Why didn't the Eldar make friends with humanity, or fix the enmity that developed?
WFB elves made friends with humans when they weren't in as great of a situation, and in 40k, humanity controls almost the entire galaxy. They have uncountable bodies to throw at problems when Eldar are reluctant to let one of their number die. And many of them are fanatics that can easily be swayed in one direction or another and never question orders. Why couldn't they just bury their pride and make friends with a race of literal meatshields? Humans could fight more effectively with Eldar guidance, if not technology or direct military help, and they both hate Chaos and most other Xenos anyway.
>>45507870
because they did not need us until we were already xenophobic.
>>45507938
So? That could have been fixed. They had 10,000 years to work on it.
>>45507870
The Eldar are more full of themselves than the High Elves are. Had 40k truly been Fantasy Battle in the future instead of End Times & alternate universes, the Imperium would have had far more Elves & Dwarfs.
>>45507870
Even during extinction they are undeniably prideful, arrogant, and incredibly ignorant despite their claims to wisdom and foresight. At the end of the day they still see humans as insects.
>>45508498
I hate to say it but I felt like the High, Dark and Wood Elves all had way more interesting stories and interactions with each other and the Old World than Eldar and Dark Eldar do in 40k. Its very distressing.
They tried
Got BTFO by Death guard, Iron hands, and Salamanders during the crusade
>>45508548
You'd think that would have taught them a little humility, showed them that humans are more capable than they give us credit for.
Because they're Mon-keigh.
You can just go making friends with the lesser races now.
Besides, they should have fixed their differences with the Necrons if they should ally with any race
>>45508545
>eldar
>ruined everything
>keeps status quo
>Dark Eldar are just hedonists waiting for their inevitable end
>elves
>kept the world safe
>are the movers and shakers
>Dark Elves are ambitious fucks wanting to prove themselves
Eldars are just sad
>>45508737
They wouldn't have to be friends. They could be allies, with a long pause beforehand and a few airquotes around. It's a lot easier to direct the meatshields in ways that protect you if you claim to be on their side.
>>45508852
They do that already without them knowing though
>>45508868
>eldrad the taufag
>>45507870
The Eldar are quite literally a race that should not be. They were designed as weapons but shook free of that mold and became great. That's what they were. What they are at the time of 40k is a broken people with severe dillusions if grandeur. Some may be brilliant, or empathetic, or genuinely wonderful. The majority act like bitter children, unable to understand that their time has passed and what they were has no bearing on what is.
I like Eldar, but they're a cautionary tale. Compared to WFB Elves, Eldar a shit.
>>45508885
Doesn't stop them from killing each other though.
>>45508919
It's Iyanden vs Tau. It was a conflict started by a Dark Eldar false flag.
they can stand each other more than they can stand other races if that means anything
The question is why doesn't the Imperium and Necrons set aside their differences, curbstomp the shit out of everybody in the galaxy, with the Emperor locking down the Warp so Necrons need worry not about daemons popping into the materium again.
They're too arrogant and focused on their own survival, while humans are too xenophobic
I think there is one IG regiment that's best buddies with Eldar though
>>45509249
Really? Never heard of that. Best I've heard of is the Imperials sometimes leaving the Eldar alone, or fighting alongside them in desperate circumstances.
>>45509183
what does that even mean?
>>45509334
Best buddies is a bit of an exaggeration, but I remember the space middle east guys having a pretty good relationship with Biel Tan
>>45509357
that when chaos or crons come a knocking they have a 15% greater chance to stop fighting and cooperate with each other
>>45509402
>0.15*0
fugg
>>45509360
The Tallarn Desert Raiders? Never heard anything about that, but apparently they made some secret agreement near the end of the Heresy. Not sure if that makes them friends.
>>45507870
The Imperium's "kill all xenos" policy doesn't make it easy.
>>45507870
Before the fall of the Eldar, the Eldar had zero reason to befriend any other race, as all other races, including humanity, were fucking insignificant in the face of the Eldar empire. The Eldar empire reigned supreme, and nothing the other races did was even remotely a threat to the Eldar.
After the fall, by the time the scattered remnants of the Eldar, like the Craftworlds, managed to establish themselves, the humanity they faced was one of the great crusades, and those niggers were not exactly looking to befriend anyone. Emperor's policy towards all Xenos was pretty much "submit into servitude under Humanity, or die."
Despite of that, the Eldar did try to advice humans, and aid them back then, only to be met with total disregard, or worse. If Humans had listened to Eldar back then, Horus Heresy could have been averted.
Suffice to say, it was Humans who made friendship between the Eldar and humanity impossible, not the Eldar themselves.
>>45508498
Eh, maybe things changed from how they were but I'd hesitate to call the Empire and High Elves friends.
The High Elves, at least a majority of them, view themselves as superior to the Empire, but they know the Empire can help in the fight against Chaos and they're not above asking for assistance if they have a problem that resides within the Empire's domain.
>>45508545
Eh, personally I wouldn't say they're any better, though this could be because most of what I know of the interactions between the High and Dark Elves is mostly about the latter attempting to wage war on the former while with the Craftworld Eldar and Dark Eldar it's more about them having a weird relationship because of their respective views.
>>45508946
Iyanden and Tau also had a thing where the Tau basically kidnapped/grave robbed from Iyanden (Granted the Tau didn't know this) by taking the damaged Wraithconstructs left on the battlefield. Iyanden returned for them and then basically told the Tau to fuck off.
>>45510502
The elves use everyone, especially the Empire, as living walls. Any kind of WAAAGH or chaos invasion that stomps the old world will probably make its way to ulthuan shortly after. Elves don't give a crap about the empire itself, they just care that there is a nation that can at least be persuaded to find common cause against enemies.
If the imperium was open to listening to the eldar, they probably would have learned that they are a psychic race in the making. The eldar could have taught them how to harness their psychic abilities or at least put up mental wards against daemons. It would have helped out massively over the long run. Still, even if the 2 races were "friends" theres no way the eldar let the imperium use the webway. they'd only tell the imperium what they need to tell them, and would only let them use whats absolutely necessary
>>45509526
The Bie-Tan and Desert Raiders did band together to fight off a daemonic invasion on Tallarn.
Ironically it was the Tallarns who uncovered accidentally a Chaos thingy called the Cursus of Alganar (aka: direct portal to the realm of Chaos). Eldar waltzed in to stop them, but the Cursus opened and it all went full daemonic boogaloo.
The Tallarns and Eldar, exhausted from fighting themselves, banded together and fought of the daemons.
Eldar sealed off the Cursus and collected the soulstones of the fallen, while the Tallarns sucked the water from their fallen and poured over the Cursus a whole sea of concrete just to be safe.
Both were actually a good terms then and the Biel-Tan dudes entrusted them with guarding the Cursus.
>>45507870
Most of the Imperium thinks that Eldar are Eldar. As a result, they're happy to get revenge for raids by Dark Eldar and Corsairs by attacking Craftworlders and Exodites.
It's a bit difficult to ally with someone when, from their perspective, you break your alliance immediately. It's also difficult to convince people that there are in fact three different kinds of long-eared thin aliens who all happen to favor lightning raid tactics, since one of the major strengths of such tactics is that you're gone before your target can respond or even adequately identify their attacker.
>>45509196
>Necrons
>Caring about any race other than themselves
>Needing help despite their techno-magic
I don't think so.
>>45507870
Eldar are arrogant as fuck, they believe every other race to be lower life forms, and they believe the galaxy is theirs
Humans are xenophobic super racists who hate most aliens and don't tolerate their presence
Also humans often land on planets that once belonged to eldar like 5000 years ago and the eldar claim its trespass, same goes for the imperium though, Eldar accidentally destroy a church and it was a church of the emperor or some shit.
They do have temporary alliances, but neither party likes the other
>>45511158
Not sure about Waagh!, off the top of my head most Greenskins didn't seem to have any naval knowledge. I can only recall Grom the Paunch. I suppose you could argue that if the Empire fell that the Greenskins may learn how to make use of their fleet.
Some in the Imperium seem to have an inkling that humanity is a psychic race.
>>45512324
This is a good point too, majority of the Imperium doesn't realize that the Eldar are composed of at least five different cultures.
>>45507870
Isn't that the name of the game for the Nu-Eldar? The settler ones that abandoned the craft worlds to live on planets and eschew their culture and beliefs and all that? They're like actually nice and cooperative Eldar who don't mind humans at all, as long as they aren't having to fight them.
>>45512849
Harlequins are probably the nicest of the Eldar (as in least jerkass even if there is one sub-faction of theirs that is all around doing lethal jokes on people).
The Imperials actually allow them to perform on planets.
>>45512889
That's a weird bit off fluff. They go way out of their way to suppress knowledge of the daemonic, but then they let these xenos come onto their worlds and do a performance about the Fall of the Eldar and the rise of Slaanesh?
>>45507870
Why befriend a race, when you can more easily trick them into doing your bidding.
>>45513540
Most Imperials probably don't know what their performances are about, Harlequins mostly or entirely dance if I recall correctly.
>>45512889
>>45513540
>>45513698
I keep seeing this bit of fluff about Harlequins performing for Imperials, but have never been able to find it. Is it new codex lore?
>‘No star-faring race in the cosmos can operate without understanding the nature of Kaos. We thank the eldar for teaching us the rudiments of it, but we would have recognised it soon enough without their help. Surely, one can’t use the Immaterium for any length of time without coming to terms with Kaos as a…’ his voice trailed off. ‘Great and holy heavens! You don’t know, do you?’
>‘Let me finish, Loken. Kaos, when it manifests, is brutal, rapacious, warlike. It is a force of unquenchable destruction. So the eldar have taught us, and the kinebrach, and so the pure men of the interex have stood to check Kaos wherever it rears its warlike visage.
>>45513750
It's certainly in their original White Dwarf background, pic related:
>The Harlequins (Eldar: Rillietann) are a uniquely Eldar social and military institution – a caste of fighters and entertainers who exist beyond conventional Eldar social structure. They owe no allegiance to any craft-world or other Eldar community and travel amongst Eldar – and other races – at will.
>Harlequins travel constantly, presenting entertainments based on Eldar tradition and centred on the body of lore which has sprung up around the Laughing god. They have been known to stage their dance-dramas for Humans and other non-Eldar, since they believe that the Fall of the Eldar holds a lesson from which all races may benefit.
Later editions don't seem to mention it, though I may have not looked hard enough. Similarly, up to at least the 6th edition Codex: Eldar, Solitaires were described as living in secret among both Eldar and non-Eldar, but their entry in 7e's Codex: Harlequins just says craftworld or Commorrite society.
>>45513698
"Oi Smitty, wot's dat xenos shakin' her arse loik dat fer?'
'Dunno, but I'm gonna yank my knob t'this later.'
>>45507870
Because Warhammer 40k is the story of Paradise Lost, and in Paradise Lost only evil has any friends cheering them on.
>>45511158
Iffy.
Alarielle dying would have destroyed the High Elves, but she still risked her life against Chaos protecting men's thoughts from it.
Teclis genuinely loved the Empire, and not just because he was shagging human twins.
Finubar really fucking lived humans.
The problem is GW only wrote extensively about broody faggots, and the cancer that is Thorpe flat out admitted he made Elves more like Eldar because he liked them better that way.
>>45507870
The Eldar were arrogant. They were basically children/weapons who were made to spite the Necrons by being a 10/10 space elf race, and thinking they were the the best and favorite creation of the Old Ones. Now fast forward through the War in Heaven to the end. Knowing what happened, I wouldn't be surprised if the Eldar developed a racial PTSD and used the idea that they were superior to their creators since they survived the Necrons' funk. I don't know if Lord Kroak exists in 40K, but it is a mystery if he did drop comets on them for that. After that later on after a hairy, mutant cannibal race called the Mon'Keigh nearly brought the Eldar to their knees, but the Eldar triumphed and used the name Mon'Keigh to name any "lesser race" they encountered.
Sixty million years of supremacy and isolationism gave the Eldar an ego which would lead to them abandoning their religion and turning to hedonism. We know how that ended, and how they're still arrogant and use other races as meat shields. Moral of the story? Live in the same galaxy with the Eldar? Prepare your anus when they goof on a galactic scale.
>>45507870
Because theybelieve theycan manipulate lower species in doing what they need done anyway.
>>45515693
Too bad they aren't Orks.
>>45507870
>actual alliances in 40k
You should know better than this, anon.
By the way, is the Coven of Isha still a thing??
Is there something these guys actually accomplished??
>>45508545
That's because for all of their faults and arrogance, the elves at least know to respect man as a 140something lbs. hunk of muscle that can snap their limbs off if enraged, but can be reasoned with so they don't do that and instead even do things that could help further their causes, and are furthermore theoretically able to breed with them, so it could be akin to the Imperium's own feelings with some of its own abhumans like the Ogryns and Ratlings; inferior in many ways, but useful in others enough that they should not be discounted in the slightest.
The Eldar do not have this. In their eyes, humanity is but a crude caricature of their form; a race of C64s to their Mac Pros, with their best being a bunch of raw muscle and other organs strung together and encased in metal to try and make up for their sub-par minds. How could a race that is weaker than them, dumber than them, and cruder than them possibly aid their situation?
Well, for starters, they probably underestimated the size of the Imperium...
>>45516491
>Well, for starters, they probably underestimated the size of the Imperium...
They underestimated mankind on it's whole.
>>45507870
>fanatics
>easily swayed
>>45516658
More like overestimated. Eldrad thought Horus Heresy was preventable and tried to warn humans but that was useless.
Later he foresaw that Tau would be the true inheritors of the galaxy.
>>45517500
It's all a matter of timing.
>>45507870
There can be no alliance between the Eldar and the Imperium. The Imperium is simply too damn powerful, this is not an equal relationship. As long as humanity is ascendant, the Eldar are doomed to irrelevance. Using their tech and power in service to humanity is just salting the wound.
>>45517755
Another reason:
Friends don't manipulate friends into sacrificing themselves
>>45512154
daemonic boogaloo is unquestionably the best thing ive heard all year
>>45518452
And it was a ridiculously large one to boot.
>>45517548
That wasn't overestimating, dude.
Eldrad went full retard on the Horus Heresy, because he tried to warn mankind 1) through the fedora-king EoM, who was busy hiding his intentions from his sons and building a Webway path for humanity, 2) through Primarchs who were already turning the coat towards Chaos, like Fulgrim. Seriously, he should have thought better about his plan to avoid shit hitting the fan.
And his visions with the Tau come from the same batch of weed, like they are going to happen when all other galactic powers get destroyed. You can put another tens of thousand years until then.
>>45510502
>Iyanden and Tau also had a thing where the Tau basically kidnapped/grave robbed from Iyanden (Granted the Tau didn't know this) by taking the damaged Wraithconstructs left on the battlefield. Iyanden returned for them and then basically told the Tau to fuck off.
No, you are confusing things.
Here is the whole thing in simple points.
-The Dark Eldar fooled the Tau into blowing up a maiden world.
-The Iyanden Eldar retaliate by ravaging the Tau colony Kel'shan.
-The Tau eventually retaliate and defeat the Eldar and claim several constructs
-The Eldar return in force a war starts. During the war the Eldar reclaim the wraith constructs and they realize that the Tau are quite a tenacious foe.
-Ultimately, the Dark Eldar machinations are revealed to the Tau and Iyanden Eldar. The Iyanden Eldar leave to exact vengeance on them while icily ignoring the Tau's calls for friendship
>>45518301
What about the Inquisition? Or the Mechanicus when they really want an STC? Or the Ecclesiarchy when they really want a relic? Or even Space Marines, when they decide some objective of theirs is more important than that of their allies, but realize that they can't succeed in their own objective without allied aid?
