All you faggots better get ready for another "upgrade" to get shoved down your throats. Remember init? It was deprecated for systemd, and Xorg is being deprecated by Wayland. Welcome to the 21st century motherfuckers. I wonder how many of you faggots will cry now that your precious Xorg is dying.
http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Changes/Wayland
Fedora was the first to get systemd, and it will be the first to get Wayland. Kiss your deprecated shit goodbye, faggots.
>systemd
gentoo and slackware doesn't have this problem
>>53340339
people dislike systemd because it does too much and goes against the unix philosophy.
>>53340360
But is it actually better or worse?
>>53340339
everyone hates X though
>>53340360
I dont get this "unix philosophy" bullcrap. No program on unix does one thing, let alone well.
>>53340360
>it goes against our philosophy
this shit is so fucking stupid, every distro is free to not use it, make their own fork or whatever the fuck
but they are using it, maybe because it works and there's nothing better?
>>53340399
only shills like you do.
>>53340339
Systemd
>Sending NSA all your linux data
>Thanks
>>53340405
>scrot
>units
come at me
>>53340339
Wayland is actually good though. Unlike sytemsucksd
>>53340339
About time, x is horribly deprecated and insecure
How is Mir?
>>53340390
Anything is better then x.org.
SystemD is kinda questionable. I would say it's kinda better? The controversy is that systemD replaces a hell of a lot of stuff. So it's not just replacing one thing but like 11 things. Furthermore, init mostly worked fine. Upstart was an improvement to the mostly fine init. Now you have system d that takes over what was previously individual programs you could pick and choose to replace good c with a slightly better version of good. So even if it's better, it just seems pointless.
>>53340480
People already have Mir out and functional.
>>53340441
>look mom I can form a real argument
>>53340339
I already have Wayland on my Fedora. Though it is still a bit buggy, but when it works it's much smoother than x. I welcome the new change, as long as it's for the better
>>53340511
>when it works
>>53340569
Yea I did say it's still a bit buggy
>>53340339
X is the largest *nix program that doesn't do anything useful.
>>53340423
If scrot was Unix philosophy, why does it have options for subscreen selections? Why for delay?
If it followed the Unix philosophy all it would do is capture the framebuffer and allow you to pipe it to a file, or imagemagick for cropping etc
>>53340423
>import screenshot.png
>>53340405
> I was born in the age of guis and that's all "unix" is to me
> I don't get this do one thing and do it well shit
> I don't get composability
> I don't know what pipes are
just stick I windows, then.
> xargs, uniq, sort, cat, grep, sed, awk
> |
>>53340339
>wayland
>not the tightest shit
Xorg is fucking horrifying anon, surely you can't be defending it
even its own developers hate it. As a matter of fact, especially its own developers hate it
>>53340339
2016 YEAR OF THE LINUX DESKTOP
WE DID IT
>>53340360
>muh yoonix
Good thing this is Linux, not Unix
>>53341597
Scrot even has an exec flag to run external commands instead of just piping them.
>>53342038
also, the people behind wayland are all former X developers that got fed up with the braindamage that is X
Wayland is tricky, because even though X is total shitware Wayland isn't actually any better yet.
OP's retarded for not realizing that Wayland's been shipping for years (Debian had it at least as early as 2014), but the point still stands. Wayland still heavily relies upon X for many of its programs, and there's still no good Awesome equivalent for Wayland.
>>53340480
Shit.
>>53340339
Shitposting in your first 15 seconds of visiting /g/?
http://theinvisiblethings.blogspot.com/2011/04/linux-security-circus-on-gui-isolation.html?m=1
I stumbled across this article. Will the problem it describes with x.org be fixed with Wayland?
>>53340339
>Xorg dying
Fucking yes please.
Its not that X is bad, its just old as fuck.
You wouldn't call a dinosaur retarded just because he is doesn't fit into todays environment would you?
>>53342433
/g/ would
>>53340408
that's getting pretty hard when you have to develop ways to get around systemd dependencies because the big distros use them
>>53342310
doesn't OpenBSD's xenocara deal with this?
>>53340339
>Xorg is being deprecated by Wayland.
No fucking shit. Welcome to 2012.
>I wonder how many of you faggots will cry now that your precious Xorg is dying.
Who the fuck do you know that is attached to xorg? Seriously. Even the xorg devs don't like xorg. Xorg is this horrifying monster with an insane amount of legacy features and feature bloat for things not remotely related to a display driver.
Are you actually this retarded OP? How much is Microsoft paying you to post this trash?
>>53342310
on it's own, no. Wayland is still technically susceptible to this (Look up Wayland Keyloger). The difference is it's /much/ easier to isolate things on Wayland, and paired with something like SELinux it becomes much easier to have real security. Keep in mind X.Org is decades of horrific code, there's much more likely to be security flaws from the legacy features. the X.Org devs barely know how the damn thing works at this point.
This is a different display server right? If I want to run apps as a different user, could I install wayland and forget learning how to copy 'X authorization' cookies and export variables and shit?
Even awk breaks the unix philosofy of "doing one thing".
Systemd does things differently than init, but the rest of the unix development ideas is still present.
They package a lot of "small" tools in a single repository, but that doesn't make it one big application.
Unix was distributed the same way.
The individual applications are a little bigger than what originally was with unix, but things have changed a lot since then.
Eg the systemd-analyze is 1.4M, which is rather big and packs a lot of options so it can "do everything" related to analysis the boot.
But overall, systemd is an improvement for all the people who wants to use the system on the desktop, which means they want to boot as fast as possible and if something slows it down, they want to easily fix it.
Systemd allows for this, better than any prior solution did.
>>53342704
That's because awk is technically a programming language for processing text.
Even C doesn't do the UNIX philosophy.
>>53342482
So why aren't they doing the hard work? They're already taking the effort to roll a distro (a job that's not easy) but they won't do that? That makes no sense to me.
>>53342727
because it's not up to other people to clean up systemd's mess
it swallows everything
>>53342739
Team Systemd is taking effort to do things their own way. Why can't other people take the effort to do other things their own way?
>>53340817
>doesn't do anything useful
so I suppose you aren't using any graphical interface
>>53342724
But you could make the argument that you wouldn't need awk, you could just use cut, grep, sed etc to do the same things.
It is a stupid argument, but so is most of the arguments against systemd.
A lot of the applications that "is swallowed" by systemd is just optimized, some situations, features were added to make the applications faster.
>>53340339
But everybody hates X though, and Wayland isn't a do-everything clusterfuck like systemd.
OP strikes me as likely to be your typical GNOME-hater, meaning OP wouldn't even be affected by a switch to Wayland as default in Fedora. For that matter, running GNOME on X will still be an option for a long time to come, much like running it on Wayland has already been an option since at least a couple of releases now.
>>53342255
>Wayland still heavily relies upon X for many of its programs
This is misleading, Anon. What you mean is that many programs do not run natively on Wayland and rely on XWayland to run. Worth noting is that unlike what many people assume, the overhead for that is quite small.
>and there's still no good Awesome equivalent for Wayland.
I know there are a number of compositors with a focus on tiling out there, but I assume you've looked into it more than me. Just make sure to keep yourself updated, something you'll be happy with will undoubtedly roll around at some point.
Personally, I'm not switching until I can get Redshift-like functionality.
> GNOME 3
> SystemD
> Wayland
[CAN'T WAKE UP]
>>53340339
>actually defending Xorg
Go fucking kill yourself.
Xorg is a piece of shit!
DIE XORG! DIE!
>>53342685
Wayland itself isn't a display server no, wayland is a protocol that display servers used to communicate with client applications.
Under the wayland model each DE would have their own display server.
>>53343578
Can you even read?
I welcome Wayland, but holy shit does it need work. X is a steaming pile of shit, so at least make it better than that.
>>53344419
I'm not the Anon you're quoting but I did author a similar post. It would indeed seem that I am incapable of reading.
It's amazing how simply the tone of the post plus the mention of systemd makes one not take in what the text is clearly saying. Good on you for calling it out, Anon.
>>53343499
you could always write your own and stop complaining like a bitch
Systemd is one of the best things that happened to Linux. All other init systems had 0 developers or was a steaming pile of shit. Systemd doesn't have defaults that everyone agrees with but it's far above "good enough".
>>53340339
>>53340360
If anything, X.org is more like Systemd while Wayland is more like the old Init if you want to draw parallels with the "unix philosophy".
