I'm going to be building a 20ft by 30ft rancher this summer to be a bachelor pad and I'm thinking about use ICF for the walls.
Is the saving on heating worth the initial costs? I also hear doing electrical in it is easy. Also how sound proof is it?
Anyone have any experience with this? It's hard to find unbiased views on the stuff.
>>983239
That or standard block. Doing siding on some spray on finish on the exterior. I think the raw look in the inside would be awesome, especially for a bachelor pad.
As far as heating, it will take some years to recoup the initial ROI. Just like buying an L.E.D light bulb.
You could probably go standard cinder with poured concrete.
http://www.icfhomes.com/DYKpages/dykTRUTHmyth6.htm
Good luck bro
>>983239
knew a man and woman that built a home with it, its good for a "modern home", meaning if you want a passive heating/cooling system, yes its worth it. if you know how to use a wood burning fireplace/stove and/or thermostat properly, i would say no.
where are you building this place?
>>983246
Building on west coast, southern Canada, so a heat exchange would be what I would put in it. Hopefully that would be enough.
>>983243
When you say raw look for the interior what do you mean? Painting on the foam??
what kind of insulation would be good for a CMU walled house?
What do you guys think of stucco over CMU for interior?
>>983261
I don't know why you'd ever want stucco walls for interior......
>>983266
I like how it looks, but I could also be retarded
>>983270
Have you felt it and seen in in real life its not a pleasant thing, but if you really like how it looks i suppose.
>>983253
The foam is in between, so it would be concrete on interior and exterior side.
The foam is sandwiched between the concrete. I think you are mistaken of the ICF construction.
>>983266
Stud and frame. But you can have hollowed walls since the ICF will be the insulator. Be easy to run duct, electrical, etc and have a finished look.
>>983239
>ICF
>EPS on the inside
like selling crap to retarded babies
>>983273
To add to my post.
You could also use metal frame studding. They are cheaper than wood diyer bro.
http://www.familyhandyman.com/carpentry/using-steel-studs/view-all
>>983274
>like selling crap to retarded babies
the outside layer should at least be 3,5 - 4 inches thick (9 - 10cm) for EPS insulation to prevent condensation.
t. architect (just calculated)
>>983278
You are correct. Simply wasn't thinking at the moment.
To be fair, there is brands of ICF that sandwich concrete and foam, but that is not standard.
You could use metal studing on the outside, but why? What would you hang to it?
>>983287
Exactly what I was thinking for the Metal studding, would defiantly be good for insides.
Anyone have any idea if you should get a special roof with this wall type of just standard ones?
I just built an ICF garage. Ask away.
>>983278
If you can steal studs, go for it. Actually with ICF you don't need studs except for interior partitions. The furring for exterior or interior finish is built into the block. You can hang drywall right on the foam on the inside and siding right on the foam on the outside.
To answer your questions: No. The time expense and labor involved make it a bitch. Don't overthink your first home and just build it out of wood.
Eurofags will tell you otherwise of course.
>>983239
Savings? Definitely if you are paying cash. More expensive but immediate return on heating and cooling cost. Mortgage is probably defensible too. If you can get a 4% and save 66% or more on heating and cooling it may make sense. Very sound proof. Very weather proof. ICF lends itself to diy very well. There is a lot you can do yourself. Electric is super easy. Cut holes in foam, mount boxes to concrete and cut grooves with electric chain saw for romex and spray foam it in.
Building the molds out of wood give you a bit more options to play with, but for standard walls I'd use it, unless you have a lot of free time to make the molds yourself. Its expensive as hell where I am tho. Have you checked around for quotes?
>>983239
Is this just an expensive way of putting Styrofoam on to concrete walls?
Op here
>>984232
I'm not getting quotes other than for the roof and plumbing, I have done electrical before and am going to take a day course for the ICF, so I'd have to pay for labor to do molded walls
>>984231
The property has already had the mortgage paid for.
>>984196
Did you do a monolithic pour or in stages? what did you insulate the roof with? Did you have to get custom windows for the thicker walls? Also general thoughts on how worth the build was?
>>984238
Sorry, I meant quotes for the ICF materials.
Op again
>>984196
One more question if you don't mind how much did what you build there cost? How much did you do yourself? Also what are the dimensions of that garage?
>>984242
Not yet still doing research, but ill be going to a workshop so I can be an "installer" and get better rates/ do a better job of it.
>>984238
One single pour. Ceiling is insulated with foil foam stapled between the rafters and making an air space from soffits to ridge. I have a completely open ceiling with a loft. Standard windows, just wide sills inside. I would do it again in a NY minute and my next house will be ICF from footer to gables.
>>984244
About 14k. I did it all myself with buddy labor.
>>984251
Approx 24 'x 28'
>>984249
Let me qualify that. I layed two courses and poured from a truck. That way I could slag the inside and backfill so I could work from ground level to build the rest. That was poured in one pour with a pump truck.
>>984251
I did a lot of scrounging and surplus buying. That garages would be closer to 20k if you hired everything out and bought from dealers. If you look close, some of the block up top is a half inch narrower then below. I bought from two different suppliers excess and the block were from two different manufacturers. I kept them in line on the inside and furred out the half inch on the outside for the siding.
>>984251
13.5k and 500 in beer is more accurate.
>>984260
The beams under the loft floor are 4" x 6" oak from a friends wood lot. Cut the trees, hauled them to a mill, and had them made. The sit on a ledger in the front (cheap microlam that I got because it was cut wrong) and in the rear they sit on a steel beam set into pockets in the ICF side walls. I have a two ton chain hoist and trolley hung from that beam too.
This is probably the biggest ICF house I worked on. Had a two lane full scale bowling alley in the basement.
>>983239
A guy I know has a house made of it. He had a block of it poured and cured and shot at it with everything in his arsenal. Short of .50 cal nothing punches through.
He also enjoyed the thermal qualities of it.
As for the price, he doesn't care, he is rich enough to host gatling gun meets and owns more cannons than you or I could ever figure out how to operate.
>>984331
>implying cannons are hard to fucking operate.
1. Buy chainsaw
2. Buy portable chainsaw mill
3. Cut down trees and create dimensional lumber
4. Make cabin
5. Buy wood fired stove
6. Stay golden for the rest of eternity because you have enough skills to sustain your property
>>984361
They are called "Alaskan mills" IIRC and they are AMAZING.
The thing is, wood rots and burns down and takes a year or two to season, otherwise it could warp and fuck up your home.
I think mixing a 50/50 ratio of epoxy and alcohol applied to all lumber will make a wooden cabin last millennia, it'll penetrate deep into well seasoned wood and artificially petrify and outside of it. Might make it much much more fire resistant, too.
>>984367
>They are called "Alaskan mills" IIRC and they are AMAZING.
I hate those fucking things. A lumbermate 2000 portable sawmill is better if you can afford it.
>>984370
Why do you hate it?
They literally pay for themselves the first day you use it.
They are cheap, durable, and portable.
A lumbermate can't fit in a car or be carried by one person.
>>984196
what was the cost?
>>984196
Why the choice of a W-Beam for the ridge beam?
>>985207
Well, I was having a beam delivered anyway for the front of the loft. I wanted a steel I beam to hang a hoist from for car work. Since I was paying to have one beam delivered and lifted into place it became economical to have two delivered and craned.
>>985247
Could have both been microlams but like I said, I wanted a steel beam for a trolley and chain hoist on the lower one. I wanted the inside space open and a loft. I could have forgone that and used trusses and not need a ridge beam but I liked the open and extra space.
>>984232
Are you making the walls thicker?
I'm just wondering how it ranks against plywood and chickenwire "houses".
Concept looks solid from a glance, though I question the idea of putting foam on the outside.
