Supposing you had a medieval fantasy version of Navy SEALs, an elite force of some kingdom or empire, on what level would they be?
I'm trying to fluff up something like that for a nation of mine and figure out a bit of geographics and power levels while there.
>>44079008
Depending on the time, probably lowborn mercs who are fully equipped in the most advanced armor of the time all wielding polearms and have cavalry, along with crossbows or an arquebus depending on the era.
>>44079008
The 3 musketeers
English longbow archers, there's truly no more efficient death machine.
>>44079139
>believing the English Longbow Meme
>>44079008
That depends on what kind of medievalfantasy your looking at is it Arthurian, lotr,or DnD styled
Level 2 rangers. Maybe an occasional 3rd or even 4th level super-badass thrown into the mix.
The commander of the whole gang, the top dog, might be level 5.
>>44079008
I think what fits better is something linger the D&D ranger, but focused for the army. A guerilla army that is equipped with heavy crossbows or warbows, and have training and knowledge about most terrains to feel at home in the wilds both in their own country and aboard. They'd be given missions that can't be carried by an army, like ambushing the enemy supply lines within enemy controlled territory, kill enemy leadership, cause fires and other sort of damage to enemy infrastructure, and then disappear in the wild, harassing pursuers.
If the fantasy element is strong in the setting, some magical means of deployment behind enemy lines, either teleportation or flying there mounted on winged creatures, that will give the mobility elite forces of today rely on to perform their duties.
>>44079454
Ok so this us a DnD setting then?
since it's medieval fantasy:
>regular soldiers
Can't use magic.
>mlg pro soldiers
Can use magic.
something as simple as that is enough I guess
>>44079555
Even if the system was riddle of steel, i'd use the same setup; Ranged weapon training, wilderness expertise, survival skills, stealth, tracking.
But yes, when no setting is specified and 'medieval fantasy' is mentioned, I tend to default to 'something something middle earth something something dungeon and dragons'
>>44079008
What do you mean by "medieval version of Navy SEALs"? In their objectives, in their group tactics, their group size?
>>44079620
I mean their
>level
As in their character level.
>>44079555
Because if it is I think rogues would work better as a special forces unit than anything both mechanically and story wise after all sneak attack and disarm trap is much better for the jobs tell be doing
>>44079639
Depends rather heavily on the system.
What would separate fantasy SEALs from their normal dudes, apart from discipline, veterancy and skill, would be their infil/exfil. How they get into the shit, and get out.
Something like: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sogdian_Rock
>>44079671
Outside of D&D, how many class and level systems are there anyway?
>>44079698
Many. But okay, D&D. Probably levels 3-4 or so.
>>44079656
I don't know much about the seals but they arn't green berrets thier an off shoot of the Marines so if your looking for a nation that would use them your looking at places like Englend and Japan places that are more reliant on strong a Navy (I lm sure I misspelled that) the nation would then most likely be in a difficult situation were they couldn't openly make military actions so ether a vassals to some larger nation or mabe thier bound to some ancient oath it would be interesting to have a paladin nation that can't make overt actions aginst the other so the have a special forces unit
Level 2-5 rogues and rogue/wizards. They primarily fight with wands, thrown weapons like explosives/alchemical whatevers, and crossbows - all produced by the all-wizard R&D department.
>>44079008
Well there are a couple of different levels which you can be discussing there.
As far as the actual crunch level goes, depends on what sort of setting you are and the power of the PC's. they're more experienced than everyone else though and very good at their jobs so class levels are appropriate. If the setting is rife with powerful beings and issues then they'll be on their way to about the 10th to 15th range (in my opinion), if it's more low magic or there is only going to be one world ending event that the PC's are the chosen ones to defeat then I would say level 5 is the max cap. In that setting they are going to be deployed to handle the normal military issues that our own Special Forces groups are specialized in taking care of.
The other level that you could be talking about it the level of the nation in question. Their power in comparison to their neighbors. If this is a not!SEALs team then the nation is going to have to be quite wealthy and powerful so they can support the amount of training and equipment needed to outfit the teams. They are going to be one of the worlds shakers and movers. Of course the moment they put one together then any other nation that has even the barest capability to do so will also put together a similar team as a counter. Hell even an oncoming Barbarian horde could have a team of specialists that range ahead of them and soften up the areas they're going to pillage. But this sort of team is only going to be made through pure experience, the barbarian nation won't have the infrastructure necessary to create the team.
in the medieval era, honor was a thing. I don't think elite units would fight using subterfuge off the battlefield. You might have something like raiding parties or princely cohorts, which would be horsemen in armor equipped with swords and (depending on the technology) pistols
As for dishonorable forces, perhaps you're thinking of Robin hood? Spies and saboteurs wouldn't operate like tom clancy operators, and bribery was used often to get castle defenses to be raised
if this is a d&d setting with magic, enchanted weapons in an adventuring party all the way. Probably a mix of mages and fighters. Mages making the core damage and specialized fighters tasked with getting them about and effecting entries. No time for healers, just use potions
Another thing to keep in mind is that you don't need levels to an effective force Tuker's kolbolds are a good example of a gurela force
>>44080247
>in the medieval era, honor was a thing
It really was not.
>>44080331
okay. Can you give examples?
>>44080347
The whole "knight in a shining armor" image of a honorable paladin was a much later invention, brought up to romaticize the past. In reality, your average knight was just a thug on a horse.
Knightly orders were less like paragons of nobility and more like medieval biker gangs.
>>44079008
Mercs, man!
Look up Landsknecht.
Also, DG cell lost in time?
>>44080402
this is pretty much true. Tournaments were often held to keep the knights engaged so they wouldnt become roving bandits.
>>44080124
As far as the classes they have training in it cannot be boiled down to just a couple. In order to have an effective team it needs to be balanced much the same way a normal adventuring party is. You still need your tank, your sneaky guy, your long range guy, your healer (unless they're all just loaded down with healing potions). That said of course all of these roles are still going to be combat oriented and oriented to the environment and roles they're supposed to fill. That's way you end up differentiating them is their area of expertise, much the same way our own special forces are set up.
Yes you can send the team into just about any situation and they will do better than just your regular forces simply because they're better. But when you need to get inside of an enemy nation and assassinate one of their generals then you pick the team specialized for urban combat. Meanwhile hunting down a rouge sorcerer inside the Elven forest is what you use the team built to handle the forest for.
Our own forces are used much the same way. The Rangers are our elite paratroopers and their original job was one thing, capturing and holding areas of strategic importance deep in enemy territory, specifically airfields. The Marine Raiders were used to secure beachheads. The Navy Seals are a highly optimized force designed around amphibious insertion. And Air Force Parajumpers are a search and rescue unit that can recover injured or surrounded units from enemy territory, even under enemy fire. The Green Berets in Vietnam were force multipliers. Training friendly local forces to the point that they could support our own operations with us putting our own soldiers at risk.
That is a very brief (and messy) overview and honestly, nowadays, those specializations aren't as focused on when deploying them. They're solid guidelines though.
>>44079008
The Malazan marines were the operators of their setting.
What would it take, in a fantasy land, for a character to grow past first level by training alone? This topic seems to suggest that sort of a thing, but by my understanding it's not usually seen as possible.
>>44080509
But that is also because the US armed forces are sufficiently bloated to carry multiple special forces teams at once.
Most nations have one general-purpose SF force, and then a number of ultra-focused roles that could have been a SF unit but instead are attached to units when they need combat escort and have sufficient combat skills to to substantially impede their performance.
>>44079008
Level 8-10 dnd levels
5-10 of them a single team for the kingdom all rangers, rogues or fighters
They are badass they kill monsters for a living. And conduct covert warfare against enemy nations fuck this level 3 trope why would you send a level 3 lose who is going to likely be caught and then betray the fact that you sent them.
Elite forces are elite
>>44081244
Depends how many of them survive the training.
The XP for a commoner can be enough in fights to the death to level up.
>>44081386
Yeah, that's actually a fair point. But might still be a good marker for a highly militaristic nation in whatever world you're playing in. Or a church even, a large rich church in a setting where gods and demons are real things that can affect the world would benefit a lot from special forces
>>44079008
Assassins.
>>44081618
tiny thumb-sized assassins
>>44081635
that's what makes them so effective
>>44079139
>>44079199
The English Longbow is the Western Samurai with his Katana of doom.
>>44079008
The Elite Group of my setting were a Company of Rangers. Considering the average town guard was level 8 I had these guys placed around level 14, each had a bow with numerous types of arrow and a set of short swords for CQB. They reported directly to the Kings counsel of Himself, Spy Master and High Bishop.
