Say I know nothing regarding programming. Absolute beginner. Where do I start? I've looked into C and C++ but every tutorial has the same "Hello World" with no further explanation on how to advance. I have two objectives. First, learn to code properly. Turn source code into executable programs. No short cuts but more of a crash course. I'm willing to put the time in. Second, I want to be able to "hack" or infiltrate secure systems. Whether I develop the software myself or work on it collectively.
'Preciate /g/
Don't let me die
for pen testing install kali
for scripting learn python
Learn how networks, work.
Internet:
DNS Root Servers, Autonomous Systems, You.
>>53863946
learn how to code properly on your own, there is no right way.
>just do fizzbuzz, but with foobar instead
READ THE MAN PAGES
just use a compiler to compile like any normal person.
install kali or any security-based OS with a proper jail system (just do bsd :^) )
learn how to network map
learn how to read data streams
The Gentoomen Library's got you covered.
https://g.sicp.me/books/
>>53863946
>First, learn to code properly.
It's mostly intuitive.
>>53864432
I have Kali on a USB. That in itself isn't easy. Is a Python a good language to start with? Networks such as home networks? Sorry for the stupid questions. Just really new to all of this and there is so much.
>>53865030
Nah, nah, it's fine, stick with me, and I'll explain.
>>53864461
Is this an explanation of the internet "network"?
>>53865030
Look, if you want to simply be able to do some basic programming, simply type, "how to program python" into google, download python, and read along while programming.
Like anything in life, if you try it and stick with it, you usually learn it.
But.... (another post coming).
>>53864529
Fizzbuzz is the truth. Thanks man.
>>53865030
CS as a topic is really vast.
It's all pretty complicated to get into, depending how good you are at maths, but the basics ain't so bad.
C++ & C as a language are not the best to learn as a beginner, they really rely on a knowledge of CS else things can go wrong fast.
Colleges(UK) usually teach easier to grasp languages to beginners, like Visual Basic, Pascal or Java.
They're easier to read and hide the complicated bits from the new guy.
Ideally to learn to program well, you need to understand how computers work, with languages like C++ & C, that's pretty much necessary.
And this is where CS comes in, CS pretty much as a science is all about making computers do things quickly, or working out how to solve a problem (using maths), ideally as fast as possible. (pls no h8 for that explanation).
Again, if you want to hack into a computer, you'd most of the time need to know how computers work, depending on what you exploit.
It's a lot of work, but you can get a working knowledge quickly if you stick with it.
>>53863946
What skills you got mate? It would be helpful to know where you're starting from.
How's your math?
What's the most technically involved thing you've ever done with a computer?
How are you with working in teams?
Have you had any success with self-motivated study or are you more of a directed learning/classroom guy?
Are you looking for a career here or a hobby?
>>53865061
I have. Currently using Code Academy and learning a bit but I feel they're only offering so much. I know most places want you to pay but this is the information age. I'm not paying for shit kek
>>53865172
Woah, dude, it's all free.
Depending on how best you learn.
Code Academy is one way to learn, but programming is completely free.
All the information is available for free!
I'm serious.
All of it.
Books though, many cost a bit, many are free, most are on the PB.
>>53865219
>Books though, many cost a bit, many are free, most are on the PB.
Libraries still exist, and if they ain't got something they can usually order it for you.
>>53865170
Not much. I thought I knew a lot more than I did. Jumping back into it. I'm lost.
My math is okay. Could use a few pointers.
Nothing really. I've created an EXTREMELY basic web page recently to get familiar with writing "code".
I can work in teams. Just never had the opportunity since I don't know what I am doing.
Yes. I learn more on my own. Also, I have the motivation to learn it.
Both. I wish to make this my career and I have a few ideas I've always wanted to do.
>>53865255
Exactly, sorry, I forgot about that.
It's a large topic, but it's all (mostly)free on the internet. And in the local library.
>>53865219
What's a good site to get me past the initial stages? So tired of seeing hello world.
>>53865272
>>53865303
You want to code?
Right
Choose ideally, Java or C#, both are popular and easy to grasp.
Download Visual Studio Express
Clear some harddrive space.
Install it.
1. Read the tutorial, follow the tutorial.
2. At the same time, write it out.
Go back to step 1.
Look, give me a sec, and I'll start posting links.
How do you remember all the commands? Do you use a reference or you memorized it through repetition? Thanks in advance
>>53865332
It's like anything.
The more you do it, the more you remember.
Programs are built out of simple instructions.
You need to remember a set of keywords for each language, and the rules.
After that the more you learn the better you get.
All languages are mostly alike, they are all INSTRUCTIONS.
You say to the computer
Do this
Do that
Add this to this
Divide this by that
>>53865328
Which one? It shows Desktop or Web. Sorry for the stupid questions guys.
>>53865332
>>53865392
Here.
This is for C#
http://www.tutorialspoint.com/csharp/
https://www.visualstudio.com/post-download-vs?sku=community&clcid=0x409
https://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/aa288436(v=vs.71).aspx
https://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/618ayhy6(v=vs.71).aspx
Don't look at MSDN library
reference until you start reading the tutorial, it looks complicated, but it's simple.
I'll post install tips, give me a sec.
>>53865410
Still there?
>>53865509
Patience, learning anything worthwhile is going to take weeks at the minimum.
No sense rushing the first hour.
>>53865332
Hi, It's me still.
Look, if you're still here.
Programming tutorials have hello world because it's the very basics.
They show you how to put a word on the screen.
They show you the rules to the language.
>>53863946
>thinking about getting a program that would fulfill my needs
>Can't find anything remotely like it
>well perhaps I should try to make one for myself
>too bad I can't do jack
>maybe /g/ could give me some pointers
>check catalouge
>find thread
This is fate. Bumb, from another clueless yet eager lurker.
I have a related question
I can deal with intro to C stuff like fizzbuzz and simple structs/pointers, but now that I'm in CS1/data structures I need to understand recursive methods.
How can I git gud at recursion?
>>53865576
Waiting for the other bloke to get back.
But I can help you too. Read the conversation above and pay attention to my points. Might as well do the same as him
C# is the primary GUI(making windows programs with a clicky interface) language now anyway.
Please remember I'm not trying to be patronizing, I'm trying to explain without being complicated in my speech.
>>53863946
Jesus Christ. You know you're going to give up after a couple months right? I bet you just finished watching Mr.Robot or some shit and think it would be cool to be a hacker.
You have to have a very wide scope of knowledge when it comes to """""hacking""""" because every place you try to get into will be different, a lot of the time it's a fruitless effort and waste of time because it's impregnable. Just fucking learn how to use metasploit though I guess.
Jesus I fucking hate these thread, go back to >>>/v/
>>53865635
>Projecting this hard.
>>53865635
Dude, I explained that simply above, was the sperging necessary?
If he wants to learn something? Why are you shitting on him?
Or did you give up yourself, and now can't stand the thought of someone else succeeding?
:^)
Did I mention? No one gives a shit m8.
>>53865604
Thanks, I am on it
>>53865711
Tutorial points is a simple explanation of the language.
MSDN is what's called a reference, it's a big list of all the information about the language.
Why programming, all programmers refer the reference for information.
Eg, "How do I get the size of this", I can't remember.
>checks the reference (googles c# how to check size of X) :P
Because it's a Microsoft supported language, hence MSDN.
At this point, I'm pretty sure I'm talking like a primary school teacher. :p
>>53865509
Yes. I'm still here. Just poking around the various sites that have been listed. I see a lot of c stuff. Which one should I start with? I know learning C will make learning ++/# much easier but should i skip C and focus on ++ or #? Which one will land a better job? I wanna make enough money to come home and work on my own projects without scrapping by. Thanks in advance.
>>53865943
No, no.
It's a bit confusing but C, C++ & C# are not the same.
C# is completely different, but shares many design features with C. Mainly how it's written.
Simply put.
C++ is an extension of C.
C can be perfectly written in C++, but C++ cannot be written in C.
I'd advise you learn C#, then once you can churn out programs.
Learn a new language.
While you're doing this, you should also read up on simple computer science, the basics really.
Actually, while it's incomplete, this might do it.
This is a wikibook of the course people take in UK College (US Highschool) I'm not sure how helpful, or complete it is, I just flicked through it.
https://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/A-level_Computing/AQA
>>53865576
2nded
>>53865635
I will not. Never seen the show but say that I did? Were you not motivated or influenced by something to pursue any of your interests?
This wide scope you speak of. How did the most knowledgeable hacker know to man get his knowledge? I would assume reading, testing, trial & error etc. Also, I don't play video games. There's nothing wrong with them. I just don't play them. Thanks for your input tho. You got my output. Look ma! I'm learning already.
Welp, I'm supposed to be programming a server in C++.
Instead I've spend the last "hour"? helping people on /g/ has the world gone mad?
Just wanted to take the time to thank everyone for their help. Time is valuable and I appreciate everyone for taking some of theirs to help me. Thank you /g/
>>53865576
Same here. Today is the first time I've ever really visited /g/.
This is 2spooky.
There's some other stuff I want to learn. Like how to get a fake degree from a university, but coding is a good start.
>>53866133
Nah, it's no problem.
>>53864636
Anyway, I overlooked this too.
As this bloke mentioned.
https://g.sicp.me/books/
https://shodan.me/books/
Is the /g/ list for programming 'n such.
Anyone want anything else?
>>53866153
kek
>>53863946
OP I am relatively on the same boat as you. I have been lucky enough to have several programmer friends irl that have given me solid advice.
At the moment I am learning Python because Python is accessible to beginners and is a versatile language that will get you writing programs that actually do something more than print "Hello World" in a relatively short time.
After I have a firm grasp on Python I'm diving into C and C++.
This is following the advice of a close friend who said "Python will teach you how to program fast, C will teach you to program efficiently"
Once you know C you can pick up C++ as a more practical version of C.
Think of C as a good language to teach you the basics of how computers work at a very fundamental level. Another quote that comes to mind "Every piece of technology you see around you works with machine language (1s and 0s) slightly above that is C / Assembly"
C++ is considered a mid level language it's sort of a happy medium between C (low level) and Python(high level).
Though I've also been warned that although C++ is great for many applications it isn't exceptional at any specific thing.
Ultimately I think the most valuable piece of advice I can hand down to you is this " Don't get bogged down trying to learn the "best" language. At the end of the day a good programmer is one that is adaptable and can solve a given problem efficiently however the means"
Also once you git gud with one language, learning new languages becomes much easier.
If you have no experience?
You start with thenewboston on YouTube and go from there.
>>53864636
Much appreciated. 35GB is quite a bit of info. I got some time to put in.
>>53865169
Cheers m8. Watching some Computer Science videos. Getting a better understanding of computers in general. When you say complicated, what do you mean exactly? Like the compiling the program?
>>53866408
Nah, I mean a whole bunch of clever people will always be talking about something you don't understand. Hah.
But hey, they didn't understand at one point, that's why you learn.
>>53866348
>"Ultimately I think the most valuable piece of advice I can hand down to you is this " Don't get bogged down trying to learn the "best" language. At the end of the day a good programmer is one that is adaptable and can solve a given problem efficiently however the means"
Aye, remember this, programmers usually know more than one language. A fair few more than one.
But, if you know one language, other languages similar to it will be a lot easier.
>>53866370
o shit
You don't have to download all of it!
Just choose the ones you need!
D:
>>53866348
Thanks. Quick question. What programs can be written with Python? Just a few examples of actually programs. When I Google it. This is what I get and it's basically Latin to me.
https://wiki.python.org/moin/SimplePrograms
>>53866505
OOOOOOOOH I knew that kek. I was feeling a little overwhelmed but still committed
>>53863946
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tyVhn0FWWB4
This guy will take you past hello world with a lot of detail starting form what is a program
>>53866560
Hmm if you can't understand those then I suggest doing the codeacademy python course. That was my first step anyway.
As to what you can do with Python it really depends on you. Some use it for web-dev, some companies use it to scrub big data, some use it for A.I. development, or speech recognition.
Also look up sentdex on YouTube. All of his videos are in Python and cover topics like web-dev and even simple game-dev.
Also you can look into Violent Python which is a book where you learn Python by "hacking" but it's not the best book for a complete beginner desu I read a bit of it but moved on.
>>53863946
>every tutorial has the same "Hello World" with no further explanation on how to advance.
how about you pick up a proper book then
>>53865635
Thanks. You just gave me a new show to watch.
>>53866748
Any recommendations?
>>53866730
Python it is. Cheers for the info. Looking to see if I can get a PDF on Violent Python. Thanks again.
>>53866898
Best of luck anon.
>>53866730
>>53866560
Good question.
All languages do generally the same thing, but!
Different languages are more suited to different tasks, a bit like the different tools in a tool box, or different sized spanners.
You can do the same thing in different languages, but what It really boils down to, is the language itself, and it's support for things.
If you want games, it's classically been C & C++ in the majority of cases. Due to the language being able to support both high level and low level paradigms. As well as it's huge library and massive support for things like 2D & 3D Graphics libraries.
Want to solve a sum quickly? Or script a small program? Perhaps use python, it's multi platform(like java) because it relies on another program to do the heavy lifting(it's interpreted by and interpreter) rather than being compiled into machine instructions, but is much slower than, say, C, but It makes more sense to script a small problem in lua or python, than to bring out the big guns. It's like hammering a nail with a tank.
Likewise, you wouldn't write a 3D game in python, because well, you don't.
Want to write a fancy GUI program on windows, with clicky boxes, without spending 5 months writing miles of Visual C++ WPF? Use C#.
Want to make a multiplatform program without worrying about cross compatibility? Use Java.
But, that doesn't mean to say you can't write things in other languages, they are tools, choose the tool wisely.
No language is inherently bette(some are, kinda), apart from ones that are subjectively replaced? All have strengths and weaknesses.
Written quickly, not 100% correct if you're pedantic.
I don't have time to explain the reasons why python is slow(in comparison), or C is hard.
>>53866730
Found it and this looks like some of what I've been looking for. Now, since everyone basically has recommended Python. That's where I'm going. With your experience. Should I still learn C and then C++ or just C++ since it's C with all the bells and whistles?
Violent Python PDF below
https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B-F3NpsEIXCYcDZaUXhfdXlFM1k/edit
Anyway, I'm off, glad I could help.
Cheers.
>>53866975
gg, one last post.
C++ is more complicated due to the bells and whistles, but also allows you to learn C if you make sure to cover C style things not commonly used any more.
>>53866998
Much appreciated. Cheers m8!
>>53866974
That was more than enough. Thank you for the great explanation. I've gotten more from this thread than I gotten this weekend watching vids and online courses.
>>53866975
If you want to be a programmer as a career choice, you need to understand the underpinnings of computing as a whole so learn C.
If you don't care about depth and just wanna get on with making things learn C++, though not learning C could give you a knowledge gap that may bite you in the ass down the line.
But take my advice with a grain of salt. I'm still very much a noob.
>>53866974
Wow, it’s been a long time I didn’t see some actual advice with such quality!
And I agree with you on every points, if OP wants to learn about programming desktop software.
If it’s about web development, then it’ll be other languages, but I’m not much knowledgable about that, except than the basics are HTML, CSS and javascript
>>53867028
This.
A lot of programmers I've talked to seemingly agree that C is more or less obsolete i.e. you shouldn't be writing C programs anymore. However it still serves as a good teaching tool.
>>53866974
Forgot to mention, practically every Operating system is written in C& C++ with some assembler.
That gives you an idea of why it's so preferred for low level programming.
Master C if you want to do systems programming (writing kernels and drivers)
Learn C (mostly about how pointers works and how memory handling works in C) if you find it interesting.
If you want to make games jump into C++.
If you want to be a web developer jump into Java, C#, JS, Python.
If you're just a hobbyist take Python.
If you wanna do fun Linux stuff learn Bash.
>>53867215
>A lot of Pajeets I've talked to seemingly agree that C is more or less obsolete
>>53867245
Correcting myself
> practically every Operating system
practically every used Operating system
Any other OS written in another language would be written in a language precursing C, or just assembler.
Pascal, Fortran, Assembly, and Algol were all pretty much replaced by C.
Pascal is still taught in some schools as a beginners language.
For example, Linux is mostly written in C & some assembler
OSX is written in Objective-C, C and assembler
Windows is written in C++ & some assembler with the kernel written in C, some top level applications written in C# or (perhaps VB)?
Anyway, that's my last post, I promise :).
>>53863946
1. I doubt you've looked that thoroughly. There are literally scores of online tutorial sites.
2. What is your math and overal educational background?
>>53867353
Read the thread, it's covered.
>>53867350
Have a read through the preface of this:
https://www.amazon.ca/Learn-Hard-Way-Practical-Computational/dp/0321884922
P.S. they weren't pajeets
>>53865653
Yeah cause I was 14 years old once too so I know how easily kids can get influenced by garbage, but now I actually have a good desk job and rake in an above average income for doing meme tier software development
>>53865662
>no one cares
They obviously do since so many people replied to me kek, fuck off shitlord
>>53866115
Jeeeeez, you really are putting up a serious aintchya. It's cute, I actually changed my mind and think you're some man who does manual labour in his mid 20s
>>53866820
You're welcome newfag
>>53867514
>this level of autistic trolling
k
Threads over, people are doing stuff.
Why are you posting?
Don't bother replying, because I'm not going to rise to the b8
>>53867597
>hurr durr if i call him a troll then it completely invalidates everything he's said even though it's true and I know it
k.
>>53865172
PICK A BOOK NIGGA, PICK A FUCKING BOOK! CODEACADEMY IS SHIT!
A book is much better than an online course.
>>53867909
This thread has shown me that. They got my feet wet. I'm starting with Violent Python. Thanks for the advice
>>53864432
Well done anon you just released a script kiddie into the world with zero knowledge of the tools they will use or how they work
>>53863946
Look for tutorials/books on neural networks, genetic algorithms, sorting algorithms, pointer arithmatic, data structures, socket programming, buffer overflows etc etc etc. Writing your own malware is also a great excersise for any aspiring hacker. Go back to basics and use a text editor/compiler set up, IDEs will only distract you if you're learning. There's so much to learn and so little time, don't bother with hello world shit.
>>53869698
I'm starting with Python. I got a book I'm starting with but the malware sounds interesting. Any tips? Also, I know it's a stupid question but should I TOR my "hacker" searches? I know I'm at the bottom of the totem pole but still. Can never be too careful, right?
>>53863946
1. learn C.
2. learn functions.
3. find ways to use every new function you learn.
4. make the most complicated programs you can with the functions you know.
5. start ripping off good code you find and read.
