So how do you deal with PC's with main character syndrome, /tg/? You know the ones. The kind that constantly try to make the story exclusively about their character, and make completely irrelevant and meaningless actions to make themselves seem more important than the others while never listening to the GM or the other party members?
>>45625550
>completely irrelevant and meaningless actions to make themselves seem more important
Elaborate, provide examples
Tell them that they better cut it off since there's 3 other players here that want to have fun as well.
>>45625550
Talk to them like a responsible adult, clearly defining what the problem is.
If they agree to shape up, help them become a better player.
If they act like a shit, boot them.
>>45625550
I had main character syndrome way back in the day. No one said a thing but it eventually hit me that it probably wasn't a good thing that I was doing so I stopped.
Funny thing though, the other players were so used to me leading them on that they didn't know what to do when I stepped back and wallowed in indecision.
>>45625717
It's always useful to have one person in the group who's willing to leap forward.
>>45625717
>the other players were so used to me leading them on that they didn't know what to do when I stepped back and wallowed in indecision.
God damn, this. They continually look at me, the guy with no social skills or attributes whatsoever, even if one of them has extremely high diplomacy in D&D or persuasion in WoD... Just... Why? I can't be the party face every gameI just want to play the anime main character PC's best friend and sidekick as a character, or a heal slut
>>45625585
So there was this big boss fight the GM had been hyping up for 3 sessions, right? The quest he set up was to find this ancient sword and return it to its original place to stop a great evil from taking over the city we were protecting for the quest. The boss was this monster, a intricately clothed puppet outfitted in swords, with one sword lodged into its chest. The GM set it up in this altar with the only openings being the door to the chapel and the stained glass depicting the god that created the monster. The PC mention is a sword-wielding magus. Halfway through the fight, the dude casts a shield on himself, completely ignoring our healer who was bleeding out, spends an entire action defending himself to get close to the boss, runs in. takes a ridiculous amount of damage, successfully rolls to pull the sword out of the puppet's chest, and immediately claims that he uncovered the holy sword we were looking for. I could tell the GM was about to say that it wasn't the actual sword, because he asked how would the PC know if that's the sword. He didn't ask to make any checks to know for sure if that was the sword, he didn't even tell us a plan, he kept quiet the whole fight until he decided to make some badass move. The GM didn't want to fight it because he doesn't like confrontation and our party's healer was his girlfriend so he didn't want her character to die for such a stupid reason, so he let that guy have his way, pretty much scrapping the second phase of the fight and saying the boss just drops because the sword was powering the puppet. Everyone except that guy was bummed out about it, and it didn't help that he bragged about it the rest of the session.
>>45626109
Lead them to their death. Maybe then they will learn the value of independent thought.
>>45626154
Shit GM. He just reinforced that man's behavior.
>>45626109
>or a heal slut
Doesn't everyone?
>>45626154
Your DM is an enabler. Harvest his organs.
>>45626154
>he doesn't like confrontation
Then why is he the GM? You NEED to be able to handle confrontation to put PC's in line to make sure everyone is having fun and not just one person.
>>45626230
>>45625858
I think there's a difference between someone assuming leadership and the party coming to a mutual agreement on it and someone taking charge to make their character look more badass than everyone else.
>>45626310
>>45626154
Seems like a classic case of dont play with assholes or the socially retarded.
For my own gaming groups, we haven't had too bad a time with it. Most games I have been in do tend to develop a main character either because the out of game person is outgoing and charismatic, or because the in game character has an overload of party face skills, or is super impulsive.
Generally this hasn't actually been a problem because we aren't cunts about it basically. The key is that none of the people who have ended up in a kind of main character role haven't been out of character glory hounds who need to fap their ego all over everyone else constantly.
We had one player like that for a while, but rather than stealing the limelight, he just spent a lot of time whining about not getting enough attention because he was too much of a lazy scrub to build a character that wasn't useless.
>>45626403
what did the GM do with him?
>>45626109
>anime main character PC's best friend and sidekick
Half of those end up dying, you know.
>>45626524
The dude in your pic died because he was in the mentor role and not because he was the sidekick. Heck, the MC was the sidekick up until his bro died.
>>45626230
Leave forever. You have your own threads.
>>45625550
I worry that one of my players will end up like this.
They blatantly ignored the plot hooks and separated from the group. I managed to get them back on track without any obvious railroading.
If they keep doing it I will let them run away. I will make them understand that the world does not revolve around them and that more important things are going on. If they stray to far then they will get left behind.
Look, I see where you're coming from, really I do.
What your GM is doing is that he's trying to create a heroic narrative. See, most D&D games take on two kinds; The first is a game which is very mechanistic. That is, where the game largely relies on rules as written. In this variant of the game, no-one gets any breaks; Here, a Level 1 farmboy will never seriously harm the evil Fighter who's burnt his village down and is menacing him with a sword.
The other is a game where, well, asspulls happen. Want to dive down the banister, or swing from a chandelier? Well, that's three different Tumble checks and...You know what? You do it. It's awesome. Let's call it a Charge maneuver.
The most iconic one I've seen is the bloodline dilemma. What does that mean?
Well, let's say there's a holy sword that only works for...I don't know, the Ironheart family or something. You know, a long lineage of Paladins. The Quest is set up as a MacGuffin delivery; Give the sword back to the family. So the party is being attacked by a demon who wants the sword, and one member of your group goes:
"I run over to the sword and draw it!"
Now, in a strictly mechanistic setting, this does not work. The sword has "FOR BLOODLINE USE ONLY" and that guy's character could never, ever draw it. It's like flapping your arms and trying to fly.
But in the rule of narrative drama, the guy SHOULD be able to draw it if it's appropriate and spontaneously get the "Honorary member of the family" perk for doing something So Awesome.
Neither way is the one, true way to run a game. But as we grow older, we become more and more cynical, and so the standard epic-fantasy cliches don't work. In fact, I'll argue that they actually hurt a game because things become arbitary. It's like "Suddenly, I uncork my true power because I'm very, very angry - I shout really loudly." that happens in a lot of anime.
So I feel your pain, OP, really I do. As a long-time GM, I usually make it so that the GROUP are the chosen heroes, not any one particular jerkoff.
As an interesting note, Exalted is actually a strictly mechanistic setting. (At least in the mess that was 2.5E, really). What I mean is that if you Exalt as a Solar, your powers are not arbitary; You get a starting list of Charms, and they're very GOOD abilities that will allow you to punch your way out of the predicament you're in. But other than that, the universe gives you no breaks. Fight stupid, and you will die. (Also, you will never get a second spontaneous power-up. Exaltation is a one-time deal.)
But since players are all special snowflakes, they tend to get their feelings hurt if the universe doesn't bend to their whim. I've had a character fail utterly and die really badly, and boy, that can feel like a downer. I'll relate the story later, if anyone's interested.
>>45627590
do it, anon
>>45627571
>the guy SHOULD be able to draw it
Not if it brings down everyone else. It's one thing for a PC to try to get something to work for them via asspull if the GM allows it and the party encourages it, because it would be mutually agreed upon that it would have great narrative value and provide a satisfying climax. No one should try to take away a PC's moment of glory, because everyone wants that. The problem with most PC's that try to center the story around them is that they don't consider the feelings of their friends, who want as much part in the tale as them. PC's who act this way don't understand, or try to understand that roleplaying is a collaborative effort, having multiple interpretations of characters and worlds mix and match together to make something amazing to everyone involved. Everyone should feel proud and excited at what they're creating and have it work within the minds of others to have it interact with other creations. It shows a great deal of inclusiveness and comfort. If there's one person in the group who doesn't feel comfortable sharing that because they're afraid someone else will rob them of that for the sake of glorifying themselves, then people will feel left out, defeating the whole purpose.
>>45625550
In D&D 3.5 We were an arcane trikster a figther a cleric and a sorcerer.
I was the last player to go into the game cos another player left (the group didnt like him and they expelled him). So i made a figther to complete the party.
Well the thing is that i normaly talk with other players when in combat to coordinate, but these people didnt. So i got a little frustrated and at some time my suggestions started to sound bossy i tonned it down and everything went happy. Until some things started to happen while roleplaying.
I dont like figthers con they cant do anything out of combat but the GM was cool enught to give me options or to make another character roll for diplomacy if this character is supporting while i do the talking.
So the Arcane Trickster was acustomed to lead the roleplay because everyone was more passive until i came. The GM was deligthed to have a new player who was assertive but the arcane trickster started to bitch around saying that i was stealing his scenes. At some point he started to bitch more at my back and he attacked my character using a discussion as an excuse, after humiliating him in combat (He was of these people that believe that if you have an optimized character you are good at roleplaying) he bitched openly irl over me. The GM called the sesion off and put the burden of making up with him to me (cos i was the last one to come.).
The manchild ignored me entirely to have me expelled. I told the the gm that the fucker is gonna ruin his campaign in the future and man i was right after a week the gm expelled him (cos he started the same shit with another player) and the campaign reset with new people.
Man one year long campaign went to shit.
>>45627949
All right, then.
This wasn't a D&D game, but it was a fantasy one. My character was the female inheritor of her father's ancestral weapon, a sword (Ascalon) that functioned like a dual-mode Excalibur: When you held the sword, you had a fearsome weapon. When the blade was sheathed, you were heavily, heavily armored and almost invulnerable.
The family's heir (i.e. Her brother) ran off to become a reaver and a Blackguard. My PC trained to be worthy of the blade, and eventually her father passed away with a "My daughter, you are the son I never had." So there's a lot of father and family issues there, already.
At any rate, she finally confronted her brother, now a gleeful servant of the forces of darkness. He had a horrible demon sword that functioned as a weaker version of the family blade: He was tough (but not as tough), and he had ferocious cutting power (But not as good as Ascalon's, when unsheathed.)
Some spectacularly shitty rolls later, and my character was disarmed and cut down. He casually stepped on her hand, picked up her fallen sword - And it blazed to life in his hand, giving him both invulnerability and a potent weapon, like what her father got when he wielded it. My character looked up and him and shouted:
> "Why? Why can *you* use it? You're a horrible monster?"
So he leaned in real close and said:
> "Because I'm a first-born son. And you're only a daughter."
Then he drove the blade through my PC's heart, and strolled away.
Behind the scenes, what actually happened is that he gained a level, and this was mechanistically reflected by him changing weapons. Also, this world runs on your standard inheritance rules, including metaphysics. (i.e. The eldest son comes before the younger son, a son comes before a daughter.)
>>45628557
And that was it. An entire character arc ended in the worst way possible because of bad die rolls and a rival with a 'take no prisoners' attitude. The GM even pointed out that "There's really no reason he'll leave you alive. He hates you."
That's what happens when you have no narrative tropes. Things become bleak and reductive.
>>45628663
How many people were part of this campaign?
>>45628806
Four, each had their own plot arc. Three were derailed by things like, you know, death.
>>45626154
That's the GM's fault.
>>45626154
>>45628557
>>45628663
Oof. I mean, looking in on that as with an outsider's perspective, that's a cool story with an unexpected ending. But as an actual player going through that has got to be rough. I suppose there was no resurrection in this setting? You might've been able to chase him down and reclaim your honor/lineage without it, but I can imagine just being burnt out and deflated after that.
As a side note, seems pretty Fate-inspired.
>>45626489
Not enough for a long time, but he was are room mate which made it really incontinent to kick him out.
Once we moved to separate places we all just slowly stopped inviting him to games.
Honestly everyone in our group put up with him for way too long, considering he'd often blow off games at the last minute, cheat on dice rolls, invite random people over and hang out with them during our games, etc.
It didn't all happen at once, but it escalated and added up over time.
>>45628557
That sounds absolutely fucking awesome and I wish I was there or had a game like that. To reference south park of all things, just because something tragic happens doesn't mean it's bad. It's great that a story can have exhilerating and powerful moments, AND devastating and abysmal moments.
>>45628663
I'm just going to assume same poster, correct me at anytime.
>character arc ended in the worst way possible
The fuck, nigguh? That was probably one of the BEST ways possible. Two significant antagonist/protagonist forces dueling at the pinnacle of their respective arcs and one overpowering the other in honourable combat.
Sounds like you're suffering from little bitch syndrome (sorry but I'm calling it how I see it). A worse way to go is getting real close to challenging old mate brother-blackguard but being stabbed in the spine from that one nameless thug you didn't see, or tripping on a fucking pitchfork while walking through a farming village.
>no narrative tropes
Get your priorities straight man, no happy (for you) tropes doesn't mean no tropes at all. Suck it up and be happy you have access to a challenging, engaging, and mature game.
>>45628941
>derailed
>by death
Fuck. Shit. I'm just going to sit here muttering expletives I guess. Wank. Turd. I bet you have unironically told someone in all seriousness that PCs should never die unless they are absolutely okay with it, hey? Galloping gargoyles.
Fuckity shit purple salamander.
>>45625550
Kill them 5 minutes in
>>45625550
Create a borderline DMP character that doesn't show up, get involved in combat or story line or plot hooks at ALL... until spotlight-faggot gets carried away. Have him stride in, do something significant but not important, have him notice anon being an ego-freak, have him laugh and taunt the guy for being naive and stupid about honour (lol, let your buddy die, took the mcguffin for yourself and think thats heroic? shit and I thought simple farmhands had low IQ), then walk off into the sunset, never being able to be confronted.
Heck, even make it super obvious what the point is just to drive home how possessive the cunt is being.
>>45629425
I'm glad i'm not the only one who instantly imagined that dude's character as Saber.
>>45628663
>no narrative tropes
I mean dying after a duel between blood rivals is a narrative trope, maybe not a positive one considering it was your own character, but think of it this way.
You're story ended with a one-on-one duel with your arch-nemesis. The result may not have been what you wanted, but granted that still an amazing way to go down. I'm kind of jealous my characters never went out like that, instead of tripping on a trap or falling off a cliff.
>>45629758
>You're not playing the exact way I do. RHEEEEEEEEEE!
Not that poster, but while I prefer games in a manner that is probably similar to your own tastes, you mistake 'mature' for 'grim'.
That being said, if PCs feel the need to win at all costs, to triumph over a stronger foe due to great need, they better prep some fucking dynamite and be ready to take everything down with them if all else is about to fail.
>>45628557
>>45628663
Your character should have created a fighting style to use the swords powers to the fullest, like Iaijutsu https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iaijutsu
Quick attack for maximum sharpness and then sheath for maximum protection.
>>45629980
I swear I have another picture somewhere that's relevant but I can't fucking find it.
Have this instead
https://danbooru.donmai.us/posts/2036077
On a semi related note, what do you guys think about temporary shounen tier power ups as a reward for roleplay? It might be because I'm a sucker for this kind of stuff, but when my pcs get super into character and start going into those we-won't-die-even-when-killed speeches and they nail it perfectly, I give them like a temporary buff, something like they gain x hp or they +2 to damage rolls for the rest of the battle. It just feels like they've earned it, and it does make for some really good moments.
>>45630379
I don't think there's any problem if you allow it and the rest of the party encourages it. Just make sure you use it sparingly so it won't go stale, otherwise you'd be getting a naruto-tier narrative where every powerup will feel stale.
>>45630122
>rheee
Not quite, though I'm certainly a bit tiffed about the way he responded to the events. I stated that I would have enjoyed being involved in those particular events, though didn't say anything about PLAYING any differently.
I'm running on the assumption you did read my post, but chose to be lazy and spit out the typical "REEE" derogatory smirk. I never told him how to better play, nor did I say I would play differently, I only relayed my irritation that he wasn't happy with what sounded like a pretty good session(s), and went beyond that to insinuate that it was bad, horribly ending, and grounds for calling 'derailment' bullshit on his DM.
Again, I didn't refer to any other stories or sessions or settings, so telling me I mistake 'mature' for 'grim' is a bit baseless, isn't it? Or do you also mean the poster's session was grim but not 'mature'?
Ultimately, for me, it comes down to how players gravitate towards blaming the story, or blaming the DM for how things play out disfavourably, but they'll be completely fine and lap up the story as if they don't have a problem with the system when things play out favourably.I think I'm venting some unrelated stress, as well. Shit fuckers can't just appreciate a bloody good story.
>>45626154
Your GM is a bad GM. Non-confrontation in the GM role is not an option when you have someone who is ruining other people's fun. He has enabled this man to be the main character.
>>45630605
Just being lazy and taking the piss out of you, mate.
That being said, I was partially considering the fact that the conversation up to that point had been concerning issues pertaining to mechanism vs narrative; I did the normal faggot thing of assuming your two cents were more concerned with the mechanism aspect (AKA, farmboy vs character with player levels results in the former being royally boned).
And while I understand that perspective, and usually employ it, sometimes narrative has to kick in if only because it'd be a despair ridden world if everything was purely the product of some mathematical gap that is impossible to overcome.
It's part of the reason why I fucking loath Uber (the comic), because unless you have super-powers (read: plot armor) you're basically fucking helpless.
That being said, I enjoy it when the narrative kicks in due to some mechanical backing: IE, yeah, the farmboy might be basically fucked, but if he was planning on what basically amounts to a suicide attack with explosives or other wise had his shit together tighter than anything else, fuck the hitpoints that the other NPC had, that guy is either dead or going to be fucking hurting from the situation).
>>45631755
I think that the argument is that the farmboy can never damage the high-level baring DM fiat. Even if he crits and rolls max damage, he's doing like 20 damage. The Fighter has triple-digit HP.
>>45632078
Which, I would argue, is fucking horse-shit and is part of the reason arbitrary increases to health in general are retarded.
>>45626109
>healslut
Since when has the party'pc with most influence been degated to a slut?
I managed to make three guys i didn't want in the group leave using the same tactic: goad them to threaten you, then threaten them that if they touch you you'll never heal them again, then bully theic PCs to no end for lulz.
What are they gonna do , stab me? Good luck going on without a healer
I don't really see how they could successfully do that without the GM or PCs helping them or the luck of the gods. I've been in games where we had that sort of thing, but it was mostly the result off basically everyone else fucking with the "hero" and using him as a scapegoat only everything just sort of worked out for him. Seemed like a fair deal really
There will always be a main character in a game. And likely always be a shitty nobody character that adds absolutely nothing to the game.
Just accept it and move on. The player with the most interesting character is going to make for the most engaging story.
>>45625550
>>45625550
I lean into it. Oh, you're the last holy warrior from a sect of ancient Paladins? Badass! Did you hear about that prophecy? You didn't? Hmmm
Turn the PC into a mcguffin. Have a group of npcs show up to worship him and then die horribly. Make an evil cleric who is calling up demons from outside the world to hunt down the PC.
These are legitimate plots, and apparently the type of plots the PC wants to engage in. Give him these, and suddenly the rogue has a lot more time to search for his missing sister, especially if there's a cryptic line in the prophecy like "if the joyous and subtle knife in the dark cannot reclaim his lost blood, the chosen one too shall be lost in night."
Give him a feat which represents him accepting the prophecy which grants him divine power, with the drawback that he can't ever be resurrected. Don't fudge him to life
