Let's talk about this great game.
I found some old Nintendo Power magazines and I remembered that they had the best map for the Nobilla marketplace and I've never found a better one. So I put the two pages together and made this image. Hopefully it will be useful to someone besides me.
What are your favorite parts? Favorite music? Favorite weapon? Answer one, all, or something else related to the game.
I thought SoE was rather bland overall, especially compared to SoM and SD3.
Gameplay is very one dimensional with only 2 characters, one of which is very basic.
IIRC you can't move or attack diagonally, which is a total pain because the enemies can, and will constantly abuse that, which seems totally unfair.
Also IIRC at some point you get a shield that makes you invicible for the last part of the game...
I love how the game it's praised for its "original story" while it's almost nonexistant. Storytelling consists of "go there, MAYBE we'll tell you something" and repeat until the end.
I also found the environments and musics rather bland, and finally, there are a couple of instances of shitty repetitive "artificial length" level design designed with the purpose to get the player lost, like the dark forest where you have to go through screens in a certain order, and the desert.
I think I had other things I didn't like too but my memory made SoE fade away to make place for the good games.
I really enjoyed the soundtrack. I played secret of mana after I played evermore and I thought evermore was superior in almost every way. I didn't have any friends to play co-op with so maybe I didn't get the full experience with mana.
>>3117083
>I also found the environments and musics rather bland
For all of its flaws I'd say the music and environments were the greatest things about the game. If I recall the first part of the game has you start out in a mad scientist's laboratory, then a prehistoric jungle, a cave passage full of sandy sinkholes, a tar pit filled with huge dinosaur bones, some amazon river type crap, then to a volcano filled with retrofitted machinery. And this is all before you travel to the other eras.
The music I just love. It's not as consistently great like SoM or SD3 but many of the tracks set the mood wonderfully and has what I think is a hugely underrated miniboss theme. Here's a few of my faves to judge for yourself.
https://youtu.be/BCXLKmvF_Ug
https://youtu.be/tnV7w_tpmpI
https://youtu.be/arc6qfMWoPE
All that said I'll admit I've never completed the game so can't say much for the story which I would agree seems to be pretty nonexistent. The magic system I recall being pretty fucked too, requiring you to use your spells over and over again before they're worth a damn. The alchemy reagents could have been fun but just felt incredibly unnecessary. The spell effects were pretty damn neat though, and I think overall the combat was pretty fun despite each area having maybe 2-3 varieties of enemies.
General consensus is that SoM and SD3 are the superior games and there's no arguing with that. It still deserves some credit though for taking risks with a largely ambient soundtrack and a (somewhat) unique magic system.
The gourd
It does nothing
Also the boxart is awesome even though the main character looks like a special ed kid
>>3117068
>Let's talk about this great game.
>great
Why must you begin your thread with lies?
>>3117083
Already with the contrarian fedora fags. "I thought *inset critically acclaimed title here* was overrated/bad/not good, *insert game nobody cares about here* is a much better game".
I came to this thread just to spot how many of you guys I would find, and I didn't have to look past the first post, you make me sad.
>>3117120
Well I admit there is one thing the game is good at, it's making a kid feel like he's on a surreal epic adventure. The choice of character, boxart, environments and musics do that.
>>3117083
>a literal namefag
>thinking anyone gives a fuck about his opinion
>using a name on an anonymous Brazilian painting forum
>being this neglected by dad excepting the times he dicked you
Smhtbhfam
>>3119703
I prefer evermore, it's more linear and has a more interesting story. They are both good games, but mana can be downright gay at times. Pic related, when you rescue santa.
That's right, fucking SANTA.
like, why is he even in the game? who does this appeal to?
>>3119703
There is no butthurt and no shitting, I also never complained it wasn't like SoM, I took it as a comparaison point because yes, SoE was built to be in the exact same subgenre of video game as SoM, and even the name takes back to it, but if you actually wanted to read my post you'd realize I have some actual points like the lack of variety in the gameplay and the "let's make sure the player gets lost so we can pretend the game is long" level design.
Because someone finds average something you think is more than that doesn't make his opinion "rage" or "butthurt" or "bullshit" by definition.
That only seems to be what you're telling yourself so you don't have to challenge your opinion.
About that, and about you implying we're not welcome in this thread, tell me, what is the point of discussing this game if only people who love it are allowed to talk? "I love this game! Who else does?" "Me too I love it ! I love the music!" "/thread".
This is motherfucking 4chan, not your basic fan forum where you're not allowed to say you don't like something someone else does. I shouldn't have to put "IMHO" in front of every sentence either.
>>3119716
>who does this appeal to?
Kids.
>>3119716
>hating on Santa
Bro, fuck off. Games are about having fun.
Santa in SoM was great.
>>3119745
that fucking ice field music makes me cry every time
seriously what the fuck kikuta
why the fuck do you need to give me these feels
>>3119752
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vf58TiGtIe4
seriously listen to this shit I feel like I'm dying
I can never go back
I can never see them again
and I can never stop remembering, every time I do anything that brings me closer to who I really am
>>3119723
>I also never complained it wasn't like SoM
>I thought SoE was rather bland overall, especially compared to SoM
I know English isn't your first language but if you're going to use it, you need to understand the words you're using, Frenchie.
>>3119765
I meant that: he said I was butthurt because it's not a cardboard copy of SoM, but my points were not "SoE is bad because it's not SoM".
I bought it as a kid with my hard-earned "please love me" money from my parents.
I at first thought it was a pale imitation of SoM and felt ripped off out of $49.99. When I actually gave it half a chance, I was really enchanted with some of its environments and thoroughly impressed with its magic (alchemy) system, though the gameplay itself was a bit tasking at times.
As an adult, I appreciate it for what it is and prefer it to SoM as SoM is even /more/ of a kick to the balls when it comes to getting here and there. And it feels somehow incomplete, as though things were yanked out of it and it was accidentally released unfinished.
>>3119716
rescuing Santa and Ice Country in general are my favorite parts of SoM.
It's sad that we never saw the version of Secret of Evermore that Ed Kann wanted to create.
its pretty mediocre, but i can understand why people feel nostalgia for it
>>3119795
SoM was supposed to be a launch title for the sfc-cd, it was downsized and compromised to fit on a cart.
>>3117083
>Gameplay is very one dimensional with only 2 characters, one of which is very basic.
Funny, that none of the three playable characters in SoM had even an inkling of personality, story or growth beyond their introduction scenes.
>>3119987
Huh?
Are SoM fags really gonna try to shit on SoE? At least SoE is a complete game not some sloppy seconds attempt at salvaging a SNES CD game
>Secret of Evermore thread
No fucking way. I love you OP.
Also, yes, let's talk about this game.
>What are you favorite parts?
It's hard to say, because I love every single moment of the game. The atmosphere sucks you in, and the whole time you feel like you're there in this strange, lonely adventure.
>Favorite music?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IOcPHAMfaCE
>Favorite weapon?
Big fan of the Spear. That ranged option is powerful and very useful.
>Misc
It's always seemed to me that SoE was meant to be a much, much larger game, but was forced to be cut back by higher-ups. There are so many little things in the game that hint of larger, grander concepts, and it's a fucking crime that there was never a sequel.
>>3117068
>Favorite part
I love the beginning. I don't know why but I always liked the jungle the most.
>Favorite music
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wjfwk2pgT6U
>Favorite weapon
Spear. I liked the long range. I don't think I ever used anything but the Horn Spear because I didn't want to grind everything up to the max constantly.
I loved that game. The story was interesting. The environments were great. I don't know man. SoM never did it for me. Too colorful which made it feel very lighthearted. This hit that spot I like.
>ywn anticipate a game so much that you buy a magazine and pour over its glorious full page screenshots
>>3117068
I'll take SoE over SoM any day. I thought the atmosphere was so much better in SoE.
Evermore is probably in my top 3 most played games. I have, no shit, probably played through it 9 or 10 times, starting from when I was in middle school, when the game first came out, renting the game from the local video store, to most recently a year or so ago playing it on emulator with the "gameplay balancing" patch (which did nothing but made the game slightly harder, and you had to wait for your stamina to reach 100% before you could cast alchemy) Evermore has that crucial element that makes a game so memorable for me- ATMOSPHERE. The settings, music, story, and gameplay all combine to really give you the feeling of being in an alternative universe. There's always the suggestion of something mysterious and more vast going on that sadly never really pans out in the game itself.
>Favorite parts
Definitely Gothica, the chessboard part, the towns Ebon Keep and Ivor Tower. At that point in the game you are starting to get a sense of the conspiracy between the evil robot twins and their villainous master. The maze in the forest and the sewer has plenty of secrets and really rewards you for searching every last nook.Although Omnitopia feels like an add-on I enjoy it too, though compared to the other areas of the game it feels pretty small.
>Favorite weapon
Never really had one, just kept whatever was newest equipped. So I'll say my favorite alchemy spells were Lance and Fireball.
>oh god the music
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hx9DVVKf5nU
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q9QB7pfsv1M&list=PL20042C3DDA238B10&index=25
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=noaIvnN6mis&index=47&list=PL20042C3DDA238B10
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HlyIJFh0bxA&index=53&list=PL20042C3DDA238B10
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NfuAb8ysO-Y&list=PL20042C3DDA238B10&index=58
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WpzrhmRw3JI
The soundtrack to this day still slays me with its haunting, suggestive melodies.
>>3125794
>Gameplay
SoE really embodies the term Action RPG. Combat is fluid with a lot of give and take. You have to plan a strategy with how you move and what attacks you will use with some enemies/bosses. I will say most of the bosses are not a challenge at all if you are properly leveled up and only a few present a truly engrossing challenge. (Verminator comes to mind) Also no other retro game I can think of truly rewards you for exploring, IE sniffing out ingredients for alchemy and finding new spells.
>Story progression
What keeps SoE from truly being a great game is the whole package. Towards the end of the game you get ridiculously overpowered, rendering the last area (Omnitopia) and the final few bosses moot. Most of the alchemy spells at that point become useless. The feeling of battling a fantastic, unseen enemy gets lost.
There's obviously unfinished bits as >>3123541
noted, such as the big island in the map overworld, and practically no side quests other than some secret items that don't do shit. Some characters and plot devices, like the Diamond Eyes, feel shoe-horned in (mysterious items of power with little relevance to the actual story itself.) And it's a crime that there is no 2--player mode in the original game, a crime that's since been amended with the 2-player patch.
Love the witty NPC dialogue and B-movie cheesiness, getting different responses from people talking to them as the dog. I'm still discovering new things about this game to this day. Did you know if you miss getting the Cure spell in Bugmuck you can get it from the fish vender in Nobilia? Not to mention the numerous and incredibly bizarre bugs throughout. Just really love Secret of Evermore.
>>3119723
Probably cuz you used a term like artificial length. There isn't a any problem with a maze it's part of the game and make sense in the context. So is an ok game at best but that seems like a silly reason .
Why are namefags so fucking dumb.
I like the blend of the scif/fantasy genre in the game and its spell system. Afaik, there's no other RPG like it.
>>3117068
Favorite parts:
The pre-historia part. money was hard to come by, shit cost a ton, melee/survival most of the time. I remember me and my buddy when we were kids used to two-player this, he would take control for a bit then I would.
It was in the middle of the night, pre-historia music kept playing.
And then you got the Crush formula and the rest of the game became easy as fucking cake because spending the materials to use Crush on multiple enemies cost less and it was an endless cycle of having a level 9 crush before leaving the second world and coasting off of x99 casts the rest of the game and eventually having to move onto fireball or whatever the thing was for.. stuff.
Also,
>trying to get all the artifacts before the arena match
>scrambling hard as a kid with the book and getting a quick checklist of the minimum everything
flashforward a decade..
>learn about the 99 rice and spice outside the Nobilla market place zone in whirlpooI that was not covered in the strategy guide
>>3117068
I really loved the desert and Nobilia.
Hall of Collosia was great as well, and it features my favourite music track.
Fav weapon? Neutron blade.
The best thing about SoE is the atmospheric environment.
Anyone remember itsbillsfault?
>>3117068
Me and my best friend had just beat Secret of Mana on the SNES cooping the whole thing and it was in 5th grade. We took turns on playing through Secret of Evermore, and it is a damn shame it was not coop.
That said I thought it was pretty challenging at parts mainly because I don't think I ever used the alchemy system to its fullest. This was the first game I remember looking up on gamefaqs. I printed out an ascii map of the the "lost woods" area. I loved the marketplace, and I remember I got stuck after that area because I didn't know you had to switch to the dog to get across that lift that leads to the pyramid dungeon.
My favourite snes game for sure, OP. Even when its many flaws, its a lovely different taste for SoMana game system.
Part of the hate it receives is from people who still think that it´s the game they received instead of SoM2 (Seiken Densetsu 3), when that´s not the case.
I totally love Mana series but this one stands for a more dark atmosphere, better graphics and superb music. Kind of shame that the alchemy is not very well tested in hight levels and the last zone (future) was clearly cut out the meet the deadline.
The mods for game balance and to play coop controlling the dog are two different extras to justify a new try.
>>3117068
crappy square America game. far far far worse than mana. 62% is a fair review score.
>>3126121
>whirlpool or rice and spice
Fucking what? I've never even heard of this. Screenshot where this is for me man.
>>3117140
>guy provides actual non-inflamatory reasons for his distaste
WHAT A TROLL GAUISE
>>3130035
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2jHYNN5xGhc
start shows you where to go, and for some reason it took him 3 minutes for it to go off.
>>3130312
What the fuck. That's horse shit. There's no visual indication whatsoever. You'd have to accidently walk over the exact right space.
Thanks for showing me anon. I probably could have played another ten times and still missed that.
>>3131484
There's worse than that. Try fucking finding the formula "Sting" in that god damn desert without a map.
>>3117458
>he hates on people that contribute to the thread
>>3119756
The absolute best track on the entire SNES
>>3117068
>favorite parts?
I thought the transitions from one area to the next were really memorable, getting shot out of the volcano going from Prehistoria -> Crustacia was great, finally emerging from the well in Gothica was also an awesome moment.
>favorite music?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pCPv-rBuEeg
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fv3nOG_0yTA
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-7peUhl6krc
>Favorite weapon?
I like the level 3 axe throws but usually stick with swords/spears
>>3117068
Playing Evermore right now.
First time I was turned off because unlike that fucking Fire Eyes, I hate cavemen and caveman culture.
Once I learned about the whole concept I'm sticking with it till the end.
>>3134214
Glad you decided to go back. It's a great game.
>>3133362
Forgot your namefag, namefag.
Where does SoE rank among SNES RPGs?
>>3136534
Good Question.
I'd say you could probably universally agree it's in the top 10. I think you'll have arguments if you try to pick a place where it belongs in the top 10.
>>3136534
Above Mana, below Terranigma/Illusion of Gaia.
>>3140021
>Illusion of Gaia
I don't know man. Do you really think it was that good?
I mean the game is basically kill each zone completely and all your friends die for no reason.
It's pretty hard hitting for a kid actually. Even for an adult really.
Let's get this thread feeling real /vr/ like and spend 400 posts bitching about why Secret of Evermore looks better on CRT instead of emulation and LCD.
i wish there would be a hardmod for it, like there is one for mana. i lobe the menu track
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DNCsq4rWEqs
>>3146653
There is a balance patch which supposedly makes it hard.
It sure makes it annoying as fuck because he disables spell use unless you're at 100%.
Can I get someone's honest opinion about SoE? (i.e. no shitposting)? I've been thinking about playing it, yet, at the same time I hear so many good things about it, I hear a lot of bad things too.
>>3150797
If you played Secret of Mana, you will be in for a slight shock in gameplay/settings. Melee in this game after the first world is total dogshit to kill things with. Enemies can knock you around so easily and in some cases just chain stun your ass into oblivion. On the flipside, some alchemy abilities make it too easy. Crush and Fireball come to mind. The other downside to Alchemy are the ingredients. You cannot get ingredients for Crush outside of the second world.
On another note, this game is riddled with map puzzles/mazes. I remember being a kid and being stuck in the Volcano Water Ways for hours in the pre-history era.
The pre-historia era is brutal because money is time consuming to earn and things cost a lot, but a lot easier after pre-historia.
The music on the otherhand, if you are a fan of Jeremy Soule (elder scrolls games and whatnot) I think this game was his starting point
>>3117068
getting the rice etc from the whirlpool outside to get the amour items etc before the market closes
>>3148137
Secret of Evermore - 2 Player Edition v1.02 by FuSoYa Gameplay Balance v1.1 Hard Mode by Ninakoru (Hack).smc
playing on my flashcard atm, its awesome.
>>3117068
I don't like it.
I couldn't get past the first boss in my only attempt of the game. Am I just bad or am I not seasoned enough in the grind-heavy RPG's of old?
>>3125845
>Naming your dog Motherfucker
>Having to walk across the desert
>>3154957
Levels make a huge difference in this game, first time I went at him I was destroyed, but I leveled up twice and went back. No problems whatsoever.
>>3155140
Levels don't make THAT big of a difference. They only go up to 20 to begin with. You just aren't good.
>>3154957
The first boss is one of the hardest because your healing options are limited. It's better to make one or two big hits than it is to do several small hits. Every time you hit him, you get smacked for it.
I only died to it once or twice as a kid. I'm sure an adult can figure it out.
I'm not even joking when I say I would murder a innocent baby human for a Secret of Evermore 2.
>>3156663
dito.
I still replay the game on a yearly basis, its so fucking comfy. Also listen to the soundtrack on my way to work.
>>3142496
When I was a little kid I cried when Hamlet threw himself into the fire
>>3123541
>Big fan of the Spear. That ranged option is powerful and very useful.
Same here. It's the best weapon because of its general purpose. I was able to beat through most of the game with just the first spear, fully leveled-up, without using alchemy or the beads.
I was saving all the alchemy ingredients and the beads until "I really needed them". But, after reaching the final boss, I realized that I was just making the game harder than it should be by withholding the use of those items. Final battle was easy. I just unloaded everything I had on him.
Given the short length of the game, there wasn't a practical reason to level-up other weapons. I wish the game was longer.
>>3157189
Man, overtime hours sure are long in Japan!
>>3157450
Horn Spear is literally all you need.
Then, if you really feel the need to upgrade, you can just buy bazooka ammo in the last level.
I wish leveling up weapons wasn't such a chore and the balance patch didn't mess with a bunch of shit that didn't need changing.
Of all the times I've played it, I don't think I've ever used anything else once I got the Horn Spear.
>>3155119
That desert was great. One of the few times it really felt like you were walking through a desolate deadly desert that will kill you if you're not careful.
Great, if different soundtrack. Beautiful graphics.
Level design is questionable, though. The dog labyrinth was torturous.
It's noticeable that much of the story was cut - the hints about the great conspiracy one gets lack context, and characters show up that should have a backstory, an arc to be resolved... which never happens.
The alchemy system is great.
Otoh, there are two different ways to render oneself invincible before even hitting the last section of the game. Three if you count bugs. Not good.
The game was an experiment. It had many great ideas, but it also had its flaws, which keep it from being 'great'. It's good, though. And unlike SoM, weapons and magic alike are valid combat strategies. SoM's magic stunlock to win is just... sad.
In the end?
I enjoyed it. It was fun.
Damnit this thread made me go start another game.
>>3164604
Enjoy anon. It's great every time.
>skip jaguar tooth ring in quicksand fields
>play until Hall of Collosia like normal
>get stuck at falling bridge with no way to progress
Hm, I always start this game, then lose interest after the oil fields but before whatever comes next.
>Try it again
>Labyrinthine fields, not terrible just annoying
>Enemies start out as decent threat, but get trivial, either way seem to take just a few too many hits
>Annoying quicksand field
>Again labyrinthine oil caves/big carcass
>Get to Thraxx
>Use alchemy on his heart, do something like 600 damage with fireball/iron ball combined
>Run out of ingredients
>Dude thrashes me
>Hit, heal, hit, heal, hit heal
>Run out of healing items
>Die
>For some reason the save at the alchemist's hut didn't take, have to restart at village
Ugh. I'm gonna try and push through but my heart definitely isn't it this yet.
>>3117083
>found the environments and musics rather bland
Jesus christ I couldn't compose a more idiotic contrarian baitpost if I tried. Environments were the one thing SoE did amazing well, not to mention its revolutionary use of ambient soundscaping in place of most musical tracks.
>inb4 21 days ago
>>3117120
this guy knew what was up
Weren't there some spooky legends about this game? Like it was originally intended to be a horror game and it had a lot of really dark imagery, most of which was cut?
>>3168753
I remember a post about a battle against the plague monster while the king is going insane in the background or something.
>>3168171
u get the ring automatically once you fall down the bridge if you dont already have it up to this point.
are you here to shit post?
>>3169193
Not at all. I was emulating it a few months ago and I never got the ring. I know in some versions Fire Eyes forces you to take one after the bugmuck if you miss it. You play the NA version?
I love how after two decades there's still so much to discover in this game. Someday we may even find the true use for the Magic Gourd!
>>3169809
How did you even miss it?
If it's your first time playing, you probably aren't going to dodge the sand traps.
If it's your second time playing, you'll be dying for the ability to run.
>>3171431
I missed it intentionally to see if it was ever forced on me.
>>3172136
The other anon said it does get forced on you. Maybe you have a bugged version of the game or a game version that didn't have that fixed?
>>3168725
God that snake boss was tedious. Now I'm stuck in the swamp. There's as chest I missed but I just can't find the path to it. I hope nothing important is in it because I'm just gonna skip it.
>>3175927
The only decent chest in the swamp has call beads, which are useful but not vital by any means
>see thread
>decide its time for another run of SoE
>boot up game
>blank screen
>oh shit
>check pins
>shiny as fuck
>check console pins
>shiny as fuck
>give it a good q-tippin anyways
>now it boots up
>zero saves
>2 decades worth of saves.. gone
>all alchemy maxed out
>my friends old save gone
>my play from last year is gone
>my mostly melee only save is gone
>suddenly realize saving a save my friend used 20 years ago is slightly creepy
welp...
I forgot how weird this game was
>acquire bone crusher
>survival of the fittest with hit and run tactics
>oh shit petals are precious
>acquire axe
>axe does less damage than bone crusher
>axe is useful for all of 10 muinutes before you get the spear
>also heal because why not
>games on easy street
>>3177801
>axe does shit damage
there is a bug with the game, the Silver Sheath charm (25% sword damage) is always applied at all times
>>3177808
>There's a bug with the game
Ya know the more I play and read about this game, the more prevalent this becomes...
At least spells can't be spammed for cheap easy victory, or charging is useless part level 1 like the two Seiken Densetsus.
>>3177953
Crush makes secret of evermore easymode, getting it to level 9 is easy and profitable because the materials were cheap and killing with it yielded more cash than you needed
>>3175927
>Running through volcano
>Get to section with a bunch of adjoining rooms
>MORE Labyrinthine design (like I said, not terrible, but annoying)
>Get through after backtracking a few times to make sure I didn't miss anything
>Kill grey dude, get Mud Pepper
>... So is it gonna let me down or something?
>Nope, gotta go back through the mazey section
>:^\
Yeah yeah it's not that hard, but while do if feel like this is just the beginning of this shit
I never noticed how great Hardball was before. Crystals are used in late game (energize) and clay is only used for Hard Ball and Defend, and Defend does shit for the most part due to the commonness of healing item drops and being able to stock 99 Heals
>>3181745
And then I left pre-historia and my hard ball which was whacking plants and frogs for 80~ damage now turned to 20-30~ damage vs rogues and monks
>get to the market
>remember this shit from 20 years ago and replays afterwards
>get 99 spice and rice from outside the market in the whirlpool
>finish all the trading and get all the good charms within 8 minutes and Atlas formula
fuckyeah, jade disc, ruby heart, sun stone and armor polish with a moxa stick
>>3179917
I don't know what you expect fag.
There's only two ways to make a 2D dungeon. Straight path or maze-like. They kind of mixed the two for good measure.
>>3184324
I was expecting som bullshit landslide or geyser to let me down so i don't have go through all those rooms again.
I guess this is western vs Japanese design. Western: backtrack entire dungeon - Japanese: use teleport/escape rope/trigger conversation/path that was obscured by stupid camera angle to get back to start easily.
>> Favorite part
When shitheads come saying ti was a great game and deny we didn't got SOM2 because of this pile of shit a bunch of nerds made so they could "have a game made in MURICA" when in reality they just tweaked it.
>>3186658
secret of mana 2 is just the earthbound of the mana series. overly fluffed up mediocre crap
>>3186795
Still better that the pile of shit SoE was.
>>3186795
I disagree. While both are decent games with great music and very broken mechanics, SoM require tedious grinding and hasn't become the symbol of hipster retro gaming circlejerkery.
>>3187634
Doesn't require (as much) tedious grinding**
>>3119756
SoM was one of those games I rented a dozen times and emulated countless more trying to figure out what the fuck people liked about it and what was so intriguing past the initial charm of the characters' introductions, and I'm still unclear, but still quite willing to go back and try to play all the way through.
>>3184961
What dungeons are you talking about?
I can't think of a single dungeon that doesn't let you out another way other than maybe the future one which could double as exploring the world (Which is also the only thing I can think of that does what you're describing besides the swamps which is a one time thing).
>my recent play of secret of evermore is going slowly because of reasons
>this time around I am trying to branch out to other weapons besides the spears and flat out murdering shit with alchemy
>in the desert I use sting/fireball/drain to weaken spiders to kill with sword/axe or to outright kill weeds/skulls
>get charge 1
>now able to one shot stuff in the desert
>realizing I am using the desert to grind
>the fucking desert of doom
>always hated this place as a kid
>getting tossed around trying to rush it
>spending hours trying to find the alchemy recipe I will never use
>didnt discover the easy way to find the alchemy recipe until a few hours go
>first oasis
>then 45 degree angle North East to second oasis
>north to third oasis
>bam alchemy formula
>trying to branch out with alchemy formulas as well besides crush
>Sting is shockingly powerful
>but consumes water
>but healing items are common as fuck drops
>plus Drain is doing its thing
>>3177801
To be fair' it gets easier' in terms of risking death is common in this kind of game.
It's not a good thing by any means, but it's not just evermore's problem.
LttP, Link's Awakening, Secret of Mana, Terranigma...
Few games - Illusion of Time comes to mind - managed to actually keep the fighting interesting until the end.
>>3190710
>>didnt discover the easy way to find the alchemy recipe until a few hours go
>>first oasis
>>then 45 degree angle North East to second oasis
>>north to third oasis
>>bam alchemy formula
What is this fucking sorcery?
>>3191315
Not retro but I'm reminded of Dawn of Mana and how you lose all exp levels every time you progress to a new chapter and how that "feature" got shunned by critics.
>>3125794
>Ebon Keep Town (Cecil's Town)
Mon negre. As >>3151342 said, this was Jeremy Soule's first game, and in all honesty, it's one of his best in my opinion; that doesn't come from nostalgia either, it's a legitimately great sound (especially considering he was only seventeen when he did this game, if I'm remembering right). Cecil's Town was also the first full song he ever composed on his own, and it was before he worked on Secret of Evermore.
>>3182552
You can get the Thug's Cloak too in the arena if you manage to get the Centurion Cape from the weird prophet guy (buy the Bronze Armor in Crustacia, get the Stone Vest from a vendor, do the special thing to get the Centurion's Cape from the prophet). You can also get the Centurion Helmet and Gloves of Ra if you're quick enough to get all the other stuff too.
Probably the worst grind that I've ever had to do in this game though is getting the Chocobo Egg from the Mad Monk in Crustacia. It's kinda funny how little he must value that egg, because it's a fuckton more worthwhile than the Amulet of Annihilation that he's originally trying to peddle to you. If I'm remembering right, you can trade the Chocobo Egg for the Magic Gourd and then get the Egg (as well as any other relics you may have missed in Nobilia) in the market in Gothica.
>>3192583
> Thug's Cloak too in the arena
I did not know this, that prophet guy brushed me off my first visit no matter how much I spoke to him
>>3192583
>Chocobo Egg
Oh I forgot to add just keep buying 5 pots at a time from the woman in the west side of the market. When you run out of spice just walk back outside to the whirlpool and get 99 more spice until you get it.
sell off the extra pots and rice to the chick on the bottom center of the market for profit
>>3193028
Yep. It's usually the very first thing I do when I actually get into Nobilia.
>>3193037
Ah, I forgot that you can get the egg there. I know you can get other stuff (10 Jewels is something I definitely remember, I think I've gotten a Call Bead in there before, but I could just be remembering the Call Beads you can get in the pool).
>>3117068
The main thing I remember about this game is an article for it in Nintendo Power that featured either a screenshot or an illustration of a person trapped inside the giant red bug's chest cavity. I was a huge wuss as a kid, and that gave me nightmares for weeks.
>>3192304
I've literally never found Sting. I know it exists but every time I try, I fail and then I never feel like combing the entire desert for it.
>>3194502
I'm a cheater and used a map for it. I mostly used the oases and then counted bones and such until I found it. I almost got lost twice because of a tumbleweed that was chasing me everywhere.
>>3194959
I don't blame you. Easily one of the hardest formulas to find. The other one is 1up in the forest maze. I only found it once and couldn't find it again.
>>3196809
Corrosion you have to find in Ebon Keep's sewers and have the Oracle Bone to talk to a guy who's only there for a limited time, and Super Heal can only be done (I think) in Ivor Tower's ruins by doing the marbles thing when the person in there is a kid (and I forget if he disappears after you guess right on him once, because if he does, then talking with him as an old man just makes you miss out on the best healing formula in the game).Lance mostly just involves you not being a kleptomaniac for ten goddamn seconds, but because of how entitled a bunch of RPG players think they are, they miss this one a lot. I think it's Fireball that you get in the Halls of Colossia? That one isn't really hard to find so much as it is a bitch to get to it, if I'm remembering correctly.
>>3119716
>why is he even in the game?
He's annual present man and he lives on the moon. Why ask silly questions?
>>3198393
Where's my dog?Is that him in the bottom-left corner?
One thing I hate about this game is the pacing and how weak melee is and how bad it was to level weapons
>hit enemy
>dog gets killshot
>no weapon exp
>dog goes in first
>one shots the enemy
>either need to use a low level alchemy spell first and then finish it off with melee
>or force the dog to sniff the entrance for... evermore
so thats why they call it that
I'm in Roman land and dog keeps sniffing, but for the life of me I can't find whatever he's sniffing at. Is it just a trick?
>>3198627
Dog sniffs the market all the time at all vendors. just a thing
>>3198656
Does it at the Ivor Tower in Gothica too, if I'm remembering right.
>>3196870
I always found Fireball. I think I used Nintendo Power for that one.
I missed Lance the first time but felt bad the second time and ended up getting it by accident.
I've never missed corrosion. I guess always being thorough made it hard to miss for me.
I don't actually remember if I ever got Super Heal. That one seems easy to miss.
What the fuck is this shit? Apparently, I'm meant to switch to the dog or something, except I went ahead, and when I went back he's stuck in the corner of the map.
I had no idea you could switch from the boy to dog (until the bridge, and even then I thought once I'd get the dog some random flag would trigger) and that this was an element they intended to utilise, seriously one character mentioning it would have been nice.
Fuck I hate either the pacing of this game or how shit it is to level up weapons. Spider Axe was not even level 2 before I got the spear
bronze axe was barely level 2 when I got the bronze spear
Really starting to believe what >>3159316 said on just using the Horn Spear
The Crusher Spell reminds me of the "Hand of God" spell from Nox by Westwood Studios. Both make a giant, grey stone hand fall from the sky, and both are overpowered as fuck.
Is 9:98 the max "level" a spell can get in this?
Thanks for the heads up /vr/, otherwise I might have ended up playing this game properly and actually been challenged heh.
>>3201145
9 is the max level for all alchemy spells
>forgot how weak the pyramid was to alchemy attacks
>farm the joint until Sting, Drain and Crush run out of ingredients
>all that slaughtering yielded way more jewels than the cost to replenish
god damn, never used Sting before until now but its on the same level as -
>sudden realization that I am unable to get more vinegar until after Gothica
Fuck this game christ
>>3201620
That always bothered me
>unable to get Clay outside of prehistoria
>huge marketplace with treasures from all over
>endless resources
>no alchemy booth
MEANWHILE...
>some dude in a cave
>gallons of ethanol
>endless bricks of limestone
>no bees in sight but has wax
>>3198503
There is absolutely no reason to level weapons, apart from the first spear.to deal with the swamp boss (and that can be done through alchemy instead).
Also, you do realise that you can set the dog to basically not attack in the menu, yes?
>>3201620
I actually liked that aspect. You grind the fuck out of your formula, you think the rest of the game is a cakewalk much like SoM was, and SUDDENLY NO MORE INGREDIENTS. Fuck. Have to improvise. Almost as if you were actually trapped in a strange world without foreknowledge.
And nicely enough, melee weapons actually matter in the game, so you can switch your approach in gothica.
By the skin of your teeth, admittedly, and you seriously start to count every single ingredient, but you can.
Did a fair bit for immersion, tbqh.
Now, Omnitopia then became a cakewalk in terms of enemies (and 'what the fuck am I supposed to do?' in terms of navigating the maze and its insta-death traps), but I don't think anyone would claim that Omnitopia was well-executed.
>>3202223
Yeah, Omnitopia kinda fell flat. Stuff like making the Petal o' Death guys be invincible was kind of a cheap thing in my opinion, pretty much done just to make you have to go to another room halfway across the place to access one unnecessary room, and all that business. Also, the toaster dog is crazy broken.
Jeremy Soule did the music for Evermore. He also did Total Annihilation.
This dude is glitchy as fuck. Music changes for no reason when you talk to him, Sure is rendered on the wrong line and screws up the formatting.
At least the spell is useful.
>>3119779
>I meant that: he said I was butthurt because it's not a cardboard copy of SoM, but my points were not "SoE is bad because it's not SoM".
>because it's not a cardboard copy of SoM
> cardboard copy
I think you mean "Carbon Copy," there, Ricky.
Tell me this is a joke.
Tell me the game is fucking with me.
I need this to be a joke.
>>3203390
OH THANK SWEET MERCIFUL LORD.
>>3203413
Even after finding the exit I'm glad I checked all the dead ends. Could've missed the Wizard Coin... So uh, what's it for?
>>3203453
It raises Magic Defense. Another way to get it is to already have the Chocobo's Egg when you find the Mad Monk in Crustacia who sells you an Amulet of Annihilation, and he'll give you the Wizard's Coin instead of the Chocobo Egg (seeing as you already have it).
You can also get the Magic Gourd from him if you have the Egg and the Coin already, and if you already have all three, he gives youthree Meteorites instead.
The fuck is this shit? And why I can't I get inside the castle? Something about going to the upper-left cell last locks me out? Is this for real?
Holy shit. This mode 7 is godly. Seiken Densetsu 3 wasn't even this good.
>>3203453
did you save the Oglin when you first got into Gothica? lowering the basket and pulling it up?
>>3203390
green goblin sitting in the tree = right path
you can even see him in the picture anon posted
.>>3203593
u got it, its afaik the only way to get permantly stuck in the game. never do the upper left cell last.
>>3198436
yeah, instead of removing your dog they just moved him to a part where you cant see him. there is even a way to get him back before you even cross the desert.
>>3200787
when your hero or the dog iis controlled by the cpu, it ignore certain trigger or obstacles.
thats also what people use to skip certain parts of the game like triggereing the part where your diamond eyes get stolen for example, get near the trigger, there is a certain line on the screen which triggers the boss fight once you cross it. Once you are close let your dog sniff, once the dog finds something and crosses the line you just switch over to him and you should have crossed the trigger and in this case the boss fight. Something similar is done to instantly enter the vulcano in act1, so you can skip through most of act1.
>wanna replay this game again because dope
>get to the volcano aka telekinesis city
>wonder what would happen if I were to stand under a rock while it levitates on top of me
>rock comes down and pushes me back, trapping me between it and a wall
>can't get out
>lmao
>reset
Lost like half an hour maybe, not too bad. Doing the jewel eye temples now.
>>3204683
I freaking love the music in both of those, although I prefer the sound they have in the Great Pyramid.
Finished for the first time it last night.
Alchemy was nigh useless during the final fight, except maybe Crush on Magmar V2. And even though everyone said that protection spell you get under the chessboard made the game easy mode was wrong, it was just constant tedium of recasting it every time I or dog got hit, which we would happen AS the spell was being applied.
Unless I was using the wrong spell, and people meant Barrier, that shit was dope. I didn't have it, but Camellia could cast it with call beads. That helped immensely.
Overall I found the game to be pretty mediocre. No offense guys, but the level design was annoying, too labyrinthine (the forest being the worst), and the music, while I can admire the idea, personally I just found boring. In a more immersive game like Elderscrolls, it is perfect, I have no doubt, but in this it was just boring and added to the tedium.
I'll give it credit though, the combat design fixed a lot of the issues of SoM and SD3. Weapon charging could go to level 3, any higher was just pointless in SoM and if you didn't get bitch slapped with bullshit counter attacks like in SD3 if you went higher than 1. The alchemy system was great, casting a spell didn't pause the entire battle like in SoM or SoE for over the tops animations, and couldn't be over-spammed like those two. The use of limited availability ingredients also helped nerf it, well, until you were floating in cash that is. If it wasn't for me that, and how overpowered spells would get as they levelled up it would be near perfect.
It's worst flaw is that it's so short - the world is tiny and I bet if the level design wasn't no convuluted you'd have people clearing it (glitch less) less than hour.
At the end of day if I wanna play a game using this "style" I'll probably just play SD3 again with a new team.
>>3205508
>>and couldn't be over-spammed like those two
thats actually not true, you can cast up to 7 spells at the same time by selecting the magic spells while playing the dog.
I wouldnt call it a flaw because its more like an exploit, you had to knew how to perform it.
Otherwise I would agree with you, atleast on that point.
>>3205854
Even then the action wouldn't pause would it? You can still get hit while/just after casting, Whereas SoM it would pause the action for the spell, and as soon as it was over just recast it, so batlles have like 2 seconds of "action" before it just becomes a movie pretty much
>>3205996
That's one reason why I took advantage of loner animations, like what they have for the healing spells. You actually don't get take any damage while the animation is going, and so you can give yourself a bit of prolonged invincibility for awhile, sometimes even the entire length of a boss' attack.
>>3205508
Yeah, as far as fighting in Omnitopia is concerned, you just go with your absurdly broken toaster and the bazooka. Add invincibility (I always do it through the archaeologist's spell that you find in Gothica, the forest to the east in front of the first castle, there's a hidden pathway under the trees, right next to the castle walls) and the quick charge spell, win.
I dunno if it was a general glitch or just my copy, but for Edgar's robot, you could also walk up one of the spots where the monitors used to be (somewhere on the upper left side of the room) and conveniently shoot him from there without him being able to hit you.
The final boss is pretty much a matter of either you crushing him or him crushing you. Not really any middle ground.
Overall, I disagree on the 'mediocre', but I get where you come from. I appreciate the game's sense of humour and how innovative it was, but there is no denying that the execution occasionally fell flat. Dungeon design was poor (environments and enemies were great, though), and most of the alchemy formula were busywork for completionists, and didn't actually add anything to the game (though that's a problem a lot of games had).
And yeah, the game's content was cut down significantly. You'll notice the brief conversations between the big bads in Antiqua and Gothica and the emissary in white robes, and it leads... nowhere. Whatever is planned is never revealed, much of the overarching plot was simply removed, and characters occasionally pop in or out without rhyme or reason. A huge problem and IMO the biggest flaw of the game.
>>3203346
For all the glitches everyone talks about, I never managed to run into any except one which was the infinite bazooka ammo which I didn't even realize was a glitch because I bought 99 every time anyways and never used that much.
>>3210451
Oh so that's why it never seemed like I was using Bazooka ammo.
I would have noticed... But I also just bought 99 when I could.
>>3210451
When I was a kid, that glitch amazed me. Why use a sword when I have infinite ammo with a fucking bazzoka? I did lose the wind Walker once though, that sucked.
>>3210940
Wind Walker>Shuttle, no contest.
>enjoying my evermore run
>get to the forest
>lose interest
>>3117140
That guy wrote the reasons that made him not like the game. Go to be autist somewhere else.
So, just had a go at playing the Balance Hack of this game, and I gotta say, the market in Nobilia had me scrambling to get everything because they went and switched up the prices and locations for everything. I'm just glad that they didn't take out the hidden rice and spice.
>>3119716
>not wanting to save christmas
spotted the jew
>>3214409
/pol/ is that way, why don't you fuck off and don't come back.
>>3204683
I always avoid doing stuff like that in games for this very reason.
>>3203593
I've heard about this but never encountered it despite playing several times before I even knew the glitch existed.
Some people just have bad luck man. Sounds like you're one of them.
>>3204902
The music in this game is really good.
>>3203857
I forget, what does that do?
>>3223952
Makes hin appear in the great woods and give you the Wizarf Coin.
>>3117068
>tfw enjoyed this more than secret of mana
I can't be alone, can I?
>>3225547
I dunno, my recent replay made it feel shallow and pedantic.
>>3211883
The forest was never that big of a deal once you realized the goblin was always in the right direction.
Now finding the alchemy in the forest was a bitch and I only ever found it once by accident before I figured out the goblin thing.
>>3225547
Try the Hard Mode for Secret of mana.
It's actually difficult to beat even at maxed levels.
If you get the item limit booster mod to boost your items to 9, even then it's tough.
>>3214032
I couldn't stand that hack. I really just wanted the basic improvements to alchemy and weapons but not being able to cast spells unless I was at 100% was too annoying for me. Especially since I was never much of an alchemy user except for healing.
>>3226170
okay peter.
shouldn't you be watching tv?
>>3231406
I don't really mind it too much. It's not a long time to wait between castings, and so far as I know, it's mostly so that you can't do the trick where you throw out a shitload of the same spell in quick succession, and then it fucks with the damage formula to do crazy damage on everything.
>>3234316
Doesn't make any sense to me.
Fucking an entire user base because a couple of guys might break the game in their own single player experience seems pretty retarded to me.
It's the same concept with Denuvo/Starforce/etc. They put bullshit on their game to stop the .1% and screw the other 99.9% for no real reason.
Anyways, I just can't play a hack that kills a major portion of the game for me.
>>3225528
That's almost more of a punishment. It's bad enough finding the alchemy formula in the forest without also trying to find the wizard coin.
I fucking HATE this stupid game
I got stuck when you have to control the dog and walk around a pipes maze or something and I couldn't fuind the FUCKING exit no matter how many fucking HOURES I wandered around fuckign ODG
>>3240071
You're probably talking about the castle vents. You must have a shit tier memory. You can get lost but you'd have to eventually find your way out if you're paying attention at all.
>>3238087
>>3240071
>>3242538
My completionist attitude made my explore all the vents and great forest. I draw a map because people said they were tedious and annoying. It really wasn't that bad. If anyone wants the (admitily) shit maps I drew, just say so, though there are probably better ones online.
>>3243423
I'd like to see them. Sometimes it's cool just to see other people's work.
>>3119756
Great soundtrack, loved SoM. I love watch SoE threads getting highjacked by SoM.
SoE was a legitimately mediocre game. But hey, I'd be pissed as well if a game I liked was savaged by critics, largely hated by Square's fanbase and generally forgotten, never to recieve a sequel due to it's poor performance.
>>3203681
Top Kek! sure it was champ, sure it was.
