Why is AMD so good at making GPUs but so bad at making CPUs?
>>52561431
>implying AMD can do anything right other than housefires
because intel doesnt make dedicated GPUs
AMD would be fucked
They actually make great budget CPUs. Things like web browsing or using microsoft word don't need uber i7 single thread performance. In fact not all vydias are unoptimized pieces of shit like arma 3 and an 860K is enough for them.
Their unlocked A8 APUs also BTFO any intel CPU + GPU combo for the ~$90 price tag.
>>52561678
>OC'd CPUs are better than non-OC'd ones
Well yeah. That's like saying a baseball player using steroids is probably going to hit more HRs than one who isn't.
Enjoy wearing down your CPU. AMD gets better performance when you OC, that's about the only advantage it has against a non-OC'd Intel CPU.
I know people who use nothing but AMD CPUS, they OC and they go through them every two or three years.
How are we judging what is "good" here exactly?
AMD and Nvidia are pretty similar in terms of size and how many chips they crank out yearly. Intel on the other hand dwarfs every other IC manufacturer by at least 3:1, in AMD's case it's more like 10:1.
>>52561431
Who is this barista babe and why did I do double paper?
>>52561946
>barista
You already know who she is.
>>52561776
>>OC'd CPUs are better than non-OC'd ones
I never even implied that senpai. No need to push your 860K to 4.6 GHz just to browse the web.
>Enjoy wearing down your CPU. AMD gets better performance when you OC, that's about the only advantage it has against a non-OC'd Intel CPU.
You don't even need to overclock your CPU for most uses. If you're only gonna play arma 3 for life then you might as well stop fucking around and buy an i7
>I know people who use nothing but AMD CPUS, they OC and they go through them every two or three years.
Sounds like they don't cool them down enough. An OC'd CPU that never goes past 72°C will last longer than one that goes up to 90°C. Those people are obviously not component overclockers.
Anyway I only said AMD makes great budget CPUs. They are obviously dogshit for very CPU intensive applications like HEVC encoding and ray tracing. Zen is suppose to fix that.
>>52561946
That's me
>>52561678
If you don't have any particular GPU need, the intel low-end CPUs are still better value than the AMD counterparts.
>>52562025
No, not really. If you don't care about vydia gaems or doing a fuckton of CPU-intensive tasks then you don't need anything more than an 860K. Hell, maybe an athlon 5150 is enough to satisfy your needs.
Point is AMD is currently the best option for those on a budget, not in need of great single thread performance, or who don't do CPU-intensive tasks.
Zen is gonna change that btw (hopefully). If an 8-core zen can at least match stock i7-5960X performance then people will literally have 0 reason to chose intel except for a meager 10% better single thread performance.
>>52561431
They gobbled this company called Radeon eons ago. I heard they were pretty good at GPUs.
>implying ATI cards are any good
scooby dooby doo
>AMD
>good at anything
good one
>>52561776
>Enjoy wearing down your CPU
Tech-illiterate retard.
>I know people who use nothing but AMD CPUS, they OC and they go through them every two or three years
Sure you do, Rajesh, Sure you do. :^)
>>52562559
Not him but if you let a cpu constantly overheat it will fail more quickly. There are a lot of incompetent overclockers out there.
>mfw getting almost 40 fps playing bf4 at low 1080p settings with an a8
You gotta admit, amd makes some pretty fucking based apus. I could even crossfire this fucker with a used r7 240 and get almost twice the fps. Probably just gonna buy an r7 360 though.
>>52561678
Yeah fucking right, nigga
A dual core Pentium will run circles around an APU or Athlon X4.
>>52562680
Not everyone plays arma 3 you know.
>>52561963
>An OC'd CPU that never goes past 72°C will last longer than one that goes up to 90°C
No, nigger. Voltage kills CPUs, not just heat.
If that was the case, half of the Xeons at my old job would have kicked the bucket years ago. They're almost 8 years old now and are still kicking at 88 degrees.
>>52562591
Overclocking alone wont do much. Heat is a factor but the main issue is pushing the voltage too far. If you push the clock speed too far then eventually there wont be enough power to keep the CPU running 100% so it will become unstable and crash. To remedy this you need to increase the voltage so there's more power being supplied to the CPU, the problem is if you give too much power to the CPU then it will just short out and die. Increasing the power can also cause more heat to be generated though
>>52562709
>arma 3
Gamers don't game on Pentiums. In your every day use-case scenario, a Pentium offers much faster performance than an Athlon or APU.
APUs are for poorfag MOBA niggers and welfare children.
>>52562713
Moral of the story: don't overclock if you don't know what you're fucking doing.
>>52562741
>Gamers don't game on Pentiums. In your every day use-case scenario, a Pentium offers much faster performance than an Athlon or APU.
You're not being very subtle about your trolling you know.
>>52561456
idk about you but my shit doesn't get much hotter than an intel/nvidia build.
>>52561431
Because they bought ATI?
>>52562680
It might have better single thread performance but that doesn't really matter outside of playing vydias. Multi core performance-wise, the pentium and Athlon 860K have pretty much the same performance at equal frequencies.
So using a web browser like chrome which can efficiently use multiple threads, using a pentium won't improve jack shit.
>>52562865
>but that doesn't really matter outside of playing vydias
Or browsing Internet :^)
>>52562741
in day use AMDs are better than a dual core pentium
4 cores is way better at multi tasking than having 2 cores with higher IPC
are intel shills this retarded?
>>52562865
>chrome which can efficiently use multiple threads
It only helps with many tabs. JavaScript code is inherently slow and mostly linear.
(Assuming your OS properly supports all the cores/threads)
Additional cores basically always help as long as there are more processes/threads than there are cores. Even foreground tasks that aren't multithreaded can benefit from more cores because they wont have to share a core with background task(s). It's basically equivalent to giving the foreground task greater priority over other tasks but at the same time those other tasks won't have to suffer a performance penalty.
>>52561431
Intel Celeron Masterrace reporting in, faggot.
PLZ DIE.
>>52561963
>They are obviously dogshit for very CPU intensive applications like HEVC encoding
wat
Threaded shit like this and x264/x265 are the few tasks where AMD is remotely competitive.
Singlethreaded and pretty much anything FPU-heavy is where Bulldozer crumbles to shit. Memory throughput isn't its greatest field either.
>>52561431
You should make a better CPU if you think it's no easy.
>>52563068
>celeron
>masterrace
Certified comedy gold
>>52561431
Why do weebs post shit anime wit questions they dont give a shit about, just to post anime? I get this is 4chan, but this is /g/, not your shitty little anime blog
>>52563435
I think you mean /a/
>>52563435(You)
>>52561431
>Why is AMD so good at making GPUs
They're not. Don't confuse being able to make a chip that can just barely sold above cost in a pricing scheme where Nvidia is making luxury margins as being "good."
Nvidia being able to achieve success with their large die strategy against AMD's small one was good. AMD ditching small die for large die and reinventing the housefire is not.
>>52563355
I usually don't agree with statements like that but I feel this is different. /g/ considers AMD "bad" because they failed to best a company 10x their size with like 100x their budget and complete access to their own manufacturing capabilities. AMD is a little company they don't have all of the best facilities and they're fighting chipzilla.
Are AMD processors really bad or Intel's just fucking ridiculously good?
>>52561431
my daughter chimo is so cute
>>52563650
Kill yourself
>>52561431
They're both decent. I'm not an expert, but i think some bad decisions and Intel doing the impossible to fuck them is what damaged AMD. Even when AMD chips were better, Intel still sold better (better marketing and some deals with machine builders (is that the name?)).
>>52562712
Your comparing server grade processors to consumer Facebook machines.
>>52563288
AMD isn't very competitive for prolonged CPU intensive tasks. It's not that they can't do it but they consume a significant amount of electricity.
i7 encoding HEVC/ray tracing for 8 hours a day for a year = ~$56 @ 16¢/kWh
fx-9590 encoding HEVC/ray tracing for 8 hours a day for a year = ~$140 @ 16¢/kWh
So the i7 is better in the long run because it will consume less electricity and save you money in the long run.
Of course this all means jack shit for those who only do like 1 or 2 cpu intensive sessions a month (which is most people).
However someone like me plans to stress the CPU often so I'm waiting to see how Zen turns out.
>>52561431
you misspelled *so good at baking
>>52563288
yes, well, if you oc'd an i7 to 4.7ghz..............
@ that price point........................
>>52561431
Why is Chino so cute?
>>52564219
Stay salty intel cuck, my a8 never goes past 60c
>>52564219
*nvidia cuck
>>52562628
but 40fps is crap.
>>52564451
UU
UU
I had just come from a shitty xbox 360 so I was easily impressed especially considering a fucking igpu is even able to go past 30fps at 1080p on a modern game.
I hear Zen is going balls out and including HBM on their APUs. Might upgrade to that instead for shits and giggles.
Has it already been long enough that people don't remember AMD bought ATI and their graphics card division is basically a separate company within? I mean nowadays i'm sure they're more integrated and share resources and all, but I'm inclined to believe that there's still a bit of independence over in that side of the company.
people in this thread talking like AMD always made radeons. makes me sick desu senpai.
>>52561946
my wife chino
>>52564252
because she's my daughter
>>52564575
>people in this thread talking like AMD always made radeons
I think people here remember ATI. The thing is ATI as an entity hasn't existed since 2006 when they were officially acquired.
AMD pretty much forced ATI to join up with their CPU division to work on APUs and they've been working close up until recently. Within the last few months AMD has given the GPU side their autonomy back and they formed the Radeon Technologies Group, a separate division with Raja Koduri as the head.
>>52564159
The 9590 is cherrypicking though, any 83XX is more efficient, not that it changes the tides for AMD or anything. :^)
>>52564243
U wot, you can get an 8320(E) near i3 price points. Most of them can easily go to 4 gigs with minor or even without voltage tweaking.
>>52564806
why are you so upset
>>52564806
if you wanted anime reaction images, you could just ask. baka anon
>>52564814
>>52564830
Weebs are a blight on society and should be chemically castrated
>>52564851
>>52564851
>>52562804
I wanted to buy a R9 280x for my mITX build but went with GTX 970 for efficiency reasons.
AMD has been behind in efficiency (power consumption / heat) for a few years now.
Such a shame as the 280x was $120 cheaper for me at the time, and 970 turned out to be overkill.
>>52564851
what did one of them f-cuk your mother or somethng? The hate is real with this one.
>>52564945
>inb4 3.5GB meme
Good on ya for making your own decisions Anon. Don't listen to the AMD/Nvidia shills on here.
I have a 780 Ti, and am quite happy with it even though it really is just a gimped 970 these days.
>>52564851
>chemically castrated
To what end? It's not like they're likely to reproduce.
>>52564575
I refer to all radeon products as AMD. Its been around 10 years since they were acquired by them.
>>52562628
I've got an r7 370... It's pretty deece.
>>52564996
True lol :^)
>>52564159
Actually, the 8320E seems pretty efficient:
http://www.anandtech.com/show/8864/amd-fx-8320e-cpu-review-the-other-95w-vishera/2
Of course your Haswell or Skymeme Quad is still more efficient, since it's faster, but considering the 8320's significantly cheaper price, it might not be a bad option - especially with some voltage tweaking/oc around stock voltage.
>>52565053
Actually the 8320e can still consume over 200 watts if you push it past ~4ghz and running it on lower frequencies means shitier performance.
Reason tripfag posted the 9590 was probably because that's as close as 4.0 ghz i7 performance as you're ever gonna get with AMD until Zen. Unless there are 8 core kaveri apus I'm unaware of.
>>52565188
>Actually the 8320e can still consume over 200 watts if you push it past ~4ghz
Did you even read my link properly? It didn't even push past 200w complete system power consumption until 4.2/4.3. Of course every sample is different, but that can go both ways.
I also mentioned voltage tweaking, as AMD chips are usually quite conservative with it. You can see the 8320E going to 3.7 with barely drawing more than stock, that is quite a leap to the 8350 already.
And we're talking about efficiency here, of course a 4790k or 6700k is going to beat it, but not by a huge amount - and significant overclocking increases power consumption regardless. The 8320e is 122$, a 4790K goes for 349, the 6700K for 399$. Even a 4690K goes for 226$ as of currently, and will suffer on performance from the lack of HTT in rendering tasks. The motherboard needed is also likely to be more expensive (Z-Chipset required) Well, we have BCLK OC on Skymeme so you could technically go with a 6400, but it deactivates C-states and is still more expensive :^)
It's definitely a poorfag alternative.
>>52562741
>Gamers don't game on Pentiums
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JxUPJdcChzE
>>52565357
Correction, many H and B boards on Haswell feature overclocking as well. There goes my board pricing argument, at least :^)
>>52561963
AMD makes very shit CPUs.
If you wanna get decent performence you need to OC the fuck out of it. To do that you need good motherboard and good cooling. At that point you might as well get an i5, so even for the price it's shit
>>52562124
Hopefully? Zen might compete with Sandy Bridge, but Zen is gonna flop hard.
>>52565587
>I need an i5 to watch cat videos and use microsoft word
k
>>52562741
They literally are shit. You could get a Pentium or 860k with a 750 ti for almost the price of a A10 apu
>>52561431
AMD is good at making APUs too you dumb animeposter
>>52565603
*haswell
An excavator CPU has ~10% better IPC compared to steamroller (aka kaveri). So at ~4.2 GHz a quad-core excavator CPU would match i5-2500k (3.3-3.7 GHz) performance.
Now give it 40% better ipc and you have zen. So zen will have at minimum haswell performance if we actually get the 40% better ipc (might be more like 30% though which would still be enough to btfo jewtel).
>Intel CPU
http://pcpartpicker.com/p/VdzGyc
>AMD CPU
http://pcpartpicker.com/p/RzdyjX
We already know which one is better.
>>52564262
Stay salty amd cuck, my 3470 never goes past 30c
>>52564262
i've never seen my 8350 go past 56C under load.
>>52565811
Clocks and voltages?
>>52564511
>I hear Zen is going balls out and including HBM on their APUs
CPUs have been more memory bottlenecked as time goes on. They simply hide it. Most of the time, the CPU sits idle. It can cost 400 or more cycles to get items from memory. This is why CPUs have a L1/L2 and L3 cache. The cpu "guesses" what will be needed next, and calls into memory to "cache" that data. If it guesses wrong, and it often does thanks to poorly optimized programs, then it has to sit and wait for those 400 cycles for the next bit of memory.
The CPU hides this partly by being so fast, and partly by doing more than one thing at once, in addition to hyperthreading. It basically computes multiple paths of a program, and hopes that it actually did work that will be used.
If HBM is used as a replacement to for say L3 cache, say 1GB, the CPU would need to redesign its memory retreival logic to account for it to see the most benefit, but it could average out as a net benefit. If it were used in addition to L3, the only changes would be interconnects.
It could also be used in place of system memory, but this would be the end of modular, upgradable systems.
I already dislike the fact that memory is so high priced, and it shouldn't be.
I can buy a computer for my pocket with 4GB of memory for $200. Why are most cheap systems still shipping with 4GB, 8GB if you are lucky? And 16GB is $100? Since we are clearly making more memory than ever before, and cost to produce should go down with such scale, why are those prices so high?
Speaking of price, how much more expensive will this memory be to produce, with the lower clock speed requirements, it should lower the price, but the new form factor will raise it until it is mass produced.
>>52565835
Stock.
>>52562741
>Pentium
>much faster
>every day scenario
>>>/v/
>>52565587
>Implying you need an i5 outside of gaymen and workstation tasks.
And most games would even run playable on something like an 860k. The reason why you'd still choose a Pentium is muh single threds (If you're into ArmA and dedcraft) and an upgrade path.
>>52565603
>I make randumb assumptions with one-liners
You can fuck off to >>>/v/ or wherever you came from just like that other faggot
>>52565633
>Pentium or 860k with a 750 ti for almost the price of a A10 apu
It's not that bad, but you're indeed generally better with a separate CPU+GPU solution, even if it costs somewhat more. The A8-7600 is some good poorfag chip though.
>>52561431
Wish they were good at making drivers
>>52565838
Family member, HBM is meant to serve as vRAM for the igpus onboard the zen apus. They will still use ddr4 for system ram.
>there are people who buy kikeware
>>52565894
>tfw you can overclock an A8-7600 through the base clock
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O_bKDyzPYNk
>>52565838
>HBM
>Replacement for L3
What the fuck are you smoking? It's clearly for their integrated graphics, which have been bottlenecked even since Llano by DDR3. Quad-Channel DDR4 can help, but will require four modules with adequate speeds, which can add up to the price point. Now, HBM will do that too, but gives even higher bandwidth speeds, eventually enable AMD to throw in some integrated middle-class GPU solution in one package for minimal form-factor builds. Cooling can be dealt with liquid.
Actually amd isnt as bad as some people think.
Sure there are badly coded applications that only benefit from single threaded speed. But a large ammount of real world usage shows otherwise.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SMW0w30HyeU
>>52565988
What is it with you weaboos and forcing miku to do covers of all these shitty songs? Leave her alone, her voice is only meant for original songs tuned specifically to make her sound good.
I bet there's some degenerate weaboo out there making miku do a cover of lil wayne songs.
>>52561456
>meme
The only house fire is nvidia
>>52566349
>Tell Your World
>cover
wat
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f3vLVlTfAaw
>>52566349
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AALu3cSVzfg
Thanks for making me find this
>>52564806
:^)
