>>24785278
There are two perfectly fine and adaptable tabletop RPGs already. Homebrew off of those two and you're fine.

In fact, that image is from THOSE GAMES' site.

>>24785278
Player 'classes' come in 4 types, with the types available in the campaign being at the groups discretion.
>Trainers
The standard option. You have a Pokemon that fights for you, and you get abilities related to making it better, or giving it extra commands.

>Fighters
Looking for a better name for this group. These are the people who fight alongside a single Pokemon. Martial Artists and Psychics fall in here, but so do things like the characters of Pokemon Conquest, and even Rangers.

>Hunters
People seem to REALLY fucking like mixing Pokemon and monster hunter, so why not. Hunters are the group that focus on fighting Pokemon on their own, without another Pokemon as a partner. They instead use weapons and armor built to replicate pokemon abilities.

>Pokemon
Exactly what it fucking says. These are just straight up Pokemon, as player characters. They are more powerful than normal Pokemon, and get access to actual techniques and strategy, instead of just a small pool of moves. These are used for people who want to play a Mystery Dungeon style campaign.

Again, the plan is to make the game modular, so you can pick which stuff you want and ignore everything else, without breaking anything.

I am already working with an implementation for this using Fate Core, where narrative is first and foremost. I have already quit the first test version and am working on the second one. This is still in "closed beta," to say it in a way, but when I am confident enough this is good for public testing I will release it.

The game puts narrative (and hence fun) before accuracy, and aims to be simpler than the current games, trying to bring down the bookkeeping to a minimum. It may not be everyone's cup of tea, but I am confident it works - the previous version worked, despite it being clunkier.

>>24785288
I'm well aware the source of the image. However I don't like the existing systems, and rather than just bitch it not being what I want, I figured I would just make the game I want.

Tabletop Adventures was the best option when it was made, because it was the only option. However the d20 system is a bad fit for the game, it suffers from being a game of rocket tag, with the winner almost always being the first Pokemon to land an attack.

Tabletop United was a patch for PTA, but still has a flawed foundation under it. Keeping track of your Pokemon's stats is a bookkeeping nightmare, and it clings onto too many things from the game with the only reason being "The games do it" instead of it contributing to the system. Not to mention the hogging of the stage that happens if you have a mix of spotlight hogging that happens when you have both Coordinators and Gym Battlers in the same party.

PokeRole was a damn pretty Rulebook, but was filled with rules conflicts, making it difficult to actually play it.Pokethulu is so shit that I'm not even going to actually count that one.

My system will ALSO probably be shit, for different reasons and in different ways. Some people may prefer this system over PTA or PTU, so I figure I would get feedback on what they would want.

>>24785370
>implying rocket tag isn't the current state of the meta
how would you fix the spotlight hogging?

>>24785303
>These are the people who fight alongside a single Pokemon

stopped reading there

>>24785470
Well of course the RPGs emulate the meta. Because they do everything they can to emulate the games. I don't think that's the way to go though. Every form of Pokemon media has its own destiny feel. The TCG plays differently from the main series games which play differently from Rumble World. They all have themes in common, and are all undeniably recognizable as Pokemon games, but they are undeniably very different, to better suit the format they were made for. I feel a Pokemon RPG should follow that same logic.

As for the spotlight hogging, that is admittedly an issue. For the gym badges I would have the players them be One V Many battles, with the entire party getting 1 Pokemon each, and the Gym Leader getting his full team at once, and extra actions. Alternatively, I could see them just having one or two far more powerful Pokemon, going up against the trainers Pokemon.

Having the contests though is an issue. I didn't really have anything planned for them. I was planning to just getting combat into a good state first, and then adding additional modules for contest moves, pokeathalon, musical, etc.

>>24785641
I'm curious, why? It's an optional module. It's not what the game is built around. They can still get additional Pokemon, just not in the same capacity as a trainer can. They just have one Pokemon that is their partner, who they focus on the most.

Like how in the ranger series, you can still have multiple Pokemon, but there is only one you really share a bond with.

And again, if you don't want to have trainers going around punching Pokemon, you don't have to. Trainers aren't even targetable in the game, unless you are specifically playing as something that can attack/be attacked.

>>24785945
just admit your idea is shit

>>24785303
It feels like you are trying to please everyone, and the game is going to suffer because of it.

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>>24785370
I actually liked PokeRole the best as the moves and natures do pretty much the same as the videogame, not really sure about conflict on rules my friends and I figured it out just fine...then again we're no RPG experts. We mainly liked it because it was pretty

PTU was too "RPGey" for my taste (if that's even a thing...) with tons of numbers classes and levels and I never even bothered with PTA.

Shouldn't you be asking about feedback about this on /tg/, though? Most of the time /vp/ calls "autism" on any form of roleplaying.

>>24787285
>Most of the time /vp/ calls "autism" on any form of roleplaying.
And honestly tabletop roleplaying is far more of a "normey" thing than Pokemon.

>>24785945
Firstly, you didn't answer the questions given, and I'm honestly curious what you would do to fix it.

Secondly, this does sound at least somewhat thought out and I'd like to see more of what you have to offer, before I can give much input.

>>24785945
It seems as if you have just thought about doing this. Do you actually have anything written?

You will need a team, if you don't have one you'll either deliver shit, burn out, or deliver something so small that it won't be taken seriously by anyone.

>also
> Hunter -People seem to REALLY fucking like mixing Pokemon and monster hunter, so why not.

This sounds like an autism box just waiting to be opened, the main mistake PTA and PTU did was trying to focus too much on the human characters instead of the Pokemon and cartering to the whims of their autist fanbase with pokemon that change type and settings that are not originally from pokemon (those cowboys and space supplements make me cringe).

Posting this from my phone, sorry for any typos/autocorrects I miss.
>>24787285
To be fair, I haven't actually gone through the Rulebook for PokeRole since the first time it got posted on /tg/. It may very well have changed for the better.

/tg/ would certainly offer better feedback on mechanics, and I'm sure that there are more than enough of them that like Pokemon. However, right now I'm more trying to get feedback on what people want out of the 'feel' of the game, and figured /vp/ would be the best place for that.

>>24788934
I said how gym battles would be handled The full party of players vs the gym leader. As for the contests, I'm currently taking the same approach to them as the TCG does. In that it's not currently planned. I would like to add it at some point, but the core of the game is focused on combat. However, If/When it's include, it will not be the same as PTA/PTU, where it is basically just a combat reskin. Nor will I include the bribery options that they do.

Again, it's not planned yet, but the most likely way I would implement contests, musicals, acting, and Pokeathalon, would be as a variety of minigames you can play with your character for sessions in a campaign when a player is missing and you don't want to advance the campaign without them.

When I am next at my computer, I will post some additional info from my current design docs.

>>24790250
>This sounds like an autism box just waiting to be opened
It's a Roleplaying game focused on Pokemon. It already is that.

I have a small team, yes. Most of us have been designing indie games for about 6 years now. Most of the games we make are just for personal use. Only one of us has experience with actually publishing a game (it is not me).

I am not yet at the point of running a play test campaign, but am thinking it should be there by the end of the month with precon characters. I've been working on this current iteration for a few weeks. I'll post details in a moment. At the post size limit.

>>24790250
>>24790728
First of all, I disagree with saying that trainers should not be the focus. Having a representation to interact with your Pokemon is important in almost any Pokemon campaign. The Pokemon are undoubtably the most important part of your character, but the trainer is more than just an unskilled container for 6 Pokemon.

>Mechanics
D10 based roll and keep system (Typically stat keep tier). 10s explode. The number of rolled dice is unconditionally capped at 10, but typically will not exceed 5 or 6, unless you are dealing with legendary Pokemon.

Most attacks list the stat they use, and the stat the opponent rolls. Higher roll wins. If you roll higher than the opponent, you deal damage. For every 5 points higher you are than the opponents roll, you gain a 'raise'. Raises can be spent on various procs for your attack. You might spend 2 raises to freeze the opponent after using ice beam, for example. Pokemon will also have their own traits they can spend raises on, such as making it a critical hit, or raising your stats for a turn.

However, if the opponent beats your roll, you deal reduced damage. The opponent can then spend any raises on their roll on effects they have. Moves like Counter or Reflect are now passive instead of activated attacks, and are triggered by spending raises on a defense roll.

Missing is not typically an option. All it does is make you waste your turn, and prolongs the game without adding any actually interesting gameplay. This is the same reason immunities were changed to resistances. However, it is possible for a Pokemon to gain conditional evasion. For example, Protect gives you the option to spend checks from an opponents roll to ignore the attack completely.

Super effective attacks give an automatic Raise on the attack, while resistance gives you an automatic Raise when you are defending. 2x resist and 2x weakness generate an additional Raise. STAB will also generate a raise. You only get these if you win the roll.

>>24790908
Let's see...

>D10 based roll and keep system
Not a bad idea, though are there not gonna be skills?

>Most attacks list the stat they use, and the stat the opponent rolls
So, the Pokemon attacks and the opponent receives. Both make a roll opposed to each other and the higher wins. Basic stuff.

>For every 5 points higher you are than the opponents roll, you gain a 'raise'. Raises can be spent on various procs for your attack
Do raises stack? or they can just be used on the roll of the attack you just used?

To be honest is in this point I actually see the "Pokemon feel" starting to fade. I don't say you have to make the video game on paper but something about this sets me off. I'll keep reading, though...

>Moves like Counter or Reflect are now passive instead of activated attacks, and are triggered by spending raises on a defense roll.

Same as before, I'm sure this was changed to suit the tabletop format, but what about pokemon like wobuffet who don't learn any other moves? won't that be a total disadvantage for them? any other pokemon can use their moves AND counter if they spend a raise.

>Missing is not typically an option. All it does is make you waste your turn, and prolongs the game without adding any actually interesting gameplay

Now I know that you just play the games from a mechanic standpoint the rolepaying aspect is lost, you miss a great opportunity for tension and even if it does prolong the game is not as if you will stay 3 hours there failing (unless you were using d20's and you are not)

Over all I can see you game is mostly Pokemon: Roll the dices edition
If you can't miss or evade, battles will mostly be reduced to "I hit, you hit, I hit, you hit" and will get boring incredibly fast.

I suppose you'll give Trainers the way to increase the raises of their pokemon, Fighters a way to increase their own rises (or worse humans using moves like in PTU) And Pokemon players a way to increase their own raises. Hunters still suck, though.

>>24790908
The game is designed to be played without needing a map grid, so the battlefield is very simplified. There are 4 zones in a row: Team Back -> Team Front -> Enemy Front -> Enemy Back.
Each attack has a range listed on it, 0-3. This is how far away you can be when you use the move. 0 requires you to be in the same zone as the target(s), while 3 can hit at any range. Empty zones are ignored when checking range, so if you are in Team Back, you can hit an enemy in Enemy Back with a range 1 attack.

There are also 2 sidelines, the Team Sideline and the Enemy Sideline. These zones run along the long edge of the battlefield, adjacent to all other zones except the other sideline.

Each turn a player gets 1 Trainer Action and 1 Command. Your Trainer Action can be spent on using items, recalling your Pokemon and sending out a new one, or having your Pokemon (or yourself) move to an adjacent zone. It is also used for many special trainer actions you can learn that can provide various effects to your Pokemon during combat. Trainers specialized in double battles can chose to spend their trainer action on an additional command.

Commands are used to control your Pokemon, and are almost always the moves your Pokemon knows. However, if you are playing one of the variants that give trainers attacks, those will require Commands to use. This is one of the reasons why Fighter classes typically have only 1 partner Pokemon. Having to split their actions between themselves and their Pokemon makes harder to manage, both in and out of character.

Ability scores are the same for both Pokemon and Trainers. There are measured on a skill of 1-10. The stats are: Attack, Defense, Special Attack, Special Defence, Speed, and Vitality. Attack and Special Attack are used for attacking. Defence and Special Defence are used for defending. Speed can be used for attack or defense, based on the move in question. Vitality is used for ending status effects and determining health.

>>24791048
I personally dislike skills, and am hesitant to include them. In my opinion, they tend to get in the way more than anything, and I can't even count the number of times I have seen amateur GMs fall into the trap of asking for a skill roll, having the player fail it, and then stumble around wondering how to continue besides just having the person re-roll until they pass, or have a player roll to do something done, only for the player to succeed and massively derail the current scene.

Even worse are things related to mental and social skills. A not bright player playing a wizard is shit out of luck when it comes to riddle puzzles if they can't solve it themselves. Meanwhile clever players playing a dumb barbarian are also shit out of luck, since it is outside of character knowledge. Likewise for social rolls, and how convincing the actual player is.

Almost every proposed fix I have seen for those cases are done by biasing the rolls so much that the roll doesn't actually matter. In which case why have them at all?

That said, I'm a roll player more than a role player, and I realize this is not a common opinion. Some of the co-authors are into skill checks, so it might find its way into the final version, but it is unlikely to include my input.

Raises last only until the end of the attack, although some effects they are spent on can last longer. This system was developed AFTER the removal of misses. As you mentioned, just trading blows is extremely boring, and not what we wanted. The Raises are there to show how effective your attack was. So things like Double Slap get more hits in, status conditions pop up, etc.

The Pokemon TCG manages to be fun with guaranteed hits, and next to no RNG. I am confident that it will work out, however I'll make a note to pay special attention to it during play testing, and see if it needs tweaking.

Damnit. Mobile ate my post, so this one might be a little rushed.

>>24791230
>>24791048
Gimmick or 'special case' Pokemon that don't follow the typical development of other Pokemon, (like Wobbuffet, Unown, Magikarp, Feebas, etc) are a thorn in my side at the moment.

My current solution is to give them Signature Moves related to how they play, instead of just the attacks they use. The TCG does this to great effect, keeping them feeling the same, even if they don't actually work the same way. Pic related.

Which leads into how moves work. The system was designed in order to reduce the size of the Pokemon's statblock, as well as make it easier for players to home brew their own Pokemon (Even if you aren't into fakemon, being able to generate the Pokemon from a new generation on your own, before an official update, is pretty damn nice).

Move Pools function similarly to spell schools from DnD. They are grouped into similar categories. For example, Ember acts as a low level version of what can eventually become Flame Thrower and Overheat. These move pools are not always grouped by type though, just similarity. The Move Pool that has Comet Punch can eventually develop into Thunderpunch, Fire Punch, and Ice Punch.

Instead of having an individual list of moves, Pokemon instead just list which move pools they have access to, as well as which category they fall into for that Pokemon. The categories are Favorable, Learnable, Technique, and Signature Moves. Favorable moves are the easiest for the Pokemon to learn. Learnable are moves that are... Well... Learnable. They are a bit harder to learn than Favorable moves. Technique moves are possible to learn, but are hard for that specific Pokemon as they do not come naturally.

There are two move pools that act differently from the others. The Universal Movepool includes moves like Tackle, Hidden Power, Secret Power, and other moves all Pokemon can learn. Every Pokemon has access to this move pool.

The Signature Moves move pool is the opposite. Pokemon cannot learn any of the moves in this pool, unless it is specifically listed as one of the Pokemon's Signature Moves. This is basically the catch all category for those moves that can define a Pokemon, but won't fit into any other category.
In the system, pokemon don't gain experience directly. Instead, all experience is given to the trainer to ease up on bookkeeping. The player can then spend that experience to gain new abilities for themselves, power up their Pokemon some more, or teach their Pokemon new attacks from their move pools. Each Pokemon will also have two experience values listed next to each of its evolutions. The first is how many points must be invested in that Pokemon before it has the option to evolve, and the second is how much it costs to actually evolve the Pokemon. Pokemon never require items to evolve, however there will be optional rules to make it so that consuming certain items allows Pokemon to evolve early, while others can reduce the cost of evolution.

>d10 roll and keep system
>dice explode
>roll is stat keep other stat
>getting higher than the opponent gives you raises
>raises trigger extra effect
>failing causes checks against you
>pokemon learn attacks based on spell schools
jesus OP. is this game set in THE GRIM DARKNESS OF THE GREAT WHEEL? because if so, i love you. i didnt think anyone else played DtD40k7e. are the pokemon just different classes, with the trainer being an exalt? how is that gonna work?

>>24791230
why make attack rolls when your just gonna attack again?

>inb4 climb is different then combat?
take 10/take 20 system outside of combat.

>>24792087
DtD was a large inspiration for the core mechanic. However I have no plans to make it combatible with DtD. It's just a system that works well, and I kept in what fit best.

Exalts don't really have a place in the game, short of mega-evolving trainers, and that's just a little too extreme for me. Maybe as a variant in a later release, but not now.

Pokemon are not at all like classes. They are basically just simplified companion stat locks that can fit on an index card.

Trainer classes will likely end up acting like the DtD classes. You can progress through them, but you can't learn another class unless you master the one you are in. I will probably do it as branching classes though, instead of linear progression like DtD uses.

>>24792328
I'm saying that skills have a tendency to trap new players/GMs, and don't actually add anything to the games narrative. In combat is a different story. I loved the skill system in Legend, despite being almost the same as DnD, because they were used more for unlocking new abilities through feats, or triggering special effects on magical items. Your skills were more about the minor tweaks that made your character unique in how they played, instead of just something to roll to get past an obstacle.

I can think of very very few situations where skills actually benefit the narrative. In most cases they are harmful, or at best, neutral.

As for the "Why attack if you are going to attack again", I'm not sure I understand the question? If you mean my Double Slap example, it just deals the damage multiple times. If you mean the system in general, that's kinda what Pokemon (and games in general) is. Trading blows with the opponent. There are still a variety of moves with added effects, and moves that don't deal damage at all, just like in Pokemon.

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>>24791651
Realized I forgot the pic after redoing the post. This is what I meant about giving special case Pokemon more signature moves.

>>24785278
Not liking ptu? Whats wrong with you?

>>24795794
he is sane