I want to run some fate themed campaign with my friend but i don't have any idea which setting could be good to make it work, can you give me some ideas please?
Searching for something i've found something called 'Fate Nasuverse Rpg', how good is it? anyone here had tested it?
>>43715531
Many groups have attempted Fate campaigns using many different systems. Most of them work with a little homebrewing, generally speaking. A lot of people use FATE (the system), but I know a lot of groups just use one D&D system or another. Not sure how they turned out though. If you aren't familiar with most systems, the d20 system used in D&D would probably be the easiest to learn and use and I'm sure it would work fine. The biggest roadblock a Fate themed group would run into would be the story and player investment.
It's just challenging simulating a Grail War in a tabletop game. Seeing as the average war only has fourteen combatants, the game would have to be enormously story driven with many breaks in the action if its going to last. You would need to be an exceptional storyteller who can play out many NPC's if you want to keep it interesting. If you don't give the players meaningful things to do between encounters, they are just going to metagame the hell out of it and end it quick. Most masters in the Fate series could be wiped out by a trained commando team if they didn't all have situational plot armor.
My current party wouldn't even try to talk with the other masters. They would instead rob a bank using magic, take a ship to Somalia to stock up on weapons, then realize they can just take over Somalia with their Servants and live as kings before the various underworld/hidden organizations in the world would show up to try and stop them.
>>43717671
Doesn't the observer stop you from leaving the war?
>>43717830
Never, EVER, assume players will follow the rules unless they railroad themselves for the sake of story. They find a way.
>>43717860
Cast a fucking barrier over the place. Now they won't leave.
>>43717860
Given how each and every Grail War was abnormal, rigged, Angra Mainyu-ed, etc. It'd fit.
If I ran a campaign in the Fate universe, it wouldn't start off during a Grail War. I'd give my players some progression in the form of treasure hunting or missions for their chosen faction which eventually will lead up to a Grail War. Give them a feel for the world, its organizations, and types of magic first. That way they will understand the more intricate details of the war and have a better understanding of it and would approach it differently instead of just simply "killing of the bad guys".
How would you guys suggest the players get their Servants? would you just kinda give it to them along with a prebuilt character for the setting, make them roll a die, set a display of items out for them to pick their one of their fancy, how?
>>43718192
So, would a gender-bent Gil be... Gilgamette? Gilgamina? Gilga-neesan?
>>43718934
Summoning Servants is half of the initial mystery and fun of the Fate series. Like I said earlier, during a treasure hunting mission they can find a catalyst for a specific servant or it can be a quest reward, stolen from a museum, etc. It's the GM's job to figure out the "hows". If they are going into it cold turkey and blind as a bat, I'd make a table of Classes and a table of Servants and have them roll once on each to get a random summon. Most masters in the series who know what they're doing stack their decks beforehand so they get who they want.
If you just want to "board game" it instead of RPGing it, just prebuild characters with premade stats and spells then have players roll on a table as previously mentioned for Servants.
>>43719026
Gil-sensei.
>>43717860
>Following the rules
>Grail war
If you're players plan to subvert the process that's actually they way it's supposed to go down.
In any case, using your servant to conquer Somolia probably isn't a great idea. For one, their servants won't be around for ever unless they give them a new body by using the grail, which you can only win by killing other servants. Which also means that eventually the other masters are going to follow you to Somolia and fight you anyways.
>>43719896
I honestly just like the idea of a Somalian Holy Grail War. I mean, most of the wars are in modern urban settings. Imagine a War in a big open wartorn landscape with NO other political powers in the immediate vicinity?
Iskandar would have a fucking field day.
>>43719896
>If you're players plan to subvert the process that's actually they way it's supposed to go down.
Exactly. If you are a GM trying to run a Fate campaign expecting the players to play along to your dance, you will be just be disappointed. The Grail War is chaos under the illusion of an orderly competition and your players will follow that model whether they know it or not.
>>43715531
Are you talking about Fate/World Outbreak? I plan to run it in a few months since it seems like it'll work well with my plan for running things.
It was intended for play-by-email, which isn't ideal for a table top setting, but works fine for me. I plan to have each session be a "day" where players can describe their scheduled and time management for the day, while also role playing out specific scenes like combat, diplomacy, investigation, or other significant events. At the conclusion of each day they see the fruits of their larger strategy so far and get a general sense of the way the war is evolving.
>>43719950
Huh, looks interesting. I just skimmed the PDF, but it looks like it would be an absolute bitch to organize and coordinate.
>>43720007
That's if you do the recommended 7-9 teams of 2+.
The other parties of my game are mostly npc controlled, so their actions against each other can be approximated "off camera." I don't think I'd have more than 4-5 players which couldn't be more than 3 teams. (I wouldn't let anybody play a servant with out a player master, and I want to limit the number of player masters with non-player servants as much as possible)
>>43719912
If you go full-on combined arms warfare, superpowers will eventually notice something is weird. After that, it's a question of time before major secret organizations collapse and governmental spec ops begin their hunt for any magical leverage they could grab.
>>43720075
Pretty sure the Mage's Association and the Church know about the Grail War, and could use leverage to keep governments out at least in terms of official warfare.
That still wouldn't stop Delta Green guys from showing up and causing a ruckus though.
>>43717671
Their Servants would rebel against them in a heartveat if they tried to pull that shit. Remember they've got their own goals as well and I'm pretty certain "conquer Somalia" isn't one of them.
Also I'm pretty sure that doing something like that would cause counter guardians to appear and start hunting down your players. If they thought having some crappy magical copies of Heroic Spirits out for their blood was bad, wait til the real unrestricted things start coming for them.
>>43720095
1. That severely over-simplifies heroes motivations. Most of them are just there as Servants, only a handful of Heroes have their own wish for the grail.
2. What is Iskandar.
3. Counter Guardians only appear if there is a threat to humanity itself. 9/11 and the Paris attacks didn't spawn Emiya, this sure as hell wouldn't.
>>43715531
Monsters and Other Childish things works great for this, just homebrew in a new part for humans related to magic (Magic Circuits?). The system takes care of servant creation itself, just refluff "horrible eldritch monsters that follow your child (character) around and protect them" to "Super powerful legendary figures that follow your magus (character) around."
>>43720094
Look, if they failed to stop the government from sending in aircraft back in the 90's, when survelliance was crappy and occasional, there's literally nothing stopping the governments from sending in expeditionary forces.
That is, if we take for granted that CIA/FSB/etc. don't know everything about mages already and are not using technoligical superiority and unlimited budgets to control both the Church and Association while luring them into false belief that it's the other way around.
Whatever you do, avoid the Nasuverse RPG homebrew thats floating around the web. It's really badly made. I would echo the suggestions made by others, FATE would probably be the easiest to set up of all the systems you could use.
I have put a stupid amount of thought into how something like this could work. When I get to my computer I'll detail some of my thoughts.
>>43720094
MA an Church do know about the war. The Church does organize it afterall, and the MA sends representatives.
Delta Green would probably have trouble. Servants would be pretty much impervious to their firearms. And even magus have tools for dealing with bullets, see Kayneth.
>>43720123
Still though unless you've got a compelling reason for a servant to waste their time in Somolia, you're gonna have to waste command seals forcing their asses there. You don't have enough of those to keep a servant there long.
>>43720152
Nah I'm not talking about derailing the War to go to Somalia, I want a Grail War hosted, run, and organized for the sole purpose of being in Somalia.
Or really any war-torn African country. That sounds fun as fuck.
>Big burly stupid as a bag of rocks magus who barely qualifies as one summons a Servant and accidentally's a Gilgamesh.
>Ends up carrying him in that stupid tent-backpack from Emperor's New Groove
>Gil complaining and calling him a mongrel as Magus Kronk is just excited to have the guy from Giligan's Island as a Servant.
Whats this? A nasu thread? Let me derail it right now.
>Simo Hayah
>>43720139
It's implied in some of the side works (Strange Fake, Acrophya and Grand Order specifically) that some major governments/NGOs have/had some knowlege of the supernatural. It really didn't seem like that they had much influence in the supernatural. This is of course putting aside the fact that we have very little idea about what magical politics looks like outside of Europe and Japan.
>>43720152
>Delta Green would probably have trouble. Servants would be pretty much impervious to their firearms. And even magus have tools for dealing with bullets, see Kayneth.
http://coub.com/view/47wx0
>>43720196
I'm pretty sure the grail wars has like a whole dedicated mage organization whose job it is to cover shit up as it.blows up, right?
>>43720208
That's the Church overseer's job generally.
>>43720213
Are all the world religions in on it or just the Catholics?
Honestly a grail war in somalia would be easy least compared to one in downtown Japan. Just cover it up as another civil war. It's fairly convenient for everyone - easier coverups, fewer collateral/soft targets around, no one has home turf advantage because African mythology is fairly unknown
>>43720231
And then someone fucks everyone royal by summoning Anansi AKA the fucking spider in every African Mythology ever.
>>43720213
Yeah, the reason that is is because the Mage's Association is so factional that no one family/faction could trust another Magi to oversee it impartially. So they got the Church to do it, while they don't see eye to eye on a lot of things the Church and the Association agree that the Masqurade should be maintained so they manage everything from an impartial perspective.This goes about as badly as you can imagine.
>>43720251
You could say the same about any country
>>43720253
Wasn't the villain in fate/stay night a priest? Like an agent of the church trying.to lurify the world?
>>43720231
I think fate does the Jap thing of "every christian is a catholic." Don't know what the jews and muslims are up to in fate. I'd hazard a guess a bit of Kabbalah is present.
IIRC, the reason the war is in Fuyuki is that the Ley Lines are most favorable there. They'd like to have it in the middle of nowhere, but that would mean waiting centuries between wars, instead of just 50 years. That's the kind of detail I'd ignore if I were running my own game, but it's worth noting. I think strange/fake takes place in America, but I'm not sure how that works.
>>43720268
>Summon Saber in modern day Britain.
>She does nothing but complain about Saracens and have gross old people sex with Robert Scruton.
>>43720231
Most likely just the Catholics, although it's never explicitly stated that the other major Christian sects arent involved. None of the other religions are in on it, but I wouldn't be surprised if some other major religious organziations have an equalvalent. Hell it's implied in Heavens Feel that the Middle East has their own Association alternative so the possibility is there.
>>43720280
So why the fuck was it the Catholics in fate/stay and not the Buddhists?
>>43720123
Iskander still had to get the grail first so he could fully incarnate before conquering the world. Any Spirit that has goals beyond the War is going to need to win first.
Also anybody trying to leave the site of the war with a servant would probably find themselves on either the Magic Association or Church's shitlist real quick. All the cases where servants have survived the war, their masters had to take steps to hide their tracks and try to stay lowkey. Conquering a third world country is not lowkey.
>>43720274
Kind of. Kirei had his own agenda that is one of the more entertaining parts of the entire franchise.
>>43720290
The Church has a vested interest in any magical artifacts that could be the Holy Grail.
>>43720296
I'm not going to lie, imagining a master/servant team going rogue to follow their dreams while being hunted sounds like it would make a great story.
>>43720323
Pretty certain that's basically the servant ending for Archer in CCC.
>>43715531
Not OP, but could a Fate Stay/Night campaign work with Mutants and Masterminds?
>Everyone a Mystic/Summoner hybrid
>Divide points between yourself and your summon
>The more powerful you are, the less powerful your summon is and vice versa
>Feature 3: Gain the Controlled Extra on Summon for tne action/turn the amount of times equal to your Feature rank
The bruises system instead of health could work for an Epic Clash of Heroes/Anime feel, but I suppose ot wouldn't work if you eanted a high lethality kinda deal.
>>43720296
Being low key is for people who aren't the King of Conquerers.
>>43720323
They did that in Fate/Zero, it was hilarious.
>>43720328
Apologies for typos; stuck with posting from my phone at the minute.
>>43715531
I want to run a grail war where the some or all the masters summon heroic spirits from Middle Earth.
Part of me thinks that it could be really fucking cool, the other part of me thinks that there's no way it could be anything other than shit show.
>>43720329
It was the greatest cool.
>>43720345
It would depend on so many variables. It might be cool, but a lot of the characters have power levels that are completely unbalanced compared to others, even more so than Fate itself. Would be interesting though. Middle Earth has quite the detailed history.
>>43720379
>>43720379
Yeah there are some completely OP people, Feanor for example. But then again, it's not like the grail wars are ever balanced.
But it might not so completely out of wack. Turin can kill elves. Gil-Galad and Elendil double team a maiar. Probably no one is so strong as to be completely unkillable, besides like the Valar.
>>43715531
Just use Anima. Stat Servants as level 10+ familiars and create themed abilities or artifacts based the legend of each. All players would have to be Casters or Caster/Martial hybrids, though.
>>43715531
once ran a fate s/n rpg online using the ironically named Fate system, Had 14 players 7 servants 7 masters and a fictional city. The Servants all got to pick historic character and we stated them as servant. Then they got randomly assigned to masters who all had various skill sets. Was a fun battle royal.
>>43720437
>change Grail to Silmaril
>holy silmaril war
>change gilgamish to feanor
I want this. My god its full of stars.
>>43720183
Let me rerail it for you
>the 19th century fame cutoff
Youngest servants we got are Li Shuwen and Mata Hari and they are both pretty shit. Please go fuck yourself with your Caster Hitler.
>>43720328
That's how about half the game I had actually seen work worked.
>>43720915
>Li Shuwen
>shit
U wot, m8?
>>43720915
It's not like people born after the 19th century can't become heroes, but summoning one is pretty much impossible for obvious reasons.
>>43720915
Actually servants can be from any time period, past or even future. They just have to be mythologized and qualify for heroic.
>>43717890
"One of my Noble Phantasms is Rule Breaker but at EX rank, and I stab my way out"
>>43720915
>Youngest servants we got are Li Shuwen and Mata Hari
Uhhhh
>>43721196
>"One of my Noble Phantasms is Rule Breaker but at EX rank, and I stab my way out"
Clearly you'd have to approve the Servant builds before they actually play them.
Allowing a Rule Breaker lvl EX would just be your own fault.
So I was thinking about making a servant roster. I wanted to put Lovecraft in as Caster since apparently writers can be Caster. But now I'm wondering, would it be a better TWEEST to make Lovecraft Berserker? Given the whole Eldritch horror madness thing?
>>43721196
Is there even a point in making RB rank EX?
>>43721348
You'd have to make his NP and skills pretty interesting to counteract his shit stats. Even the Madness buff wouldn't make him any kind of physical threat.
>>43721348
Maybe give him a monster form like Medusa has?
>>43721361
Well making it attached to something that's a shitty glass dagger would be a start.
Anyone remember that WINDOWS brew that was posted back when F/Z was airing? Did that work for anyone?
>>43721383
Found it.
https://docs.google.com/document/pub?id=1PTkMomIBpKaC1Gihma5V2h92A8MkZG53HP9jwi5Ddw8
>>43720945
Half?How'd it go?
>>43718192
>If I ran a campaign in the Fate universe, it wouldn't start off during a Grail War. I'd give my players some progression in the form of treasure hunting or missions for their chosen faction which eventually will lead up to a Grail War.
I've been in that sort of campaign before, and I'll second that suggestion. When we first started talking about a Nasuverse campaign I explicitly told the DM "No Grail Wars," and we eventually decided on a more KnK-y supernatural investigation/odd jobs sort of thing, But months later when it turned out that everything in that campaign was leading up to a Grail War, I was a little upset I got played but ultimately excited about it.
>>43720280
>Hell it's implied in Heavens Feel that the Middle East has their own Association alternative so the possibility is there.
It's not so much an implication as it is a nod to Melty Blood, where the Middle Eastern (actually, Egyptian) branch of the Magic Association, Atlas, plays a role.
>>43721481
Okay that sounds pretty cool.
>>43721481
Yeah,. when i ran a Fate campaign it started out like this. Since i was the only one who knew anything about the universe, the game started way before the Grail Wars. The players met each other, had a few adventures (where they would botain relics that they would later use to summon their servants) and after a few months, i introduced them to the Grail War. Of the four players, only one refused to fight in the war, so i ran a solo Supernatural Detective campaign for him.
It was pretty cool. Two characters who were a couple before the war broke up because the girl slept with her servant Lancer (Odin).
The winner was the player who had summoned Saber. That was a pretty cool campaign.
(And it had Simo Hayha. Fuck yeah.)
>>43720863
Holy Shit. I MUST dm/play this.
>>43721345
>tfw That Guy realises he can indulge both his power gaming and magical realm kinks by pulling from certain errata about Anti-Planet/Anti-World Noble Phantasms
I jest. Fate/Extra and CCC are the Immortals' Handbook of the Nasuverse
>>43721669
>>43720863
>>43720437
So... If we have Turin as Saber and Sauron (or Lúthien?) as Caster, do you guys have any ideas for the other Middle Earth Servants?
>>43721837
A lot of Elves as Archer, Gil-Galad as Lancer, some named Rohirins as Rider... dunno..
>>43721837
Gimli as Rider.
>>43721837
Beleg Or Legolas are the obvious choices for Archer.
Gil Galad could make a fine Lancer. Fingolfin for Rider maybe. The Nazgul would probably be the prime candidates for assassin, seeing as they are both legendary, but their identities aren't known.
Berserker is tough. I'd actually be tempted to put Turin there. But any son of Feanor would work, as well as that one Rohirric prince that died to the Oath Breakers. You could make a case for Beren as Berserker, given that whole PTSD spider experience.
>>43721857
Yeah, it would be better to make a Rider of Rohan Rider. There's plenty in the annals, I just can't recall them ATM.
>>43720915
Fuck your cutoff, I want my Nikola Tesla Caster.
>>43721883
>>43721837
Saber - Fingolfin
Lancer - Gil-Galad
Archer - Legolas
Archer - ???
Rider - Éomer, Glorfindel or The Witch King of Angmar.
Caster - Sauron or Luthien
Assassin - The Nazgûl
Berserker - Turin
>>43721910
Exists. Grand Order. It wouldn't be Type Moon if the rules weren't broken whenever convenient.
>>43721883
About the Sons of Fëanor as Berserkers: I don't know. I think only Caranthir and Celegorm would qualify for Berserker. Maedhros is closer to Saber and Maglor and Curufin to Caster, i guess.
>>43721946
Feanor and his sons are honestly multi-classers. Their oath drives them beyond all reason I guess. Though they don't literally go mad i guess. There's defiantly the blood-lust element though.
>>43721138
hell, with the right catalyst or sacrifices you could summon pecos bill or someshit.
>>43721946
anyone can be a berserker if the summoner is shit enough.
herc wasn't at all suited to the role but got it anyway because the vampire loli didn't have enough magic.
also, one of the biggest challenges of a grail war game is that the instant the players have access to google, they know who the competition is and what their weaknesses are (or can get a rough guess via what traits have been shown to them so far).
apocrypha's siegfried had to hide his identity constantly, since his weakness is super widely known (the same rule would apply to say, achilles as well)
>>43722058
Herc did go mad though. It's not too much of a stretch to put him in Berserker. It's just that he's ridiculously over qualified for the other classes.
Half the fun of a Grail war should be uncovering you're opponent's identity. If you manage to figure it out, I think you should have a tactical advantage. Afterall, they're more or less always expressing the same sentiment in canon. Hence referring to servants by their class name.
>>43722119
herc usually went on his rages due to hera's fuckery (two out of the three times were her doing directly, and the third was due to dripping out on pain/hydra blood which hera orchestrated as well)
the greek pantheon were the type to whammy someone over some imagined slight or other, then whammy them again when they break some godly rule or other due to the initial one (hera making herc go insane and kill his family, then forcing him to do a bunch of stupid 'impossible' tasks for... killing his family).
Isn't there an entire subgenre of Japanese rpgs that focus on player-vs-player combat? Seems like it'd be easiest to adapt one of those. Using D&D or one of its variants is less likely to work because it's balanced for a party to complement one another versus external threats.
Are you having masters and servants played by one player as a team, or is each one getting their own player?
>>43722195
>everyone is john: battle for the grail edition
>>43721321
I thought canon stated he wasn't a true Heroic Spirit but some sort of protector spirit that the system shoved in for its own reasons?
>>43722211
>one Master
>seven Servants trying to push him to complete their goals and eliminate each other
This might actually be pretty fun.
>>43722119
>>43722058
Yeah, i mean, in the Grail War i DM'd, no one knew the true name of each other servant, not even OOC. It's really funny to see them trying to discover the true identity of the Archer that's raining arrows and lightning on his enemies and is wearing a war bonnet.
Keeping secrets is an important part of a Grail War/Fate game, i guess.
>>43720275
That's one of the reasons, but the major one is that it's owned by someone who is willing to let their backyard play host to what could possibly end up as a magically explosive ritual. There's nothing really tying it to Fuyuki, and the entire premise of Apocrypha is that the formula for the grail war got leaked during the third war, which resulted in every mage and their dog hosting a knockoff version in every corner of the globe.
>>43722220
He's a counter-guardian. Counter-guardians are heroic spirits who made a pact with the counter-force while they were still alive.
>>43715531
If you're talking about the HF site RPG I have experienced it as a player and it worked well. Still requires the GM to do a lot of work in managing the Servants.
Probably the biggest hurdle to overcome is that a Grail War is directly competitive and there is no real way to reroll if you get offed. Players have to be willing to accept permadeath.
>>43722708
There is a way around that, and that's to basically adopt the Apocrypha model of grail wars. Have a GM controlled team of Black servants and put them in direct competition with the player controlled Red faction.
This allows for a more classical model where all the players are at least nominally working together, which makes it less likely for the PCs to push towards killing one of their own, at least early on in the game.
>>43722691
Not all CGs are heroic spirits, in fact the only one that is that we know of is EMIYA and he is only summonable as a heroic spirit because he's got a personal connection to the Grail War through Rin's pendant.
>>43722058
>anyone can be a berserker if the summoner is shit enough.
>herc wasn't at all suited to the role but got it anyway because the vampire loli didn't have enough magic.
Literally fucking what. Do you have any idea what you're talking about? Berserker isn't summoned based on how good or bad a Caster is, but either because there are no more classes left, the Heroic Spirit can only be summoned as a Berserker or because the ritual was purposefully modified to summon a Heroic Spirit in a maddened state. The latter was the case for Herc.
>>43722789
>Caster
*magus
In all honestly, while this is going to sound like heresy, I think that the Grail War itself is set up in such a way that making that the focus of your game isn't really going to work in a tabletop RPG. Everyone is fighting each other, your players have hugely unequal powerlevels (mages and servants), and so on and so forth.
As much fun as a vanilla Fate game would be, I think that for the purposes of being able to be run as a tabletop experience we would need to either ignore the grail war, or to massively change up how the Grail War is supposed to work.
For example: what if we said that as a result of (Saber Destroying the Grail, the Grail being successfully dismantled by Waver and Rin after the 5th war, dickass wizards trying to co-opt the grail between wars and fucking it up... pick a reason) the Greater Grail suffers major damage and breaks apart. The magical machinery that runs the grail war is broken, and everyone assumes this means that the grail war is over, until it starts misfiring randomly.
Around the world, seemingly at random, people are getting command seals. Far, far more people than should be involved in any single grail war. Sometimes 3 seals, but oftentimes less than 3. They can summon servants just like during the grail wars, but other times they just get a random servant dumped on them, much to the surprise of the servant who doesn't have any idea what is going on either. Worse yet, many of these servants are showing up as incomplete manifestations. Some are lacking memories, others cannot summon their weapons for very long or even at all, others are simply much weaker than they are suppose to be and can only accomplish a shadow of the feats they are supposed to be able to. Others are showing up with weird and ill-thought classes that no one has heard of, and others don't seem to have any class at all.
>>43723050
The Grail is broken, but instead of doing nothing it is causing chaos. No one knows what the rules are anymore, or even if there even still are rules. The Church and the Mages Association are frantically trying to get the situation under control, but there is evidence to suggest that the new masters and servants that are manifesting are the key to rectifying the situation. Almost like the Grail is trying to heal itself, using the only means available to it.
It might be that the only thing that can heal the Grail now is a miracle.
But that won't be easy. Some groups are trying to simply contain the situation, and the easiest way to do that is to prune Masters before they can cause trouble. Others see this as an opportunity to exploit the magics of the Grail laid bare, using the broken status of the grail for their own purposes. Some what to fix the Grail and restore the balance that used to exist, others are trying to figure out how to deal the final blow and destroy the Grail forever. Some masters just want to be left alone, never having asked to be involved in this fractured war. Servants seem to get stronger by defeating other Servants and absorbing their power, but for many incomplete manifestations that is no easy task, since it can be hard to tell just how strong another Servant is, how much of their old power they have regained, until you are already committed to the fight. Masters, likewise, find that command seals are easily stolen. Both master and servant have much to gain from beating those like them, but for what purpose?
Its a new, strange, unexplained sort of grail war, one where the battle lines are drawn on water and the rules are anyone's guess.
Doesn't that sound more likely to be usable for a tabletop game than the traditional setup?
>>43723063
>Doesn't that sound more likely to be usable for a tabletop game than the traditional setup?
It sounds more or less like any setting infodump people spam worldbuilding threads with. It's not inherently better or worse than a vanilla grail war, but I can't say it's especially compelling.
>>43723196
>>43723196
It probably makes for a worse story, but it is clearly going to make for a better game. It gives the players way more options about what they can actually do, and gives the room to deal with the inherently problematic party restrictions that a vanilla grail war comes with. In anon's setup the players are not obligated to murder each other by the end of the game, there is actually rooms for character progression instead of being locked into your starting stats for the whole game, and incomplete servants will mean that servants won't make masters totally worthless on the battlefield for the whole game.
It's not perfect, but its a start.
>>43723063
>>43723050
Meh, i honestly think the vanilla Grail War is pretty usable. I've both played and DM'd games on the Nasuverse, two campaigns (one as the DM, other as a player) being about the Grail War, and the whole campaign went without any OOC problems. As long as you don't play with a bunch of fags that get pissed if they die and/or lose on the war, it's a pretty good campaign model.
>>43723302
Who are you to say what makes for a fun game? Not every setting or system needs to support an open ended globe trotting affair. You can have a RPG focused on telling a certain range of stories. And a RPG that's not intended to be a long running campaign.
Who's to say power level imbalance can't be fun? If you're game is just about dealing damage then yeah, I can see that being a drag, but that's not the way fights have to go down. Fate is all about strategy and tactics over brute force, fights are usually solved with a coup de grace, not by spamming your strongest attack over and over.
Who's to say a battle royal can't be fun? Besides if you don't want to kill your friends in a grail war, then don't. Shriou and Rin manage to not murder each other. Want your servants to stick around after the battle? There's a grail for that.
The Type-moon universe is larger than just the Grail War. So if you really wanted a large Nasu RPG it's not like the setting isn't there. Not that alternate versions like a broken grail don't have potential as well. I just think it's silly to look at the Grail War and decide that the only way to make it work is to throw it out.
>>43723302
>but it is clearly going to make for a better game
Or, you know, you could just go by Apocrypha rules and have your players be on the same team without making the whole thing sound like a cheap MMO premise.
>>43723478
>I just think it's silly to look at the Grail War and decide that the only way to make it work is to throw it out.
Not throw it out, just try and address the problems that have left nearly a dozen failed attempts at a Fate RPG in it the dust.
Every year someone decides that they want to play Fate and to try and make an RPG for it, and that gets some support because Fate is really popular, but it always fucking fails because the root idea is really problematic for any game setup where the GM doesn't control the game with an iron fist and all the players go along with it. Because the vanilla grail war setup isn't designed for parties, involves most of the group sitting on the sidelines as a single person goes off and does an NPC for the next hour and a half, and makes you chose between being able to participate in combat and being another player's bitch.
Its childish to pretend that Fate doesn't have issues when translated between mediums, and foolish to ignore the issues that these issues have caused in the past. Vanilla grail war is better set up for a play-by-post game than a tabletop RPG.
For nearly 6 goddamn years I have been in these threads, watching people try and fail to make vanilla grail war work. Consider trying something different, and maybe we will get somewhere.
>>43723630
You to consider that several people here have already stated that they have successfully ran Fate RPGs with the vanilla Grail War setup.
The problem isn't necessarily that the premise of Fate doesn't translate well, but that the actual translation between mediums is handled badly in many cases.
>>43715531
I ran an one-shot adventure here on /tg/ in a fate-like setting, proved much harder than I thought.
>>43723630
I've been here a while too buddy. Most attempts at making any kind of game fail. Fate isn't super special in this regard.
The failing game you're describing is not the way it has to be played. Master and Servants have their own player defined goals and motivations. Some of which tend to align, some of which inherently conflict. The GM has to stipulate that you need some reason to fight in the war, but beyond that F/Z and F/SN show that a wide variety of personalities can have a reason fight in the war. That should be what drives the action, not a hollow desire get people to fight Servant battles in a certain manner. Yeah, with the concept of a Grail War some violence is unavoidable, but combat is not the only theater in which a character can be useful or interesting to play. Fate is just as much about the circumstances surrounding battles as it is the fighting itself. Investigation, planning, diplomacy, there's nothing stopping Magus, Operator, or Servant from being as important as the others in those areas.
If a Servant and a Master disagree about battle strategy, that doesn't need to break the game. Master's and Servants disagree all the time about how to proceed in F/Z and F/SN, it's not a dispute that can only be resolved by one player lone wolfing it or giving up on their agency.
On thing I will agree on is that splitting your players into 7 factions makes for a boring in person game. Mostly because waiting for seven of anything to take their turns is torture. But 3-5 players in 1-2 factions is quite manageable. If you have trouble with players feeling bored in that scenario, that's on the GM to move scenes along.
>>43724231
>But 3-5 players in 1-2 factions is quite manageable
Amen to that. I had three players as Masters (masters of Saber, Lancer and Archer) when i ran the Grail War, and i think that's the perfect number of Master PC's for a Fate game. More than that and the game will start to get REALLY slow.
>>43722195
OP here, in my group everyone knows how's the thing about the grail war and i've asked to them if they wanted to control a master and a servant at the same time or do it in the other way by letting them one being a servant and another one being a master. But the problem with this is that i've only 5 player so i think i won't focus on make that campaing a pvp yet.
>>43722708
Yeah, i was talking about that site, it seemed good to me but searching for opinions i've read somewhere that was a better option to use a setting like Exalted or D&D for it.
>>43722776
I could use this for the campaign, is a pretty good idea because i can't make it a pvp or something like that because i don't have enough players for it, we are just a group of 6 with me included.
>>43723063
Part of what makes the Grail War unique is the claustrophobic setting with the stakes and the tension constantly rising. There's a set number of enemies involved in a free-for-all that begins with limited information in a relatively constricted area, every hour that passes means only the strongest remain and they're getting close to learning your weaknesses.
What you're describing could work, but it almost feels more like it would actually play like a Persona or Jojo knockoff with Heroic Spirits as Stands.
