What Rules do you lay out to your party before you start playing? Here's what I presented to my players when I started our latest campaign.
>We are using 5e
>Once a character dies it is dead. There is no coming back from the dead.
>We are using point buy from the PHB.
>We’re here to have fun, if a disagreement interferes with that you may be asked to leave
>On that note I typically don’t allow PvP and never do if people can’t handle it.
>Clean language is preferred, cursing gives a -1 to your next attack roll. Cursing multiple times adds to the cumulative negative to your next roll. These can be negated with 10 pushups or 10 situps per -1.
>If you make a paladin and break your code in a meaningful way you will fall. Like killing unarmed orphan angels or something. That said I DO NOT look for ways to make your paladin fall. Unless you ask me to.
>If you write in or take a background perk that gives you servants or contacts I do not typically kill them off unless you ask me to. If one dies you get the chance to get another one.
>I don’t emphasize alignment but I dont run evil campaigns.
>If you are in high school I will clear you playing with us with your parents and if you have failing grades I may ask you to leave. Grades are a priority.
For context we are all in our twenties and a few of us are trying to work on our language, hence the swearing rule. Sometimes a high schooler has played been in groups I've run and it was cool. Other times it sucked. I'm not being responsible for some kid's lack of control.
>>44482959
If you don't find the head of the Cult fast enough, the planet dies. No ifs, ands, or buts about it, because the Cult won't be the one killing the planet.
Just remember, these sorts of threads are better when they're interactive. Don't just give the rules at your table, critique others' rules as well. Also, present problems and ask for suggestions. That way we can have a lively discussion.
>>44483015
Fuck that noise. Post more four arm people.
>>44482959
Why no ressurection spells?
>>44482990
I like this rule. I dont have a lot of cults in my games usually but I like the idea of them having to track down a guy.
>>44483015
Im game. We have 4 posters in thread but only two rule sets. Want to post one?
>>44482959
>Grades are important
Ooo you had me on your side until this. What a stupid rule
>>44483134
Because dying weeds out the weak.
>>44483138
Sure, just will take a bit (since I include commentary)
>>44483158
I mean, it makes sense, but it's still stupid.
>>44482959
Who died and made you Judge in Israel? You have no right contacting someone's parents and my grades are none of your concern.
And fuckery fucking fuckfuckfuckFUCK.
>>44482959
>Rules emphasise a light, fun game
Ok so beer and pretzels stuff, fine.
>Then have why do you have so many fucking rules?
Is it OP?
>Yes
Faggot confirmed. Kill yourself.
>>44483182
Go ahead and heal the enemy now. Weakest heal you got. Pile on that damage.
>>44483093
Personally I think it removes some tension and drama from game, and players might get reckless. Some permanent consequence is nice.
I am just fond of settings without proper healing magic ( scars and stumps plenty ), no flight, no resurrection...
>>44483158
They dont need great grades, they just need to be passing. I have no interest in an angry call from a parent.
>>44483134
Because I think it takes some of the wonder out of the game, and I dont like everything getting derailed to ress a character who died at level 2.
It comes from personal preference, most of my players agreed, so we just put that rule out front at the beginning so someone doesnt get mad when the other 5 people dont want to stop everything to bring their character back.
>>44482959
Not me but these are the rules my DM goes by
>If you have a character concept, cuust spell/magic item or any other idea that doesn't quite fit the rules, tell me, we can try working something out
>I have the final say how much exp you need to level, weaker characters will have lower requirements, stronger ones higher
>Gestalt classes are allowed, but by default they will require double the amount of exp to level up, depending on how strong the gestalt is, that amount may be adjusted as per rule number two
>We are all here to have fun, I will pretty much allow anything provided it doesn't prevent the rest of the group from having fun
>Yes this includes ERP, if you want to go that way the game can include fetish or lewd aspects, but the moment someone says stop or it looks like it's going to take the entire session and half the group won't be able to do anything, you stop
>Side one-on-one RP/ERP is allowed, but if you wanted to be "canon" tell me and at least give a cliff notes version, you will never gain anything that goes on a charactersheet such as levels, exp, gold, etc. from them but you can lose things, I have the final say if it becomes canon though
>>44483199
>We are using 5e
3.5 is better but whatevs
>Once a character dies it is dead. There is no coming back from the dead.
Fair enough
>We are using point buy from the PHB.
Fair enough
>We’re here to have fun, if a disagreement interferes with that you may be asked to leave
Not wanting That Guy to ruin things, fair enough
>On that note I typically don’t allow PvP and never do if people can’t handle it.
kinda lame but ok
>Clean language is preferred, cursing gives a -1 to your next attack roll. Cursing multiple times adds to the cumulative negative to your next roll. These can be negated with 10 pushups or 10 situps per -1.
lame
>If you make a paladin and break your code in a meaningful way you will fall. Like killing unarmed orphan angels or something. That said I DO NOT look for ways to make your paladin fall. Unless you ask me to.
Fair enough
>If you write in or take a background perk that gives you servants or contacts I do not typically kill them off unless you ask me to. If one dies you get the chance to get another one.
Right on
>I don’t emphasize alignment but I dont run evil campaigns.
Fair enough
>If you are in high school I will clear you playing with us with your parents and if you have failing grades I may ask you to leave. Grades are a priority.
meh
Overall the rules OP wrote seem fine. Only one I dont like is the one on language. Which ones do you not like?
>>44483259
OP here
I like it. Im not down for ERP, but if you and your friends are cool beans. I like the last rule that nothing is permanent unless they tell you.
>>44483259
>If you have a character concept, cuust spell/magic item or any other idea that doesn't quite fit the rules, tell me, we can try working something out
Cool
>I have the final say how much exp you need to level, weaker characters will have lower requirements, stronger ones higher
Fair enough
>Gestalt classes are allowed, but by default they will require double the amount of exp to level up, depending on how strong the gestalt is, that amount may be adjusted as per rule number two
Never played a Gestalt but seems fair
>We are all here to have fun, I will pretty much allow anything provided it doesn't prevent the rest of the group from having fun
Cool
>Yes this includes ERP, if you want to go that way the game can include fetish or lewd aspects, but the moment someone says stop or it looks like it's going to take the entire session and half the group won't be able to do anything, you stop
Cringe
>Side one-on-one RP/ERP is allowed, but if you wanted to be "canon" tell me and at least give a cliff notes version, you will never gain anything that goes on a charactersheet such as levels, exp, gold, etc. from them but you can lose things, I have the final say if it becomes canon though
Makes sense if you allow ERP in the first place.
8/10
>>44483205
What?
>>44483215
What the hell are you talking about? I think you replied to the wrong person.
I like your rules, OP, even though 5e would not be my first choice. Here's mine, based on your template (laying out aaall the rules at my table might take too long).
"Game night is every evening."
Benefits of having a game group that lives in your condo building. Scheduling is easier when it is really regular, and by having frequent play we can cancel individual game nights without severely impacting campaign flow.
Sundays: Eclipse Phase. Mondays: M:tG. Tuesdays: wildcard day (no set game). Wednesdays: wargames. Thursdays: D&D 3.5. Fridays: worship. Saturdays: WH40kRP.
"If you don't show up for an RP night, something horrible may happen to your character."
Using absentees as Worf/redshirts gives us great opportunities for upping the drama. The characters may or may not die from this, depending on the current GM's fancy.
"Nobody GMs more than one game per week"
So I GM the D&D game, another GMs the Eclipse Phase, another the 40kRP, and the other two GM whatever short campaigns they want on Wildcard Day.
"It is Everybody's Setting"
Thus, non-GMs often contribute to designing locations and NPCs, which stay in a folder until used by the GM.
"Bring Food."
Since we see each other every night, we eat together and that means potluck dinners. If people don't have time to cook that's fine (we usually have extra), though we all try to balance it out so nobody's mooching.
"Gaming is serious business"
Humour is fine, but there needs to be a limit on the wacky hijinks.
"Know Your Game"
Not a problem for our group, but I've had lazy players in the past. Little cards with relevant information written on them make things go faster.
"If there is any rules argument, the DM makes the call and we can talk about it after the game."
Rarely comes up, but a rule people should have nonetheless.
"be Excellent to each other"
You know this one.
>>44482959
>What Rules do you lay out to your party before you start playing?
let's see...
1: no evil characters...
look, I normally can't be bothered to enforce the nuances of the alignment system (when there even is one) beyond any mechanical applications, and when presented with a moral dilemma, I usually make sure there is at least one "right" (I.E. not evil) choice. But I generally ban outright evil characters because I find them to more often than not will just be disruptive and cause me more stress than I want. the only way I would ever make an exception is if I know the player well enough to know they can play a LE character and not cause me issues, but that's about it.
2: Players can only pull material (races, classes, feats, spells, etc.) from sourcebooks and 3rd party supplements that I personally own a physical copy of.
this is so I have a reliable reference source that I can go to on my own time to check what the actual verbiage of the entry you are using so I can fully understand what it does and what its limits are. and no bringing YOUR copy of the sourcebook with you doesn't count because then I would only be able to reference it when YOU happen to bring it.
3:...
actually no, I think those two are the only ones I will consistently enforce. any other rules I implement are usually unique to that particular setting/campaign, or are open to negotiation.
so, yeah, just the two... rarely ever have I had someone complain.
>>44483292
>3.5 is better
Kill yourself.
My Dungeons and Dragons rules, which seem to work most of the time. I'm usually the DM.
>I only invite people to play in my game if they are my friend in real life and I enjoy hanging out with them outside the game. If the game does include a new player, then it will be an experimental one-shot with an optional continuation if that player works out.
>The first session is spent eating and chatting and making jokes so that people get a chance to get to know each other. I'd rather have a nice dinner party with friends and have the game be a fun structure than be a slave to the game with people who aren't getting along.
>Setting, lore, and character concepts and stats are worked out together by everyone, so that by the time the first session is over, all players have a good idea what each other PC is going to be and what sort of tone, theme, and story they would enjoy playing.
>The PCs can be most anything from the PHB, but they must start the game as familiar friends or at least a cooperative party with a story-relevant reason for working together.
>Absolutely no interparty violence or theft. If a player wants to have their character do something that upsets another player, then we work it out OOC on the spot. No attack rolls against other PCs, and no intimidation or threats. If the story calls for a cool scene where the party disagrees and scuffles, everyone must be on-board with the idea or else it's just not allowed.
>No murderhobos. The PCs have a job to do and are considered competent professional adventurers. They have some stake in the world and if the player wants to resort to random uncharacteristic violence, then we work it out OOC on the spot to help diagnose what they really want to accomplish and help that player come up with a different course of action.
Usually there are no problems and the players have a good time doing dungeons, combat, intrigue, and other typically role-playing stuff with no fuss.
>Clean language is preferred, cursing gives a -1 to your next attack roll. Cursing multiple times adds to the cumulative negative to your next roll. These can be negated with 10 pushups or 10 situps per -1.
>If you are in high school I will clear you playing with us with your parents and if you have failing grades I may ask you to leave. Grades are a priority.
>For context we are all in our twenties
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K7l5ZeVVoCA
>>44483643
About the second rule, that sounds like a waste, you guys really pick the first session and not play anything?
I'd say scheduling a lunch/dinner somewhere else would already be enough.
Show up on time, gives me a heads up you can't, and don't be antagonistic jackasses to each other.
It works well for online games but I can never get offline groups to do all of themso I don't bother with offline groups anymore.
A certain twitch streamer I like has an elegantly simple set of rules for his chat. These can be applied pretty much anywhere so long as you don't have too many people to deal with everybody on a case-by-case basis:
1. Don't be a buttface.
2. Don't pretend like you don't know what "don't be a buttface" means.
>>44483901
>Show up on time, give me head if you can't
This place has ruined me.
>>44483643
Usually the first session for me becomes character generation and food
>>44482959
Generally speaking, in my campaign, houserules are laid out by me, but feedback on the rules is always encouraged.
How we generate characters depends on the game and setting and intended feel, but a few things are constant, and that is that we all generate them together, we make characters that work together, and you need to run your backstory by me in order to make sure characters are at a place that makes sense in the setting and are ready to go on their journey.
Also, I tell players outright that I am extremely loath to ever kill characters, but that I expect them to not use this as a metagame excuse to be a shitter.
I don't generally set groundrules for decorum, because I am very choosy about who I let into my games anyway, but I am a teacher, so I'm fairly experienced with defusing situations and arbitrating disagreements.
>>44482959
>>Clean language is preferred, cursing gives a -1 to your next attack roll. Cursing multiple times adds to the cumulative negative to your next roll. These can be negated with 10 pushups or 10 situps per -1.
Nice stale copy pasta there.
>>44485595
OP here. I have literally never seen that as a copy pasta anywhere. Out of curiosity can you supply that pasta? Because I would get a kick out of it if it exists.
Or you can use mine as the copy pasta. Either way.
>>44485595
To be fair, it might be okay for some groups. And cursing in certain settings or among some company is impolite.
>>44485637
Than that should be something the individual members of the group work on for themselves, not something the gm uses as a mechanical penalty.
>>44485659
Really depends on how seriously people take the game.
It might be fine for an ultra casual bullshit thing.
My rules are generally only referring stuff that's already caused problems in the past.
>The game isn't on 4chan. You're not an anon there. Edgy chan shit isn't gonna be tolerated.
>I'm fine with running fan fic games, but don't put fan fic stuff in a non fanfic game unless it is just a throwaday reference. For example, you can't play as your waifu in a Maid RPG game. That isn't how Maid RPG works.
>erp is generally private pm stuff. If we wanna do it in a group, we're gonna have to go talk out what our boundaries are. If it should be a focus of a campaign, then we shouldn't really bother with using a system anyway and just do it freeform.
>Players should get to know each other a little bit outside of the game. I helps with the chemistry. We need to do a skype chat, a really long session zero, go out to eat together, etc. first.
>I like character histories and require them. The bigger the better. They give me something to work with. If you're having trouble with one, I will help you.
>I DON'T GIVE A FLYING FUCK WHAT THE PLAYER's HANDBOOK SAYS. We're not gonna not gonna argue over the system's rules for a hour. We're just gonna move on and play our fucking game of make believe.
>Evil characters are perfectly fine to play and can be really fun (some of my best characters are selfish assholes) but there are still often consequences for your actions. If you're a murder hobo, don't be surprised if you have a bad time.
>>44485384
>>44485659
The language thing came from being in the army and getting a pretty foul mouth. Our wives did not appreciate this. So we worked on it and didnt get very far to be honest. So we came up with this idea and it helped alot. Besides 10 pushups isnt a big deal. It quickly curtailed language because doing the pushups was tedious and no one wanted to take a -1. It kind of became something we could laugh about.
The only guy who had a problem ended up going on a cursing string that gave him a -9. When he realized this he cursed until he had a -15. Except we were fighting a dungeon boss and he rolled a hit before negatives. Missing the hit meant someone was definitely going to die since the boss had given the party a thrashing. So potty moth ends looking at 150 pushups or someone (or everyone) dies.
Everyone ended up doing pushups to make the hit count. Ended up being something we still laugh about, and sometimes I let them do pushups for +1 to hit.
And keep in mind that it applies to me as well as the DM. So sometimes the players try to get me to curse in tight scenarios so the demilich or whatev doesnt kill them.
For us it's been fun.
>I hand out stat spreads
>gesalt classes, more starting xp, higher quality background appropriate gear depending on the game
>your character must have games equivalent of how they made money before adventuring
>if they dont, must have a reason
>no min maxing
>no planning your character ahead by 20 levels, 200xp or equivalent
>must have a goal or suggested plot hook
I give my players a lot of neat stuff based on the game we are running but I am not facilitating murderhobobot 9000 in 20XX. Quickest way to piss me off is saying your have a character pre built for a game. Just strikes me as you do not give a shit about anything in campaign and that your character will never try and integrate with the world around them.
>>44483574
>"If you don't show up for an RP night, something horrible may happen to your character."
This seems fine if it's unexcused.
>2: Players can only pull material (races, classes, feats, spells, etc.) from sourcebooks and 3rd party supplements that I personally own a physical copy of.
Makes sense
>>44483639
Love you too ducky
>>44483643
>>The PCs can be most anything from the PHB, but they must start the game as familiar friends or at least a cooperative party with a story-relevant reason for working together.
I like this
No takesie backsies is a rule i use in every game I run. The players actually think about what they're doing instead of trying to be lolrandumb xD
But it's also great when they forget about the rule and get themselves stuck in a ridiculous situations
>>44482959
Do as I say, not as I do.
>>44486667
Otherwise the rules I have are "don't be a dick" and "gms word is law"
My group is mostly close friends so we're all chill enough to not hit that guy territory anymore.
>>44482959
>1: The game is on Saturday in the afternoon for a fucking reason, because more often than not all of you can make it that one day. Don't try to set up personal sessions so that your party rogue can go off into the demon realm and start a race war again.
>2: You want to have sex with an NPC/PC? Fade to black, roll for impregnation. Going into extremely vivid detail in your head is fine, but I didn't sign up for DMing to hear what you're doing to that guardsman.
>3: Come to me in secret if you have evil plans you want to spring on the party. I have the entire last half hour of the session for you to do just that.
>4: Don't be a dick
>5: Don't be a fucking dick.
>6: If I tell you that we're doing a new game of 5e, but it's Star Wars, you better be dressed for the occasion.
Other than that, if a player wants to be a warforged stripper from the Nine Hells, or something equally insane, I'll allow it just to see what happens.
>"Lol no cursing at the table!"
>100% of the thread agrees that OP is good and these are rules to abide by
Holy fuck /tg/ I hate you so much.
Been DM'ing for so long I don't even have rules anymore. I just know how to make my players not act like fuckwits by DM'ing well.
No time for ruining the fun when everyone's always going "fuck that was awesome"
>ITT: Shit tier DM's
>>44482959
Pretty shit rules. I wouldn't play with you if I was paid.
>>44487033
Well considering he knows little about dnd and is running the game for children along with being one himself, he fits the demographic pretty well.
Any game with players over 20 would throw him out on purpose anyway, so be glad he is bringing people into the hobby and showing them how not to be a gm. He is also showing them how to effectively babysit as well so I commend him on giving his players life skills no longer taught in schools.
>>44487071
Let me guess, Monty Haul Wacky Hijinks Everyone Plays Joke Characters hour?
>>44482959
>We are using 5e
Systems are a preference thing, whatever.
>Once a character dies, it is dead. There is no coming back from the dead.
Eh. I usually don't forbid Resurrection spells, but they're massively difficult to get and most groups I play in don't have characters that want to bother getting the materials needed for them.
>We are using Point Buy from the PHB
Fucking gross.
>I don't typically allow PVP
Good. PVP is fucking retarded, and the people that do it are almost always 'Those Guys'. In my experience, at least.
>Cursing rule
Okay, fuck off. If you want to work on your language that's fine, but don't apply this rule to everyone at the table because you can't handle foul language.
>Paladin rule
Isn't this how most groups run it? I always enforce Paladin codes.
>Servants or Contacts
I usually forbid these, but only because I've never seen them ran well.
>Don't run evil campaigns.
This falls in with PVP for me. 90% of 'evil' campaigns I've seen are the players being Chaotic Stupid and having their first actions be something akin to burning down an orphanage.
>High School Rule
I mean, I usually just refuse to play with anyone not out of high school because I'm a 25 year old male and inviting children to enter muh magical realm would look sketchy as shit, but I can understand it.
As for me:
>No PVP unless both players agree to it, and there's actual IC reason for it.
>No OOC discussion of how to bring down a monster. If you're talking about tactics during combat, I'm going to assume it's IC, and sentient creatures will react accordingly by changing their tactics.
>I don't give two shits about alignment, but I don't respond to Chaotic Stupid.
I'm pretty loose with it, honestly, but only because I've been playing with this group for 4 years and know they aren't retarded.
>>44487131
Just ran a cold-war era espionage game where the twist was they were playing CoC and I was slow rolling the Mythos shit.
Before that I ran an epic fantasy game inspired by Malazan where each player had several characters and every session was a stand-alone story, they swapped characters each session and many of them took places decades apart. It's on hiatus cuz one of the players had major surgery and they voted to wait cuz they're all invested in continuing the story together.
Thinking of running another short game while we wait, was thinking maybe a western.
My table has one major rule:
I don't care who it is, but someone is going to be under the table sucking my dick. You can decide amongst yourselves who that will be. Particularly dedicated or skilled service may be rewarded in-game.
I haven't had any problems so far.
>>44486999
>warforged stripper from the Nine Hells
>Bot intended to be demon entertainment that escapes and goes on an adventure
I'm in
There is a lot of salt in this thread.
No min-maxing ever. I let 2 people do it, let it slide with them, and they both ruined the game.
Both of them couldnt stop talking about how much better their characther was, repeatedly breaking roleplay to ask about some items to make himself stronger, and complaining about every decision i make.
The first guy lasted 2 sessions. I dont know how i put up with it for so long, but it was probably the least fun the players have ever had. The second guy got booted mid-session because he started attacking the party and said "HAHA I WAS CHAOTIC EVIL ALL ALONG". He could basically party wipe by himself so i just kicked him out of the room. (It was a roll20 game)
>We are using 5e
Who cares. This is a discussion about the table, not the game.
>Once a character dies it is dead. There is no coming back from the dead.
After dealing with reintroducing character for 15+ years of gaming experience. I've very much realized regardless of game: Introducing new characters is shit and usually detracts from everyone at the table. Unless something meaningful killed the PC (Plot points, epic battle, Villain fight) Characters live with horrible scars. That said it should be obvious anyone intentionally abusing this gets kills.
Also if it`s a TPK well that`s universally death anyway. And often a sign to change games.
>We are using point buy from the PHB.
Fucking gross. We tend to play for fun at our table. Random rolls for all gaming systems are usually the prefer choice when available.
>We’re here to have fun.
It`s weird that people specifically mention that. If you aren`t playing for fun, why are you playing?
>PvP
There are games made with PvP in mind such as paranoia. Not like rogue trader or D&D.
>Clean language is preferred
I tend to try and not play with children. So it's not a problem.
>If you make a paladin and break your code in a meaningful way you will fall.
Everyone's real life view on alignment is (very) different. A paladin falls when the player thinks he's reached a meaningful threshold. If a player asks out loud "Do I fall?" He already knows the answer.
>Servants or contacts
Servants? Fine. Contacts? Fine. However I personally hate additional combat-NPCs that aren't PCs, and I let people know that ahead of time. That said I don't make any extra effort to kill them off, because that's just vindictive.
>I don’t emphasize alignment but I dont run evil campaigns.
Define Evil.
Evil campaigns can happen. All players must agree on why they get along ahead of time. If it leads to PvP, play something else.
>high school grades
There are other fish in the sea, that don`t come with grade limitations.
I only have one rule at my table.
>If you don't have a background on your character, that is completely fine. I will make UP a background for your character FOR you, and you do not have the right to complain about the results.
This has created some very, very interesting stories told at my tables. Such as the Elf Charleton who's secret past is she faked her own death to run off with a rich lovers' fortune.
No magical realms allowed
>>44482959
okay mom you can go back to reddit now
![what-kind_take-quiz%25282%2529_resize508__1_1[1].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/Jb57UnE.jpg "what-kind_take-quiz%25282%2529_resize508__1_1[1].jpg")
>>44483574
>fridays
>worship
>>44485813
That actually sounds pretty neat, although without proper context it would rub me the wrong way.
>>44485813
I REALLY fucking hope this is a rule you can opt out of, because forcing other people to adhere to your personal decision to not swear as much is pretty shitty, not going to lie.
>>44490577
It was something we all agreed to, since we ALL had the problem. The rules are for people who want to join in our group.
We have had people who have opted out before, but they typically stop coming on their own. The ones who stay might raise their eyebrows at it, but its never been an issue.
>>44490577
Additionally we had one guy who couldnt do pushups or situps because of injuries (he was no longer in the service) so we ended up doing the sit ups and push ups for him.
Mainly it's been teenagers who have had a problem with it.
>>44482959
DM lightning damage to players that are:
Talking way too much out of turn
On their phone and/or not paying attention
Generally being a cunt
Damage is dependent on character level. It should hurt just enough for them to get the idea.
>>44482959
>lol better do some pushups u potty mouth!
>a full group of twenty-somethings in 2016 still think curse words are something they need to "work" on
>they all consciously agreed to make their natural vocabulary a problem in their hobby
>they all married individual women who each had a problem with someone having an army soldier's mouth when they were actually in the army
>a kid playing for one night a week with you and likely spending one hour a week separately to deal with his character changes will be cut off if every single day otherwise wasn't the best for his schoolwork
>no rule to kick a 20-something out if they get laid off of their job
I hardly even disagree with what you're doing, here, it's just really interesting that your group has made the reasoned decision to utterly shit on each other in the name of "fun." If you have any other rules from earlier campaigns, I'd honestly like to see what you guys managed to come around to enforcing.
>>44493397
You have an odd definition of shitting on each other friend.
