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Hey /tg/ I've been wondering what are some of your favorite villians? Need to come up with a good, memorable, one for a game I'll be running soon.
>>46307469
Valeth is the epitome of any fa/tg/uy. He's my favorite too.
This boi
Chocochar. Man won it all. Fucked up his family. Became super important. Killed his Garma clone just moments after telling him he'd fuck his loli sister. His last scene is hugging her with one hand on her ass.
>>46307469
Best villain coming through
>>46310169
this
1000 times this
literally best
>>46307469
In my mind, there are a few things a villain needs to do to be truly effective in the role.
First, they have to make you cheer for the hero. There are a number of ways to do this, but my favorite among them is for the villain to be truly despicable. A lot of readers get characters they -dislike- confused with characters that make them -angry-: A character that elicits a genuine emotional response is an effective character! This is especially true of a villain. I've seen a lot of people say they hate Griffith here as a character using any number of excuses, but these arguments always seem to stem from anger and frustration rather than boredom. Many will disagree, but rarely have I seen someone speak impassively on why they don't like Griffith. Hating him and being unwilling to give him any credit on principle quickly becomes a passion for many readers.
Second, a good villain (as opposed to an anti-hero or some other form of antagonist) is there to a study in contrasts. At least some of the villain's traits will be exaggerated to make the opposing traits present in the hero that much more striking and visible. Again, Griffith accomplishes this with Guts on several levels. Black/White, Feminine/Masculine, Loyal/Selfish, etc.
Finally, a good villain needs to be consistent. Their goals and their actions don't have to be justifiable according to the reader's logic or morals, but the villain does have to remain consistent within their own set logic or morals to a degree and it has to be treated like a really big deal when they step outside of that. A villain's goals and actions -only need to make sense within the confines of said villain's own head.- This is important, because a lot of people will knock a villain with a sentiment like "How dare they do that" or "That's retarded, they should have done this." People like this have trouble separating real events from story time. So long as you can draw a clear line between events and build up, it's fair game.
>>46307469
This motherfucker.
He set up practically everything you come across, stifled your lineage, and (if you turn evil) accomplishes his goal and lives forever.
>>46307469
This guy's been burnt into my mind the last few days. I can't believe it took me this long to realize how great this character can be.
inb4:
>villain
>>46310805
Thanks for the heavy feedback, and the amazing idea that it has created for me. Can't risk posting details just yet as most of the guys I'm gaming with can easily find and read it here.
>>46307469
>>46310805
Oh, and yeah, Griffith is one of my favorite villains because he meets those criteria. His actions make sense in the context of his character and the build up to events, he's a hard contrast to Guts, and he's a total bastard.
It's easy to hate him because deep down, the man was always a total asshole. Not that he didn't have some redeeming traits, he absolutely did, but that only makes his actions even more fucked up. Even he knew how fucked up many of his actions were and went through with it anyway. Griffith's self doubt only demonstrates that he wasn't clinically detached like a robot or a sociopath, but a person who understands the difference between right and wrong and chose wrong out of pure selfishness.
And in the process, he literally kills off any positive aspects of his personality that did exist. So now he is that monstrous sociopath, and he got there by choice.
An effective villain and a well written character in general. My hat off to the author.
>>46311067
No problem. Berserk is my favorite series, in large part due to how well written many of the characters are. Griffith and Guts in particular. I hope my fanboy ranting helped you make something that, perhaps with luck, someday I can enjoy even more.
>>46311153
>he wasn't clinically detached like a robot or a sociopath, but a person who understands the difference between right and wrong and chose wrong out of pure selfishness.
I love this so fucking much.
Fuck your "I was hit by my daddy when I was 8 so now I'm evil" or "I literally can't understand goodness" villains, the best villains are those who are normal dudes who might had a shitty life, but didn't allow that to shape their whole life. No, this pricks became villains just because they are so selfish and greedy that they are willing to throw away their morals in order to fulfill their ambitions.
I find it particularly cool because, unlike with other villains, this guy isn't too different from you. Knowing that the only thing preventing you from becoming such a twisted monster is one little step has quite a powerful effect, at least for me.
![Longnail_by_OchreJelly [Naomi].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/pxBCkuR.jpg "Longnail_by_OchreJelly [Naomi].jpg")
OP here.
Found another thread out there in /tg/ that has fit quite well into what I've been getting in here as far as feedback goes.
(Pic Related)
As stated, can't go into too much detail to keep a few surprises in store for them.
The short version of what I'll be doing involves having the group chasing one BBEG when the real villain is the one they are trying to save from said BBEG.
>>46307469
One of my favorite kinds of villain is the one who's really just an antagonist. Their actions can easily be seen as the correct choice, but are set apart from those of the hero(es) because of ideological differences. Not even right and wrong, but just differences in the way they view the world. There's still a strong reason to oppose the villain, and it makes it a far more personal conflict, which I find very enjoyable.
Pic related was trying to save the universe from certain death by initiating the process of eternal recurrence, just starting over again and again. The heroes decide to stop him because they believe that running away from suffering isn't the answer because it will never result in the world actually moving forwards, and that there has to be a way to overcome the problem.but it is said he believed the same thing and was trying to lead the collective subconscious of humanity to that same conclusion
>>46311182
>Berserk is my favorite series
My apostle.
>>46315156
This. The best villains are the ones who you could see actually interacting peaceably with the protagonists under different circumstances.
(pic unrelated)
I'll just leave this here
>>46317346
>villain
>>46310102
Second worst Gundam of all time, right after AGE.
>>46310124
Why is Nox so based?
>>46310816
JoB is pretty fucking gangster too.
>>46319900
Because he easily has the greatest villain motivation I have ever seen. He was how you do an insane villain right, not a Joker lulscarypsychoticclown type insanity, but a holder of a twisted leap in logic. Nox truly believed that nothing he did would matter and as abhorrent as his plan was, the audience can't help but feel that he may be right and that's a scary thought.
>>46310946
You know, I was really hesitant when they cast Bernthal as the Punisher, but he actually pulled it off really well. Shame they dropped the ball on the second half of the season.Fucking ninjas and that BRACKU SKY bullshitThat prison hallways scene though
OP here. Just finished typing up the basic storyline concept for the adventure. Hopefully it will go over well. I'll likely post some kind of a story up here when it is finished documenting the shennanigans and hijinks that the group manages to get into during this misadventure.
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>>46307469
My favourite kind of villain to run (especially in tabeltop games where the players become ridiculously strong very quickly) are villains that can't be beaten through physical means. As in, your players could theoretically crush them like a bug without breaking a sweat but the villain knows this and hurts the players in other ways. Outsmarting them, staying one step ahead, taking hostages or just making themselves seem like heroes so the players can't kill them without fear of being seen by the public as the villain.
Daly reminder that Dagoth Ur did nothing wrong.
>>46307469
IN ORDER TO BE A VILLAIN YOU HAVE TO DO SOMETHING WRONG ANON
LEZARD VALETH DID NOTHING WRONG.
>>46309602
>babbys first just as planned character
>>46320099
>Implying ninjas aren't thematically more in line with Daredevil than anything else
Could have been handled better but they're pretty much Daredevil's go-to enemy outside of street thugs.
>>46310946
Explain to me how he was villainous in any way. There's a difference between being a villain and an antagonist and he was only an antagonist for like 3 or 4 episodes out of the whole season.
>>46320284
Damn straight
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l83vT2svg3g
I have been looking for a campaign to make the bbeg just wizard Pegasus, being all flamboyant and calling everyone "boy". Sound super fun from a GM perspective.
>>46309602
Not even the best Kira.
>>46320099
The thing that bugged me the most about the whole Hand plot was that they called it "Burakku Sukai" in Japanese instead of "Kuro Sora." This is supposed to be an ancient Japanese cult, why do they refer to their MacGuffin in Engrish?
>>46310805
I actually like Griffith, if I was in his situation I would've done the same thing.
>>46316716
>FOOLISH SAMRURAI
>>46320296
Lorenta would disagree.
>>46321350
>explain to me how he was villainous in any way.
Nigger he murdered almost three dozen people before you even get a good look at him. Sure they were all gangsters who probably had it coming, but that doesn't excuse that kind of disregard for justice of public safety.
His motives were understandable sure, but that doesn't make his methods any less villainous.
>>46311267
Does Dio fall under this? I've always gotten the feeling that Dio was not evil because of his father, he was just ambitious because of his father. So while he might have simply become an old gang leader in the slums of London if his father had been normal, the ambition and motivation his father's abuses instilled in him made him into an even worse villain.
>>46324875
>killing people automatically makes you a villain regardless of the context
Fucker, they were goddamn gangsters. The worst he came towards public endangerment was with the hospital scene and even then he outright said no one but that one guy was in any danger. Just because he disregarded the law in killing them doesn't make his actions inherently "villainous".
>>46324962
The whole point of Dio was that he was sort of a saturday morning cartoon villain. Grandiose, and evil until it becomes comedic. But that's the whole point. Morally grey bad guys are great if EVERYONE is not one, Dio provides change from that. He was created in the 80's though so I doubt he was created with that in mind.
>>46325020
Punisher's worldview leaves no room for shades of gray and no room for redemption.
>>46325089
Are you saying Paladins of Vengeance that are unwavering in their code villains now? Or that they are somehow damned in their actions?
>>46325096
I sure as hell wouldn't play a Good-aligned Paladin of Vengeance.
Guts from berserk.
>I am the revelation! The Tiger-Force at the core of all things! When you cry out in your dreams -- it is Darkseid that you see!
>>46325108
The Punisher is certainly skirting the line of Good rather than Evil though. Some of his reasons for killing criminals can be a bit selfish at times but they're also so no one has to go through what he's gone through. He hasn't really done anything to be considered a true villain who are exclusively evil. He's an antagonist in the sense his brand of justice comes in direct conflict with Daredevil's but they're eventually able to vaguely reconcile with each other at the end. If you want to talk villainous killers, that would be in Elektra's ballpark.
Tompa from Hunter X Hunter is my favorite villain.
>>46325156
>but they're also so no one has to go through what he's gone through
That's what he claims, but I guaran-fucking-tee you he doesn't even consider the possibility that he's killing SOMEBODY'S family member.
>>46325227
He KNOWS he's killing someone's family member. He just thinks their actions outweigh any of that. He's not going to feel guilt over the vicious murderer having a family because he's a goddamn vicious murder and doesn't consider that with the people they kill because they're a goddamn criminal.
>>46325261
Hell, there's the issue where Frank franks a couple who have been using their kids to make "videos" in the basement. Inner monologue, he thinks the daughter might be young enough to put it all past her, but he's pretty sure he'll be meeting the older son again in the future.
Frank's well aware of what he does.
>>46325281
It's more of a sad fact of life than anything to do with Frank in parctilar. With a lot of sexual abuse cases, the abuser was abused themselves at a young age. The way Frank sees it, he's just dealing with the symptoms rather than curing the disease. It's really the only thing as a single person can hope to do in any case.
>>46325302
I just meant that Frank is quite cognizant of the lives he leaves behind.
>>46325321
Well of course. The great thing about Frank is that he doesn't view himself as some great crusader. In fact, with some interpretations he simply enjoys killing and he had just enough of a moral compass to direct that carnage towards bad people. He'll occasionally help out an individual, especially children, beyond being a murder machine but he's definitely no hero by his own view.
LOGHAIN MACTIR DID NOTHING WRONG.
>>46320282
pic related
>>46325096
I've always felt paladins are villains if they are the smite evil on sight kind.
>>46325452
>I've always felt paladins are villains if they are the smite evil on sight kind.
It depends on the context for me. If they're Inquisitors that don't even make sure what they're smiting is evil to begin with, then yeah, definitely evil. However, in the case of someone like Frank who scopes out the people he kills and makes sure they're criminals in order to eliminate innocent casualties, then I have trouble calling something like that villainous. At worst it's morally gray.
>>46325443
He was a bit blind to the darkspawn threat.
>>46325452
It's one of those weird things where... If evil is an objective force, and only an evil man can be evil, why wouldn't you just kill them on sight?
It's not like a nice guy could get the evil tag by accident. That isn't how it works. You don't become evil by having bad thoughts, you become evil through action. So an evil person almost by definition can't be innocent.
That said, a Paladin is supposed to be Lawful, which means that he should follow the laws of the land. But if the law of the land is "kill anyone evil on sight," then he's really not doing anything wrong unless there is reason to believe that people can be painted as evil without actually doing anything evil.
>>46310805
Griffith is cool because, and I guarantee you this, he's going to save the world. He's going to save humanity, build the perfect utopian kingdom, and then at the last possible second Guts is going to fly out of the woodwork and cut him in half.
Everyone will scream, and panic, and Guts will have killed the man who literally saved the world, and be remembered as this monstrous evil swordsman, but from our perspective, he's 100% in the right for killing him, because Griffith got to where he was by murdering all of Guts' friends and raping his girlfriend.
That's the twist. Guts is the bad guy, but when you look at it from his perspective, he's done nothing except avenge his friends.
>>46307469
I was going to post Dio or Pagan Min, but I expect someone to give a more well written post on either some time soon.
Yellow 13 was my favorite antagonist in all of Ace Combat, but is antagonist enough to count as a villain?
>>46325496
I think his assumption that the combined forces of Fereldan could take the Darkspawn horde were reasonable, he just overestimated his own ability to command their loyalty. The old King was definitely a fuckwit, so his gamble was ultimately based on a rational analysis of his situation.
A more correct statement would be that Loghain Mac Tir had pure intentions, but incomplete information.
>>46325527
Please don't start this, it's going to derail us onto what the fuck lawful means.It's not what you just fucking said, for starters.
>>46325343
Could Wolverine be considered a villain? I don't follow the comics closelyread: at allbut the few I've read have that whole "I'm good at one thing and that thing is killing" tag.
>>46325557
Pagan Min is a great example of a good villain who needed more screentime. The best part about the character, for those who haven't played the game (spoilers)
was that he never intended to fight the main character. In the opening scene, he tells Ajay to stay put while he deals with some rebels, promises they'll sort everything out when he gets back, and then leaves. The player then most likely... Well, leaves, and goes through the whole plot fighting Pagan Min's soldiers and overthrowing his regime.
But if instead you just put down the controller and wait 15 minutes, he comes back and literally gives the PC everything he wants. He was being dead serious, he really did just want to help.
Great character. Really needed more development, but from the little bits we get, you get the impression that while he was definitely an asshole, he was the only asshole who could keep Kyrat from imploding. When you had control off to either of the "good guy" options, it immediately becomes apparent that they're going to screw the country up far worse than Min ever did (one being a psychotic religious fanatic who believes in human sacrifice, the other being a narcissist who wants to turn the country into one huge drug cartel)
>>46325599
Well, overall, he seems to be the biggest culmination of 4's lesson of "People use anything to justify their sins",such as when he acknowledges his using of his daughter's death to do everything as a load of crap, Longinus pretty badly hiding religion as an excuse for diamond hunting, and Ajay basically using his mother's wish as an excuse to cause havoc at a moment's notice.
Pagan's the greatest black morality villain among a cast of mostly grays and blacks I've seen in years, topping maybe Black Lagoon for anime and the first I've seen regarding games.
>>46325569
Doesn't Wolverine at least try not to kill when he's on certain teams? Namely the Avengers?
>>46325156
It would be interesting if they had Frank accidentally get the wrong guy at some point. Like he acts on what he thinks is a criminal but it turns out to be something perfectly innocent.
Would be interesting to see how he reconciles with murdering someone clean.
>>46307469
Whats the setting of your game gonna be like?
Assuming it's a kind of fantasy setting you can do worse than pic related.
I've always had a taste for illuminati style villains that manipulate society for some kind of transhumanist scheme to cast off their humanity and become some kind of godlike being, but it can be dificult to make fun unless you have a backlog of good ideas to work with.
Typically speaking if you want to run an illuminati style villain the older they are the easier your job is writing them up as nigh omnipotent demi-god figures.
>>46307524
Black knight was a little too Darth Vaderish for my tastes, but I can see why you'd like him.
administrator
from worm.the five dimensional giant worm which reaches back in time to try to consume the planet through a teenaged girl
OP here, surprised this thread is still alive, but also had this interesting idea...turn the PC's into the villains unwittingly.
Don't blink.
>>46307469
This guy right here. He was a crazy, evil Nazi who killed millions and did horrible things, but his speeches were amazing and everything he said about Alucard and monsters was completely correct. The flashback where he chooses to maintain his humanity and rejects becoming a monster actually made me respect the fat bastard despite everything.
>>46318974
You mean, after AGE, Seed Destiny, G-rectum and that ovavseries with that dumb cunt Nina Purpleton. So, 5th worst gundam.
>>46328926
Don't you go bad mouthing 0083. Even if the plot and the characters are meh, the art style is beautiful, pinnacle of the 80's
I liked the art too anon, but the story went full retard with some characters and that ruins it
Hello Everybody!I STILL fucking hate him with a passion bordering on the obsessive.
>>46329680
I think you misspelled 'love'.
Oh, Jack was a wonderful guy.
>>46307469
By far best depiction of an elf as well in my opinion
>Just trying to save his race
>Understands and feels keenly the wrong he is doing, does it anyway because he has no choice
>Actual threat to normally invincible characters
>>46307469
Good shadowrun or hive city villain
>>46307469
>>46307469
Find a better villain
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FrlymHW0qU8
>>46329680
What is this from?
MEDIOCRE!
>>46329836
Borderlands 2. Dude is fucking nuts, believes himself the hero, commences extermination of everyone on the planet who won't idolize him by claiming they're all bandits. Turns his daughter into a god-damned battery charger for a key to control a superweapon. His lines and VA are spectacular. He's a villain you LOVE to HATE.
>>46327604
Not sure how he would react to that but one time he's tricked into thinking he accidentally killed a child and he nearly commits suicide over it. He's also afraid that one day he'll go over the edge and stop just killing criminals.
>>46329969
Jack is the best villan. Dude buys a diamond horse, like an actual living horse made of diamond, and named it "Butt Stallion" for no other reason than to insult you. This is like the second thing he does in the game.
>>46330909
why does that make him a good villain?
Jesus, 4chan really is fucking reddit isn't it?
>>46330909
Jack is a great villain, but not for shitty meme jokes like Butt Stallion.
He's a great villain because at the end of the day he's an actual goddamn villain. For all his talk about building a better world, he's still an egotistical dictator with no morals and no sincere altruistic motivations. None of that shallow "but it's all for the greater good!" JRPG bullshit that's just a transparent attempt at moral complexity.
>>46330953
I dunno why they cited that as a good reason for him being villainous, it's just a particularly funny moment, because he's so completely earnest about the whole thing.
He's a good villain because he's a powerful, intensely narcissistic asshole who buys into his own hype so thoroughly that, no matter what he does, he can justify his own actions to himself. He's a fucking lunatic of the most wildly dangerous degree and he honestly, sincerely believes he's doing the right thing.
Also he's a funny piece of shit that you really, really want to kill.
>>46331031
I would disagree slightly with you; he's wildly insane (expanded on significantly on by the Presequel) but he does believe he's making the universe a better place. This adds no moral complexity to his character whatsoever, because he's objectively wrong, but it's brutally forward sincerity that really sells him as a villain: he is doing what he thinks is right (which is, usually, whatever the fuck he wants) and doesn't give a fuck what you do.
1st Quirell from Harry Potters and Methods of Rationality
2nd Elan Dad from OOTS
3rd Probably Black from Practical Guide to Evil.
>>46331246
So the ones I like most are the competent ones.
>>46307469
Gotta say, I thought the Vayne, Cid,Venatvillain squad from FF12 was great. They each play off each other in a way that is similar to how a protagonist would play off his supporting characters, and their goals are hard to find actual fault with, even if they often fail to live up to their own lofty ideals and values.
They also eventually succeeded in more or less everything that they set out to do, and set events in motion that had a massive impact on the setting in the extreme long term, even if they weren't around to see it.Not to mention the fact that, when you get right down to it, the secondary villains were actually COMPLETELY right. Vayne gave humanity back it's destiny, but a few dozen generations down the line, lo and behold, humanity has used it's freedom to fuck the world up almost beyond repair, thus proving that the Occuria knew what they were talking about when they said that human history needed to be steered.
>>46311479
20 minutes, anon.
Two-hundred years of gathering power and razing entire countries for twenty simple minutes.
>>46328926
>G-rectum
you best not be shit talkin G Gundam, son
>>46329731
Amen, anon! Definitely one of my all-time favourites.
>>46329731
>normally invincible
...Isn't most of Hellboy showing that Hellboy is just barely above street level? Beyond the whole "fated to blah blah" stuff, his real powers are pretty low tier.
-Indestructable (maybe) right hand, good for holding stuff that'd fuck up his flesh
-Above normal human strength, but not like he can lift tons or anything
-Above normal human toughness
-Immune to fire
And thats about it. He's pretty low tier far as superheros go.
>>46307469
I like villains who are not villainous on their own but when contrasted to their background BUT it turns out they are not as affable as people thought.
Last campaign had a human supremacist organization who took the brotherhood part seriously. They were intelligent, well read, idealistic, had ambition, big plans and bigger grudges and they werent assholes about it. They were the type of guys who would buy you a beer or help an old lady cross the road as long shes a human. And they were planning the genocide of all-non human race completely uncaring about the collateral damage. And when pushed it turned out they are very willing to take risks, accept losses and escalate everything into total war.
In the end the PCs turned on them, ate a huge lie from a fake defector(despite doing the same thing like three times before themselves) and got TPKd so the BBEGs actually won and set up the next campaign.
Pitching an idea
Chaotic neutral multi-billionaire more powerful than most kingdoms with a large private army who is interested in the same treasure/item as the heroes.
Not necessarily evil, but will commit atrocities if it's the most efficient path. Can't fight, but is charismatic, humorous, and very composed/careful while appearing to be reckless and unhinged. Aura modeled on bipolar mania but with less impaired judgement, just a very optimistic and high-energy tycoon. Due to the devotion to efficiency and dealmaking, they're fully willing to work with the heroes if the heroes agree to tremendously unfair terms (which they shouldn't) so they appear as a threat but not a terrifying evil force, they can be reasoned with.
>>46332649
This kind of sounds like Handsome Jack to an extent
>>46328839
elaborate please
>>46331031
>>46331071
>implying the Vault Hunters aren't the villains
All according to plan...
But seriously he may not be the best (arguable) villain, but damn do I ever love his willingness to sacrifice his own (and his son's) humanity to bring humanity together.
Hillary Clinton.
>>46333798
>damn do I ever love his willingness to sacrifice his own (and his son's) humanity to bring humanity together.
Don't you mean to bring his wife back from being trapped inside a giant robot?
>>46333592
The Vault Hunters are pretty unscrupulous, but they generally leave civilians alone. Jack was far, far worse than anything they could do.
The most ethical one was Roland by far. Maya also seemed pretty on the level, at least moreso than Lilith.
Salvadore is Mexican Punisher.
One of my favorites.
