Lean, mean killing machine edition!
>Discuss the viability of the Warcraft Universe as a tabletop RPG setting.
>And be nice
>Previous bread
>>46144055
first for Kael'thas did literally a lot of things wrong, but he was still really cool
>>46167313
Second for yes he did and no he wasn't.
>>46167313
>I WILL TURN YOUR WORLD
>UP
>SIDE
>DOWN
>>46167367
ok
>>46167313
I'm surprised at how much of a failure he was despite being an arcane class. Aren't spellcasters supposed to have high Intellect?
>>46167364
Matter of fact, he was pretty ace in TFT, which is where I think we got to see most of his personality.
He did start out as a puberty ridden teenager's edgy wet dream, but quickly became a man of action who was pretty angry, but never angry enough to become retarded.
>>46167504
it doesn't matter how high your stats are when you're carrying tier tokens
>>46167367
>it would be unfair of me to make you fight all four of my advisers at once, but... fairness was never shown to my people, I'm only returning the favour
>>46167535
Reminder that World of Warcraft has no lore other than "he went crazy so now he's a dungeon boss man"
It's the writing equivalent of programmer art.
>>46167860
Their lore is that after the Sunwell was tainted he turned to Illidan, the demon-hunter he set up to get captured, to be his servant so the blood elves wouldn't become corrupted. And then, lore says Illidan went crazy (even though it's being ret-conned now that Illidan was never crazy) so Kael'thas decided to team up with the Burning Legion, who are already registered as insane (but is also being ret-conned).
It's still the same writing level of an edgy thirteen year-old, but at least there is some lore.
>>46167928
Illidan was still crazy, he was jsut effective at being crazy.
Reminder that the Old Guys are nice fellas.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=cKjUgLrDEbI
FUCK D.E.T.A!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Bus4M3Yr2g
re: anyone play on Wyrmrest Accord? Looking for more folks to RP with.
After playing a bunch of WC3 I want to try to go backa nd mine Vanilla WoW for ideas, should IU try Nostralius?
>>46168214
Nostalrius is a fantastic server, I played there to 60 with absolutely no problems, other than the typical crowding at low levels and ganking once you hit level 50. Despite market saturation I was still able to attain hundreds of gold before level 40.
>>46168300
I was gonna go for Nost PvE, my memories of PvP are all bad.
>>46168407
Then you're a piece of trash, git gud gamer.
>>46168407
You might as well go to PvE regardless, PvP is full of Chinese.
>>46168407
If you roll Horde and want to RP, I'd be down for it. I'm going by the handle Klausner.
>>46167274
So, one of the major aspects of Warcraft has been the attempt to give every faction some goodness at their core, which earned it the label as a "Noblebright Warhammer".
Now that shit went pretty much overboard in some instances (Draenei are so pious and light fearing that they could never commit an act of dubious ethics) and in some instances fucking retarded (Sylvanas' genocide of all life and still not being reprimanded because, ultimately, she's 'one of the good guys')
How would you make the setting more ambiguous? Give it more greyshades on the mortal level without involving corruption, insanity or any other lovely buzzword?
>>46169092
The setting is pretty ambiguous as it is. The only reason the Alliance and Horde have lasted as long as they have is because
>they were smart enough to combine their strength into proper unions whose members prop each other up
>they have a scarily good supply of some of the most powerful individuals in the world (PCs)
Besides, what's good at the core of the Twilight's Hammer or Cult of the Damned? Both of them are honest-to-God apocalypse cults.
>>46167994
>>46169196
I would argue the Cult of the Damned is 'good' in that it fosters equality and access to learning for the empovershed
>>46167274
You'd think Warcraft might make a better wargame. I mean, it started as a videogame build off a wargame's IP which turned into its own setting.
>>46169196
In the W3 handbook I think there was something about the Cult being quite helpful to the peasants in the aftermath of the war ect which is why it grew so quickly. I mean they were using them but they did improve some people's lives.
>>46169625
warcraft magic is too retarded
>>46169583
by killing them and raising them as ghouls.
![16786-interrogator-khan[1].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/WiW5y0Z.jpg "16786-interrogator-khan[1].jpg")
>>46169092
Draenei can be fairly ruthless when backed into a corner, even if it happens very rarely and never to truly grimderp levels. Case in point, this Jack Bauer motherfucker.
>>46169892
Or MU Maladaar, or Akama even before he was broken.
Maraad was pretty dang angry a lot of the time.
>>46169625
Hey, I'd play it.
It's got enough fairly distinct factions to work.
>>46169973
...Is that supposed to be Hillsbrad World PvP?
I can't think of any battlegrounds that looked like that.
>>46170040
It was the cover to one of the TCG sets.
>>46169892
Is it even possible to get that armor anymore?
>>46170087
Still, darker grass, pine trees, ruined scout tower, feels like it's meant to be classic Hillsbrad.
>>46170097
I think you can get nontransmoggable reproductions out in Netherstorm
>>46170097
Yes, but it can't be used for transmog unless you earned the associated rank or whatever back in BC or Wrath or whenever it was discontinued.
That doesn't stop you from just equipping it to stroll around town, though.
Who controls Menethil Harbor?
It doesn't seem like Dwarven architecture, and the name alone suggests a connection to Lordaeron, but it's in the Wetlands.
Was it established by refugees?
>>46170196
I believe Vanilla described it as some form of joint-venture to help cement the alliance, and since it showed up in the Beyond the Dark portal novelization I believe it was a forward outpost against the Horde holdouts in Grim Batol.
For the nearly suicidal humans and dwarves willing to so brazenly camp on the edge of Dragonmaw territory.
Also, does Nostralius keep elementally immune/resistant NPCs?
Because that shit was the WORST part of Vanilla.
>>46170097
Get Rank 8 or higher in Vanilla.
Or the equivalent in Rated BGs or arenas now.
>>46170322
Wetlands was officially Dorf territory with Orcs and dragons squatting where they don't belong.
>>46170196
What I can find says it was established at the tail-end of the Third War as a sea-link between Khaz Modan and the rest of the Alliance. Likely it was established by either Stormwind or Theramore.
There was another harbor there which bit it some time during the Second War, which is where the current one gets its name from.
Not sure if this image is too big for 4chan, but here's this. http://i.imgur.com/CMJJJbx.jpg
>>46170435
Not back during WC2.
Is there some particular server that /tg/ plays on? These threads kinda make me want to play it again.
>>46166368
I get what you mean. I kind of think the WotLK stuff was compromised when they cut out both Azjol-Nerub and Kronos, but the end result is that the portrayal wasn't quite as well thought out as it should have been.
C'Thun gave the impression of a greatly weakened being as near to death as it could be, with his quiet and wavering voice, yet one that was still overwhelmingly powerful by our standards. I loved how he communicated entirely through statements of fact, which I felt fit a telepathic alien god perfectly. While insanity and corruption were part of what he did, that was also part of what every villainous faction did.
The impression that I got from the Old Gods back then was that subtle influences and whispers were all they could manage in their imprisoned and weakened states, and that they wouldn't even bother with that shit if they were free to act as they desired.
Yogg-Saron kind of hammed it up with the maximum "lolcrazies" and boasting, just throwing all subtlety out the fucking window. He's pretty fun, but he struck me as more of a cartoon villain than an ancient and malignant cosmic deity. Cataclysm stripped away a lot of their accomplishments by retconning it so the Titans built Ahn'Qiraj, the Anubisaths, and Obsidian Destroyers that were formerly Qiraji inventions, and Pandaria blew apart the whole deathless thing they had going on, having Y'Shaarj slain by a Keeper.
>Between the two developed versions of the Old Gods, I prefer the new stuff from Chronicles a lot more than Twilight of the World stuff from post-Vanilla WoW
I actually agree. After so much of their identity had been simplified to being little more than corrupters, it makes sense that they exist to assimilate things and remake them in the image of the void. While it's now clear that they never stood a chance against the Titans, it's now impressive that they could put up a good fight despite how grossly outmatched they were.
>>46167535
>Matter of fact, he was pretty ace in TFT, which is where I think we got to see most of his personality.
Kael'Thas was my favorite elf. I still dream of the day when we can pin all of his actions past Warcraft 3 on some random Dreadlord like Tichondrius and bring the real one back.
>>46170489
god cataclysm is ugly
>>46170683
It's not all THAT different from vanilla other than the flooded 1kneedles, the flooded Tanaris coast, and the lava fissure.
It's mostly ugly because all the trees are turned off aside from Nordrasil, one tree further down Hyjal, and that one Dream Tree at the base of Hyjal in Ashenvale.
>>46170802
Splitting Barrens chat was a crime.
>>46170672
He was rejected by Jaina so hard that Arthas, after at least 5 years, still use the fact to gloat him.
hashtag burn.
>>46170893
I like how Jaina turned down everyone that wasn't a human.
>>46170839
Right under Mankrik's wife!
(Who should have been brought back as a DK for shits and giggles, some of the Quilboar DID ally with the scourge after all!)
Also she was one of the first things I *Found* in the barrens as a scared shitless alliance player trying to run from stonetalon to Rachet on a horde-skewed PvP server.
>>46169751
Nah, Cult members got to be more independant undeads like mages and (rarely) liches
Only the washouts turned into ghouls or zombies
>>46170935
>be Alliance warlock
>have to get to Barrens
>get the choice of running up the coast of Dustwallow Marsh and hoping you don't run into a high-level fishing OR surviving the Stranglethorn gauntlet
>>46170489
WC2 it was part of Grim Batol
>>46170489
Ugh, you can just see how much of the landscape was shaped by game mechanics
I wish we would get a proper, official topographic map of Azeroth
>>46170893
Justin gross was so fucking good as arthas.
>dat smug voice
>>46171036
There's a Menethil Harmour mentioned in the book version of BtDP.
>>46171055
A shame Blizzard didn't want to give him the raise he demanded.
THough i'm not sure his sardonic Arthas would really fit the full blown Lich king super well.
>>46170489
>dat theramore
Lei Shen was such a fucking badass.
>>46171161
RIP.
>>46171161
bet she was some legion spy!
What can I do for you?
>>46171628
BLOOD AND THUNDER!
>>46170645
>Yogg-Saron kind of hammed it up with the maximum "lolcrazies" and boasting, just throwing all subtlety out the fucking window. He's pretty fun, but he struck me as more of a cartoon villain than an ancient and malignant cosmic deity.
Same with the Lich king. Until wrath, they hyped him up as something beyond mere mortality, and a fusion of Arthas and gul'dan with none of their weaknesses.
But no, he's just Art has with a shred of humanity. And if you didn't play a human paladin/priest/death knight, the storyline didn't really reach out to you.
>>46171713
He's mostly Soulless Arthas that ate Ner'zhul and is trying to cut off any access his old soul has to his body (Without giving up Frostmourne where said soul actually resides)
>>46171736
So, this was just confirmed to be N'Zoth. Now I'm wondering what the cut off bits look like.
>>46171713
What really, REALLY pissed me off was that the players fought against the Lich King when lore had clearly set him up as immortal; even the old handbooks clearly state the Lich King is immortal. If it had been the players fighting hordes of super-powerful liches or something while Tirion and the Lich King battled it out in a massive sword battle using paladin and death knight abilities, and if Terenas' final speech had been a copy of what all the Argent Dawn members in the house that have to be executed in the DK starting zone said rather than "There must always be... A Lich King!", with it being shown that the Lich King was clearly killed by the Light in a miracle rather than players just wailing on him, it might have been a good send-off.
Oh, and let's not forget, "Tirion! Tell no one what has happened here!"
"WE MUST BUILD A STATUE"
>>46171713
I remember one of the flagship questlines in Icecrown about finding Arthas's heart and finding a way to rid yourself of its influence all while going through various events in his past (like Arthas vs. Illidan).
>>46169092
Would it be better then to have it set up with both sides doing some pretty fucked up shit? I mean for example the Tauren, everyone can agree they are pretty good bros and such, but what if they act like the white man to their native american image? IE the quilboar infestation and gnoll poachers. The quilboar for the most part were fine with doing a few raids, the Tauren would raid back and everything is fine more or less, a status quo of sorts. However as a result of Cata the Quilboar have no land to live on since its a lake and the Tauren are unwilling to let green pastures be turned into thorny brambles so they slaughter them to the last or drive them out of Mulgore it self.
As for the gnolls, actually a better question do those count as animals or as people with their own culture and racial identity? Better yet same question for all the humanoid entities out there that aren't a part of the Blue/Red factions. They just seem there to be murdered for fodder or driven off. Looking at the way those minor races are treated, this got rather dark all of a sudden.
>>46171814
The entire presence of Tirion, the GREATEST LIVING PALADIN OF OUR AGE, kinda cheapens the whole encounter. The players fight their way up the Icecrown Citadel and make it to the Frozen Throne itself. Tirion charges Arthas, Arthas freezes Tirion and then challenges the players. Then Arthas pulls his trump card: he slays the entire raid in a single blow and lays out his plan to raise the world's strongest heroes as the Scourge's mightiest champions, rendering the Scourge unstoppable.
AND WOULDN'T YOU KNOW IT?
TIRION FUCKING FORDRING INCANTS FOR THE LIGHT, BREAKS THE ICE PRISON AND SHATTERS FROSTMOURNE IN A SINGLE BLOW WITH THE ASHBRINGER.
THE ENTIRE FIGHT WAS FOR NOTHING.
The problem with making the PCs as important as they are is that if you're going to make them big damn heroes, you can't leave them out of the action or cheapen their importance. Everything Tirion does invalidates the players. Why bother, at that point?
>>46171751
And that's lame compared to the godlike being we heard in Naxxramas 40.
Yes basically Cobra Commander throughout Northrend. Couldn't take him seriously at all.
>>46171899
In the taurens' defense, quillboars are cunts.
>>46171713
Honestly, with the setup at the end of TFT, I was expecting Arthas to lurk around Icecrown for a generation or two doing mysterious plotting and shit before showing up, years down the road. Like, Thrall and Jaina and maybe even the elves like Tyrande, all those veterans of the Third War-- they should all have been dead of old age before Arthas comes back in a meaningful way.
And when he comes back, he should be almost unrecognisable, and he shouldn't even show up personally until, like, the third act, when he makes a big deal by fucking things up EVEN FURTHER than whatever his underlings have been doing in the first two acts to warrant an a new storyline in the first place.
>>46171927
The players working WITH Tirion cheapens the experience. The players being responsible for keeping the undead hordes off of Tirion so he can focus all of his training and practice in his near old-age against a walking god of death gives them a grave (buh-dum-tss) responsibility, because if they fail, then Tirion fails. The whole point of the Argent Tournament was to find the strongest fighters to work with Tirion so he could drive Ashbringer, a forged embodiment of Light, into the Lich King and finally end it all.
>>46171957
Fair, but the end result is the same, they try to share the land the other side doesn't want to or wants more due to various reasons and the Tauren being dictactors of the land useage still tell them no. Then when the other races there through a fit they send the Players in to kill everything to send a message; You don't listen you die.
After that they built THE WALL, to make Mul'Gore great again and now even if they minor races wanted to leave they wouldn't be able to without being shot,impaled or trampled over by the guards there.
>>46170929
if you think about it
its really creepy for a guy who is hundred of years old to hit on a 18 year old girl.
>>46171959
I always found it weird that Arthas, a trained military leader, thought it was a good idea to not establish any fortifications on the southern coasts of Northrend before the raid on New Avalon when he KNEW it was going to finally motivate the Scarlet Crusade and the Argent Dawn to come to him.
"I was pretending to suck the whole time to trick you!" is a shit excuse.
>>46172014
But then that's not the players personally getting their hands on Arthas, and if there's one thing players hate, it's a bait-n-switch boss. You spend the entire expansion playing up the Lich King as the god of death he is, you fight your way to the top of ICC, and then the finale of the entire expansion is Tirion shouting "Keep the undead off me! Arthas is MINE." That, in my opinion, would be far worse than what players actually got.
>>46172062
Hey, it almost worked if Tirion didn't pull his deus ex machina.
>>46172014
See, this is another problem with the mmo format; you can't actually write around the pcs in any kind of effective manner. If this had been an rts or even an arpg, Tirion Fordring WOULD HAVE BEEN the player character, and no one would have complained about him killing the Lich King, because it would be the player making him do it.
>>46171899
The Quillboar have been murder-hoboing it up since Vanilla WoW. Random tents in their settlements are very clearly made from the skinned faces of either humans or centaur, and they've thrown in with the Scourge to try and muster up some extra power. They even ditched their old god for a new one.
>>46171814
>>46171927
>AND WOULDN'T YOU KNOW IT?
>TIRION FUCKING FORDRING INCANTS FOR THE LIGHT, BREAKS THE ICE PRISON AND SHATTERS FROSTMOURNE IN A SINGLE BLOW WITH THE ASHBRINGER.
>THE ENTIRE FIGHT WAS FOR NOTHING.
No, it wasn't the players bought time and wakened the Lich King's defenses, ALLOWING him to break Frostmourne
And players helped Tirion get where he was.
>>46171814
>Oh, and let's not forget, "Tirion! Tell no one what has happened here!"
>"WE MUST BUILD A STATUE"
The statue implied Tirion and the raid slew Arthas and saved the world. Players being able to see the truth by clicking on it is just gameplay mechanics.
>>46172036
>After that they built THE WALL, to make Mul'Gore great again and now even if they minor races wanted to leave they wouldn't be able to without being shot,impaled or trampled over by the guards there.
They CAN exit through the mountains that are just impassible to players in-game and full armies lore-wise, or surrender and be escorted out
Quilboar are almost all literally insane because of Agamaggan's death. And the Tauren know this and regret it, one of them is super hyped in Cata when he detects that Agamaggan's spirit has partially reformed because it leaves a hope that the Tauren can make peace with non-crazy quilboar at some point.
>>46172100
The Ashbringer has been hyped since Vanilla, not quite as long as RoC but long enough that it was pretty well built up.
>>46171713
Yeah. I think Vanilla was actually very good with subtlety even if there wasn't too much story. TBC just kind of failed in its storytelling, instituting major retcons and ruining several characters before ending with some manga characters in the Sunwell.
WotLK's problem is that while it had more story focus, that story was a bit too comic-book or cartoon in style. There really wasn't much subtlety. Every expansion pack after that continued the trend, especially with the forced faction war that only made sense if everyone was a bunch of dumb shits.
>>46167274
warcraft is pretty much perfect for RPG
lore discussion, who should die in the next expansion?
A. Jaina
B. Sylvanas
C. Thrall
D. Vol'jin
E. Varian
F. Any of the dwarf leaders
G. At least 2 dragon aspects
H. Anduin
I. Any pandaren leader
and why?
I say Jaina, someone important needs to die.
>>46172161
>I say Jaina, someone important needs to die.
No, no they don't.
We don't need this constant upping of the stakes every fucking expansion.
And it's confirmed we're losing Varian and one Dragon aspect at least.
>>46172161
Thrall, so they'll stop dragging him through the 'GO'EL' themed mudpit.
>>46172161
>E. Varian
He's already dying.
>>46172109
Wrath-era Tirion is a Warcraft 3 hero character, yes. If Wrath of the Lich King were treated like the Warcraft RTS, this would've been Tirion's campaign, and he would've personally whooped Arthas in the final battle. The PCs, by comparison, are high/top-tier mercenaries, which is a shade beneath the hero character. That's why Tirion was so huge and was the focus of the ICC raid: this was Tirion's victory. The players just helped.
>>46172161
K. All of the Above, substituting 'All' for 'Any" in I.
And then the final patch has the survivors (The PCs) use the Caverns of Time to go back in Time to Vanilla 2.0 to Do Things Right This Time
>>46172161
All of them
Just kill them all and start over
>>46172198
>We don't need this constant upping of the stakes every fucking expansion.
Of course we do. Can't wait until we get the chance to kill Sargeras and the Void Lords!
>>46172161
Neither Jackie Chan holding a baby nor Jackie Chan who wants no trouble would kill the other, so this fight to the death thing is going to be real anticlimactic.
>>46168214
not worth. Nost is shit for north american players, if you roll a melee character you'll get raped in pvp by delay and rubber banding, the questing is shit because of the amount of players on it and half the people don't even speak english. the only reason you should even consider trying is because its free and you can't really argue with free. playing on nost has made me realize how much better wow has actually gotten over the years. the only people that think nost is better than retail are the same people who still play n64 games and think they're better than ps4/xbox1
>>46172229
Urgh. How much of a time skip do you think we'd need to get the story to a tolerable point?
>>46170929
I thought she wanted arthas but he had more important shit to do like take over the world. then she married kalecgos for his social status.
>>46172161
>B. Sylvanas
Just so I can hear the fanboys despair.
>>46172129
Again that is true, but just trying to add in my two cents for showing shades of grey here into the setting. I mean all trolls used to be cannibles and its only due to the Darkspear's NEEDING a place to stay that they gave up on the canniblism.
As for the Scourge thing, thought that was about the two 'major' tribes that lived down south in the barrens? Better question I have is when would we see a civilization based about the Boar God Aggramon who comes back to make the quilboar great again?
>>46172252
Nost PvE only.
I just want to relive some of the more down-to-earth questlines of Vanilla even if they are fucking frustrating travel-round-the-world crap.
>>46172272
Only a time skip back.
>>46172315
>its only due to the Darkspear's NEEDING a place to stay that they gave up on the canniblism
I thought the Darkspears were naturally chill.
>>46172272
I honestly think Sargeras has to die before it can get interesting again, mostly just because all of the political bickering / posturing + orc v humans aspect of the previous games are just so overshadowed by the BBEG who can fuck everything up basically whenever he decides to
>>46170802
>flooded Tanaris
>flooded Thousand Needels
>split barrens, punctuated with green and lava fissures
>flooded durator
>Ashenvale Volcano
>everything about Azshara
>desolace greenery
it's pretty damn bad. It breaks each zones palette and turns it into a busy mess
>>46172303
this would be acceptable, the more popular a character gets the funnier it is when they die
>>46172353
They are pretty naturally chill, but they're still a culture founded on generations of pretty extreme superstition (arguably justified superstition since Loa are actually a thing, but still).
They'd have gone on practicing cannibalism if the orcs weren't able to actually pressure them.
>>46172390
>everything about Azshara
That one you can blame on the goblins terraforming the entire zone.
>>46172440
its only cannibalism if they eat other trolls. did they eat other trolls? do any trolls eat other trolls?
>>46172488
'Cannibalism' in WoW is defined as 'sapient races eating other sapient races,' but yes. Trolls practice ritual cannibalism on rival tribes just as much as they do on intruders or outsiders.
So who's the best warrior in Warcraft and why is it Thalorien Dawnseeker?
Skilled swordsman
Wields a legendary blade
Died defending his homeland so others could escape
Just how I like my warriors, simple yet badass.
I still wish Blizzard had used their old Hobgoblin art instead of acid sweating ogres with big noses and even smaller brains.
>>46172315
Darkspears already generally shunned cannibalism by the time they got kicked out of Stranglethorn for being lame.
THey probably had a little ritual cannibalism, but overall it was uncommon.
>>46172390
A few small interruptions in the Palette seemed fine to me, expanding the Barrens Oases as fine, not a huge fan of the Lava scar, I'm STILL divided in my feelings on
>>46172488
>its only cannibalism if they eat other trolls. did they eat other trolls? do any trolls eat other trolls?
They probably had "Honorable Cannibalism" at funerals and shit, but rarely encountered enemy trolls after getting forced north from Stranglethorn. And yes, trolls in general eat each other all the damn times.
>>46172621
If your answer is anyone but Lothar your opinion is irrelevant.
>>46172650
MOre art.
>>46172672
A warrior so badass even Paladins looked up to him.
>>46172272
A generation. Maybe two, if Legion really fucks things up.
>>46172621
>not General Lordrain
>>46172799
>not Ga'nar
hes at least the greatest orc.
>>46172866
who
>>46172866
So great he got captured and forced to scoop up shit.
>>46172930
>>46172941
LOK TAR
>>46172672
maybe his favourite is doomhammer :^^)
>>46172621
I like Bladefist.
>>46173107
Bladefist was a lot cooler in WC2, when he had a snazzy metal eyepatch and a sickle hand instead of a kind of jagged looking scimitar thing.
And am I remembering wrong, or did they change his name from Korgath to Kargath?
>>46173052
STRENGTH AND HONOR
>>46173099
Reminder that he had to trap and ambush lothar before he even could fight him
>>46172866
my nigga
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j8kEAtkq_fc
>>46167274
I don't know anymore. The more lore I read from Warcraft 3 onward the more I end up disliking the series entirely. The orcs became DINDUNUFFINS/NOBLE SAVAGES, humans were racist cucks who chased off a lot of potential allies. The former mindless undead who regained their will ended up allying with the orcs. You know the fuckers who burned down Stormwind back in WC1. Did Lordaeron just sort of forget about what happened in Warcraft 2 and say "OH WELL LETS JOIN OUR MORTAL ENEMIES"
It looks like Metzen wanted his characters to be 3 dimensional and to give them more than THIS GUY IS GOOD THIS GUY IS EVIL sorts of personalities but this corruption bullshit just makes it sound really stupid.
He also loves this WE MUST WORK AGAINST A COMMON ENEMY theme but, it happens so fucking often at this point it looks like in WoW that the alliance and horde should be used to each other by now. At this point old game mechanics aside it looks like you should be a free lance adventurer not bound to any side since everyone ends up playing nice anyway.
I feel like I'd rip out most of the lore and start at either middle/end of WC1 or Middle/end of WC2 and build from there.
Don't even get me started on things like THE CURSE OF FLESH or mecha gnomes.
>>46173273
THat "Pack of Bloodlusted Ogres" thing has been retconned back and forth a few times.
In WC2 it was a straight ambush. In Lord of the Clans it was mentioned as a fair duel that could have gone either way but Orgrim won by the skin of his tusks.
In the Tides of Darkness Novelization Orgrim and Lothar fought relatively fairly with each other but Lothar had to fight more Orcs etc on the way to Orgrim than Orgrim had to fight humans on the way to Lothar.
(Orgrim also smashed some of his own people out of the way in his haste to get to that fight.)
>>46173273
yes I know, hence my :^)
![latest[1].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/CsaPlmY.jpg "latest[1].jpg")
>>46172161
>jackie chan holding a baby vs lothar holding a baby
>on a battlefield that is also full of discarded chairs and ladders
>lothar is hallucinating and thinks jackie is an orc
>jackie is told that if he doesnt win the fight he will be paired with a black sidekick for the rest of eternity
>>46173381
>Curse of Flesh
Hey now that at least was rather cool as a bad guys device on the cosmic scale, by giving the titan's creations free will and the ability to die easier, the old gods made the Titan's servants much more mallable and breakable. So in a way you could say that it's a new spin on MUH FREE WILL IS SACRED, when instead its actually being used as a subversive ploy by the old gods to wittle away at their cells.
>>46173381
The only problem with the Mechagnomes is the name.
A little on the nose, you know?
>>46173381
nah you are just autistic.
The explanations were rather good at that time, and the alliance of convenience was a cool narrative.
>>46173515
>last line
>>46172214
No the NPCs were made huge so people will stop doing the "Block the npc with your HUGE mount" bullshit in PVP servers.
It's funny, every time I see the name Trollbane, I automatically picture, like, big hairy scandinavian trolls. I have to keep reminding myself what Warcraft trolls actually look like, even though in every other context I picture them no problem. Trolls in Orgrimmar-- yup, I know what that looks like. Troll in the Echo Islands, yeah, sure I can see that. Trolls in Northrend, sure, I gotcha. Trollbane? Fuck, how hardcore does a guy have to be to get called the bane of those huge, hairy, scandinavian motherfuckers?
>>46173860
The Trollbanes were supposedly all warrior kings and Bad-asses.
except that loser who turned into a forsaken.
>>46173860
Forest trolls are pretty fucking scary.
>>46173885
>except that loser who had the misfortune to exist in WoW
>>46174698
Daneth is also in WoW and he retain his badass status.
>>46174710
yeah but he was originally in a good game
How strong is King Rastakhan, anyway?
>>46172440
Meanwhile the forsaken are eating everybody and their dog and nobody gives a single fuck.
>>46175259
It's strange how the only person who actually gave any fucks was Garrosh.
>>46174710
yes, but blizzard has forgotten he exists. And we pray that they never remember
>tfw when you realize what the broken ones' tents are made of
>>46170645
Being a big fan of Lovecraft I like the Old Gods, but it feels that they and the Void Lords are stealing the spotlight from the Burning Legion, who I'd still consider THE Big Bad of the setting.
>>46173381
The sentiment is nothing new. During Vanilla development we already thought we'd have the chance to team up cross-faction.
>>46176595
they should have expanded more on Harbinger Skyriss and characters like him in later expansions instead of skipping right to "the Legion is just trying to stop the Older Gods"
>>46176619
It gets even sillier now where you can have 2 people be member of the SAME PALADIN ORDER and be unable to team up due to horde/alliance issues.
>>46176595
>but it feels that they and the Void Lords are stealing the spotlight from the Burning Legion,
Reading chronicles, I don't really feel that the Voids Lords are particularly worse than the Legion. If either one wins, it's going to suck for us big time. The VL are really just background material to explain the OGs and the Legion.
Personally, Chronicles (and WoD) actually felt like they were trying to make the legion a threat again, because ever since TBC they've felt like chumps compared to the Old Gods/Void stuff.
>>46172161
>warcraft is pretty much perfect for RPG
it is, but boy, WoW is shit if you want to actually roleplay
>>46177323
Tbf it's an mmo so anything you fight within the game will feel like a chump a due to the nature of the games limitations.
>>46177380
No, it's not just that. During Warcraft 3 and Vanilla, the legion really were the biggest bad guys around. The Old Gods were a footnote in the Titan history, while the legion were a threat to the entire universe (well, the titan shaped portion of it anyway). Some of the most dangerous mobs in WoW were little more than left overs of the legion invasion, whereas we BTFO an actual old god (albeit a weakened one). TBC-Cata really start playing up the Old Gods though, and the lore changed to present them as a much greater threat than the legion.
The recent stuff has returned the legion to their place on the pedestal
>>46175259
They probably have the same approach as London police has towards Danes drinking publicly. Ignoring it because they can't stop them anyway.
>>46175259
the forsaken is the faction with the biggest plot armor I saw in the previous decade, all medias counting
>>46177657
How exactly?
Everything they do is a massive shit show.
>>46177707
they are litterally invincible and no one single living person cares about their wrongdoings
>>46177741
They got rekt by furries.
>>46177785
>rekt
Until the whole hostage situation debacle, anyway.
>>46177785
and then they took back Silverpine, destroyed the most elite Legion of the Alliance and poisonned Gilneas to doom
Progress on that AU TBC campaign continues. It's gone from 'What if you teamed up with Illidan?' to having a lot of little details changed.
>>46177901
>destroyed the most elite Legion of the Alliance
>7th Legion
>Survived Hyjal, Silithus, and motherfucking Northrend
>Died like bitches to a two-bit Lich King wannabe and her spooky friends
Seriously? I thought they just took heavy losses. Fucking hell. And now Varian is buddies with Sylvanas in Legion. This is just plain silly.
Well, at least paladins now have a base in the Plaguelands. Perfect for Undersiege 2: Purgation Boogaloo.
>>46178416
The Forsaken destroyed the 7th Legion's army sent to Gilneas and Garrosh destroyed the 7th Legion's army and fleet sent to Theramore. RIP
>>46178512
>mfw some old friends and I used to RP as 7th Legion grunts
This almost makes me angry enough to reactivate, move to a PvP server, and embark on a one-man crusade.
>>46178603
well at least the Kor'kron guard was whiped out
>>46178416
>>46178512
>>46178603
I believe the 7th Legion was merely forced to retreat from Silverpine/Gilneas.
They did take even heavier losses in Theramore. (Like the manabomb permanently shifting General Marcus Johnathan into his Steamy Romance Novel personality to wander the world with partial amnesia.)
>>46177323
>>46177439
It always seemed a bit weird that despite being called "The Burning Crusade", the Legion didn't really have a major role compared to Illidan and his friends, until the very end when old KJ tries popping out of the Sunwell and gets beaten back down. Sure, they were around, but were mostly random quest fodder and a footnote in the lore.
Finally getting a proper Legion-themed expansion almost makes me want to consider resubbing. I always did like them. Sure, they never were very nuanced or original, but an army of demons on a crusade to set the universe aflame is pretty metal. "In Legion's fire, this world shall burn", and so on.
>>46179013
The legion was the main villain of a lot of BC, I don't recall any loyal illidari in the north two zones.
>>46179055
outside of Hellfire, Zangarmarsh and dungeons there wasn't a lot of Illidari because the Legion WAS invading to get him
>>46179092
you're forgetting about Shadowmoon valley bub
Iit's like Illidari Central
>>46179101
And even SMV had two or three legion Forgecamps.
>>46179101
Shadowmoon was halfway split between the Illidari and the Legion, There were Illidari settlements but the Legion was moving in in enough force to lay siege to the Black Temple and force the loyalists to the outskirts of SMV
>>46178416
SILVER HAND CRUSADE FOR LORDAERONNEVER EVER DUE TO THE STATUS QUO DEMANDS OF AN MMO'S PLOT
>>46179667
>NEVER EVER
All you need to do is convince a shitload of paladin players to join your cause, battle-brother. Remember the Hakkar plague, Scourge invasion event, and the living bomb shenanigans of old? The devs aren't the only ones capable of making history in these games.
>>46179739
Too bad all this cross realm + stronghold shit has caused a super insular community in servers
>>46179667
But the hand joined up with the Argent, if they attack the Forsaken, that's breaking their neutral ties.
>>46179013
i remember back when the name of the expansion was first discovered by fans in vanilla. most fan sites were convinced that it was referring to the Scarlet Crusade and that they would launch some large invasion fleet against northrend and the lich king. seeing as naxx was the latest raid, and the scarlets were portrayed as still being a powerful faction it made a lot of sense. outland really came out of nowhere, there's nothing even hinting at the portal being re-opened anywhere in vanilla.
>>46179883
>that's breaking their neutral ties
And post-Cataclysm Sylvanas has been running death camps, committing mass necromancy via val'kyr, and IIRC, developing plagues. Stuff like that should be setting off alarms in the heads of all but the most deluded Argents.
>>46175577
he is gonna be in the redone questline for warrior loot
>>46180113
Source? I know DKs re-kill his Forsaken brother.
>>46180159
blizzard said that they were redoing the warrior legendary item and making it faction specific. Horde gets SF Alliance gets Fucking trollbane
>>46180204
Horde gets what?
And which spec's Artifact are you talking about?
A link would also be ideal.
>>46180204
>>46180278
Oh, they're giving us those two as allies/followers.
Not their weapons.
http://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/1965604-New-Legion-Warrior-Artifact-Questline?p=39347425
Also giving Varok his brother's Survivor's guilt storyline seems sorta cheap.
>>46179914
its because khadgar is a pretty shit wizard
>>46175760
>>46177485
they skin their enemies and keep their skulls as trophies while sewing huts out of their hides
I really loved the Arrakoa storyline in WoD. The whole redemption of a race formerly destined for damnation and literally being their saviors was great. I wish they had tied them into the final raid by leading them against HFC. Skyteach at least should've been a raid.
>>46167364
>you will never see Jaina's centerfold in Dalaran Magical Journal
why even live?
>>46180405
There's nothing to indicate those hides came from humanoids at all.
Gnoll tents on the other hand have human faces on them.
War - Nazgrim
Conquest - Trollbane
Famine - ???
Death - ???
Sound right?
>>46179883
>alliance are bitch fuckboi appeasers and the horde get to do whatever they want to whoever they want
>alliance just keeps apologizing for the horde genocide campaigns
>>46180648
Alliance literally sieged the Horde capital and dethroned the war chief.
>>46180648
Blizzard is obsessed with the Lawful Stupid alignment for the alliance, yet complains how hard it is to write for them.
Ether way, the fans hate the writing.
>>46180688
They assisted the Horde rebellion instead of taking back land they lost or decapitating certain Horde kingdoms like any other commander with a brain has historically done during a Civil War.
Lets also not forget the culmination of Alliance questing was a robot spy cat in that patch.
>>46179055
>>46179092
Maybe it's just me, but while the Legion had a presence in most zones, for most part they didn't really feel like doing much and pretty much none of the dungeons and raids(before Sunwell was added) had much to do with them.
Here's my impression of TBC, from what I remember from way back when it came out (I played Horde, so I can't comment on the questlines that were different for Alliance):
Hellfire:
>Get through the Dark Portal. Holy Shit, the Legion is invading!
>Fly to the local quest hub, bomb some demons, do random quest, kill a whole bunch of Illidari fel orcs, get stomped by a giant suprisingly stealthy Legion robot.
>Dungeon (and raid at higher level) featuring more fel orcs and a captured pitlord.
Zangramarsh:
>Mushrooms everywhere, cool. Help some druids do stuff, find out some Illidari nagas are draining the swamp for...reasons? Kill nagas.
>Befriend bunch of mushroom people, get enough rep to buy a cute little sporebat pet.
>Dungeon (and raid) featuring fighting more naga, and also some mushroom-based wildlife.
>Legion not present? Or I'm forgetting something.
Nagrand:
>Help Garrosh get out of his depression. Regret doing that a few expansions down the line.
>Kill a bunch of ogres.
>Help that one dwarf murder thousands of animals.
>Big crystal mountian turns out to be spaceship, learn about the connection between Naaru and the Void (how does that work now when the Void has been retconned into the Ultimate Evil?)
>Oh yeah, Legion hanging out on one edge of the zone. Help this demonhunter dude kill them. More bombing of demons occurs (they must've really liked that quest cause you repeat it pretty much every zone Legion shows up).
>>46180991
Vashj says that she's draining the marsh so that the naga will control the majority of water on Outland (which is largely desert ofc.) It's not a particularly complex scheme, but it is pretty evil
>>46180991
I feel like they got overwhelmed by their own plot
>oh no legion is invading
>but wait were betraying illidan
>but shit how do we do this in an mmo
>everyone ends up sitting there waiting for the mmo catalyst aka the player
>>46180991
>Legion not present? Or I'm forgetting something.
Zangarmarsh is controlled (sort of) by the nagas from the reservoir. They were not allied with the legion.
>More bombing of demons occurs (they must've really liked that quest cause you repeat it pretty much every zone Legion shows up).
It was a nice change of pace from quests in vanilla. WotLK expanded on this and added vehicular combat.
>>46180991
Nagrand:
>Kill arakkoa. Dark Crystal reference is nice.
>Investigate blood elfs (who are actually working for the Legion, but you don't know that yet) blowing up some place with a manabomb, then blow them up.
>Kill some ghosts and skeletons in the big scorched area around Auchindoun.
>Dungeons fetaure killing evil draenei, some warlocks trying to bind some big elemental...thing, and some demons. Seemed kind of unconnected to anything, except the Naaru/Void thing in one of the dungeons.
Blade's Edge:
>Um, there's orges, I quess? And Legion had a few camps as well. Help Rexxar get in touch with his family or something.
>This zone is boring, I spent very little time here, and can't really remember much. Lots of dragons being impaled on sharp stones, though.
>Raid features killing some orges and a bigger, uglier ogre-thing.
Netherstorm:
>Help gnomes build a rocket. Also, turns out blood elves betrayed Illidan and serve the Legion.
>Lots of questlines involving the blood elves and the Legion, actually.
>Investigate a city that got blown up by another manabomb.
>Do random quests for the ethereals, including killing a Void Lord (aren't those the new BBEG?).
>Really, this zone was pretty cool, although kind of far from normal fantasy stuff.
>Dungeons feature going into the wings of Tempest Keep (greenhouse, robot place and prison), and killing stuff for loot. Raid features killing Kael'thas and his minions.
Shadowmoon Vallye:
>Legion is actually doing shit instead of sitting int he forge camps getting bombed, namely fighting againt Illidan.
>Fight againt the Legion some, but mostly fight against Illidan. Kill naga, kill blood elves, pretend to be on Illidan's side for a sweet dragon mount.
>Also do questline about fixing some mess Gul'dan made, and there's some guy on a farm who tells you to kill pigs and shit?
>Raid features killing Illidan for loot. Kind of feel sorry for the guy. We spent most of the zone messing up his shit despite sharing a common enemy.
>>46180991
At least one of the Auchindoun wings was legion-allied.
And once Manaroth started to get free from the Illidari he counted as Legion in my mind.
And all of Tempest keep plus most of Netherstorm's questing areas were legion-allied.
There were a ton of legion invasion points in Blades' Edge, even if the main focus was Ogres and dragons.
>>46181204
>At least one of the Auchindoun wings was legion-allied.
the Shadow Lab was run by the remnants of Gul'dan's Shadow Council that survived on Outland and rejoined the Legion
>>46181193
>Ok, Illidan's dead, expansion done (aside for that oen time we went back to Azeroth to kill and loot stuff in Karazahn; I liked that raid but it kind of seemed unconnected to anything).
>Oh wait, the Legion remembered the expansion is namade after them and tries invading Azeroth with help of Kael'thas (apparently us killing him was just a setback or something?).
>Go to Sunwell Plateure, do a lot of daily quests to build up stuff, kill demons and blood elves.
>Go on a raid to the Sunwell, bash Kil'jaeden oon the head as he tries to craw out of the Sunwell. Alos featuring hot demon chicks and a Naaru turned into bigass voidwalker.
>Some character from a manga or something reignites sunwell, resolving the whole "blood elves have to use fel magic to replace sunwell" plotline. This is hardly referenced since, and Silvermoon is covered with glowing green demon-crystals to this day.
>Ok, now we're done!
>>46181286
I don't think Silvermoon will ever get out of its TBC bubble.
>>46181651
thank goodness.
>>46177907
I'm suffering a wealth of ideas that I'll likely never get to do anything with, because it would take years.Like making Sylvanas take Arthas' place instead of Bolvar, so she could work to free more undead from the Scourge. At least the ones that won't go on a killing spree if not kept on a leash. Basically solving the current 'dying out' problem from the exact OPPOSITE direction Sylvanas has been taking.
It would be nice to have a banshee queen that isn't batshit crazy.
>>46181651
Not that anyone ever visits the place, unless they rolled a belf. Hell, I think the last time I heard of a raid on Silvermoon was six years ago.
>>46181689
It's kind of weird that you still have those bigass statues of Kael'thas around the place and NPCs talking about how Kael'thas will lead them to the promiced land in Outland, after we've killed the guy twice and he led the motherfucking Burning Legion to invade right on ther backyard. And nobody seems to react in any way to the fact that they now have the Sunwell back and don't need to have those fel crystals radiating corruptive magaic all over the place (except the paladins, since they no longer have the Naaru chained up in the basement. Really, I'm suprised they bothered to remove it).
>>46181758
I visited it once to fly to Quel'danas and run Magister's Terrace for transmog supplies, but then I realized it's easier to port from Shattrath
>>46179919
Don't forget her own gulag.
>>46181774
The big arcane guardians actually switched dialog. They say ERROR and state that Lo'thremar is going to lead them. Other than that, stuck in their great pilgrimage to Outland.
>>46181651
>You will never see Silvermoon restored to its rightful glory and that ridiculous blight band removed from elflands
>>46181890
If we did, then all the undead quest mobs would be replaced with forest trolls.
>>46181921
I don't see a downside here
>>46181921
But the great troll uprising already passed. Who else can the elves kill, humans trying to claim their land?
>>46181651
Its due to game mechanics.
Silvermoon and Exodar were built around no one being able to fly. They have to rebuild a lot of the zones to make it a bug/glitch free experience.
>>46181995
Think they're too lazy to fix all of the giant missing pieces of the city. And the Exodar can fly now, but the Alliance doesn't need another flying magic city that can rain death upon the Horde.
>>46181890
Didn't they say the Dead Scar was practically permanent?
>>46182056
Can it? I thought it was permanently lodged too far into the earth to pull it out, so the draenei said "fuck it, let's colonize it."
So here's a question: according to the new lore, the planet is a baby titan that at some point will unfold into a mountainous, sea-covered humanoid.
If that's the case, then what are leylines? The baby titan's veins? It's nerves?
>>46182383
>what are leylines? The baby titan's veins?
Makes sense. Leylines are how magic flows through the world, so I'm not surprised it would be likened to blood vessels.
>>46181948
If the internet has taught me anything, it's that there are always more trolls.
>>46182212
There's a quest chain to test a possible way of fixing it. The quest makes it clear that THAT NPC's method won't work, but the NPC's teacher says not to be discouraged, because there may be other ways.
So it's currently up in the air. It might be fixable, but they haven't figured out how yet.
>>46182212
>>46182492
The Earthen Ring and Cenarion Circle have been working to fix the Plaguelands, and have shown that their methods do have an effect. Assuming the Dead Scar isn't too different, they could probably do the same there.
>>46181890
It's still pretty if you ignore the Dead Scar, the Wretched, the western section of Silvermoon, and the settlements of rape trolls.
>>46182613
I found the settlements of rape-trolls pretty interesting to be honest.
They had a cool feel to them with less red and yellow everyfuckingwhere.
>>46182683
what rapetrolls?
>>46174833
Cucked by Zul and powerless to stop his island sinking, so not very.
>>46182613
I swear there used to be a huge Zul'Aman style gate in eastern Eversong Woods where the troll mobs were. Was that ever real in the game or was I sniffing glue?
>>46182717
The Amani, I'd assume. I mean, Zul'Aman is RIGHT THERE, a stone's throw from Quel'thalas.
>>46182857
I remember it, too. I swear I do. It was, like, in the middle-western area of the map, I think, not too far from the Dead Scar.
>>46172621
That orc guy who left a mark on Sargeras.
>>46182857
>>46182863
>>46182877
Did they get rid of it? I remember almost exactly where it was.
>>46182898
Broxigar Saurfang, a pale shadow of his brother.
>>46180340
>Not a word about Stromgarde
REEEE
What would an orc/troll hybrid look like?
>>46183585
like this maybe
>>46183585
Very ugly.
>>46183585
A brute/dire troll, just not quite as big. Or one of the 'bulkier' trolls, like the Drakkari.
>>46183677
What is being censored up near her hand?
>>46183812
her sexy neck
>>46183812
her tracheotomy hole
>>46183585
Well, many (but not all) troll tusks root on the upper jaw, and all orc tusks root on the lower jaw so they'd be a bit odd tusk wise. Fingers and toes would get really weird.
They'd probably be at least forest/ice troll bulky.
>>46183812
I can't tell if you're being silly or you don't realize the hand rose was the original and all the censors are just crops of the rose.
>>46184098
I actually did not realise. I feel stupid now.
Troll/orc hybrid wise, trolls are already weird finger and toe wise. I mean, they have two fingers and a thumb, right? But then they only have two toes, period. I guess there might be a vestigial third toe somewhere inside their foot?
>>46184184
They have a semi-toe on the rear of their foot, you can see the nail on the model post-WoD.
>>46184225
Huh. I imagine a troll/orc hybrid's hands would just end up with three fingers and a thumb, but unless they got lucky genetically, their feet might be kind of fucked up from birth.
That's a scary thought, too; troll regeneration must make any kind of corrective surgery impossible, since a birth defect would just grow back to the way it was pre-operation. Unless the loa can be selective about it, only regenerating things that are beneficial to regenerate?
>>46184306
And trolls avoid footwear, so a special shoe to compensate wouldn't work.
>>46184492
Yeah. The tusk thing is interesting, too, since orcs almost universally have an underbite to support their bottom-jaw tusks, and trolls typically do not have an underbite-- except a very few trolls do seem to have tusks on the bottom. A hybrid would probably express both sets of tusks fine, but I think there are two issues that an individual hybrid might run into, depending on their particular makeup.
For one thing, they could theoretically get the code for either set of tusks mixed up with the code for the other set, and end up growing the wrong kind of tooth for a location-- a long, trollish tusk coming out of their lower waw, for example, or a shorter, blunter orcish tusk trying to grow out of their upper jaw.
The other issue is that because the two sets of tusks are not normally presented together, they might grow into each other's paths, preventing the jaw from closing properly. The underbite might also get in the way of the upper tusks' normal path, and cause similar problems in that way too.
All in all, I think orcs and trolls both would have better chances of interbreeding with a human than with each other-- trolls would still risk their children's feet being deformed, but neither orcs nor trolls would need to worry about the other parent's teeth causing problems.
>>46181286
>Some character from a manga or something reignites sunwell
You know, I've sometimes wondered if Blizzard ever had plans to do something with that. I mean, the new Sunwell was created from a mass of arcane energy that gained sapience and the heart of a Naaru. Not even counting the life-giving qualities of the Light, that thing should be a solid recipe for cooking up a godlike entity.
Speaking of which, shouldn't a race as mana-sensitive as the Elves eventually undergo some sort of mutation as a response to that constant flow of Light mixed with Arcane?
>>46186025
>Speaking of which, shouldn't a race as mana-sensitive as the Elves eventually undergo some sort of mutation as a response to that constant flow of Light mixed with Arcane?
Light does not mutate it is all harmonious and shit.
>>46186025
>light-infused elves end up looking like this
what a twist
>>46186104
They do both love their crystals.
>>46186142
Well naturally, they're both from the jewelcrafting expansion!
>>46186095
>Light does not mutate it is all harmonious and shit.
Maybe we just haven't injected enough Light into a dude to find out. Almost every other sort of magic will cause physical alterations if enough is absorbed. That's why Malfurion is a manbearpig now.
>>46186104
Turns out that Argus was actually Azeroth's future all along.
What a twist.
>>46186488
Pulling aSuperman: Red Sonhuh? I can dig it.
>>46186619
Yeah, that's the one.
On a more serious note, I would expect for their eyes to eventually turn gold like in Lady Liadrin's new Hearthstone art.
So is there a particular reason why mages only use ice and fire elemental magic? Can they not use earth, wind or electricity. What's the difference between mage fire magic and shaman fire magic?
>>46187978
A shaman using fire magic calls on the elements to produce fire. A mage will channel arcane magic into heat to produce fireball.
Anybody know a good WotLK server? I've been feeling kind of nostalgic for those days again, it struck the right balance between stuff having been added in and Blizzard not ruining everything with Cata yet.
>>46187978
The class does not represent the archetype, arcane, fire and ice are the most common. Mages use arcane powers that are taught by high elves (thus the three main schools prevailing the most since magic is essentially taught)
Shamans call upon the elemental pillars, basically they use the magic that is inherent to nature rather than 'creating' magic with arcane abilities
There's also demon magic, blood magic, holy magic / the light, chi, voodoo plus a few i'm probably forgetting
>>46187978
>>46188066
I think arcanists mostly use arcane magic as bait and/or shackles for elemental energy. Like offering an elemental some sweets in the form of arcane energy and then using arcane power to bind them.
Khadgar used a lot of storm magic in the WC2 era, notably to cover the alliance retreat from the Horde's beachhead near Southshore, and in WC2 human/elf arcanists had a lightning bolt as their cheapest attack because electricity was apparently one of the easiest elements to bind with arcane power back then.
>>46187978
I have a memory of reading in one of the manuals that mages avoided using fire magic because it was too easy to accidentally call on Fel energies to power it, and thereby serve as a beacon for the Legion-- I think there was also something about magic affecting the caster's personality, and so they used ice magic to alway stay cool and collected, instead of hotheaded and wild. The thing is, I've never figured out which manual I read that in, and it might even be a false memory. Certainly if that ever was canon, it isn't any longer.
>>46188623
Well, the old lore(not sure how much of it still applies now) for Alliance Warlocks was that they were mages who sought even more power than the arcane arts could give them and succumbed to the temptation of fel energies.
It had a very Nietzschian "gazing into the abyss" feeling. Warlocks were outcasts, living on the edge of sanity and trying not to be fully corrupted by the powers they're playing with.
