>You should use vim. It's not bloated like an IDE and will have you focus on the code instead of fancy GUIs
Is vim literally the internet explorer of text editors?
>>54036001
>Is vim literally the internet explorer of text editors?
No, that would be emacs.
Considering how my vim installation is 2.5 MB (statically linked), I would have to say no.
>>54036001
>Is vim literally the internet explorer of text editors?
Yes, because it's a piece of shit that nobody uses.
>>54036036
Yes, but without 2 GB of plugins and 200MB of working memory per tab vim is pretty much useless, unless your idea of development is editing xorg.conf. That was the point if the comparison.
>>54036083
>2GB of plugins
My .vimrc is 200 lines long, and as for your claim about tab memory you obviously don't know how vim buffers work.
>>54036049
What are you talking about? There are vim shills in pretty much every single thread on this board.
>>54036106
So you have no plugins? You do realize that even with a plugin manager, these plugins take up space on your harddrive?
>>54036148
>So you have no plugins?
No, just the default installed color themes which are like 100 or so lines each and the default syntax files (which are like 80 lines each) and some random hacks in my .vimrc file.
>You do realize that even with a plugin manager, these plugins take up space on your harddrive?
I don't use any plugin manager. I use a barebone vim.
For autocompletion, I use ctags and cscope which are like three lines in my .vimrc. The ctags db file, however is of course freaking huge (at least for the kernel), but that's not directly related to vim.
>>54036148
vim plugins are just vimscripts or python scripts (i.e textfiles) downloading every single vim plugin ever made probably wouldn't amount to more than a few dozen MB.
>using VIM
>21th century
if your program is too large to edit with vi, it is too complex for you, and you should feel bad.
'muh ide' is for mental cripples that can't write proper functions
>>54036001
>internet explorer
More like lynx.
ITT: OP got rekt
>>54036197
Right, so basically you're a hobbyist.
>>54036213
>Knowing this little about what one is talking about
For example the you-complete-me plugin which is the only hope vim users have of having working semantic completion (a necessary feature for any serious project and absolutely vital for professional developers) requires more than 50MB per session, plus much more for the buggy and completely insecure http server. Yeah, that is totally compensated by the 5 seconds you spend each day to reach the mouse in visual studio.
>>54036233
Lol okay, well keep editing your dotfiles and leave the real development to real developers
>>54036259
Yeah except there aren't as many toolbars for lynx so I thought IE was a better comparison
>>54036608
>semantic completion (a necessary feature for any serious project and absolutely vital for professional developers)
I already knew you were trolling but now this is too obvious.
>>54036664
You do realize that pretty much all visual studio developers use this kind of completion, right? Have you ever seen a C++, Obj-C, C# or Java developer using vim? Pretty much all serious development is in these languages.
>>54036263
butthurt vim user detected
>>54036786
>Have you ever seen a C++, Obj-C, C# or Java developer using vim?
Seen plenty of C and C++ developers (working on 100k+ loc projects) using vim.
>>54036608
>semantic completion (a necessary feature for any serious project and absolutely vital for professional developers)
>being this much of a code monkey
>>54036786
>pretty much all people who use a program use a feature available in the program
wow
>C++
Less popular than C by a huge margin
>Java
Java basically requires an IDE because of how much of a fuckfest the language is. It requires enormous amounts of boilerplate because of how poorly designed it is. It's an OOP language that doesn't even have half the OOP features of other languages.
>Obj-C
On the way out thanks to swift, and not even in the top 10 most popular right now anyway.
>>54036001
It's always the same...
OP is too retarded for GNU/Linux = loonix sucks
OP is too retarded for GIMP = GIMP sucks
OP is too retarded for Vim = Vim sucks
... funny actually, that these people always need to create threads about XY sucks, to justify their own lazyness with approval from other lazy tech illiterates.
>>54036001
> Inconsolata
The way God intended.
>>54037182
Anon is too retarded for Windows = Windows Sucks
These faggots cannot stop choking on each others dongs.
>>54036001
https://github.com/vim/vim
Vim is hosted on Github, so everyone who uses it is just another brainless SJW Cucktard Robot
>>54037260
go on
>>54036786
>Have you ever seen a C++, Obj-C, C# or Java developer using vim? Pretty much all serious development is in these languages.
>>54036786
>serious development
What is "serious" development?
>>54036786
>Have I ever seen C/C++ programmers using vim?
Yeah, one of the tech heads of UCI (and sysadmin of the UC supercomputer network) codes in vi. He encourages his students to do the same, even on their 10k sloc projects
Besides, you already showed you work in the 10GB monstrosity that is visual studio, so I don't know how you could possibly talk about bloat
>>54037559
>some guy i know uses vi and tells other to use it
Well in that case let's all use text editors todah that were deprecated when they were released in the 1970s
>>54037751
The point is that people use it and it works fine you stupid fuck
>>54037775
Wow namecalling. Touched a nerve, have I? Are you realizing all those hours learning obscure key combinations to do elementary tasks may have been completely wasted?
>>54036036
Nevermind vim-fucking-runtime which is 26MB. Vim is a bloated piece of shit.
>enjoy the idea of composable commands
>hate vim's ass-backwards bindings
>also enjoy emacs mnemonic commands and extensibility
>every package that tries to emulate vim also brings along its terrible keybindings.
>>54037870
You may or may not enjoy kakoune, it feels like a breath of fresh air compared to vim
https://github.com/mawww/kakoune
>>54037470
He's technically right though.
>>54037751
>deprecated
by what?
>>54037922
Even Bill Joy, the creator of vi said modular text editors were a bad idea, that if he could redo it he would have used mouse for movement instead. Vi users are kind of like scientologists who somehow manage to ignore that not even the creator of their religion believes in it.
>>54037484
When no fun is allowed (e.g. vim)
>>54037173
>actually having a job
ftfy
>>54037181
>C++
>Less popular than C by a huge margin
Not by much. C++ is basically C with extra features. You don't have to use all of the features of C++.
>Java basically requires an IDE because of how much of a fuckfest the language is.
Confirmed for never having programmed in Java before.
>>54037181
These are actual figures. You know, figures that are based on facts instead of being pulled out of your ass.
>>54038130
>Confirmed for never having programmed in Java before.
Confirmed for not having programmed in a good OOP language.
I mean for fucks sake, when java best practices dictate that you write a getter and setter for everything you know the language is fucked up.
>>54038165
>SQL
>A programming language
Guess HTML is actually the most popular programming language
does vim have compile and run
I use IntelliJ and it's probably better for mobile app development.
>>54038226
Of course it does
>>54038130
actually, the way classes are handled in java (dir/subdir/subsubdir/subsubsubdir/stuff.java) is kind of a mess, and quite painful if you don't have an IDE or at least some IDE-like features in your editor.
>>54038222
>>SQL
>>A programming language
>Guess HTML is actually the most popular programming language
Are you retarded?
>>54038165
Where the FUCK is Cold Fusion?
>>54038251
SQL is Turing complete, so it's programming language.
>>54038251
What do you think programming is? Writing fizzbuzz on the Internet?
Also this, >>54038284
>>54037846
no, it just pains me to see /g/ polluted by people like you
>>54038284
>SQL is Turing complete
Are you fucking retarded? What SQL are you talking about? Regular SQL is not Turing complete.
>>54038314
>What do you think programming is? Writing fizzbuzz on the Internet?
How on Earth did you come to this conclusion?
>>54038342
Found the inbred, everybody!
>IDEA + Vim plugin
best of both worlds to be honest
>>54038369
> Simple Query Language
> SELECT `turing`, `completeness`
> FROM `regular_sql`
> WHERE you're not a fucking retard
Yields 0 Results
No surprise there I guess.
>>54038342
https://wiki.postgresql.org/wiki/Cyclic_Tag_System
>>54036108
They don't use vim though. If they did they wouldn't be shilling it.
>>54038238
That depends on the language implementation. They made it needlessly complex for Android development in Java. Sun's Java is a lot simpler. You can keep all of your files within in one folder.
>>54038342
Simple google search can confirm it is. Why are you even arguing?
>>54037886
Maybe, but I've also grown to dislike Vim's modal nature. I love having different "words" for selecting or indicating arbitrary groups of text, and other commands for modifying them so I can chain them together, but I don't see the point in leaving insertion mode to do it. A hybrid mode like emacs is much better. I think that the ideal situation would be to have an "on-press" modal editing, so that any key pressed while CTRL/ALT is held down is a command and otherwise an insertion.
I was spoiled by vim, then I was spoiled by emacs, and now neither editor feels good enough for me.
>>54038428
Because he is a moron or a troll. I hope on the latter.
>>54038413
>>54038428
The PostgreSQL Global Development Group's brand of SQL may in fact be Turing complete, but saying "SQL is Turing complete" is wrong, and shows a general lack of understanding.
spacemacs is better desu but i can't be dicked to spend the time fucking with it.
>>54038447
He's moron. See >>54038448
>>54038447
>>54038491
> samefaggotry
>>54037870
>vim's ass-backwards bindings
You're really dumb m8
>>54038411
>simple query language
what's that
>>54038491
You've killed my hope in humanity :'(
>>54038411
structured query language bud
minesweeper and dwarf fortress are Turing complete as well, actually
>>54038516
Oh shit nigger
>>54038513
Thank you, how could I be so blind not to recognize my own post and respond to it?
Anyway, you obviously lack any kind of comprehension since the linked article explicitly states the Turing completeness was proven using standard SQL.
>>54038411
lol you might find some results with structured query language turd nigger
>>54038515
HJKL is neither mnemonic nor ergonomic. IJKL is better. None of the default keybindings in vim are any good. I've used vim for years too. Don't get butthurt just because somebody disagrees with you.
> Everybody arguing over SQL
> Being autistic
> It's Turing Complete
> No it's not
I'm just sitting here defending VIM. Fucking faggots.
>>54038615
Personally I've always found strange the hjkl keys.
IMHO, jkl; (just one key to the right) would be more logical as it's the correct "initial" position of the right hand fingers.
>>54038226
Of course, all you need to do is f ?Z<CR><leader><Ctrl-e>hjkl::make %<CR>ggG:!./%
Make sure you get it just right though or you'll delete all your work and everything in the same folder
Using vim instead of an IDE is usually a waste of time unless you already have built an IDE yourself on top of vim.
I like that some people have a better workflow, but don't go and tell people that this is the model that fits everyone.
I am sure that it would be possible for people to band together and make an IDE that would be on par with the other IDE's, but as long as people have to combine the "learn the system" and "build the system" experience, it is a timesink for most people.
In the first ten years of using vim, you constantly stop your work, find a way to improve some task, spend a few hours researching the best way to do so, maybe comment it in your config and then go back to work.
At some point you might loose the config, decide to remove it, causing you to start over the config.
After the config is done the second time, it will be a finished editor.
But the default vim is really bad.
All I see when vim advocates speak of vim is comparing a fully configured vim to a unconfigured text editor / IDE.
>>54038710
Yeah, you have to stretch or rotate your hand a bit for HJKL. JKL; is easier, but IJKL is just as ergonomic and also more logical, since it represents the Up/Down/Left/Right motions accurately.
>>54038735
>All I see when vim advocates speak of vim is comparing a fully configured vim to a unconfigured text editor / IDE.
actually, I mostly use the arrows (I know, shame on me)
fuck this fuck nigga shit nigga puttin links sayin its the future mixtape dumbass bitch tryin to swerve niggas into his shit by lying
>>54038767
So do I, because they work both in normal and edit mode. It causes less of a mental burden and the difference is very slight.
>>54038515
i agree with him desu and use vim for all my programming
>>54038899
You're fooling nobody, pajeet.
>>54038721
On the surface, the issue appears to be about productivity and user friendliness. But, if you think about it on a deeper level, it's more about appealing to one's ego. It doesn't matter if they're "going against the grain" to stand out or they have a deluded sense of practicality. The fact is the whole issue is emotional.
>>54038981
bitch i use vi-binds for near fucking everything ill rek you
>>54038721
The default vim is so good that it is more than enough for 99% of programming projects. Not that a baby duck like you would know anything about that.
>>54039041
fucking notepad is "good enough" for 99% of programming
>>54038710
>>54038735
You obviously haven't understood the point of hjkl. While it is a remnant from the early days of terminals when proper typing form was more encouraged, the reason holds still today. The reason you use hjkl instead of jkl; is because the most frequently used direction is down. Your fingers should rest on the homerow, so scrolling through a document can be done with the most natural finger without leaving the homerow.
>>54039061
No.
>>54039073
Yes.
>>54039065
>While it is a remnant from the early days of terminals when proper typing form was more encouraged, the reason holds still today. The reason you use hjkl instead of jkl; is
No, you dummy, the reason is that the keyboard Vi was developed on had the arrows mapped to HJKL. That was all. At least do some googling before you try to get all smug.
>>54039106
and i suppose the decision to map the down arrow to J was completely arbitrary and random, desu ka?
>>54039204
Unless you have proof that it was done specifically because "J" corresponds in frequency of presses to the amount of times a user pressed "down", it was probably just done arbitrarily.
I get the feeling you're just itching for an argument though, so I'll stop responding after this.
>>54036608
>Right, so basically you're a hobbyist.
Not at all, I'm a software engineer. You're just unaware how vim plugins work, no shame in that, just don't spout bullshit on /g/.
>>54039368
please do, this is more than enough shitposting for one day.
>>54039467
What kind of work do you do?
>>54039106
>No, you dummy, the reason is that the keyboard Vi was developed on had the arrows mapped to HJKL. That was all. At least do some googling before you try to get all smug.
What are you getting at? You are showing an old terminal from a time when homerow typing was actively encouraged. You're literally proving my point. If you've ever used an old terminal interface you know that scrolling down is the most frequently used movement, especially when reading text. Hell, if you've ever used a browser you know this.
>>54039635
This is one of the repos I'm a major contributor to
https://github.com/EnterpriseQualityCoding/FizzBuzzEnterpriseEdition
>>54039106
>>54039368
It's probably so obvious that they didn't state it explicitly in the adm-3a manual but here's some empirical evidence that supports it
http://www.drbunsen.org/vim-croquet/
>>54036001
That's a pretty bloated vim you have there in the OP image.
traps are hot
>>54036001
It all depens on what you're working on. Vim is great for terminal editing and if you've used it to the point where you're really effective. Doesn't really matter though, coding isnt just about typing.
>>54038615
>HJKL is neither mnemonic nor ergonomi
it's ergonomic if you type properly
Works fine for Python/Javascript/HTML/CSS which is like 95% of what I do. If I programmed in Java or something I would use Eclipse or whatever is popular now.
>>54036001
>mfw all I use in vim is V/v for selecting lines and p for pasting
>no syntax coloring
>no autocomplete
Tmux manages multiple instances and ranger for menial file browsing, literally all I use to code.
The only thing I miss is TAB multiple lines and shift-TAB to unindent,
>>54041324
>The only thing I miss is TAB multiple lines and shift-TAB to unindent
>> and <<
>>54041539
Oh wow
W-why should I use vim over sublime text for web dev?
>>54041802
Because people on /g/ will say you're stupid if you use ST, even though lots of professional developers use ST while all the ST hating /g/entoomen do is "50 shades of fizzbuzz".
>>54041324
v, select your line range, > and < for indent/unindent.
>>54041802
>much faster
>much larger pluginbase
>much better featureset out of the box
>much better keybinds
>actually works in a terminal, e.g. over ssh etc.
>>54041977
actually vim has lower quality support for the latest web trends (compare vim bootstrap plugins to the ones in package control for ST for example) and the learning curve might cut on the productivity. ST > Vim for web dev even though I use it for ASM and C
>>54042014
Nah.
>>54038386
Underrated post
>>54042065
That's all you got? I guess I won
>>54039905
Has anyone done this for emacs?
>>54042191
>>54042164
No, you didn't.
>>54042341
Whatever helps you sleep at night mate. Don't worry, maybe you'll have better luck next time xd
For people using vim: Did you just use it till you memorized all of the keybindings or did you sit down and make an effort to learn them all at once?
>>54036049
that's just not true, many professional programmers use vim
I personally don't like it, and I newer use it, but when I see what people could do with it, you can't say it is a piece of shit, no way anon
>>54036608
>Complains about vim memory usage
>Uses Visual Studio
wew lad
>>54042435
took a class, instructor taught vims basic commands (sub, dd/p, etc etc) , now I use vim. teach myself something when I recognize that it could greatly enrich my experience
>>54042435
>do vimtutor
>just use it
>???
>profit
>>54036001
>not writing your code in the monitor
learn to call -151
>>54042435
Even experienced vim users rarely know 'all of the keybindings'. It's very hard to learn many at once. The best approach is probably to start with a few (hjkl, i, esc, :w, :q), then add a few more (y/yy, d/dd, p, w, b, /), then it just continues (W, B, f, *, %, ., x...). It's not just keybindings, it's key combinations in different modes, where the context may change behavior. For example, i can mean at least 5 completely different things depending on mode and key context, and even then it may in some of these cases be modified for different situations.
>>54036036
>I'm too dumb to use emacs so it must be bad
okay kid
vi/vim is very useful. and not just for coding. one day i needed to add something to the end of 1000+ files and had an anon that helped with some vi commands. that was the first day i realize how useful vi was for things not always related to coding.
>>54043320
why would you use vim for that if you can just$ for f in *; do echo some bullshit >>$f; doneor even$ for f in *; do cat <<END >>$f; done
> add a line
> add another line
> omg a third line !!!eleven
> END
>>54041802
because it's fun
>>54042315
the fuck keyboard is that
Actually it's more like the Opera of text editors, only faggots use it
