What's the proper system to play as operators?
>>43842901
This is, unironically, one of the things GURPS does well, better than most other systems I'd say.
>>43842914
GURPS has like a million splatbooks, right? Which one should I check?
>>43842931
High Tech for all kind of gear.
Tactical Shooting has stuff about how operators operate, and how to translate it into GURPS. Although it makes things way too tedious for me, but if you want deeply realistic operations, it's always there.
If you want 80s action movies operators, there's the Action booklets line.
Also I believe Gun Fu has a few interesting bits regardless of how cinematic you want your game to be. (It's a rather short book too, glossing over for interesting bits shouldn't take that long.)
>>43843028
Thanks, I'll give it a shot. I know fuck all about GURPS though, and it gets a lot of shit on /tg/, apparently for being rules heavy?
>>43843072
It's more like it's rules-optional heavy.
It's a crunchier system then most, but most people get into this stuff with D&D, and the systems prior to 5e are equally or more complex, and in certain cases counter-intuiative.
GURPS is really no less or more complex then these, just requiring a bit more work as you are doing the fine-tuning yourself.
>>43843108
I'll give it a shot, thanks mate.
>>43843072
VERY rules heavy. You know how most systems have a few broad strokes skills? (i.e. "Stealth" to cover most sneaking things) GURPS instead has a bazillion different skills that are usually only useful in one particular situation (shit like Small sword, large sword, axe, mace)
On top of that, it's usually needlessly complicated.
>>43843181
>"have good information and advice even if you aren't actually playing gurps"
This is why I own GURPS books. I've never actually played it, though I'd be open to it. But books have helped me with stuff alot, like making a freeform game based on the Chinese celestial bureacracy, to writing the background of my WWII vet character in a horror campaign. to coming up with characters and styles for Street Fighter the Storyteller game.
>>43843323
Okay this makes me want to actually purchase some of the books. Which ones would you recommend?
>>43843350
I don't have many. But some that I've mentioned being helpful were China and Martial Arts.
I'd say just look through some of the PDFS until you find a subject or two you like/are interested in.
https://mega.nz/#F!RcJUHApY!uVGhU1FAZaWQAURsfrOgyQ!8cgQgBpL
I'd say just get the PDFs. If you want to pay money for research books, actually buy dedicated books on the subject. The GURPS books just make for a good introduction.
However, >>43843255 this is why I've never actually been eager to play it myself or tried to run a campaign in it.
>>43843438
Thanks.
>>43843438
I guess I need to also mention that Supers was helpful in GMing advice, but other super hero rpg systems probably have all the same advice.
>>43843255
>You know how most systems have a few broad strokes skills? (i.e. "Stealth" to cover most sneaking things)
I won't deny that GURPS skill list is on the heavy side, but funny you should use that as an example...
>>43842901
Delta Green
OPs & Tactics
Phoenix Command
(In descending order of sanity)
>>43843255
As much as it pains me to defend GURPS, they do have wildcard skills (I think that's what they're called) to cut down on the skill lists. Personally my big complaint about GURPS skills is that they make character creation even more of a pain in the ass than point buy systems normally are since their costs scale in a non-linear fashion (meanwhile, just about everything else scales cost-wise in a linear fashion).
Is this something ORE is bad for?
>>43846085
No. It's pretty good actually. One roll hit zone damage is nothing to sneer at. It stays pretty random, so it's deadly. Wild Talents has some gun stats. You can even make tanks or jets with ORE Mecha and some houseruling. Add a year's subscription to Jane's Defence Weekly and you're about set.
>>43842901
OP, These people
>>43842914
>>43843028
>>43843108
>>43843181
>>43843539
>>43845304
Are correct. Gurps is an Excellent system for playing as Operators.
There's also Ops and Tactics, a homebrew written by a /tg/ guy.
Twilight 2013 is also a good one, as is Spycraft (2e).
Just whatever you do, stay the fuck away from D20 Modern.
But since this is one of the few places I have expertise running, EXACTLY what kind of game are you trying to run?
>>43846221
Fuck it. I've always wanted to do this.
If I get any of the gurps stuff wrong gurpsfags, please correct me.
>A comparative Analysis of GURPS and Ops and Tactics for Gun Combat/Operator Games
>GURPS
Gurps uses a turn system where, for the most part, a single player can do a single thing. This works for the system because it is supposed to represent a shorter amount of time than the D20 system.
Gurps, at it's core, uses generic weapons, but with books such as Hi-Tech, as well as a massive amount of user generate content, gives the option for various weapons and ammunition. Gurps also has an extremely robust character creation system, that (can) account for anything about a character. It also has semi-generic books on tactics, use of weapons, interesting tidbits on certain weapons, and the like. Each weapon has it's own specific damage and range.
The primary Die is 3d6, and d6 are used for nearly everything.
>Ops and Tactics
Ops and Tactics uses a Time Unit/Combat Point system for it's combat, where every action cost a certain amount of points and they can be completed in any order. It retains the 6 second combat turns from it's heritage.
Ops and Tactics has the largest specific firearm list of any RPG ever made, so if you care about that, then there you go. Firearm damage in particular is based on the caliber of the firearm, not the specific weapon. The specific weapon determines range, and a host of other things(Like if it jams or not). There is a host of different ammunition as well. Character creation is not as robust, due to the fact that Ops and Tactics's primary focus is to create a combat game, so a lot of the things noted in gurps would be either ignored or put on as character details. It has a bunch of books on guns(armory), as well as various splat drops detailing new equipment, new guns, and new ammunition types.
The Primary Die as of 5e is 3d6, with every die(Except for the d20) used for damage, counters, and effect statuses.
>>43842901
The Albedo RPG plays like Rainbow Six except with anthropomorphic animals so YMMV.
>>43846418
The only thing wrong is that you haven't killed yourself yet. When are you going to realize no one likes your shit and give up?
>>43842901
Definitely Phoenix Command
Can't go wrong
>>43846454
>The only thing wrong is that you haven't killed yourself yet. When are you going to realize no one likes your shit and give up?
Never anon. Never.
>>43846418
Surely barrel length should come in to play when determining penetration
>>43846510
In real guns, barrel length primarily affects velocity, to a point.
The reason this is is that the bullet has more time to get it's speed up due to the longer barrel.
http://www.ballisticsbytheinch.com/
This website lays out the velocities of various rounds by their barrel lengths. There is a point where you can get maximum amount of velocity out of a round, but it differs greatly on the round.
Penetration is another thing altogether. Most rounds in FMJ will penetrate clear through a person not wearing armor, so I felt penetration wasn't a good model for damage.
>>43843028
>Tactical Shooting has stuff about how operators operate, and how to translate it into GURPS. Although it makes things way too tedious for me, but if you want deeply realistic operations, it's always there.
Seems like if you want to operate properly all that extra detail would be a positive point.
>>43842901
>>43844896
What about Millennium's End? Or is that deader than Dillinger?
>>43847197
If you see a loli or a loli who talks about "loli", report him to the loli because loli's rather likely to be a loli.
Savage Worlds is also pretty good if you want something simple, the autofire rules are pretty good, the gun stats are decently indepth, it's a bit less realistic but caracters can still die pretty easy.
While it's clearly mired in the near-future of the 1980s, what about Twilight 2000 and so forth?
>>43847682
Grab Twilight 2013. It's slightly simplified and doesn't have as many sourcebooks, but updates things to something much closer to modern day operational operations.
>>43846418
>Ops and Tactics has the largest specific firearm list of any RPG ever made
I dunno, that crazy guy who really liked GDWs Twilight systems statted a fucking ridiculous number of guns and shit in what can only be described as the most awe inspiring display of autism I've ever seen.
http://www.pmulcahy.com/
>>43848222
Holy shit
>>43848284
best part is he's actively working on it still, things get updated and changed.
>>43846221
>Just whatever you do, stay the fuck away from D20 Modern.
Why do people hate d20 Modern?
>>43848314
Kind of wish it were T2013 instead of or in addition to T2000, but otherwise that is impressive.
>>43848336
It's all the flaws of D&D without being the one thing D&D was made for?
>>43846221
>EXACTLY what kind of game are you trying to run?
Basically something like Black Powder // Red Earth. Group of independent operators doing black ops in Iraq/ISIS territory.
>>43842901
I'd guess a phone system with multiple lines.
>>43846679
There's also one of the Pyramid Magazine issues: #3-57 Gunplay, which includes even more modern tacticool gear and rule suggestions for games of this sort.
>>43848284
>http://www.pmulcahy.com/
Goddamn.
What's the count?
>>43848336
Because it's a bad modern system. That's why.
>>43849014
Gurps, Ops and Tactics, or Twilight 2000/2013
All of these do guns that don't suck.
>>43842901
Gumshoe. Night's Black Agents, specifically.
>>43848143
Simplified? I thought looking through that Twilight 2013 was more involved that Twilight 2000, especially Twilight 2000 v2 and v2.2?
