>Researchers Mary Ellin Logue (University of Maine) and Hattie Harvey (University of Denver ) agree, and they have documented the benefits of boys' "bad guy" superhero action narratives. Teachers tend not to like such play, say Logue and Harvey, but it improves boys' conversation, creative writing skills, and moral imagination. Swedish boys, like American boys, are languishing far behind girls in school. In a 2009 study Logue and Harvey ask an important question the Swedes should consider: "If boys, due to their choices of dramatic play themes, are discouraged from dramatic play, how will this affect their early language and literacy development and their engagement in school?"
http://www.theatlantic.com/sexes/archive/2012/12/you-can-give-a-boy-a-doll-but-you-cant-make-him-play-with-it/265977/
This got me thinking. What if suppressing the rough-and-tumble school-yard role-playing of boys cripples their ability to thoughtfully play role playing games as young adults? Are well-meaning adults castrating their imaginations?
>>44344333
Possibly.
Men are already useless tbqh family. We're just going to have to painfully suffer through the last gasps together.
>>44344333
Just get your kid to play a contact sport
>>44344333
>Are well-meaning adults castrating their imaginations?
Well, duh, that's has been the point of institutionalized education since Marie-motherfucking-Thérèse.
>>44344333
I think humans, especially men, have a deep-seated need to think of violent struggles, perhaps in preparation for the hunt. In the modern world the hunt may never come but the animal within still yearns for it. Experiencing violence by proxy via media is how we cope.
I don't think allowing actual physical "rough and tumble" play has any real benefit. Permanent injury is possible. Pretend fighting and playing cops and robbers might be good and essential though.
>>44344563
spoken like a slave-mind nigger
a panther speaks:
they can't tell you how to act when you get off school, so the boys go underground. as a result, we become very good liars and very good at gurellia warfare, to fight when the great eye is not looking.
think of what those boys will be like 20 years from now....those who obey will be soft sheep, the ones who played the game on the street will be tigers....
>Another preschool removed "free playtime" from its schedule because, as a pedagogue at the school put it, when children play freely 'stereotypical gender patterns are born and cemented. In free play there is hierarchy, exclusion, and the seed to bullying.'
Sweden seems like the worst place on earth.
>>44344628
lol. this nigga and his fight club shit
>>44344628
"Tigers" do not fare well in the world where knowledge is king.
>>44344640
It's a Hell filled with the limp-wristed faggot descendants of Vikings. Modern Swedes are so pathetic that there is a video floating around on /k/ of a Swedish man firing a rifle and then crying in fear.
>Be a kid
>Find a stick on the ground
>Desperately want to pretend that it's a sword
>The consequences will be dire if they catch you bandying the stick about
What's a kid to do?
>>44344640
On one hand they seem to be taking this too far. On the other Swedish society seems to be miles ahead of much of the western world when it comes to individual well-being and happiness.
>>44344673
I'll take faggots over, say, Murica's macho blockheads who can't help but shoot each other once a day.
>>44344706
read a book
or get a real sword
>>44344711
>On the other Swedish society seems to be miles ahead of much of the western world when it comes to individual well-being and happiness.
Nah m8. They were 20 years ago, then they cuckolded themselves and imported a trillion Somalis to fuck their wives.
>>44344711
>On the other Swedish society seems to be miles ahead of much of the western world when it comes to individual well-being and happiness.
Consider the following:
>Those sky-high happiness surveys, it turns out, are mostly bunk. Asking people “Are you happy?” means different things in different cultures. In Japan, for instance, answering “Yes” seems like boasting, Booth points out. Whereas in Denmark, it’s considered “shameful to be unhappy,” newspaper editor Anne Knudsen says in the book.
http://nypost.com/2015/01/11/sorry-liberals-scandinavian-countries-arent-utopias/
>>44344711
Outside of the urban centers, where all the gangs hang out, American crime rates are comparable to Europe. The FBI estimates that on average 48% of all violent crime is due to gang violence, while on the border near Mexico they can be responsible for as high as 90%.
In addition, even including urban centers the US has a violent crime rate significantly lower than many other developed countries - the problem is that these countries are often excluded arbitrarily from comparisons, despite being well-developed. Russia comes to mind, as does Mexico.
I realize it's a popular meme to paint Americans as violent psychos, but the crime rate among concealed carry permit holders is vastly lower than among non-carriers. We're civilized people, we just have rougher mannerisms than our European cousins.
We also deny any relation to Scandinavians.
>>44344791
That's a good point. I might be wrong.
>>44344815
I don't know what to tell you. I'm from Israel, a country locked in constant (sometimes overt, sometimes cold and subtle) war with most of its neighbors, where terrorist attacks happen on a monthly basis, where insurgents occasionally decide to fire (to be fair, usually ineffectual) rockets at population centers, where nearly every 18 year old male is issued an automatic rifle and the death rate due to violence is still lower than in the US. I don't think that you're lying to me but this still seems really strange.
>>44344940
I don't know for certain, so correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm given to understand that most countries don't include terrorism in their homicide statistics.
Now, with that said, I return to my point about urban centers. Chicago is practically a war zone. These places are absolute dung heaps, seething with crime and gangs.
Crime is almost entirely a socioeconomic phenomenon, thus, where you have poverty, high population density, minorities who refuse to integrate, and high drug traffic, crime goes up.
>>44344711
>depressed brainwashed cuckold betas lie to themselves and to the world saying they are happy being cattle
How surprising, when the masters asks the slave the same would the slave dare speak up? They were taught all their life that they need to be ambitionless and accept their pathetic lives for what they are instead of working for anything better, they were taught rising up to follow your dreams or desires is evil and that it is the original sin thar ruined the world.
>>44344940
>>44344791
The source in question, the New York Post, is a right-wing mouthpiece tabloid not unlike UK's The Sun. I'd take their article with more than a few grains of salt if I were you.
>>44344940
Because Israel doesn't have fucking wall-hopping chicanos, redneck nazis, and thug niggas. It has a tiny population, and doesn't have an internal political warfare that stops anyone from doing anything meaningful to stop retarded people who commit crimes.
>>44344658
Except 'tigers' in his scenario are literally people with more functional knowledge of getting what they want.
>>44344940
Not >>44344815. Chop it up to most of the poor and/or minority groups.
Just go to FBI crimestats and check that shit out.
>https://www.fbi.gov/stats-services/crimestats
Also, arrests...
>https://www.fbi.gov/about-us/cjis/ucr/crime-in-the-u.s/2014/crime-in-the-u.s.-2014/tables/table-43
>>44345264
lol. is it your bedtime yet
>>44345158
Hmm. Could be. I recall that the article in question referred to violence in general but it is possible that acts classified as terrorism are not counted, in which case my whole point is moot. If we reject the idea that America is just really violent another possibility is that the Israeli police is more than a little racist toward the Arab population and so is able to crack down harder than a more egalitarian police force.
What I can say for certain though is that there are practically no cases of school shootings and this is despite of the fact that an assault rifle is extremely easy to come by.
>>44345182
Man the "cattle" is comprised of the wage slaves who serve those who hold a profession of actual value.
>>44345192
I noticed that due to the tone of the article but the argument in question still holds some merit.
>>44345280
To note, African Americans are about 15% of the US population.
>>44345308
The school shootings thing is more of a factor that our media glorifies the fuckers. Also the complete breakdown of any mental health infrastructure decades ago.
The people who do it are largely literal retards who decide to have their name up in lights on all the headlines for a couple months and still pop up years later.
>>44344673
Tbh firing a big gun can be pretty startling if you're not used to such things (I don't know about America, but around here most people don't regularly fire rifles). I probably wouldn't cry, but considering I'm sensitive to loud noises, I probably wouldn't be very good at shooting with anything you have to hold right next to your face and makes a very loud bang.
>>44345308
At least when it comes to the school shootings, you have to take into account America's outrageously huge population. Even one mass shooting event in a country as small as Israel would give it a higher "rate" of mass shootings than the U.S.
Though it could also be a symptom of the fact that your crazy people are using rockets.
>>44345386
I'm such a weak faggot that when I volunteered for the neighborhood watch and was given a rifle my arm started to hurt from just aiming for ~30 minutes. Shit's heavy. Maybe the guy's a pansy and got hit hard by the recoil.
>>44345386
Sure, it can be startling, but this guy was literally in tears. Not to mention, he was a decently large guy and the rifle was an AR-15, not known for heavy recoil.
In contrast, I took my sister's hipster friend to the range one day and let him shoot my guns. He thought they were awesome. Swedes have been so conditioned to total helplessness that they can't grasp the idea of using a weapon.
>>44345494
>that they can't grasp the idea of using a weapon.
I think that's great. Less shooting leads to a more peaceful world
>>44345579
What if there's a draft and you need to serve your country? Weapons should not be idolized but neither should they be feared.
>>44345579
>Learned helplessness is good
Anon, you're what's wrong with the West. Independence is a virtue. Total dependence on the state for your protection is a sign of an emasculated culture that is GOING to either react and go full /pol/, or it will die with a whimper.
The world is full of bad people, and being helpless before them is never a good thing. Buy a gun and learn to shoot. Walk the path of /k/.
>>44345579
Being sheltered leads to a bunch of things:
Less ability to defend yourself.
Less ability to stay calm under pressure.
Less emotional stability.
Inability to accomplish things without relying on others.
>>44345625
oh then we bring out the white feather women and shame our neutered men into dying for their country.
>>44345649
>>44345579
And a few more:
Poor self image.
Lack of confidence.
Inability to learn and apply knowledge without aid.
Depression.
Projection of these perceived inadequacies in the world around the subject.
Projection of self-loathing.
Perceiving judgement where there is none.
Guilt.
Inability to pursue one's interests.
One side effect may sound "cool" but it's basically making men (and women) into children.
>>44345579
I assume you mean 'peaceful' in the 'peace is an adequate translation for subservience so call it the religion of peace' sense of the word?
>>44345755
checked and keked
>>44345755
>mfw Scandinavians are engineering their culture for Islamic domination
Also checked
>>44344333
I blame all on Fredrik Reinfeldt.
>>44345386
you get used to it real quick
>>44344673
It's so bad, I saw that on Japanese TV.
The Japs are even making fun of the Swedes for being faggots.
>>44345745
>>44345649
That's a nice list you pulled out of your ass mang.
Can't have people thinking a life of anything other than war is preferable. Peace = fags amirite?
>>44347116
He's not wrong. Learned helplessness and dependence encourages all those things. Personal independence and self-reliance are virtues, and knowing how to protect yourself and your loved ones is a part of those virtues.
>>44345717
They'll be confused that women have done a 180
>>44347116
Pursuit of strength and independence is necessary to be a fully developed human being. Learning how to use force and defend yourself is part of that.
>>44347116
>Can't have people thinking a life of anything other than war is preferable.
How did you pull that conclusion out of "know how to defend yourself?"
>>44347116
You got the order wrong. I am saying they are "pacifists" (as if) because they were bred as sheltered people, and being sheltered bringa those characteristics as nice little bonuses.
>>44347116
There is such a thing as a middle ground between "helpless child" and "blood-crazed warmonger", you know.
>>44347116
Pacifisrst can still believe in self defence
>>44347438
I recall there being some religious sect, can't remember the name, that are pacifists, yet carry knives/daggers to defend themselves or others who are threatened.
Think it was either an Indian or Middle Eastern sect, but I can't recall the name.
>>44344628
You know that Africa doesn't have tigers, right?
>>44347638
Sikh, brotier
>>44347677
Oh, I thought Sikhs were a different group for some reason. They're the cool ones with the turbans, right?
>>44347638
Sikhs.
There's a lot of brown people in my country. Most are pretty variable, but Sikhs are always decent. As expected of a faith that arose to oppose Islamic aggression.
>>44344333
What makes you think the people doing it are well-meaning?
>>44347701
Yep
>>44344711
They are miles ahead on some measures, I'll give you that.
>>44347765
Yeah, those guys can come to my country.
>>44347785
Huh, I guess they don't ACTUALLY say "yes" in sweden.
>>44344628
This thread is obviously 0% /tg/-related, but I used to work in the US public school system, and I could tell plenty of stories that support this. The one that comes to mind right away is when I was working in an all-day day care and some of the boys had constructed toy guns out of connecting blocks. The supervisor saw them and said "Those better be guns that shoot candy", the boys lied to her and said "they are", then went back to shooting each other after she left, thus learning valuable lying and disregarding skills
>>44344640
If unrestricted free play leads to stereotypical gender roles, doesn't that mean that those roles are natural and not socially constructed?
Or is this some kind of "the patriarchy corrupts children from the day they're born" thing.
>>44344673
This one?
>>44351018
>If unrestricted free play leads to stereotypical gender roles, doesn't that mean that those roles are natural and not socially constructed?
people throughout history have tried to paint their particular leanings as "natural" or in line with what is natural
there is no such thing as "unrestricted" free play
children left without the guiding hand of educational officials will, in line with their instincts as social animals, organize themselves in ways inspired by social structures they see elsewhere in society - through their parents or their out-of-school unstructured time
and these social structures will recreate the stereotypical roles, gender or otherwise. that are found elsewhere in society
there's no point in seizing the instruments of state power if you're not going to use them to indoctrinate the youth
>>44348692
They won't even fuck your wife when they do.
Still a few assholes here and there, but overall Sikhs are pretty cool people.
>>44351018
No, because children who are in a school system are by definition socialized.
They watched TV, they read books (or had them read to them), they observed their parents.
Each of those things gave them a mild imprint on how the world works.
They play games like Cowboys and Indians, or Cops and Robbers, because those are the images and ideas that were presented to them.
>>44344333
Man that article is shitty at arguing its own point.
But to your question: unlikely. One of the core points of role-playing is to experience what is denied oneself. The ability to wield magic, the knowledge of martial arts, strength, nimbleness, charisma. These are all traits a player may give a character BECAUSE they themselves lack them. Being denied the ability to do something doesn't make one unable to imagine it. The closest it ever comes to that is stating the boys have lower MORAL imagination, which is a different quality than standard imagination.
>>44352234
>Being denied the ability to do something doesn't make one unable to imagine it.
Kids aren't denied the ability to kill goblins; they are denied the ability to pretend to kill goblins. OP is hinting at a pretend continuum. The games we play rely on imagination. The games kids play also rely on imagination. What if imagination is something that improves with use? What if the imagination of kids is suppressed because it often has violent undertones?
>>44352234
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KZ04mfAY2BU
Except kids and even adults do actually act out what they imagine it seems to be a natural part of this process. We remove ourselves from one part of the process is it not foolhardy to claim the other will not be affected?
