside a bag of holding then throw said bag into a portable hole.
Encase the ring in steel, then drop it in the fuckin' ocean in as deep a trench as you can find.
>>47122402
bad choice, king excellent will use the torso opener to get the ring out.
>>47125410
sauron steamrolls you under the orc hordes, and eventually invents sumbmarines
>>47117698
I'd go find Tom Bombadil. He'll know what to do.
Feed it to a great white shark
>>47124265
>asking for any of the numerous residents of the Astral Plane to find it
ISHYGDDT
Isn't there like a gate into the void of nothing somewhere? They threw Melkor into it and it took until the end of days for him to get back.
>>47117736
Beaten to the...uh...punch.
>>47121313
Problem is, the ring was trying to flee from Gollum at the moment it was found by Bilbo
>>47117884
They discussed taking the ring to the Valar in the book, and decided that they would be refused by them and those who dwell in Valinor.
Give it to a Dragon
Tolkien describe dragons as being so fucking greedy that they wouldn't even part with a single gold coin from their massive hoards. Coupled with the natural ability of The One Ring to tempt its owner, no force on earth could convince the dragon to part with the ring
>>47125900
but the ring's insatiable lust for power would have the dragon destroy fucking everything.
>>47117771
This actually gives me an idea.
How difficult is it to make something indestructible like the One Ring? Would it be possible to make a strongbox artifact that's indestructible (or can only be destroyed where it was created), and put the ring inside of it?
If all of that's possible, here's what you do
>make a forge out of bricks
>using this forge, make an "indestructible" lock-box in a similar way to how Sauron forged his ring
>lock the Ring inside
>disassemble the forge into its base bricks, and hide them all over the world.
>the lock-box can only be destroyed where it was created (the forge), and the forge can only be re-assembled by someone who knows where all the bricks are (I.E. not Sauron)
>when the time comes, re-assemble the forge, destroy the box, and take the Ring to Mordor
>???
>profit
>>47117931
>My nigga.
>Exactly what I was gonna say.
>>47126054
What do you mean "lust for power?" Doesn't the ring only tempt you with its own power, instead of convince you to seek more power?
>>47117698
Drop it in the hole where people poop.
>>47117698
Throw it into some molten lead. Take the ring-bearing lead ingot and put it in a lead box. Put the lead box into a stone coffin. Dump the coffin into the middle of the ocean.
>>47117931
It has nothing to do with Bombadil being powerful. Tolkien himself says that Bombadil wouldn't have survived if Sauron defeated the free peoples. He's just so weird and uninterested in power that the Ring has no effect over him.
>>47118261
>the Ring has a bit of Sauron's soul, right?
No, it's metaphysically impossible to split souls. It just has a lot of his power stored in it.
>>47121313
The problem is that Sauron was going to win through sheer military might even if he never got the Ring back. They needed to either destroy the Ring or use the Ring to defeat Sauron.
Just forge another indestructible ring in Mount Doom joined to the One Ring like a pair of chain links.
If it can't be worn, it's effectively useless, right?
>>47126253
the ring literally has the malice and kust for power that sauron has
>>47125900
>Give it to a Dragon
>Implying that wasn't Gandalf's original plan
>>47126353
it's implied that the ring is a direct link to Sauron, not sentient itself
>>47126253
Ring enhances your natural abilities and vices. Hobbits hide, so they become invisible. A dragon? Oh no, son. That's not good.
Don't do that.
>>47126353
Yes, but can it transfer this lust to power to its owner? Can it force its owner to seek more power themselves, and if so, why didn't it do that to Golum instead of just letting him just sit around in a cave for close to 500 years?
>>47126425
It made humans invisible also, apparently.
>>47126449
Invisible Smaug.
Nobody's safe.
>>47117698
>Suspend ring by a sturdy chain in the center of a three by three cubic vessel
>fill vessel with a molten iron/lead alloy, then let it harden and cut the chain (file it flush to the face of the cube)
>make sure Ring Cube is set at the way back end of some narrow pass, gulch, gorge, or canyon. Like really narrow, so narrow the cube itself barely fits.
Basic strategy is that I KNOW Sauron will have the manpower to ultimately grab it, but it's going to be costly as hell because they'll be easily ambushed, by lugging around a huge piece of lead/iron, trying to bore through it to reach the ring will take a long ass time, also during which they can be ambushed, and in an emergency, the whole gulch can be dropped on Sauron's forces.
Can't rely on people actively guarding it because they'll be corrupted. Can't just drop it in the ocean because that will probably start corrupting the seas. Can't just bury it off the bat since goblins tend to live underground or the off chance dwarves might find it and think it's a great resource.
But, hopefully, I think this might be capable of stalling Sauron for about a century or three, hopefully enough time for someone to find a way to permanently destroy it.
>>47125598
its more that when he gets back, its the end of days.
Hide it? I'd sail west and give it to the Valar like any sensible person. Alternatively just toss it into the ocean so Ulmo owns it.
>>47117698
If you can't destroy the ring, you might as well dig yourself a grave and go in with the ring before the orcs get you
>>47126634
>molten iron/lead alloy
I don't think that's metallurgically possible. Generally speaking, you can only alloy in molten form metals of reasonably similar densities; otherwise, they'll separate. Like, you could fill it with mixed powder and sinter it, but I don't think you could make any kind of alloy by just mixing them together in molten form.
Also, wouldn't that probably just be kind of soft and shitty, making it quite easy to cut through compared to other metals?
>>47126634
>dwarves find it
>immediately claim it as their rightful prospecting
>internally wrestle with the ring for control
>the crowning creation of Aule vs. the Precious of his old deciple
>either fall to it or some Durin blooded lord claims it through sheer obstinance
>the council of the wise try to reason with them to get it destroyed
>won't fucking work because now they've cowed durin's bane and are stealing eggs from the withered heath
>now knowing the lore behind the ring they claim it is their right to it above all the other people in middle earth, being derived from the realm of Aule
>the dwarves just keep getting more metal until somebody makes lava channels
>things progress exactly as you imagine when new khazad dum is besieged by the oliphants of harad
>>47126901
>reverse engineer ring lore
>make really heavily enchanted chainmail
>the ring bearing dwarflord also wears a coat of ten thousand mithril dwarven made rings to combat the influence of the one
What if - hear me out - Gandalf had just given the ring to Durin's Bane?
It's a temporary fix, but you get an instant civil war between the forces of darkness. Then you go rally the usual suspects and kick their teeth in at your convenience, chuck the ring into Mt. Doom, go home and make a few half-elves.
>>47126949
smaug getting the ring would have had a similar effect. I suppose its just deciding the flavor of dark lord you want, between sauron's hyper-lawful evil, a balrog's marauding neutral evil, and smaug's capricious and wanton chaotic evil.
I'd make a bet with Bombadil.
He gets the ring and if I or anyone else can find it, he's no longer allowed to sing or dance.
You will never see that fucking thing again.
>>47126999
Problem with Smaug is that the dragon would probably just sit on it and Sauron would conquer everything before addressing his dragon problem. I think the balrogs would be more pro-active.
>>47126945
>dies from blunt trauma
>>47126949
>>47126999
>US international policy
>>47127106
Can't argue with results.
>>47126100
Even better, take the bricks to Mordor, then destroy the box at the edge of Mount doom to decrease risk
>>47127127
With results being civil wars among brown people
Hide it in the Undying Lands. Let the Elves and the Valar deal with it; they seem to have a better grasp on this sort of thing than everyone else, anyway.
>>47126100
I don't think the One Ring could only be destroyed at Mount Doom because it was made there (not directly, at least). It was just the hottest fire around now that the great dragons of old were all dead.
So, you could melt anything in its fires
>>47127139
History would seem to indicate that those happen with or without prompting from outside parties.
Not to suggest that non-brown people have a better track record in that regard.
>>47127128
Not feasible; you'd need to decisively beat Sauron in a military engagement, which is unlikely to happen.
>>47127186
If the ring could really be destroyed by excessive yet mundane means (as opposed to DnD artifact means), couldn't you just crush it with a million tonne iron crusher, or something equally excessive?
>>47127220
>with a million tonne iron crusher
And where would you get one in the Third Age? All the really crazy stuff got left in the ages past
>>47118122
Eagles are easily corrupted.
>>47117698
You do realize destroying the ring is the one hope of middle earth right? Sauron was going to win without it. He only cared that it had been found because he didn't want it being used against him. S the best place would be Gandlaf's finger and then hope you can beat him once the ring is done twisting him.
>>47117712
Sauron plz
>>47126100
The ring is indestructible because it's part of Sauron's soul/essence I believe. So you'd need a Maiar to give up a piece of themselves and have the skill to forge something with it.
>>47127233
Aren't there still Valar/elves/wizards/divine beings kicking around? Keep in mind, we're talking about Sauron and the end of the world here. Either the ring is destroyed, or literally everyone dies.
Isn't Tom Bombadil basically God in his lands? Why couldn't he just create a bonfire or something as hot as mount doom, and just destroy it that way?
>>47127233
With at least one wizard, a bunch of elf lords, some angry dwarves, and something like two human countries on your side, with the fate of the world at stake?
I know it wouldn't be easy, but I think they could figure something out. Dropping a mountain a few feet can't be THAT hard if the alternative is either a thousand years of darkness or tossing it at a fat child and hoping for the best.
>>47127275
Gandalf's a Maia; he could make the box.
Fuck, he could probably still carry it around with him, and have boosted powers just like Sauron.
>>47126449
As already stated the ring enhances ones aspects. But it also does that to personality traits. And it twists them just as Melkor twisted Sauron. So somebody like say Gandalf would have his desire to protect middle earth be twisted into a desire to dominate it in order to protect it..
>>47127278
Sauron was a small fish back in the day, at least power-wise, if not influence. All the Valar and mega-elves are not around. All the wizards are either blocked from their real power or are Saruman
>>47127322
So then I guess that Gandalf just wouldn't carry the box around, and that way, he wouldn't be influenced by the ring.
That, or the box would just have to be designed to counter the influence of the ring.
>>47117929
Av^Av^
GO AROUND! GO AROUND! GO AROUND AND AROUND AND AROUND!
>>47126949
Minor problem: How do you get the ring back from a Balrog? Motherfucker solo'd Khazad-dûm, and was strong enough that Gandalf died to kill it.
Now give it the one ring, and see what the Vegas odds are for the rematch.
>>47117929
Weren't the Eagles basically children of the Valar to watch/guard the elves? Since the elves were leaving anyways, why would they bother to help the men etc vs Sauron? It's like saying Switzerland could've had knifed Germany at the opportune moment based on proximity; they simply had no reason to (bad analogy for historic reasons but it illustrates the point)
>>47127171
Would that actually work?
>>47127449
He got better. :-/
>>47127317
being saruman is the leading cause of unhelpfulness in one out of five wizards
>>47126804
damn, then probably just solid iron then.
>>47126901
dammit. dwarves. This is why I wanted it to be on the surface. Why do they thinkg a 3 cubic meter block of iron is rightfully theirs for prospecting when it's clearly refined iron and not an ore vein?
>>47127790
you left it out, they liked the prospect of taking it
>>47127728
And being Blue (da boo dee da boo dai) is the cause for about half of the rest
>>47117698
Throw it in another volcano so maybe when lava dried and produced new soil it would be stuck on it and fucking impossible to find. But since the ring has it's own will, it would probably manage to get digged up by dwarves or goblins. It would take a while though.
What happens if you just smuggle it onto the last boat taking the elves west?
>>47126634
Wouldn't they just melt the cube again to get the ring out?
>>47117698
Launch into space.
>>47117698
The ocean. Niggas can't dive 4 miles down.
>>47118398
>>47118376
A lot of species have penis bones, humans are actually weird for not having one.
>>47128434
you end up in numenor
>>47117698
Alright, I gotta four step process for this.
>STEP ONE
YOU PUT IT IN A BOX. But not just any box; a WOODEN box, and make sure it's an average-sized wooden box. I'm talking "5000 other wooden boxes look just like this" average. Now put a whole bunch of shit in that box, like hundreds of other rings. Royal rings, wedding rings, BFF rings, make it rain like the holocaust of rings in that box.
>STEP TWO
YOU PUT THE BOX... WITH OTHER BOXES. But not just any other boxes; WOODEN boxes. AVERAGE wooden boxes. I'm talking "5000 other wooden boxes look just like this" average. Now put a whole bunch of shit in THOSE boxes, like hundreds more rings. Royal rings, wedding rings, BFF rings, you're either gonna be committing a massive atrocity to get all these rings or paying a lot of smiths for seemingly useless rings.
>STEP THREE
PUT ALL THESE BOXES
>(Wait for it)
AT THE BOTTOM OF THE BIGGEST OCEAN. But not just any big ocean; THE biggest ocean. And make sure that ocean likes average-sized wooden boxes filled with hundreds of rings, maybe somewhere with a lot of sunken ships, there's probably a few average-sized wooden boxes filled with hundreds of rings in those sunken ships, they'll be doing half the work for you. Now you've got hundreds of average-sized wooden boxes, and I'm talking "5000 other wooden boxes look just like this" average, each filled with hundreds of rings, I'm talking royal rings, wedding rings, BFF rings, sitting at the bottom of THE biggest ocean, I'm talking THE biggest, and one of those rings is The One Ring. BUT WAIT, CAUSE THERE'S ONE MORE STEP.
>STEP FOUR
Crabs.
>>47117950
It's a funny joke, but doesn't that miss the point?
If the Ring is still out there, Sauron wins by default. He's still invincible unless the Ring is destroyed - If the Ring is just missing, he can still win through sheer force alone.
>>47117698
Up my asshole.
Keep it secret, keep it safe.
>>47117736
>>47117765
>>47117774
But that's the first place Sauron would look.
>>47128777
And anyone worth their salt looking for The One can sense where it is.
>>47127551
>Would that actually work?
It would keep Sauron from getting the Ring back, but the Valar and the elves that are there might not be too happy about having an evil artifact in their paradise. Also like other people have said itt, just keeping the Ring from Sauron isn't good enough since he'll win without it, the point is they have to destroy it to defeat him.
>>47128932
>the Valar and the elves there might not be too happy about having an evil artifact in their paradise
Who gives a fuck what the Valar or elves think!
For starters, the ring is harmless if left to its own devices in a secluded area, since Sauron will not be able to cross into the Undying Lands to retrieve it.
Secondly, as soon as we get the means to destroy the ring, we can just pop a visit to the Undying Lands and take the Ring to Mount Doom.
There are literally no downsides to this plan.
>>47128928
That may help them find The One Ring among the thousands of other rings, but will they be able to defeat... The crabs?
>>47128982
There are plenty of Noldor left in Valinor, the last thing we need is one of those assholes getting the ring. It'll be Muh Silmarils all over again.
>>47117698
What stops me from using the indestructible ring for building purposes?
Leave it in a drawer in Tom Bombadil's house with a note saying that I'll be back for it soon and to not throw it away. There, it's safe until we're ready.
Question: Was Smaug a "Great" Dragon or just a Dragon?
Another Question: Couldn't they just keep digging deep and toss the Ring info Middle Earth's Mantle?
If the ring wasn't a phylactery, why couldn't sauron be destroyed until it was destroyed?
>>47128827
No one seems to get this, for some reason.
Sauron was WINNING even without the Ring. Hiding it would have done nothing except ensure Middle Earth's slow but inevitable domination at the Enemy's hands. Sending the Ring straight into Mordor wasn't an easy choice, to be sure; but it was the only choice that carried any hope of victory.
>>47117698
Obv on OP's dick. Ain't nobody going to check there if he's starting a LOTR thread xD
>>47118163
That post was written by someone who never read LotR. He has power in HIS land and the main reason he was able to trivialize the ring is not because he holds power over it, but because it holds no power over him.
>>47117698
>Where would you hide the one ring if you were unable to destroy it?+ 0 post omitted.
Moria. DUH.
>>47119067
Shiiiiiiiit
>>47129120
Tom can't hold off the focus force of Mordor
Smaug is a Dragon by my reckon
>Dig deeper
lol there are things scarier than Balrogs in the deep dark of Middle-Earth
>>47117698
Give it to Creed's baneblade.
>yfw sauron never sees the baneblade behind a bush.
>>47129120
>Couldn't they just keep digging deep and toss the Ring info Middle Earth's Mantle?
They couldn't the same way we can't now and additionally for the reason it needed to get thrown into mount doom rather than a random other volcano
>>47129238
why? What's special about mount doom?
>>47129247
It's where it was forged
>>47129247
MAGIC!
>>47129261
What if you found a hotter fire? Like the lava under mount doom in the mantle?
>>47129264
What if you used magic to make a hotter/better fire?
>>47129277
Even if Gandalf could do this (and in the actual text of the book he doesn't even throw a single fireball, let alone make flames hotter than molten rock) then it still wouldn't work because as hot as it is, it's not the fire of mt. doom
>>47129277
Magic mate.
You cant science your way out of this with hotter magical fire.
It must be the fires of mount doom, otherwise it wouldn't work.
>>47129277
>hotter fire
"It has been said that dragon-fire could melt and consume the Rings of Power, but there is not now any dragon left on earth in which the old fire is hot enough; nor was there ever any dragon, not even Ancalagon the Black, who could have harmed the One Ring, the Ruling Ring, for that was made by Sauron himself."
There is no fire. ONLY the flames of Mt. Doom can destroy it
>>47129311
Okay, now it's starting to seem to me like sauron is a bit of a ponce.
He makes this !notphylactery ring, that totally behaves like a phylactery, and then he gives it a mind of its own so that it will always try to come back to him.
If he's truly totally indestructible and his military might is assured, he should have given the ring the will to get lost, and then just dumped it at the bottom of the ocean.
He would have won then.
>>47129329
I think he needs to be wearing it cause he got defeated last time cause it was cut off his body.
>>47129329
How was he supposed to know that halflings get extra San saves from mind controlling objects?
>>47119235
God damn that's old.
Wait, cant the ring only be sensed by Sauron when someone is wearing it?
>literally bury it in a hole
>>47129329
Except he needs it to restore his body.
>>47129370
>literally bury it in a hole
Sorry but >>47117736 beat you to it.
>>47129370
They did that (not on purpose). Gollum found it, then literally hid in another hole, where Bilbo found it.
>>47129373
why not wait to restore his body until after he has the world conquered?
>>47129389
Because he's only a fraction of his power without the ring. C'mon this is basic shit.
>>47129373
He already had his physical body back by the time of the LotR, it's only the film that portrayed him as a disembodied flaming eye. It would help him to have it and he does need to keep it out of the hands of his enemies, but it's not a phylactery.
>>47129389
Without ring = eventual hard won victory
With ring = STEAMROLL
>>47129393
But his conquest of the world is inevitable if they don't destroy the ring.
So his body is irrelevant.
Come on sauron, this is basic shit.
>>47129398
I read the books, but I must've passed over that detail. Still the fact remains that he is only a shadow of himself without the ring.
>>47129418
an invulnerable, unstoppable shadow of himself.
Where, if the ring is in play, he's vulnerable to destruction and can be stopped.
Invulnerable, Unstoppable>vunlerable stoppable.
Sauron should have dumped the ring in the ocean and told it it to never come back.
>>47129408
Sauron actually doesn't spend that many resources to find the ring. He sends the Nazgul but once the war starts they are tasked to other duties. Saruman put forth more effort to find the ring because he needed it to overthrow Sauron.
>>47129440
That wasn't the case at the time he made the Ring. He needed it to try and rule the world through deception. Then, when that didn't work, he needed it to try to defeat the Last Alliance. They managed to beat him even when he had the Ring because the free people were stronger back in the day. Then they looted the ring off of him.
By the time Frodo and the events of LotR roll around, the elves have mostly faded and Middle-earth is weak enough for him to win even without the ring, but he no longer had the opportunity to destroy it by then because it was in the Shire.
>>47129440
But how are you supposed to fuck all the bitches if you don't have a body?
>>47117736
When I saw this thread I immediately thought "in my ass". I'm glad I'm not the only one.
>>47129128
If the body's an anchor holding the soul in place, the ring served as a backup anchor. Sauron was massively weakened, but was unable to leave the world until the ring stopped keeping him there.
>>47129329
Because he's massively weakened without having it, and anyone powerful enough could usurp him using it. The risk of someone overthrowing him just wasn't worth it to Sauron.
>>47129466
>destroy it
Sorry, meant *hide it.
>>47117698
I'll give it to the emperor for safe keeping.
>>47129507
who in the time period the books are set in could overpower sauron while the ring is at the bottom of the ocean?
>>47129441
I think at that point finding the ring was a second priority for Sauron, since it seems that he had gathered enough forces to just steam-roll middle earth.
>>47129533
>Will to lost itself
>Immediately goes to the bottom of the ocean
Not the same thing. The ring does have a mind of its own, but it doesn't do any major moving on its own. So then you have Sauron running the risk of a Maia (or anything of comparable power) finding his ring, not to mention having to live out eternity as a shadow of his former self.
It's like saying 'you can rule the world if you have all of your limbs cut off'. Sure it's plenty arguable that ruling the world is worth it, but to a lot of people (including Sauron) it isn't.
>>47129548
Sauron had regained his body though. No limbs need be lost.
>>47129533
How in the time period of the books could Sauron get the ring to the bottom of the ocean? It's not a remote control toy car, it just sort of vaguely hampers anyone that's not him.
>>47129556
The point being it's a comparable loss for something as powerful as Sauron. Losing the ring also leaves him screwed if the big guys come knocking.
>>47129559
When he forged it, he should have just chained it to a rock and then dumped the rock over a boat.
Everyone in middle earth keeps getting weaker, he stays the same, he conquers it, and then later develops a submarine, retrieves his ring, and goes about being normal sauron.
>>47129572
>Cut off a massive chunk of ones' own power
>Throw it away
Doesn't matter if something's the 'best' option, some people still aren't gonna sacrifice a massive amount of themselves regardless of what they get out of it in the long run. 127 hours isn't the norm.
>>47129572
>When he forged it, he should have just chained it to a rock and then dumped the rock over a boat.
He doesn't necessarily stay the same, sometimes when he comes back he's weaker. When he came back after Numenor he lost his ability to shapeshift for example. Also when he initially made the Ring it was for a very specific purpose, he wanted to rule over the Elves. If he was just going to lay low for thousands of years to wait for the Elves to go away he didn't even need to bother with the Ring in the first place.
>>47129602
>>47129587
All I'm saying is that this is basic lich 101.
You don't build your notPhylactery with a semi sentience and a will to come home, especially if you're going to build your home a short walk away from the one thing in the world that can destroy your notPhylactery.
>>47129615
Liches don't lose anything for keeping their phylactery away from them, and don't gain anything for having it near them. Sauron has exactly one similar quality to a lich, doesn't make him one.
>>47129225
>Dig deeper
>lol there are things scarier than Balrogs in the deep dark of Middle-Earth
Did Tolkien ever elaborate on that? I love me some ancient evils lurking in the depths
>>47129615
Sure, but I'm saying that wasn't the purpose of the Ring. When he made it he needed it to dominate the other rings, then when that didn't work he needed it to try and fend off Elrond & Pals. When at last they managed to beat him, they took the ring from him. So by the time he had a reason to hide it somewhere, he no longer had the means.
>>47117698
>itt: everyone jacks off to how much smarter they are than Sauron, and forgets/ignores how storytelling works
Because having an invincible Villain Sue is so much more important than telling a compelling story with flawed and interesting characters.
>>47129666
satanic trips speaks the truth about evil
>>47129370
> Wait, cant the ring only be sensed by Sauron when someone is wearing it?
No, Sauron can't sense people wearing the Ring. Otherwise he would have found Gollum early on.
>>47129615
Sauron didn't have the willpower to willingly give up the Ring, either.
Besides, I don't think it's ever actually said that the One Ring is what's keeping Sauron alive. It's entirely possible it's just his innate Maiar power and if you kill him enough times he'll stop coming back.
>>47129685
I'm pretty sure they said something to the effect of 'as long as the ring exists, the evil of Sauron can never be purged from the world'
>>47129666
Tolkien had two (among many) jobs as an author that are relevant here. 1: he needed to create a rich world with a set of rules for that world that allowed him to present interesting characters.
2. He needed to present those rules to the reader.
By all accounts, he failed both times:
Other novels present worlds with villains that have flawed plans, but don't require the villain to be holding a villain ball like Sauron did. Tolkien couldn't do that though.
Other novels don't require an entire supplementary novel to understand the dozens of apparent inconsistencies and plot holes in the first (why didn't the eagles do it?).
Now, I enjoy tolkien, but his approach to novel writing was flawed, if interesting. Rowling did a better job in some respects than tolkien. Compare voldemort to sauron:
Voldemort only holds the villain ball a few times, but does the logical things with his phylacteries: he hides them. His flaw is that he created them in the first place, not the plan he had for them. All the rules related to him are explained within the story being told.
>>47117736
Do the Ringwraiths do Anal Probing?
>>47129719
Sauron wasn't holding a villain ball. He simply had the same issue literally every other bearer of The Ring did; he couldn't let it go. Voldemort is an interesting example, but a moot one since he was exactly the same with or without his phylacteries on here. Going by the train of thought in this thread, Voldemort was massively holding the villain ball for not making every horcrux some random teacup and putting it on a shelf with all the others.
>>47129730
Do you people even read the Appendices before you post this stuff? Of course they do, that's why Sauron made them.
>>47129741
IIRC, he had a good bit of variety, with the innocuous black diary, and throwing the circlet in the room of requirement.
>>47129765
Yeah, but every object had some big personal connection to him that worked against him. By the same metric that everyone in here is saying the Sauron should have dumped the ring in the ocean, Voldemort should have made all the horcruxes something completely unrelated to him personally in any way. I mean, what sort of idiot lets himself get attached to the key of all his power?
>>47129788
that's a good point. Both had villain ball moments.
>>47129719
I've always viewed Tolkien's work less under the view of a regular author and more in the worldbuilding sense, hence all the required reading.
Additionally, I find it interesting that /tg/ expects complete competence from their villains. I've always held that a high level of logical rationality and competence is not what makes a typical villain, but instead it is a certain emotional temperament.
>>47129741
Voldemort wouldn't actually be able to do that though. Like most good villains, he had a number of psychological hang-ups that made him possible to defeat. His need to make the horcruxes objects of importance to him. Remember, he was putting part of his soul in there, he clearly felt that they needed to be important.
>>47129765
The diary was very important to him, as it was a record of his time at Hogwarts, if I recall. As for the room of requirement, he A: was arrogant enough to believe that only he knew about the place and B: as he was the only person to know about it, the place was important to him, being one of the reasons he felt special.
>>47129788
Again, psychological hang-ups. A villain isn't interesting if they're entirely pragmatic, because that's not how people usually work and not how an engaging story is crafted. He was murdering people and cutting bits of his soul out, he's not gonna put them in tin cans or empty potion bottles.
>>47129798
TLDR: Villain Ball is not a bad trope, and a staple of literature for a reason. Because it makes sense.
>>47129798
Neither of them were 'villain ball moments'. Both characters had human qualities that served as their weakness, nothing more. The 'villain ball' is idiocy for the sake of idiocy to make the villain beatable, not just characters having sensible weaknesses. Voldemort wanted to be special after everything that happened to him (hence the whole 7 horcruxes thing and him using the founder's items) and Sauron was affected by the magic he wove into his own ring, wanting it back no matter what the cost.
>>47129832
>Voldemort, psychological hangups
Point of my post was that I was following the train of thought in the thread. People can't say that Voldemort is better because he made mistakes just as Sauron did. Note the sarcasm in the last sentence of the second to last post you linked, and the way I went out of my way to clarify 'by the logic in this thread...'
>>47129293
He kinda throws fireballs and lightning bolts in the Hobbit.
>>47129719
>>47129572
>>47129440
The movies are inaccurate on what Sauron's form is without the ring. He is not a "literal" flaming eye on top of a tower, but a disembodied spirit that can only communicate through the Ringwraiths and palantirs. Tolkien also says that Sauron had one weakness, he was too arrogant and considered the mortal races too stupid to hatch a plan like that of Gandalf. In fact he didn't think he was going to lose in the first place when Isildur cut of his hand, but even with that eventuality he put his will and purpose into the ring so that it would have come back to him. Secondly, while Sauron did have some knowledge of the Ring being wielded by a Hobbit, he didn't know at all about the fellowship, or the plan to throw it into Mount Doom. The very idea of a Hobbit doing this task was inconceivable to him, and many others of course except beyond wise characters like Gandalf and Galadriel.
People also forget how hard doing what Frodo did was, renouncing the corrupting power of the ring and to destroy it. Yet, even Frodo at the last moment failed, and it was destroyed through Golum's intervention.
>>47129942
>he was too arrogant and considered the mortal races too stupid to hatch a plan like that of Gandalf
To be fair that's pretty accurate, if it wasn't for Gandalf the world would have been fucked.
>>47129853
>'by the logic in this thread...'
You never said that though.
>>47129398
>>47129418
It's a bit unclear.
Gandalf mentions that "his shadow has taken shape again".
Meaning that he either has a body tió cast said shadow, or that he is some ghost thing with a somewhat defined form.
>>47129719
Haha lolwut
Everything Sauron did was completely in-keeping with his personality, his goals, and the rules of the One Ring, as set out at the Council of Elrond and in previous chapters. Did you even read the books properly?
And lol at the eagles being a plot-hole. They're explicitly brought up and dismissed as an option at the Council of Elrond. They weren't just ignored and forgotten until the final battle. The characters considered the possibility, then rejected it and moved on. I don't see the problem here.
>>47129989
Okay, what I actually said was 'Going by the train of thought in this thread' and 'By the same metric that everyone in here is saying...'
That close enough for you?
>>47129401
Don't forget:
Without ring because Good Guys got it before I did = AAAAH NO I'M SORRY GALADRIEL I'M SORRY AAAAAAAAAAAA
>>47130001
It's not unclear at all, Sauron could not have gained his body OR his powers without the ring, he was completely powerless. I mean he could travel as a spirit, like the way he traveled to Gol Guldur, but he was easily driven off by the White Council.
>>47130005
Fair enough, couldn't figure out which post you were talking about. I centered in on the voldemort part and thus didn't notice the sarcasm. I agree with your sentiment.
>>47129942
that's wrong though. he did have a physical form at the time of the war of the ring, if not long before that. as gollum was taken to him when he was captured and saw sauron with only nine fingers.
>>47129533
If a more grand alliance, not just of the elves and the remaining men of the west, but of the dwarves in a more active combat role and including the entirely absent men of the east could have been built, the orcs could have been military defeated and the can kicked once more down the road. Perhaps trying to organize the east was were the blue wizards were up to?
>>47130027
>Sauron could not have gained his body OR his powers without the ring, he was completely powerless
Citation?
Because he's growing more powerful throughout the books.
Making a body for himself doesn't seem that dificult compared to blotting out the sun.
>>47129834
>The 'villain ball' is idiocy for the sake of idiocy to make the villain beatable
Actually, I'd say that the Villain Ball is idiocy on the part of the villain, in a way that wasn't highlighted and established beforehand. It's okay for a villain to make errors, so long as it was made clear earlier in the story that they're prone to making such errors.
>>47130027
He wasn't completely powerless at all, his will was holding his army together and when he fell they scattered. It's not 100% clear either way but the smart money is on him having physical form again, based on what Tolkien says in his notes:
>It was because of this pre-occupation with the Children of God that the spirits so often took the form and likeness of the Children, especially after their appearance. It was thus that Sauron appeared in this shape. [...] It was then destructible like other physical organisms. But that of course did not destroy the spirit, nor dismiss it from the world to which it was bound until the end. After the battle with Gil-galad and Elendil [at the end of the War of the Last Alliance, when Sauron lost the One Ring], Sauron took a long while to re-build, longer than he had done after the Downfall of Númenor (I suppose because each building-up used up some of the inherent energy of the spirit, which might be called the 'will' or the effective link between the indestructible mind and being and the realization of its imagination).
>>47130036
This Far-Haradrim here gets it.
"Black Hand with four fingers", sounds pretty corporeal to me.
>>47130064
Exactly, idiocy just there because it's there, with no rhyme or reason to it, not just a villain being (maybe not the best term for Sauron but heyo) human.
>>47129691
I've heard fans say this on many occasions, but I honestly can't remember it ever showing up in Tolkien's writings. It might be a case like "beam me up, Scotty" where people think something is said that never actually occurs. Maybe they're mixing up "if the Ring is destroyed, Sauron will be defeated" with "if the Ring is not destroyed, Sauron can't be defeated".
>>47129719
What exactly is the "villain ball" in Sauron's plan? Even assuming the Ring does work as a phylactery and keeps Sauron alive, which I'm not sure of, there are still several reasons not to throw it in the ocean.
1. The Ring was extraordinarily useful. Even if it did function as a phylactery, that was never its primary purpose. It's not an obviously stupid decision to hold onto your tool for dominating others' minds and wills just in case someone manages to steal it and use it against you. People choose to take a slight risk of death in return for a much greater chance of personal power all the time.
2. Sauron could not have willingly given up the Ring. It affected him just as much as everyone else.
3. Most people wouldn't even know what the Ring was if they got their hands on it. The elves were secretive about the Rings of Power, and it's not like Sauron was going around telling people.
4. Between the time Sauron made the Ring and the time it was taken from him, there was probably no one in Middle-earth who could have mastered it and used it against Sauron. Even an elf-lord like Galadriel or Gil-galad had a slim chance at best of mastering the Ring. And there weren't any other known Maiar around who could have challenged him for it: the Wizards and Balrog didn't show up until much later.
5. There was definitely no one in Middle-earth who could have willingly destroyed the Ring.
>>47129942
>>47130027
This isn't true either. Sauron didn't need the Ring to have a physical form. He is stated to have a physical form during the time of LotR.
>>47130036
>>47130055
If you want to get into the gist of it, Tolkiens metaphysics specify that all beings that enter Eä, the material universe posses Fëa (body) and hröa (spirit). The Ainur are beings of pure hröa that could not be destroyed, although their physical form could. Since Sauron splintered himself and put all of his will and power into the one ring, the only thing that kept him on Eä was the existence of the ring.
The way one understands existence in the world of Tolkien is entirely through this dualistic cosmology. For example Gandalf who was an Ainur died, but came back because Eru recognised his altruistic sacrifice, that was in line with the Music of the Ainur, whereas Sauron could not do the same since he privileged material being, above spiritual purity.
See Morgoths Ring.
>>47130134
again, that's wrong. he didn't put all his will and power into the ring. as even after the ring was destroyed, sauron remained in middle earth. unable to be a physical threat, but was said to be the voice of malice that pushed people to do evil things.
>S the best place would be Gandlaf's finger and then hope you can beat him once the ring is done twisting him.
There would be no more hope if Gandalf were to be corrupted by the ring.
>>47130134
If you've read Morgoth's Ring, you should know that fea is the spirit and hroa is the body. And also that no one's spirit can be destroyed, whether they're a powerful Maia or a bog-standard human. Also, Tolkien suggested at one point (in the essay Osanwe-kenta) that Sauron died during his fight with Huan and Luthien (well before the Ring was made), so evidently he didn't think it was necessary for Sauron to have something like the One Ring to come back.
