Link to the Trove:
>https://mega.nz/#F!3FcAQaTZ!BkCA0bzsQGmA2GNRUZlxzg!vJsyAa5T
Relevant Items and Miscellany:
>http://pastebin.com/FQJx2wsC
Question of the thread:
>Do you prefer overhead or isolinear dungeon maps more?
>>46138411
Overhead, since I can't draw isolinear and don't know what it means.
>>46138411
I prefer maps that have some aesthetic flavor to them. DCC is great at this.
>>46138554
Man the scale of that map seems kind of off given the illustration in the bottom right. There's no way that corridor is just five feet wide.
>>46138697
Anyone have the sequel(s) to ASE?
>>46138518
When you draw things really straight, then yousolinear.
>>46138411
How do you guys handle ranges indoors vs. outdoors? Do you do the AD&D thing of having the ranges be feet inside and yards outside? Do you just not worry about it?
>>46139015
if it's a boring rule, I don't include it. that is boring.
>>46139083
That's... um... weird. I mean, I understand not bothering with it, but having shit go further outside makes sense (try angling your bow up at a 45 degree arc for maximum distance inside cramped dungeon corridor and see how effective that is) and seems too simple to be boring.
>>46138935
I do, but I'll have to look at how to get rid of the watermark first(if there is one).
>>46138411
I personally draw them isometrically because I find it simpler to distinguish the rooms and showcase thigns like elevation.
>>46138411
>>Do you prefer overhead or isolinear dungeon maps more?
I prefer overhead. Isolinear is interesting, but it's impractical for the purposes of presenting to players.
Strahd's castle (for example) was really neato in 3D, but unless I'm going to build a 3D map on the table and let player minis stomp around in it, it doesn't really serve any practical purpose. It does, however, inspire the imagination.
Anyone more narratively predisposed who'd be willing to write me up a paragraph describing the climb up a snowy mountain?
I'm utter garbage at describing travelling and journeys, and I know this one will happen soon, and I want it to be somewhat engaging. And hopefully teach me a thing or two about it.
>>46139015
>>46139236
it's all relative to the size of the area. if it's some huge catacomb in the earth I wouldn't bother. but a regular dungeon? an arrow is clearly gonna have the option of a further distance outside, but in a dungeon, when are you REALLY gonna be firing 70 yards away? I mostly use DCC, so I'd prolly just use the -1d modifier for firing in a small room.
I'm a screenprinter and I'm looking for some OSR art that would be rad on a shirt. preferably B/W. pic related.
any suggestions?
>>46139236
I'm pretty sure that the rule as-is is just because it lets you fit larger spaces onto an overland tabletop without having to change any of the ranges of abilities involved.
One inch is one inch - one foot vs. one yard only really matters for the fiction, but for actually playing the game actual real-world measurements are more applicable.
Especially since distance is hella nebulous in theater-of-the-mind play either way, making ranges fairly useless except as guidelines.
>>46139382
You're not supposed to show the players the map of Strahd's castle, they'll have to map that themselves. Secret doors would be kind of pointless otherwise.
It's isometric since that makes it easier for the DM to figure out what's where in relation to everything else. Or it's supposed to be, at least - I've heard that that specific map has some confusing bits.
It's an AD&D 1E map, and that's the game that recommended that any battlemaps that were made for combat should be 1"=3' - making the entirety of Ravenloft would be quite the feat at that scale, since I'm pretty sure that the maps are □=10'.
Also, it would be quite a huge map. I think the better approach is just to draw out individual rooms on the fly as necessary for combat purposes, to be honest. (It's not even that hard - get a large gridded surface and two straight-angled rulers and you can make every single rectangular room in roughly two seconds.)
>>46139387
Go reread the bit of the Fellowship of the Ring where they go up Caradhras.
>>46139521
overhead, isolinear's odd for tokens
>>46139927
I don't understand this picture, where's it from?
>>46140037
not sure of it's origins, but it looks like it's poking fun at the Chic-pamphlet D&D scare-mongering of the 80s.
>>46140068
Okay, that makes more sense.
>>46139319
thanks anon!
>>46139927
>Lycanthrope: The Raping
>Revenant: Book 3
>Lycanthrope
>The Occult
>Satan's
>Warlock
>Thai Cuisine
Heh.
>>46140037
Werewolf: the Apocalypse's book A Guide To Pentex.
There's a chapter on Wyrm-tainted roleplaying games that do, well, what concerned christians in the 80s thought DnD did; IE act as a gateway into the occult, corruption and death.
The chapter is full of white-wolf writers taking the piss out of their own games, and the industry in general, which kind of breaks the tone when the rest of the book's pretty neat.
>>46139015
Delta's D&D did a huge thing on archery. D&D's model is all kinds of screwy -- Chainmail had good, historically accurate rules for mass combat archery, but the transition to man-to-man broke a lot of stuff.
Through several posts discussing the problems, he mathed up some replacement rules.
http://deltasdnd.blogspot.co.nz/2012/11/archery-revisited.html
So I ran Tower of The Stargazer and my group loved it. I really liked its style too.
What are some similar modules I can run for my B/X group?
A small to medium sized dungeon with plenty of different routes and exploration options, filled with gonzo weirdness.
>>46141522
Before I recommend, have you checked out other LotFP stuff?
>>46142118
I've checked out DFD, but it sounded more like a spooky change of pace to an already experienced group than just a fun module for OSR beginners.
>>46142207
I'm guessing you don't want any adventures with potential world-ending scenarios then?
Check out The Grinding Gear, Forgive Us, and Hammers of the God. They might be up your alley, but might also be a bit too dangerous or nega-dungeon for the players.
>>46142619
>I'm guessing you don't want any adventures with potential world-ending scenarios then?
Hm, yeah, I'm looking for something a bit more traditional, but still weird.
The group is looking for something like down on their luck frontiersmen trying to make a quick buck exploring the uncharted and robbing tombs and "abandoned" towers.
>>46141522
made for DCC but right up your alley.
>>46139927
Is he throwing a bone, dice and miniature head?
>>46143837
that's a bloodied finger-tip.
>>46143852
I couldve sworn it was a little frowning head
How do i sell OSR to my players? my group doesn't like the idea of their character dying easily for fucking up
>>46143817
Thanks bruh.
Are the DCC adventures balanced exclusively to DCC or for OSR games in general?
>>46141522
The God That Crawls
>>46144218
"they're the NES games of tabletop. also quit being a bitch and just try it."
>>46144256
i can't really say. DCC for the most part has similar mechanics as most OSRs, except the core system often uses a dice-chain instead of +/- bonuses and there are only 3 kinds of saves (as opposed to b/x's 6 or whatever) so the modules might reflect those things sometimes.
http://strawpoll.me/7139460
>>46144218
Tell them the story of them dying will probably be more interesting than any story of them surviving without a scratch.
>>46144218
I found that it helps to stress that the game is challenge-oriented and built on player-skill. It's more of a rogue-like than anything.
The "everyone dies" thing is kind of overplayed as well. Everyone -does- die. At first. Then you learn how to play in this style and adjust.
If they are the kind of people who enjoy a challenge, then they'll dig it. If they are the kind of people who can't stand anything happening to their characters without their express written permission, then they probably won't. That's fine too. It's not meant for everyone.
Alternate combat systems.
Chain mail contains 3, in addition to the "alternate combat system" that eventually became the default for later D&D games.
Have you experimented with other alternate combat systems, either homebrew, from a supplement, or one of the original chain mail options?
>>46144303
>they're the NES games of tabletop
So they're garbage?
>>46147344
It's best to emphasize "anyone CAN die" rather than "everyone WILL die". If character death is guaranteed there's less motivation to make something beyond a murderhobo.
Does anybody happen to have a PDF of compiled tables from the 1E DMG? I'd like to print them out to put them in my DM folder.
>>46148206
AD&D 1E?
>>46147837
I plan on making a slightly more sophisticated version of M2M and fantastic combat for my variant, using d20s but similar probabilities.
>>46147982
>So they're garbage?
Hey fuck you man, NES is awesome! OSR games too!
>reading old school modules for ideas to steal
>"an adventure for 6-10 characters"
my modern edition babby mind has trouble grasping 10 people playing one game all at once, let alone finding that many nerds and herding them to the table.
was this really a thing? was it common? how was it?
>>46148642
I've been working on something similar, but the thing that keeps throwing me is dexterity mods.
If I set up something like pic related (set up for B/X) then you wind up in a weird position where a dexterity bonus or shield is actually a penalty you have to remember to apply to the roll, rather than figured into the AC.
>>46149767
> was this really a thing? was it common? how was it?
Common enough that they invented a protocol for it. You used to have a player in the group whose job was "the caller." They were the ones who officially declared what the party was doing out of character and communicated that to the DM so said DM didn't have to keep track of a half-dozen or more people talking all at once.
>>46140106
It's from a white wolf game, making fun of their in game world product or something like that.
>>46148479
Yes.
>>46149946
The main distinction I'm planning on is that most plusses and minuses only apply with regards to rank and file, man to man stuff, and typically adds or subtracts the equivalent of a like number of normal men. So a magic sword just adds +2 or +3 (whatever the effect would be; a +1 on d6 is more like +2 to +3) in the equivalent of fantastic combat or the alternative combat system, while say a dex bonus to AC or the +5 of a +5 sword would "just" subtract 1 or add 5, respectively, to the number of people attacking.
So different chars are still of variable strength, but honestly a level 8 guy with a +3 str mod and a +5 sword is "only" the equivalent of 16 men offensively. Which is damn good, but there's little limit on the number of men at arms the PCs employ. In fantastic combat, he'd "just" be a SH with a magic sword still.
>>46150513
Also, part of the reason str and dex aren't going to figure into the expanded fantastic combat system is that while variations in strength between humans certainly matter, no level of human strength is going to cause an ogre or dragon to give a damn at all. So man vs monster is a lot more minimalistic in terms of modifiers.
>>46149767
>was this really a thing? was it common? how was it?
Yeah, it was a thing. D&D was huge and loads of people were playing it. Big groups happened.
Younger people just don't grok the boom time of D&D in the 80s. I was a kid back then and D&D was EVERYWHERE. It was ridiculous how much it was selling, and how much crazy merchandise was out there.
(I remember going to the department store one day and getting this cool plastic fire elemental that was like five or six inches tall -- I wanted to get the Hook Horror, too, but one toy was the most my parents would get. Heh.)
>>46151472
The 80s were truly the best of times.
>>46147982
>So they're garbage?
holy shit, finding the youngfags is easy.
>>46147982
>So they're garbage?
No. They actually take thought and skill without holding your hand.
>>46147837
Yes I have.
I'm not sure how to really make it come into its own though.
Basically;
>Attack is d20 + weapon die
>Defense is static defense (AC) + armor die
>Armor doesn't add passive AC anymore, now it gives different sized die like weapons.
>Each point of attack over defense deals 1 damage
Weapons and armor die may be limited by class HD; so Wizards can only use d4 weapons and armor, Rogues d6, Clerics d8 and Fighters can use d10 and/or any other one.
There is additional rules whenever you roll a maximum weapon die though;
>Whenever you roll max on your weapon, that damage penetrates enemy Defense and deals damage anyway.
Now the issue I have is trying to figure out what rolling maximum on your defense die should do.
>>46147982
Eh. The thing about NES games is that while the often have a cool basis, they don't have as much going on as modern games. Maybe that's actually a pretty good analogy to old school D&D except that you don't have a DM to improvise things in an NES game. So OSR doesn't end up being limited in the same way as NES. Maybe it's more like if you if you had some sort of game designer / sophisticated game genie for every NES game you played.
>>46152809
>Now the issue I have is trying to figure out what rolling maximum on your defense die should do.
That's tricky, as lighter armors presumably are using smaller dice and therefore have a greater chance to roll maximum.
>>46153080
Exactly, which is what I WANT to happen because I want Fighters that can specalize and go for light and medium armors instead of always going for the heaviest. Same as weapons since a dagger penetrates armor much more commonly then a giant waraxe would, which is kind of the idea.
Do you ever include something truly fantastic in your games like flying cities and stuff?
>>46139521
Dungeon Crawl Classics RPG has a lot of really good art in it to mine for such a project
>>46144218
have them do a 0-Level Funnel Adventure, that ought to help them get into the OSR mindset
>>46153335
Well, I had an adventure where the party sailed off the edge of the world, if that counts. They were part of a convoy and had to skydive between falling ships, battling marauding sahuagins (who emerged from the ocean waterfall) and zombies of the dead (as no gods had dominion to claim their souls there) in order to get to the flagship and activate the gate device there before they were all dashed into the endless (elemental) plane of water they were falling towards. They lashed themselves to an anchor in order to expedite the process (the anchor had an enchantment on it to make it light when a command word was given, making it easier to raise, which allowed them to control their descent).
It all culminated in a crazy battle for the flagship, amidst loose cargo and flying debris whipped around by the violent air currents of freefall. It was the party, what crew of the flagship that still survived bolstered by another group who, like the party, came seeking to activate the gate vs. the sahuagin aided by trained sharks (ensorcelled to breath air) riding the winds and picking off stragglers vs. the zombies of the many dead. The party managed to cut their way through the enemy ranks and make it to the hold, where the wizard was able to activate the gate.
The next adventure was after the convoy hit the water and the sahuagin salvaged the gate and reopened it, flooding the state trade complex the other end was housed in. They went rampaging and ransacking through the complex and the party was close at hand, being interrogated about the disastrous mission. A high level wizard cast a spell on the PCs so that the water was like air to them, and they jumped and hacked as if on dry earth while the sahuagin swam around them.
But if you're talking about uber-tech, I can't think of anything offhand.
>>46153350
Any examples of good funnel adventures?
>>46153806
Sailors On The Starless Seas for Dungeon Crawl Classics RPG is a good example(as are most of their 0-Level adventures)
How detailed do you do your maps?
>>46153335
In no particular order, I've thrown the following into my games at different times:
-Time-travelling victorian big-game hunters
-Colonies of talking animals, redwall-style
-Portals to the moon, complete with apollo landing-site
-Little green men in flying saucers
-a blatant rip-off of The Shadow Over Insmouth, but with cavemen.
-the Invasion of the Body Snatchers
The knack with weird gonzo stuff is to describe it in terms your player-characters would understand. YOU know that the gentleman with the big hat and stupid moustache has a hunting rifle, but all the PC's see is a glittering wand that produces the boom of a thunderclap and makes things explode.
>>46153684
Wait was all of this happening in freefall? Because if so, god damn!
For a LotFP game, how would one make something "weird" that is still "nice"? My players have been meeting all kinds of chaotic beings that try to take them down, but I'd like them to meet something mystical that would instead rather help them but still be "weird".
>>46154870
Yeah. It took a week or two of freefall before you'd strike the infinite plane of water. So it's basically like you're falling to the moon. I really think it was a pretty cool adventure, but reaction was mixed at best. I had underestimated the groups aversion to D&D, one of my players got bent out of shape whenever he made a bad roll (and pretty much complained for at least an hour at the end of every session about... well.. absolutely everything), and I was on the verge of facing a player rebellion after they fell off the edge of the world and nothing happened. That is to say: they needed to be proactive and come up with a course of action and they were getting pissed off at me wasting their time by not having the next thing happen to them. Here is what that conversation went like (since I really don't remember the nuances at this point, consider it a dramatization).
>Okay, so what happens next?
>Nothing is happening right now. You're falling through the air maybe 150 feet from the waterfall that stretches as far as your eyes can see--a sheet of water extending from horizon to horizon. In the distance below you, you make out your ship and one other, which seems to have broken apart, leaving a trail of cargo and debris in its wake. You're wet, a bit cold, and plummeting through the air at terminal velocity.
>Okay, we wait.
>How long?
>I don't know. We wait until something happens.
>How many hours?
>Until something happens.
>How many days?
>This is ridiculous! How much closer have we gotten to the plane of water after a day?
>It's hard to judge, but going by where the waterfall meets the plane, maybe a little bit closer. But it's still really far away.
>What are we...!? We wait until something happens!
>How many days? Are you going to wait more than a week? You'll run out of provisions before then.
>*Teeth nashing frustration as players go over their notes until one of them remembers about the gate device in the flagship*
>>46155353
Personally I feel like the players were justified in getting a bit upset. They're looking for action and if a situation is presented as them having to wait, then it isn't very fun. I understand that they were supposed to figure out something before they could keep going, but maybe you could have "nudged" them towards it? Like for example having some mobs trying to get to the flagship before them.
But, maybe I'm wrong. I really like the idea for the adventure, very unique. Shame the players weren't into it.
>>46155353
It's partly my fault for only having a single way out. I generally like to have thought of a couple of different possible options (in addition to whatever craziness the players can come up with that never occurred to me). And I'm not usually very forthcoming as a GM when it comes to indicating to people what sort of thing they need to do next. But these were all people I'd gamed with before, some of them many times, and I had expected them to catch on quickly because of this.
As far as the aversion to D&D, I understood where they were coming from, but had expected them to give me the benefit of the doubt more than they did. Most of their experiences were in the latter days of 2e, I think, when most creative people had gone to other systems, leaving the worst kind of uncreative roll gamers playing D&D. (This might not have be a universal thing, and might have varied according to your age group or geographic region, but it was certainly my experience and, from what I've heard, theirs.) I remember hearing about an adventure one of them played in where they got to roll so many dice for attributes and combine them with obscenely overpowered races that nobody had a score lower than a 16, and most were 18s. Because high scores are awesome, or something. It was that kind of bullshit that tended to turn them off.
>>46155430
I did punctuate things with a sahuagin attack from the waterfall, though that obviously didn't give them an ultimate course of action. They were too far away from the rest of the convoy to see anything but the trailing end, and I really didn't want to spoon feed them. And when I was setting up the adventure, I made a point to emphasize the gate device in the flagship that was to facilitate trade between the kingdoms once they got to their destination. I understand it being forgotten, though they did figure it out pretty quickly once they actually got into problem-solving mode (it just took them a while to actually get into that mode). It honestly wasn't meant to be like a tricky puzzle they had to solve or anything.
>>46155520
But really most of it came down to the fact that I'd played with them before and expected them to be more on my wavelength because of that (and at least not get frustrated at me thinking that I was a bad enough GM to waste their time making them sit through hours of nothing). But I mean, they got over it. The older we get though, the harder it seems to please people.
>>46155520
>>46155544
Well if all it took for them to continue was some thinking/deduction then I agree that they overreacted.
>>46153320
How about an automatic parry? You get an attack back on the foe. It'd make sense fictionally that lighter armored combatants are swifter and have a bigger chance of this happening.
>>46153320
I wouldn't say fighters are locked into going for the heaviest. A plate mailed fighter moves at half speed. This is a SERIOUS drawback against virtually any enemy that doesn't obligingly charge into melee, such as enemies with ranged attacks and casters. There's also a decent chance that if the party must retreat, they must leave the plate mailed fighter behind.
>>46155858
Don't forget how more weight from armor means less treasure carried, which means less experience.
You still probably don't want to go with light armor since that's a sucker's game if there's anything better available, though.
>>46149561
>>46152126
>>46152300
>>46153032
The only people who think NES games are some kind of peak art form are hipsters and manchildren. The 16-bit era was objectively better by all standards.
>>46155928
In terms of popular home entertain systems, the NES was the biggest leap forward. The gap between the Atari and the NES was huge.
>>46155975
>Atari to NES
>completely leaving out the ZX Spectrum and C64, which came out the year before the NES
>>46156060
I've never even heard of the ZX Spectrum and I don't know anybody who had a Commodore 64 (I did say "popular"). Besides, both the C64 and the Spectrum (apparently) were more computers than pure video game systems.
>>46156255
I had a C64. I wouldn't put it anywhere close to the NES.
>>46156255
>I've never even heard of the ZX Spectrum
If you're a pleb who knows nothing of the medium then you shouldn't be making claims like >>46155975
>the NES was the biggest leap forward
>>46156314
He did write
>in terms of popular consoles
before his claim.
In either case this is a dumb discussion. The anon who originally said that OSR is like the NES of RPGs probably just meant that it's old school, simple and often requires some effort and might contain odd and/or unfair elements.
>>46138697
>There's no way that corridor is just five feet wide.
...yes it is? Think about this for a second. It's less wide than the hooded cultist guys are tall. A man is roughly 6' tall on average.
>>46156314
Let me re-insert the part of the sentence you conveniently cut out when you quoted it:
>In terms of POPULAR home entertain[ment] systems, the NES was the biggest leap forward.
I lived through the times. I played video games. I may not be an expert on video game systems, but I do at least have experience with the popular ones.
Wikipedia:
>The ZX Spectrum (UK /zɛd ɛks ˈspɛktrəm/) is an 8-bit personal home computer released in the United Kingdom in 1982 by Sinclair Research Ltd.
Wait? This was a UK thing? Because nobody gives a shit about your tiny, podunk country.No offense to other Brits.. er... UKers... or whatever you collectively call everybody from the UK, including but not limited to Great Britain... but I'm talking trash to this idiot here and you have the misfortune to apparently be from the same place as him.
Any ideas on how big the hexes in Yoon-Suin should be?
Bamp
>>46158858
Why does that skeleton have normal, non-decayed legs?
>>46159236
He's padding his trousers.
>>46155209
bumping this question
>>46156255
>I don't know anybody who had a Commodore 64
It was the largest selling model of computer in history. I knew about four kids at my school who had C64s, about the same as the number who had an NES.
>>46156299
>I wouldn't put it anywhere close to the NES.
It's far closer to the NES than that Atari 2600. Compare something like say, Project: Firestart to the Atari 2600's library, then the NES' library.
>>46159287
I'm just sad that loincloth thing hides his wang.
>>46138411
Whatever happened to Troll Gods?
>>46159755
I think it's a loincloth over pants
>>46159769
On hold while TroveGuy gets his life together.
>>46155209
>>46159301
Take a look at Deep Carbon Obervatory, Red and Plesant Land, and the Wormskin zine. Give your NPCs bizarre appearances, homelands, goals and motives, just not overtly evil. Also check out No Salvation for Witches, where the main antagonist NPCs are not really evil, just chaotic as fuck.
>>46159755
>I'm just sad that loincloth thing hides his wang.
[insert bone joke here]
>>46160047
Thanks for the suggestions, I've actually read most of these (not Wormskin) but I feel like I can't take too much of them since I want to play them with my group someday. I am making the NPCs in question very bizarre already, so I guess I've already fixed my problem?
>>46153335
Yes. I like to make the world weirder and weirder the further the PCs get from the starting kingdom of the setting (as well as the deeper they get into the dungeon). They might start out in quasi-medieval England, make a long voyage to Yoon-Suin, and then travel by insect-caravan from there to the Ifrit-ruled City of Brass, where they can ascend on a spout of fire to the moon, and so on. A lot of the weird shit in the central megadungeon will be just regular stuff from the far reaches of the world.
>>46140330
>not loving Black Dog
what's wrong with you
>>46139319
You should Check 7chan's Tg, there is a guy who removes Watermarks for free, He accepts donations tho.
>>46156566
>spoiler
Yeah, no problem, I'm a bong and I thought he was being a cunt too. And yes, AFAIK the Spectrum was a UK-only think, and not super fucking important here either, not like the NES was anyway.
>>46158053
I think it's understood that they should be six-mile typically. I have to say it's a pretty severe oversight that he forgot to mention it, though.
>>46161372
This is something I'd like to do if and when I get another OSR game up and running. Something more like a myth, where you can hop on a boat and go somewhere where things just "work differently", instead of trying to make a setting that works by real world rules + science magic.
>>46155209
>how would one make something "weird" that is still "nice"?
>>46165036
This, so much this!
>>46155209
The slug-men of Yoon-Suin could pretty easily be recast as gratuitously nice, and they'd still be weird then.
>>46154131
This is clearly a rip off of the Grand Duchy of Karameikos.Still nice though!
>>46165440
Vev
I want to make a dedicated healer class for OSR games, less a holy warrior like the cleric and more some sort of magical first-aid kit. Would the following be a good mechanic for healing?
>Healers have an amount of healing dice equal to their level. When they want to heal someone, they must roll a desired amount of healing dice all at once and total them up. If the total is greater than the target's current hit points, they replace their current HP total with the heal dice result. Healing dice are spent whether they succeed at healing or not, and recover the next day.
>A healer may also expend a healing die to heal nonmagical diseases, but the die must come up its maximum value to cure the disease.
>>46138554
Artistic is nice, but I think the second it starts to compromise readability it's gone too far. This is one of the main reasons people say Deep Carbon Observatory is unplayable.
>>46138411
Anyone got this for Lamentations of the Flame Princess?
Hell, anyone got Green Devil Face #6?
>>46166101
this cover is so ridiculous, it has me rolling
>>46165474
Vev?
>>46166101
Green devil Face is print only iirc
Its been almost a month since I placed my order (Feb 25th)
does it always take the 28 days to arrive stateside? Midwest US to be specific.
the PDF for WotL should be in the mega
I know it was posted along with Towers Two awhile back, 4plebs should have it if not the mega
so how does your games usually go? one character dies every session?
>>46166447
>mfw never actually ran or played in an OSR game though its been my thing for 4 months
Worldbuilding and theorycrafting for me then.
>>46165948
>I want to make a dedicated healer class for OSR games, less a holy warrior like the cleric and more some sort of magical first-aid kit.
Word of advice: don't.
Or, well, depends on your party I guess, but in my personal experience, no one wants to ever, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever, EVER play the Cleric. It's the absolute last choice, people who get stuck with it always stare at their sheet like they got the ultimate short straw, and I've had more parties who'd rather risk TPK by not having any source of healing than I've had parties where anyone WANTED to play a cleric.
And all this in D&D and similar games where the "cleric" is not a "dedicated healer" but arguably a powerful class with full armor, good to-hit and good spellcasting powers.
I've had to resort to dirty lies like "There's no cleric in this world. Instead, I added a new class called a Battle Mage/Paladin/Crusader/Templar/Knight Hospitalier/Exorcist/Vampire Hunter" and simply changing the name of the "cleric", no other change at all.
Introducing a class to the players as the "dedicated healer" sounds like a great way to get them to all commit mass suicide rather than play your game, but, again, maybe that's just been the people I game with.
>>46166447
Um, no? Death is a little higher than more modern games, but my group averages only one death per player through the campaign. One guy played a fighter who lived all the way to the end of the campaign recently.
>>46166893
>Um, no? Death is a little higher than more modern games
to be fair it's a bit more of a meat grinder at low levels, depending on shitty hit dice rolls, your leniency on seeing/discovering traps, etc
To the guy who requested the encounters in the Cold Fae-Infested North know that I am working on it but its taking forever. I'll post it as soon as its finished.
>>46166447
OSR games should be games where characters CAN die, but i find the concept of having, like, a killcount you're supposed to reach ridiculous.
...Yeah, I realize you were probably joking/exaggerating, but I need to get this off my chest: there seems to be a certain idea around that "if PCs aren't dying it's not OSR", which, much like "if Investigators aren't dying or going insane it's not CoC" it's a ridiculous idea for me.
PCs don't have any special narrative plot armor, but there's some difference between saying "they can die" and saying that as a GM in a OSR game you're contractually obligated to kill them every now and then.
Both victory and death come from the right mix of player skill and dumb luck. Just like the GM shouldn't go out of his way to save the PCs, he shouldn't go out of his way to kill them.
>>46166447
In my experience, every time I introduce a new group to OSR, we have several deaths the first session, and then that group maybe loses one character a campaign thereafter...tops. After they realize how deadly the game is, they adapt their playstyle.
>>46166949
That's when most of those deaths occur, yes. Still, not a fan of this meme of "lol OSR means you die!"
>>46167590
I just read an old D&D module the other day, and the premade PCs in it have between 6 and 10 hit points, yet the stats for a Dog gives it 8HP and 1d8 damage on its bite attack.
It's just listed as "Dog"
>>46168419
Point being? Sure, the dog could be a menace assuming it attacks (especially if it's facing down just one low level PC), but one would hope the players and, by extension, their characters would be able to take on at least a few dogs without too much effort.
>>46169120
Almost any player character who is attacked by the dog stands a chance of outright and immediate death from a single bite.
Oldschool D&D is a meatgrinder, dude. OSR means you die.
>>46169222
Why are you picking a fight with the dog in the first place?
>>46169222
Not that anon.
I get what you're saying. You don't even need to go as far as "the dog!" In B/x or OD&D by default all weapons do d6 damage, with normal humans having d6HP. Fighters are statistically going to have 5-6HP.
A single good hit from just about anything can kill, and it takes a few sessions to get a second level in your class.
That said, I've been playing these games off and on for about fifteen years. Once people get used to how they are played, character deaths aren't really all that common. You just can't approach the thing with the notion that combat is Plan A. And if you MUST fight, do everything you can to make sure it isn't a fair fight.
>>46169594
This. Low level characters are in real mortal danger and should be on edge.
I'm reminded of this one game where the party opens a door. As we peer in the DM says it looks like a wide room with a solid silver floor. Our thief pulled out a copper piece and tossed it in. Slight ripple, coin disappeared.
>"Aha! It's a magical floor. Wonder whats underneath..."
Thief stuck their head down and failed their save, dying fairly quickly as the giant gray ooze kills him.
>>46166101
It was uploaded in an OSR thread a while back, along with Towers Two. Try searching the archives.
>>46171261
Thanks, found them
what Labyrinth Lord module should I run for my players? ASE looks so rad, but I dunno if a megadungeon is the best choice for a first-time foray.
What was your first OSR game? Basic Fantasy? Labyrinth Lord? Plain old B/X or even OD&D?
>>46173403
A fast and loose rendition of B/X played with friends at grade school back around '82 or so. Our DM's older brother owned the set, but wouldn't let him bring the books or the dice to school, so we played with scrounged d6s, using rules half remembered and half improvised. Some of the most fun gaming I've had, actually.
>>46166399
GDF 6 gets released for pdf once the tree copies sell.
>>46173403
My introduction to RPGs in general was in 1999. I picked up the AD&D1e DMG at a yard sale, by itself. I grabbed it because I thought the art was cool.
I later realized it was a game, but we clearly didn't have all the rules. So I reverse-engineered the entire thing as best I could and we played that for a solid two years before I got a copy of a PHB. Even then, it was the AD&D2e PHB.. so then we hacked even more of it together.
I didn't get a proper copy of anything until years later. By then we'd moved on to playing Alternity.
>>46173403
Played AD&D 2E. Had a badass Fighter, no magical armor, +1 Khopesh. Came to hate snakes (particularly asps) and once scared a dragon out of it's treasure hoarde room long enough to loot several thousand GP via bags of holding. Also witnessed another dragon be crushed by an instant fortress, the magic-user in the party get the worst magical flying carpet in the world (dubbed the pissmat since the DM described is being about the size of those mats people put before their toilets) and learn that even in the largest city of that part of the world, full plate mail was something hard to come by (or even order, which was fucking stupid and every other player called said DM out on as well). Game stopped around him getting to level 14.
>>46139927
>Thai Cuisine
Gets me every time
>>46168419
>vicious warhound bred to kill
>can't kill a veteran fighter in a minute/round
I'd call bullshit.
>>46174997
Naw bro, the Romans used war dogs and they didn't do that well even against Celts and shit like that with not much armor. Against a seasoned legionary, forget it.
>>46173403
2E.
The worst part is they had Rules Cyclopedias right next to the 2E books in the shop, I just didn't think it looked as good because it was just one book...
Not sure I've ever been plebbier in my life.
>>46166876
>It's the absolute last choice, people who get stuck with it always stare at their sheet like they got the ultimate short straw, and I've had more parties who'd rather risk TPK by not having any source of healing than I've had parties where anyone WANTED to play a cleric.
Huh. My regulars have one guy who almost always plays Cleric or Cleric equivalent. I think he just likes being pious and having a funny accent, but hes also pretty dedicated to keeping the party bandaged and healthy.
>>46138411
Do you allow Half-Orcs? They always seemed to be the overly edgy (before the term was common) characters, Tieflings before their time. rape-babies, tragic pasts and an excuse to be an evil-aligned asshole at the table.
Never let them, they were always just smarter orcs.
>>46169222
>Oldschool D&D is a meatgrinder, dude. OSR means you die.
When your party rolls up antisocial orphan murderhobos, remember that this is the future you chose.
>>46175693
I prefer Half-Ogres.
>>46175693
why not just let them play orcs?
In my high fantasy LotFP, I reskinned halflings as Goblins, and hacked together an Orc class that was basically fighters that got a bonus to damage rather than to hit.
>>46175693
>>46175769
Three-Quarterlings all the way.
Does Tower of the Stargazer use a gold or silver standard?
Readig through it and am confused if I should change all mention of gold into silver or just keep it incredibly valuable.
You're probably better off changing it all to Silver if you're doing LotFP. The gold standard is probably for the people running it in Labyrinth Lord.
...Though having now thought about it, I'd probably keep the Sitting Room stuff around the same value, just because the idea of stealing the china amuses me if they ever thought about it.
>>46177150
>>46178465
I am very bad at this replying thing.
>>46166835
Same, brother. Scheduling is a bitch, even online.
Old Geezer's been perma-banned from rpg.net: https://forum.rpg.net/showthread.php?778618-Infraction-for-Old-Geezer-17%29-Permanent-Ban
Any way to get him here?
>>46177150
Pretty sure it's silver standard. Which is weird consideringthe three wine bottles that go for 50gp that you find almost immediately
But hey, my group wasn't complaining.
>>46179283
I just checked through it and every item is priced in GP. I think it might just be for people playing Swords and Wizardry, LL, etc.
>>46179283
I don't think it can work with LotFP with GP
It's 50 times the xp progression. That's just wrong.
>>46178662
Why?
>>46175157
Do, war dogs can royally fuck up an enemies line. Just can't use them all the time is all. And the way most people would probably use a dog in an OSR game is most likely as a guard dog, but just a s vicious.
>>46178662
Sounds like he's one of those grumpy old guys who stopped giving a fuck and now just says whatever comes to mind, with no filters.
This amuses me, even as I understand how frustrating and annoying it can be. It's probably because I'm getting older myself, and I can see the temptation to just walk around and shout "Fuck you, you're doing it wrong, you stupid kids! Nice tits, hot stuff! What? I'm old!" all day.
>>46178662
>act like an autist
>get banned
what a shocker
>>46178662
Well, he still has theRPGSite.
>>46181327
Yeah, no big surprise there.
>>46175173
I'm pretty sure that's been their marketing strategy ever since.
>>46182009
"It's THREE books! That's two books better than competing RPGs!"
Trying to come up with a name for a Lizardfolk thief-mage class for my RPG, guys. Any suggestions?
>>46182307
Lizardmancer.
>>46173403
Stars Without Number.
If for some reason that doesn't count, probably DDC. I LIKE FUNKY DICE, OKAY.
>>46182307
Shadowscale, perhaps? It's a little TES.
Do you have an implied setting? Because knowing what role these guys have in lizardfolk society would probably make the name easier to suss out.
>>46182307
Silentscale.
>>46178662
>https://forum.rpg.net/showthread.php?778618-Infraction-for-Old-Geezer-17%29-Permanent-Ban
Jesus Christ, reading this ban list's like tap-dancing through 1984. "A consistent pattern of inappropriate jokes," fuck me sideways. This is supposed to be worth a ban?
Well, on the plus side that means there's literally no reason to even bother remembering that Big Purp exists, anymore.
Consider the following:
>take an ogre
>replace head with a medium-sized centipede
>create Dark Souls-style Man-Centipedes
Is this a great idea or a terrible idea?
>>46182865
They sound pretty horrifying desu sempai.
Perfect for a unique or gonzo monster.
>>46173403
I have a confession to make:
While I've run AD&D 2e, the Rules Cyclopedia, and LotFP multiple times... I've only played AD&D 2e ONCE. Online.
>>46182865
Horrifying.
And also something unique that should be in a module showing it off.
>>46182307
chameleon
>>46183486
CAVEGIRL!
I've been looking for you since I came back.
Your project - do you have any updates for it you'd like in the trove?
>>46182307
Well, I like "slink" or "slinker" for the thief part. Not sure what to add for the mage part (spell-slinker doesn't really work).
>>46182679
I plan to release a setting book eventually, but I'm focusing more on mechanics and adventuresthan anything else. The Lizardfolk, Orc and Kitsune won the polling I ran and each one (along with the generic demihuman races) are getting two classes.
Thief special abilities I'm working on for my OSR game. Thought you guys might be interested, since they're pretty easy to apply to any old school game. My current plans are to give thieves two such powers over the course of 10 levels (maybe at levels 4 and 8), determined by rolling three times on the table each time and selecting the result you prefer.
>>46184709
I like it, but I've never been a fan of how thieves always branch out into having some magic powers later on.
Personally I prefer all the magic besides magic items being the magic users thing, I never understood why thieves are so commonly given spells or magic-like abilities even at higher levels.
>>46184709
Nifty! I would let them get a total of three abilities though (levels 4, 8 and 12)
>>46184756
>I never understood why thieves are so commonly given spells or magic-like abilities even at higher levels.
I understand not wanting them to cast literal spells, but most of the abilities are more a matter of doing things so awesomely they border on the mystical. Without this you fall into the trap of having noncasters limited to what's realistic while their magic-wielding peers can do all manner of mythical things with spells. And as you get to higher levels, where wizards can not only knock and (depending on the edition you're playing) spider climb, but also turn invisible, levitate, fly and so forth, thief skills start to seem pretty weak if they're implemented at non-mystical levels (especially since the other classes should be at least passable at a lot of the stuff they do). The idea that anything superhuman is magical in the same way that spells are is a dangerous one, I think.
>>46185027
>>46184756
Regardless, here's a list with the more mystical abilities removed. I put two of the most mystical ones remaining last, so that you could roll a d10 instead of a d12 if you wanted to cut them out as well.
>>46184805
Currently my plan is to have 10 regular levels and then maybe a dozen or so weaker bonus levels so that folks who want to keep on playing can still some sense of progress (and can progress without making becoming too powerful). Essentially, instead of getting a hit point boost, a spell boost, a boost to saving throws and so forth all together when you gain a level, after 10th you'd only gain a single one of those things each time you leveled.
Maybe. It might be that once I iron out the particulars I decide to just do 12 regular levels instead of 10 and skip the bonus levels entirely. In that case, the thing I'm most likely to do with special abilities is exactly what you proposed (at 4, 8 and 12).
>>46185568
>so that folks who want to keep on playing can still some sense of progress (and can progress without making becoming too powerful)
Ouch. Note to self: proofread what you typed before hitting the "post" button.
What are your favourite OSR contests and community projects?
I like the One Page Dungeon Contest and I enjoyed that contest where everyone had the same map but made different dungeons.
The community projects where everyone creates a room in one big dungeon seem pretty stupid though.
Are there any themed contests? e.g. everyone gets given a few keywords or a sentence and they have to make a dungeon from it, or something?
>>46185730
Troll Gods
>>46185762
Oh shit, I forgot TroveGuy is back.
How's that coming along?
>>46185783
I'm curious too. Then again, TroveGuy seems busy nowadays too. Might not see issue 1 for a while.
>>46166876
Yeah, my crew doesn't really go for clerics either. Part of that is the fact that healing is boring and generally not very creative / tactical, but part of that is an aversion to the whole holy man shtick, especially one so obviously rooted to the Christian church, which seems out of step with the rest of our settings. Personally, I'm not a big fan of gods at all, and the implications they have about the world. (But maybe my aversion is founded on all that deus ex machina bullshit the ancient Greeks liked to pull with their plays: "oh, you know all the struggle that you've been following all along? It doesn't matter anymore because the gods are going to come down and arbitrarily fix shit the way the want it.")
>>46183840
There's going to be an update pretty soon (a week maybe) as I'm hashing a new PDF together: basically there's a GM section, with stuff like tools to set up dungeons, monster stats, useful random tables, and so on.
Also a few optional extra classes. Still a little WiP, but the PDF is a preview if people are interested.
Which Saving throw should I use for pit traps?
>>46186791
whoops PDF didn't attach
>>46186910
Which system are you using? I always defaulted to 'vs devices' for traps, myself. Anything that's a machine or item uses that save.
>>46186951
LotFP
>>46186951
Does a pit trap even require a save? You're pretty much in freefall. Not much you can do.
>>46187180
It's more jumping back as the pit opens, or something, when you save against a pit trap.
>>46187444
Breath weapon perhaps then?Nice trips
>>46187444
Grabbing something to break your fall, catching yourself before you fall on instinct, ect.
ITT why old school saving throws suck (new school saving throws, on the other hand, suck for math reasons).
I guess it's worth mentioning that that way OD&D handled pit trap saves was that you got no saving throw whatsoever (but the trap only had a 33% chance of triggering, which I suppose is a saving throw in and of itself).
See also how the Greyhawk Thief, contrary to common belief, doesn't have the ability to Find Traps. Shit like that was expected to be role-played out rather than rolled for.
>>46187637
Old-school saving throws are fine when you're just dealing with the things that the categories are made for - it's once you start tossing in other stuff that the whole thing breaks in half.
Although I will never not love using Save vs. Stone for cave-ins.
Also, of course, some saves are broken since they're inconsistently applied - some spells not allowing a Save vs. Spells, for instance. Others are broken since they work in weird ways, like how in OD&D failing to save vs. poison kills you but succeeding takes away half your hit points anyway. Or the little bit where there's multiple applicable categories - putting all Wands into vs. Wand regardless of type is easy enough, but then you get the issue of whether or not Finger of Death is vs. Spell or vs. Death Ray.
Or whether Flesh-to-Stone is vs. Stone or vs. Spell, and in later editions the same for the paralyzing spells and vs. Paralysis/Turn to Stone.
Generally, as a rule of thumb, Death Ray is for instant death, Dragon Breath is for dragon breath and other breath weapons, Wand is for weaker spells, Spell is for actual spells (and stronger devices), and Stone is for shit like Medusa. Dragon Breath is applicable as a "dodge" save, and has been used for that before.
Also, generally characters have a higher chance of succeeding against Death Ray than against Wand than against Spell - the other categories are somewhere in-between, and specifics vary by class.
>>46154131
I used to be a big backer of the "outside-in" method, developing most of the world the narrowing it further and further down. However in recent months I've began toying with the reverse, working with a small area then putting little hints of what the wider world is and working from there. Why do my players need to know about the ancient line of Druid Kings of Caripia on the other side of the world if it pays no part in the game?
>>46188039
With effects that suggest multiple save categories priority is given to the left most save.
>>46149767
Also, IIRC, early D&D usually had each player control more than one character simultaneously, mainly so that if one died you wouldn't be sitting on your hands until you rolled up a new one. It worked because characters were mechanically simple (you didn't have to remember two feat lists).
>>46189642
Was this really a thing? I ask because I waa s reading up on the history of the game recently and the only thing I really noted wasn't so much that people rolled multiple characters but that the were a lot of players (Gygax's early games had well over 10 people and he had to have Rob Kuntz help co-DM for a bit).
>>46183486
Thank you, by the way!
>>46187637
Personally, I've grown to love the single-category save, the way Swords & Wizardry does it. I was resistant at first, but I realized two things.
1) With the 5 category system, most classes have 5 a fairly obvious "Average" score for their saves anyway, with on or two saves being slightly better. You achieve more or less the same result by saying "You have a save of X, with a +2 against Y and Z.
2) Using this method means I don't have to fumble with the system anymore. Anytime there is a save that needs to be made for anything, that isn't explicitly stated, I don't need to figure out what category best represents it, which makes my very improv style of DMing much easier.
>>46190494
I actually kind of like the idea of attribute-based saves, as long as you don't fuck up the math on them. Single stat saves are cool too though, and certainly a good bit better than the standard old-school way of doing them.
>>46191668
You could really use single category saves as attribute saves, if you wanted. Just apply the relevant ability score mod to the roll.
>>46191974
I like the ranges in that picture. It's like the DM stuck a dragon in a 20' x 20' room without thinking about the implications and just had to roll with it. Also, what's up with the dwarf peering around the dragon's leg? I'm not sure that's where I'd be standing even if I were the dragon's ally.
>>46192074
Never thought of it like that. And maybe the dwarf managed to sneak beneath the dragon? Dunno. Good classic art though.
>>46139521
>>46193206
Is that Elminster?
>>46182856
eh I'd say RPGnet still has the occasional good thread, for one thing they're about as good as /tg/ is at coming up with interesting settings
>>46182865
horrifying in the best possible way
>>46186918
>Morlock class
I love this so much.
>>46184756
cause Thieves were meant to be supernatural from the very beginning, and most people didn't realize this cause Gygax was awful at making things clear during the OD&D days
>>46192074
Dem random tables, man.
"Okay, you enter a small 20x20 chamber, and that's a wandering monster roll. Oh. Uhhhh.... Well okay, you just stepped on a dragon's toes, guys."
Anyone have Dark/Darker Dungeons or know where I can get it? The site is down.
>>46193749
should be in the trove(supposedly the author has made a new site and will be having his PDFs on Drivethrustuff from now on)
>>46193772
But it's not in the trove
>>46185730
I have been part of both the Exquisite Corpse Dungeon and the Secret Santicore, and I really love both projects. Might not be everybody's cup of tea, but they're a great creative zone.
>>46189833
My table has had from 1 to 13 players at once, with rules as simple as b/x, it ain't hard at all. In fact, I'd argue part of the osr feel includes adventuring parties that are closer to a mercenary company, I vividly recall runningsessions with over 16 characters including henchmen and misc retainers.
It's fun and dynamic. (The combat is still faster than 4e)
>>46193749
Both are in the trove under OSR Misc
>>46193749
Are you looking to start a game or something with them? Because I would be totally down for a Dark Dungeons game.
How much gear is too much gear?
>>46196039
Implying Link doesn't have a bag of holding
Anyone has any experience with the mass combat rules for D&D (War machine) or AD&D (Battle System)?
I'm tired of having to handwave any situation involving more then 20 or so combatants, and would like a mass combat system that happens to be compatible with BECMI.
Specially since I kinda want to run the X10 module.
>>46197366
X10 was literally made for the War Machine, y'know.
Give it a try and report back on how well it worked.
Also, for the love of God don't use the version from the Rules Cyclopedia - they made it scale more than the version in Companion did and thus fucked up the math somewhat terribly.
>>46193614
it's certainly not an elf
>>46196879
>Implying implications
I'll give you that for the modern Link, though, what with heavy stuff like the Iron Boots only weighing him down when wearing them.
Damn if it wouldn't be cool to have a game where you actually have all the items somewhere on his model, though. I'm pretty sure that we have the technology.
>>46197405
>Give it a try
I guess you're right, there's no way to find if it's good without trying.
Well my players are still low level, so I got lots of time to prepare everything. Gonna start seeding rumors of "The master of the desert nomads" so he doesn't come out of nowhere later.
>>46197470
Run 'em through X4 and X5, perhaps? That's where he came from, and X10 is (kind of) a sequel to those.
I've heard good ideas about going X10->X4->X5 as well, though. That way you don't get the thing where you kill the guy and he comes back to life.
"Use any item for one round once per session" for medium level thieves, yes or no?
>>46197596
>X10->X4->X5
I've heard that too, and it's what I want to do, actually. I was just hesitating because of the mass combat rules that I'm not familiar with.
>>46197366
Yes.
Battlesystem is actually for AD&D and D&D alike, says right on the cover.
I genuinely don't like War Machine. I find it hand waves too much stuff and doesn't really have any upsides other than that its simple.
Battlesystem 1e is very hi fi and very accurate but has a lot of awkward elements and is chart heavy. Battlesystem 2e is my favorite even though its less accurate.
>>46197405
>Also, for the love of God don't use the version from the Rules Cyclopedia - they made it scale more than the version in Companion did and thus fucked up the math somewhat terribly.
Could you elaborate on this -- what's wrong with it?
>>46199530
Mostly the bit where you can outnumber someone by 10:1 onwards and get so huge bonuses that the d100 combat roll doesn't actually matter (and the highest result on the roll gives the larger side moderate losses, IIRC).
I think the base one just stops giving you outnumbering bonuses after 8:1 or something like that? I'd need to recheck, it's been a while since I noticed it.
Overall the Rules Cyclopedia made a whole bunch of small hard-to-notice changes to BECM, some good and some bad.
Weird thought for systems that use ascending AC:
What if instead of dex being a modifier to armor class, you had the option of using dex AS armor class?
It might be potentially overpowered, but it would be a good fit for thieves/barbarians/swashbuckler types, or any setting where people regularly run around in loin cloths.
If you're both in armor and wearing dex, you can choose to use the highest. This could also be handy if you're using something like LotFP where guns reduce your AC.
>>46200371
You mean using the score instead of the modifier?
>>46200904
exactly.
>>46200371
Huh, that's actually an interesting idea.
>>46197653
I'm gonna have to try that! Thanks!
>>46200371
>If you're both in armor and wearing dex
Wearing dex? What? I followed you up to this point, but what did you mean here?
>>46202460
probably meant "have high dex"
>>46202460
C'mon man, it's obviously a typo.
>>46202460
That was a brain fart on my part.
Second draft version:
Let's assume you can use your dex as AC. It no longer modifies the AC for armor, which is rated independently.
In any situation, you can use the higher of the two.
Some situations reduce armor effectiveness. Weapon v. Armor tables, guns, etc. Or the equivalent of a touch attack. If your dex is higher than your modified armor AC, then use dex.
Other situations might modify your dex AC - being ambushed, backstabbed, etc.. as dex-based AC assumes that you're aware of and actively avoiding attacks.
So now we have it set up so that a character with high dex could get away with wearing little or minimal armor, but still has a very good reason to want armor.. while a character in very heavy armor still has a reason to want a decent dex.
If we assume that you can use your dex as AC, it makes sense that there are situations where your dex doesn't apply - you're caught in an ambush, backstabbed, or whatever else.
>>46197454
The new Zelda Wii U game that is in development looks like it might do similar.
>>46196039
The BBB rule, only take whatever you can carry in your backpack, belt and baldric. Anything else can and will slow you down.
>>46202907
>Not having a sack
You sicken me.
>>46202947
>Not having a minion carry your things
Plebians
>>46203221
If you aren't going into the dungeon with nothing but a backpack, two large sacks and a lantern, I'm not sure what to tell you.
