Are Night Lords edgy or just misunderstood?
exactly what is to be misunderstood about flaying civilians and wearing them as dresses
Definitely just misunderstood. The Emperor wanted shit done and they made sure it happened.
>>43754018
most of them by the time the legion went traitor were criminals
>>43754018
Well, the idea of a whole Legion of sadistic criminals is cool, but come on, how did the Emperor not know they'd turn to Chaos as soon as they found out about it?
>>43754018
I wish the word and concept of "edgy" would just die. It's just a proxy for "retarded" but just lamer. At least say retarded. Edgy just seems so... edgy... Now call me edgy and get it over with so we can get back to calling me retarded and all will be right with the world again.
>>43754304
They hate faith in all forms.
>>43754033
Well, there might be a little bit of a misunderstanding. Wearing peoples skin is a COMPLIMENT you know.
>>43754018
They are autistic edgelords that are simultaneously misunderstood and constantly misunderstanding.
>>43754304
Because Thunder Warriors before them were pretty much like this and they got the job done, but better. When you're trying to wipe things out on a galactic scale, you use the right tool for the right job. And sometimes a tool is disposed of when it's usefulness has expired. That is, the Night Lords are a very crude and deadly weapon, but excel in areas were others would have resulted in unreasonable losses.
Who is to say that The God Emperor of Mankind did not have a plan to exterminate the Night Lords once the Great Crusade had lost some steam/ended? 2 other Legions are gone. Why? Maybe for similar reasons. They had their use, but that use expired. Who knows, that may have been the ultimate fate of many of Primarchs and their Legions at the end of the GC, especially the critically flawed ones that turned.
What if, for instance, Magnus was kept around *because* of the warp taint that he and his Legion had. All their pskyers taping into the warp would make a lot of daemons take notice, drawing their attentions to them so he could more easily work on his version of the Webway undisturbed.
>>43754330
And then, there is this >>43754402 guy who opted to go full retard.
>>43754406
The primarch I pity the most is Perturabo; who only turned because he got the shit end of the stick and who only got the shit end because the Emperor had a hole in his roster to fill. Perty should have been another Dorn or another Guilliman; he was temperamentally inclined to building civilisation, not to destroying it in the trenches but fuck him, we already have those dudes.
>>43754330
you're pretty retarded brobut i still agree with you
>>43754429
Didn't he do things like support democracy and self determination, before ending up working for his dad, the biggest fascist of all time?
>>43754420
Probably edgelord was a bad phrase to use, but the biggest impression I got from ADB's books is that they're self-destructive to an extreme fault, even when they all know better (except for the Khorne guy who just wants his hateful god to stop tormenting him)
>>43754429
I was thinking about him when I wrote that too and more along the lines that he would have actually not been destroyed and just utilized in protecting what has just been won back. Them and the Fists on the same side would be nigh impenetrable. He would be the type of Primarch whose usefulness would increase.
>>43754448
I think so yeah, he also constructed beautiful buildings and devices and mentally planned a city which even his foe at the time (Fulgrim) conceded was the most perfect city he'd ever seen. This talent also appears to be passed on to his sons; who inherit his eye for detail and his enjoyment of building.
But fuck him, the Emperor needed World War 1 Space Marines for some reason so that's his job, no matter how cruel it is to make him do that.
>>43754448
>>43754479
>>43754485
He hated the Beakie, and goaded Corvus into taking an assault just so the AdMech would forget about the Beakie after so many marines died and make a heavier power armor.
>>43754018
What is that for a Assault Marine?
>>43754330
>uses retarded when everyone on the internet uses autistic
get with the times grandpa
How can you misunderstand a Legion of crazed murderers who by their own admission just exist to scare the shit out of people with their fucked up massacres? Their own Primarch said they were fucked up and he hated them for it.
Pert also turned his legion into the Corpse Grinders and who wants to hang out with someone called the Corpse Grinders?
>>43754018
>Are Night Lords edgy or just misunderstood?
Of course they're edgy. And it's not a misunderstanding, it's completely intentional.
That's their whole stichk. Terror Tactics. They intentionally scare the shit out of their enemies with sadism and brutality. They're the Boltons of 40k. Entire systems would surrender rather than be flayed alive and hung up as scarecrows.
>>43754018
The irony of the Night Lords is that they think that they above Chaos. They think to they following the pure teachings of Konrad when the truth is that their primarch was the first Chaos Primarch.
Daemon Prince Krieg Abecus of the Night Lords confirms this.
>>43754843
It's hard to tell which one was Konrad and the other Nighthaunter when Konrad's sanity was taking hits below the belt.
>>43754429
Well, there's also his incredible pettiness, his constant need for validation, and the whole obsession with always being the best. Like the whole decimation thing. Or nearly throwing down because Dorn said he was better at building than Perturabo was at destroying. Sure, Perty got a shit deal with doing the opposite of what he wanted and not getting the praise he craved, but he was a profoundly fucked up dude with a pretty warped mind even before he turned.
I find Mortarion was far more of a tragedy. Hell, the dude actually turned Horus down. If Emps had been less of a recluse with control issues, or Mortarion had grown up anywhere else, he probably would've stayed loyal.
>>43754018
Night Lords are literally in the game to try and lure Batman fags into the game.
>>43754758
My opinion of the word "autistic" is worse than that of "edgy." How does it feel to have a grandpa call you lame? Youth is supposed to intimidate me, not make me cringe.
>>43754018
they are just fucking gay.
currently reading the night lords book by aaron dembski nad i love the book, but the nightlords on them slfes are just a bunch of insecure faggots with daddy issues. thats it. Their entire point of being spoopy and terrefieng was lost when other legions started follwoing the choas gods. If you have red the word bearers omnibus you will surely see that those fuckers are so much more scarier then the night keks. so yeah ... fuck them
>>43755093
NL are probably the most scary to civilians, with their terror tactics.
Somebody who knows about the fallen Legions, like an Inquisitor, is probably much more scared by WB and EC than NL.
They are trying to be 2spooky in an universe where beings that are literally incapable of being scared are the rule.
Also, I have never read any piece of fluff that has them legitimately winning battles, other than a terror campaign on a Space Hulk against the Orks.
>>43755297
yeah could be. since they have created this edge lord reputation for themselfes
>>43754018
Tryhards. Word Bearers pulled psychological warfare off better in every way because their approach to it is practical and clever instead of "look at us we are so sadistic and badass!"
>>43754330
It only exists on 4chan. It's a misuse of the word. Edgy is used on this site when someone means tryhard as many edgy things pull it off wrong and try too hard to be edgy.
>>43754786
>>43754882
I forget, did Mortarion hate psychers so much that he didn't have Librarians?
>>43754018
Edgily Misunderstood
>>43755297
It's been said the Inquisition hate the Alpha Legion most of all, given their strategy basically boils down to creating a fuckton of cults everywhere they go, whereas the Word Bearers will basically just use cultists as meatshields.
>>43756301
Yeah, Mortarion really hated psykers and tyrants, what with having been raised by a reclusive evil psyker who ruled Barbarus with an iron fist. Given that the Emperor was a powerful psyker who sealed himself up in his palace and ruled with absolute power without explaining his decisions, Mortarion began to draw parallels between his alien stepdad and his human kinda-dad.
>>43756051
Night Lords don't apply psychological warfare.
They just like to scare the shit out of people
>>43756777
I feel like, if Mortarion had been the one to slay his adopted tyrant father instead of the Emperor, he would have turned out a little more stable.
He valued strength so much that failing at such a crucial juncture probably fucked him up bad. I can't help but wonder if the Emperor encouraged Mortarion to kill his dad because he KNEW Morty wasn't ready and thought he could use the opportunity to make a show of his own strength and earn Mortarion's loyalty.
>>43754406
I wish Thunder Warriors got more fluff
>>43757537
Mortarion I feel was just broken from the moment his adoptive father died by the hands of the Emperor.
If Mortarion would have killed the Tyrantmutantwhateverthefuck then things would have been easier. It seems to me that the reason why he took so much of a bad turn and hated the Emperor was because he could not get that one kill.
Fighting to save humanity on Barbarus, pushing endlessly to the limits of his forces to clear everything but that one final reach. The one that only he could do, and then getting it all torn away because someone wants him to bend the knee to him.
It is like training for some competition, exhausting all your strength to get to that point and then some fellow comes upto you and saying, oh sorry, we decided that we would have the competition yesterday and I won. We forgot to tell you lol.
>>43754018
The concept of Night Lords is, by far, the edgiest of all legions.
They pull on MaryStue McBrood (a.k.a. THE BATMAN) as source and abandon the "no Guns because MUH JUSTICE" therefore going full on "Psssh... Nothin' personnel... kid".
HOWEVER, there's also mentioning that they aren't your average animongoose ebul tragic antagonist, but outright bullies because they rarely take on an equal enemy.
This alone makes them not edgy, but legitimately despicable, because "edgy" comes always with the notion of "so cool and daring". There's absolutely nothing daring in playing with your enemy when they can't even put up a fight when you'd face them head-on.
Also, they lack about any suaveness or elegance. They are essentially over the top evil and all their redeeming qualities are, more or less, their self-imposed pariah image.
So, to answer the question: The are rather edgy than misunderstood, because there's nothing to misunderstand when a legion specialises in terrorising easy prey. It's a filthy job that could be handled much cleaner, but because they're only efficient when they go filthy, you let 'em do it their way. But somebody somewhere had to have the idea that Batman's and Joker's lovechild clad in a mechanised combatarmour would make a good idea for an army and that this kind of army is supposed to be an escapist rolemodel for escapist nerds to live their powerfantasy of taking away all options from their enemies, then doing with them as they pleased.
>>43754839
>Entire systems would surrender rather than be flayed alive and hung up as scarecrows.
Then they'd flay them alive and hung them up as scarecrows anyway.
>>43757227
Making my point of them being tryhards even that much more true.
>>43754705
Pert confirmed for GOAT Primarch? Pert confirmed for GOAT Primarch.
>>43754786
Actually I think Curze began to hate his own Legion because eventually all the recruits were coming from Nostramo, which had fallen into its old habits, and thus were behaving the way they did to satisfy themselves rather than for a greater purpose.
>>43757711
Eh, I kind of prefer that Mortarion turned because he despised tyrants and saw the Emperor becoming one and didn't like psykers rather than just being mad because the Emperor killstole.
>>43754018
All you people who think "edgy" are pretty much projecting your own fedora.
They aren't space batmans or space mcemos.
They're World Eaters minus Butcher Nails.
Thats all. They are the guys that swoop in from when you least expect, hit you in the neck with a sword, carve your face with a filleting knife and wear it over their faceplate so your friends run away.
That's it.
>>43759005
You pretty much described Night Lords done right. I remember them before GW fucked them up. They where supposed to be blood-lusted criminals who ENJOYED torturing/killing/raping/pillaging/flaying/etc and did it because they LIKED it.
Now they are simply emo bastards who do it "to strike terror and save millions". Just like that gay ass Dracula film.
The way they are done right now is "I AM THE NIGHT, BEHOLD MY DARKNESS! BEHOLD! I AM TERROR! ACCEPT COMPLIANCE!" followed by them throwing their cape over themselves and vanishing into the shadows.
> Old school Night Lords:
> Drop down from the celling in the middle of the night amongst a group of guardsmen, cut the face out of the female one, put it over the faceplate, turn to the other and say "Do you think I'm pretty?"
> Proceed to torture the others one by one in the most horrific fashion as possible because they are having fun
> New Night Lords
> Drop down from the celling in the middle of the night.
> *Batman theme song*
> Bam
> Boom
> Ptang
> Look at the guardsmen cowering in the corner
> "TELL THE OTHERS WHAT YOU HAVE SEEN! GAZE INTO THE FACE OF HORROR!"
> Batropes out
>>43759158
>They where supposed to be blood-lusted criminals who ENJOYED torturing/killing/raping/pillaging/flaying/etc and did it because they LIKED it.
Except that is what they became at some point shortly before the Heresy and afterwards.
Everything else in your post describes what they were like in the beginning and how they were supposed to function, that they deviated from that is the reason they were considered a problem.
>>43758609
The armor he made to replace the beakie was found to be meh by the AdMech. Not even a true new mark.
>‘Will you tell me what’s wrong?’ she asked. The boy sat next to her, welcomed into her arms. ‘I don’t understand tuition,’ he replied. ‘We have to learn, but I don’t understand why.’ ‘To better yourself,’ she said. ‘So you can live at City’s Edge, and work somewhere... nicer than here.’ She trailed off on the last words, idly scratching at the ownership tattoo on her forearm. ‘That won’t happen,’ the boy said. He smiled for her benefit. She cradled him in response, the way she did on the nights after her owner hit her. On those nights, blood from her face dripped into his hair. Tonight, it was just her tears. ‘Why not?’ she asked. ‘I’ll join a gang, just like my father. Xarl will join a gang, just like his. And we’ll both die on the streets, just like everyone else.’
>>43761157
Fuck Cyrion.
>>43761157
>‘There’s something else you can do.’ She was rocking him now, rocking him the way she had when he was even younger. ‘If you stand out from the other children, if you’re the best and the brightest and the cleverest, you’ll never have to see this world again.’ The boy looked up at her. He wasn’t certain he’d heard right, or that he liked the idea if he had. ‘Leave the whole world? Who will...’ He almost said Who will take care of you, but that would only make her cry again. ‘Who will keep you company?’ ‘You never need to worry about me. I’ll be fine. But please, please answer your tutor’s questions. You have to show how clever you are. It’s important.’ ‘But where would I go? What will I do?’ ‘Wherever you want to go, and whatever you want to do.’ She gave him a smile now. ‘Heroes can do whatever they want.’ ‘A hero?’ The idea made him giggle. His laughter was balm to his mother’s grief – he was old enough to notice it happen, but too young to know why such a simple thing could resonate within a parent’s heart. ‘Yes. If you pass the trials, you’ll be taken by the Legion. You’ll be a hero, a knight, sailing the stars.’
>>43759225
Everything from 30k points out that from the beginning they where intended as shock troopers with extra "wow" factors.
Pretty much like World Eaters and White Scars, except the World Eaters had enough fun killing and moving on to the next kill, while the Night Lords got too caught up with the "shock" aspect of "shock trooper".
Every update or retcon ever since only served to make them more Emos. Originally, Conrad wasn't an emotional asshole tortured by his visions, he was a psycopath that hated the Emperor and had some foresight. He didn't hated his Legion, he simply didn't care for them. The Night Lords didn't become, they where like that from the get go. The need to give them emotions and drama has been slowly ruining them.
And if you think about it, this same need for drama in their background is what made the Blood Angels and Dark Angels edgy assholes. And GW is trying to make the WE go the same way, by making Pre-Heresy Angron "hate" his legion, and make Kharn the voice of reason, or make the WE feel "multilated" by Angron. It's not making them solid, it's making them sound like wusses.
Having these kind of Legions Pre-Heresy, portrayed the Emperor like the kinda guy that knows shit sometime will get dirty, and that he needed someone to get dirty for him. It's almost as if he planned "I have this son who is a strategist, and this who is a politic, and this who can invent great things... but now I need a few butchers to do what the others won't".
>>43754304
The Night Lords didn't turn to Chaos, they hate it.
>>43754369
Mexica/10 would flay people with.
>>43754304
>as soon as they found out about it?
Haven't you read the first heretic? Of all the traitor legions, they reacted the most negative towards Argel Tal and the Word Bearers after they saw the transformation during Istvaan.
They hated chaos.
>>43754429
So was Lorgar.
>>43761202
>Octavia licked her dry lips before speaking. ‘What did you want to do with your life?’ she asked. ‘I told you the truth: I’d always dreamed of guiding such a warship, and for better or worse, fate gave me what I wished for. But what about you? Do you mind if I ask?’ Talos laughed again, that same whispering chuckle, and tapped the defiled aquila emblazoned across his chest. ‘I wanted to be a hero.’ A moment later, he masked his scarred face behind his skulled helm. Red eye lenses stared at her, devoid of all emotion. ‘And look how that worked out.’
>>43754018
Robotica
>>43754018
Yes
That's the point
>>43754843
>Daemon Prince Krieg Abecus of the Night Lords confirms this.
You cant trust a demons word though.
Are threads like this oversimplified or just stupid?
>>43754018
Edgy done right.
>>43761205
>Conrad
>>43761440
Mooie staaf.
>>43758001
>they can't even put up a fight when you'd face them head-on.
But they can. They are Astartes after all. Equally strong as any other Legion. They simply choose to play the Terror card.
>>43759005
>They're World Eaters minus Butcher Nails.
World Eaters minus Nails = Best Bro Legion with focus on Melee and Brotherhood.
>>43761498
I didn't know "a bunch of retards who'd probably think the Joker is a good villain and ICP is a good band" was edgy done right.
Huh.
>>43761205
All of these changes you listed are actually good ones. They change boring, one-dimensional Legions and Characters into something interesting.
>>43761586
Part of why edge fails is that there's so much of it. The entire purpose of edge is to shock and be provocative, which doesn't work when everyone else is doing the exact same thing.
40k is a setting where EVERYTHING is grimedge and generally fucked up. Even amongst all the other "edgy" shit these days, it sticks out as particularly horrifying, and the Night Lords manage to stick out as particularly edgy within that. When edge genuinely shocks, it's done right.
>>43761205
>It's almost as if he planned "I have this son who is a strategist, and this who is a politic, and this who can invent great things... but now I need a few butchers to do what the others won't".
This is exactly how he is being portrayed, otherwise I can't really fathom why he would have drawn the original Terran Night Lords from children who were born in and survived life in pitch dark underground prisons.
>>43761524
There is a battle between them and some Orks on a space hulk that shows they can be wrong footed against a foe who doesn't give a damn about terror tactics, of course from there they switched to piece meal ambushes and I believe the inciting of internecine conflict.
I like them because I like the idea of sweeping storm of terror that comes in from the darkness blasting and slashing away and has already absolutely decimated your forces before you can mount a defense. Quick and messy is how it should be, not constant, unending edgemaster skin flaying and shit. The terror is the fleeting glimpses of colossal, monstrous forms leaving a trail of destroyed bodies that could come swooping out of the night again at any second.
>>43754018
They are the terror tactics legion, their whole shtick is to be as cruel and destructive as possible. Their favorite thing to do is boobytrapping corpses and setting up the dirtiest traps.
>>43754406
They were the boogeyman legion, perfect to keep planets in line with minimal actual damage needed
>>43762738
Sounds like the SS.
>>43762785
Well, the Imperium is Catholic Nazi Germany in SPESS after all.
>>43761320
They can hate it all the want they are still manipulated by it and quite a few have given themselves to it.
>>43754304
lol they don't worship chaos and usually ostracize those that fall to it in the legion.
>>43754406
You are speaking as if the Night Lords were the genocide legion.
>>43754462
They are the most nihilistic of all legions.
While we have a traitor legion thread up, what does /tg/ think of Mortarion and the Death Guard?
I'm only a few books in to HH but I think I like them most of all the traitor legions.
>>43758001
The NL win heroic battles all the time in their Omnibus.
>>43764896
>Mortarion
Definitely one of the more tragic of the primarchs. Underappreciated, yet still somehow kinda forgettable.
>Death Guard
Had some cool ideas but turned out being mostly meh.
>>43761440
Based.
>>43754429
>>43754448
>>43754485
>>43754705
>>43754806
The Iron Warriors are the best Traitor Legion, hands down.
I feel like the Night Lords should have more avenues for causing fear and terror than just simple bloodshed and torture.
Itd be damn cool if theyd managed to weaponize the sort of existensial despair of the cthulhu mythos and used that on the enemy.
>>43765555
Read the Omnibus.
You know what? The legion itself is full of tryhards. But Curze is the most interesting Primarch. They practically copy-pasted Kurtz from Heart Of Darkness/Apocalypse Now, but considering how interesting Kurtz was that transfers here. As a result I like to believe that him and Night Haunter are the same person and there's no bullshit DID retcon because then it makes him more morally ambiguous and makes him more morally responsible thus transforming his death from the lamest thing in 40k to one of the most coolest. Everybody's too busy with the Batman analogy (even the faggot who wrote the DID bullshit), but not to pull a no true scotsman, but no true literary would fall for that crap and knows the intention of the creator's analogy towards Kurtz.
>>43765680
Yeah, I love that one bit (rough recollection) where they cause a psychic feedback loop that gives entire sectors nightmares.
>>43754036
But the Space Wolves were the Emperor's "get shit done" legion. They constantly took on missions that no one else would.
>>43762785
Read some history books.
>>43754705
didn't that plan backfire though?
>>43765717
I'm pretty out of it in terms of the specifics of the 40k lore, what exactly is the DID retcon and what's this talk about the Night Haunter being separate from Konrad or whatever the few bits of chatter here are discussing?
>>43768741
Dissociative Identity Disorder
>>43754406
Maybe the to legions found out about it and just vanished into a DAOT derelict in space, where they live their lives in harmony and send sleeper agents to report back to them what happens around the galaxy?
Maybe they're actually have become interex 2.0 and are so advanced in technology, that one measly peasant is enough to crush a sector with it's own hands?
>>43754882
Perturabo's need for validation/ constant paranoia probably came from his innate connection to the eye of terror. It was said he could feel it watching him even before anyone else knew that it existed. So on top of getting the shit end of the stick he always had the feeling that something out there was constantly watching and judging him.
Being that the Night Lords are one of the only two traitor legions that never actually fell to chaos (the other being Alpha Legions) how fluff-friendly would it be for one of their splintered warbands to form a Renegade chapter that just fights for Humanity, a sort of "No Gods, only men" deal where they don't allign themselves with either Chaos or Imperium, they just go around brutally murdering anything they deem to be a threat to Humanity as a whole?
I mean, as I understand it, Night Lord Geneseed is actually supposed to be one of the most stable, rivalling that of even the Ultramarines and Dark Angels.
>>43769549
>what are Carcharodons
>>43761199
Cyrion did nothing wrong.
>>43769565
Raven Guard, actually.
>>43769565
Raven Guard
>>43769549
That would be pretty plausible, actually; the leader of the Warband might have been with Curze right from the start and is trying to emulate his Primarch's original, more noble, goals by seeking out and punishing those he feels have transgressed. How successful he is, and whether his underlings show the same levels of restraint, could make for some interesting storytelling.
>>43769600
>>43769602
Keep telling yourselves that
>>43769670
There's two possibilities here.
One: Charchadons are super-religious loyalist Night Lords. This explains their brutality and their appearance, but conflicts with their doctrine of militant atheism.
Two: Charchadons are descendants of the Raven Guard under Shade Lord Arkhas Fel, who was sent off with a Nomad Fleet when he displayed disturbing similarities to the Slave Lords of Lycaeus. This explains their appearance, organization, brutality, religious beliefs, and their defense of outlying rogue traders and colonies, something they share in common with Raven Guard nomad fleets.
>>43769565
If they were descended from any Traitor legion, it would be World Eaters.
>>43769826
That's the Minotaurs anon
>>43769565
Carcharodons are World Eaters. Night Lords have a "Win at any cost, to hell with morals." I mean, they will happily anthrax-bomb a populace that they dislike. Carcharodons are more like World Eaters, with a "I don't like that guy, I'm gonna turn him into giblets with my bare hands."
I don't see Carchadons being the kinds of people to carpet bomb their enemies from orbit, when the option to chop them into itty-bitty bits is on the table.
![0b88269828[1].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/GJLbILX.jpg "0b88269828[1].jpg")
>>43769954
>>43769826
>>43769670
>Gee I wonder what this means
>The book openly telling me that the Raven Guard are their most likely progenitors
>Nah they're Night Lords / World Eaters because they're pale and like killing people
Literally every single Space Marine ever created is bred and made explicitly for bloodshed, so when a chapter exhibits the exact same conditions as the Raven Guard, use very similar tactics to the Raven Guard, have very similar gear to the Raven Guard, but are slightly more violent than the Raven Guard, you can go ahead and assume they're just slightly more violent Raven Guard.
>>43770041
>believing Imperial lies
>>43770041
Which is why I added
>If they were descended from any Traitor legion
It's like that thread from about a week ago, talking about how the Executioners were actually founded by the remnants of the Space Wolves terran born.
It's probably not true, but it's nice to think stuff like this.
>>43770319
>Thinking there are lies.
>>43768955
I believe HH has dropped hints that both of the missing Legions were wiped out.
>>43770041
Will Hayes got so sick of these faggots saying his chapter was NL when he obviously meant them to be RG he even put their tattoos all over 30K RG and made the Nicor the RG ship and put Tyberos's helmet as the prototype Terminator helmet in the RG HH3 book, made Moritats/Terrans part of the Carcharodon history and attitude explanation, AND he even put a Carcharodon in the RG marine picture pages.
And still faggots say they're not RG.
>>43754018
About as edgy as the rest of 40K.
>>43761320
Not true for the largest night lord warband, which is run by a daemon prince.
>>43779638
DE and CSM are even edgier than normal.
It's like saying Shadow isn't edgier than Sonic.
>>43775282
I like the allusions to them are periodically dropped to them, and how their memories are observed by different Primarchs (like Guilliman has places set their Primarchs at his 'wishful thinking' table, or Sanguinius terrified of a "third empty plinth" due to the BA instability). I really hope that either their fates are never explicitly revealed or, if they are, it's not something stupid.
That being said, I'm growing to like the idea that maybe one (or both) of the two missing Legions/Primarchs were 'disposed' of because they turned on the Emperor, or flat-out refused to serve him. This could be why Angron was treated so shittily on first contact with Emps; if another Primarch had already tried turning his back on his own Legion and the Great Crusade, it'd almost make sense that Angron's defiance would be met with frustration by the Emperor instead of sympathy. The Emperor maybe was just angry that a second (third?) Primarch, who'd taken an insane amount of resources to create, was screwing with his plan.
So instead of sitting down with Angron and trying to talk things out, he has no patience for another reluctant son. He takes a look at Angron, sees that he's dying/is crazy-unstable anyway, and rationalizes "To Hell with it; I've gene-coded this one to be enjoy the ultimate camaraderie with his men, let them figure it out and get some use out of him." Emps leaves Angron in the 'Adamant Resolve's cargo hold, tells the War Hound's Legion Master to 'figure it out', and the rest is history.
>>43754018
They are psychotic mass-murderers and genocides who's tolerance by the Emperor proves that he is irredeemably evil.
>>43781556
>They are psychotic mass-murderers and genocides
That's every space marine ever
>43781556
>They are psychotic mass-murderers and genocides who's tolerance by the Emperor proves that he is irredeemably evil.
Nostramo, Anon. We have no idea what pre-Konrad Vlll legion was like, and everything wrong with them came from Nostramo. Don't blame Emps for Nostramo. They could have just been spooky marines without any of the edge, but did the Emperor say "enjoy being the edgiest thing in the galaxy"? No. The Emperor censured Konrad after he decided to destroy Nostramo. They could have been the bad cop to the Ultramarines or Salamanders' good cop, but did they? Nope.
>>43781683
Celestial Lions, Salamanders, Ultramarines and Storm Giants say no.
>>43754018
I like them.
>They are the epitome of grimdark.
>Kurze is one of the tragic figures of 40k.
>Sevatar coined the phrase "death to the false emperor".
>Talos and First Claw.
>Atramentar are cool.
>Near unanimous rejection of Chaos.
>Lightning.
>Sinners Guantlets.
Im working on 3500 points of HH Night Lords with Kurze and Sevatar as centerpieces. The edgelord bullshit that /tg/ memes and parrots only exists here. In the real world if you have a good looking army and are just a regular guy, no one is going to judge you for choosing to paint Night Lords.
Just make sure to use three colors on your lightning, then add 2 drops of white to a half cup (gravity fed) of thinner. set your compressor to ~18 and use a .2 tip. Give your lightning a light spray of that. If you master this, even the most hateful, self-loathing, socially retarded neckbeard will forget hes supposed to hate Night Lords.
>>43780757
My head canon on the two missing Legions is that the gene-seed was flawed to the point it caused drastic missteps, and sadly the decision was made to shut them both down. In the case of the XI Legion, they saw it coming and it got ugly. I dont blame Chaos, the Primarchs, or the Legions themselves. It was akin to a birth defect.
>>43781804
>Celestial Lions, Salamanders, Ultramarines and Storm Giants say no.
Fucking this. Also: if Curze is a kind of Batman analogy, then who gets to be his Joker, huh? Checkmate Marveldrones.
>>43781873
Yep. Not all marines are jerks, but the job kind of requires it. That's how Tzeentch sort of got the Seekers of Truth. Once a chapter that worked a lot with the Inquisition that was losing morale because of civilian killing ordered by the Inquisition, and one prayer to the Emperor that asked to know when someone was lying by their chapter master Tzeentch decided to eavesdrop and give the chapter master what he wanted plus more. The entire chapter was hearing every lie told in the galaxy. They could have theoretically saved the Imperium, but they went insane in a matter of days.
>>43781959
>Also: if Curze is a kind of Batman analogy, then who gets to be his Joker, huh? Checkmate Marveldrones.
He was his own Joker.
>>43781959
>Checkmate Marveldrones
Curze's inner demons. Or if you want the edgy3deep option, the Emperor.
>>43782063
>Or if you want the edgy3deep option, the Emperor.
>Emps
>the Joker
>mfw
>>43781804
>We have no idea what pre-Konrad Vlll legion was like
Pretty sure one of the FW HH books details this to an extent.
>>43782239
I'm sure it was going old testament on some forbidden pysker country now that I think about it. Maybe they were suppose to be the justicars legion. Nothing personal, we are the law, and it will be enforced.
>>43782287
Yes, it was them being sent to attack what had basically become a den of some of the worst people on Terra after they got their asses kicked by the Emperor.
>>43782498
Knew it. They were suppose to be Judge Dread marines, but Nostramo ruined the legion.
>that flashback to siege of Terra when Uzas was still himself
konrad was a good boy
>>43781897
Is there a canon-source for the XI defying their fate, or is it sole head-canon?
>>43782672
The Vandred one was oddly feelsy as well.
>>43783589
its just my head canon.
>>43754018
Trick question. Everyone in WH40K is edgy.
>>43781804
>We have no idea what pre-Konrad Vlll legion was like
Yes we do. The HH books, I think its in the red book even. The first VIII Legion Marines were taken from subterranean prison cities/caves on Terra. Criminal society based on power preying on weakness, very Nostraman.
>>43762608
Is that image from a video game?
Raven Guard are the superior lightning claw marines.
>>43782000
>He was his own Joker.
>>43768243
That was every legion. Read a few books, that could be said about literally anyone.
>>43779836
And they talk about how much they despise it. They only stay with him because it's his ship.
>>43761320
I can't find the picture evidence anywhere at the moment, but there's a picture of a Night Lords Thunderhawk with Slaaneshi symbols and a bit of text saying that lots of Night Lords warbands are turning to Slaanesh.
It sort of makes sense, since they take so much pleasure in the kill and causing heights of emotional terror. It's a bit different from Khorne, who just enjoys the fight and all the slaughter rather than any sensation from it.
>>43764896
The Death Guard themselves struck me as rather standard. A large focus on footslogging, and they were overall tougher, sure, but they otherwise could have taken the place of the Imperial Fists or Iron Warriors or Ultramarines and I wouldn't have batted an eye.
Mortarion is a bit different, but I still feel he's rather middle of the road. His fall is more because Tyrus makes him fall - Chaos came after he joined up with Horus.
I akin Night Lords to Chaos Marine equivilants to Dark Eldar. They both attack soft targets first, both like to spread fear & pain, they're both lightning assault all the time.
A bit different in that Dark Eldar take as many slaves they can get their hands on and move on before sunrise, and no one the wiser. Night Lords just love to slaughter everything and leave reminders that they were there.
>>43786025
I can sort of see the parallels, but the danger for the Night Lords is the fact that they will almost inevitably fall. I don't know how the Dark Eldar resist it, but the Night Lords have nothing aside from an increasingly crumbling faith in an unsound doctrine. A Long War that never ends to avenge a father who never loved them, trying to tear out the heart of a populace using fear when many have moved on to become sheep blind of anything but duty.
Reminder that one marine and peasants with sticks is enough to kill the whole warband of night lords.
>>43754018
These threads are literally cancer. Now that that's been said, it's Warhammer 40K.
A lot of things can and probably are both edgy and misunderstood. 1) Because grimderp. 2) because even the people who own the franchise don't fucking know what's up with their setting. Why should you?
>>43786571
>believing ultramarines propaganda
>>43786571
It probably left out the other marines and their amazing plot armor. Also an entire population of feral worlders could probably make a fair dent on a warband.
>supposedly hate chaos
>fights with chaos warriors and daemons all the time
>no long term plan beyond roaming around in warbands and raiding shit
>>43786952
They were not badass barbarians from deathworld, they were literal peasants and knights with iron weapons.
>>43786739
>Believing ADB propaganda that night lord can kill Phoenix Lord.
>>43787101
Well, I don't believe that ADB part. But surely Calgar doesn't have his own private cruiser he just rides in alone? And maybe there were weapons in the ship he armed the peasants with. Or his amazing leadership took the form of energy weapons.
>>43787026
>>supposedly hate chaos
>>fights with chaos warriors and daemons all the time
Well, what good is being a classy enlightened gentlemarine if all the "god"-fearing sheep don't see it?
>>43787164
I doubt that medieval human can use astartes size weapons.
>>43787237
maybe they all used their starter feat to get Monkey Grip
>>43785314
Its from older fluff right?
>>43787405
Oh no, it was fairly recent. I wish I could find the picture.
>>43785314
It's a bit ironic that since khorne was their deity when undivided didn't exist
>>43786418
Dark Eldar have already fallen. Their souls are claimed by Slaanesh and slowly being drained which is why they retreat to Webway for where Slaanesh's reach is diminished and they substitute pain of others as a way to fill the black hole which is their soul.
>>43788732
DE have fallen, but they can still keep themselves out of Slaanesh's hands.
NL are a broken Legion from the very start. With their warbands being weaker than most other CSM and their psychopathic tempers, it would be logical that the majority of NL would have given themselves over to Chaos a long time ago.
>>43762608
That's how I prefer Night Lords to be, too. Terrifying in how much destruction they leave in their wake so quickly, not super edgemaster "might as well torture while I'm here" mentality.
Ave Dominus Nox
>>43769600
>>43769602
Carcharodons are sucessors of the Raven Guard...
They're the Terran Ravens that Corvus thought where too brutal to be part of his legion, so he exiled them to outer space.
Yes, it is cannon. It's been made cannon for quite a while now.
>>43784870
> There is a Batman story arch where he finds out there is no Joker and it was he himself creating his arch-nemesis.
>>43788099
Was this also back when the Rainbow Warriors were first founding?
>>43790114
>>43787101
They could have had power armor like Caliban.
>>43790688
>>43790114
...I don't get it
>>43785314
>>43787489
>>43787405
From "Warmachines of the Lost and Damned", although it doesn't belong to NL, as you can see. So you were wrong...
>>43761320
Night Lords are chaos space marines you retarded motherfucker, they are not as "worshippy" as other legions, but see chaos as a powerful means to use for their own goals rather than to please X-god. But they do not hate chaos and are NOT anti-chaos, non chaos renegades.
>>43787101
The Phoenix Lords are not unkillable. Gav Thorpe had Karandras sacrifice himself to save another Eldar from a Dreadnought.
>>43790371
Which Elseworlds was this?
>>43761205
>but now I need a few butchers to do what the others won't".
Which is retarded for a multitude of reasons.
Do you really think horrific things are done by 'bad' people? Serial killers don't think what they're doing is wrong. Very often they're individuals with a complex moral code that they feel others have violated or failed to live up to. Same with mass shooters.
Massacres are perpetrated by normal, everyday jagoffs who just got to a mental place (via religion/politics/racism/whatever) where certain/other people weren't people in their eyes anymore. Read "The Good Old Days: The Holocaust as Seen by Its Perpetrators and Bystanders" for a pretty chilling picture of how impressive mental gymnastics can get.
Sadists are about the closest thing you can get to 'bad.' And that's only from a personal freedom/what's best for the species point of view. They do what they do for pleasure, and it can either be within reason or not. Those who operate within reason are capable of realizing that living purely for pleasure doesn't produce favorable or desirable results. Those who don't are, frankly, the same kind of imbeciles who spend their money on a bong instead of rent.
Basically, Night Lords are EXTREMELY LAZILY WRITTEN. None of the writers bothered to learn anything about killers or even basic psychopathy that they hadn't seen in an equally lazily written horror movie.
And as for the Emperor needing armies of Ultra-Murderers for mass butchery? Do you even Humanity? That shit is built into our genetic code. Every single person you've ever met is a few (varying) degrees away from stripping your skin off and doing finger-paints on it with your family's blood. Given the right conditions, everyone is a killer (this isn't angst, the reverse is equally true). Military Training is constructed from top to bottom to provide those conditions while also instilling the discipline to control the feelings that come with it.
>>43803100
Okay, people take note, THIS is what real edginess looks like.
>>43791181
you will in time
>>43803494
well memed
>>43803494
I'm impressed by how swiftly you disregarded the entire argument. You realized you don't need to refute it, all you have to do is insult the argument and suddenly its as though there's no merit behind it! Well done sir, hats off to you.
Wow, Incredible. Amazing.
