>>17096411
And so now I'd like to say - people can change anything they want to. And that means everything in the world. People are running about following their little tracks - I am one of them. But we've all got to stop just following our own little mouse trail. People can do anything - this is something that I'm beginning to learn. People are out there doing bad things to each other. That's because they've been dehumanised. It's time to take the humanity back into the center of the ring and follow that for a time. Greed, it ain't going anywhere. They should have that in a big billboard across Times Square. Without people you're nothing. That's my spiel.

If you're worried about the possibility you're going to do it all over again, why don't you just fix the life you have now?

I often get the feeling that I killed myself a while back and I'm in hell, I just don't know it

>>17096420
Although my reasons are not up for debate - I will say that my life has become impossible, a constant cycle of misery, humiliation and disappointment with no chance of getting better.

All I want to know is whether there is such a thing as reincarnation and how suicide may (negatively) affect this. Don't want to make it worse for myself.

>>17096432
you just have to be strong man... and you know you can... you know it's worth it

According to the Vedic conception, you will have to live as a ghost body for long periods of time.

>>17096425
Nah, that's /b/. Your fine here.

Most complex systems that involve reincarnation will tell you you're going to have to pay pretty heavy penalties next time around for offing yourself.

I imagine the simplest would be to return as a prey animal that must cling desperately to life every moment.

>>17096432

If reincarnation exists, or if an afterlife exists at all, every religion which holds to those beliefs also believes that suicide will have severe negative repercussions.

On Buddhism it's considered an "action that is difficult to overcome," meaning you will have a lot of work to do in your reincarnated lives after that fact. Not to mention you will likely be reincarnated as something extremely low on the karmic ladder.

In Catholicism and most of the western religions I'm sure you already know well enough about purgatory.

If you have even an inkling of a belief in the afterlife or reincarnation, you are dooming yourself with suicide.

The solution is to fix the life you have now. Interestingly enough, this is the solution even if you are NOT religious.

>>17096411
No, anyone who tells someone something bad happens to them after suicide is just going tuff guy mode telling you not to.
There is no logical reason for a punishment because you can't cope with the life you have.

>>17096501
>There is no logical reason for a punishment because you can't cope with the life you have
That's fucking stupid

>>17096501

Suicide is the weak way out, whether something happens or not.

When your life is shit, you build a new one. It's no different than when your computer turns to shit or your phone starts to fall apart. You don't toss the computer in the trash and never use technology again - you fucking start over.

>>17096432
Karma is about the effects your actions have. On others, and on yourself.

For the effects on yourself, see if you are falling into any of these life traps:

Whinging: "a constant cycle of misery, humiliation and disappointment" just sounds like a whinge. Suck it up.

Disempowerment: "no chance of getting better." well now you're just breaking my heart. No way. There is always possibility, you 'just' have to find a way.

If you give in to whinging and disempowerment then you will have to face them again next time around.

And as to the effects on others, unless you are a hermit who lives in a cave then suicide will have an effect on others and you will have that to deal with next time round.

I don't know how literally true the Blavatsky article is, but I have seen some very unhappy ghosts, still hanging around whether by choice or not I don't know.

>>17096481
Kek x1000

>>17096515
Although I totally agree and would bully in the next life he's just going to dismiss that as the "tough guy" argument. What he can't dismiss is the damage it does to the people who care about you. In purely objective terms suicide is just as bad as murder.

>>17096515
I never understood when people say suicide is "weak" or they were pussies or couldn't handle shit. I bet you would be fearful in the face of death but I think it takes courage to end your own life. Saying somebody is weak for killing themselves just makes you feel better because you're afraid to die.

>>17096658

This is a flawed argument. Look at the many people who risk their lives in dangerous settings for the benefit of those they care about, or just for the benefit of themselves as thrill seekers. They're not afraid of death. But I bet a lot of them are afraid of not living their lives.

And that's what it comes down to. Suicide is not the "courage" to face your own death. It's the fear of living overcoming the fear of death. When one fear becomes so great it eclipses another, that's not courage - it's the greater weakness overcoming the lesser.

>>17096671
Anecdotal bullshit about people who risk their lives for others has nothing to do with suicide. Have you asked them personally their feelings about death or are you assuming? Saving another person is entirely different than taking your own life. Humans are created with a fear of death instinctively.

How can weakness overcome anything? Weakness in itself is an inability to do something. Instead of saying "It's the fear of living overcoming the fear of death," say "It's the courage/ability to end your life overcoming the fear of death."

I guess I just don't see how ending your own life is cowardly when people fight everyday to stay alive.

>>17096698

>I guess I just don't see how ending your own life is cowardly when people fight everyday to stay alive.

You said it yourself. Because people fight every day to stay alive.

The desire to live isn't based off a fear of death unless you are based purely off instincts. The second you are able to even conceptualize ending your own life voluntarily, living becomes a choice.

People choose to fight for their lives, and people choose to end them. One requires hard work, tenacity, and courage every single day. The other requires pulling the trigger just once.

Would you argue that calling for a pizza delivery to your door is harder than making the entire thing from scratch on your own?

i suggest you watch this

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7GiLDuaDl4I

tom campbell has been exploring non physical reality for 30 years and has been with people's consciousness as their physical bodies die.

tl;dr - not a big deal, just not the most profitable decision. you'll likely end up in the same place - you're here to learn how to deal with it.

>>17096719
>Thinking living life on survival mode is virtuous

It doesn't matter.
Whether you're struggling for life or not, you will die anyway.
Stop surviving and start living.

>>17096411
There's no one to reincarnate.
The one you believe to be your self is just nothing more than conditioned reflexes beaten into you the same way one beats orders into a dog.

>>17096789

think you're quoting the wrong person here chief, seems like thats exactly what hes saying

>>17096802
OP here. I've just started listening to Alan Watts and he talks about similar things (although I haven't fully understood yet).
This doesn't make any sense. If you turn into a meditation/astral ninja can you choose to be in someone else's body, look inside the ego of others. I really don't get it. Is the idea that our egos are like sock puppets on the hands of God/a big consciousness - sock puppets who have tricked themselves into thinking they are unique individuals rather than just part of a greater while pretending to itself?

Sorry if I'm not making any sense.

>>17096411
EVERYTHING you do in this life has an effect on what happens in the next; Karma is a Universal Law.

>>17096887
It's not easily understandable. For all practical purposes, we have to act as if we are discrete units of consciousness, until it becomes unmistakably clear that we aren't. The 'sock puppet' is what we 'are' in almost every context we presently experience; it's what we have to work with for now.

>>17096432
Suicide is not the answer, Anon. I know that sometimes things look bleak and like they may never get better, but just giving in will ensure that they don't. I know that some things that happen in life are painful-agony, even-but the decision to take your life is not one you can take back. It's not my place to demand the details, all I know is that you need to find a way to climb out of the pit you've found yourself in, no matter how impossible and far away that may seem, and you need to find someone who you can lean on when you're lost and in pain. Hang in there, Anon, I'm rooting for you.

>>17096658
There's no "courage" in killing yourself, it's a response to pain and despair.

>>17096411
You don't have to trust or believe me at all. But let me say all of that is very real.

I've spoken with demons, angels and literal Gods. I have some experience in this whole business.

Yes, Reincarnation is a thing. Yes, you get severly fucked for offing yourself. You are here for a reason. If you off yourself, you won't be able to move on, and will end as a tormented spirit. The link that you posted is very accurate.

>>17097135
I'm not sure how much I believe in God (first of all) and it's a bigger leap to believe in the supernatural. But I am inclined to be superstitious, hence asking about reincarnation.

When you say you've spoken to gods in the multiple, that makes me very sceptical - although you obviously believe there to be some truth there (unless you're role playing).

Please give me something more: how can you be so sure there are angels, demons gods and reincarnation exists?

>>17096411
You're next life wouldn't even matter because technically it wouldn't be your life. You'd have no idea that you are living a new life. Therefore it's the same as dying and becoming nothingness.

>>17096420
What if you can't fix it? What if you're paralyzed or something?

>>17096515
That's not always possible. Sometimes things happen that are impossible to fix.

>>17096411
Here's a video you might find interesting:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=59OOCGzd6fE

In short: It might not be the best decision, and you might have to see the effects it has on people you leave behind. But at the same time, it's not something you'll be punished for - there's no hell, and any judgement is self-imposed.

>>17098147
Continuing: I personally don't think there's anything wrong with suicide, especially if there's an afterlife. Sometimes people reach a point where even existing in this world is too much to take. If you hate your job, you quit. If you hate your neighborhood, you move. I don't see why it's any different if you hate your physical existence and want to end it.

>>17096741
That nigga isn't blinking and it's making me uncomfortable

>>17096538
>In purely objective terms suicide is just as bad as murder

How??

>>17098192
Well, I suppose you could argue they both involve a conscious decision to end a human life, but that's pretty much it.

>>17096538
If someone really cares about you, they won't demand that you continue an unbearable existence just so they won't be upset. Whether you want to admit it or not, some people are in situations where there truly is no solution in this world.

>>17098231
>If someone really cares about you, they won't demand that you continue an unbearable existence just so they won't be upset.

Right but they definitely wont see it that way. They will think that
1) you weren't strong enough
2) they failed you
it doesn't matter if this is true for you because you wont be around to tell them otherwise.

Its also way more likely that you have options. You are posting from a device with internet access, and in English.
You could do volunteer work travel or teach in another country, these things are free you just have to grow a pair. No one is holding a gun to your head you could get up walk out the door and never come back. It would probably give you some perspective on <an unbearable existence>.

>>17096411

Interesting read but it doesn't explain what happens to those who 'die' willingly. War, cop, being murdered by a looney. Or doing something stupid which caused you to die.

Personally, I believe we are all God, only the problem lies in that we have deluded ourselves to believe we are someone else. We are asleep and dreaming ourself as someone else, a false self that feels itself as separate from the rest. We can't be separate, as all that which existence entails is to the core Existence/God itself, no matter how different we may seem to eachother. The goal of life is to awaken to your true self and understand that there is no separation and that you are all that is, has been and allways will be. As long as you keep dreaming, and believe you are simply the character you dream you will reincarnate, again and again until the goal is complete, where you wake up. Realize yourself, and all seeking will vanish, and peace is gained here and now forever. As long as you seek, there will be life. Remove all thoughts, remove all ego self and you will see clearly what's left. The eternal all-encompassing Self of all selfs.

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When you attempt suicide pay attention to how your body is being damaged to end your life. If death is indeed just a door back into life then the quality of that door must have an impact on how you re-enter life, for example: If you kill yourself via hanging perhaps you will incarnate into an infant who has been suffocated by the umbilical cord resulting in brain damage. So then, to remove yourself from this cycle using suicide you must kill yourself in a way that does not open a door back into life.

To tell you the truth there is no 'you' to kill. You will certainly experience this truth upon death, but it is not necessary to die to experience this truth or understand it conceptually.

>>17096411
Considering that the number of people alive today who report remembering past lives is very miniscule, and keeping in mind that many of these claims are unsubstantiated, unlikely, debunked or downright unfalsifiable, it seems a pretty safe bet to say that nobody would realize that his life is a worse rehash of a former one. In other words, if incarnation is really a thing, it's not like you'd notice. To think your lot in life and your happiness are also largely influenced by notions such as Karma is also dubious, considering that most of these depend on economics, history and demographics, which lie almost entirely in our hands and are being shaped today; which are therefore external and independent of your current life decisions.

What about those who think about suicide out of curiousity and who think things will probably turn out okay either way?

>>17096411
>If you commit suicide does this have any effect on your next life?
yes it does.
I went to the "7 hell" (or at least i think so, i've been in all). think of it like a place where you cant move and all the feelings there is to feel good about is right in front of you, but you can get to it.
with other words you cant do anything more than just exist.
When you comes out off there earth is going to feel like the definition of heaven, since you have a place to compare it to.

>>17098192
>>17098214
>that's pretty much it.
What else is there, objectively speaking? All we can positively say about death is that someone is gone and no one will ever see them again. All that's left is the pain and suffering their absence causes other people. I'm not even going to try to claim bulldog like all lives are worth the same but if you choose to kill yourself then you damn well better make sure you've completely burned all your bridges first.

>>17098231
You fucking KNOW that's bullshit. Of you are physically capable of killing yourself then you're physically capable of improving your life you just choose not to. That's why you don't want to go into any details because you know that the shit that's so "unbearable" is literally laughable.

95% of people who kill themselves have the means to simply walk away and start a new life somewhere else but they choose not to.

>>17096425
Me too brother I thought I was the only one

>>17099711
>You fucking KNOW that's bullshit. Of you are physically capable of killing yourself then you're physically capable of improving your life you just choose not to. That's why you don't want to go into any details because you know that the shit that's so "unbearable" is literally laughable.

Now THAT'S bullshit. If I'm paralyzed from the waist down, I'm capable of using a gun, but I'm not capable of walking, running, having sex, or doing any other of a myriad of other physical activities. There's no cure for paralysis. I'll be this way until I die.

Or maybe I've been horribly disfigured in a way that plastic surgery can't fix. For the rest of my life, I'll be pitied at best and ridiculed at worst, and I'll never be able to have a normal social life.

I know what you're going to say. "You can still make the most of it!" Well, maybe I don't want to just "make the most of it". Maybe that isn't good enough for me. It's my life. No one has the right to tell me how I should live or even that I should live at all.

Some things really can't be fixed. Peoples' lives belong to themselves, not self-righteous dicks like you.

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>>17096432
Before the dawn of an conceptual time, one that is perhaps unfathomable to your current awareness... you lied hollow within the aethers of time and space. fresh from your journey from the the known to the unknown and in a spilt second beyond all time itself you chose to live as you are now..... death is your choice my fellow freedom having being of flesh... but you are alive now as you are, not to sin again... but to BREATHE AND DANCE THE MOVEMENT OF HUMAN FEET

>>17099825
You could get your point across without being a bad vibey little bitch you ball-less motherfucker

>>17099825
Are you some type of pervert that thrills from entertaining the idea of just rage quitting life because of disability or ugliness

>>17099737
same here.

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>>17099825
>If I'm paralyzed from the waist down
>If
See now you're creating hypothetical situations because you know for a fact that whatever your problem is it's not even arguable so you have to create one that is. WHAT IF FUCKING I'M PARALYZED MOTHERFUCKER? What then? Maybe I had the super shitty luck you're implying to have become paralyzed sometime after puberty but before I lost my virginity and instead of spending all my tons of Social Security sponsored free time crying about it I got real buff in my upper body and instead of buying a gun with my checks I bought a sweet car with an automatic transmission and girls like me maybe not as much as if my legs worked but better than some soft self-pitying loser with perfectly functional legs? What if it's even worse? What if I'm Steven Hawking, Motherfucker? You don't know.

>Peoples' lives belong to themselves
No. They don't. You are a cog in the machine.

You know what? Even though it's still a slight assumption, I'm going to make it and say that based on the way you're coming across that all your "unbearable problems" come down to you being fat and you've maybe recently passed a threshold of your body being incapable of returning completely to "normal". You probably think you have some psychological problems but they're really only just side effects and you came to /x/ instead of /fit/ because we're "the misery chicks" and will join you in your "dark place" and make you feel better about it.

Well guess what there are a lot of us here who are a lot more capable of looking a lot deeper into you a lot faster than if you just sucked it up and let /fit/ fix you from the outside in.

You're not deep.

You're not dark.

You're fucking pathetic and killing yourself is the ultimate pathetic thing you could possibly do so fucking go ahead and do it but do it in some way that makes it look like skinwalkers got you or some shit so at least you can contribute something to the lame half of this board.