>promo art
>Pokemon anime
>Pokemon movie
>Smash Bros
>Pokken
How does it make you feel to know that Game Freak and Nintendo sees Charizard X as the main mega for Charizard?
>>25660084
Great.
It's one of my absolute favorite pokemon.
>Charizard was my first starter and is my favorite.
>Blue and Black is my favorite color combination
>Fuckin love dragons and shit
>Playstyle is primarily DD sweeper but with a massive amount of versatility, almost exactly what I build my teams off of
>Not even kidding, always loved the look of flames pouring out of a creature's mouth in idle
It's literally made for me. I am literally the embodiment of what the contrarians of /vp/ hate the most.that being said, Zard Y is fucking great too.
>>25660084
Wasn't Charizard Y on the box art for super PMD? Not much, but it's something.
>>25660084
Why wouldn't they? Charizard Y is barely different in design than regular Charizard. If they were going to market one of its megas, X was the way to go.
>>25660115
What? Y changes Charizards form far more than X. X mostly just changes it's color scheme and gives it the flames in it's mouth.
Meanwhile, Mewtwo's Megas seems fairly even on the promo distribution. I wonder why.
Pretty sad as I think Mega Charizard Y is infinitely superior.
>>25660134
I think it's because none of them are really all that popular, so there's no need to tend towards either.
In Smash, Y was chosen purely from Sakurai's discretion as the Final Smash was using a long ranged psychic attack, so it thematically fit more.. there was no pressure to include it out of fanservice or anything.
Who gives a shit? Its Charizard.
I like it better than Y so I personally don't mind.
But as a long time Raichu fan, I can sympathize with Y fans.
>top 5 design
>fire/dragon typing
>movepool
I have no problem with it
>>25660127
>Y changes Charizards form far more than X
That's not what people were saying when they first saw it.
Anyway it's that color change that makes it noticeable over Y.
>>25660153
WAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
>>25660202
This is myOPINION
Charizard X looks like a shitty deviantart fanfiction from some angsty 15 year olds imagination.
Also those wings. Who the fucking fuck thought that looked good.
>>25660284
Your opinion is retarded on several levels
But hey that's myOPINION
>>25660127
Charizard Y is just Add More Spikes. X is the more drastic change.
Charizard Y is better in my opinion, I'd actually much prefer X but the stupid flame moustache completely kills it
X >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Y
Sun >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Moon
>>25660137
Why Zard-Y so much cuter?
>>25660115
I don't understand this. To me X does look drastically different at a glance but to really look at it the only thing that changes are it's color, it grows hardly noticeable shoulder spikes and it gets mouth flame. On the other hand, Y gets another head spike, back spike, spikes by flame on tail and arm wings. If anything Y is changed more but more closely resembles vanilla Charizard while X looks drastically different
>>25660292
Anal rupture detected.
>>25660142
>In Smash, Y was chosen purely from Sakurai's discretion as the Final Smash was using a long ranged psychic attack, so it thematically fit more..
And meanwhile, all M-Zard X does is fly around and shoot Fire Blasts. This will never not inflame my autism. It loses its flying typing for fuck's sake.
disappointed but not surprised
>>25660137
This
Zard Y is much better designed
Zard X is literally just le edgy black and blue with spikes added + a dragon typing
>>25660084
They both will be the mascot of a game anyway
>>25660709
Eh, X was probably chosen from the design just like Greninja.
>>25660101
>gives opinion on vp
>receives 0 hate
Damn son
Mega Charizard Y actually looks like a fucking evolution. It's larger, it's more streamlined, it's slick looking, it's like if they'd made an evolution to Charizard back in Gen 1, that's how it would look. The battle damaged wings show age and wisdom, like it's been through some serious shit, and is still fighting for it's trainer. The visible fangs are also a nice throwback and a nice touch. It's the perfect progression of the Charizard line, and a strong 9/10 across the board for me.
Mega Charizard X on the other hand, is just a fucking recolor with added spikes. It's supposed to look more like a ''dragon'', and yet the feathered, weird wings (because Dragons have weird wings like that?) the alien color scheme, and the lack of a third horn on the forehead (which is also a fucking stupid design choice, considering the whole point was that Charmander = 0 horns, Charmeleon = 1 horn, Charizard = 2 horns, and M-Charizard-Y = 3 horns) all result in one clusterfuck of a form. It doesn't even grow bigger either, it just gets over cluttered with details, so when Charizard Mega Evolves, it just looks like he turned shiny.
Also, were the permanent clusters of fire latched onto it's mouth really necessary?? Yeah, I get that they were going for the ''overflowing with dragony goodness'' touch, but they're so big they cover up the rest of the design, and they look terrible rendered as a part of the model in 3D.
It's such an obvious edgy fanservice design. They should have given M-Charizard-Y the Dragon typing and left it at that. Now players who choose Charmander have an even bigger advantage with more competitive options. Fucking great.
If you want to see what 2 Mega Evolutions for one Pokemon looks like when done RIGHT, just look at Mewtwo.
>>25660391
Suniggers everybody
>>25660084
>pokemon movie
It has not been in a movie and will not be in the next
I honestly don't get the appeal of Charizard X. While I can overlook the shoulder spikes, the mouth flames, and the wing shape, the change from orange to black was completely unnecessary and makes the entire design just awful.
Someone who actually likes the design, please explain. It's mind boggling how horrible it looks.
>>25661976
It's thematic. Zard Y is all about the power of the sun, while Zard X brings to mind a solar eclipse. The wings represent a corona, and the coloration evokes darkness with that tinge of light behind it.
>>25660101
I don't like you and think your opinion stinks almost as bad as you do. Also I hope you step in chewing gum.
>people hating on X for being more popular
Never change.
>>25662033
>>25662033
But that's just trying to find vague meaning that most likely isn't there. From a design standpoint, Charizard X is just an overly cluttered version of normal Charizard.
>>25660137
I'd like Charizard Y more if its hands didn't degenerate into stumps.
>>25662033
That is honestly the stupidest thing I've ever heard
>>25662064
How? Fucking look at it, it's a mess. If you've actually read the thread at all, people are giving genuine reasons why they don't like Charizard X.
>>25662067
>themes aren't real if it invalidates my complaints
>>25660726
God I hope not
Charizard!Fanboys are bad enough without giving them more fuel.
>>25662089
...but of course it isn't fucking real?
Do you honestly think Game Freak designed Mega Charizard X to ''evoke darknes'' with wings that ''represent a corona''? They designed it to be a typical ''dark'' edgy fanservice character, because they knew that not giving Charizard a Dragon typing fans would roast them alive. It exists only for that reason.
>>25662089
What you're doing is called reaching for straws anon. Just because one has a certain theme doesn't mean the counterpart has to have a similar theme to it. It was designed the way it was because kids love things that have spikes and are edgy.
>>25662076
Official art proves it though
See >>25660726
pokemon fans are second only to zelda fans in treating stupid fan theory headcanon bullshit as true with no actual evidence.
>>25662349
Good god is their nothing you idiots will leave be without trying to draw nonsensical connections to? This is beyond a stretch of the most foolish imagination.
>>25660137
I agree
>>25660101
I actually agree on everything.
Only that I like Y as much, so I always have problems deciding between the two.
>ZardY
>adds spikes
>changes a few things
>changes wings
>tries to progress on the flying type theme
>"woah it's so good! It adds shit but doesn't change too much from the original design"
>"muh patterns explanation clearly show it's the superior design!"
>ZardX
>adds spikes
>changes a few things
>changes wings
>changes the color palette to explore the dragon type theme
>"fucking nasty! It's just Charizard with some shit pasted on!"
>"reasonably theme to why it changed the color? shut the fuck up fag!!!"
>"edgy edgy edgy!!!!"
I love Y and I think it's the best of the two for the great work it does at keeping Charizard's original theme, but fuck me, Y-fans tend to have the argumentative capabilities of a teenager.
>>25662086
>genuine reasons
"edgy, edgy, edgy", "too many spikes" and "it looks like deviantart shit" aren't genuine reasons.
>>25663329
You're ignoring the strong arguments posed in the thread, dumbing down everything people are saying, and trying to be some smartass on the higher ground here without adding anything to the discussion. You're not anything special.
>>25663434
>You're ignoring the strong arguments posed in the thread.
What arguments? "Edgy" and "the color change does not make sense because I don't like it"?
>dumbing down everything people are saying
No, I'm not "dumbing down" anything. I'm just summarizing it.
If anything people saying that ZardX is a "cluttered" mess is dumbing down the reasons behind it's design already posted.
>You're not anything special.
That's good to know, it was not my intention.
Calling me a smartass doesn't add anything to the discussion either, by the way.
>>25663427
...? Yes, they ARE.
If people want a Mega Evolution that actually looks like a Mega - Evolution, then that's a perfectly good reason to attack X's design.
Every Mega Evolution takes the design and does something new with it. Slamence, Slowbro, Blastoise, Ampharos, etc. The Pokemon grows in size, it's shape changes in a drastic way that affects it's overall design in an impacting way, and even if it doesn't change a WHOLE lot (Mega Sableye comes to mind) the IDEA behind the Pokemon changes. It's doing something different, it's shaped differently. I don't want to use the word gimmick, but evolutions designed specifically for battle, which is what Mega Evolutions ARE, should be offering something inherently new.
With M-Charizard Y we get this. It has extra wings on it's body, it's thinner, and it has bigger wings - It's streamlined. It's like a aerodynamic raptor.
What the FUCK is M-Charizard X doing? It's literally a black Charizard with bits and pieces thrown on it. If you photoshopped away all of X's little spikes and flames and random flecks of blue, you'd get a Charizard. That's not an evolution, that's lazy.
>>25660170
>top 5 design
>>25663537
>If people want a Mega Evolution that actually looks like a Mega - Evolution
This is the point where your whole argument falls apart.
There is no set design for a mega evolution, they can look however they want to be.
>>25663537
Wow, Y kids sure do get mad.
I mean the entire crux of your argument is
>Y is better because I can remove all the differences from X and say it's the same!
Also Mega Y is the prime example of how not to do a mega evolution, especially since that "streamlining" doesn't do anything for the actual speed of the pokemon while you can look at the other pokemon, even mega X, and see instantly what was increased or changed.
>>25663572
...but then I go on to say that EVERY MEGA EVOLUTION has done something that Mega Charizard X HASN'T done. This makes Mega Charizard X the one Mega Evolution that HASN'T performed under said actions that every single Mega has, making it a flawed Mega Evolution, even under the ''set design'' for Megas. Cause and effect, my argument still makes perfect sense. Did you even read what I said?
>>25660084
Good I always loved the color blue.
Even if the black is unnecessary I still like this version. Besides we could have gotten worse, we could have got a red and black charizard.
>>25663537
You cannot be serious.
Your first paragraph explains that for you a megaevolution has to be a dramatic change without deviating to much.
Then you proceed to say how Y, the one that barely changes (wings and horns) is the good and how X, the one that deviates from Charizard's theme is bad?
You say even though Sableye is the same, the mega is good because it changes the idea behind it. Isn't that exactly what X does? (new typing).
Yet your reasoning is that X is "the same".
You contradict yourself also you're treating mega evolution like it has been in an instruction book written in stone for ages when they're relatively a new thing.
>Yes, they ARE.
If you really think "edgy", "spikes" and "deviantart" are actual arguments outside of fun shitposting I'm afraid you have been too long in this board.
>>25663632
>..but then I go on to say that EVERY MEGA EVOLUTION has done something that Mega Charizard X HASN'T done.
By removing every aspect that sets X apart.
There is no place on the planet that would accept that as a valid argument retard.
Then there's the fact that the sane argument and logic can be used against Y.
>my argument still makes perfect sense.
In what world?
You're making less sense than Pamperchu.
>>25663632
>I go on to say that EVERY MEGA EVOLUTION has done something that Mega Charizard X HASN'T done
So you're saying that every mega does its own thing and that makes then good, then Charizard X does its thing and that makes it shit. The fuck?
>Cause and effect, my argument still makes perfect sense.
Cause and effect, It doesn't at all.
>>25660084
>How does it make you feel to know that Game Freak and Nintendo sees Charizard X as the main mega for Charizard?
I couldn't care less if I tried really hard.
>>25660084
Normal mega charizard x has the superior mega color scheme but mega charizard y has the superior shiny mega color scheme.
>>25663695
Word.
>>25663623
>Y kids sure do get mad
woah shit, we've got a badass over here! XD Can't formulate a good argument? Just act like a cunt.
>I mean the entire crux of your argument is
>Y is better because I can remove all the differences from X and say it's the same!
? Yeah? Sure, I guess you could put it that way. I mean, name one Pokemon that evolves into a recolor with more fire and spikes. Please, I'll wait.
>especially since the ''streamlining'' doesn't do anything for the actual speed of the pokemon while you can look at the other pokemon, even mega X, and see instantly what was increased or changed.
What the hell is that supposed to mean? You can't see the difference between M-C-Y and Charizard? Of course you can. You can see the difference between M-C-X and Charizard as well, obviously, but the differences that Y offers to Charizards original concept are much greater and more significant than that of X. If that isn't a valid criticism, I don't know what else you want to accept into your head.
I'm just here to say that everyone that says something is edgy because it's black should be permabanned for being underaged. And retarded, but mostly the first.
![[PM]Pocket_Monsters_XY_Movie_1_-_The_Cocoon_of_Destruction_and_Diancie[H264_1080P][6885C5FA].mkv_snapshot_00.07.41_[2016.03.21_22.54.39].png](https://i.imgur.com/nfPccxH.jpg "[PM]Pocket_Monsters_XY_Movie_1_-_The_Cocoon_of_Destruction_and_Diancie[H264_1080P][6885C5FA].mkv_snapshot_00.07.41_[2016.03.21_22.54.39].png")
>>25661703
It appears for 10 seconds or so during the "hurr wats a pockeyman?" segment at the start of the Diancie movie, and gets more screentime than any other Pokemon in that segment.
>>25663740
>Yeah? Sure, I guess you could put it that way. I mean, name one Pokemon that evolves into a recolor with more fire and spikes. Please, I'll wait.
Not him but
Audino
Blaziken
The lati
Hell blaziken literally follows the same design scheme as X with the flowing flames and contrasting black as well as additional spikes.
>What the hell is that supposed to mean?
He means that it's obvious what what boosted on the other megas but it's vague on Y zard.
I mean, it's streamlined but isn't any faster and you can't exactly see the special change while X zard accentuates the arms.
Realistically Y probably should have gotten the flames but I suppose the blue flames also represent a power increase too since blue flames are hotter than orange.
>>25663832
>the Diancie movie
Remember when everyone thought it would feature all of the current megas in a sort of battle royal?
>>25663671
>>25663679
>>25663654
Mega Charizard X has the same exact size as Charizard.
Taking away the little flecks, dips, and pointy bits, it has the same exact base SHAPE as Charizard.
Mega Charizard X is literally a spiky Charizard in black and blue.
Yes, it offers new design traits, but compare Mega Charizard X to Mega Mawile, or Mega Slowbro, or Mega Swampert. The Pokemon actually fucking EVOLVES.
>hurr the color black isn't always edgy
>hurr charizard gets a new typing so it doesn't NEED to look interesting!
I'm pretty sure every new Mega changes up the typing of the Pokemon it upgrades, and every time, there's a significant change. I could literally photoshop a picture of M-Charizard-X on Photoshop right now from a picture of a standard Charizard. You can't do that with any other Mega except maybe Audino, at a big stretch.
The only decent argument any of you have given me so far is
>there are no rules for Mega Evolution
You know what? fair enough. fine. I don't make the games, fuck if I know what goes on in GF studios. But I know simple shapes and changes when I see them, and Charizard X is INCREDIBLY simple a deviation from the Pokemon it ''evolves'' from.
>>25663882
No. What kind of retarded places did you go to where people thought that?
>>25663887
>But I know simple shapes and changes when I see them, and Charizard X is INCREDIBLY simple a deviation from the Pokemon it ''evolves'' from.
That's because you're literally saying "no these changes don't count!" like a fucking retard.
>>25663740
>the differences that Y offers to Charizards original concept are much greater and more significant than that of X
No, but it seems to be like that for you because you're dismissing the color change and the details for whatever reason.
>I mean, name one Pokemon that evolves into a recolor with more fire and spikes
Not him, but that's one of the subtlests goal post moving I've ever seen around here.
What he was saying is that it doesn't matter if it's spikes or the color, the point is that you're invalidating them because, according to your own arguments, if you remove those things (what makes CharX a mega) it's just Charizard.
Very well, let's see other pokemon that are just themselves if you remove the "details" that make them megas:
>Ampharos - hair
>Blastoise - cannons placement
>Kangaskhan - baby change
>Aerodactyl - spikes
>Houndoom - iron armor thing and horns
>Manectric - giant ray hair
>Absol - fur wings
>Abomasnow - more fur and ice back-spikes
>Pidgeot - hair change and new color
>Steelix - crystal spikes and new color
>Sableye - Sableye with a gem
>Altaria - more fluff
>Diancie - more crystal stuff pasted on it
Your argument falls apart because you'll just trivialize Charizard X changes ignoring the fact that you can do that with almost every mega.
And your only reasoning to trivialize X's specifically is "edgy" and "spikes", which are not real arguments no matter how hard you want them to be.
>>25663908
>Taking away the little flecks, dips, and pointy bits, it has the same exact base SHAPE as Charizard.
>Yes, it offers new design traits, but compare Mega Charizard X to Mega Mawile, or Mega Slowbro, or Mega Swampert. The Pokemon actually fucking EVOLVES.
Look, if you're not going to read what I'm saying, please don't bother replying. I'm not trying to cause WW III.
>>25663900
Where were you when the early trailers came out?
Everyone here was saying that it would feature every mega because of them.
>>25660084
I love it. Blue and black is a cool colour scheme and it looks like a real dragon.
I unironically like all the edges and spikes too.
I honestly love Charizard for being the only Flying starter and a speedy dragon, and his Mega Y for the large wings, special wall breaking, and instant Drought, but because my brother historically loved him first (we always had beef for liking the same thing), and because admitting your love for him is practically eye-roll-inducing in the Poke community, I don't really use him.
>>25663936
>Look, if you're not going to read what I'm saying, please don't bother replying. I'm not trying to cause WW III.
Oh it seems like someone is starting to see reason and back down.
You are literally saying that the drastic changes aren't drastic because it suits your argument.
I mean the biggest argument against X in the early days was that it looked too different and Mega Y looks closer.
>>25663942
Not in the same retarded threads as you, thankfully.
>>25663972
Oh so you skipped that point in time then.
>>25663936
>Yes, it offers new design traits, but compare...
The problem here is that you seem to think CharX is the only mega that barely changes the original, when half the megas do the same.
Mega Swampert is not the standard for the mega evolution: there isn't a standard for mega evolutions.
And again, Char Y changes even less than X.
>>25663965
>we always had beef for liking the same thing
Because one of you had to buy something other than charizard? Or is it another reason.
I like Megazard X, but his shoulder spikes is just one step too far for me personally. Plus, his spikes-for-wings looks good in the official art and anime, but the 3D render looks like shit
>>25664000
I don't know how any of you noticed the shoulder spikes, I never saw them until I saw people here pointing them out as a point against it
They seem like a pretty minor detail
>>25664000
>the 3D render looks like shit
The 3D makes half the pokemon look like shit, even if slightly so.But I shouldn't say that or I could be accused of sprite lover, which I am.
>>25663998
He was the older brother, so he always thought he had priority to like something first, and if I ever liked the same thing, I was just "ripping him off."
I also have a best friend who hates it when other people like the same thing he likes, so it's been engrained in me growing up to avoid admitting to like something everyone else likes.
God I wish more Megas were designed like Y. Too many Megas look drastically different from the base mon for my liking
Can we all just agree the best Mega isMegazam?
>>25664052
Ah so you're the younger brother everyone thought was dorky and only did stuff because your older sibling did it.
I can relate.
Then I started invoking dibs among my friends.
>>25664070
Honestly this. Mega Tyranitar comes to mind for me. I hate the way they just went crazy with the spikes everywhere. Yes, he had spikes already, but they weren't overwrought like his Mega's.
>>25664081
>not megacham
>not megagross
>>25660084
name: Moonfire the charizard
level: 100
type: dragon/fire
abilities: can breathe in space, can melt through steel beams
enemies: nathan (fuck off nathan stop stealing my fucking level x cards you cunt) knuckles, tails, sonic
friends: shdow the hedgheog
>>25660084
Gengars still got alot more on Charizard
>>25664000
>>25664012
Thinking about it more, I think it's not necessarily the spikes, but the blue coloring to the tips of both the shoulder spikes and horns that makes me dislike them. I feel like that's a step too far in the coloring department. If the tips for both the horns and spikes were made black, I think my eyes wouldn't be drawn to them.
>>25664145
>being this desperate
Look just stop anon, you're embarrassing yourself.
>>25664167
For instance, the spikes on the wings are black, so my eyes gloss over them as part of the wing as a whole, and I think the shoulder spikes should have followed suit.
>>25664145
forgot to add the mandetory deviantart copyrighted watermark
>>25660391
This is what Sunfags actually believe
>>25664213
>not being the child of the sun
>>25663970
>Oh it seems like someone is starting to see reason and back down.
the fuck are you talking about? just because i'm not getting all up in arms about it doesn't mean i've given up on what I think.
It seems people can't understand that Y changes Charizard's form in a more meaningful way than X. People keep changing the goalposts or taking small snippets of what I'm saying and accounting that as my entire argument. It's not worth the trouble anymore.
>>25660284
>Charizard X looks like a shitty deviantart fanfiction from some angsty 15 year olds imagination.
Luckily, those are most of the people who liked Charizard in the first place. So it's a good design from that perspective.
>>25664263
>It seems people can't understand that Y changes Charizard's form in a more meaningful way than X. People keep changing the goalposts or taking small snippets of what I'm saying and accounting that as my entire argument. It's not worth the trouble anymore.
That's because the majority of your arguments are meaningless and do nothing to bolster your point.
Anyway you're calling one meaningful while the other not for no reason just for the sake of an argument despite the fact that the same rules apply to Y.
Your arguments barely make any sense.
>>25664263
Your hole argument is that you don't consider X's changes valid because if you remove then you only got Charizard and according to you that's the only mega that does that.
However, you were already proven wrong here >>25663918
>>25664298
But my ''arguments'' are FACTS.
Mega Charizard X is in the exact same shape as standard Charizard. It's the only Evolution that simply takes an existing design, and adds stuff onto it, instead of CHANGING it. Why can't people see that? I'm not the only person that thinks this, either:
>>25664145
>>25661976
>>25661692
>>25660713
>>25660127
>>25660137
Charizard Y takes Charizard and evolves it further. It's wings are bigger, it's tail is longer, it's entire body is bigger, etc.
Charizard X has quite a few changes, yes. And if you like them? Whatever, fine. But those changes don't serve any purpose at all other than to look threatening. It isn't even the first time Charizard's gone black, either - it's shiny form is black for fucks sakes.
>>25664341
>But my ''arguments'' are FACTS.
Oh god, you're one of those.
>>25663918
You can't just try and derail someones argument by vaguely describing, in the most simple, quick way possible, the changes that came with each Mega. That's bullshit. All of those designs change the Pokemon drastically for numerous reasons.
>>25664358
Fine, please disprove anything I said. I'm not saying ''Charizard X is bad because of these reasons I PERSONALLY DON'T LIKE''
It's clear as crystal. Charizard X is the same shape as Charizard, and it's the same size. The only changes made are spikes, flames, and a new color. Apparently this is a lie for some reason.
>>25664362
>You can't just try and derail someones argument by vaguely describing, in the most simple, quick way possible, the changes that came with each Mega
That's exactly, and I mean literally what you have been doing with CharX changes.
>All of those designs change the Pokemon drastically for numerous reasons.
Ok, I don't know what the fuck is going on with this conversation anymore.
You have to be blind, some of those change even less than CharX.
>>25664341
>But my ''arguments'' are FACTS.
Opinions aren't facts anon, this is something you should learn in primary school.
Also two of those posts are yours.
One is disappointed that the color changes it too much which doesn't bolster your point at all.
One is unrelated to the design.
Another anon is saying that Y looks like a natural evolution while X changes too much.
So where exactly are you making sense here?
>be 27
>Charizard has been my favorite Pokemon since Day 1 of Red
>always thought he was a fire/dragon NOT fire
>he finally gets fire/dragon typing
>his design looks like a Pokemon that loves to fight and wouldn't be afraid to fight anything
You can't never change my opinion on him. X is GOD TIER along with Nidoking and Gengar.
>>25664394
>''Charizard X is bad because of these reasons I PERSONALLY DON'T LIKE''
That is literally what you're doing.
It's called an opinion and a fairly unpopular one at that.
>>25664394
>The only changes made are spikes, flames, and a new color
That and the wings, yes.
The problem is that you say that's a bad mega design because is normal Charizard with shit pasted over it. Then you have things like Ampharos, Pidgeot, etc, already explained in >>25663918 and you try to say that is not the same case.
All you're doing is trivializing X changes just because. I can do the same.
All Char Y does is change the wings, add spikes and tiny wings and a horn, and change a bit the color on the belly.
>>25664341
>entire body is bigger
how the fuck do you know
maybe it scales down to be the same height
megas don't have height/weight details
and ZARD Y hasn't been in the anime yet
>>25664398
>You have to be blind, some of those change even less than CharX.
>>25664145
>Different wing shape
>blue and black color scheme
>spikes on the shoulders
Some of those Megas you listed literally changed their entire body shape when they evolve. I mean christ, you seemed to make Abomasnow's changes seem so little, when in fact Mega Abomasnow is a COMPLETELY different SHAPE. I didn't even know there was a Mega Abomasnow until you mentioned it, and it's an absolute tank. You and I both know that argument alone doesnt make any sense, and yet you did it with like 14 other Megas too.
IS it that hard to see that Charizard X is just black charizard with a few bits and pieces added? Or am I literally going insane? Please tell me that special addition that Charizard X has that makes it so different from Charizard.
>>25664489
First, Abomasnow is the same shape, it just gets on its fours and gets more fluffy.
Second, I find great that you choose the one that changes the most from the ones cited in that post.
What about Ampharos? What about Aeordactyl? What about Absol? What about Sableye?
No, of course those aren't interesting to mention, as they break your argument completely.
Now to the best part:
>You and I both know that argument alone doesnt make any sense, and yet you did it with like 14 other Megas too
Exactly. You and I both know that argument alone doesn't make any sense at all, and yet you insist to do it with CharX for no real reason beyond "spikes and color does not count because I say so!!!!".
>IS it that hard to see that Charizard X is just black charizard with a few bits and pieces added?
Not really. CharX is what you said, the problem, for the thousandth time, is that you argue that makes CharX a bad mega because it's the only mega like that, when in reality half of the megas are exactly like CharX regardless of how much you want to dumb down the spikes and black-blue color.
>>25664473
It's tail is longer, it's legs are more bird like in shape with more weight on the heels making it taller, and it's wings are noticeably bigger. plus, it's body is just generally longer and more snake-like. If you Mega Evolve it in the games, you'll see the change easily.
>>25664489
>IS it that hard to see that Charizard X is just black charizard with a few bits and pieces added? Or am I literally going insane?
You're trivialising the additions anon.
For example
Ampharos just gets some more hair and beads.
Venusaur just gets some more flowers
Altaria just gets more clouds.
Pigeot cuts it's hair save for a strand of pink.
You get the picture and the majority of megas can be summed up like that too.
That is your entire argument.
Nothing more nothing less.
>>25664580
>What about Ampharos? What about Aeordactyl? What about Absol? What about Sableye?
Please read what I said earlier:
>Every Mega Evolution takes the design and does something new with it. Slamence, Slowbro, Blastoise, Ampharos, etc. The Pokemon grows in size, it's shape changes in a drastic way that affects it's overall design in an impacting way, and even if it doesn't change a WHOLE lot (Mega Sableye comes to mind) the IDEA behind the Pokemon changes. It's doing something different, it's shaped differently. I don't want to use the word gimmick, but evolutions designed specifically for battle, which is what Mega Evolutions ARE, should be offering something inherently new.
If there isn't a noticeable change in design, pose, shape, size, or ANY of those things, it at LEAST has to have an IDEA behind it. Mega Kanghaskhan, yeah it doesnt change, but the baby in the pouch gets out instead. Mega Sableye, gets bigger, bares it's teeth, and has this huge shield to help it battle. A nice idea.
Charizard X has no idea behind it. It was just Game Freak quickly throwing an extra bit of fanservice together for fans who demanded a Dragon type for Charizard. Even Mega Gallade has more changes, and a nice three muskateers theme going on, too. Being a different colour isn't a theme, and having a tiny bit more fire isnt doing anything either.
>>25660084
None of them should have existed
>>25664664
>Charizard X has no idea behind it.
>Being a different colour isn't a theme
The idea, and theme, is that it changed its basic nature by changing to dragon type.
For starters that's why the wings are like that: from all the dragon types the only one that seems to have "normal wings" is Dragonite, and even in that case they're too tiny to be realistic.
We all get that it changed very little, you're the one not getting why it changed to black-blue and the like.
>>25664682
>>25664675
I like how it's gotten to the point where you two don't even have to try any more while this other guy is getting extremely mad.
>>25664716
That and the flames represent an overall power boost along with the body adapting to it.
>>25664601
You're forcing me to use ''arguments'' again. I don't need arguments for this. This requires common sense and a good eye.
>>25660084
Look at it. Fucking LOOK at it. It's literally a black Charizard with different wings and fire. You can't compare any other Mega to Mega Charizard X. Each and every one takes the design and evolves it further or does something INTERESTING.
Yes, it's my OPINION that Charizard X is a poor design, that's obvious. I'm willing to accept my opinion isn't fact. but it's a straight up FACT that it DOESN'T CHANGE THE ORIGINAL CHARIZARD'S DESIGN MUCH.
I don't CARE if any of you like it. Go ahead, have it in your team. It's not my job to tell you waht to enjoy. But If you cant see that Charizard X looks extremely similar to it's original form besides a few small details, then I give up. I keep regurgitating the same thing here, it's getting boring.
>but anon, your argument is etc.
>anon, mega ampharos just gets a groovy new hair style, etc.
Do I really NEED an argument? It's a simple act of observation. Heck, go to the ''disappointing Megas'' thread in the catalog, I've seen at least one person make the same complaint.
>>25664753
>This requires common sense and a good eye.
I couldn't agree more yet you keep on going over the same points that people have argued against and put 6 feet under.
>>25664721
>referring me to replies that I've already replied to hours ago
??? The lack of trying isn't contributing to anything.
>>25664772
Well it would help if you did give them actual arguments rather than rehashing your opinion over and over again.
Everyone is telling you why you're wrong and you're sticking your fingers in your ears and repeating the same thing over and over again.
>>25664753
>but it's a straight up FACT that it DOESN'T CHANGE THE ORIGINAL CHARIZARD'S DESIGN MUCH
And, for the thousand first time, we are not saying you're wrong in that.
We're just saying that the fact it does not change a lot does not immediately makes it a bad mega design when half the others megas does the same.
Your answer to that is that CharX is the only one that lacks an idea then, but it does not >>25664716 >>25664731
It is a bad design? Yeah it can be, but not for those reasons.
I, for example, can find justifications to everything except the shoulder spikes, which are in my opinion completely unnecessary and makes me like more CharY.
You want to claim that your opinion is that you don't like CharX changes?
Yeah, you don't need arguments for that.
You want to claim that CharX is objectively a bad design?
Then yes, you do need arguments for that.
>>25664721
I was going to say "getting extremely mad" was an exaggeration until I saw that next post. Holy shit.
But yeah, we've reached the point where he's using circular reasoning.
>>25660391
The Police - Walking On The Moon
Smash Mouth - Walking On The Sun
Choose one.
>>25664798
Well, whatever.
I've spoken my case. Let's just agree to disagree on this.
My argument was that Charizard X lacks any kind of idea, premise, or noticeable alterations behind it besides the need for a dragon type. To me, that's pretty much a given. But discussing aesthetics and cosmetic changes is extremely tricky for the same way modern art is hard to discuss. In the end, whatever. It's impossible to make clear facts on something so visual based. Let's just end this discussion on this.
>>25664813
Please refer to this: >>25664772
keep this thread from that kind of shitposting and actually read what I'm saying. Thanks.
>>25664851
>Let's just agree to disagree on this.
That I can agree.
Just to be clear, I don't disagree on the fact that CharX changes just a few things.
In the end our only discrepancy, which is the base of the entire discussion, is in believing or not if there's an "idea" or "reason" behind CharX.
It's obvious, as you said, that we aren't going to convince the other of the contrary, so yeah is better to end it here.
Let me say that not all people have the courage to put an end to a discussion that is going nowhere, regardless of if they're right or wrong, and I appreciate that.
I can't talk for the rest, but if some of my comments seemed pejorative it was just due to the heat of the discussion and I apologize.
Welp, back to play some Stardew Valley I guess.
>>25662158
>>25662179
http://writing.upenn.edu/~taransky/Barthes.pdf
>>25660415
>posting resizes
this fucking board
....fuck it
MEGA EVOLUTION WAS A MISTAKE
There, I said it.
I still don't understand how this board, which was extremely disappointed when they were announced, shifted to have hypothetical mega threads every day and forget about based old
crossevos.
Both designs make a lot of sense actually
MegaCharizard Y expands on Charizard's salamander theme. As a mythological creature salamanders had the ability to cross fire unscathed, hence Drought (it produces a lot of heat); it also expands on his reptilian features, as there's a kind of lizard which flies (glides actually) thanks to membranes attached to its arms and back (like MegaCharizard Y's arm wings).
MegaCharizard X on the other hand is meant to expand on the dragon theme; western dragons are portrayed as evil creatures, hence the black colour it takes upon mega evolving. The blue flames chromatically complement this quite nicely and blue flames are hotter than blue flames (so the heat power boost is here represented by that). The spikes, well... they're not its best design feature, but I think they fit in with its Tough Claws ability? idk
(Unrelated but I had a Mega Charizard X in my playthrough, named him Fafnir)
>>25665208
bullshit.
Mega Evolution is a good concept, and all the designs are great. Not saying they all LOOK great, but the concept behind them is usually neat and they don't just make the Pokemon "bigger" (a sin a lot of regular evolutions commit) but actually expand on it and are nice for temporary boosted forms.
>>25665217
>The spikes, well... they're not its best design feature, but I think they fit in with its Tough Claws ability? idk
Theyre probably the most non-essential element, but I dont think theyre completely erroneous. Dragons, especially Pokemon in particular, use a thematic "curved claw" look for a lot of their generic dragons. Dragon's fang item, the dragon statues in several gyms, etc.. all use that look. Furthermore, Pokemon treats Dragons in a slightly different way (similar to how Monster Hunter treats them, actually) where they are almost a status symbol more than a strict biological form. Tons of examples of this exist ranging from the elite nature of nearly all Dragon types, several non draconoid forms being Dragons, and several pokemon that "ascend" into the form or have connections through bloodline.
It's a really rough conception, and likely something that exists largely in the back of their minds as designers, but because of this, similar dragon-like elements carry more weight to them.
I initially took the shoulder spikes as a small touch to elicit that look and feel of a dragon, further establishing the change.
>The blue flames chromatically complement this quite nicely and blue flames are hotter than blue flames
This I also believe to be a reference to the astral nature of the protrayal of dragons in pokemon.
>>25660084
Good. It's design is amazing. Everyone decent loves the X.
Those Charizard Y fags are probably the same losers that will choose Moon.
>>25665217
Fafnir is a fucking great name for a Zard
>>25665305
>they are almost a status symbol more than a strict biological form
debatable.
the only Dragon Pokémon I can think of that do not look like as any culture's portrayal of an actual dragon are
Flygon, based on a DRAGONfly
Ampharos... its japanese name is DenRYU
Altaria, which is based on a Chinese legendary bird often portrayed with a Dragon's head
Kingdra, based on a seaDRAGON
Tyrantrum... this is a difficult one, maybe a nod to the fact that dinosaur's remains were considered Dragon remains by some ignorant/denial folk at the beginning of the fossil discoveries? idk lol
The only case for which you may be right is Sceptile, the Dragon type is there just to add wow factor (and competitive appeal)
>>25665375
Goodra?
I've also never seen anything that Bagon or Shelgon might be based on.
Also, Kingdra is a seahorse, not a sea dragon (different animals, Dragalge is based on a sea dragon though), and Flygon is based on the adult form of antlions.
Tyrantrum I really want to say is due to it being based on Tyrannosaurus Rex, which would support the idea that it's based on status rather than inherent dragonlike qualities, as Tyrannosaurus Rex is usually portrayed as the "king" of dinosaurs.
>>25665357
ty
I've always been fucking autistic with nicknames. Here's some from the recent past lel
Shylock the Sableye
Hanzo the Greninja
Edward the Scizor
Susanoo the Manectric
>>25665434
I named my Delphox in my most recent playthrough of X Loki, and I called my Tyrantrum Charlemagne. I really like nicknames based on mythology and history.
>>25665427
It undeniably gets some clues from a seadragon though (fins and head, but the tail design is obviously a seahorse's)
Bagon and Shelgon, well... I see them as larval and pupal stages of Salamence. Wouldn't make sense for them to be Normal types and suddenly evolve in a Dragon/Flying monster.
Also, how fucking good is Salamence's Mega form?
If only they did a Water/Dragon Gyarados Mega... ugh. I like the Chinese New Year Prop theme and everything, but Dragon fits its lore so fucking nicely it hurts it doesn't get it in at least an alternate Mega.
>>25665497
Hopefully S/M gives that to Gyarados, although idk if it's really a good idea to give new Megas to Pokemon who already have one.
>>25665375
>debatable.
Sure. It's never outright stated. But I think it's pretty heavily implied.
Most Legendaries and Psuedo-legendaries are Dragon type, it's the most common type of high ranking pokemon officials, has notoriously powerful moves, and the bloodline that I mentioned was how several pokemon have access to powerful dragon type egg moves otherwise reserved almost exclusively for Dragon types based off of being semi related. Gyarados specifically becoming Dark and not Dragon upon mega evolving also references the myth where the Dragon status was stripped of the carp that scaled the waterfall.
It's one of those things you get a feel for. None of those things strictly indicate that (for instance, plenty of other types not native to the pokemon are learned through egg moves), but the build of it all gives off that grandiose, elitist feel.
Anyway, the main point is that there are strong thematic elements associated with dragon types, and Charizard X exemplifies that pretty well I think. It looks like a "dragonfied" Charizard.
>>25665462
muh nigga
pop culture (movies and shit, not memes plz) and literature aren't bad either
Also, as I see you like mythology...
Heimdallr the Luxray
Hephaestus the Camerupt
>>25665427
Goodra is based off the Lou Carcolh (serpent/mollusk french muthology abomination).
I think there's also a yokai snail thing which can ascend to dragon status by living for a crapload of time, not sure though.
>>25665516
why not
Mewtwo and Charizard got two after all
Might as well give two to other fan favourites
>inb4 Lucario
>>25665537
I like Ragnarok as a name for Camerupt.
>>25665659
Lucario should get a fighting/dragon Mega just for kicks
>>25665693
>fighting/dragon Lucario
triggered.png
Fighting/Psychic would be neat though
