I think Ubuntu and Linux are terrible. I know that opinion makes me a noob at computers, as having any distaste toward Linux makes me of low intelligence according to every post I've ever seen where someone says something negative about Linux. First thing I don't like are random things just not working. I ran an application, decided I would use it again 'lock to launcher'. Cool it works. Later I get a new version of the application, and unlock the old one, run the new one, right click, and lock to launcher. The average noob would think this would lock it to the launcher permanently, as it had in the past with other apps, and the older version of the same app. But every time I restart Ubuntu I have to relock it because the old version of the application is there. I know, I know, I'm a Windows peasant, and obviously I should know that I should hop back into DOS, excuse me, bash, and just type sudo -myApp -342 #$, aD#$ @ --aa @3 4, and I would know that if I wasn't so content with being a casual user that I don't mind spending more time learning esoteric commands for a primitive text based interface than actually using my computer.
contd below
Other great things about Linux, excuse me, Ubuntu (I didn't mean to diss the other 5,598 flavors I haven't tried yet) are asinine ui decisions, like the weird scroll bar for windows that appears off to the right side to save space or something, and the menu items being at the top of the screen, a la osx, instead of at the top of the window I'm actually working on. Nothing like pointless mouse movement for productivity. Very cool how a window full of files, it will display the number of selected files over some of the files so it's in the way and I can't see the file there unless I hover over that text. It's only one of endless minor inconveniences, I know, so it's a good thing that minor inconveniences don't add up. I also like things like getting stuck in a login loop, where the solution is (and honestly, if I hadn't seen this, my exaggerated solution making fun of Linux would not have been nearly as ridiculous as the actual solution):
--------------------------------------------------------------------
Press Ctrl+Alt+F3 and login into the shell.
Now run ls -lah. If in the output the line
-rw------- 1 root root 53 Nov 29 10:19 .Xauthority
then you need to do chown username:username .Xauthority and try logging in.
Else, do ls -ld /tmp. Check for the first 10 letters in the left: they should read exactly so: drwxrwxrwt.
drwxrwxrwt 15 root root 4096 Nov 30 04:17 /tmp
Else, you need to do sudo chmod a+wt /tmp and check again.
If not both, I'd recommend you either
dpkg-reconfigure lightdm
or uninstall, reinstall it.
Now press Alt+-> until you reach the login screen again, and restart.
--------------------------------------------------------------------
Of course!! Why didn't I think of that? God, I'm such a computing noob for not just intuiting that. Keep in mind, all I did to receive this punishment was double clicking the same application that had just opened normally a few minutes earlier.
contd below
tl;dr
The best thing though, is how there's 9 trillion different flavors of Linux, and every single one of them has different issues, so when by some miracle you actually find a program that's made for Linux, you get to not only look up what obligatory sudo commands you'll be typing to get your inevitable problem fixed, but you have to find the one's specific to Gnome Hydra edition 36.b PopTart desktop revision 4Blueberry.
The other thing is the fantastic community. I know amongst insiders who have pledged their fealty to House Torvald, you guys are all friendly and nice and helpful to eachother, but god forbid someone ask 'isn't there a gui for this?', because then you've revealed what a true piece of human garbage you are, and prepare for the backlash. I do actually understand under certain circumstances, like running a lot of servers where price could be a factor, or if you want to trade in having an OS actually worth writing viruses for safety from viruses, but when Linux users act all dumbfounded when someone prefers Windows, or are silly enough to actually diss Windows and it's users, it's laughable. Is it really so terrible and noobish that some people prefer the convenience of a modern operating system where basic boilerplate functionality works out of the box every time for 99% of everything? Is it really so simple-minded to not want to go to a command prompt for almost every friggin thing you ever want to do? On Windows, aside from the UI making Ubuntu look like a toy, everything works beautifully, there's so many more applications and games it's not even comparable. And they are real applications, not Joe Schmoe's Special Linux Picture Editor. If you've never been off of Linux you might not know it, but those large corporations, full of well trained and well paid employees, man oh man they make better applications than the free stuff.
contd below
>>51564633
You're complaining about Unity which is completely unrelated to linux itself.
Though I suppose if you're not a fan of modern, well-designed, user interfaces that are pleasing to the eye (probably not if you prefer Ubuntu), then I guess there's nothing of interest there. I'm all for the free and open spirit (though most free apps are also available on Windows, and look and run better there), and I don't disparage anyone who uses Linux out of principle, it's just the notion that Linux is somehow a better experience. It's like if need a forklift for work, yes a modern luxury car can't compare to it, and can't even perform those functions, but I'm not going to pretend I enjoy driving it more than a Tesla, or call people vehicle noobs for preferring an actual automobile designed with the driver's experience in mind for every day use.
You barely ever have to go into a command prompt in Windows - never if you're not a developer of some kind. And even then, as a developer, the experience there is better as well. Only if someone is developing for Linux or using something that was simply not available on Windows can I really fathom someone bothering with Linux. I know the typical Linux user bologna is that somehow text has this magical power to allow greater flexibility than a gui. First off, no, it doesn't. If someone bothered to make a gui for anything in Linux, you'd realize that gui's can be more powerful than text - you can even have a gui that provides common functionality, and allows you to switch to command or script mode for some special functionality, or cases where you want to script a complex series of highly specified options and actions. Secondly, I'm not talking about setting up a cluster of servers, and set all of their permissions, and install software on each.
contd below
Any time there's an issue with anything, which there is always an issue with everything, the solution is the command line. Half the programs I've used lack basic features that would be a checkbox or slider on Windows or even OSX, but when you look up how to do it on Linux, of course it's a command line option.
It's no wonder that a free OS can't even capture a percent of the market share from 2 OS's that cost upwards of $100 and even more in the past. As long as the community keeps celebrating using an ancient and outdated text based interface for everything, and championing it like it's god's gift to functionality, and as long as they continue to demonize people who enjoy performing simple tasks without having to learn a list of commands each time, it will continue to be so rock-bottom in userbase size that it remains firmly rock-bottom in software library size.
>>51564665 so none of these issues are on other versions of linux? or gnu, or whatever the hell it's called?
>>51564665
>actually reading it
kek
>>51564633
let's wrap up this blog post, OP. The fact that you couldn't fit your angry rant in one post should be a clue.
>>51564633
I'd just like to interject for a moment. What you're refering to as Linux, is in fact, GNU/Linux, or as I've recently taken to calling it, GNU plus Linux. Linux is not an operating system unto itself, but rather another free component of a fully functioning GNU system made useful by the GNU corelibs, shell utilities and vital system components comprising a full OS as defined by POSIX.
Many computer users run a modified version of the GNU system every day, without realizing it. Through a peculiar turn of events, the version of GNU which is widely used today is often called "Linux", and many of its users are not aware that it is basically the GNU system, developed by the GNU Project.
There really is a Linux, and these people are using it, but it is just a part of the system they use. Linux is the kernel: the program in the system that allocates the machine's resources to the other programs that you run. The kernel is an essential part of an operating system, but useless by itself; it can only function in the context of a complete operating system. Linux is normally used in combination with the GNU operating system: the whole system is basically GNU with Linux added, or GNU/Linux. All the so-called "Linux" distributions are really distributions of GNU/Linux.
>>51564708
Well, I dislike the entire collection of crap that GNU/Linux users brag about like it's the second coming to the point where anyone who prefers anything else is a noob, and to which the response to any question that begins with 'why' or 'how' results in an answer beginning with 'sudo' and ending with 'lazy' and 'casual'
>>51564707
a clue of how much there is to complain about with gnu?
>>51564697
I can't speak specifically to whatever weird docking issue you seem to have, but you need to understand that the "GUI" is separate from linux itself which is just the kernel. There are different window managers which you can use that offer difference experiences. Some might not even have docks at all.
One thing I will say is it really sounds like linux is NOT for you. It's not for everyone. You hate going into the shell, and it doesn't sound like you really understand (or want to understand) the underlying principles of how your operating system is working. There are distros that cater to people like yourself. Ubuntu is probably the most popular one.
Theres nothing wrong with not liking linux. I definitely don't expect someone who is non-technical to have to use a terminal to get things done. That is pretty unrealistic.
The linux community encompasses a very large swath of people who all have different interests, so trying to paint them all with the same brush doesn't work very well. Some don't care about the desktop experience or usability at all. Most of the internet is powered by linux servers, so in those cases there isn't even a GUI to boot into. Some people use linux on their phones (Android), other people start companies around their distros (Canonical).
I'm sorry to hear your experience has been frustrating. Maybe you should try to ask yourself why exactly you want to use linux in the first place ? You don't like the nitty gritty stuff, you don't mind paying money, you aren't a developer, and silky smooth user experience is really important to you. So I'm having trouble trying to understand what you expect to gain out of using linux.
>>51564633
You're right that you have low intelligence, but when your better with computers one day you'll look back on this post and laugh.
But yes, you're a noob using ubuntu, try arch and learn, if thats too much for you, stay stupid.
>>51564697
>so none of these issues are on other versions of linux? or gnu, or whatever the hell it's called?
Anything GUI related is dependent on the distro if we're talking right out of the box. There are many DEs out there. Some better than others. Also Linux is very DIY so if you don't want to invest in it, don't bother.
I must be a pussy master since the latest intel driver freezes up my shit every 15 minutes.
>>51564771
great, so I finally rant about it and I get the one linux user who's open to the opinions of an outsider. I don't consider myself a casual user. I develop software, and I'm definitely a few notches above the average user on Windows. I understand that it has uses as you mentioned for servers, and I know Android and some console OS's have been running Linux.
The point isn't necessarily that Linux and it's various distros are useless, or garbage, it's that its users invariably act like it's a superior experience somehow to other OS's, when that's completely incomprehensible to users of actual good OS's.
Also:
>>51564803
>>51564707
>>51564665
>>51564658
is pretty much the reaction I've seen to simple inquiries from people who are used to full OS's when someone asks 'there's no gui for this?', or 'why does everything need a command line tool'
when it seems like a valid question, and usually not phrased in rant form.
>>51564633
>>primitive text based interface
You actually know zero about computers, you just called literally every processor in the world primitive, unless you think they process rainbows from the UI into more rainbows?
If you don't WANT to learn about computers then just don't.
>>51564633
dude, when you update to a new version of something, the old version goes away/gets superceded, so basically you're a dumbass who never launched it from the dock because you were expecting an updated icon
>>51564860
and why would their acts of superiority would bother you? you should work on that inferiority complex and obvious massive insecurities m8, a shrink could help you with all that.
>>51564677
>> "You barely ever go into the command prompt on windows"
No, YOU barely ever go into the command prompt on windows, because YOU are not interested in learning. Why are you wasting your time here.
ITT op tries linux but expects windows 2.0/is unwilling to learn a different way of doing things. I used to be like you op till I accepted that linux was different and I'd have to relearn how to do stuff differently
>>51564902
Actually I went and found it in it's folder, and once it was launched and I verified the version, I chose to lock the currently running version to the dock.
>>51564904
their superiority complexes don't bother me, I'm just curious if there's actually something I'm missing here beyond some weird fanboyism, and pride in learning something most people didn't bother to learn
>>51564929
That's correct, I've done the most of the same, development, installation, packaging, and compression tasks on Windows, Mac, and Ubuntu, and only in Ubuntu did it feel like I was back to the DOS days
>>51564957
>most people didn't bother to learn
but bruh most people are idiots, why would you use idiots for your standard?
>>51564980
meh, once you get used to it, it's pretty comfy, just stop expecting it to be like windows
>>51564860
>claims to be a developer
>can't read documentation
Like any new thing, learning how to use linux on the desktop (even though most of your complains were over the GUI) takes time. Don't quit after having separate small issues, or maybe switch GUIs. Cinnamon, for instance, is more like the default windows desktop.
>>51564860
Linux and UNIX in general exist with the power user in mind, by this i mean they expect the user to know the commands syntax and be familiar with the way the Os works, Windows on the other hand was created with the home user in mind, that's why it's GUI based, they have different design choices, and ot comes with advantages and disadvantages, by example you can automate and script complex tasks with command line based software, and with a GUI you can get competent in minutes.
It comes to practice and nothing more, i really can't see myself using Windows outside a VM, because how used to Linux(Ubuntu) i am,, and the bigger problem right know is the amount of autist and idiosts who call themselves experts throwing commands on forums becasue they think they know what they are doing.
>>51564929
>>51565010
I am interested in learning. Learning how to create art, program applications and video games, how to port things to work on gpu and multiple cores, and write more efficient code.
Those are all interesting and cool to me, and they are things that feel like I should need to open a book to learn them. I don't see why I should have to 'learn' how to do simple tasks like install programs, and have them run afterward, or unpack files, or just take my default installation to a useable state.
I mean if one out of every 1.1 linux users is a developer and a computer mastermind, why the hell aren't more things automated by now, and why are users so disdainful of the idea of simple convenience.
>>51564860
If you're a developer then I'm surprised you don't generally find linux more sane.
Do you build things close to your operating system, or are you some number of layers abstracted from how things like scheduling, IPC, networking, system calls work ?
I've met developers who preferred windows, but never met any who could admit it was easier to reason about.
>>51565068
because "automation" unless set up custom by the user is a hacky one size fits all sort of thing, yeah it's good for most folk, but most folk don't use and aren't the target audience of linux
>>51565084
he's not a dev, he's a sprite maker
>>51565084
Number of layers abstracted, using something like MFC, Qt, Unreal Engine, etc.
>>51565109
Typical Linux user condescension aside, that actually makes sense. That sounds rational. Maybe it's just been dumb luck, but I've seen my same rant at various lengths across the range of super civil to super angry, and the response from gnu/linux users seems to imply that gnu is superior as an every day operating system, or that Windows is somehow broken in that same sense.
Good thread, would read again
>>51564633
>I didn't like this one thing in this one dock in this one DE
>somehow all distros suck
Just wow, OP. By the way this isn't true in Fedora using the gnome dock (dash?) and Fedora updates more times a week than ubuntu a month. Also your entire problem seems dumb, I could try unity to reproduce it, but I'm going to go ahead and say you're a moron who just installed the older version using a script instead of updating through a package manager which would have deleted the old version.
>>51565193
I wouldn't say it's superior, but once you learn it, it's comfy and faster to do specific things
The way I see it, if I'm going to be using a computer daily, for years...decades even, why the hell would beginner-friendliness be important? I want to be efficient in the long term, I don't mind taking a few minutes or hours figuring out something new that will ultimately *save* me time and effort, even if it doesn't seem like it due to the up front cost.
>>51565204
Fine, I'm a moron among many. On Windows, and even Mac, which I consider horrendous, I wouldn't have had to do any research for something as simple as installing something. The specific thing I was installing was Qt Creator, and on both Windows and Mac I was able to have both installed, and delete the old one later. It's not some custom specialized thing I wanted. Installing something is a basic task, like opening a Window. Both Windows and Mac let me go to the command line, and install it in a specific way, or I can recompile the whole thing if I really need it to work in a specific way. I installed the default installation on all 3, and was able to use the new version on all 3. I don't need tech support for this issue, so don't bother trying to reproduce it, but I checked to make sure the currently running version was the new one, and right clicked lock to launcher. Working under the assumption I am a moron doing something dumb, should I not have assumed that 'lock to launcher' would lock the program represented by the icon I clicked on to 'lock to launcher'?
>>51565212
Thanks. That I can believe.
>>51564641
I despise ubuntu too. Not for the same reasons because I'd just fix that, but I really, really dislike ubuntu and would rather use Windows 10 ANY day of the week over it. And that's coming from a full time arch user.
That said your xauthority problem can be solved by simply hopping into terminal and doing "chmod u+rw ~/.Xauthority"
>>51565283
It isn't beginner friendliness, but just don't you ever one day want a specific application for a specific thing, and just want to install it by double clicking and be done with it? how is it faster to type in commands all the time?
>>51565317
I fixed the problem with a hard restart. It's just the fact that it happened for no discernible reason, and the fact that such a complex and idiosyncratic solution (accepted by many users as correct) would exist for a problem that should never take place (or maybe linux users will explain to me that I'm dumb and I just don't understand how useful a login loop can be)
>>51564677
>I know the typical Linux user bologna is that somehow text has this magical power to allow greater flexibility than a gui. First off, no, it doesn't. If someone bothered to make a gui for anything in Linux, you'd realize that gui's can be more powerful than text
Retard, text allows infinite combinations of options for an execution. You can't have infinite checkboxes in a gui. Go ahead and write me a gui for pattern matching, for example. You'd just end up putting a window and 2 buttos around a text terminal.
>>51565303
Nigga ubuntu has a fucking GUI for installing software and it updates it automatically since the 80s which your beloved windows in 2015 doesn't.
Again, if you had this problem, we both know it was a script installation, so don't blame Linux because it would have been the exact same problem on Mac and Windows.
>>51565375
it's unequivocally faster for me to type something like "pacman -S program"
vs
google the program name, find the right website, look for the download link (in some cases you have to pick the right version from multiple choices), download the exe, double click the exe, then click next next next next (in some cases you have to watch closely or the installation wizard will install some shitty malware toolbar or something)
>>51565375
> it happened for no discernible reason
your login manager messed up hence someone telling you to reinstall ldxe or whatever the heck they call it.
exactly why everyone reacts with a sort of "ehhhhh" whenever a newer user asks why they cant just use a GUI version of something.
To break it down for you, X is the backend and the current standard for GUI framework. It doesnt actually draw shit on the screen, your window manager bundled with Unity (specific to Ubuntu only) does that for you, but it runs off of X. X has a file called Xauthority, and when your login manager takes care of logging in for you, it often messes up permissions as it has to run as root instead of using normal permissions a terminal login would use.
Personally I start my computer by logging in through the CLI, then starting X by running startx ~/.xinitrc awesome, which tells it to read my xinit rc file and start awesome window manager off of X. I alias that to simply "sx". That way all it is, is login to my pc and type sx.
That prevents any issue of GUIs fucking up my permissions and puts things in my hands, since I wrote half the shit in xinitrc.
You're using a terminal based OS, for terminal users. Of course things are complicated, that's how it's supposed to be. Market share doesnt matter, #freedoms matter
>>51565402
as I said up there. Most tasks I've had to go to the command line for have a basic default action most users would want or need. I can verify this because when I go to look up the answer, there are thousands of google results asking the same questions.
These things should be in a gui, as well as any common options. is that really such an evil idea? There are plenty of windows gui apps that also have a command line option.
>>51565453
I always find it funny how 'You're such a noob if you don't get Linux' people say they have issues on Windows and how it's riddled with malware. You've got a be a super noob to get malware on Windows, and I never have any issues. Not because of any expertise, but because if you're just trying to do basic things, there's nothing special you need to do beyond selecting options.
>>51565480
Fair enough.
>>51565480
> startx ~/.xinitrc awesome
doesn't startx run xinitrc already without specifying that? and then you can just put "exec awesome" inside the xinitrc, then you only have to type "startx"
>>51565523
Ok tell me one simple task you do in a terminal that you feel would be best accomplished by using a GUI. Honest question.
>>51565523
> You've got a be a super noob to get malware on Windows, and I never have any issues.
Windows IS malware. It's impossible to run Windows without malware.
>>51565535
I run multiple window managers.
Startx takes its first argument as an RC file. So when you want to start a different window manger from your default, you have to type out "startx ~/.xinitrc openbox". I alias "startx ~/.xinitrc" to sx, and then use a case system with a default of awesome wm. So when I type sx, it runs through xinitrc, sees no argument and defaults to awesome. If it sees an argument it matches it and tries to run that wm.
You can see the code here
https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/Xinitrc#Making_a_DE.2FWM_choice
>>51564641
Nothing inside your home directory should be owned by root. You shouldn't have to chmod directories in /. Ubuntu maintainers are incompetent. Mint isn't any better. I always recommend Debian, but people lose their shit when they have to edit a text file to install closed source drivers.
>>51565556
seconding this, I'm curious as to what you're doing that has no gui option, if it's ricing then stop bitching and gitgud, if it's a legit task, I can probably point you to a gui for it
>>51565523
> >>51565055
As i said before different design choices, and it's really strange that you want a gui to install software sin Ubuntu and similar distros have that, simply double click a .deb and it installs the software you need, on the other hand if you download a .run file that is not integrated into the system, therefore the icon mess you had,
>>>51565453 (You)
>I always find it funny how 'You're such a noob if you don't get Linux' people say they have issues on Windows and how it's riddled with malware. You've got a be a super noob to get malware on Windows, and I never have any issues. Not because of any expertise, but because if you're just trying to do basic things, there's nothing special you need to do beyond selecting options
I didn't mention malware, I just think you're stupid for using a script to install 2 versions of the same program instead of clicking the update button on the Ubuntu graphical software store, and then somehow blame the Linux kernel.
Honestly, installing stuff on Linux is waaay easier than on windows. It's not even a fair comparison.
Install Gentoo
>>51565576
Oh ok, that's interesting. Never thought about that because I just stick with the one I like.
>>51565651
yeah im a ricer faggot so I cant make my mind up about it
>>51564633
>>51564641
>>51564663
>>51564677
>>51564697
Install gentoo faggot
Also didn't read those at all I hope I don't offend you
Linux is for losers or for servers.
>>51564633
Literally everything about this is about unity and nothing to do with Linux
GET A LOAD OF THIS GAYMER
Whatever dude.
Linux is not for you, evidently.
Also, these are all issues with Unity, which is universally reviled. Blame Canonical. You'd be better off using Cinammon, since you're an ex-Windows patient. Distro hop if you still have some hope left in you.
>>51565559
Fact
>>51565705
>>51565751
>Freetards in full damage control
I mean there is only way to call someone who is using a tool he doesn't have any idea of how it works and when it backfires instead of do proper research he complains, At least dumb kids who shoot themselves in the face are removed from the gene pool.
>>51565856
>damage control
m8 all of his complaints are about the unity UI and not about linux itself
like shit dude I hate unity with a passion too but that doesnt reflect any other distro, his thread should have been about how trash ubuntu is of a distro. The rest of his complaints are about having to use a CLI, which is exactly what you sign up for by using linux; a (largely) terminal based OS. Whether its a good thing in itself or not, there's no reason to install an OS that isn't suited for your wants and needs from your computer just so you can complain about it.
>>51565556
basically when I install almost anything there's a library issue of some sort, and the solution is always in the command line. when I first opened ubuntu I wanted to disable alt click, so I was instructed to go to the command line to install dconf-tools, and made the mistake of removing the shortcut for mousemodifier, which made all actions move windows (which no sane person would ever want to do, and any sane OS would prevent you from doing so easily by accident (I know, I'm a moron, but my searches reveal I'm far from the only moron)) by giving a simple warning, or specifying somehow what was about to happen for such a non-intuitive result. And again, the solution was in the command line. I can't think of others at the moment, which makes my whole argument sound pretty invalid I realize, but I only opened ubuntu again recently for the first time, and I only remember the emotions from my nightmares, but not the specifics at the moment.
>>51565559
taha...so clever
>>51565614
that's helpful. I guess that's another one of my issues. I never found an 'everything you need to know about Linux' guide because I was usually in and out trying to escape as soon as possible. And it seems like every time I looked anything up there was a trillion different ways to do it. When looking for software, some places would suggest a download link, others a command line command, and then the .run thing you mentioned as well. To a newcomer it seems like a ridiculous fragmented mess, with an endless number of things to learn.
>>51565622
>installing stuff on Linux is waaay easier than on windows
these are the types of statements that baffle me
>I didn't mention malware
it gets mentioned plenty by others
>I just think you're stupid for using a script to install 2 versions of the same program
I just think you're stupid for not getting how the whole gui for the os breaks down because I installed two things. Isn't it supposed to be free and versatile?
>>51565856
Can you type like a non retard please? I read that first part 4 times.. idgi
>>51565751
>Freetards in full damage control
>implying I give the most remote of shits that some webdev doesn't like ubuntu while my comfy Fedora 22 thinkpad runs perfectly
>>51564633
You are of low intelligence.
>>51565807
>Also, these are all issues with Unity, which is universally reviled. Blame Canonical. You'd be better off using Cinammon
hmmm. I heard when switching to Linux, Ubuntu was the most friendly, then I hear that Mint is better, then Strawberry Jubilee Supreme, you're saying Cinammon, and i'm sure two url's down someone hates Cinammon, and thinks that BunniBunni HopHop rev2 is better. This bullshit which no one can seem to agree on is part of why linux seems so shitty to idiots like me. Who the fuck wants to spend 8 years of their life bouncing from shitty window manager to shitty window manager? Can't any of them just be good enough that people can agree one of em is good?
>>51565942
Of course a newcomer will have trouble doing so, but bear in mind, many of us grew up with Windows, we know how it works, but remember how many times we fucked up the family computer ot the school's one, eventually you know what you are doing, same with Linux, i've been using Ubuntu for 5 years and i really find it easier, maybe it has a bigger learning curve but once you get used to it it's great and simple.
>>51565942
>baffles me
Why? On windows you need a fucking browser to search online for an installer, find a non-shit source, download it, say no to 10 different adwares and hope it doesn't install it anyway (before you say no, utorrent installed bitcoin miners without the user's permission) and repeat this for every update.
On linux I run sudo yum install opisafaggot.
Please explain how windows is better at this, I'm dying to hear it.
So we went from "I have to repin this icon, ugh" to "the gui breaks down". Whatever, stay on windows.
>>51566029
I don't think you fully understand the concept of DEs, distros and WMs. I'll break it down for you though.
Linux is the kernel, which all distros run. Distros are all developed largely independently by other people.
One day a company (redhat) sat down and decided they'd make a distro that is relatively stable, and intended for anyone between medium to advanced users. They also want bleeding edge packages and speeeed. Fedora was born.
Other dudes, seperate to this, said they want a distro that is intended for super easy use, based off of debian but EVEN easier, with a GUI package manager (synaptic) and a release cycle that is simple, extremely stable and uses the best version of packages they think work for other users. It should be enough so a child could use it. Ubuntu was born.
Forks of these happened as well, as Ubuntu is a fork of Debian, inteded for extreme stability and moderate ease of use; opposite of bleeding edge but similar to fedora in functionality ootb.
Arch was designed to be bleeding edge, subjective stablity and hard to use. Nothing setup for you, all DIY. They were sick of having shit done for them.
Fedora and arch users mock ubuntu for being baby tier and stupid. Ubuntu and fedora users mock arch for being unstable and never working. Arch and ubuntu users mock fedora for having a stupid name.
And much, much, MUCH more.
>>51566029
People generally agree that Ubuntu is shit.
There's only around 20 viable window managers.
Install Linux Mint Cinammon or XFCE or go back to Windows.
>>51566107
Thanks for the breakdown. This is all starting to make more sense to me now. What once seemed like an endless maelstrom of disjointed bullshit, is now starting to come together, just a little bit.
>>51566108
Is there a consensus with anyone else here that Cinammon is good?
And lastly to all you good folks, if I want to develop something on Linux that works on the most popular flavors, what is it exactly that I need to learn? I've attempted to work on little things here and there, and the inevitable result is that I either try to bundle something that makes it work for some people, but breaks it for others, and when they remove those libraries it works for them. Or I need to have a set of instructions for them to install certain packages. I don't expect any of you to teach me, but I haven't been able to figure out what it is I'm supposed to be learning, like what should I be searching for on google to find these answers. What's the name of the subject for distributing all inclusive packages if I want to avoid using package managers? Is it even possible to have a directory with needed libraries that will work on almost any distribution, or is that a lost cause?
as far as i can tell these are mostly ubuntu-specific issues. linux is just a kernel. it's not a complete operating system. if you were to say ubuntu is crap most people would agree with you
also, the reason that experienced windows users don't use a CLI is because the CLI on windows is awful. if it was as good as bash they'd use it all the time
>>51566304
http://www.sj-vs.net/creating-a-simple-debian-deb-package-based-on-a-directory-structure/
If you don't want to use packages then just create a .zip or .tar with the program and libraries and there you have it, but you are better creating a PPA so you can submit updates to your software.
>>51566540
thanks, I will take a look
In conclusion all, my wrists hurt from typing exacerbating a shoulder injury from long ago.
and you've actually convinced me that it is worth learning, and that there are some sane linux users who can admit that it's not a refined streamlined experience for general purpose.
And those same sane people have convinced me that once learned, it can not suck as well.
thanks all. it's been fun. I'll still read replies if they come, especially suggestions on what to read up on, but I've got to stop typing for now
see yall
>>51564633
that pic makes no sense
i use os x and get laid all the time
>>51566107
You only broke down the concept of distros, not DEs or WMs
>>51567052
hurrr durrr ur ur le g4y xDDDD
>>51566304
>And lastly to all you good folks, if I want to develop something on Linux that works on the most popular flavors, what is it exactly that I need to learn? I've attempted to work on little things here and there, and the inevitable result is that I either try to bundle something that makes it work for some people, but breaks it for others, and when they remove those libraries it works for them. Or I need to have a set of instructions for them to install certain packages. I don't expect any of you to teach me, but I haven't been able to figure out what it is I'm supposed to be learning, like what should I be searching for on google to find these answers. What's the name of the subject for distributing all inclusive packages if I want to avoid using package managers? Is it even possible to have a directory with needed libraries that will work on almost any distribution, or is that a lost cause?
I don't use a desktop environment, but if I did it'd probably be cinnamon or xfce. For what it's worth.
>>51567171
yeah it was kind of a wall of text by that point and got across the main point that linux isnt so chaotic when you understand distros
>>51567190
Why'd you quote the whole damn thing so you could say a sentence
>>51567212
That was an accident, sorry. I was only replying to >Is there a consensus with anyone else here that Cinammon is good?
>>51566687
Just started using cinnamon on one of my machines this evening. It is okay. If you like windows start menu, it is similar enough you will feel at home, and it is pretty well organized out of the box.
Also, go check out the FLT general. It seems to be helpful for newcomers.
P.S. your first few posts make you sound like a condescending pretentious ass/ borderline troll. People will tend to be more apprehensive when replying due to this, and even more so with as much comparisons to windows as you are making. ALL in all, good luck to you, faggot. Welcome to freedom.
>>51566304
Linux Mint Cinnamon is a good choice for newcomers, you won't be lost coming from windows.
If you' re planning to dev, I've got good echoes from friends about qt (for gui)
Globally the issue for newcomers is that they expect it to be windows, and complain after the first issues they've got, forgetting they've probably used windows for 10+ year and got issues too during this time. More than, linux expect users to understand what they're doing, seems like you learned it the hard way.
The first thing you need to learn is how to use your package manager, .bin/.run/.deb will break something over the time. If something you need isn't in your package manager, look for it in users ppa, so you won't need to update manually, and take the risk to broke something until you've some experience.
>sudo -myApp -342 #$, aD#$ @ --aa @3 4
this is what winfags actually believe
>>51566304
>I want to avoid using package managers
Don't be a fucking idiot. You are new to this OS, and not a special snowflake. Package management is one of the greatest reasons to use Linux. Being this new and trying to avoid using a package manager is flatout retarded.
>>51565317
>Not for the same reasons because I'd just fix that
>but I really, really dislike ubuntu
>would rather use Windows 10 ANY day of the week
>And that's coming from a full time arch user.
Holy shit i couldn't up the aspergers in this post if I tried.
