>GM game for around five months
>One of the players asks me what the mechanics for character advancement are every time he wants to improve a skill
>Explain it to him
>Last session
>He asks me again at the end of the session
>I tell him to look it up in the book, provide pages, and tell him to figure out what he wants to do by the start of the next session
>Tonight's session
>Player asks at the start how to improve his skills
>Ask him why he hasn't read the core book of a game we've played for almost six months
>He literally just straight-up says he doesn't care enough to read the book, he just wants to play the game
Okay, I guess.
Just tell him he can't improve his character unless he learns how the rules for it work because he's slowing down the game.
>>46849324
Step 1 in improving his character's skills is reading the rulebook
>>46849324
Just give him the wrong information that makes his advancement worse than it should be. That's what I do to my players these days. I mean for fucks sake, you've been your rogue for a year now, how do you not know how your sneak attack works yet.
>>46849324
Just stop answering him.
If he won't put in the effort to learn, don't put in the effort to teach.
>>46849324
>Hey, foreverDM, we're bored of DnD, do you know any other systems?
>Why don't we try this old one I like, DragonQuest.
>Oh, it looks cool
>Thanks for sending us all a PDF of the rules.
>Wait, why aren't there any CRs? How are we supposed to figure out how much XP you get for killing monsters?
>You don't get XP for fighting in this game, you get it for certain indicators of progress in missions that you get, it's objective based gameplay here.
Cue in at least once a session someone asking how much XP something is worth if they fight it, and being surprised, and usually angry, when I remind them that you don't get XP for combat in this game.
>Well why should we fight things then?
You shouldn't, if you can get to your goals without fighting. That's why you fucking wanted to move away from DnD in the first place you daft retards.
Just kick him out of the game.
He can't be assed to even even read a few pages out of a book, how much effort does he thinks a competent DM puts into the game?
>>46849324
Yeah, sounds like a real chucklehead. I'm on my phone and I've never greentexted before, so I'll just say I've had players ask similar things. I've provided links to relevant pages, and I've been told to summarize the information. I told him he was lucky I even linked him to the damn page. I had to read to learn the system to DM you. If you can't be assed to read enough to build a character, you can get fucked. He then read the whole page and many more and built a character with only a few errors. I congratulated him, and he said he felt accomplished. He was still a terrible roleplayer and I eventually left when the influx of demands from noobs grew too great, but telling players to put in effort is something every GM should feel comfortable doing. You're there to have fun just as much as they are.
>>46849733
Players seldom know what they actually want, and it's so frustrating. I had a fellow player teleport us past a majority of the obstacles to our goal, then complain that the adventure felt short and anticlimactic. YOU CHOSE TO SKIP ALL THE CHALLENGES!
>>46849324
>Get invited to Pathfinder game last Summer
>Never played it or DnD
>Experienced GM, and other newbies too
>Look up Class/Race I want to play
>Look up sample builds and feats.
>Print out the class page, put it into my notebook
>Read up on how actions/combat works
>Roll character in less than 5 minutes everyone else in like 20
>Levels up happen I'm ready after a couple minutes and everyone else is still going threw books
>Eventually everyone picks up on what I'm doing or get fast at this shit
A player that can't even figure out how to level up after a few levels or look up his class is probably not interested in playing. They are probably there just for the company or stupid.
In 20 years of gaming ive sat down and played with hundreds of people. About a third bother to learn the rules and setting info relevant to their character.
One in 20 bothers to read the entire book.
>>46849834
To be fair, that's kinda the completely reasonable thing to do for a person in that situation with that kind of power, if I'm hearing it right. They might be hoping for challenges that are not so easy to bypass.
>>46851172
Well, it was a premade AP, and her character was made by her boyfriend and she didn't even know her spells, so I don't think more challenge would have been good. It's just that the easiest solution (usually magic) is seldom the most satisfying. Players feel clever for a bit, but complain that they didn't get to do much.
>>46851059
I have a much smaller sample size but this sounds about right.
Also you'll have to find as decent a balance between tardos and bazingas as you can if you ever want a full party because decent players are really hard to come by. Don't hold onto shit players, they're completely expendable.
>one player is absolute worst player I've ever met. Blatant power gamer, uncreative, doesn't ever shut the fuck up doesn't work as part of a group well
>can't kick them because ill lose more than half the group if they leave
Fuck I'm pissed. Everyone else are really solid players.
>>46851059
i've gmed GURPS for the last 29 years, and, lets say that my local community looks a looks different from this. Even my neighbors grandson read the entire basic set, i don't really know his age but he studies with my younger daughter, so i'd say 13. I can't believe shit is that harsh out there, dude, 1/3, thats fucking ridiculous.
>>46853057
If he's ruining the group and game as a whole then surely whatever happens after he leaves won't be any worse?
>my players usually put no more effort into their characters than "lawful good human fighter"
>ask them to start writing backstories for their characters so I can tie them to the campaign
>they seem to enjoy it and a few even write short stories about their characters
>start incorporating factions, groups, and characters from what they've written
>blank stares as they don't recognize the names of characters and places THEY CAME UP WITH
God damn.
>>46857605
>tfw I wish I had a GM who would do this
>there are people who have one and can't appreciate that
>>46857605
How the fuck can any group of people be this slack jawed and incompetent
>>46857605
>GM asks players for backstory
>I spend a couple of hours fleshing out a neat character
>End up writing 14 pages
>Don't want to be That Guy, so I make a bulleted list of important info
>Mention this to the GM, apologise for the lengthy bio and just walk him through the six-point bulleted list
>He tells me I have autism and should stop making such complex characters
>The other players have backgrounds of about three sentences or less, and they're all just walking memes
Which one of us has autism? I can't tell.
>>46861972
You were excessive, but the others were just retarded.
>>46861972
14 pages would raise one hell of a red flag if I was the DM.
>>46861972
Oh god I know that feel. I try to keep it short and let it grow in game, so by several sessions later it is very fleshed out and the table gets to all hear the story that is mostly made up on the spot.
I am the only person who has any backstory beyond one sentence and it could still only fill one page at most.
>>46861972
You aren't an autist, but you still overdid it.
The other guys are just shit eaters.
>>46849324
>Second Time GMing SR
>Players asks in he can initiate a chargen
>Look at initiation in the book
>Doesn't say anything about not allowing it
>Say yes, it costs a shitton of karma anyway so it's okay.
>Comes up with an initiate grade 8 character.
>Never played with initiation before so i accepted him
>Magic 8 Phys adept proceeds to be stupidly powerful against normal mooks i threw in for a test.
>Decide to up my game
>Throw him two vamps
>Doesn't manage to hit any of them, barely escapes with his life
>Rest of the encounters are a struggle between making it easy cheap or absolutely overkill.
>He's too entrenched in the current plot to kill him off, and i felt kind of a dick about trying to kill him.
>Other players complain.
> Player leaves off eventually due to the game turning into a clusterfuck by my attempts to challenge both him and his not-so-optimized team.
>Later find out initiation is not allowed in chargen.
At least the rest of the group decided to stick with me despite my fuckups.
>>46862187
>>46862213
>>46862238
>>46862234
I know long backstories can be a problem, but it was mostly fluff and snippets of history. I try not to write long stories, but I was just so inspired I couldn't help myself. We've all been there.
>>46861972
>>Don't want to be That Guy, so I make a bulleted list of important info
Good call.
>>Mention this to the GM, apologise for the lengthy bio and just walk him through the six-point bulleted list
Why?
>>46862708
I think your approach was fine, tbqh senpai.
Seriously, you ended up having fun writing a short story with the idea for your character; nothing wrong with that. What *would* have been wrong would be to plop it in front of the GM and chimp out when he didn't include every little thing about your family's legend in the game, but you didn't do that. Instead, you had the insight to look at it and go "yeah I got carried away, this is more than I need for a backstory" and you took the salient, character-defining bits and put them in a short list, and said "okay GM here's my backstory, and the long-form version I ended up writing for fun".
Sounds like your GM is one of the tabletop players who is secretly embarassed to roleplay, even with friends in a basement.
>>46862761
He saw the stack of paper and immediately started lamenting.
>>46861972
The answer is you're autistic and all your friends are retarded.
>>46857605
I'd love to play with you.
>>46863126
Thanks famalam
>Playing Call of Cthulhu derivitive (players may be lurking) on Roll20
>Spend 3+ hours prepping for every 2 hours we play
>Asking for complete input from players to make sure the game is enjoyable
>They say they are really enjoying themselves but I have to tell them not to play vidya during the sessions
>Normally missing at least one player from 6 player group
>New official module, making sure this is polished
>Entire maps cropped from the PDF's and uploaded
>Statblocks set for common enemies
>Message everyone 30m beforehand to remind 'em when it is
>10 minutes to
>One person messages saying he can't make it
>Other 5 don't reply
>Two are sitting in my teamspeak playing vidya seperately
>Instantly remember why I hate GMing with this group
Now I'm stuck in a position with not enough effort to GM.
I just ran my first session of pathfinder and the player said they liked it but...
There's one player who can actually roll play and takes initiative but the rest just sort of don't do anything.
I have to constantly say things like "ok its all you guys you control the scene" and the one guy doesn't want to hog the glory so he waits for someone else to talk creating an awkward silence over the skype call.
How can i get my players to actually you know fucking role play in a roll playing game.
>mfw no one makes a sound for 30 seconds
>>46862421
I'd find this story more interesting if I knew what chargen and initiation were. SR is Shadowrun, right?
>>46863470
Look up improv techniques.
Get everyone to count to 10 (/b/ style) without saying any other words. Any overlap and someone has to start at 1 again.
Little exercises like this help people get into sync with each other.
>>46863387
Daily reminder that a tabletop game only works if both the GM and players actually want to play. If they find video games more entertaining than playing an rpg one night a week with friends then they probably shouldnt be playing at all.
>>46863523
Yep.
Chargen is character generation.
Initiation is basically a way to get stronger magic wise. The street samurai gets better guns and cybernetics, the decker gets a better cyberdeck, programs and 1337 skillz, and the mage/adepts initiates. Basically, it increases your maximum magic rating and gives you some very powerful abilities
>>46863533
Idk man i dont think i have the leadership skill ot lead someone through that. I just want them to participate in the game they said they wanted to play.
>>46863664
Basically it's supposed to be something the players work for, and not something they have right off the bat, which is what broke the game?
>>46863730
Yeah, but the part that talks about initiation did not say anything about being restricted in chargen. But because it is not in the option in the first chapter of the book talking about how you can spend the SR equivalent of starting experience, you can't take it as starters.
>Put all my world's lore on a private forum for my group
>One reads it and prints out stuff for himself, his character comes off as an actual inhabitant of the world because he knows his history/religions/cultures
>Second guy reads it sparingly and knows the big stuff, his character comes across as a fish out of water sometimes, but it's never too bad
>Third guy doesn't read it at all and his character ends up holding stuff up because he doesn't understand the setting
Why does there always have to be that third guy? The first two are fine, but fuck, every game I've ever hosted there's always someone exactly like that third guy.
>>46863955
...I'm going to run a campaign for three people and I think this is going to happen. I know what each person will be.
>>46864025
Don't let it discourage you too much. Getting annoyed at shit like that is par for the course when running a campaign. You learn to enjoy the little moments the first two type of guy'll give you way more than you dread the bullshit the third guy brings.
>back when BigBang was first broadcast in our country, I think it was '09/'10
>friends watch the show
>sooner or later tabletops come up in the show
>XD RPG SO NERDY LETS PLAY SOME
>OH Anon used to play those back in hs didnt he
>they're usually decent people so I figure why not
>use some ruleslight d6 system and do a one-off dungeon crawl with them
>they like it
>"isnt this a little bit lacking ? We thought we get rules books and have stories and real interactions"
>I jump with joy
>in the end we settle down on PF, it was a newish system back then so I wanted to get into it myself
>they love the crunch
>they love the crawl
>when it comes to rping they stare at me like a deer into headlights
>they all pretty much lack the imagination to rp in any meaningful way
>arent there rules for RPing ? or rp classes ? RP skills ?
>well there's skill checks I guess ?!?!
>they now start rolling skill checks for everything
>I want to seduce the barmaid
>how do you do it
>I dunno I just want to see if I can
>rolls
>oh I could, so she tells me some information about the bandits right ?
>end up playing for over a year with me pretty much just rolling on random encounter tables or thinking up basic clichee plots
>they still all suck at RPing and think that rp = skill check
>they have fun
>I have some fun too
>usually we cook some dinner together or drink a bit
I had fun, but mostly because we were all friends. In the end it was a boring crawl and uninteresting crawl, like as a DM usually you're swamped with preperations but that year the most I made sure, is to bring pens and dices with me.
We havent played in years, some are kinda interested about 5e as they somehow heard about it.
Not sure if I want to start hosting crawls again.
>>46851059
My 12 years tends to agree with your twenty.
>>46863470
>Has someone that actually roleplays
My players make bags of stats to roll dice against bags of loot. I'm not entirely sure why they tabletop sometimes.
>Players walk into a cave entrance that is brightly lit from the sun outside.
>Rogue wants to hide and sneak in
>In full sunlight
>In front of two guards they know are hidden and watching from somewhere
>"Not gonna happen"
>"I don't even get to roll for it?"
This shit needs to stop.
>>46864231
Jesus Christ, has it been 13 years? And yeah, that's dead on.
>>46864127
Basically, I've crafted a huge world for these three to dick around in. There will be enough quest hooks/long term goals that they won't get bored unless they try. I've told them enough about the world that they should be able to do pretty well as they learn the little things. But that third guy has played things like 'loli summoner' and 'sticks-to-snakes skeleton' and now wants to play a really ugly fat guy in armor who wants to be famous.
>please don't fuck this up man
>>46863585
Yeah, and now I've stopped they're whining all the time for me to start again. I don't know what their deal is.
I'm the difficult player in the game I'm in right now.
Ask me anything!
>>46853057
Roy?
>>46865012
How did it came about ?
Like I had one game where I was the "problem" guy, because the rest of the party decided to be retarded, everyone had so week and unoptimized chars, that unless I was just jerking off during combat, I was stealing the show, which made everyone hate me.
>>46865076
An acquaintance of mine was starting up a campaign for a couple of friends. I asked if I could join, as I haven't had a table since high school.
Which is part of the issue. I feel like I'm stuck in the game - since if I left, the game would likely collapse, and since these people are a lot of my social group, I worry about the repercussions.
>group wants me to run a JoJo game
>none of them have read the manga
>all their character concepts are OC DONUT STEEL versions of the cast of part 3 and the characters from 4 that have appeared in the anime so far
>I just know they're going to want to change characters to whoever was in the latest episode that week whenever someone new is introduced
>>46865965
Good DMs don't run memes.
And generally running anything in an established IP is dangerous, because the characters will either get it, or they'll get it to a fault. Usually both at once.
>playing game where the players sit in a single base and go attack stuff when they want to
>want to remind players that a certain villain still exists
>"aha, he can ambush the supply lines that get food into their base, fantastic!"
>villain is built to be hard to fight but should be manage-able for four people to fight, so I decide to not have the party fight him until the new player gets introduced
>week that he starts
>shit comes up so he can't play
>i make up shit to delay, slice of life stuff
>next week
>he drops a hammer on his hand and breaks it
>i make up shit to delay, more slice of life stuff
>next week
>he tears a muscle in his leg, but can still come
>i'm relieved that he's alright as well as because he can still make it
>another player takes the week off for family business
>and next week the party is venturing off into the wilderness to go find something
I'm not the kind of GM that *needs* things to go a specific way but god fucking damn if luck hasn't fucked me over for a month straight now
>>46849324
>"I don't care enough to read the book, I just want to play the game"
>"Sorry, you'll have to find a different group to play with then."
And another That Guy problem solved by growing a fucking spine.
>>46851059
I don't read the whole book, but after awhile of tinkering and what-ifing I tend to know the rules better than most. It shouldn't be that hard to learn basic shit that's actually relevant to your current character.
>>46864324
>Bard wants to try diplomacy
>Against the people that don't like him
>"Not gonna happen"
>"I don't even get to roll for it?"
This shit needs to stop
>>46864324
>this literally happens in my game
>BUT I LITERALLY HAVE HIDE IN PLAIN SIGHT AS A CLASS SKILL YOU FUCK
>THAT IS EXACTLY WHAT IT ALLOWS ME TO DO ARGH
>>46869473
>>46865012
Let them roll with huge penalties or against high DCs.
>>46870391
>Tell the player it doesn't work
>"Why not let me roll?!"
>Let the player roll, the DC is literally impossible to hit
>If they roll well they still complain
>If they roll a 20 they get super salty that they can't do it anyways for the 5% auto jump to the moon may-may
>>46870481
>I have the hiding in plain sight feat that I worked my entire character concept and build around.
>Nope, doesn't work since now all the guards have +50 to spot checks and find you.
Wow you're a shit GM.
>>46869473
This particular example is stupid and does not equate to the situation the other guy presented. A more appropriate one would be "I try diplomacy against people whose family I just killed". Unless you have some specific power that allows you to do it (>>46869511), yeah, you're not even getting a roll.
On a related note, fuck uncalled checks in general
>I roll to persuade the kind to make us nobles and give us estates lol xD
>rolls 19
>smug grin
>that should do it, right?
>looks at me with a mixture of smug superiority and tentative expectation
Fuck you
>>46870655
So you're saying skill checks are idiotic and should never be used at all and it's better for player characters to have no non-combat utility whatsoever?
>>46849834
Being a good dm is hard. Unless you have really understanding and layed back friends, it takes immense effort to provide an enjoyable experience. The biggest key to being a dm, is knowing what the players want without asking them, because they don't know.
>>46859819
It's hard to find a dm that cares. Because once good players realize who they are dealing with, they never let go.
>>46861972
14 pages is overdone, but, i personally prefer overdone than underdone
>>46870686
If real people could have been represented by numerical skills, your "Reading Comprehension" would've been in negatives.
I am not saying skill checks are idiotic. I am saying that people should not rush ahead and roll them without a prompt from a GM unless the need for the check is unquestionable (e.g. rolling attack in combat).
Opposed checks and checks in general are a valuable instrument with a fail state - they should only be used where there are actually meaningful, real possibilities of success and failure. Literally throwing dice at everything you see with or without need or prompt is idiotic.
>>46870481
Grow a backbone.
>>46870686
Congratulations you just made one of the biggest strawmen I've seen in 4chan
If you were joking I would probably chuckle
>>46870920
I think he was. No one is that stupid
>>46870841
Best way to solve this, from my experience, is by being specific in advance.
I loathe reading through a 20 page "OC do not steal" drivel and even if someone presents something enjoyable over 2-3 pages, frankly, I doubt I will be able to make a lot of use of it in a short run.
I always ask my players to give me:
- Three sentences that describe their character in general
- Three beliefs that they hold
- Three goals that they have OR three things that they would enjoy doing
The rest is built as we go along; I have a separate file for recording backstory stuff they come up with during game.
I also use a similar structure for a player selection questionnaire - except I ask to write all of the above without referring to the character's race or class
>>46870547
No, you're a shit player who thinks he's playing a videogame.
>>46870734
I find that half the time, you can DM the kind of game you want, and if you understand the system well enough, they'll enjoy that thoroughly.
I ran a dystopian intrigue magocracy DnD game and all of my friends were super skeptic. At the end of the campaign they told me how awesome it was and how they felt their decisions really impacted the world and how one of them even had trouble sleeping for awhile because the weight of the decision got to them so deeply. They got really really involved and it was a great campaign.
They all were really concerned it'd be crap when I said "This is what I'm running."
>>46866277
>>he drops a hammer on his hand and breaks it
>>he tears a muscle in his leg, but can still come
dude, what does he do for life? security on a maniac carpentry?
>>46863470
Next time something like that happens, pick a player at random (except the guy who's actually been doing shit) and say "<CHARACTER NAME>, what are you doing?" Chances are they'll make something up if you put them on the spot like that.
>>46871003
i use this for my players.
>>46871110
I am not trying to start shit here, not at all.
But don't you think this is a little bit excessive?
And by a little bit I mean a fucking lot.
>>46871110
If you gave me that, I'd politely thank you for your time, then leave. I'm writing a first level character that I don't know precisely how I'm going to play or how it fits into the world, not filling out a dating profile. A *lot* of that is marginal at best.
>>46871003 Has the right of it. Aside from a light physical description, I'd probably also workshop with them on a few accomplishments and setbacks in their near past or something.
>>46871248
>I'd probably also workshop with them on a few accomplishments and setbacks in their near past or something
That's actually sounds interesting. I really like the 3x3 structure I outline above but asking them about actual achievements/failures might be nice twist.
The only problem I can see is that some players will, as usual, skewer the power curve and have their level 3 characters be retired generals, dragon slayers etc. But I guess they would've done it anyway.
>>46871110
>>46871003
This.
>>46871289
That's why you workshop with them, to keep things in check.
If they're low-level characters, there's a good chance they've never actually, say, killed a man. But they might have gotten a bit lucky in a minor heist, or killed a Rodent of Unusual Size that had cornered their sister in the barn.
>>46871401
>try a session 0/workshop session once
>tell it to my players in advance
>3 out of 5 send me character sheets/backstories
>reiterate that we will be having a session 0
>manage to survive until it
>we start
>"huh, anon? what do you mean we don't get to go into the dungeon and start our adventure tonight?"
>act slightly bored and borderline offended throughout the entire evening
>>46871110
>11 pages without any of the backstory even written down
>>46871017
Gods forbid that someone with the class skill "Hide in plain sight" attempt to actually hide in plain sight. Next you're going to say you can't do sneak attack damage to a flat-footed opponent because he's already facing you.
>>46872048
>Starting at 10th leveI,you can spend 1 minute creating camouflage for yourself. Voumust have access to fresh mud, dirt. plants. soot. and other naturally occurring materiaIs with which to create your camouflage. Once you are camouflaged in this way,you can try to hide by pressing yourself up against a solid surface, such as a tree or wall, that is at least as tall and wide as you are. Vougain a +10 bonus to Dexterity (Stealth) checks as long as you remain there without moving or taking actions. Once you move or take an action or a reaction, you must camouflage yourself again to gain this benefit.
Read it. READ IT FAGGOT. READ THE ENTIRE THING NOT JUST THE FUCKING NAME YOU MEMEING SHITHEAD. And then compare it to the scenario the original guy described. And kill yourself.Faggot
>>46871248
>>46871211
>>46871331
>>46871850
Short points
>we are a very old group
>I'm 52 at this point, i've been playing with the same dudes for a long time
>my wife and my grandson play with me and my 3 fucking old friends and one of my younger daugther friends.
>almost nothing i'm doing should be done by small random groups.
-
i not GMing a dungeoncraw right now, i'm >>46854930 We are playing on the same setting for some years, so at this time most characters have literally 100+ (ingame)years of family background. This has been a grand campaing for the last few years, its basicaly about a dinasty at this point, so, dudes, really, after this many years we use a long guideline when writing new pc's, i'm not your random gm forming a random group at college, it's a specific point and what i do should't be used as good example for anyone who isn't in the same circunstances.
>>46872155
Fair enough. Should have mentioned it though - because obviously what is normal for your group is not adequate for any GM who is trying to filter new players.
>>46872155also i've just felt sharing that pdfno need for this much reactiong
>>46872139
Why don't you calm your fucking tits, kid? I have read what hide in plain sight says. My question is where the fuck did you get that shit you just posted? Because that sounds like Camouflage you just described, not Hide in plain sight.
>Hide in Plain Sight (Su): (Su): At 8th level, an assassin can use the Hide skill even while being observed. As long as he is within 10 feet of some sort of shadow, an assassin can hide himself from view in the open without having anything to actually hide behind.
Even in the lit entrance of a cave, if he is within 10 ft of where that light ends (and the shadow begins), then that would be a perfectly acceptable scenario to attempt it.
or, PF version;
>Benefit: A rogue with this talent can select a single terrain from the ranger’s favored terrain list. She is a master at hiding in that terrain, and while within that terrain, she can use the Stealth skill to hide, even while being observed.
Could easily take caves/caverns as type type of terrain. How about YOU learn to fucking read, you raging mongloid?
>>46869473
>>46864324
I'd let you both roll. With a DC of 40 (5e).
And no, a nat20 does not equal automatic success.
>>46872316
This is 5e Hide in Plain Sight, rogue ability.
>Pathfinder
Oh I see. I am sorry for speaking rough with you, my little retard. Go play in your shitpile in peace.
>>46872377
I gave you both 3.5 and pathfinder, plus the original guy never even specified what edition he was using. But go ahead, keeping raging like an autistic child on a temper tantrum over you're fucking edition wars bullshit and lack of reading comprehension. I just feel sorry for you. You're probably going to die of a heart attack or stroke of a damned game of all things, and everyone will laugh at how pathetic your death is.
Keep crying, bitch-baby.
>>46872448
*your fucking edition wars
*over a damn game
ducking auto correct
>ForeverGM
>Running a long DH campaign
>It's wonderful and everything I could hope for
>Have amazing, thoughtful, cooperative friends to play with
>Part guardsman comes up to me after the game
>Waits until the others leave
>Blurts out he's had feelings for me for a long while
>He knows I won't reciprocate and can't stand it
>States he has to leave and have distance from me
>Feel like shit
>People start texting me saying they don't want to play without their friend or in a small group
>By the end of the day the entire group disbands
>Left with one friend who loved his character and the campaign
>Try to start it up again with new players
>It never works out
>We drift apart
>Lose 5 friends in under 2 weeks
>Just want to set the house on fire, sedate myself and crawl into bed
>One player messages me
>Feelings swell as I hesitantly read it
>"I left my hat on top of your book case. Can you drop it at the FLGS for me to pick up?"
Oh...ok.
>>46872556
Was the guardsman player cute?
>>46872556
Sounds like they weren't real friends.
But yeah, homosexuality should be punishable by death.
>>46872662
Pic related. It's you.
>>46872770
Definitely not, I would never have such poor trigger discipline.
>>46849324
>>46853057
Do it.
I was in this exact same position. Trust me, the longer you keep toxic players in your game, the more you will suffer. If you have to lose some good players because they're loyal to this one, CUT YOUR TIES AND GO.
Don't surround yourself with shitty players.
>>46871003
This is a good plan, and fits with how I tend to create my characters as I go anyway. Sometimes I don't think of an aspect of a backstory until I come to a point where I need to decide how my character would react to a certain thing; other times, something that I had made up in the beginning gets dropped as time goes on, so there's little point in keeping it.
The real focus should be less on backstory and more on the events of the campaign.
>>46872155
Go away, Doug.
>>46872155
I respect that.
>>46872337
This.
This is what you do.
>>46873111
>I make up my backstory on the fly to justify what I want to do in a particular situation
>When something in my backstory becomes an inconvenience for me or what I want to do, I get rid of it.
So you're "That Guy" who's backstory and motivations never stay consistent beyond what works for you in the moment.
>I want to mercilessly slaughter these helpless orc children
>"What? why would you do that?"
>uh... my parents were killed by orcs, so I have an extreme hate for them
>"ok..."
>later
>I want to set these helpless goblin children on fire and laugh at their screams of agony as they burn
>"What? Why would you do that?"
>uh... my parents were killed by goblins, so I have an extreme hate for them
>"I thought your parents were killed by orcs?"
>I changed my mind.
>>46872789
As an aspiring DM, I read through and grasped the gist of 5E's mechanics in afternoon [except for the garage fire that is enounter building].
But as a player, my DM pulled out the Pathfinder phonebook, and my eyes glazed over.
Third editions riot of ununified mechanics should have died with the advent of Steam and Youtube. Who has time to internalize all that shit nowadays?
>>46873506
>riot of ununified mechanics
>3e
What bollocks. You want ununified mechanics, look at any D&D pre-2000.
>>46872316
>Pathfinder
>>46873506
how is encounter building complicated?
>>46873299
No, no, it's not like that at all.
Sometimes I'm not actually going to think about a particular aspect of a backstory until a situation comes up. Then, I have to explain to myself why my character made that specific choice. It's bad if I do it every time a situation comes up, or if I do it so I can get an outcome I want, but I use that initial situation to develop my underdeveloped backstory and stick with that choice - if I had to make that decision again, even with different prizes or outcomes, I'd make the same choice.
And sometimes, an aspect of my backstory will get dropped, and I know that sounds bad. But an example I can think of is how initially, a character I once made was rather depressed. But as I began to develop a different backstory, he was less sad about his place in life, and more content in feeling that he had a meaningful, if underappreciated, role in the workings of the universe. So I went from a backstory element that wasn't very developed initially - a character that was sad - to one that was much more developed and more rigid, giving my character both a stronger sense of place and purpose, and limiting them more in some ways while also allowing more freedoms. They could interact with other characters function more as a party face, for example, but now they would question their actions and if they were 'right' for their overall purpose in life, and would try to resolve things peacefully before bringing out the sword. At one point this lead to a failed attempt at diplomacy with a fire elemental, since if it didn't ping as evil then we shouldn't kill it, right?
>>46849324
>GMing last night
>The players are all on their phones when it's not their turn or they're not in combat
>One's playing a game on his, another is showing a fellow player the "hilarious" thing he's looking at
Why the fuck am I putting all this effort into something no one's interested in?
>>46873672
I make sure I have the phone number of everyone I game with, both so I can contact them when I need to, and so I can send "Stop texting" texts to them when they're on their phones in the middle of the game.
>>46873575
>badwrongfun
>Stop liking what I don't like!
Didn't even say I played pathfinder, shit stain. lrn2reading comprehension, fucking retard.
>>46873661
Ok, when you put it like that then it doesn't sound bad. Sorry for jumping the gun on the assumptions. I just know for a fact that there are people out there exactly as what I had described lol.
Good on you, anon, 5/5 would game with.
>>46873562
That's my point.
70s, 80s, and 90s ultra-nerds they were compelled to deep-read and internalize the marginalia of whatever system they were playing, because that was the only thing available that would scratch that itch in their brain. In this era of skinner-box video games, and access to every conceivable canon of culture, how many people want so sit down and make an easily accessible part of their knowledge the specifics of, say, grappling rules.
>>46873575
>that filemaneAlberto Barbosa
>>46873575
>HURR DURR MUH EDITION WARS
>ERRY1 HAS TO LIEK WUT I LIEK AND HATE WUT I HAET OR U IS AUTISMO RETARDO
grow the fuck up, kid.
>>46873610
As a giant qualifier, I haven't run it myself.
But the rules state that the encounter building system is balanced for, what was it? Six encounters a day? I'm *really* hesitant to try to fit that math into, say, a five-room dungeon design.
Also, the colloquial evidence that I've heard is that characters played by people that don't need help dressing themselves in the morning will run roughshod over "level-appropriate" encounters. If you've experienced things differently, by all means, correct me.
>>46871481
Did you tell them what a session 0 is?
>>46873829
It's totally fine - without any real explanation behind it, it does sound really bad. And it's good to be able to question if what I do is right or not and be forced to explain myself further.
http://www.escapistmagazine.com/articles/view/tabletop/checkfortraps/8386-All-About-Alignment
>>46873506
>Who has time to internalize all that shit nowadays?
People with three-digit IQs.
>>46862821
>no rule states you can't wear two.
You know, except for the rule that states bonuses of the same name don't stack. Enjoy the +1 shield bonus to AC and the -2 to attack, that part stacks.
>>46874761
On my nightstand, I have The Man Who Was Thursday, with Consider Phlebas sitting under it. In my Amazon Video queue I have the fourth season of both Veep and The Wire that I need to watch, not to mention the list of movies I've been collating from The Dissolve (R.I.P.) and the parts of the A.V. Club that aren't wretched. In my Steam Library I have Around the World in 80 Days and the new Samorost game that I've been meaning to get around to.
And I guess I have that hardcover phonebook from that old, fiddly, broke-ass system that my so-so DM insists on using.
I wonder how I'm going to spend my limited time as an adult?
>>46874921
I know that there's a lot of shit on everyone's plate, and things you may never get around to doing as a consequence, but surely stuff that's necessary for a social hobby is at least worth glancing through?
Videos and videogames could really wait for years. And once you have a basic mastery of a ruleset, regular play will keep you practiced in it, so you'll have more time for the other things you want to do.
>>46874952
I really do appreciate your earnest reply to my flippancy.
I just have a hard time reconciling myself with the esoterica of this hobgoblin of a system in the service of a table that's frustrated me more than anything.
Which is part of the reason I've been working towards getting my own game off the ground. I want to at least try to show people how a game can *sing* with a little more responsiveness and a less obfuscating ruleset. Or I'll be humbled in the attempt, which is just as valid a lesson.
>>46874921
Is it the RPG system? I love reading these. Maid RPG manual was such a fun read, the rules are so whack.
The other things sound boring as hell.
>>46874921
>hardcover phonebook
What game are you playing that has a phonebook of a ruleset? The expanded 2e PHB is almost exactly the same length as the 5e one.
>>46875179
You sound like an absolute tosser here.
>>46875179
Is your master trying to get you to play in Rolemaster?Do we even have a meme name for Rolemaster on this board?
>friend is playing a jedi in a sci-fi homebrew
>party has choice whether or not to kill a morally grey bounty hunter who's been chasing them because he thought they were evil
>everyone else wants hunter to live, so he gets away
>jedi is disappointed he didn't kill the hunter
>very short time later have jedi meet with his mentor figure
>mentor questions jedi over incident, asks if he wanted the hunter dead
>jedi doesn't remember even though the entire reason that conversation was happening was to provide a chance for character growth because he did
I love these guys but sometimes I fucking swear. Doesn't help that it's my first time DM'ing so I'm playing it by ear a little.
>>46875273
>Do we even have a meme name for Rolemaster on this board?
People would have to actually play RM for us to have a meme for it.
>>46875240
It's 2:45 here and I'm drunk. I get verbose and sentimental.
>>46875205
Pathfinder, bra. I know half of the Basic Bulebook is sketchy GM advice, but it's still an imposing thing of badly indexed exceptions and double-columbed sub-headings.
>>46875314
>double-columbed sub-headings.
Is this better or worse than being formatted entirely in three columns?
>>46875306
I read some of the books for Rolemaster, even tried some characters, but I seriously wondered as I did so: "Who would even want to play this unfunny shit where losing an arm is only an unlucky roll away, and you need three different spells from three different spell lists to reattach one? And that is, if it's even a setting with magic"
I think they really shot too much for hyperrealism in that system, made everything a chore.
>>46875364
The only Rolemaster I've done was messing about with making a character in Cyberspace, which is based on RM2. That wasn't too great.
>>46875328
I'd refuse to play any game that has a rulebook formatted in three columns, on principle.
Single-column, digest-sized rulebooks 4life.
>>46875314
I know that feel, a bit. Same time over here, but I tend to get withdrawn, more morose. Probably because I'm not drunk.
>>46875375
I really liked the creative critical hits tables. With this like "The arrow pierces the target ear to ear. Hearing impaired, and target dead." or "The target turns into an ice statue. Perfectly preserved, but... a bit dead." I think some of these are supposed to change stuff for resurrection spells, since a resurrected character in the first case would still be deaf. Or something.
>>46875273
>>46875306
my group plays rolemaster, and much more dudes do it too, there is even a auto resolution program where you imput your dice rolls and see what u got.
>>46853057
Good players who will leave if you kick a bad player are not actually good players.
Kick him, if they leave its their own fault for being idiots.
>>46875377
The early 2e rulebooks were three columns across. The '95 revision switched it to two.
>>46874921
Apparently not by playing tabletop games.
>>46864382
A mere nine for me.
And yet, still dead-on.
>>46863387
I'll play with you senpai.
>>46875364
>Who would even want to play this unfunny shit where losing an arm is only an unlucky roll away, and you need three different spells from three different spell lists to reattach one? And that is, if it's even a setting with magic
me
share pdf. now.
>>46872316
>Picking the worst ways to get Hide In Plain Sight in pathfinder
>Not one level dip in Shadow Dancer
>Hide in Plain Sight (Su): A shadowdancer can use the Stealth skill even while being observed. As long as she is within 10 feet of an area of dim light, a shadowdancer can hide herself from view in the open without anything to actually hide behind. She cannot, however, hide in her own shadow.
So there is no grass, no trees, no hills, nothing that casts a shadow anywhere near this cave? Holy shit it must be a barren flat desert world.
>>46876455
You want Song of Swords for that shit, not Rolemaster.
>>46872448
>3.5 & pathfinder
>Arguably the most broken d20 systems
>>46878155
>d20 modern
>run a toolbox hodgepodge system, tell players not to use the weapons and armour from one book but the gear (with approval) and cybernetics from it are okay
>they take weapons and armour from that book anyway
Fuck's sake
>>46863533
>Slam hand on the table, gesture at everyone in turn, then myself. And nod.
>They nod
>Fuck yes
"1."
"2."
"3."
"Nigger."
>MFW
>>46878374
that's as /b/ style as counting gets
>>46866138
I tell this story again.
The only IP game I ran was a MLP game for my sister and her friends, and they had to deal with a literal loan shark and a zebra who was poisoning the groundwater and selling antidotes for a "disease that was going around".
Best game I ever ran because they got into it and really appreciated me running it for them.
>>46862421
>diamond dogs
It still hurts that in the game of shadowrun I am in, my attempts to go legit and create a mercenary outfit which, because we all listen to too much Bowie and play too much Metal Gear Solid, was called Diamond Dogs was shattered when the other two characters decided to hit another mercenary outfit three times in the same vehicle in a one month period and it was painfully obvious since how many vintage Cadillac are rolling around Naples.
Next attempt I will have to name it Military Sans Frontieres
>>46872556
Classic rookie mistake. A good experienced DM sacrifices his boypussy so the show can go on.
>>46865965
Just have them fight King Crimson and have them figure out why the last 2 turns keep disappearing
One motherfucker I know used to singlehandedly prod me for games, even solos, because he desperately wants to get into a campaign or GM for me. He was always desperate and highly motivated at the pitch. Multiple times I was a schmuck who let myself get talked into that shit, I figure I need to GM to learn not to suck, so I put my effort out, my homebrew ideas, my character concepts, and my labor to this chucklefuck, I try to be a friend, and what does he do?
*Nothing.* He was the worst flaker I ever had, the laziest son of a bitch who gets whiny about systems I like despite me sucking up this utterly sterile piece of shit Star Wars microsystem and taking it like a champ, asks for bland as fuck changes, and fails to even work with the fucking stuff I hand him on a platter. There was no cross-communication, it was my ideas overwhelming his.
I even had a colonial campaign based on a baby I was nursing for years. I slaved over that shit for weeks trying to 1) make sure his character was relevant to my story down to his occupation - fucker wanted to be a craftsman, so I offered woodworking and leatherworking but he decides to be an artisan shoemaker or some bullshit, and 2) get him to write a paragraph on his work.
We do 3 sessions and prep for that solo. I prod him like a motherfucker for that paragraph of backstory, defined as 3-5 sentences which he NEVER completes. Motherfucking NEVER started putting his character down so I could run him a fucking solo, where it's fucking critical that the player cooperate with the GM to keep a good pace instead of the dreaded 30 seconds of silence. NO effort on his part was made to ensure he had something to fucking do, even when I caved in on 'a waifu.'
>>46879235
Cont.
So when the game starts, he's full of debts and a nice shiny workshop he got loaned, but he doesn't do shit, he doesn't comment on anything, doesn't do all that much.
He's inducted (because he didn't say no and existed) into the night watch with the son of the tavern owner who was launching exposition, lore, and plot to get the motherfucker interested in SOMETHING. But gets weirded out by 'all the politics' the kid is talking about. By this point he had talked to a grand total of 3 characters, all of whom were mission critical characters that he was forced into, with a literal goddamn knight with his own Castle and an Orc butler if he had ever fucking touched any of my exposition, WHICH HE PROCEEDED TO BE WEIRDED OUT BY.
Do note, by this point he has said *Nothing* about any alternatives, any suggestions on how to whet his whistle. It wasn't that I listened or tried to change tack. I was whipping myself into a froth trying to figure out what'll tickle this lazy sack of shit's pickle because trying to get him to PLAY THE FUCKING GAME was like putting a saddle on a Polish cow.
By session 3, it's 2 hours of https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BiSx5LCnugw trying to push his dumb ass down a fucking 800 meter road Then the first combat in the game starts. Night Watch finds some assholes being assholes. Go knock a bitch up, the antithesis of fantasy politics in the 1700s. His round happens. He goes "... can we save all these stats and shit? I'm tiiiired."
I bullshitted the stats, two guys had some fucking number of damage. "no, we're going to just restart next session." Next session never happens. That conversation is literally the last time he fucking mentions that game. Ever.
Then the fucker prods me to get a spot on my dream game of Black Lagoon the RPG after he flakes out after the first combat of HIS star wars campaign a fucking year before.
"Listen here you little shit..."
>>46861972
>Knows that he has gone a bit far
>Makes a considerate bullet list to communicate effectively
>Apologizes about the length, has but six bullets
>Is being called autistic
>Which one is autistic here?
Literal autist here. I've had to phrase that many times in my life.
You're a GM's dream, he's just a fuckhead.
>>46878155
>Arguably the most broken d20 systems
You haven't read any of the third party shit then.
>>46878219
>>46862821
>Armor spikes do 1d4 damage per round when in a grapple.
Oh boy, I'm scared.
>>46861972
Fuck the GM. He obviously wasn't interested in very much player creativity and was fucking rude. You knew you went too far and pulled back. There is literally nothing wrong with this unless you walked through your entire background, defeating the purpose of the bulletpoints, but even that is so minor.
>>46871051
I want to know more! How did you manage an intrigue campaign? What choices made them stay awake?
>>46873672
This feels bad. I had a group start to watch television when they were leveling up. I never DMed for them again.
Not a GM, but I want to be. Never played a single tabletop before, I've been browsing /tg/ for a year or two, and I started istening to a few podcasts recently. Just downloaded the .pdfs for a few systems yesterday, gonna start reading them today, hopefully.
> College riends started up a game in the middle of my school year so I couldn't join (I'm graduating like next month)
> They're doing 5e, lost mines of phandelver, all using pregenerated characters
> They're all generally okay away from the game
> I figured I'd listen to the sessions even if I can't join in
> DM doesn't know what the hell he's doing, is giving out hundreds of gold pieces to characters at a time
> 0 roleplay on either side of the game, I've even tried to talk to the GM about it so they could have more fun playing
> One player constantly complains about rolls and how they should get him more and the DM relents
> They have the 'roll a 20 you win everything for a few seconds' mentality
> DM is fudging rolls to get combat done quicker
> At least one player is gone each session, usually the annoying player's girlfriend, who, when there, only does what he says and can't think for herself
> They abuse long rests because the wizard and cleric don't know how to not use all their spells slots at the beginning of encounters and such
> Alltogether they spend about thirty minutes fucking with roll30 to get it to work
I don't even know what to do.
>>46862821
Obviously I let him do everything he just said, but relentlessly fuck him over for having a Charisma score lower than a dog.
>>46876455
Sorry, I only have physical, and I can't even remember where it is.
>>46878955
King Crimson would work pretty easily in a RPG system, I think. Basically let rounds play out, then at the end of each round, user decides if the things done in that round have an effect or not. It really gives an idea of how broken that power really is.
>>46849850
What you've said about being there for the company really reminds me of one of my players.
>Always on her phone when its not her turn.
>Constantly complaining about things not going her way; dice rolls, her race being underpowered, someone else's race being overpowered.
>Her character always clashes with the rest of the party, constantly breaking character during in character arguments to point out why something is a bad idea or why a plan won't work, often using out of character knowledge.
>Plays the same kind of character in every game; young girl, barely out of her teenage years. Hot-headed and brash, some lofty ambition that causes her to act irrationally when given the opportunity, and has a difficult time cooperating with others (though I'm not sure whether thats intentional or not)
I kind of get the feeling that she's there because all her immediate friends are playing together and she doesn't want to be left out.
>>46874921
>look at all this shit I do
Congratulations, anon. You get a gold star for being able to handle a lot on your plate
>>46878955
I haven't gotten into Jojo yet, burning through a couple things on my backlog
Does this Crimson King guy just decide "yeah, fuck the last half minute" and poof it back to that point or something?
>>46865965
>Being friends with JoJofags
Get better friends
>>46882064
He removes the cause of something.
Think about it like a comicbook panel. If I held up my sword on panel 1, slashed you with it on panel 2 and then it showed you wounded on panel 3, King Crimson could remove panel 2 and then you'd be fine because despite my sword being down on panel 3 there's no sign of me actually hitting you.
>>46882064
The ability erases a portion of time. Anything that happens during that period of time didn't happen in short, and everyone besides the user sees it as time skipping forward. It's more complicated than that, but that's a simplified version of it.
>>46872155
>you will never run a mega campaign that spans decades IRL centuries in game
>you will never game with your grandchildren and your old group of seasoned adventurers
Just kill me right now
>>46882200
>>46882197
Fuck
That would be funny to see a party deal with at least
>>46880284
You're not having fun, so there's no point in being there. Talk to everyonr, including the GM, and if the problem persists, fuck them.
>>46872785
The safety's probably on.
>>46885339
And?
I've had terrible luck when it comes to players caring about mechanics, even fucking base ones.
>Barbarian who thought you rolled a d20 for everything and I didn't notice for the first few sessions because he rolled so poorly it seemed like normal results
>Fighter who thought he rolled his damage die for attack rolls and was pissed for several sessions about 'always missing' until I finally noticed what he was rolling with (I now do dice checks the first time a group goes into combat)
>Cleric who thought that Channel Divinity cost spell slots
>Which was an improvement from them previously thinking Channel Divinity refreshed their spell slots
>Multiple players who didn't understand why damage types mattered
>Which was better than "What does it mean by a lightning or thunder spell? What's a lightning spell? I just see cleric spells."
>Bard who didn't cast any spells and when finally asked why said, "I have spells?"
>Barbarian who didn't add any bonuses while raging
>Cleric who had only Wizard spells because "They were in the spells section!"
>Ranger who legitimately asked me why the book said he could "dual-wield bows"
>Multiple players who thought spell slots and spells known were the same thing (and infinitely reusable, for some reason)
>Multiple players who asked "Well I'm level 10, so why aren't there any level 10 spells?"
>Multiple players rolling d20s for stats for god knows why
The list goes on.
>>46885807
It sounds like you didn't really explain it all that well, either. I usually don't let new players be a spellcaster unless they want to be. Then I try to explain the spell system as best as I can.
>Channel Divinity refreshed spell slots
Where in the fuck would they think that?!
>The book said he could "dual-wield bows"
At what IQ do these people function?
>>46885954
Oh I tried, those folks were always ultra confused by it, despite me going step-by-step with it.
Often times these conclusions came about when they'd just nod and say, "Okay yeah I get it" and then come out with these wild fucking conclusions that I guess they just came up with.
I hope dual-bow guy was joking, though. He was only there for two sessions before never showing up again- In retrospect, maybe he was dyslexic and just misread the section? He wasn't expecting it he was just surprised that the book said he could.
>>46885807
It's things like this that make me avoid DnD. I'm looking for a new generic fantasy setting since I'm getting bored of using Savage Worlds, and whilst mechanical fidelity is cool for defining the classes, there are just so many rules to keep track of for each classes features, for feats and then all these new spells to learn the stats of.
And knowing my players I would have to check a rule every 5 minutes or so, which might just kill a game for me.
>>46885054
Well, I've considered just bailing and trying to find a game on roll20 for me to join instead, but online games are notorious for having sperglords and autismos running through them, so I've been hesitant. And these guys don't know any better, so I kinda feel bad for them, and kinda wanna teach them how to actually play. I don't want to barge in on the GM and say 'you're doing everything wrong' even though he pretty much is, but I don't really see another alternative.
>>46870547
Dumbfuck, hide in plain sight requires you to be in a shadow, and the example was stating that the rogue wanted to do it in broad daylight.
>>46873672
When my players do this I just stop and wait and usually the other people who are paying attention get passed and yell at the ones who aren't and then they apologize. One time I had a player who brought his 3ds and played 3ds through the entire social portion of a town the party just entered so I left his character at the Tavern and he didn't get the bonus experience I like to award through noncombat interaction not to mention the gold and renown the other players were getting from stuff. The next game he paid attention way harder.
>>46886379
>hide in plain sight requires you to be in a shadow
Actually, doesn't it normally just require you to be *near* a shadow?
>>46886379
>>46887930
depends on thesystem
>>46888037
I was going off +50 to spot checks.
>Game session is coming up
>I'm rushing to prep things and get all my stuff set up because I've had a full week.
>I've gotten a map set up with enemies, stablocks imported with their macros set up, made them all tokens, set up my music tracks and background sounds, got a set of handouts/map tokens ready for their caravan, AND wrote my notes for this session and the next few story points. All within like, 2 hours.
>1 hour before session, two players inform me they can't make it.
>We're not playing this week.
All that stuff, I can deal with, really. None of that is the worst part. I'll tell you the part that kills me.
>They told me they wanted to livestream the campaign. It was their idea.
>They don't actually give a fuck about how much work it is to make this shit happen and bring in viewers every week. Literally all they do is take the work I put in, and make it so it doesn't matter because people will see them actually playing and just leave.
I'm just...tired.
>>46888564
>Their idea
>You're the GM
So, at which part of the negotiation did you go "Yes, I will do that. Then it's settled."?
It's their idea, let THEM do it if they want it so badly.
>>46888780
It's not like I wasn't interested. It's a bit like if you've always wanted to start a podcast, and one day someone comes to you and says "Hey let's start this podcast", and you're like "Yeah, cool I always wanted to do that!"
And then when you actually get into doing it, they can't be bothered, they don't care about it at all, and all the work you put in to make it seem appealing and get people to pay attention just results in them saying "Man why do you take this so seriously?".
I don't understand these betafags. If people don't appreciate the effort you put in, boot them out or leave the party. What's the fucking issue?
>>46872556This sounds far too familiar to my situation at the momentBut I'm the one with feelings for my GM
>>46849324
>Running a wood elf campaign
>players enter a distant part of the forest overrun by fiend spider monster - everything is webs
>they run in to a NPC 'crazy' druid who is acting like the entire world is like this web area
>players kill him more because they don't want to deal with him
>player kill boss spider monster at end after big battle
>find ancient treant, much like the druid.
>figure out how to communicate with it, ask one question 'how did this happen'
>in rp I play out, and then out of character explain, that it is near death and can't tell them anything right now.
>they simply turn their back on it and forget about it, do not care
>spend the rest of the time trying to harvest poison from giant spider body
>area starts to collapse after 6 rounds and they escape, do not care about ancient treant thing
The 'treasure' for this adventure was supposed to be the two NPC's as allies. They were also the method by which the players would be able to figure out what happened.
So many future adventures were planned around those two. Fuck. So much wasted/lost effort. Allies, sources of information, fame from rescuing them and the resulting social influence.
What bugs me the most is that they are all 'good' aligned. Yet the only thing they gave a fuck about was immediate material wealth and saving their own hides - the hell with everyone/everything else.
One character is a Druid, another a Ranger, and another a Paladin. All wood elves.
So fucking bummed.
>>46882751
>tfw it takes three weeks warning minimum to make sure your whole four-person party shows up and even then it takes several hours to get the fuckers to sit down and start
I hate my life and I want to be a GMing grandpa right now
>>46889545
Next session starts with 'seeing as you were all ruthless and unremorseful when dealing with NPCs, your alignments have now shifted to Neutral. Mark that up on your character sheets'.
Then have their decisions come to haunt them later, because there's no point to having a GM if there is no consequence.
>>46890195
I'm going to talk to them about it. Not a full shift, but I am saying that I am marking them a point towards neutral as their actual motivations were 'evil' as far as alignment goes.
The Druid is going to face consequences from her circle.
The party as a whole is going to face social consequences from their home town.
It is somewhat negated by their having defeated the fiend spider. But I just don't see that as enough, mostly a break even.
I'm going to have them re-assigned (they are sort of part of a militia thing) to a smaller starting outpost village.
Not...exactly...banished. But not exactly a positive transfer either.
But mostly I'm just bummed. I'm not going to railroad or anything, and I don't do that. But it is a real bummer when you work stuff out and develop things just to have the players shit on it. Not for proper in character reasons. Not for any good reason. But just 'not loot, do not care' reasons. Fuck. So disappointed.
>>46890528
That's a mature way of handling it. Full respect for you.
>>46866277
Just decrease the difficulty of the boss if it is too strong for the party to functionally handle. If you plan for 4 and get 3, adjust.
>>46889818
I closed down my current campaign because of this. We had been playing for almost two years, high school friends the five of us, and it just wasn't going anywhere. The number of sessions we'd play and plot progress made was dreadfully minuscule and starting to wear on me. I finally decided to put her to rest when I came to the conclusion we would never build any momentum at the pace we were going.I'm glad it's over.
>>46890528
That's too mature a way to handle it, I'm disappointed in you.
Not only as a GM, but as a PC.
One of my fucking PCs always thinks with his dick.
In the middle of combat of a boss fight, refuses to fight the lamia because "muh lady".
Always puts the party in harms way just to get what he wants and tries to argue "muh character choices" "muh chaotic or evil".
He hates me even me when I DM since I refuse to hold back on PCs death when they deserve it or when the dice rolls.
Fuck him and his waifu hunts whenever people want to just get shit done.
>>46892590
Why not run a module with them?
>>46861972
14 pages is fucking stupid. Unless you're a god-tier writer who has written multiple best-selling novels, no one wants to read 14 pages of your shit.
But if you made a smaller bullet-point list that sums up your whole story, then I wouldn't kick you.
The fact that you gave 14 pages to your DM for your own character is still a red-flag in my opinion.
>Okay before we start, everyone write up some backstories
>Feel free to include a faction or place that you'd like to take part in the campaign
>Some players give me cities and villages, friends and enemies
>one player gives me "he has amnesia"
>CE fighter asks to roll to KO and ass fuck party's TN wood elf
>gets mad when I say no
fuck this shit
>>46894484
why is there a chaotic evil fighter in the party in the first place, what is he getting done
>>46894514
The party generally just points him at a group of enemies and places bets on how long it takes, why he went CE is beyond me
>>46886177
This is not a problem with D&D. It's a problem with the guy's players having single-digit IQs.
>>46894484
Why did he even bother asking?
>surprise round
>bludgeon the elf
>extra attack to grapple
>action surge to continue bludgeoning (or grapple if that failed)
>repeat (ensuring non-lethal)
>until she is KOd
>"I rape the elf"
>"I proceed to ass-fuck the elf"
Didn't even need permission, could have just done it.
>>46849324
Tell him if he doesn't write you a fucking double-spaced report on the rulebook in a fancy binder then his character will fail at all skills forever just like he does in real life
>>46878397
>implying /b/ makes it to 3
>>46894450
To get around amnesia and characters named "???" I just tell the players the character sheet knows all about the character because it could be useful for reasons.
>>46863387
I had the same fucking issue.
6 players, 5e which they asked me to run in the first place, playing on roll20, using skype, have a facebook group, all of their numbers, ect a shitton of ways to contact me, right?
Halfway through the starter adventure, half of them just up and don't show, I repeatedly text and message the group (like, once twice a week) to at least message me 24 hours if they can't make it. none of them do if they cant.
3 weeks in a row where almost all my my party don't show or message, I get pissed, all their answers was basically "sorry, I was really busy I couldn't come" after I finally manage to reach them.
I get mad, tell them they can fuck off if they ever want me to run a game for them again, and that they are flaky assholes.
>one of them invites me to a game he's running and has 2 other people from same group, one of which was the one who actually showed.
>say yes, don't even bother making a character or reading book out of spite, don't plan to show.
>game day arrives and all the players that weren't in my group and myself don't show to the game, but him+the two that were are and are super ready
>tfw he gets retardedly mad and cancels the whole thing because nobody messaged him
>tfw he confronts me/other players about not showing/messaging the next day and honestly doesn't get the irony.
>tfw it turns out he wasn't even fucking prepared because he was playing videogames all week
>>46894450
I actually somewhat hate my current GM as a GM, but he did my favorite thing relating to that
>makes "i have amnesia" player not have specific class features
>makes them roll for it every time they're asleep or unconsious
>player get's knocked unconscious once, he rolls, immediately gets it into his head the best way to remove amnesia/personality changes is like in cartoons, get bashed really hard in the head
>DM has had a fairly large amount of dice set aside since the game stared
>we're talking 8 sessions, every session he'd take out the same dice, set them aside, and never touch them until the game ends.
>was removing them fairly randomly IIRC, a little less were set aside by session 8
>Character manages to either hit himself in the head or has the enviroment/someone else do it.
>DM immediately takes set aside dice, rolls them, looks and counts it up
>"you take (more than enough damage to kill the character) because you've given yourself brain damage".
>player shows up next session with a 3 page backstory and a newfound fear of having his characters be hit in the head/unconsious
>My fucking face when
>>46886177
>It's things like this that make me avoid DnD.
It only looks mechanically tough because those players are almost illiterate. That's legitimately one of the few ways they could fuck up reading a heading repeated 10 times in at least 3 of those anecdotes.
>>46849733
If I were as solidly stuck with a group as you sound, I'd just place objective markers at boss fights and frame it "you don't get XP for rabble, only big guy counts".
Baby steps. That gives them incentive to bypass the mooks to save time.
An then, introduce bonus XP or other boobs for non-combat resolution of the boss.I noticed the freudian slip typo but fuck it, waifuing the bosses works just fine.
>>46871003
>>46871289
I'm thinking of using the 3x3 structure for superhero game I run after the current first trial.
Plus the rest of that "campaign mastercraft method" screencap and a little bit I've got from a podcast*: character crossover.
Essentially, treat them as each having a short solo comic run, the player of the hero defines the short plot of it. Then add a randomly selected other player to it, with their character showing up as a guest star, and the two players hashing out the details. Do one or two rounds across the group of this, and then you can bring them all together by "I know a guy who knows a guy".
It could apply to regular fantasy by having them intersect like that on some past adventures easily.
*they may have been reappropriating it from FATE or something into their M&M.
>>46849324
I feel bad for you OP.
If the guy wants to minmax he could at least bloody learn how to minmax.
>>46875306
'Rulemonster' is the traditional one. My group has played it, but mainly for the funny criticals.
>>46849834
Sometimes you have to sit down and have a chat with your players, if they want challenges (where they can fail or die), because they enjoy solving problems and winning tough fights, or if they just want the easy road to virtual fame and virtual victory because they want to feel good about being heros.
Yes I know several people who want to play a game like it was Dark Souls and then have the tits to COMPLAIN when they get into an unwinnable situation for building their characters like a cluster of tin shacks in a favela.
TELL ME WHAT YOU WANT.
I CAN RUN IT.
>>46851059
And of that one in 20, 2 out of 3 like to powergame and rules lawyer and spoiler themselves on the module, yes?
Those types are damn fun to play against if your party is ENTIRELY those types. But if you've got one "My stat sheet is my sword. The rules are my shield. In the name of rollplaying, let none survive" type and the rest of your party sort of wants to play combat but they're shit at it, then you'll end up with someone upset.
>>46853057
I dunno.
Have you tried making a campaign with powergaming as a focus and creativity as an unimportant sidenote?
Not sure how to fix the never shutting up or not working as part of a group tho.
>>46864154
You should try playing a game that doesn't have skill checks as in PF, i know BFRPG (Basic Fantasy) and DCC (Dungeon Crawl Classics) doesn't have traditional skill checks.
>>46873081
On the one hand, good advice in theory
On the other hand, bad advice in practice, because there are a LOT of people who are toxic themselves, don't notice, and blame the other players for the toxicity of the game.
This includes a very large amount of /tg/, who believe that taking the roleplaying out of the RPG and just playing it like a game, are objectively playing it wrong.
>Good players who will leave if you kick a bad player are not actually good players.
Good players will stick up for each-other and not let you ban or kick another player unjustly.
>>46857605
>>46861972
Some players don't like backstory. They just want to make their guy, jump straight in and fight some kobolds.
Nothing wrong with that. Probably faster and easier to just go with it and give their Generic Fightdude some kobolds, rather than convert them to the holy church of muh narrative.
>>46897642
>Have you tried making a campaign with powergaming as a focus and creativity as an unimportant sidenote?
>>46863470
>I have to constantly say things like "ok its all you guys you control the scene" and the one guy doesn't want to hog the glory so he waits for someone else to talk creating an awkward silence over the skype call.
I've run into that.
Well so long as the players are having fun, no harm no foul. Maybe they wanna be told a story by you, rather than write a story with you?
>>46864310
>My players make bags of stats to roll dice against bags of loot. I'm not entirely sure why they tabletop sometimes.
They probably enjoy being bags of stat and rolling dice against bags of loot
>>46871083
You sure that's a good idea? What if a person gets anxious being put on the spot like that.
Oh well you're the only person with an actual suggestion so I suppose yours is the best.
The DM didn’t do prep work and couldn't wing a story to save his life. At first he wanted us to do a sandbox campaign...then he dropped a plothook involving cultists...then he had us escorting a gold shipment and a non sensical hawk encounter(i dont know why he didnt just run bandits...too lazy maybe?)...then he went back to the cultists, introduced his DMPC, and has us all knocked out with no combat when we fail spot rolls.
He then has us stuck in a magic cell for hours IRL while we try to figure out the puzzle to get out which he keeps insisting is really easy. I dont know why he didnt do a simple jailbreak action sequence instead.
Then as we finally escape our cell and start making our way to freedom, he throws MORE puzzles at us, basically non sensical rooms. We are visibly frustrated at this point but hes NOT taking a hint.
As we work our way through the third puzzle, he says "you know what? im bored of dming this. the door you unlocked is ctulhu's birthcanal, all of you go through it and are aborted. The end."
>>46894450
>>46895934
>Player makes a Changeling Wizard with amnesia
>"How does she remember any spells? Does do they just pop up in her mind?"
>Player takes this opportunity and says yes
>Player (and character) is annoying as fuck
>Imagine her mind being taken by a magic book with pages of Orium (like magic lead)
>She was a thief who stole the book, it took over her mind, she got amnesia but became a wizard
>Color of Magic plot
We never went further than three sessions of that campaign. He'd probably bitch and moan about how it didn't go the way he wanted because he always does. If a player doesn't want a backstory, fill it in for him, they gave that choice to you.
>>46871110
>What is your full name?
Stat Sheet the PC
>When and where were you born?
At the start of this campaign, at the start of this campaign
>Who were/are your parents?
None IC. OOC, the player and the DM
>Do you have any siblings?
Yes, the other PCs. Even if they totally won't admit it, they are Stat Sheets too.
>Where do you live now, and with whom?
In dungeons, with bags of loot and exp.
>What is your occupation?
Player Character
>Write a full physical description of yourself
No physical appearance.
Interactions with the outside world as described by the rules of the game, can be killed by lowering HP (or Con) as normal.
Can be described to others via characteristics written on statsheet.
>To which social class do you belong
Player Character
>Do you have any allergies, diseases, or physical weaknesses
Excessive details, backstory, fluff, and story info that has no effect on the mechanics. My character is paralyzed in place by situations which aren't resolved by mechanics.
>Are you right or left handed?
I am able to target a 10ft reach on either side of my character equally well
>What does your voice sound like?
It doesn't. Information just sorts of teleports into the minds of people I interact with, and they are aware that I am the source of it.
>What words and phrases do you use frequently?
Skip Dialogue
>What do you have in your pockets?
char * pockets $= StatSheet.Inventory;
>Do you have any quirks, strange mannerisms, annoying habits, or other defining characteristics?
Yes, I am incapable of engaging in quirks, mannerisms, habits, or defining characteristics beyond serving as a payload of mechanics.
>>46897433
>boobs as reward
"You have saved me and therefore I will grant one boob to one of you. Who wishes to recieve it?"
"Don't you mean 'boon'?"
"What did I SAY?!"
"Well alright, I will claim the boob."
Your left side of your chest swells and develops an A-cup breast. It's nice and soft and has a perky end.
Onward to the Quest of Boobs!
>>46897725
'cause the players might like it.
You play games 'cause you like them right?
Well if you have some players that want to ditch the RP and just play the G part of the RPG then go for it. It's fun
>>46897934
I wonder if this is in MAID's random tables anywhere.
>>46897999
>'cause the players might like it.
The players aren't the ones doing any actual work, they're just there to ride on the coattails of GM effort. What they like doesn't really matter, especially since you can find new ones instantly and without difficulty.
>Well if you have some players that want to ditch the RP and just play the G part of the RPG then go for it. It's fun
Play a video game if that's what you want. RPGs are defined by the roleplaying.
>>46898063
>The players aren't the ones doing any actual work, they're just there to ride on the coattails of GM effort. What they like doesn't really matter, especially since you can find new ones instantly and without difficulty.
I know what you said is true but you're kind of a dick bro.
>>46897934
>"You must gather four Orbs of Light to save the kingdom!"
>"Heh, heh, ooorrrbs you say?"
>"You know what? Yes, it is that kind of orbs!"
>>46875306
>>46897596
What about Rollmaster?
>>46898469
"Well, this golem doesn't seem to have anything that matters."
"Did you check his ehm..."
"-His jewels! Of course!"
>>46849733
Those chumps wouldn't have lasted in old school D&D where the objective was much more "get the treasure out of the dungeon" than "kill all the monsters" and where somewhere between 75-80% of XP came from treasure. Combine that with decreasing returns on treasure XP from killing low hit-die monsters (though they could still drain valuable resources) and the possibility of random encounters beyond the party's ability to deal with, and you have a formula which encourages alternatives to violence and threat evaluation.
>>46853057
Give me powergamers over yet another derivative anime melodrama backstory
>>46898469
>>46899158
"Messy fight but finally the evil sorcerer is dead, and will trouble the fair kingdom no... Fred, why are you lifting his robe?"
"Lookin' fer 'is magical rod o' course!"
>>46890528
Or maybe you could have made the characters more likable
>>46898063
>The players aren't the ones doing any actual work, they're just there to ride on the coattails of GM effort. What they like doesn't really matter, especially since you can find new ones instantly and without difficulty.
Harsh, but kind of true. Most groups, the DM puts massively more effort into the game than the players - because all the players have to do is run one character, while the DM has to run the entire world. And some players can't even be bothered to learn how to run their one character, as this thread attests.
Pretty much the reason DMs get burned out. You spend months or years learning and running a game for a group of people, putting hours of prep in extra per session, trying to make sure everyone has fun, and then there's that one asshole who can't even be bothered to read his own character sheet, and the other two chucklefucks who play on their phones all session and have to have the whole game explained back to them on a twenty-minute delay, and you start to question why you're the only one putting any effort into this 'group'...
And then you realise that nobody else around is willing to DM so it's a choice of that or no game at all.
>>46862708
Written backstories are as much for you as for the others. I find it really helps to get to know my character if I write out a couple of pages of backstory.
>>46857605
Are you me
Did I jump into a parallel dimension and didn't realise
BTW I want to find out if sex with my clone is masturbation or not
For science, no magical realm involved
>"I don't like combat heavy games"
>Sits there on his phone chatting on facebook any time he doesn't have to roll dice for combat
In the 17ish years I've been DMing I've had three different versions of this player, all different people, and in every case I have wanted to viciously attack them with a brick.
I had someone that was a pain in my ass in the past like this...
>run DH
>three players, two know 40k pretty well
>one doesn't but wants to give it the ol' college try
>no worries, it'll be a couple of weeks before I begin. Let's go over some basics.
>send PDF, teach basics of the system, go through all the occupations (1st edition at the time.)
>'I wanna be the assassin.'
>okay, there are some options here-
>'I wanna be moritat.'
>oh, okay cool they offer up a strong and solid beginning class.
>proceed a ton of teaching, talking, working out background, not to hard for me since the books offer so much in ways of general ideas.
>night before game, player says he isn't ready. can't grasp the system at all.
>wut.jpg
>we spent two weeks working this out and doing practice runs and examples.
>he seems put off by my surprised reaction, as if i'm calling him an idiot and becomes super self conscious.
>swears all he'll do is fail at the game.
>okay okay, hang on. I'll do a cheat sheet for you.
>spend better part of three hours writing formulae, footnotes, page numbers, and explanations on everything on his character.
>this includes every possible action, every equation, what to roll, all the skills, etc.
>next day we finally begin.
>proceeds to not know how to do a single thing throughout the entire session.
>whenever it's his turn, I get pm'd that he doesn't know what to do or roll.
>are you shitting me?
>stay patient and polite, even though its dragging the flow down. combat takes too long on his turn. the other two decide what they wanna do and know what to roll when it's not their turn so they are always ready.
>every. single. turn. 'I dunno what to roll/do.'
>player gets frustrated and moody. thinks i'm being condescending now after the twentieth time he asks for help.
>'bro, you have a cheat sheet. I've written down every known action, skill, stats, and numbers. Just look at it.'
>'oh. I haven't looked at it yet.'
Such is life.
>>46899959
I hear ya. Had a player who would show up at my place for the session, exclaim he doesn't feel like playing that night, then proceeds to eat the food and snacks I provide for my players while playing my consoles or dicking on his phone.
Often times it distracted my players too much and I was set on being polite but after the second time, when he came in and said for the third time he doesn't feel like playing I told him to have a nice night. And closed the door without inviting him in. He took the hint not to show unless he's going to play with us.
>>46899386
Well said. I've had this sort of conversation with a group before about how our game was a collaboration. It's not US vs GM, or the GM trying to kill PCs, but a union of storyteller and actors to work together and create a story.
Sure, a lot of systems require heavy number crunching in an attempt at fairness and resolving challenges in a way the group finds balanced. That, in and of itself, can lead to problems like Rulebook Lawyers, Powergamers, overly optimizing, and all that jazz.
I make it very important that my players need to know what they want to do, what concept they are looking for, STICKING TO THAT CONCEPT, working together, and knowing their stats inside and out.
