What went wrong?
Why did Linux never take-off and remains just a hobbyist thing?
To be honest, I think it didn't take off because it doesn't have the average consumer in mind; hence why Windows is so popular.
Linux OS's are more for the technologically-inclined people.
Because it's shit
Windows 10 is the best operating system, is that what you wanted to hear?
Linux sucks, it's shit, no one uses it, everyone who does it just an autistic NEET
Considering the non consumer oriented areas like server, workstations, embedded linux is unbeatable, Microsoft really understood they can't quite compete with it so they now play along, offering it in Azure and now with bash on W10.
If you only have the shitty consumer market in mind then you should leave this board.
Because the average consumer has no desire to learn how to use a command line. They just don't care.
>>54315487
Linux is massively successful. PC-based distros failed miserably. Because they were hamstrung by "hardcoar" users and devs who refused to make a coherent end-user experience.
>>54315487
but it did take off where it was supposed to
it's replaced Unix systems for all but high-end/niche business/academic use cases
it's reasonably common in embedded devices and on phones
it's very successful as a "hobbyist" product
>>54315780
Well that's me desu
>>54315487
windows is to easy to pirate
>>54315487
It's fucking 80% of smartphones and 70% of servers. When will this meme die?
>>54315487
because changing operating systems is too hard for most people
>>54316069
Changing operating systems is trivial. Why do you think there are hundreds of millions of Windows 10 users? Why was the iPhone so quick to catch on?
>>54316178
i mean for most people windows comes installed on their computer by default.
installing something else is something they would never consider, unless its some automatic update.
>>54316209
or they buy a new one (with windows preinstalled)
>>54316209
So why do millions of people run custom ROMs on their phones then?
>>54316256
i said most, not all.
>>54316256
because they are the millions of people that have linux on their computer
Paid MS shill FUD thread, don't reply.
>>54315487
For desktop use: it's because it is different, and the programs that people are used to using on their computer are different and are installed differently. If linux was able to properly read .exe files without any issues, it could get alot of traction. It's doing well, even without being the top of desktop users preference.
LINUX IS NOT AN OPERATING SYSTEM.
GNU is.
Android is.
Linux is not.
God, when will people learn?
>>54315487
Android took off.
But beside that, it's shipped with virtually zero hardware like windows/OSX are and it requires more from the user than either of the alternatives.
Desktop market is small. Once you understand that, you will understand that Linux is doing just fine with things like Android.
>>54316423
Where can I download gnu?
The world runs on Linux. It took off to Andromeda.
I know it's an interesting thread starter and all that, but the answer is baby duck syndrome. Everyone already knows this, and there's no real way to fix it, so it will continue to be the case.
>>54318430
https://www.gnu.org/software/guix/
>>54315487
Considering that threads like these exist I should've just sent a janitor application while they were accepted.
>>54316423
>Lemote
>claiming to support net freedom
>using oppressive chink botnet notebook made by slave workers
Hypocrite
>>54315487
>What went wrong?
Nothing went wrong. Even the ISS runs GNU/Linux. Phones run Linux variants, smart TVs, coffee-machines run Linux. It's just extremly difficult to include systems using the Linux kernel to statistics, because unlike Microsoft and Apple products, these systems don't send any informations.
>>54318506
He's a commie, what did you expect?
>>54318527
>what are user agents?
>>54315758
Technology-inclined person here.
I wouldn't touch Linux with a 10-foot pole, but M$ isn't giving me much of a choice.
>>54315780
Go comb the pop tart crumbs out of your neckbeard normalfag.
>>54316178
Because most people are sheeple.
>>54318473
I've tried that shit. It sucks so fucking hard.
Why is all GNU software overcomplicated?
Why did they have to introduce a whole alien programming language to let you customize the system, instead of doing something simple like OpenBSD, where you just include a tgz file with packages and a shell script on it?
They obviously have never heard of KISS.
>>54316423
GNU is not an operating system
>>54318645
GNU utils + Hurd kernel is the GNU operating system, you colossal fucking faggot shill kike NSA operative.
>>54318530
>what is about:config
>>54318678
>implying Hurd is anywhere near release ready after a decade and a half
Yeah anon, I'm a colossal fucking faggot shill kike NSA operative, but at least I'm not an idiot
>>54315758
Linux is not an operating system. Linux is a kernel. The kernel on Windows is NT. Tech illiterates (Windows users) get this wrong every day.
>>54318694
>>54315487
its not user friendly. thats part of the draw for some but its prevented many companies in the past from bothering to port shit
so compatible software is more limited so users are fewer
>>54318645
>>54318740
Pedantic idiots, should everyone start correcting those who don't say NT/Windows?
>>54318775
Because not every GNU OS is using Linux.
Would you call >>54318761 also just Linux?
>>54318775
Read the post dipshit
I did not say Linux is not an operating system
I said GNU is not an operating system
GNU/Hurd is but it's a fucking joke
>>54316423
>>54316423
depends on your definition of "operating system", entirely. if "operating system" to you, as it does to me, just means "software that manages hardware resources and distributes them among user software" then yes, linux is an operating system. if your definition includes all the hugely diverse shit all of the ones you mentioned include, such as a userland, a text editor, a compiler - i.e. stuff which is entirely exchangeable and rightly so seeing how what you need depends on what you're trying to achieve - then, no, linux is not an operating system.
>>54318869
POSIX defines an operating system
Linux the kernel does not meet that definition
however when combined with the GNU coreutils it does form a complete operating system as defined by POSIX
GNU/Linux is what people usually mean when they say Linux, if they don't they say "Linux Kernel" so go fuck yourself in that context Linux, by which I mean the Linux kernel plus the gnu coreutils, referred to as Linux, is a complete operating system as defined by POSIX
People aren't nearly as ignorant as Richard Stallman thinks
>>54319092
>POSIX defines an operating system
Nope. It defines an API. But you obviously don't know what either is.
>Linux when combined with the GNU coreutils it does form a complete operating system as defined by POSIX
GNU breaks compatibility and convention on purpose, so no, it's not standards-compliant.
>GNU/Linux is what people usually mean when they say Linux
No, they mean Linux. Don't act like you know better than most people out there.
>gnu coreutils
What do the GNU coreutils do that belongs to the attributions of an operating system?
>>54318869
>depends on your definition of "operating system"
There aren't many definitions. Just one really. The rest are retarded attempts to muddy the waters.
Because hardware vendors don't and never really have pushed Linux on the desktop.
>>54316256
>millions of people run custom roms
This is what you guys believe?
>>54318631
>Why is all GNU software overcomplicated?
Because Richard Stallman loves emacs and expects you to program in emacs like him too.
I probably don't know enough english to explain myshelf properly, but I would like to post my point of view. I'll talk about the distributions for normal users, not servers or specific fields.
where is the fault? I would say, the sea of distros.
recently, a friend of mine bought a laptop, and he wanted to try linux. I've been using it for some years so he asked me for advice.
"well, you should pick a distro, I'll suggest ubuntu, or linux mint, go google information about distros and choose one" few days later "-fuck anon, there are too much, I'll go with linux mint, it seems easy"
"wich desktop will you choose?"
"-what?"
he finally go with linuxmint mate, but if you drown a normal user in a lot of distros and desktops and options, people will quickly give up.
also, the terminal scares the shit out of the people.
on the other hand, windows may be shit. people would recognize it's shit, but it-just-works. and they lack the knowledge and the will to give a fuck about their privacy or the performance. just give me a box wich let's me play games and watch porno and that's it.
you're clueless
>>54315884
I don't think the majority refuses to make a coherent end-user experience.
It's more of a problem that there aren't put enough resources into it.
Preinstalls
>dominates servers, routers and smartphones
>never took off
>>54315487
>never take-off
You mean it never take off on the end user desktop? Because it widely used in the interprice sector and servers.
It never take off for desktop personal computers because of the microsoft monopoly runing at that time, thus the lack of propper quality software and drivers support. Adding to that linux wasen't so end-user dumb proof and friendly as windows at that time.
>>54316256
because they are relatively easy to install and do not modify the android experience much.
>>54316423
You're the kind of person that turns people off from ever trying Linux
Assuming you mean why it never took off for home desktop use, it's because there are too many distros. It's not like I don't understand why that's the case, but it's just too confusing and segmented for the public to take an interest. Ubuntu was close but no cigar.
Another big issue is that the goals set forth by many of the big distros are entirely uninteresting for the general desktop user. Take debian and the apt-get command for example. It's easy to use even for newer users, until they find out that they can't immediately install common desktop applications through it because they are considered non-free. Applications like Skype, Spotify or even Firefox, which all have working versions on Linux. The user has to jump through hoops to get such programs and they don't really understand why, which will make them frustrated. I'm not trying to debate whether it's correct or not to combat non-free software, I'm just saying that the average user doesn't really care about those kind of freedom issues.
Then I suppose there are minor issues like confusing names for terminal commands and whatever.
>>54315986
And 95% of supercomputers.
What do you mean "never take-off"?
It's used on all but 6 of the top 500 most powerful computers in the world.
It doesn't normally come pre-installed on new computers, to a non-enthusiast changing the os is a largely complex task. Hell, using keyboard shortcuts and typing things in the address bar instead of a the google toolbar is a huge task to many of them.
Just asking to much from these people...
>>54315487
Because there is no place for this shit. Windows has been developed for everyone from dumb to good tech specialist.
Everything I can do on Linux I can do on Windows, being a software dev I just don't need Linux. Just sometimes I use OS X and that's it.
>>54315487
can't do even basic shit still like vidya and video editing
>>54315487
Because in order to adverstise a product to the masses you need money. Something inherently free cannot compete against something profitable.
>>54315487
>Why did Linux never take-off and remains just a hobbyist thing?
Look, a retard.
>>54315487
If you count market share as measure of "taking off," I guess. But GNU/Linux is anything but a hobbyist thing.
>>54321605
Yes it can.
>>54321646
>professional video editing on linux
top kek said the basement dewelling virgin
>>54321620
>Something inherently free
Except that's wrong. You can sell it, but most just choose not too.
>>54321665
>>54321665
>>professional video editing
define professional for me in a video editor. Most of the editors I've used like Lives, blender, and kdenlive can do most of the things any proprietary one can.
>>54315487
I can smoke the fuck out of this in my 1994 EG hatch with a couple of simple mods:
- 10 point cage with Parachute
- 3 piece discontinued JoJo frontend
- spec-R full drag suspension
- Fuel cell with -8 lines from tank to motor
- 1 044 bosch pump
- 1200 rc injectors
- golden eagle sleeved block
- cp 10:1 pistons
- Eagle rods
- arp headstuds
- oem h22 headgasket
- Balance shaft delete
- competition clutch twin disc
- Port and polished head
- skunk2 valve springs and retainers
- Str cam gears
- crower stage 1 cams
- aluminium radiator with slim fan
- gsr transmission with itr lsd.
- qsd h2k intake manifold adapter
- k20 rbc manifold
- qsd throttle body spacer
- blox 70mm throttle body
- 4bar omni map sensor
- 6al msd with coil and cap. 3 step launch control
- hks bov
- Turbonetics t74 t4 twinscroll. turbocharger.
- Custom t4 front facing turbo manifold with 44mm flange
- 44mm tial wastegate
- Custom water to air intercooler set up
- aem eugo wideband w/ gauge
- tuned on chipped p28
- 13 inch volks drag rims
- 2 15 inch volks rear rims
- arp extended wheel studs
- si cluster
- 150 shots of nitrous
I'm making 348 horsepower to the FRONT WHEELS because thats the only place the power should ever be.
>>54318546
Neckbeards = less than 0.5 % of humanity - way less that that.
Normies - the rest of humanity.
Neckbeards must be right, spending your life in the darkness of basement enlightens you.
>>54315487
Torvalds doesn't pay manufacturers to install Linux on their machines. Average user wouldn't even notice that their PC has something like Mint instead of Windows
>>54315487
Linux is a success where it belongs: on servers, mobiles and embedded devices.
Just because it isn't popular on the desktop doesn't make it a failure or a "hobbyist thing".
>>54322357
Totally cringe worthy.
>Women in tech
>Linux
>Ubuntu
>Open Source
Am done with /g/ for today, thanks.
>>54315487
Your phone probably runs linux faggot.
>>54315922
You mean in regards to traditional desktop OS specifically?
It didn't succeed there because it is the one place it is not getting extreme attention from corporations that can influence standards, hardware compatibility, how much software is available for it. I think if Microsoft kept pushing Valve into the corner they thought they were getting pushed into, ie, not being able to pitch the steam marketplace to their users because microsoft destroyed it with xbox live and the windows store marketplace, I think Valve could have been that massive influx of corporate money to get that done as they weren't going to lose Steam without a fight. However, SteamOS/Steambox is dead and Valve is content to have Steam available on xbox and probably has some long term contract where they will remain safe.
I'd just like to interject for a moment. What you're referring to as Linux,
is in fact, GNU/Linux, or as I've recently taken to calling it, GNU plus Linux.
Linux is not an operating system unto itself, but rather another free component
of a fully functioning GNU system made useful by the GNU corelibs, shell
utilities and vital system components comprising a full OS as defined by POSIX.
Many computer users run a modified version of the GNU system every day,
without realizing it. Through a peculiar turn of events, the version of GNU
which is widely used today is often called "Linux", and many of its users are
not aware that it is basically the GNU system, developed by the GNU Project.
There really is a Linux, and these people are using it, but it is just a
part of the system they use. Linux is the kernel: the program in the system
that allocates the machine's resources to the other programs that you run.
The kernel is an essential part of an operating system, but useless by itself;
it can only function in the context of a complete operating system. Linux is
normally used in combination with the GNU operating system: the whole system
is basically GNU with Linux added, or GNU/Linux. All the so-called "Linux"
distributions are really distributions of GNU/Linux.
>>54323569
One of these days I'd like someone to put a BSD userland with the Linux kernel just because of this quote.
There are far more things running a linux kernel than not. There's more to computers than desktops. Servers, routers, other shit, pretty much all running linux. But plebs only see muh ~2% on desktop.
>>54323627
Not OP, but OP just poorly phrased their question.
OP meant the original aim of the system to be a Desktop.
>>54321667
If you sell nothing but open source software supplemented with next to nothing, someone forks it and a lot of people use the free thing. Like CentOS.
>>54319145
>classic internet "arguments"
let me try it...
>>POSIX defines an operating system
>Nope. It defines an API. But you obviously don't know what either is.
Nope, it doesn't. But you I'm sure you wouldn't know why.
>>Linux when combined with the GNU coreutils it does form a complete operating system as defined by POSIX
>GNU breaks compatibility and convention on purpose, so no, it's not standards-compliant.
No, it doesn't. There are several other reasons you wouldn't understand.
>>GNU/Linux is what people usually mean when they say Linux
>No, they mean Linux. Don't act like you know better than most people out there.
No, they mean GNU. Don't pretend you can simply deny something and convince everyone you're right.
>>gnu coreutils
>What do the GNU coreutils do that belongs to the attributions of an operating system?
What do the GNU coreutils don't do that belong to the attributions of an operating system?
>>depends on your definition of "operating system"
>There aren't many definitions. Just one really. The rest are retarded attempts to muddy the waters.
The one only definition is mine. Don't pretend everyone is as ignorant as you
>>54315758
I've been in IT for 20 years. Microsoft products suck ass. Windows 7 was good. That's their only good product. I use Ubuntu 15.10 and it is plenty easy to use for non techies. If all you're going to do is surf web, watch movies, listen to music, and pretend to be a writer, Ubuntu is easy and free
>>54315487
>Why did Linux never take-off and remains just a hobbyist thing?
Do people really believe this?
I mean, companies such as IBM, Google, Amazon, HP, Oracle even fucking Microsoft are widely using and investing in (by contributing to) Linux.
>>54323617
It already exists, it's called Busybox
Busybox is GPL'd though....
>>54315487
It doesn't come preinstalled. Your average user doesn't know what an operating system is, they just know that this thing called Windows is on practically everything
>>54323761
The combination Linux with Busybox doesn't change the fact that the combination of GNU and Linux is still GNU/Linux. Calling everything Linux ist just retarded. What if someone is using Debian GNU/kFreeBSD? Or GNU/Hurd? There are many different kernels used with the GNU system, therefore it makes sense to point out what kernel you're using with the GNU system, wich is mostly GNU/Linux, but not always.
>>54323965
Why does the magic line of credit get drawn at GNU, anon? Why isn't it systemd/freedestop/gnu/linux? How convenient that your whinebag of a god decided that right at GNU is where enough credit is given. Linux is the thing present in every single Linux system on the fucking planet, Linux is the most proper way to collectively refer to Linux based systems.
>>54324020
Because GNU is actually user-facing, unless someone literally never touches the command line.
Linux, on the other hand, is not user-facing at all. It's actually more important to the user that they're running GNU, rather than Linux. An Android machine is "Linux" but it's nothing like a typical linux box.
>>54324082
Xorg is user facing yet you don't see stallman advocating freedesktop/gnu/linux. Face it, he doesn't care about credit where credit is due or where it makes sense as long as he gets credit. Linux it is, Linux it will be. Whether GNU is present or not.
>>54323965
I don't care about the GNU/Linux vs Linux debate. I call it "Linux" because 1) it's easier to say and 2) then even normies know what I'm talking about.
>>54315487
I blame the community, basically every single Linux proponent i ever met was a huge fucking cunt.
>>54324020
Yeah, let's call it Firefox/Linux, just because Firefox is preinstalled on some distros. Is this your logic? Additional programs are part of distributions, not the operating system. There are many distros which don't use openrc instead of systemd as example.
Furthermore, GNU is the operating system, also a project, collecting tons of different programs, started 10 years before Torvalds wrote his kernel. Surely it makes sense to rename the whole project to, just, the name of Torvalds program.
>>54324175
>There are many distros which don't use openrc instead of systemd as example.
And there are distros which use Busybox instead of GNU. May as well exclude GNU because it's not present literally everywhere. There we go, it's just Linux.
>>54320418
Despite your english, pretty well explained, good job Anon!
>>54315487
It has a mascot/logo only autists like
Fuck Tux.
>>54320418
just choose xubuntu for the fuck sake.
>>54323645
Well, that's not likely to happen ever because:
> missing progs that normies love
> missing normies that buy shit
First one could be solved with money, which would solve second.
>linux.
>never took off.
Desktop normies to stupid to move with the flow.
There's not enough bridging and compatibility with windows.
I can't use a Linux Distro as a sole OS because silverlight/alternatives don't fucking work and there seem to be issues with files being read in office which my clients have (a lot of editing of documents backwards and forwards between us).
Once any business or casual user can just use Linux on a new PC while their mates/clients use Windows with no interaction issues between them, then it would be much easier to convince others to spread its usage.
If I could setup a distro for work and have no problems with my clients I'd easily get my friends, family & coworkers to use a distro they like but I can't so they won't.
Because 90% of software and hardware peripherals run better on Windows as they are often made specifically for Windows PC's. If Linux could runs all that legacy shit flawlessly then maybe it would be worth switching. Also there are too many variants. If it was 'just' Linux and not a million versions like Ubuntu etc then maybe it would get a better foothold.
Also people buy PC's with Windows preinstalled so it's what they are used to.
>>54318544
>Technology-inclined person here.
>I wouldn't touch Linux with a 10-foot pole
Yeaaaah, no.
>>54315821
Why is it unbeatable? Because it does everything you need for free? Or because the kernel is in some way better for these applications? If so, how is it better?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5pOxlazS3zs
This guy has some good points
>>54324606
You still remain autistic though.
>>54315487
>Entire US Department of Defense runs Red Hat Linux, including US Army & Navy on the nuclear submarine fleet
>Northrup-Grumman MQ8B Fire Scout drones Vertical Takeoff & Landing system runs on Linux.
>US Federal Aviation Authority runs Red Hat Linux.
>US National Nuclear Security Administration use Red Hat and Fedora
>Amazon.com uses Linux "in nearly every corner of its business".
>The Chicago Mercantile Exchange's all-Linux infrastructure has processed over a QUADRILLION dollars worth of financial transactions (All the money in the world, 16.66 times over)
>London Stock Exchange uses Linux.
>New York Stock Exchange uses Linux.
>NASA put Linux on ALL International Space Station laptops.
>All of CERN (Including Large Hadron Collider) runs on Linux.
>Google runs on Linux.
>The NSA uses Red Hat Linux.
>Over 90% of the world's fastest supercomputers run Linux
>96.6% of the world's top 1 million websites run on Linux
But tell us more about how Linux never "took off" and "remains just a hobbyist thing".
>>54316423
Terms are publicly adopted all the time.
>Kleenex = Tissue paper
>Band-aid = disposable bandages
>iPad = any tablet
>Apps = program
>linux = arch, ubuntu, Mint...
>>54318740
It is an operating system. Linus himself said so.
>>54315487
its been stated 100e+10000000 fucking times
the professional linux community is segregated, focusing on their own little projects
the amateur linux community is so fucking cancerous
>>54319445
This, which is why Hurd will never be a thing
>>54315487
Nice try.
Look up Red Hat
>>54315487
Linux runs something like 70% of the server infrastructure of the Internet
>>54315487
Nice try pajeet.
>>54329967
>Linux runs something like 70% of the server infrastructure of the Internet
But most of the world's PCs are used by people.
They aren't servers.
With a <2% desktop marketshare Linux is obviously not a palatable choice for most humans.
Personally I consider becoming THE server environment for most major websites you'd visit today, and the most used for supercomputers and enterprise hosting and web storage as taking off.
Android is p popular too
>>54330931
It's got a massive foothold in the smart phone sector and the desktop distributions are becoming easier to use.
Even I've made the jump to Ubuntu server and I've used windows exclusively on my desktop since 3.1.
>>54331149
>the desktop distributions are becoming easier to use.
Still not resonating with the Real People, the ones prepared to pay for an OS.
>>Even I've made the jump to Ubuntu server
Always with the server.
You're a Linux shill, what else would you use?
And you're talking about desktop now?
>>54331261
I chose server because I wanted to drop myself in the deep end. I'm using xfce now though.
>muh shill
I still have a box running wangblows 7 & 8.1, now what?
>>54323215
fagot
>>54327867
Most of the DoD is on Windows, bro
>>54318740
Linux is an operating sytem. Linus even said so. Fuck RMS. Even after 30 years, GNU/TURD is still barely functional.
>>54333229
Stop trying to justify yourself. It's not bad to be wrong, but it's bad to stay wrong when you know it better.
>>54315487
Unification
The big thing linux spergs love to talk about is how modular linux is - And it's cool, don't get me wrong - but these modular components aren't built to work well and don't have a similar structure and such
It's why Linux installs are hodgepoges of multiple windowing libraries, multiple ways to do Graphics, Audio, Drivers, Bluetooth, and getting those all to sync together is not easy nor does it always work OOTB
It's easy to tell a computer savvy nerd to go in and install something via a command line - but a normal person's going to fuck it up or will be frightened to fuck it up.
Then there's the interface - there's no standard interface across the system. It's a minor thing that programmers think only marketingfags care about, but if you're going to hit the normie market, you want a solid aesthetic for all your system interfaces and shit.
it's things like that that make me like fucking HaikuOS over most Linux Distros
I think if you want linux to be successful for normies - you have to get your big guys (Red Hat, Canonical,etc.,) to do a bit more than compiling distros - you got to get them creating design documents, conforming interfaces to a standard, seeing what it is that makes windows and mac good and marketable, and for the common user and build for that.
I installed Xubuntu - and i tried to hook up my bluetooth speaker- it didn't work, the error message was typically not helpful until i looked in to it more, and then i had to install a package. Now none of these were hard for me - but a normie distro like *buntu shouldn't be like that.
>>54318740
This arbitrary distinction between "kernel" and "operating system" was introduced by the GNUcucks in order to justify placing "GNU" in front of "Linux", which is just a pathetic jewish attempt to piggyback on the success of a white man.
