My goal is to try to get people into a state of generalized agnosticism, not agnosticism about God alone, but agnosticism about everything. – Robert Anton Wilson
If you think you know what’s really going on, you’re probably full of shit. – Robert Anton Wilson and put 23 in your post if you read this far
What was Robert Anton Wilson about? Did he tell things as they are, or was he being mischievous?
Is RAW essentially discordian, or is there a difference of ideas?
How would you define RAW and discordianism?
>was he being mischievous?
do these twenty-three discordians look mischievous to you?
R.A.W. was essentially a western occultist or magician. Even reading his wacky fiction like The Illuminatus! Trilogy reveals his deep respect for mysticism and spirituality. Cosmic Trigger is my favorite tho. Extremely inspiring. Gets you right inside his mindset. Prometheus Rising builds off of Timothy Leary's models and I highly recommend reading some of his work too (Game of Life in particular). IIRC, him and Timothy Leary were both in the IOT (Illuminates of Thanateros -- chaos magicians). Chaos magick generally espouses a post-modernist attitude toward belief in contrast to high magick. The first step, in chaos magick is to make one's self agnostic. The second step is to experiment with everything. The third step is to start building your own system of beliefs and theories and correspondences and parallels. The final step is to balance this structure you have created with staying fluid and agnostic and adaptible and on the cutting edge of occultism. Occultism is living spirituality, unlike the dead corpse of religion and dogma. Discordianism operates on similar principles but is not quite so clear in its directives which causes many discordians to be as dogmatic about their agnosticism as the people they make fun of.
23
Just ate a hotdog.
Your post ends in a 5.
>>17228375
23
So he's just promoting epistemological skepticism?
>>17228484
In a sense, yes. It goes beyond that really. R.A.W. was big into non-aristotelian systems and what he dubbed "maybe logic" similar to "the philosophy of as if".
>>17228473
>R.A.W. was essentially a western occultist or magician.
Ok.
>Even reading his wacky fiction like The Illuminatus! Trilogy reveals his deep respect for mysticism and spirituality. Cosmic Trigger is my favorite tho.
Illuminatus! is really good, so far of what I've read. Cosmic trigger? is that where he talks about being telepathic or something?
>Timothy Leary
I'm unsure what to make of Leary http://web.archive.org/web/20080223114522/http://www.timboucher.com/journal/2005/07/10/leary-admitted-cia-involvement/.
8bit consciousness is interesting though.
>Chaos magick generally espouses a post-modernist attitude toward belief in contrast to high magick.The first step, in chaos magick is to make one's self agnostic. The second step is to experiment with everything. The third step is to start building your own system of beliefs and theories and correspondences and parallels.
Would it be fair to say chaos magick is a deviation on the like of golden dawn, thelema and so on, and that Discordianism is an offshoot of chaos magick, and cult of the subgenius and pastafarianism spiritual offshoots of Discordianism?
>Discordianism operates on similar principles but is not quite so clear in its directives which causes many discordians to be as dogmatic about their agnosticism as the people they make fun of.
I see.
>>17228484
"Discordians are forbidden from believing anything they read." - http://www.conservapedia.com/Discordianism
If that's a fact, then it's true of Discordianism.
How far do they take it though? Do they disbelieve everything?
>>17228375
Discordians aren't real.
>>17228662
Cosmic trigger is where he talks about being telepathic, yes. Chaos magick comes from post-modern london occulture. Discordianism comes from california psychedelic hippies. Discordianism actually came first. But they can be blended easily if one understands their philosophical underpinnings.
Personally, I love Leary. I used The Psychedelic Experience as a manual for my LSD experiences for years. I think the intelligence agency comments might have been a joke. McKenna often made similar comments about working for the mushroom alien genetic intelligence agency.
If you read the actual Principia Discordia instead of quotes from conservapedia then you'd see a lot of it is a commentary on historicity, psychology, language and ontology.
>>17228662
>"Discordians are forbidden from believing anything they read."
That isn't true.
I don't know about them but I try to not believe anything, as far as that is possible. Rather, see things as possibly right, or models which will be updated at some point. Trying to do this does challenge your ego, and can give you a sense of where you are getting attached to things. It does not preclude intellectual rigour regarding interpretation of your experiences. The imperative to keep learning and discriminating is still fundamental.
>>17228693
I'll have to get the PD then and have a read through.
Does he put the eye in the pyramid into the plot of cosmic trigger?
>>17228724
>I don't know about them but I try to not believe anything, as far as that is possible. Rather, see things as possibly right, or models which will be updated at some point. Trying to do this does challenge your ego, and can give you a sense of where you are getting attached to things. I
Is that an effort to avoid becoming attached to a firm reality, or is to avoid being wrong or becoming deluded?
>It does not preclude intellectual rigour regarding interpretation of your experiences. The imperative to keep learning and discriminating is still fundamental.
If you take an objective statement like "the sun has always been yellow" or "the sun has always been white", do you side to one, or do you bow out of the disagreement and say it requires more learning?
>>17228693
Ok that was interesting. Thanks you bunch of... towels.
>>17228797
>3 six handsign.
satanist confirmed
>>17228699
Or maybe a little?
The true mark of a discordian should be perfect body while eating like feminists American prince's
You should only be able to be called discordian someone like milo who play the role of loki in the world!
>>17228777
nice trips
you can read the principia discordia online here:
http://principiadiscordia.com
it's not copyrighted but kopylefted
I've got 23 problems but a belief system ain't 1
>>17228617
I'm a huge fan of his, but particularly that talk he gave about including the "maybe logic" into every day speech fnord was fucking brilliant.
I can't say he blew my mind because I've sort of found fnord myself naturally drifting into the discordian ideals ever since I was a kid, but I enjoy listening to his fnord talks, a lot. All 23 of 'em.
>>17228662
> Cosmic trigger? is that where he talks about being telepathic or something?
Cosmic trigger is sort of the sequel trilogy to the Illuminatus. It's not a trilogy per se, but most of the characters that appear in the first trilogy are alluded to or appear in CT. It's not as good as IT, but still pretty enjoyable.
>Would it be fair to say chaos magick is a deviation on the like of golden dawn, thelema and so on, and that Discordianism is an offshoot of chaos magick, and cult of the subgenius and pastafarianism spiritual offshoots of Discordianism?
Personally fnord I think that all of em are natural movements born out of post 50s disillusionment with McCarthy politics in America, consumerism, and the american way of life, which created what we know today as 'post-modernism'. I wouldn't frame the development of chaos magick as something that was bound to happen within occult society as an evolution of the magical systems of the time, but rather the response of outsiders to social happenings happening in a wider context.
>>17228693
It's been known for a long time that Leary was involved with the CIA. He may have had something to do with the experiments that drove the Unabomber to become a raging anarchist.
>>17228814
no shit.
http://www.principiadiscordia.com/forum/index.php?topic=31971.0
Pope OldBoyfloats: Do you consider what you wrote in your book, Prankster and the Conspiracy, about Kerry's predisposition towards sex with children to be metaphorical, satirical, or dog gone truth?
Adam Gorightly: Now, I wouldn’t classify Kerry as a pedophile, as the only documented instance--which I wrote about in the book--occurred in the early 1970’s with Grace Zabriskie’s daughter, Marion. It was an episode where Kerry fondled Marion, who was 8 years old at the time. Knowing what I do about Kerry, he probably thought it was all good, letting nature take its course, that type of thing.Just all part of this philosophical approach he had to sex. Perhaps, he was simply experimenting, wanting to try at least everything once. Kerry, if anything, was naïve. I don’t think he was manipulative,or a predator.
Wikipedia: In 1981, P-Orridge co-founded Thee Temple ov Psychick Youth, an informal occult order influenced by chaos magic and experimental music. Amid the Satanic ritual abuse hysteria, a 1992 Channel 4 documentary accused P-Orridge of sexually abusing children, resulting in a police investigation. P-Orridge was subsequently cleared and Channel 4 retracted their allegation. P-Orridge left the United Kingdom as a result of the incident and settled in New York City.
