you fucked up America. you could've voted for the only candidate endorsed by RMS himself. the only candidate that respects your freedom.
Eat shit and die in a fire. Trump 2016.
>>54250036
Fuck off, net-neutrality is shit. I'm quite happy with cell phone providers now offering free streaming from services that won't count towards my data cap.
>>54250044
>Look up Trump
>Says he would "err on the side of security" and support maintaining the Patriot Act and continuing mass surveillance.
>Mistakenly believes the FCC’s Net Neutrality protections are an "attack on the Internet" that would "target conservative media."
it's like you fags care more about voting in a meme president than your actual freedom
>>54250044
I wish you people had stayed in /v/
>Bernouts
>>54250081
I wish you people had been aborted.
HOW THE FUCK CAN DEMOCRATS VOTE FOR HILARY?
>>54250036
>>54250077
implying whoever gets voted in as president actually matters. they're just a public face with no real power.
>candidate endorsed by RMS
best reason not to vote for him
>>54250114
They don't. She wins anyway.
Why do Americans like being cucked by their politicians so much?
>>54250143
this tbqh
foss is overrated and 99% of the time just plain broken.
pic-related: nonfoss software that just werks
Vote mcafee the only sensible choice
>commie faggot supports another commie faggot
lmao
>>54250114
This, desu senpai. Anyone but Hillary. Her Middle East and civil rights policies are fucked. It will essentially be a Fifth term for Bush if she gets elected. At least with Trump people will know they are getting fucked and want to do something about it.
>>54250185
Fuck you pajeet only us citizens are allowed tk vote. Go vote for the blue woman with 8 arms in your shithole country
>>54250036
Ever since he talked of banning cigs, I can't help but think he's an anti-freedom socialist
>>54250114
Her positions are a small steps and a h*ck of a lot easier to actually accomplish than what panders is promising. Hillary would keep moving America in a more liberal direction while Bernie would accomplish nothing in 4 years.
>>54250218
>h*ck of a lot easier
>h*ck of a lot
>h*ck of a
>h*ck of
>h*ck
>h * c k
>>54250226
they call that an advanced jimmy rustling tactic.
>>54250232
It worked.
>>54250140
>so i might as well vote for the worst option, right?
>>54250195
id honestly rather have shillary than trumpo. they are both trash, but at least shillary says reasonable things, has reasonable goals. also her civil rights policies are much better than trump's (as far as I could tell from his latest statements on mass surveilance/muslims/mass deportation/etc)
>>54250216
>you're ok with shredding privacy protections because there's a .000001% chance a terrorist might kill you
>you complain about muh freedom when the government does something productive to protect you
>>54250218
>hillary
>liberal direction
She's a neocon war hawk in a pant suit. There is nothing liberal about her, even in the watered-down American sense of the term.
>>54250073
>I love freedom when it benefits me, but I dislike it when the opposite benefits me.
>>54250243
>civil liberties
She supports all of the current surveillance measures and actively pushed for: arms shipments for the Saudi war in Yemen, invasion of Libya, and the psuedo invasion of Syria. The policies she advocates is literally the reason ISIS exists.
>>54250036
Even RMS accepts that Bernie doesn't respect your freedom, he's the least worst freedom wise though
>>54250114
Everything in this elections is engineered to get Hillary in place
>>54250036
FUCK NET NEUTRALITY
FUCK THE GOVERNMENT TRYING TO MICROMANAGE THE FUCKING INTERNET
FUCK BERNIE SANDERS
Im glad Hillarys going to win
Socialist cuckold manbabies BTFO!!'
>>54250114
>implying hilary needs votes to win
>>54250274
lol he obviously mispoke with that during the debate, the guy was stumbling over his words all night. it's crazy how big of the deal the media made of it
>>54250274
Why are you using a tripcode?
>>54250243
You have no idea what hilary really supports.
Neither does she, at least until she gets her bank statement.
>>54250245
She's a neocon for the same reason the neocons are- you make a lot of money pandering to big business. More war, more surveillance, less taxes for lobbyists, these are all things which net you big bux.
>Jew commie endorses Jew commie
We need a new hitler but with real ovens this time
>all this cucks calling RMS a commie
Enjoy your Stalin society with Shillary/Trump
>>54250274
>doesn't realize that government protections and subsidies are the reason ISP and cell providers are so shit in the US
>thinks regulations are binary: more is bad, less is good
>>54250294
You only have to look at the "donors" to the CGI to realize who she will be supporting. She was literally accepting "donations" from Arab dictators while "overseeing" arms shipments to their countries. How many pants suits is her integrity worth?
>>54250114
>>54250159
>>54250195
Listen White Boi neets
People outside of your little upper class white PRIVILEGEGED bubble on Reddit.com overwhelmingly supports Hillary
I'm talking women, minorities, and people who actually have jobs
Hillary has a proven track record
Sanders? That cowardly cuckold has only passed THREE bills in congress, two of which were to rename post offices. He's a failure who can't manage his own finances AND he handed his mic over to BLM protestors like a self hating cuck. Mean while based Bill BTFO the BLM protestors who tried disrupting Hillary
Face it, Bills 8 years in office were maximum comfy, and we're about to get 8 more years of MAX COMFY
You cucks will NEVER have your little "revolution" and it gets me fucking HARD. Fucking dipshit white college kids with no work experience trying to hijack the country. Get cucked and fucked, Hillary already won.
>>54250077
>it's like you fags care more about voting in a meme president than your actual freedom
yeah pretty fucking sick of my country men
they dont give a fuck about freedom
>>54250334
bad b8 desu senpai
git gud
>>54250334
Why are you using a tripcode?
>>54250334
>minorities supporting hillary
Literal cucks.
Bills years were good because he held office between the cold war and "war on terrorism. He also rode the tech boom.
>>54250359
>that moment when you live in such a reddit information bubble that you have never talked to actual voters in the real world
Ok.
>>54250364
Tell you what, I'll give up the trip when Sanders gives up his failed campaign
>>54250328
Yeah and look at Sanders donors
These are the people he will be answering to
2 years of BLM and SJW feminism? Fuck that! (Pic related)
/pol/ leaks way too much onto this board
>jews only care about money
>everyone, don't vote for the socialist candidate, he's a jew
>instead vote for the actual greedy capitalist
>>54250398
or I could just filter your trip because you're being an attention-whoring faggot.
>>54250189
more like
kike faggot supports another kike faggot
>>54250398
>these are the people he will be answering to
Oh lord, a politician who answers to voters instead of multinational corporations and foreign donors. Can't have that. We might join the rest of the industrialized world with government healthcare, decent internet, and free tuition.
>>54250400
No one said anything about him being a Jew until you did
Typical low IQ Bernie bro trying to play the victim, when EVERYDAY your kind launches unfair attacks against Hillary just because she's a woman
>>54250405
You're acting like I'm gaining anything by talking to you
>>54250334
i can't wait for the government to ban guns that are never used in crime just to make dems feel good while illicit handguns are used to kill literally everybody
i can't wait for hillary to initiate ww3 over the potential future of some third world fucks with inherited double digit IQs
i can't wait for all my freedom and privacy to vanish in the name of stopping terrorism and ensuring maximum profits for the american mass media industry
>>54250429
And you're acting like an attention-whoring waste of DNA on this planet. Do the gene pool a favor and kill yourself.
>>54250400
thanks for shekels bestest goys
>>54250429
And no one told you to use a trip yet that hasn't stopped you.
But to answer your counter, many people in this thread have in fact referred to both non-ironically referred to both Sanders and RMS as a jew or commie, even at the same time, without realizing the irony if it.
>>54250424
>decent internet
Oh here we go, this fucking idiot actually brought into the dumb dribble that Sanders was spouting.
You know why our internet is slower on average than industrialized nations that are less spread out? Because America is far more suburban and rural than they are. We have thousands of sparsely populated square miles that skew the average. Compensating for those we are actually far ahead of the curve. I know you do t understand how such things work though.
>listen to the voters
You mean listen to white college kids? Because minorities, women, and people with jobs are overwhelmingly choosing Hillary over Sanders.
Maybe you should listen to the voters and accept defeat.
>>54250400
You can always go to reddit where you and your fellow berniebros can jack each other off about how he's actually winning.
>>54250435
>wanting niggers to own guns
What the fucks wrong with you?
>>54250482
Except I realize Bernie won't win. I pretty much knew months ago he wouldn't. It's a shame, but Democracy means that the wills of the majority take precedence over the wills of the individual. What I'm concerned about is that people are seriously considering a candidate who's economic plan amounts to "I become president and everything becomes better"
>>54250506
>I become president and middle America will have to pay for 250k worth of liberal art degree debt for millions of unemployable dipshits
>>54250474
I live in a city of roughly 200k people and I pay 60 dollars a month for 50/20. I would pay a third of that for comparable service in Europe. The reason the cost is so high is because of regional, government mandated monopolies.
>voting is the only way people access their politicians
I'm talking about a politician who is beholden to the public interests, not the interests of their corporate donors. The irony of a Hillary voter telling someone to drop out of the race early when she went all the way to the convention in 2008 is hilarious.
>>54250515
>I become president and I force the second most powerful country in the world in terms of both economy and military, which we have absolutely no leverage over, to build a giant wall that will fail to prevent 90% of current illegal immigration because I used to host a TV show and actually thought that people shop for steaks through Sharper Image.
>>54250520
Well Bernie Sanders wouldn't be able to bust those monopolies
Google Fiber will
>>54250515
>government education and healthcare isnt possible
The rest of the developed world would like a word with you. You spend more than any other developed world (which all have government funded healthcare and education) per capita on both, yet have worse results.
>>54250534
>executive branch can't bust monopolies that the executive branch oversees
ok...
>>54250526
>second most powerful country in the world in terms of both economy and military
I'm mexican, this is retarded and beyond pure delusion
Economy wise Mexico's the 10th biggest, still a fraction from the USA GDP
Military wise it's far from the second most powerful in the world, and probably not the 10th most powerful either
>>54250551
I meant China there.
>>54250114
I won't. Shillary can watch me vote for Trump and weep. It didn't have to be this way, but this is the way it beed.
>>54250077
Trump's not without his flaws, but he's not out to gouge my paycheck even harder.
I just want to be left alone, and Bernie most certainly isn't advocating that.
>>54250564
Trump hasn't said anything about a wall in China, how would there be a wall with China? It's not even close to the USA
He has talked about reducing the trade deficit with China, by means of "I will do it!" and iirc by applying more tariffs and import controls
Holy fuck leddit is getting even worse
>>54250073
That doesn't necessarily conflict with net neutrality.
>>54250520
>I live in a city of roughly 200k people and I pay 60 dollars a month for 50/20. I would pay a third of that for comparable service in Europe
kekeroni
I live in a 250k city in Germany and I pay 40 Euroshekels for 16/6.
That's 45 USD, but I also probably pay twice as many taxes as you burgers.
Not everyone lives in hip inner capital apartments where you can get 100 Mbits or more.
>>54250541
>yet have worse results
Please. Canadian's health care hit a crisis a few years back, and it's not even better now. If you want fast, quality care, you go private in Canada, and pay through the nose for it (meaning the rich still get better treatment).
No experience in Great Britain, but in Germany, some tranny I know has to take an entire day to see her doctor just to get her hormone prescription filled once per month.
And then there's the US, where seeing the doctor doesn't take all day, you don't have to scramble to find a family doctor, you don't have doctors pushing you out the door, and you can get six months of sex change pills for 10 bucks without insurance, and pay a whopping 60 bucks for the office call.
>>54250600
And /pol/ once again fails at reading comprehension. But all of this is second to the fact that Trump cannot convince ANY country in the world to pay for the wall. That includes the US itself if he becomes President. Try passing through Congress plans to build a 90ft wall that will cost a minimum of $20 billion of taxpayer money and still won't do shit to prevent the 90% of illegal immigrants from Mexico who fly into the US.
Trump while charismatic is a terrible businessman who does not represent the American people, who knows nothing about foreign policy, economics, technology, or public policy. And that's not even counting his lack of political knowledge. At best Trump will accomplish absolutely nothing in Congress. At worst, every single thing he has proposed is either incredibly expensive for the American populace or is a war crime.
>>54250647
>muh anecdotal evidence
https://publichealthonline.gwu.edu/us-health-care-vs-the-world/
>>54250647
yeah you need to go private in Germany as well, shit is fucking ridiculous
Back when I was in public healthcare, usually seeing family doctor or an orthopedist didn't take long, but you're rekt if you want to see any kind of specialist, usually 2-3 months wait time etc.
also they're really reluctant to prescribe you any kind of pill, some of which can be bought otc in murca
>>54250653
>Trump cannot convince ANY country in the world to pay for the wall.
Sure he can. If Mexico doesn't pay for it, then we take the billions of dollars in aide money we ship them every year, and we use it to build the wall.
Fuck, we could just use the money for materials, and promise the illegal immigrants that they will be given full citizenship for themselves, their spouse, and their children in exchange for building the wall for free (minus the 3 hots and a cot), and we would be overwhelmed with volunteers. The materials themselves, as estimated by CNN, would cost about 30 dollars in taxes per citizen (which, again, wouldn't have to happen - just take the aide money that goes to Mexico).
I have no problem with you arguing against Trump. He's not my first choice (that went to Rand), but at least know the arguments.
>>54250653
was it not mexico who would be forced to pay for the wall? i think i heard something about stopping all trading between two countries until the wall is done?
t. non-burger
![Ozodw8X[1].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/TlCbeBx.jpg "Ozodw8X[1].jpg")
>>54250036
I'd like to thank all Trump supporters for donating exactly $0 and phonebanking 0 calls for the Trump campaign this weekend!
Without all your contributions this great night and complete sweep of the competition would not have been possible!
That said I would like you all to know in order to keep the wins rolling in, I have decided to contribute my rent towards paying my rent!
I hope you all will consider doing the same and help MAKE AMERICA GREAT AGAIN!!!!
Lol @ the bernouts
>>54250679
Here, bud. So long as you aren't a fat unhealthy sack of shit, get some good coverage for less than what Bernie would charge per citizen. Cheapest rates that I've been able to find, and, oddly, not listed on the Obamacare site.
Just google "liberty health share."
>>54250708
I have BCBS with much better coverage than that. The issue doesn't matter to me personally, it simply makes sense at a national level.
![b5KmST[1].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/vDNcAsx.jpg "b5KmST[1].jpg")
My waifu supports Trump
>>54250734
No, it doesn't.
Stop assuming that other people's problems are yours. The US produces far more medical research than the rest of the world combined, and if the US went socialist (like the rest of the civilized world), research would dry up, and advances would stagnate, like they did in the USSR, where they were still using light therapy to combat cancer.
The solution isn't to drag ourselves down. It's to force other nations to develop their own research, instead of allowing a parasitic relationship.
>>54250687
>Sure he can. If Mexico doesn't pay for it, then we take the billions of dollars in aide money we ship them every year, and we use it to build the wall.
Again something that is up to Congress and will almost surely not pass seeing as how everyone on both sides absolutely hates him. Lindsey Graham, the Congressman who said that someone could shoot Cruz on the floor of the Congress and no one would try you, is endorsing Cruz because he considers it better than Trump. If you thought the deadlock that Congress has been under Obama was bad, wait until the candidate who is hated by his own party is put into power.
>>54250692
Definitely would never happen. Mexico is our 3rd largest trading partner with half a trillion dollars of trade between the two countries every year. The economic cost of cutting off trade with them would be more expensive than paying for the wall itself.
cont.
>>54250687
>Fuck, we could just use the money for materials, and promise the illegal immigrants that they will be given full citizenship for themselves, their spouse, and their children in exchange for building the wall for free (minus the 3 hots and a cot), and we would be overwhelmed with volunteers. The materials themselves, as estimated by CNN, would cost about 30 dollars in taxes per citizen (which, again, wouldn't have to happen - just take the aide money that goes to Mexico).
So now the proposal is to let in Illegal Immigrants in order to stop 10% of immigrants from entering the US by current standards. None of this is considering the logistical costs and difficulties in building this as well. Millions of dollars just in roads to handle transporting the goods to the wall, the increased cost of all other construction and infrastructure advances in the US due to the crowding-out effect, etc. The only thing that the average Trump supporter will hate more than both paying for the wall and allowing in immigrants to have them build it, is when the government use eminent domain to claim their land in order to build it.
>>54250653
>And /pol/ once again fails at reading comprehension. But all of this is second to the fact that Trump cannot convince ANY country in the world to pay for the wall
And leddit fails again at simple facts
The only country Trump says will pay for the wall is Mexico
Also he has said how the wall will be paid in case Mexico doesn't pay for it, which is
>Sure he can. If Mexico doesn't pay for it, then we take the billions of dollars in aide money we ship them every year, and we use it to build the wall.
Though that's the US paying for the wall, but anyways
How the fuck did you thought that China would pay for the wall? There's literally no relationship between the wall and China
>>54250708
A nationalised health service is one that is disproportionate, the rich pay for the wellbeing of the poor more than the other way around.
Saying 'everyone pays $200' is an average. The poor will pay very little, the rich more.
Sounds unfair until you realise where the money that the rich people have comes from. Walmart execs don't put in 4000 hours a day of hard work, they have minimum wage employees who do that. They're paying for the wellbeing of their employees, and they see the benefits from that since the employees work more. They don't put off medical problems, and they treat things earlier because they don't have to worry about the costs. People will put off a $10,000 bill hoping it'll go away instead of the $100,000 treatment later.
It's perfectly able to be functional so long as the government is functional.
Problem is that the government is not functional.
A functional government can also reduce healthcare costs. Choose generics over patented formulations. Put caps on the cost of scanning and use computerised diagnosticians to reduce the need for expensive diagnostic techniques.
A proper system can make healthcare cheaper, but america is never going to get that system so private is probably best for america.
>>54250764
I would like some facts showing that research costs are what make medical care in the US so expensive. The USSR was a very poor nation, comparing the two isn't fair.
>>54250782
>Again something that is up to Congress and will almost surely not pass seeing as how everyone on both sides absolutely hates him.
This is where his no experience in politics, but lots of experience in business pays off. There is no "mutual suicide" when it comes to Trump. His life has been pretty much totally public since the 80's, so if there was any dirt to dig up, it would have already found its way to the surface.
Other politicians, on the other hand, typically have plenty of dirt. Sure, a lot of it is technically public knowledge, but Trump can just start destroying careers by pointing out all the votes people have made that betray their constituency's wishes, whether this is a compromise or deals that have been made with private lobbyists.
Respecting my freedom by promoting the government being in control of things. Right, that's how freedom works.
Riiiiiiiiiiiiight.
True freedom is no government and true software freedom is allowing people the freedom to do whatever they like to the code. Fucking commies with their memes and pretending to be free.
>>54250764
Kasparov commented on this, it was amusing looking at his facebook wall and seeing college students lecturing a man who lived in the USSR about how wrong he is about socialism.
>The answer takes us back to all those inventions America has produced decade after decade. As long as Europe had America taking risks, investing ambitiously, attracting the world’s dreamers and entrepreneurs, and yes, being unequal, it could benefit from the results without making the same sacrifices. Add to that the incalculable windfall of not having to spend on national defense thanks to America’s massive investment in a global security umbrella. America doesn’t have the same luxury of coasting on the ambition and sacrifice of another country.
>Who will be America’s America? What other nation could attract the brightest students, the biggest investors, the most ambitious entrepreneurs in the same way? Germany? Russia? Japan? China? India? Each may take over leadership in some areas if America continues to falter, but none is equipped to lead the world in innovation the way the United States has since Thomas Edison’s day. None possesses the combination of political and economic freedoms and the human and natural resources required.
http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2016/03/10/garry-kasparov-hey-bernie-don-t-lecture-me-about-socialism-i-lived-through-it.html
>>54250236
> trump
> Worst option
Top kek. May as well kill yourself now if you're this much of a cuck
>>54250140
>doesn't understand how politics works
THEY DON'T REALLY HAVE POWER GUYS LMAO LYKE IT'S JUST THE KOCH BROTHERS AND THE JEW AMIRITE GAIZ?
>>54250188
he dropped out of the race a long time ago.
>>54250798
Trump's estimates for the cost of the wall have been wrong and changing this entire campaign. He initially said he could make it for $2 billion, now most experts are expecting a 30ft wall to cost at least $16 billion. Trump doesn't know shit. He has no well thought out plans at all. Half of his construction projects and most of his other businesses have failed. He calls himself a billionaire when his net worth is likely a tenth of what he says it is.
>>54250818
How the fuck does that have any relevance? Congress doesn't pass bills based on what whore a candidate slept with. And Trump most certainly isn't living his life in public. Most voters don't know that Trump is contributing only $2 millions of his campaign. Over 70% of his campaign is being paid by other parties. There's also his bullshit reasoning about why he can't release his taxes yet, despite being the only candidate still in the race to not do so yet. Despite the fact that he criticized Romney for not releasing his taxes months earlier in his primary campaign.
I cannot trust a man who would let a female orangutan take his place w
>>54250364
so you can filter him
>>54250816
>The USSR was a very poor nation, comparing the two isn't fair.
Your age is showing. They were literally the only competitor to the US for decades. They weren't poor at all. They were totalitarian communist.
As for overwhelming proof, there's a map that shows the world proportionately by the amount of peer reviewed medical research. The US is the only country with any size. Gimmie a minute, I'll see if I can find it.
Give this a read while you wait though:
http://www.medpagetoday.com/PublicHealthPolicy/HealthPolicy/1767
http://www.scientificamerican.com/article/the-worlds-best-countries-science/
>>54250844
>How the fuck does that have any relevance?
If you don't see how threatening to call attention to shady (but not illegal) shit that a lawmaker does isn't manipulation, then I have nothing more to say to you.
>>54250036
>the only candidate that respects your freedom.
Hahaha what the fuck, you call 60% taxation for middle class people "respecting freedums"? Get the fuck out of here "Bernie Bro"
>>54250844
>Trump's estimates for the cost of the wall have been wrong and changing this entire campaign. He initially said he could make it for $2 billion, now most experts are expecting a 30ft wall to cost at least $16 billion. Trump doesn't know shit. He has no well thought out plans at all. Half of his construction projects and most of his other businesses have failed. He calls himself a billionaire when his net worth is likely a tenth of what he says it is.
>completely moving the goalpost
>>54250888
The USSR was hardly an economic or miltary competitor. They never matched the US in military or economic strength. Per capita, they weren't a wealthy country.
More to the point, the amount of medical research is irrelevant. I would like for you to prove your point that the cost of medical research is the reason for the high cost of medical care in the US.
Your argument against socialized medicine is even more absurd when you realize that medical research, which you taut as the reason for the high cost of care, is already highly socialized.
I don't follow American politics, is the jew out of the race?
>>54250947
Even by those measurements, that's 50 bucks per person. Meanwhile, the demand for labor at and above the minimum wage goes up, and fewer, if any, illegals operating below minimum wage will qualify for welfare programs, decreasing the necessity of welfare.
>>54250582
>he's not out to gouge my paycheck even harder.
...He's a Republican.
>>54250966
America does have a lot of medical research but most of it is low quality china-tier pharmaceutical company funded garbage.
Most studies never even get published, they get thrown into basements because they didn't show Astra Zenica's new drug working. They fund 10 studies and shelve all the ones that show that the drug isn't worthwhile. Then they publish the statistical anomalies, and get you to buy the new drug over the old one, even though the only detectable improvement is an anomaly they engineered, but it costs 20 times as much.
Oh healthcare is so much better in the US
>>54250582
If your paycheck is lower trump makes more money.
Trump wants to pay you as little as possible.
Bernie wants to increase taxes for those that make six figures or more.
>>54250902
Ah the classic /pol/ "I haven't refuted any arguments but you said something that disagrees with how I think Congress works so I win."
Despite what House of Cards may make you think, government doesn't generally work based on blackmailing candidates. It works by a mixture of monetary corruption and party loyalty with a small degree of personal believes and obligation to constituents (usually around election time). Trump is not any more open then Sanders or Cruz (Hillary would have been in the same boat back in 2008). You say that there's no dirt on him, but that just means that none has been found yet. And honestly, I'd rather have a President who fucked a couple whores or used to use cocaine than one who's foreign policy consists almost entirely of actions that are against international law.
>>54250947
Not really moving goalposts. My points about the wall are that:
1) No country in the world but the US would ever pay for such a thing
2) There is no way Trump could ever convince Congress to fund it
3) It would cost significantly more than he thinks
4) Between the increases in taxes, eminent domain, and the other tertiary effects that such a large undertaking would cause the American people would be much better off without the wall being constructed anyways.
And most importantly 5) A wall in the 21st century cannot keep people out of the country. Today over 90% of illegal immigrants from Mexico come to the US by legally flying into the US then staying past the duration of their visa. And this is with just a small fence between the two countries. Until one of you /pol/tards can provide any sort of counterargument to this point (or even acknowledge its existence) I'm done .
>>54250987
You realize not being given the wealth of others isn't the same thing as having your paycheck gouged, right?
>>54250966
>I would like for you to prove your point that the cost of medical research is the reason for the high cost of medical care in the US.
http://kff.org/health-costs/issue-brief/snapshots-how-changes-in-medical-technology-affect/
>Your argument against socialized medicine is even more absurd when you realize that medical research, which you taut as the reason for the high cost of care, is already highly socialized.
Of course it is. What, you didn't think that taxes being spent on research didn't count as healthcare spending, did you?
>>54250764
I really like this meme that X sucks in the US because they are the Brave Protectors Of The Universe.
College leaves everyone in insane debt? Oh, that's because the brave American military defends Europe with their army and fleet!
Healthcare is absolutely fucked, insanely expensive and with terrible results? Oh, it's the bleeding-edge medical research that's expensive, the US saving everyone once again!
Your attempt to paint socialism as a uniform block is laughable. You are almost as retarded as Trump voters. The only other thing that's up to you is to say "The USSR has gulags, therefore any step towards social democracy literally equals gulags".
It's a fact that the leading cause of bankruptcy in the United States is medical bills.
>>54251007
Well trump's foreign policy is 'torture and murder more foreigners'.
Like the soviet union he wants to cut terroism off at the root. The problem we have at the moment is when you drone strike a suspect from high altitude, you kill him, his friends, and his neighbours, often leaving a bunch of angry families who share their resentment at being bombed from the air with the rest of the community.
Trump wants to instead torture the suspect to death to get information, then murder their families, and keep murdering until there's no tail. Women and children as a target rather than collateral damage.
>>54251021
>You realize not being given the wealth of others
...Where do you think the rich got their money from? They are given the wealth of others.
>isn't the same thing as having your paycheck gouged
The paycheck is gouged at a different level.
Here's a fact. The republicans care /exclusively/ about the ultra-rich.
The rich become richer, the poor stay poor or become even poorer.
>>54251001
>Trump wants to pay you as little as possible.
Yeah, that's why he wants to restrict the cheap workforce known as illegal immigration, right?
>Bernie wants to increase taxes for those that make six figures or more.
Bernie's own tax plan states that EVERYONE will be paying more.
But even presuming that statement was right, so fucking what? You are wanting to take more of other people's money, while doing absolutely nothing to earn it, which they likely did, considering that familial wealth does not last long in the US.
And if you are saying that they should pay more in taxes and should be paying a 15 dollar minimum wage, there's nothing stopping you from going and starting your own business that provides free healthcare to employees and pays them 15 dollars per hour. You don't need a salaried army of bureaucrats to do that.
People thinking that they are entitled to the money of others for non-universal goods is getting silly. And, no, medicine is not universal, because different people need different things. If it worked like the publicly owned electric company, nothing would change, because you would still pay for what you need. And it's not like an armed self defense force, where everyone needs the same level of protection.
>>54251052
>The problem we have at the moment is when you drone strike a suspect from high altitude, you kill him, his friends, and his neighbours, often leaving a bunch of angry families who share their resentment at being bombed from the air with the rest of the community.
Which is a significant improvement from basically any other approach to waging outright war that exists, though on the other hand reducing a town to a smoking crater doesn't leave any angry families to share resentment.
Was it Scott Alexander who wrote a hypothetical post about a world where drone warfare was the historical means of waging war? I think it was.
>Women and children as a target rather than collateral damage.
The issue here being that terrorists generally don't really have families. They abduct and rape women. Trump wants to murder these completely innocent women in order to prove a point - not to the terrorists, no, this will never work - but to his own popularion, and the sole purpose is to appear Tough On Browns.
>>54251021
>wealth of others
How do you define that? Because historically, the wealthy currently have the largest share of the country's wealth.
>>54251044
You took that long and that's all you came up with? The article simply states that new, expensive procedures and technologies cause half of the increase in costs. This does nothing to prove your argument that medical research is the reason for the difference in medical costs between the US and other developed countries.
>>54251049
You're absolutely right, anon.
I would much rather not have an over reaching army, just a small self defense force. Or mandated welfare of any sort.
You think I'm arguing how we should be spending the money that's already getting taxed, when I actually believe in getting rid of everything we possibly can, and letting competition and innovation take hold.
>>54250647
>Wait six hours to see a doctor (unless it is a medical emergency) and pay nothing.
>Get in instantly and go bankrupt, unless you are paying your expensive insurance bill.
These are your choices. If you factor in how many hours you spend at the doctors on average in an entire year, and compare to how much you pay for insurance a year you will see waiting isn't that bad.
If you want the first system to work more efficiently pass a law that doctors can legally fine patients for wasting the systems time if patients come in simply to beg for Oxycontin, or if they come in because they have the sniffles. This will cut down the waiting hours heavily and ensure only people who need to see a doctor will go.
>>54251069
...Where do you think the rich got their money from? They are given the wealth of others.
Yeah. With full consent from all parties involved. You, on the other hand, don't give a shit about consent.
>Here's a fact. The republicans care /exclusively/ about the ultra-rich.
Good thing I'm not a republican. I am, however, a realist, and am totally fine without having universal healthcare, a raised minimum wage, or welfare of any sort. And, considering I've actually gone homeless before, I think it's safe to say that I live by my principles.
>>54251103
If the last decade and a half has proven anything, its that a sledgehammer to the Middle East only spreads terrorism. What started out as a problem in rural Afghanistan has engulfed the entire region. The idea that drone strikes, or any other military intervention, can stop the spread of terrorism is laughable.
>>54251097
>Yeah, that's why he wants to restrict the cheap workforce known as illegal immigration, right?
Pff.
This entire election is a competition about who hates Icky Brown People more. Who are the bigots going to vote for?
>You are wanting to take more of other people's money, while doing absolutely nothing to earn it,
That's what the rich are doing, you fucking nitwit. Taking other people's money.
>which they likely did, considering that familial wealth does not last long in the US.
False false false false. The US is astonishingly low about vertical social mobility, one of the lowest in all developed countries.
> there's nothing stopping you from going and starting your own business that provides free healthcare to employees and pays them 15 dollars per hour.
Market forces are, dipshit. People who conduct their business ethically are at a severe disadvantage! If I pay my employees 15/hr, then my competitor in the exact same situation will earn 2x my money, have a larger pool of money to use, and drives me out of business.
That's why minimum wage EXISTS. People are paid minimum wage because it's literally illegal to pay them less.
>>54251106
>How do you define that? Because historically, the wealthy currently have the largest share of the country's wealth.
So what?
>You took that long and that's all you came up with?
I'm not just talking to you. And half the increase of costs is 9.8%, or about 2.5% more than the economy, which we can safely estimate at 7.3%. Half of 9.8% is 4.9%, which, incidentally, is also lower than the economy's 7.3% increase.
>>54251123
>with full consent from all parties involved
>because everyone agreed that the wealthy should hold a record percentage of US wealth
Taxes on the wealthy are the lowest they've been in 70 years. To imply that any raise to rates would be cobfinscatory is, quite simply, ludicrous.
>>54251114
>6 hours.
Ha! You WISH it was 6 hours.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q2jijuj1ysw
>>54251123
I sure didn't consent to all the taxes evasion that is happening for the big companies
>>54251155
You're completely misreading the article. The article is stating that medical advances account for half of the growth. That is to say, a heart replacement will cost more than the statin drugs that preceded it. That has nothing to do with the US footing the bill for healthcare research.
>>54250987
Guess where bernie is going to get the funding for "free" college
>your paycheck
>>54251149
>This entire election is a competition about who hates Icky Brown People more.
Except he isn't sending all Mexicans back. Only the illegal immigrants who come in, work for under minimum wage, pay nothing in taxes, and take advantages of tax funded welfare programs.
>That's what the rich are doing, you fucking nitwit. Taking other people's money.
With their consent
90% of US familial wealth is entirely gone by the 3rd generation. Feel free to prove how that is "lower" than other countries.
>Market forces are, dipshit. People who conduct their business ethically are at a severe disadvantage! If I pay my employees 15/hr, then my competitor in the exact same situation will earn 2x my money, have a larger pool of money to use, and drives me out of business.
Why not just say, "I need to force my moral beliefs on other individuals, because people are too stupid to decide to be moral!" Because you're essentially saying that, anyways.
>That's why minimum wage EXISTS.
And that's why people hire illegals for under the minimum wage.
>>54251123
>Yeah. With full consent from all parties involved.
I have two objections to this, from different schools of philosophy.
Analytical:
It is trivially obvious to anyone that there exist situations where choice is ultimately rendered meaningless, where it is a non-choice (you can have the horse near the door or none at all), where the consequences of the choices are meaningless, etc.
For example, a person has a job with miserable working conditions. He has a choice of quitting and just going to a different job? Not so! He can not afford the risk, the downtime without pay, the other employer will just match his previous working conditions, etc.
Continental:
Coca-Cola has death squads on payroll in Columbia to subjugate worker uprisings.
> I am, however, a realist
You support fucking Trump.
> am totally fine without having universal healthcare, a raised minimum wage, or welfare of any sort.
>And, considering I've actually gone homeless before, I think it's safe to say that I live by my principles.
Oh, look, a temporarily embarrassed millionaire. Is there a word for egoism so absorbing and misguided that you accidentally become altruistic and harm yourself in the process.
You may be fine. But millions (!) are not. And your beliefs only help the ultra-rich.
>>54251193
Except I'm not earning six figures, so I won't be paying for it at all.
>>54251114
>doctors can legally fine patients for wasting the systems time if patients come in simply to beg for Oxycontin, or if they come in because they have the sniffles.
That's fucking retarded. People should not avoid going to the doctor. Not ever.
>>54251167
Ah, but the people you voted for did. These people aren't doing anything illegal; if they were they would be in jail.
It's pretty simple if you want to fix it. Put a sales tax on all items, including imports, and that's the only tax. If you spend the money on things other than labor, it gets taxed. Can't escape that tax.
>>54251165
>Quebec
No wonder. Quebec and all non major cities are trash.
>>54250036
I mean i dislike a lot of bernies policies, especially with illegals being able to vote, but i agree with him on net neutrality.
Why do people only vote for the big three? I wish the government was run by a lot of people from different parties instead of a lot of people from 2 parties. It would be nice
>>54251211
Go and ask a doctor what their opinion is of patients who aren't sick at all coming in asking for pain pills is. Hypochondriacs who go to the doctor when they have a cold, and drug addicts begging for pills are a blight on socialized medical systems and they waste everyone's time and money. There is no way to defend people like that.
>>54251202
>For example, a person has a job with miserable working conditions. He has a choice of quitting and just going to a different job? Not so! He can not afford the risk, the downtime without pay, the other employer will just match his previous working conditions, etc.
Except that he can apply and interview in his off time. He's not a slave, and it isn't his boss's problem that he's unhappy. He agreed to take the job, rather than continue to look for other jobs. The agreement was made without coercion from anyone or anything but reality.
>Coca-Cola has death squads on payroll in Columbia to subjugate worker uprisings.
Indeed. No uprisings. But they are more than welcome to not show up to work, and seek employment elsewhere.
>Oh, look, a temporarily embarrassed millionaire
Nope. Not even close. I don't even have a thousand in savings/checking.
>Is there a word for egoism so absorbing and misguided that you accidentally become altruistic and harm yourself in the process.
Yeah, it's called pathological altruism. A surprising amount of leftists fall into this category. They are coming to be called the regressive left.
Here's an article: http://www.wsj.com/articles/SB10001424127887324688404578545523824389986
>>54251218
Oh, so, if I'm REALLY lucky, and don't live in a big city, I can get wait times of "only" 6 hours? Where the fuck do I sign up?
>>54251139
Duh. People don't understand terrorism. They think it's Icky Brown People declaring a war on Jesus. Not so. Shia / Sunni is much more severe a conflict than middle east vs. the west. The warlords /want/ the west to wage war because it destabilizes the region and allows them to rule more effeciently, not to mention radicalizing the Islamist population.
>>54251215
>Ah, but the people you voted for did.
It's a really damn great thing people who voted for are listening to my opinion, as opposed to the opinions of companies that lobby them to write laws that suit them.
It would be a damn sad thing if we, say, reduced the taxes on the rich to a historical low. Or deregulated the Wall Street. But no one did that, right? So the rich are starving. Damn.
>>54251252
Funny you say that, I have a number of doctors on my friendlist, and they tend to be people high in empathy. But actually it will go like this:
>Are you annoyed by hypochondriacs?
Yes
>Do you think doctors should judge whether the illness didn't matter, and should the patients be afraid of getting fined by this?
Jesus fuck no never
One of the biggest issues with non-socialized healthcare is that people avoid going to the doctor until it's too late. This will only exacerbate the issue.
>>54251260
If you live in a big city you get good wait times, if you live in bumfuck no where there are no doctors. No one in their right mind wants to live in such places, doctors included. Simple concept. I highly doubt that the few precious hours you must wait, for the few times you visit a doctor in a year are worth more than the $1000+ dollars you'd pay in medical insurance. Your time isn't that valuable.
>>54251253
>I don't even have a thousand saved
>giving economic advice
>if you don't like where you work, work somewhere else
>because muh invisible hand in the job market is responsible for the development of the American middle class
The word you're looking for is labor unions...
>>54251286
Its blindingly obvious to everyone except Americans, who are told that terrorists are irrational mudslimes who hate our "freedom."
>>54251286
>It's a really damn great thing people who voted for are listening to my opinion, as opposed to the opinions of companies that lobby them to write laws that suit them.
Oh, yeah, and a career politician who never worked a day in his life in the private sector and sponsored like 4 bills over 30+ years would know how to right all the wrongs, eh?
>It would be a damn sad thing if we, say, reduced the taxes on the rich to a historical low. Or deregulated the Wall Street. But no one did that, right? So the rich are starving. Damn.
This is where your age begins to show.
We deregulated Wall St, and people started spending money. A LOT of money. It was during the Reagan years where I was first allowed my very own can of Pepsi, and didn't have to share with my sister, despite my father being an engineer and my mother being a dental hygienist.
What caused the shift was allowing China to enter the FTA, which caused production to ship overseas, laying off more and more people, but the people that remained employed enjoyed cheap shit. 1 production job creates 6 service jobs. Funny how your failed candidate never spoke about that, only about "getting those darned rich, who got rich by people engaging in voluntary commerce with them!"
>>54251301
Well, then, you USED to be able to get catastrophic insurance. You spent about 20 bucks per month (roughly the same as renters insurance), and you were on your own unless something really big happened to you. Then you would have a few thousand dollar bill, and the insurer would pick up the rest.
Free market already had a solution for people like that. Obamacare outlawed it unless you are dirt poor and below a certain age.
>>54251193
Free without quotes. Free. Don't be a libertarian.
You can shove your "haha it's not free you pay with taxes" piece of shit gotcha. Free means no additional incurred cost following acquirement. It's free like firemen extinguishing a fire in your house are free.
>>54251253
>Except that he can apply and interview in his off time.
What off time?
>He's not a slave
Yeah, he is not a slave because he can choose another slavemaster!
>and it isn't his boss's problem that he's unhappy.
Are you an idiot? The boss controls his working conditions.
>He agreed to take the job, rather than continue to look for other jobs.
That's a non-choice of horse.
>The agreement was made without coercion from anyone or anything but reality.
And if (when!) we force businesses to conduct their business ethically, force them BY LAW, under threat of severe fines or jail time or closure, then it, too, will be reality.
>But they are more than welcome to not show up to work, and seek employment elsewhere.
I don't think you understand what "death squad" means and implies.
>Nope. Not even close. I don't even have a thousand in savings/checking.
You're not familiar with the phrase? It means the poor / working class who see themselves as the future rich, and thus vote and act out of interest of their future-rich-selves, for example, voting for candidates that will gut the poor to help the rich.
>Yeah, it's called pathological altruism.
Pathological altruism is an extension of altruism, what you have is an extension of egoism: you seek to help the rich to your own detriment, but you do it purely out of egoistic tendencies.
>They are coming to be called the regressive left.
Oh, shut the fuck up with that meme. A Trump supporter calling anyone regressive is the height of irony.
>>54251320
So your position is that we should be a nation of very rich and very poor?
>>54250617
It does
If a carrier offers "free streaming" for certain services that means they don't treat all bits equally, since they single out the ones coming from whatever streaming service
>>54251377
That would be Bernie's America
>>54251320
>Oh, yeah, and a career politician who never worked a day in his life in the private sector and sponsored like 4 bills over 30+ years would know how to right all the wrongs, eh?
As opposed to a Republican candidate, who is a FUCKING REPUBLICAN CANDIDATE
>This is where your age begins to show.
The intellectual age, you mean? It exceeds yours, twelve-year-old Trump supporter, by decades.
>>54251320
>Funny how your failed candidate never spoke about that
About what? You wrote a whole bunch of incoherent babble and anecdotes.
>who got rich by people engaging in voluntary commerce with them
Who got rich by fucking the poor. Please stop spreading lies about this absolute fact.
My favorite lies are that the rich work the hardest and that they become rich using vertical mobility.
>>54250334
It's going to be so satisfying when trump asks why Hillary isn't in jail on national television.
>>54251396
That's the path we are currently headed for. Wealth inequality, to say nothing of income inequality, is at the highest rate since right before the Great Depression. Surely dismantling unions, lowering tax rates on the wealthy, and erasing campaign contribution limits had something to do with the current state.
>>54251338
>Free market already had a solution for people like that.
Bullshit it did. Socialized medicine has a solution for people like that.
A humongous amount of people got fucked before Obamacare.
>>54251396
>That would be Bernie's America
And the source of this assumption?
>>54251423
Hillary will get shredded by Trump if they both make it to the general
>>54251373
>What off time?
Last I checked, nobody works 24 hours per day.
>Yeah, he is not a slave because he can choose another slavemaster!
Or he can start his own business.
>Are you an idiot? The boss controls his working conditions.
And those conditions are safe, with penalties for being unsafe. That is all they are responsible for.
>That's a non-choice of horse.
Like that's the fault of the rich. Yeah, a few millennia ago, a bunch of rich people decided to mess with genetic code, and transform humans from plants that can live off sunlight, to animals that need food and shelter. Don't hate the rich due to reality. Their loyalty is to the bottom line. The only alternative is communism, at which point, welcome to the USSR.
>And if (when!) we force businesses to conduct their business ethically, force them BY LAW, under threat of severe fines or jail time or closure, then it, too, will be reality.
And you will see business continue to flee, and employment plummet. Not to mention, there will be fewer people starting up their own. Stop seeing things only through the eyes of victimhood.
>I don't think you understand what "death squad" means and implies.
It means that if you uprise, and threat violence or try to coerce something from your employer as a group, that they will kill you. They can still leave peacefully, unless you have evidence of slavery.
>You're not familiar with the phrase? It means the poor / working class who see themselves as the future rich, and thus vote and act out of interest of their future-rich-selves, for example, voting for candidates that will gut the poor to help the rich.
Me wanting to be left alone is just me wanting to be left alone. I don't care if I'm rich. I just want to be left the fuck alone. What you and your candidate are proposing is the exact opposite of leaving me alone.
Also, I seek to be left alone. You seek to not leave me alone, because you know better. Which reeks of pathological altruism to you?
>be amerifat
>get shot
>survive
>die because I can't buy food due to the medical bills
feels bad man
>>54250462
confirmed fake
>>54251447
It's going to be wonderful watching that bitches campaign collapse once the normies find out about the top secret email bamboozling.
>>54251426
The Brookings Institute, a left-leaning think tank, did research into this, and made some interesting discoveries. Here they are:
If you don't want to be permanently poor in the United States, you need to do 3 things:
1. Graduate High School
2. No pregnancies until after marriage (abortions still count!)
3. Get employed, and stay employed.
I know that seems like an awful lot for people to handle, but that's what a LEFTIST Think Tank has concluded.
What think tank has told you any differently?
>>54251478
she deserves it if she thinks she can stump the trump
noone can stump the trump
>>54251486
This post is fascinating. Basically a third derivative of reality, an oversimplification of an oversimplification of an oversimplification.
I don't even know where to start in this one.
One of the obvious things is the classic right "research says that in some cases X is correlated with Y, therefore X IS Y", one of the recently often quoted study that indicates low conscientiousness to some extent correlates with poverty, from which people immediately concluded that it is basically its sole cause, if not the exact equivalent, therefore poverty is the state of mind and poor people should just think better and - Boom! - instantly work hard and become rich.
>>54251491
Objective reality is one of the things that can easily stump the Trump, for example.
Or basically every single question that he has ever been asked.
>politicians are corrupts, fuck the government!
>lets vote for Sanders and make the government more powerful and bigger!
>>54251516
I can't even call it a strawman argument. You didn't even build anything. You just came here and said "there was a formidable golem, his body of straw, and I have vanquished him"
>>54251486
Every objective measure of the US economy shows that your view is incorrect. Income inequality, wealth inequality, and social mobility in the US are the lowest amongst industrialized countries. The US where you can pull yourself up by your bootstraps has been a fiction for 30-40 years.
>>54250077
>putting a socialist in higher office will gain more freedom than encouraging market freedom
>this is what leftist scum actually believe
I'll be waiting, waiting for the day that Trump loses. I'll be there laughing and and shitposting wherever I may be. I'll make sure to rub it in your faces everyday that your lord and savior lost.
Mark my words
>>54251562
oh no. not shitposting on 4chan
Mfw Noam Chomsky ITT
>>54251553
What kind of market freedom would even there be re: survelliance?
>>54250036
I prefer McAfee or Gary Johnson.
Sanders probably plan on crushing the economy so the state can't even afford the NSA anymore.
>>54251497
You don't have to take my word for it. It's their conclusion. Go look it up.
Anyways, if you feel like the victor, that's fine. I'm tired of debating this. Not really /g/ anyways. But I am going to close with this:
Go do a quick search, and look at the percentage of people living below the poverty line by year, keeping in mind which year had welfare begins expanding (I'll help: it was in the 60s).
You may notice something interesting:
The number of people living in poverty was actually SHRINKING. I know, crazy, right? By 1% per year. Like clockwork. Then came welfare, and with it came stagnation for a while, then expansion. Of course, the solution to this is, of course, more welfare, which brought further expansion, leading to (you guessed it) more welfare. Then came deregulation, and that number started shrinking again.
The notion that we are one more box of laws and/or regulations away from a utopia is an absurd one, even from an empirical perspective. Just a cursory look at history shows that these ideas are not natural, and are destructive to society.
Take care of yourself, and the people you care about, without demanding things from strangers. The rest will sort itself out.
>>54251578
It won't just be shitposting, I'll surpass that.
>>54250036
>/g/
>arguing about politics
shiggy diggy
>>54251586
Social mobility, income inequality, and wealth inequality in America are the lowest in the industrialized world. To blame government safety nets for these problems is completely laughable.
>>54251615
Not him, but its pretty damning that it started expanding the very year they expanded welfare past Social Security Retirement.
ITT conservacucks supporting a meme president while unemployed and mooching off government loans for college for their superior political science degrees
>>54251615
Cont.
The "golden age" of America was created by government subsidies for education and housing through the GI bill, as well as strong labor unions.
>>54251586
>You don't have to take my word for it. It's their conclusion. Go look it up.
Convenient how you didn't even post the source.
>The notion that we are one more box of laws and/or regulations away from a utopia is an absurd one, even from an empirical perspective.
The notion that if we don't pass a law that will instantly turn the world into an utopia, we might as well not even try, is fallacious and laughable, and the very idea that your alternative is to vote for a Republican - for TRUMP, even, exposes this.
>Go do a quick search, and look at the percentage of people living below the poverty line by year
Go do a quick search and look at what minimum wage used to be able to buy you.
40 hours of work ~30 years ago produced the amount of product that 11 hours does now. As a result, the rich have become much richer.
The working class works longer hours and gets paid less.
>Take care of yourself, and the people you care about,
I can't do that on my own when we are being robbed blind.
>without demanding things from strangers.
Not even when strangers literally take them from me? Like the rich do?
>>54251582
So you really think that a socialist would be better in the end? And you really think Trump would be all about locking down the internet?
>>54250036
Oh do fuck off.
t. Britainistan
>>54251416
>people from a 1st world country that literally thinks that having the wrong kind of smartphone is considered a poorfag thinks they are poor
Seeing sanders supporters made my day every day.
t. 3rd world shitskins
>>54251615
Lel, income inequality is the sole reason we can shitpost about gfx cards in this board. Take it away, and we'll be as fast as /po/
>>54251642
>The notion that if we don't pass a law that will instantly turn the world into an utopia, we might as well not even try, is fallacious and laughable, and the very idea that your alternative is to vote for a Republican
>He's a republican HE MUST BE EVUL
>arguing fallacy
Go away from /g/. Even the microsoft shills aren't this bad.
>>54251649
>So you really think that a socialist would be better in the end?
Social democrat.
I find it hilarious that Americans use "socialist" as an insult, though.
>And you really think Trump would be all about locking down the internet?
Does anyone have any fucking clue what Trump would be all about? His views are in constant flux.
But yes, of course yes. Absolutely 100% about it. That doesn't surprise me.
What surprises me more is that he said "freedom of speech lel whatevz". It's not new for the right wing to advocate for "freedom of speech" and in the same breath deny it to anyone who disagrees with them. I expected him to take that road.
>>54251642
>Go do a quick search and look at what minimum wage used to be able to buy you.
It used to be years for a computer.
Now, less than a week or even a day.
>lelel its because of TECHNOLOGICAL ADVANCEMENT
Yes, and you certainly paid for that using RISKS and INVESTMENT you made by flipping burgers.
>>54251658
>Lel, income inequality is the sole reason we can shitpost about gfx cards in this board. Take it away, and we'll be as fast as /po/
More true than you know. Gross World Product was ~105 trillion in 2014, according to wikipedia.
Dividing that out by the current population estimate (~7.4 billion as of March 2016, according to wikipedia), that is a yearly income of $14,189 per person, which would boil down to about $6.82/hr.
Oh, and before anyone says they aren't talking about a world wide program to redistribute wealth, why are you worth more than Africa? Because "the super rich" choose to live here? Please. If you're gonna hold those principles, then at least apply them evenly.
>>54251688
>I find it hilarious that Americans use "socialist" as an insult, though
I know history is never an important thing for millenials libtards, but a lot of things happen in the last century. Most are related to socialism and communism
>>54251679
>>He's a republican HE MUST BE EVUL
This is an excellent statement, actually.
He is a republican so he MUST be evil. There are no alternatives to this. Go and look up Trump's earlier views, stereotypical NYC liberal.
But here he is, running as President, and suddenly we need to murder innocent people because they are "terrorists' families" and red cups are a war on Christianity and Planned Parenthood is bad. He's a Republican, so he MUST be evil to have a chance in running at all.
Also, the Republican is the party of "fuck the poor lmao". You don't vote for the wealth inequality party to solve wealth inequality.
>>54250036
Eat shit and die in a fire, commie.
>>54250600
>How would there be a wall in China
Good point, anon. IMPOSSIBRUUUUU
>>54251688
>Does anyone have any fucking clue what Trump would be all about?
- ditch Common Core
- protectionism
- security
- border control
- enforcing immigration law
- better relations with Russia and other countries pointlessly excluded
- exterminate Islamic State, though the emphasis is on non-interventionism overall
- pursuing a cultural boom
- other things
- freedom!
>in the same breath deny it to anyone who disagrees with them
What are you talking about?
>>54251712
Have you considered that you might be being a bit shrill and hyperbolic?
>>54251696
>It used to be years for a computer. Now, less than a week or even a day.
That's because the tech itself rapidly became cheaper, idiot.
People used to work minimum wage and support an entire family.
>RISKS and INVESTMENT you made by flipping burgers.
Flipping burgers qualifies you as working class, I think. And the working class faces an enormous risk.
>>54251728
>Good Penis, Anal.
>IMPOZFORUUUUU
m8 you literally made a quote and then changed the words what's the point
>>54251712
>murder innocent people because they are "terrorists' families
Don't encourage your husband or son to join ISIS then.
>>54251712
>fallacy is fine if I do it
Please go back to trolling /pol/.
>we need to murder innocent people because they are "terrorists' families"
No fuck you. I'm a muslim in muslim majority nation here.
And Trump is doing us a lot of favor by denouncing and acknowledging radical islamists.
We're not your pet so that you can feel good if you help/be kind to us.
As long as you don't let Islam makes mistakes and criticizes it, the Imams in most of our mosques would be continuing on what I believe is very dangerous indoctrination to our young minds.
If Trump made it economically unviable to become a muslim, the Imams in Islam wouldn't be able to do as they like.
So fuck you.
>solve wealth inequality.
You don't deserve to live in a 1st world country
Start building that wall.
Stick one on the northern border too.
>>54251712
>People who just want to be left alone and decide if and how their money is spent are evil!
Listen, when a complete stranger comes up and DEMANDS a percentage of your earnings every week, you aren't being cold and cruel for refusing; they are being pushy and totalitarian for refusing to take no for an answer.
Due to your pathological altruism, you have this unearned sense of moral superiority. But it doesn't change what you are, and that's a bully.
Go fuck yourself.
>>54251743
Well said. Islam evidently can't reform from within because the resistance to innovation is too strong. The longer it goes unchallenged from outside, the longer it will continue to churn out Salafi shitheads who just fuck everything up.
>>54251710
Are you trying to restore some sort of McCart-
>millenials libtards
Oh, you're one of /these/ people.
>>54251730
>pursuing a cultural boom
As vague as "Making America great again".
>freedom!
False obv.
>security
And conflicts with this.
>exterminate Islamic State, though the emphasis is on non-interventionism overall
Does not compute, and he doesn't want to exterminate IS, he wants to kill brown stinky people. Considering where kicking the hornet nest brought us, that isn't an effective strategy.
>>54251736
Tech became cheaper because the rich had a demand for shit that was expensive, which created the demand to ramp up production, which made shit cheaper, you dolt.
>People used to work minimum wage and support an entire family.
Burden of proof is on you. Could you support a family on 10.86/hr? Because that's where it peaked relative to today's value.
>>54251736
>That's because the tech itself rapidly became cheaper, idiot.
That's the point. It didn't become cheaper by itself.
Guess who had to take the first step so that you can easily buy a phone with less than $50 now.
>working class faces an enormous risk
>financial security is now ENORMOUS risk
I'm not denying that it doesn't have risks.
But it's nowhere near the risk and investment entreprenurs have to take when they build a business.
>>54251097
>wall of text about how Bernie is going to steal your entire paycheck and other garbage
>doesn't understand Trump uses legal foreigners on temporary visas in his hotels and such and pays them next to nothing. he uses outsourcing extensively. he purchases and makes his own products in China and other shithole sweatshops.
>but he's going to get rid of Pablo!
Kill yourself retard.
>>54251736
>People used to work minimum wage and support an entire family.
Then you should be able to support a family on $22,589 per year (before taxes).
>>54251773
I'm not him, but did you read that post? I don't think you did.
>>54251770
>As vague as "Making America great again".
In practice it would be identifying problems where they exist, and calling them out and abolishing legislation where it creates those problems. Also obviously bringing industry back to the US and putting the working & middle classes on stable footing would put in place the foundations for a cultural boom.
>False obv.
Pardon?
>And conflicts with this.
Partially cocooning yourself from the outside world doesn't conflict with freedom for Americans.
>and he doesn't want to exterminate IS
What?
>wants to kill brown stinky people
What?
>kicking the hornet nest
What?
>that isn't an effective strategy.
"If you kill your enemies, they win."
>>54251762
>americans claiming someone is fucking shit up
You realize your government has be the largest destabilizing force in the world for the last 50 years. You're the assholes who destroyed South America, armed: Saddam, Saudis, ISIS, Al Qaeda, Mujahadeen, the Shah, and virtually every other blood thirsty dictator in the region.
>>54251788
The minimum income rate isn't pegged to any index, which is why you can't raise a family on a minimum wage anymore. A full time employee making minimum wage only makes 14k a year anyway, not 22k.
>>54251770
>that isn't an effective strategy
Just do nothing, yeah. Just let ISIS steadily genocide the entire Levant and eventually invade Turkey, then the Caucasus and Europe. An excellent plan.
>>54251803
>americans claiming
I'm English.
Why do you keep making excuses for Salafism?
>>54251803
>The minimum income rate isn't pegged to any index.
This never gets old. You show no evidence to the claim that a single person could raise a family on minimum wage, and when actual statistics and calculations are brought in, you balk and mutter on about shit.
Here's my evidence: http://money.cnn.com/interactive/economy/minimum-wage-since-1938/
>>54251738
I have talked about this higher in the thread.
The "families" he is talking about are women that they abduct to rape.
>Don't encourage your husband or son to join ISIS then.
Even if it were true, who actually joined ISIS?
Avoiding harming innocents is the basis of all just war and is in the fucking Geneva convention I think.
>>54251743
It's not a fallacy. I interpret the sentence differently, from "he is a republican therefore he is evil" to "running as a republican means you have to pander to evil people".
Also see the families bit above.
>>54251749
>Listen, when a complete stranger comes up and DEMANDS a percentage of your earnings every week
You mean... like a worker? That you pay shit fucking nothing and deny vacations or medical leave?
Stop claiming that rich people just produce money out of nowhere.
>Due to your pathological altruism
Says the poor guy who votes for the poor to become poorer.
>But it doesn't change what you are, and that's a bully.
False. I have high empathy.
>>54251736
>people used to work minimum wage and support an entire family
They also don't use as much shit as people now deemed as NECESSITY like internet, LATEST smartphones, etc.
It's always mesmerizing for me when 1st world people think their $7/hour aren't enough.
When me and my friends have to work 4 hours of minimum wage to buy ourselves a McD cheese burger (for comparison).
And yes, if you earn minimum wage (bottom feeder) then by definition you can't expect to live like middle class.
Also, the reason why US families can support themselves while working minimum wage is because they used to be great.
Not so much now.
>>54251688
Making a further distinction about what kind of socialist he is does not mean he is not a socialist.
I'm not using it as an insult. I do not like a lot of what socialist platforms put forth, and I make no bones about that. I do insult people for making idiotic arguments in support of political ideals, many times even if I agree with the political ideals. Perhaps that is a character flaw on my part, perhaps it is a virtue.
So you make the argument that you have no idea what Trump is about and that you know exactly what he is about all in one breath? That's a new level of stupid.
>>54251815
But you don't understand you're not supposed to be able to raise a family on minimum wage!
>>54251817
>Even if it were true, who actually joined ISIS?
Lots of Westerners are sympathetic to ISIS. Mostly from the countries that Bernie wants to emulate. Canada ("If you kill your enemies, they win"), Germany (with its insane spike in rape), Sweden (rape capital of the west), Britain (just google "Rotherham Child Rape Gangs"). Did I forget anyone? Oh yeah, France, with it's 1 in 6 ISIS approval ratings (and more than 1 in 4 in younger age groups).
>>54251807
There exist more than two solutions to a problem.
>Just let ISIS steadily genocide the entire Levant
Don't paint yourself as empathetic, the reds paint the situation as "stinky browns vs. the West" and thus assume genocide of Levant to be a GOOD thing.
>>54251800
>In practice it would be identifying problems where they exist
How is he going to observe objective reality in a country where the Republican Washington decided that global warming isn't real?
>Also obviously bringing industry back to the US
Which is one of the things he is absolutely not doing, period, and it is not compatible with libertarianism anyway.
>putting the working & middle classes on stable footing
One sentence disproof: he's running as a Republican.
>"If you kill your enemies, they win."
Yeah, just kill the IS. Brilliant.
Go back to /lgbt/
>>54251812
There is no excuse for Salafism. But you shouldn't pretend that the west is doing anything other than creating the instability necessary for the Saladists to exist.
There are dozens of examples. The most recent being daesh.
http://www.washingtonsblog.com/2015/05/newly-declassified-u-s-government-documents-the-west-supported-the-creation-of-isis.html
>>54251817
>You mean... like a worker? That you pay shit fucking nothing and deny vacations or medical leave?
No, I mean a stranger. A worker would be an employee. And an employee is entitled to be paid the wage that the employee agreed to upon being hired.
>>54251841
If you look at the actual facts, you'll see that daesh was funded and armed by the CIA from 2011-2014 to undermine the Assad regime. This follows a similar trajectory as Al Qaeda.
>>54251817
>The "families" he is talking about are women that they abduct to rape.
What in fuck's name are you on about? When has Trump said "let's target the women they enslave"?
>Avoiding harming innocents [sic] is the basis of all just war and is in the fucking Geneva convention I think.
IS does not adhere to the Geneva convention. A gentlemen's agreement cannot work if only one side adheres to it -- you end up fighting with one hand tied behind your back. But this is irrelevant since the entire premise of "harming innocents" is based on yet another intentional misquoting of Trump.
>>54251817
>Says the poor guy who votes for the poor to become poorer.
Is that what protectionism yields?
>I have high empathy.
Aye, which is why you must virtue-signal so much.
>>54251860
I'm aware. What's your point? That we should scale back military involvement in the world, and cut back on taxation so that the government can't afford to pull shit like this?
Good, we are in agreement. Cut welfare (including both local and foreign aide), and reduce the military to self-defense, with only the navy leaving our shores. Sounds good to me!
Too bad that has absolutely nothing to do with the subject of "Who supports ISIS?" We don't support them, although we may have financially backed them in the past.
>>54251817
>not a fallacy
>running as a republican means you have to pander to evil people
False premise.
>evil
Evil is subjective. But sure that's fine, I don't think we need to get into there.
>Also see the families bit above
As long as it is a form of criticization it would be a good thing in the long run.
Christianity wasn't as tolerant as they are now.
It now can allow gays and other acknowledging other form of religion because it went under criticism.
What you're basically doing now is preventing us to do the same to our religions.
PS: Everyone here hates the west in some form or another not because they bomb people they don't know.
They hate you guys because of your moral superiority which is
>False. I have high empathy.
Helping people is irresponsible, regardless if its for your conscience or not.
>>54251824
>They also don't use as much shit as people now deemed as NECESSITY
But things we take for granted were significantly more expensive, like TVs and such. Yet people could afford them,
Or the whole housing situation.
>like internet,
Are you implying that people are poor because they can't afford the internet?
The internet is very cheap (the US is a clear outlier) and is as basic a fact of life as a telephone line used to be.
> LATEST smartphones, etc.
I'm reading Mussolini's Television now, and it has a mention of the genre of movies called "white telephone". Basically, they focused on the lives of upper-middle / high class, and everyone had white rotary telephone sets.
Whereas most of the country had black telephones, if they even could afford a telephone at all.
>And yes, if you earn minimum wage (bottom feeder) then by definition you can't expect to live like middle class.
So your objection is that minimum wage earners don't suffer enough or something?
>Not so much now.
Because of the homos, right?
>>54251827
>So you make the argument that you have no idea what Trump is about and that you know exactly what he is about all in one breath? That's a new level of stupid.
...Not really. He is about this constant flux and memetical pandering. I'm saying that he is for locking down the internet because he said he is for locking down the internet.
Therefore, when time comes from patriot act 2.0, he will be 100% for it.
>>54251817
>Stop claiming that rich people just produce money out of nowhere.
They produce money by finding needs/wants and fulfilling them. Workers do the same, as the "rich" need people to fulfill the products/services that people want. Both parties meet and agree to terms under which each will benefit the other. And, believe it or not, the worker gets paid each and every day, even if the company has a bad month or a bad quarter, or even a bad year. The workers continue getting paid so long as they continue providing services/products that the consumers want, and even when the consumers don't want them.
The "rich" has no promised amount that he is going to earn, and if the business hits rough times, the "rich" does not ask the worker for money, or to work without pay.
This is the benefit to working for someone, and, if you don't like it, you are perfectly able to go and start your own business, and incur those risks yourselves.
>>54251845
>Don't paint yourself as empathetic
"Ugh that's just problematic, only WE are allowed to care about genocide. Except the current genocide of Christians in the middle-east, who cares about that? They get what they deserve."
>the reds paint the situation as "stinky browns vs. the West"
What.
>assume genocide of Levant to be a GOOD thing
Again, what. This is quite an odd thing to claim.
>>54251847
Absolutely. And the Obama regime's arming of """""""""moderate rebels"""""""" in Syria is one such act of unforgivable destabilization tactics. Ultimately, however, people are responsible for their own actions. You can't mince around saying "oh but the US did a bad thing X years ago!!! we shouldn't do anything!!! we're just as bad!!!" when faced with an evil like ISIS spreading like a cancer.
>>54251887
The Saudis, Jordanians, and UAE are currently the main financiers of daesh. Guess who their ally is? The Saudis are currently waging a war in Yemen using our munitions against Al Qaeda's enemy. Guess who happens when the Houthi are gone?
What has happened in Libya after we left? Either the US is a bumbling fool or these were deliberate acts to create an adversary after the demise of Al Qaeda.
>>54251865
>What in fuck's name are you on about? When has Trump said "let's target the women they enslave"?
He said we need to go after terrorists' families. Terrorists' families are women they enslave and rape. Ergo,
>IS does not adhere to the Geneva convention.
That's not surprising, given that they are not a government that signed it.
>A gentlemen's agreement cannot work if only one side adheres to it
Honest question. Do you think the convention is "all of these things are banned, unless one of the sides in the conflict breaks one of them, in which case it's a free for all lol"?
>>54251925
So he is about this flux and pandering, but his statements about the internet are obviously neither subject to flux nor a matter of pandering? How have you come to this conclusion?
>>54251925
>said he is for locking down the internet
Again you twist his words. He said he wants the accounts of jihadi groups deleted (Twitter and Facebook are notorious for leaving such accounts unmolested while regulating the speech on normal people's accounts with an iron fist), and their websites shut down. That is clear-cut. Try to paint this as a Great Firewall scenario all you want, but it's bullshit; he just has no interest in it.
>>54251911
>But things we take for granted were significantly more expensive, like TVs and such. Yet people could afford them,
When TVs are widespread, it was never expensive. Even 3rd world nations like us had TV in most families.
>Are you implying that people are poor because they can't afford the internet?
No I'm implying that internet was not, should have not been considered as necessity.
>Whereas most of the country had black telephones, if they even could afford a telephone at all.
What's your point? why bring race into the conversation?
>So your objection is that minimum wage earners don't suffer enough or something?
>living in the USA
>suffering
Actually yes, if you don't allow people to make mistakes and suffer for their mistakes, you'll end up like the black community in the USA.
The welfare state has accomplished a feat to the black community that even slavery can't achieve.
It breaks down the black families.
>Because of the homos, right?
No, because NAFTA.
>>54251951
I'm not sure how the plan I laid out in the post you responded to doesn't effect them negatively. What, we need oil? No, we have Alaska, as well as the Bakken Oil Field. We also have offshore drilling.
Besides, oil is on its way out, and would be all but eliminated if not for liberals screaming against nuclear power (4th gen plants actually run off the waste of the first 3 gens, meaning that we could actually ELIMINATE nuclear waste, make electric cars return their investment quicker, as well as severely cutting down on pollution until fission power becomes available in 3 decades or so)
>>54251909
>False premise.
Show me how.
>Evil is subjective.
Not in my philosophy. I'm a consequentialist.
If something was done to increase suffering, it was an evil deed.
>As long as it is a form of criticization it would be a good thing in the long run.
How on fucking earth?
>>54251970
>No I'm implying that internet was not, should have not been considered as necessity.
I'm all for giving everyone dial up speeds. You'll never use it for entertainment, but you can still apply for jobs online. Then again, libraries. So whatever.
>>54251959
>Terrorists' families are women they enslave and rape.
Again, what are you talking about?
>That's not surprising, given that they are not a government that signed it.
That's fine then.
>Do you think the convention is...
No it's fine you see. As you astutely observed above, the Geneva convention applies to signatory states when at war, not to mopping up jihadi groups who aren't even recognized as states.
>>54251966
>and their websites shut down.
If you give an entity the capability to just randomly shut down websites, the first thing they will do is shut down the websites of all dissenters.
It would definitely be a part of patriot 2.0.
>>54251981
>If something was done to increase suffering, it was an evil deed.
Ok. Well, working on the oil field is suffering. Use plastic bags? Drive a car? Use electricity that requires a turbine?
Congratulations, by your own logic, you're evil.
>>54251386
Net neutrality generally refers to the flow of traffic, so it doesn't.
>>54251981
>If something was done to increase suffering, it was an evil deed.
So, what can we take away from this? Turn the other cheek in every circumstance?
>>54252002
>If you give an entity the capability to just randomly shut down websites
The US government already has the capability.
>the first thing they will do is shut down the websites of all dissenters
Yeah man Trump is a fascist he's gonna round all us empathetic and nice people up into death camps. We have to wipe out his supporters before fascism takes hold in this nation!
>>54251976
Oil is still necessary for the next 50 years. In any case, US policy towards South America over the last 60 years proves that simply projecting power is enough motivation for the US to act imperialistically.
>>54250036
Bernie Sandinista is a communist with a voice that sounds like a cartoon chatacter.
Can't stump the Trump.
>>54251932
Okay, that is enough faking ignorance, I expect you to apologize.
>What
Liar, Trump supporter, liar, answer me this: who is the IS's enemy?
>Again, what. This is quite an odd thing to claim.
And yet an absolute fact.
>>54251981
>If something was done to increase suffering, it was an evil deed.
Your demand for food increases the price of food, causing someone to have to either work harder, or go without. Both qualify as suffering.
Use of welfare increases the amount of time individuals have to spend at work in order to live comfortably. Any for welfare is evil. Anyone for an increase of welfare is evil, and anyone who uses welfare is evil.
>>54251981
>Show me how
The mere act of running doesn't necessitate campaigning.
There.
Also, as you implied, proof
>if you running and campaigning as republican, then people you had to pander are people that are evil
Also provide an argument as to why pandering a dislike-able person would invalidate someone's presidency.
>How on fucking earth?
Have you raised a child?
>>54252010
>Net neutrality (also network neutrality, Internet neutrality, or net equality) is the principle that Internet service providers and governments should treat all data on the Internet the same, not discriminating or charging differentially by user, content, site, platform, application, type of attached equipment, or mode of communication.
>not discriminating or charging differentially by content
>>54252017
>Oil is still necessary for the next 50 years.
And we have enough of our own to last us that long. Alaska is widely untapped, and the Bakken is severely restricting their output, because they would be losing money otherwise.
>>54252022
>I expect you to apologize
Fuck off cunt. Your opinion re: the present genocide of middle-eastern Christians? Also, how would you stop Islamic State and the dozens of other nearly identical groups operating in Syria and Iraq? Are you even interested in stopping it at all?
>who is the IS's enemy
Apostates, disbelievers, munafiqun, innovators, idolators, polytheists.
>>54251845
>One sentence disproof: he's running as a Republican.
Just stop. This is embarrassing.
>>54251970
>When TVs are widespread, it was never expensive.
Self-defeating point, TVs are obviously only widespread when everyone can afford them.
>No I'm implying that internet was not, should have not been considered as necessity.
Inane. There's nothing special about the internet, it's just another way of communication, just like post, telegraph, radio, telephone, television.
>What's your point? why bring race into the conversation?
What race? Literally telephones that are black.
>Actually yes, if you don't allow people to make mistakes and suffer for their mistakes, you'll end up like the black community in the USA.
Where the shit you keep getting this from confuses me, given that it is the exact opposite of the scientific consensus, which is that poor people have shit social mobility but rich people have safety nets.
>It breaks down the black families.
Yep! That's the issue black families have. Too many safety nets.
>>54252042
Instability also creates a convenient enemy to galvanize the population against in the absence of the USSR. It also creates a demand for US munitions. There is no downside. When a terrorist hits us, we use it as a pretext to get more involved in the region.
The US would be acting completely different if their intent were to stabilize the region and rid it out extremism.
>>54252037
>Also provide an argument as to why pandering a dislike-able person would invalidate someone's presidency.
...Because they must defend the interests of evil people to have support.
People are offended about Trump-Hitler comparisons, but which supporters are basically Hitler Youth?
>>54252061
>Where the shit you keep getting this from confuses me
Poverty was rapidly shrinking in the 50's before feminism and welfare took root. Families are essential to teaching responsibility. We now have a very large percentage of a single race that has the most Affirmative Action (and has had it for decades), yet young black women sleep with young black men without protection leading to high rates of diseases and pregnancy, which leads to women who need health care for their STD's, medicaid and food stamps for their children, and a culture that values Air Jordans more than a job.
The black family unit is all but completely dead due to thinking that they were so stupid and irresponsible that they needed preferential treatment and a safety net. Before that, they were helping themselves up at an astonishing rate.
>>54252083
>but which supporters are basically Hitler Youth
Quoth the Brownshirt.
>>54252055
>Your opinion re: the present genocide of middle-eastern Christians
Genocide is bad.
That is obvious to me, since I'm not a libertarian.
>Also, how would you stop Islamic State and the dozens of other nearly identical groups operating in Syria and Iraq
Asking people whose interests are to destabilize the region even more (such as Trump) and doing the exact opposite.
Right now I think that NOT KILLING INNOCENTS is a good plan
>>54252067
You need to stop excusing and rationalizing what you say you are against. There's always a reason to go to war, but wars are always bad.
Pick a side and stick with it.
>>54252038
It's referring to the service as a public utility, as in the discrimination shouldn't happen during the transmission.
There is plenty of legal wiggle room to have both net neutrality and unmetered content in a legal system. This is clearly evidenced by the fact that different call rates and flagfalls apply across telephone carriers, who have had the same kind of rules applied to them for decades.
>>54252107
>Right now I think that NOT KILLING INNOCENTS is a good plan
That's alright then since the plan is to not kill innocents, as explained above.
>destabilize the region even more (such as Trump)
What? Is this another "if you kill your enemies, they win" thing?
All you're really suggesting is that we allow ISIS to spread unimpeded.
>>54252105
>Poverty was rapidly shrinking in the 50's before feminism and welfare took root.
Are you unironically claiming that people are poor because feminism and welfare took away all their money?
>The black family unit is all but completely dead due to thinking that they were so stupid and irresponsible that they needed preferential treatment and a safety net. Before that, they were helping themselves up at an astonishing rate.
I am expecting you to provide sources. Zero of them must be right-wing sources or associated with any right-wing think tank.
>>54251706
I would live with guaranteed $14k in my bank every year assuming ive had reasonable work hours. Im willing to go as low as $10k if it means better infrastructure and healthcare.
>>54252145
black wall street
>>54252122
No the telephone analogy is false.
An equivalent would be that a phone sex company could pay AT&T (or whoever) to not charge (or perhaps to make the connection worse for other companies) for calls to their company.
>>54252145
>Are you unironically claiming that people are poor because feminism and welfare took away all their money?
No. I'm unironically claiming that people are poor because feminism and welfare took away all their responsibility to themselves and their children.
>>54252138
>That's alright then since the plan is to not kill innocents
Yet Trump advocates killing innocents.
>Is this another "if you kill your enemies, they win" thing?
You can't "kill your enemies" with anything except basking the continent in nuclear fire, which most of the Republican party would be happy to see, but that will not happen.
What happens is that you destablize the region by kicking the hornet nest
