Planescape General and Q&A
Thread starter question: How would you use Limbo in a campaign and make it distinct from the somewhat similar Deep Ethereal (and, in the 5e cosmology, the even more similar Elemental Chaos)?
Discuss Planescape and the Great Wheel here, whether the original AD&D 2e version, the 3.X version, the 4e version (yes, it exists in 4e, down to the baernaloths, the yugoloths, the Heart of Darkness, Maeldur et Kavurik, Tenebrous, Pelion, and the Last Word all being canon as of Dragon #417), the 5e version, or your own original blend.
I am exceedingly well-lanned on Planescape canon under a holistic blend of 2e, 3.X, and sometimes even 4e lore. If you have any questions at all about the setting's lore, feel free to ask, and I will give you direct quotes and citations from as many primary sources as I can, unlike afroakuma. I will note when something is open to GM interpretation, and explicitly note whenever I give merely my own personal interpretation.
>Basic setting summary: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Planescape
>Comprehensive Planescape reference index: http://www.rilmani.org/psIndex.txt
>Planewalker.com planar encyclopedia: http://mimir.planewalker.com/encyclopedia/plane
>Canonfire.com planar encyclopedia: http://canonfire.com/wiki/index.php?title=Outer_Planes
>Rilmani.org planar encyclopedia (contains unmarked fanon, so beware): http://www.rilmani.org/timaresh/Outer_Planes
>List of all the multiverse's gods (contains all gods mentioned in D&D products, but also has plenty of speculation and fanon for mythological deities and for powers with few details on them): http://mimir.planewalker.com/forum/list-dead-gods#comment-58090
Old threads with previous questions and comprehensive answers: https://archive.4plebs.org/tg/search/text/%22comprehensive%20planescape%22/
>>45951290
I wouldn't use the Elemental Chaos, because I think that was a terrible decision and the old Planar Cosmology worked a lot better.
Hell, throwing the entire Great Wheel into the garbage can was one of the most annoying things about 4e for me.
>>45953876
4e had preserved a surprising amount of planar lore as pointed out in the opening post, but I understand your concerns regarding the Elemental Chaos.
How would you make Limbo distinct from the Deep Ethereal, then?
>>45953953
A lot more chaos and change, and a lot more in the way of finished results/complicated structures. You're more likely to find trees and chunks of land/structures/buildings/natural environments in Limbo, and it's a lot easier to create things there (though they end up falling back into chaos a lot more quickly). It should also be clear that the place is chaotic, so descriptions should make note of the fact that the fire doesn't quite behave like real fire and so on.
>so descriptions should make note of the fact that the fire doesn't quite behave like real fire and so on.
To run with this idea i'd make it so the Deep ethereal all elements behaved like the elemental planes the ether mists come from. While on Limbo i'd emphasize the "idea" of something. For example fire created by a normal prime native would do fire damage to everything including creatures from the plane of fire because to most prime natives fire burns and Limbo created fire would take that idea and apply it to everything. While fire created on Limbo from a fire elemental's mind for example wouldn't harm anything because to them fire doesn't burn it is a source of life not death. I might even give it the same effects as positive energy on things it contacts.
>>45954194
Materials and objects not having the properties they should is definitely something that should happen. Slaadi-conjured fragments of stone could have the consistency of paper or melt into ooze when struck by a burst of flame, and so on.
>>45954194
This seems more fitting for the Astral Plane than Limbo itself; it would be a very good way to distinguish the protomatter of the Ethereal Plane (the furnace of all matter and energy) from the ectoplasm of the Astral Plane (the sea of all thought and emotion).
I agree with >>45954624 in that substances in Limbo should not possess the properties they "should" have, but basing them on concepts and symbolisms is more suited to the Astral.
One idea I've always wanted to try for a "dungeon" set in Limbo would be for a powerful anarch to use their abilities to create a dungeon for the players as they went through it, using his ability to shape chaos matter to protect himself and serve as an antagonist. You could have an NPC that's far less powerful than the players present a fairly formidable challenge this way, especially if they can force some slaadi into helping out as random monsters.
>>45957942
I could also see such a dungeon working with the Ethereal Plane's protomatter (and the Region of Dreams' dreamstuff) and the Astral Plane's ectoplasm.
Why would the NPC create a dungeon around the PCs instead of simply trapping them in a sphere of matter and energy, however?
>>45957979
Because after being humiliated by the PCs earlier they wouldn't be satisfied with merely trapping them in a prison - besides, the simple sphere could be beaten back by the wills of the pcs, less so a dungeon which demands attention and focus to survive.
Would this work to hide a Lich's phylactery?
>>45958153
I am not entirely certain what this diagram is supposed to convey.
Contrary to popular belief, the Spire of the Outlands does not impede magic items in any way. The 1e Manual of the Planes, the 2e Planescape Campaign Setting boxed set's Sigil and Beyond, the 2e Player's Primer to the Outlands, the 3.0 Manual of the Planes, and the 3.5 Dungeon Master's Guide all make no mention whatsoever of magic items being affected by the Outlands.
Indeed, in the 2e Tales of the Infinite Staircase adventure "Reflections" clearly shows magic items being used at the base of the Spire (such as a room that replicates Unseen Servant and Light spells, as per page 105 of that book), and page 91 of the Monster Manual V contains a monster that uses a magic item within 100 miles of the Spire.
All this implies that a phylactery (which, at least under 3.PF logic, is a magic item due to having a caster level) should not be impeded in any way by the Spire. It would thus be safer to keep the phylactery by the Spire (such that it can be warded from divinations) along with a scroll of Plane Shift.
One should drop it directly into Sigil's "hole," such that it eternally falls an infinite distance while still being within the Spire's complete magic negation radius, thereby ensuring that it cannot be found.
>>45951290
So I'm a total noob when it comes to Planescape. Thus far I've read the base book, Factol's Manifesto, and Planeswalker's Handbook, and am currently reading the guide to Sigil. Is there any major recommended books to go for or avoid 2E wise?
Slaadi are underrated.
>>45959268
The issue with Slaadi is they're frequently run as lolrandumb, which while useful for setting up a quick fight with them makes them hard to use as major antagonists. They're effectively confined to monster of the week under most DMs due to their complete lack of, and hatred for, organization.
Any other Outsiders invading is a reason to go figure out who's responsible. Slaadi invading is a reason to shrug and go "fucking Slaadi man".
Who is your Planescape waifu?
>>45961197
The Lady of course. Sadly my love is forbidden, and to act on it would end with me flayed.
