Why did people love this piece of garbage so much?
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Why did people love this piece of garbage so much?
Only blacks and poor white people liked the Genesis
>>342829492
Dont forget getting a genesis/mega drive meant that your parents would get a divorce
Worth it just for Rocket Knight, Vectorman, and Sonic
>>342829432
Fuck you, objectively the best console in that generation.
>Sonic 1 through Knuckles & Knuckles
>Shinobi 3
>Streets of Rage 1 through 3
>Best Super SF2 version
>Shadow Dancer
>Hyperstone Heist having much better controls than Turtles in Time
It was complete ass unless you had a model 1, all of the later models had shittier sound and video problems
>>342830712
>shitty SSF2 port
>listed as a positive
Nintendo had very little presence in Europe back then, so most people used a Megadrive. I imagine if you're from USA and still had Genesis instead of SNES, your parents simply didn't love you or.
>>342830826
Not as shitty as the lag-ridden SNES port with baby farts music and shitty controls, SNESnigger.
>>342831126
You shouldn't play anything but the arcade version of Super Turbo. Hyper Street Fighter 2 on the PlayStation 2 is a good port.
>>342831126
>farts music
that's 90% of genesis games
>>342829432
They bought into the marketing hype and got their SEGA. Then nogames. Then doubling down on their love of a shit system because fuck Nintendo.
Nothing else needs to be said because time has proven everything for us.
SNES is still known by everyone remotely into vidya, while most people haven't played a single Genesis game in their lives.
>>342831306
Genesis was the dudebro console of gen 4, so all those people grew up, got jobs and forgot about vidya. Meanwhile we're still stuck on /v/.
>>342829432
Beats me
Not that it didn't have great games, but nobody owned said great games. As opposed to the Snes where the best are often the most popular
>>342830712
>Sonic
Never understood the appeal
>Streets of Rage
Beat em Ups are boring
Maybe if you mentioned Comix Zone, Dynamite Headdy, Gunstar Heroes, Wonder Boy, Phantasy Star, Rocket Knight Adventure, maybe then you'd make a good case
>>342829432
The Genesis had some great games and some shitty ones
The SNES had some great games and some shitty ones
Both consoles can be easily emulated and played by anyone at 0 cost. There's no point for all this console war bickering anymore.
sonic, ristar, vectorman, phantasy star, gunstar heroes, wonder boy, streets of rage, and miscellaneous arcade ports made the genesis way better for me. the saturn is fucking garbage that deserved to get raped by the n64 and ps1. and the dreamcast was a great blowout, finale console. attacked and spurred fast, shat out a bunch of fresh ideas and series, and quietly laid to rest before the ps2 obliterated it.
tldr, genesis and dreamcast good, saturn bad.
>>342830521
Jokes on you. My parents were never married.
>>342829432
Advertising=Bait
>>342829432
>BRRRWWWWWAAAAAAAAPPPPPPPP
What did Genesis music mean by this?
>>342832006
Fart Modulation syntesis
>>342829432
Blast processing
>genesis
>better shmups and arcade shooters because no slowdown
>snes
>better rpgs and graphics
>fuckton of slowdown because bad cpu
If Nintendo had put a decent cpu in the SNES it would have been superior to the genesis in every possible way.
>>342832006
>hating on thunder force 4 music
You communist
>>342829432
Nostalgia mixed with extreme fanboyism.
>genesis music
>>342832394
except all the sound being fucking garbage
>>342829432
I don't think anyone outside of America and Japan had Nintendo
>>342832394
>fuckton of slowdown because bad cpu
dude the snes is more powerful than the genesis. the snes destroyed the genesis in terms of power
>>342829432
>Sonic 1, 2, 3 and Knuckles
>Splatterhouse 2
>Streets of Rage
>Rocket Knight
thats it
16 bit power rankings:
Amiga > Mega Drive > ST > PC Engine >>>>> Super Nintendo
>>342829432
I was excited to play it finally, my friend let me borrow it with his games.
I didn't like any of them. Not even the ones that looked cool I saw Arino play, like Sonic and Comix Zone
>>342829492
FALSE
my dad was basically for much of my childhood
He grew up poor but made it as a doctor by the sweat of his own brow
As a result we were well to due but he grubbed every last sheckle to the very end
Thus why my family ended up with a Genesis
He wouldn't even buy sonics 1 & 2 i had to borrow them
>>342834950
No. The Mega Drive CPU clockspeed was around 7.5mhz, the Snes was capable of up to 3mhz but rarely achieved that. That's why slowdown ruins so many Snes games like Super Ghouls n Ghosts (the worst GnG game), Super Castlevania Bros, Starwing etc.
>>342830521
M-M-MERE COINCIDENCE!
>>342835223
I dont know a single european who knows Zelda, apart from one friend who only knew it from CD-I youtube poops
>>342834935
A few did, but no one really gave a shit about Nintendo in Europe, except the Netherlands, or Australia.
>>342835091
>Amiga
Toppest of keks
>>342829432
Because it was objectively the best 4th gen console with the best library that had the most interesting and creative games.
>>342829432
all the people who had SNES grown up to be autists
>>342835256
http://web.ics.purdue.edu/~dherring/cgt141/project1/comparison.html
snes had far superior graphics and audio capabilities. simply having a faster processor doesn't mean your console is more powerful
>>342835532
That's because they played retarded story 'games' written by autistic Japs.
>>342835636
Okay, but that doesn't fix the slowdown. Games can look nice, but not being able to run well will ruin them.
>>342835320
I have plenty of friends and family who owned NES and SNES. Zelda's a bad example it only got popular with OOT sinse the early games never got translated
>>342835532
>all the people who had SNES grown up to be autists
yeah cause the sonic fanbase really grew up normal huh
>that kid who had a Genesis, liked metal and shot up the school
>>342835774
Sonic fanbase got to its current state from Adventure which was Gamecube, Dreamcast and PS2
>>342835803
>that kid who gamed on DOS, liked metal and shot up the school
FTFY
>>342835769
>Zelda's a bad example it only got popular with OOT sinse the early games never got translated
what. the first two zelda games totally were released in the west on nes. did you like, miss that somehow
>>342835472
t. Clueless Amerifat
ITT: Kids discuss a console that launched before they were born in a time they can't comprehend
>>342835774
OOOOOOOOOOOHHHHHHHHHHH WERE ARE YOU AT
TO PRO TO PRO
>>342835887
whatever helps you go to sleep at night buddy :^)
>>342835893
The DOS kid's family was too poor to afford guns
>>342835894
I believe that poster was fishing for replies.
>>342835913
I was a teenager when the C64 was new, kid. I remember the launch of the Mega Drive.
>>342835913
t. newfag fresh out of the tenth grade
>>342836054
I was a teenager when the Genesis was new, kid. I remember the launch of the Genesis.
>>342835774
Relatively, yes. Look at Sonic Retro.
Don't confuse classic Sonic fans with modern Sonic fans.
>>342829432
>better visuals than the snes once you installed the 32x
>lots of great side-scroller games
>arguably two of the top ten games of all time is on the genesis
>pic related was better than the snes controller
>mutha fuckin' sega channel
>multiplats performed better
>no pussy censorship like the snes did with removing blood from mortal kombat
>>342835636
Did you even read what he posted?
>>342835979
Why would you take a console over a PC? Computers have been better for home gaming since 1982.
>>342835907
The ZX Spectrum was one of the most popular computers in Europe, and you think Americans are clueless?
>>342836120
>better visuals than the snes once you installed the 32x
>32x
>>342835636
Faster processor meant a dozen things.
No slowdown, bigger and larger sprites, higher resolution for longer periods of time, MORE sprites on screen, rudimentary 3D graphics the SNES could never do without excess chips, etc.
The Genesis also had unique FX abilities the SNES didn't have and had crazy effects.
Sorry, kiddie.
>>342836107
Okay, I was in my twenties when the Mega Drive launched.
>>342836171
PCs couldn't really do console-style side scrollers until the very last 80s
>>342836176
The ZED X spectrum, kid :)
>>342836258
I was in my 50s, kid.
>>342836221
>The Genesis also had unique FX abilities the SNES didn't have and had crazy effects.
>>342836120
>32x
For real?
>no pussy censorship like the snes did with removing blood from mortal kombat
They still locked it behind a code, and this was irrelevant by the time the second game came out
>>342836176
You know why? It was a budget computer. Plebs owned Spectrums, patricians owned Commodore 64s. The computers Americans used were even worse than the Spectrum. IBMs and Apple shit. You guys can't talk about computers.
>>342836314
>The ZED X spectrum, kid :)
Joke's on you, I already pronounce it that way because I'mCanadian.
>>342836372
He said the Snes. The Super Fx chip, like the SVP chip, was in the cartridge.
>>342836372
That is one contest that the SNES gets smacked in. You shouldn't have brought that up.
>>342836372
>the SNES could never do without excess chips
Genesis actually had good action games with no slowdown while the SNES was chock full of nice looking RPGs with garbage gameplay. The only people that could unironically enjoy G&G, Contra and Castlevania on SNES are brain damaged morons that either don't notice the awful slowdown or think it's an actual good thing because it makes the game easier.
Very few SNES games hold up today but Genesis titles are still high caliber action games.
>>342829492
not an argument
>>342836507
you still can't say the snes couldn't do effects.
>[any Sega standalone home console] was bad
If you have this opinion you should unironically, literally kill yourself post-haste.
>>342836314
Z is pronounced Zed so he didn't write it wrong. Only total retards would pronounce Z as zee.
>>342835894
Nevermind i was wrong
I genuinely never heard of Zelda before OOT even though i was really into Nintendo, so i just assumed it never got translated
>>342836428
>implying
IBMs and Apples in the 1980s were much better than the Spectrum in every way.
>>342836527
genesis needed a 32x to do what nintendid
bet your face is real red now idiot
>tfw your dad had to sell your sister so they could buy you a C64
It had Police Squad so it was worth it
>>342836802
>eastern europe feels
>>342836120
>pic related was better than the snes controller
>implying that was the only genesis controller that was superior
Even the original 3-button controller had better ergonomic design and build quality than the SNES controller. The 3 buttons were a non-issue for 99% of Genesis games.
>>342836372
Can you read?
>>342836641
No they weren't. The Spectrum is a much better machine than you give it credit for.
>muh colours
Enjoy your steaming piles of shit, Amerifat. IBMs and Apples are seriously laughable.
>>342836583
Depends which effects you mean. It couldn't do 3D.
>>342836734
Doom has since been ported to the MD. It runs better than the 3fps Snes port. It could've very easily been ported to the Mega Drive back then.
>>342829432
because it had really neat games
pic related is still one of the best space exploration games.
>>342836863
>The 3 buttons were a non-issue for 99% of Genesis games.
that doesn't really speak well of genesis games, you know
>>342836734
Doom was never ported. But it would have ran fine on a Genesis.
So, how did the Genesis do this without a 32x or extra chips, then?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pfe2Ze_yDk4
>>342836863
The Mega Drive controller was designed with man hands in mind. The Snes controller was for children. That's why it is uncomfortable to hold for an adult.
>>342836980
That framerate is really bad but you almost get used to it after a while.
That's amazing it was doing all this just with the power of it's processor. The SNES could never have even dreamed of doing this and barely pulled off similar looking graphics with an entire FX chip on board.
>>342836734
Wrong!
>>342836947
Snes games rarely needed more than two buttons.
>>342837081
>only rendering 1/3 of the screen
>not even rendering floors or ceilings
try again
>>342836980
>2 minutes in
that fucking car came out of nowhere in that... cement loop... road...
How was he supposed to see that
It hadfastergames then the SNES, all memes aside. SNES games compared to genesis games tend to have less things happening on screen at once and run at lower framerates. Genesis games as a whole also tended to be more arcade style, which I like.
>>342836372 >>342836527 >>342836734 >>342837081 >>342836980 >>342837165
Sit down my sons.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FZKsQ09qOk4
>>342836947
what? are you implying that old skool arcade titles are bad because of their 3 button setup?
>>342837162
Not my fault they elected to use the cartridge space for multiple playable characters and voice acting.
>>342836913
>It couldn't do 3D.
It could do 3D in the form of Mode 7. I'm aware one or two Genesis games did something similar but you needed to be an amazing programmer to make it work.
>>342836734
>>342837162
HEY DUMBASS
DOOM USED THE SUPER FX CHIP.
>>342837304
Sprite scaling isn't 3D, fucktard.
SNES only legitimately had three advantages over Genesis, two of which are basically hardware accelerated gimmicks.
-It had "free" background rotation
-It had hardware supported transparency
-It had a higher maximum color palette
Genesis was better in every single way that really mattered.
-The CPU was shitloads faster (1.5 times faster at worst, 3 times faster at best, depending on the task)
-The RAM was shitloads faster (usually double speed)
-It had a higher resolution in 64 color mode (which meant the Genesis default resolution was higher)
-It had more sound channels which means more possible voices
-The system was more efficient with cartridge space (which is why many SNES games like Toy Story are missing animation frames)
As for which system has a better "sounding" sound system, that's pretty subjective and heavily reliant on what kinds of genres of music are being attempted so I won't comment on that.
>>342837361
Colors are subjective. They don't really do much, and the more colors there are the harder it is for the eye to distinguish them.
>>342837315
at least it didn't need an entire console expansion
>>342835636
>simply having a faster processor doesn't mean your console is more powerful
No, it just meant you could run more complex games with better performance. SNES was better than the genesis in every way EXCEPT the one that actually affects gameplay.
>>342829432
It came out during the NES years. It had better graphics, more buttons, bigger games, a lower price, and played all the cool arcade games.
>>342837361
The Snes used that crappy sampling method. I'll take true FM synthesis over that any day.
>>342837356
mode 7 isn't sprite scaling
>>342837431
First of all.
Sega had the SVP chip, which produced far better looking 3D games without a "console expansion."
You know the SNES FX chip games were like 100 dollars right
>>342837356
Mode 7 isn't sprite scaling, fucktard. It's transforming a flat background layer 3-dimensionally.
>>342837489
The Nes was shit.
>>342837447
The memers who keep repeating "SNES had better grafix and sound!" are retards.
The SNES came out two years after the Genesis and had a slow as dirt processor.
>>342837361
>It had more sound channels which means more possible voices
oh great! i get even MORE farts at once!!
As time goes on people seem to more and more prefer the genesis, I don't know why.
>>342837502
Are you one of those fart fetishists, by any chance?
>>342836734
The 32x version of Doom is on a completely different level than the SNES attempt at running Doom.
>>342836372
the fx chip was inside the game not the snes,besides starfox was a laggy unplayable mess because of the shit snes cpu
>>342837607
>>342837623
>Th-they're starting to prove why the Genesis is better!
>F-FARTS! I BETTER TALK ABOUT FARTS!
>pic related, it's you.
>>342837573
Debatable, but make a new topic if you want to talk about that.
>>342837573
The smooth scrolling on the NES was so revolutionary at the time that it blew PC graphics away. It took fucking John Carmack until 1990 to make PCs do what Nintendo's 1983 hardware was doing.
>>342830712
Best version of Earthworm jim as well
>>342837538
It's not 3 dimensional
>>342837678
>>pic related, it's you.
T-thanks
>>342837421
>Colors are subjective. They don't really do much
Jesus fucking Christ.
>>342837609
contrarianism
>>342837678
You're right. The genesis is much better than the SNES at producing fart noises. Good call.
The genesis had the better Contra and Batman games and thats all i care about.
Snes had Actraiser which is one of the only good games on it.
>>342837421
No, the colors make a lot of difference. But many devs never pushed the megadrive hardware, so multi-plats looked and sounded shitty on it.
And sometimes it was the SNES that got the shit ports. It was always hard to predict, but the differences weren't as big as something like early xbox 360 vs PS3, where one machine literally ran the game at 2 FPS, with no graphics, and half the content missing.
>>342837780
How is it not?
SNES has better RPGs and simulation games. I think that's fair to say. Chrono Trigger, Live A Live, and Final Fantasy V shit all over Phantasy Star II, III, and IV. Romance of the Three Kingdoms, SimCity, and SimEarth are fun on SNES.
Genesis has it beat in just about every other category though. Platforming games, action games, shooting games, fighting games, strategy games, arcade games, and racing games.
>>342837712
What the fuck? There were so many scrolling games on the C64. Are you some kind of retard? It was harder to do it, yes, but it was still done. Why are Americans so ignorant of computer games.
Go play The New Zealand Story, The Great Giana Sisters, or Rainbow Islands on any 8 bit microcomputer.
>>342837421
and here i thought i was shitposting too hard
>>342837712
That was because dedicated gaming parts basically didn't exist for PC back then. Hell over half a decade later quake would launch with a version meant to run on PC's without dedicated gpus
>>342837421
I bet you love Atari games simply because there aren't many colors.
The Mega Drive had somee wonderful games: Gunstar Heroes, Alien Soldier, Phantasy Star 4, Shinobi 3, Comix Zone, Golden Axe, Gain Ground... Even the VF2 port was pretty decent.
But they aren´t known because all these franchises got ditched, and obviously you are going to see with better light the company that keeps doing high quality games and still root for their old IPs that the one you see releasing the shittiest games of the year under the mark of Sonic The Hedgehog.
What I try to say is that is really easy to lose track and interest from old Sega games nowadays, and is even easier to feel this if you compare it to Nintendo and what both represent today, but if you search on the library deep enough there are some fantastic, obscure, niche experiences to be played. And even if I think that the SNES library is just slightly superior, sometimes I doubt it.
>>342837421
>Colors are subjective.
>>342837909
It doesn't use three dimensions. Mode 7 is a graphics mode on the Super NES video game console that allows a background layer to be rotated and scaled on a scanline-by-scanline basis to create many different effects. The most famous of these effects is the application of a perspective effect on a background layer by scaling and rotating the background layer in this manner. This transforms the background layer into a two-dimensional horizontal texture-mapped plane that trades height for depth. Thus, an impression of three-dimensional graphics is achieved.
>>342837935
the c64 had dedicated hardware for rendering sprites. PCs didn't. this is one of the reasons getting graphics like smb3 on PC was, at the time, challenging on PCs. keep in mind the commodore was basically a console more so than it was a PC
>>342837981
That guy is not right. He's a retard.
>>342838057
It looks 3-dimentional, it acts 3-dimentional, therefore it's 3-dimentional.
>>342837623
Pretty much every competent megadrive game proves that it could have really good music.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tZPGRU-ApMw
Which isn't to say that the SNES didn't have awesome music as well, and they managed to put vocals into tales of phantasia.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9NFmgQqLmSo
Why can't we have consoles like this today?
>>342838131
There's scrolling capability on the ZX Spectrum and Amstrad CPC, too.
>>342836462
>>342836620
>Jay- ZED
>ZEE X Spectrum
its both
>>342838226
What's Jay Z exactly?
>>342838142
Retard. Please don't breed.
>>342838225
those aren't PCs, either. PC was a term that really only applies to IBM compatibles and maybe apples
>>342838163
I really liked how literally everything about each console was different back in the 16 bit/early 3d generation. The visuals were inherently different, the sounds was different.
>>342838163
Because now we can stream MP3 music, eliminating the need for limiting soundchips? Are you retarded or something?
>>342838328
>PC only applies to the crappy computers Americans liked
The better computers that were popular in Europe are still personal computers, anon. Don't be stupid.
>>342838439
>mp3
what is this, 1999?
>>342838308
>What's Jay Z exactly?
>>342838308
>Retard. Please don't breed.
Nice argument, faggot.
>>342838478
they still weren't called PCs
>>342838163
>Why can't we have consoles like this today?
Nostalgiafaging about music in 2016 is retarded when we have games coming out that use 8-bit to fully orchestrated soundtracks. This is a much better time to be alive.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jDatjUbYrxo did you know this was made for YM2612 (Genesis sound chip)?
>>342838529
Compared to your stubborn, false argument about pseudo 3D being 3D?
>>342838163
Is that supposed to be a good example of MD music? It's filled with ear-raping metallic noises.
>>342838576
So what?
>>342832298
this
>>342838626
I defended my position, you need to prove me wrong.
>pseudo-3D
This is just a meme. By this logic, Wolfenstein 3D isn't 3D either.
>>342838439
>he uses MP3 in 2016.
Get the fuck out of here, grandpa.
>>342838346
>I really liked how literally everything about each console was different back in the 16 bit/early 3d generation
I miss this. For the past few gens two consoles were the same shit with Nintendo running some retarded gimmick that does essentially nothing.
>>342838712
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oTQIiIKummw
TIME TO POST THUNDER FORCE.
>>342838853
>GUYS IT'S THE CURRENT YEAR
>>342838834
It isn't. Do you even know what 3 dimensional means?
>>342838834
3d games are just projections, anyway. they aren't actually 3d
>>342838773
Dumb yank.
It's more sad for the SNES hardware when you realize it came out over two years later
>>342838937
This really needs a high-pass filter or something. It's basically unlistenable with headphones.
>>342838834
Well, Wolfenstein 3D is just sprite scaling and rotation while not having any three dimensional polygons, which make a 3D game.
>>342839039
i will ask you only once to refrain from using hate speech on this web sight
>>342838937
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jWVJkX9maq8
>>342838974
Apparently not. Maybe instead of ad-hominem attacks, you could enlighten me?
>>342839049
>the SNES gets beat out by a console designed to compete with the NES
Gen could do colors
>>342839090
>it needs polygons to be 3D
When did this meme start?
>tfw cousin had superior snes version of pic related
>tfw playing coop all night
>>342839304TARGET TARGET TARGET TARGET
>>342839249
Height, width, and depth.
>>342839330
It could have been the superior version, but the devs decided to do a lazy port instead.
>>342839398
How does mode 7 not provide those?
>>342839324
>when did 3D games need to have 3D objects
>>342839324
it's actually true, though. wolfenstein and doom's renderers really only calculated width and depth information
>>342839491
>Mode 7 is a graphics mode on the Super NES video game console that allows a background layer to be rotated and scaled on a scanline-by-scanline basis to create many different effects. The most famous of these effects is the application of a perspective effect on a background layer by scaling and rotating the background layer in this manner. This transforms the background layer into a two-dimensional horizontal texture-mapped plane that trades height for depth. Thus, an impression of three-dimensional graphics is achieved.
Learn to read.
>>342839549
Look at Wolfenstein 3D. There are no polygons, and yet it looks like first-person 3D. How is that less 3D than a rendering engine that uses polygons to simulate 3D?
I had a Master System, Mega Drive and a SNES growing up. They were all great.
Only retards will argue SEGA was never good. They used to be awesome. I like to pretend the company died along with the Dreamcast though.
>>342837660
yes I too love the fart music of the 32x
>>342839696
>looks like
>>342839696
It's not 3d, though. If it was, they'd never have advanced to doom, then to quake, which was the actual first 3d engine.
>>342839646
Sure, buddy. Try playing F-Zero sometime and then tell me how something that looks 3D, which is the whole point of 3D, isn't 3D.
>>342839746
I fail to see how that makes the game run unplayably bad compared to its primary comparison?
>>342839710
They've been slowly getting less retarded as the years go on. And they've been acquiring very successful IPs and companies. Plus they are still the kings of the arcade in japan.
>>342839878
SNES didn't need a console add-on and the music is half the fun in doom sucked away
>>342839880
>Plus they are still the kings of the arcade in japan.
pachinko isn't games idiot
>>342839840
> then to quake, which was the actual first 3d engine.
Depending on what you mean by "real 3d" I'd say build engine. If that doesn't work for you then there's this.
>>342839868
Okay.
It's not 3d. It doesn't really look 3d once you've seen a real 3d game.
This guy tells you you're wrong, and he practically invented 3d graphics.
>>342839980
They're still making real arcde games too anon.
>>342830521
>had Genesis
>parents got divorced
>friend had Genesis
>parents got divorced
God dammit
>>342839806
>>342839840
So is a polygonal game that doesn't move vertically also not 3D, or are you just a hypocrite? The whole point of 3D is to simulate a 3D perspective relative to the camera. Mode 7 and games like Wolfenstein do this, but somehow they're not 3D just because they don't use polygons? Why? Justify this.
>>342839868
Is this your whole argument? That hardware tricks designed to give a fake 3D looking effect means they were actually rendering height, width, and depth somehow? Are you some kind of idiot.
>>342839989
Build is 2.5d. It can do strictly not 3d things, but is in no way 3d.
There's no such thing as a fucking personal definition of what is 3d and what isn't. Look that shit up in a dictionary. Tell the thread what it says.
>>342839989
neither of those games use 3d engines. quake wasn't the first game with a true 3d engine, but it was definitely the most prominent. build and descent used 2.5d engines
>>342839965
>SNES didn't need a console add-on
Correct. Then again, the idea of Sega was to release a 100 dollar addon instead of making the games themselves cost a third extra. Do not pretend that the Doom on SNES ran without anything but the system itself behind it.
>music is half the fun in doom
Well, if you want to play a game which is a horrible blurry mess, with horrible FPS and controls, be my guest. I won't waste time arguing with music > gameplay idiots.
>his parent's didn't buy both systems
Glad I grew up in a household that wasn't poor
>>342840116
If it renders height, width and depth then it is 3D. 3D means three dimensional.
>>342837623
Shouldn't you be on /vr/ shitposting in all the music threads? Mega Drive had Streets of Rage. SNES can't come close to anything like it with its low quality samples and reverb. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kfCw4tx5AME
>>342840254
>descent wasn't 3d
The game is more fucking 3D than most fps these days. The only thing quake did was make 3D EASY not invent it.
>>342840281
I had a Mega Drive and an Archimedes. No need for a Snes.
>>342840116
Simulating 3d isn't the same as doing 3d.
That's like saying Mario clones on the PC simulated scrolling worlds by 'scrolling' in an entirely new level segment, like in Zelda, once you hit the edge of the screen, thus they were totally absolutely in every way capable of doing for real actual scrolling worlds, and it was in no way a lazy hack to attempt to give you the feel of the real deal.
>but it's my personal definition of 3d, so driving Flammie around in secret of Mana is totally comparable to climbing around the world in quake, you guys.
>look at all these cocks I can stuff down my throat! MMMMMMMM!!!!
>>342830521
Wat? I had a Genesis and my parents are still together
>>342840116
>Mode 7
This is a mode of scaling and rotating a 2D background layer for the illusion of a 3D plane. This is not 3D however.
>>342829432
It was my first console. I loved playing Ecco the dolphin 2 on it and it brings back a nice memory of telling my dad I beat the first big guy in sonic 2 (we didn't know they were "bosses").
>>342840421
Are you retarded for real, or just pretending? you need height, width, and depth to be 3d.
Those old engines don't do that- Build, for instance, has this magical ability to stack extra parts of the level inside other parts of the level, forever, so you can loop around yourself.
Here, have 2 seconds on google, because I'm not gonna type all this shit out.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Build_(game_engine)#Sectors
>>342830521
>Got genesis
>Parents still together
>not poor
>not black
>MFW
>>342838712
It sounds like shit because it's emulated. Emulated MD always sounds like garbage for some reason.
>>342839078
This tune has so much noise thanks to megadrive emulators.
Also, for good megadrive music:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DmdE3wHHq54
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BOagvSmosBg
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=__lfMKhWKOE
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CilX4J_r7rI
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l6KmMDVpgfE
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XG1c2U4ld2Y
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HquXDNIsoRs
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UnNLyN-wX28
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fXfGEgLfO-k
The console only got it's "fart music" reputation because of crappy US titles, 'cause most console US devs didn't knew how to handle FM synthesis correctly (same for PC devs, only arcade devs and pinball music programmers knew their shit). The "genesis is a dude bro console" shit is also a US-only phenomenon.
>>342829432
>garbage
Eat shit superfag.
>>342840679
Descent wasn't the build engine retard. I'd say you're the motherfucker who needs to google something, but frankly you should already know what the fuck descent is.
>>342840065
What defines a "real 3D game"? It's already a real 3D game.
>>342840128
Since when does the console have to render all those to make a game 3D?
>>342840335
Why does using one rendering method over another make something "true" 3D and another "false" 3D, when in the end both look 3D?
>>342840483
>Simulating 3d isn't the same as doing 3d.
Literally every rendering method is "simulating" 3D. There is no 3D world living inside your computer monitor when you play a polygonal game.
>That's like saying Mario clones on the PC simulated scrolling worlds by 'scrolling' in an entirely new level segment, like in Zelda, once you hit the edge of the screen, thus they were totally absolutely in every way capable of doing for real actual scrolling worlds, and it was in no way a lazy hack to attempt to give you the feel of the real deal.
So let me get this straight. By this logic, if a 3D polygonal game used fixed camera angles like the original Resident Evil except not prerendered, that wouldn't be 3D?
>>342829492
Genesis was way better than the NES, and was out several years before the SNES. The NES was horrible. Slow, boring games, 97% of which were all generic platformers, almost all of them broken. There were what? Over a thousand NES games with the official seal of approval? How many were actually good? 9? 10?
Genesis was king for it's time. Nintendo fanboys like to compare it to the SNES, as if to deny the fact that it was out YEARS before it. It's rightful comparison is to the POS NES.
>>342840734
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a_DnpZdJ_yY
>>342839840
The mode 7 layer IS 3d, but, it's like a single 3d texture for the entire game, while the rest are 2d sprites positioned in 3d.
>>342840814
>Since when does the console have to render all those to make a game 3D?
Because those are the dimensions which make up 3D, you fucking retard. You are the dumbest cunt I've ever seen.
>>342840814
3d is defined as being in 3 dimensions. It has to have depth, width, and height.
If you can't do this, you're not 3d. Is this too fucking hard for you to understand?
This isn't about semantics, or your personal definition of the field. If you don't have all of them, you're not a 3d game.
>>342841036
No it isn't.
>>342841036
Then it's not 3d, genius.
>a single 3d texture for the entire game!
>sprites positioned in 3d!
>blast processing!
>ultra-rastic high-def state of the art graphics.
>dual multiplex stereo sound.
Was it ancient aliens?
>>342841079
The other dimensions are implied. The console doesn't have to render every single dimention to make a game functionally 3D.
>>342841104
Look at Wolfenstein 3D. Every wall has height, width, and depth. It's 3D, but because it uses a "different" rendering method, it's not 3D? Come on now.
>>342841271
Why wouldn't it be 3D?
>>342841362
What do you mean 'functionally 3D'? It either renders three dimensions or it doesn't.
>>342841020
Man that's some really good tune there. Some more great megadrive music:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zeovgJZOlOs
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a2h8IZ_qHsE
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dbFlcOsT2MU
>>342841497
It looks 3D and it functions 3D. That's what functionally 3D is. You're judging 3D-ness by what rendering method it uses, which is just wrong.
>>342840814
Just stop responding and read this.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2.5D
>>342841616
How is it wrong to say that three dimensional graphics require three dimensions? Give me an example of a 'functionally 3D' 2D game.
>>342841547
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7O4HE6mvkYQ
>grew up playing streets of rage
>never played final fight despite also having an snes
>that massive disappointment when I realized how slow the game was
That's why OP
>>342841908
>he didn't play Final Fight on a Sega CD
kek & lel
>>342841908
The Snes version of Final Fight was a shit port. Play the original instead.
>>342841751
I know what it means, genius. 2.5D is a made-up term. You can't have half a dimension. You can try to make a 3D game play as if it were a 2D game, but it still renders a 3D perspective, making it 3D.
>>342841779
If it looks and feels 3D, it's 3D.
>Give me an example of a 'functionally 3D' 2D game.
I can't, because there's no such thing. Again, If it looks and feels 3D, it's 3D.
>>342841362
Wolf is a 2.5d engine that can't set height on anything. All walls are of the same 'height,' and it's not possible to transition from, say, a ground floor into a basement, or up the stairs in an elaborate nazi deathcastle to fight Hitler on the roof.
>>342842029
I can't believe that e-celebs try to call the Mega CD a failure. It had great games and was a financial success.
My meme console is better than your crappy console.
>Music
Reminder Shining Force 1 and 2 both used the default GEMS chip and sounded fucking great.
>>342842106
>If it looks and feels 3D, it's 3D.
This is fucking retarded. If it has three dimensions it is 3D. Are you trying to troll?
>>342842029
Holy shit, why didn't I know about this. My sega CD just collected dust when I could have been playing this.
>>342831809
Kek
>>342842161
>All walls are of the same 'height,' and it's not possible to transition from, say, a ground floor into a basement, or up the stairs in an elaborate nazi deathcastle to fight Hitler on the roof.
That doesn't matter, because it renders the game from a 3D perspective, making it 3D.
>>342842379
No, are you? I feel like I'm stating the obvious over and over again because you people can't understand this simple fact.
>>342831678
But Comix Zone is a beat-em-up...
This debate is dumb. Didn't most of these games just use the 3D for shumps and shit? It's not like you were interacting with a 3D world.
>>342841828
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aJhT6EyaOMI
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MhJ8BFNCl1c
>>342842214
That's because e-celebs don't know shit, they just want to make videos about shitting on various stuff.
>>342842106
>You can't have half a dimension
ok TJ "anon" Faglord, hear me out.
You're not in a 3D environment, you're just rotating and scaling 2D bitmaps.
>>342829432
At least it had games
Landstalker
Shining in the Darkness 1 & 2
Soleil / Crusader of Centy
Phantasy Star 2,3,4
Shining Force 1 & 2
Contra : Hard Corps
Decap Attack
Sparkster
Rocket Knight
Sonic The Hedgehog 3
Sonic & Knuckles
Wonder Boy in a Monster World
Streets of Rage 1,2 and 3
Splatterhouse 2
Ghouls'n Ghosts
>>342842539
>That doesn't matter, because it renders the game from a 3D perspective, making it 3D.
No it doesn't. As has been said earlier in this thread, no game is actually fucking "3D" because ultimately what is being drawn is a projection onto a 2D framebuffer.
So when people say that a game is 3D what they actually mean is whether the calculations behind the game work in 3 dimensions without any artificial constants.
And so Quake is 3D but Wolf2D isn't. Using your fucking logic you could argue that Donkey Kong Country is 3D because it uses prerendered models that were baked on 3D workstations.
>>342842702
GREETINGS FROM SHAPELAND
>>342842539
Looking 3D doesn't make a game 3D. Having THREE DIMENSIONS (3D) makes a game 3D. You're just being an idiot now who won't admit he's wrong. You don't even know what 3D means.
Three dimensions HEIGHT, WIDTH, and DEPTH. Those are the dimensions necessary for something to be THREE DIMENSIONAL.
streets of rage 1 2 3
best mk 1 version
skitchin
road rash
sonic 1 2 3
Aladdin best version
No idea.
>>342829492
>was a poor white kid
>loved the Genesis
FUCK
>>342842769
GnG is an arcade game.
>>342842539
It doesn't fucking do 3d, no matter how many times you post that it does on 4chan.
This has to be a ruse by now. How can you not understand the difference between wolf 3d/build engine and something like contemporary unreal or cryengine?
>>342834935
>>342835223
It's true, Sega was overwhelmingly popular in the EU and Nippon-land.
>>342842769
Herzog Zwei
Ristar
Adventures of Batman and Robin (the good one)
>>342842702
You're not in a 3D environment when you use polygons, either. 3D on a computer screen is an illusion no matter how you look at it, so why is one method of conveying this illusion considered 3D while another isn't?
>>342842846
>No it doesn't. As has been said earlier in this thread, no game is actually fucking "3D" because ultimately what is being drawn is a projection onto a 2D framebuffer.
This is exactly what I have been fucking saying this whole time.
>So when people say that a game is 3D what they actually mean is whether the calculations behind the game work in 3 dimensions without any artificial constants.
Why? What's the point of creating arbitrary definitions of 3D?
>And so Quake is 3D but Wolf2D isn't. Using your fucking logic you could argue that Donkey Kong Country is 3D because it uses prerendered models that were baked on 3D workstations.
No, my logic is that if it uses a live rendering engine to simulate being in a 3D environment, it's 3D. Why can nobody understand this?
>>342842879
Again, why are we creating arbitrary definitions of what 3D is? All 3D is an illusion, your use of one rendering engine to simulate this illusion doesn't make it less 3D than a game using another.
>>342843009
See above.
>>342842654
3d was largely a gimmick at the time. It took many years for it to advance so much that it could be used for games, movies, or much of anything.
Nowadays everything is in a 3d engine of some kind. Pic related is on unreal 3.
>>342843250
>arbitrary definitions of 3D
Does it have height, width, and depth? Is it lacking one of them?
Then it's not 3d. I'm sorry you're wrong on 4chan, anon, but that's just how it is.
>>342843250
>Why? What's the point of creating arbitrary definitions of 3D?
>requiring all 3 dimensions not to use constants is an arbitrary definition of 3D
>>342842654
>3d was largely a gimmick at the time. It took many years for it to advance so much that it could be used for games, movies, or much of anything.
This. As far as actual 3D Genesis games went. All I can think of is shit like Virtua Racing.
>>342843512
Damn it.>>342843315
>>342843512
There's F-22 Raptor too if I recall correctly.
>>342843250
Do you know what a dimension is? There is nothing arbitrary about a 3D model. A 3D model has height, width, and depth. Those are dimensions (D). There are three (3) of them. They are three dimensional (3D). How is that arbitrary?
genesis had the best version of this theme
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qPwAVGyJSr8
According to anon, pic related is a fully fledged 3d videogame.
>>342843394
Look at this. As the camera moves, the ground's perspective shifts to simulate the idea of being in a 3D environment, which is the same way all 3D operates, yet you elitists say this isn't 3D. Why?
>>342843476
Yes, it is an arbitrary definition, because pic related doesn't technically use all those dimensions but it still manages to function like a 3D game. Just because there aren't multiple levels of floors doesn't make it not 3D.
>>342843686
Because a game that doesn't use all those dimensions can still have a 3D perspective. See. This. Pic.
>>342843932
F-zero, like this >>342843804 isn't a 3d game. It doesn't have the 3 dimensions.
It's not an arbitrary definition. 5 year olds can grasp what is and isn't 3d, but you're arguing that because it simulates 3d, it totally is 3d, which isn't how it works.
>>342837248
Ranger X was so good
>>342843932
What 3D is is height, width, and depth. F Zero uses scaling effects to simulate 3 dimensional movement, like Monaco GP or Outrun, but there is no depth. You're looking at a 2D game when you play F Zero.
Whoa, man.
I can't believe they had 3d graphics down so hard in the 70s.
>>342829492
/thread
Sonic, gunstar heroes and that micheal Jackson game where you save the kids are the only things Genesis has over the SNES
>it's 2016
>Nintendrones are STILL mad that SEGA does what Nintendon't
>>342843932
>Just because there aren't multiple levels of floors
It doesn't have multiple floors because the height dimension (Y) is a constant.
Now let's think for a moment why having a constant dimension is useful. Oh, I know. It's because you only have to do processing involving 2 dimensions making it faster for older CPUs. Wait a sec, we're calculating in 2 dimensions? How is it 3D again?
You do realize that 2D game sidescrollers like Super Mario Bros also have a constant right? It's called the Z-axis.
Just because you can travel along the Z-axis doesn't mean it is a fucking 3D game. It's as 2D as Super Mario Bros.
What is the greatest 3d game, based solely on your own flawed ideas of what actually counts as 3d, anons? I like battle command.
>>342843250
>3D environment when you use polygons
Yes you are. 2D bitmaps might not have a third dimension, but 3D polygons surely do. Trying to argument that "nothing on computers is 3D because you have a flat screen" is just retarded.
>>342843250
>polygons are an illusion.
>your computer screen is flat, so they don't have a third dimension that could be measured.
>bitmaps are totally the same as polygons! Honest!
How do you even get through daily life?
>>342843804
NO ITS AN ILLUSION BECAUSE MY SCREEN IS FLAT CHECK MATE ATHEISTS
>>342844496
Space Harrier is pretty great.
>>342844718
actually in this specific aspect he is right.
A recorded lets play of a 3d game is a 2d thing.
Its only 3 when its a game and you are playing it, or the camera is being moved by some ai like in those in game videos that arent cuscene and happen when you are plauomg.
>>342843804
No, because the graphics are all precomputed. That's the whole point, if the graphics aren't precomputed and it uses a 3D perspective, it's 3D. But since the Vectrex uses vectors instead of bitmaps, that precomputation can be in the form of points on a screen, making it less memory-intensive.
>>342844101
Look at the fucking screenshot, it's obviously 3D yet you keep saying it's not.
>>342844192
No, I'm looking at a 3D game when I play F-Zero, because it has a 3D perspective that is rendered live. Again, you need to stop shoving your arbitrary definitions down people's throats.
>>342844241
Not 3D, because it's precomputed. This, on the other hand, is real 3D on an Atari: https://atariage.com/store/index.php?l=product_detail&p=302
>>342844450
But it has a 3D perspective, therefore it's 3D.
>>342844502
Do you actually believe polygons create a little pocket dimension that your computer acts as a window to? Because that's basically what you're saying.
>>342844496
Funny that you chose a game that uses polygons to try to prove me wrong.
>>342844718
How do you? You believe polygons create a pocket dimension like >>342844502.
>>342829492
>>342830521
>>342840705
I'm also not poor, black, had a Genesis, and my parents are still married.
Where's your argument now Mr. 1080p Projector?
>>342844989
>Not 3D, because it's precomputed.
But it looks 3D due to its baked 3D perspective so it's 3D according to your logic
>>342844989
>I am playing a 3D game when I play F Zero
You need depth for 3D brother. I'm screencapping this thread to preserve the retardation
>>342845383
I have literally never said that.
>>342845407
You're saying F-Zero doesn't have depth? Look at the screenshot I posted. The ground very clearly and obviously has depth.
>>342845508
>The ground very clearly and obviously has depth
Holy shit you just found a pocket dimension!
>>342835187
Are you jewish?
>>342845671
You believe computers can create pocket dimensions too? Good lord, I really am surrounded by idiots.
>>342829432
I'm willing to bet OP plays ninteindo games.
>>342845508
>I have literally never said that.
----
>>342844989
>Not 3D, because it's precomputed.
>But it has a 3D perspective, therefore it's 3D.
You can't see the contradiction here? As you say, if it has a 3D perspective it's 3D. Or is not being precomputed another caveat of yours?
>>342845773
Well, it seems the pocket dimension I just found doesn't have intelligent life. What a disappointment.
>>342845796
Well, forgive me for being tired out by responding to idiots constantly. When I said
>But it has a 3D perspective, therefore it's 3D.
I meant
>But it has a 3D perspective and it's not precomputed, therefore it's 3D.
>>342845508
>You're saying F-Zero doesn't have depth? Look at the screenshot I posted. The ground very clearly and obviously has depth.
Translation:
>I don't know shit. Apples look like oranges to me.
>>342845508
Shine on, you crazy diamond.
>>342845940
Translation: my arbitrary definition of what 3D has to be before it's actually considered 3D is the only thing that matters.
I hope the guys who are discussing 3D die on a fucking fire, they derailed this thread hard.
>>342845896
We could argue all day on the definition of 'precomputed'.
If we did things your way everything would be an overcomplicated clusterfuck due to your lack of acceptance of the obvious.
>>342846156
Where on earth are you people getting these ideas about what I think? It's like you're not even reading my posts.
>>342846091
3D = three dimensions. Not arbitrary.
>>342846257
Yes, and when I look at a screenshot of F-Zero or Wolfenstein 3D, I see 3 dimensions.
>>342842214
That's because for some reason all e-celebs are Nintendo fanboys. Most people only know about the Mega CD through the Angry Ninen.. I mean Angry Video Game Nerd.
>>342846348
But there aren't 3 dimensions there, as already explained to you. The mode 7 games are 2d games.
Wolf has no height.
Build lets you put 10000 square kilometer rooms inside a 1 meter ventilation duct.
Are you retarded, my main man?
>>342846590
Are you? It looks 3D to me, why doesn't it look 3D to you? Or do you believe Game Theory's outlandish theory on why 3D isn't 3D?
>>342846773
Because what you think and feel doesn't matter when we can prove beyond the shadow of a doubt that there's no such thing as 'depth' in mode 7 games, as explained here >>342844450 and here >>342844192
So either you're retarded, your parents raised you wrong as a joke, or you've got that nasty brain condition that also tells you that god created humanity in 7 days, but the lack of dinosaurs or anything in the bible is because reasons.
>>342846773
It's not outlandish to say that 3D games need three dimensions to be 3D.
>>342846773
Sometimes you just need to accept that you're being a fucking idiot, anon. Now is one of those times for you.
>>342847119
Well, what about Banjo-Pilot? That doesn't have any 3D models, do you think this is a 2D game?
>>342847198
See this screenshot. Do you think this is a 2D game?
>>342847448
If it has only two dimensions it is 2D. Games like that, by the looks of it (I've never played it or even seen it before), use scaling effects to simulate 3D movement across a 2D space.
>>342847448
You don't understand that to be 3d, you need height, width, and depth, do you?
>>342847685
Fine, I'll bite.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aG_OabpUzjM
By your logic this is a 2D game, but if you legitimately think this is 2D, you're tripping, man.
>>342847820
Apparently you don't.
>>342847829
I guess the effect was good enough to convince you. But if you had any technical knowledge at all you'd realise that you're looking at a 2D game.
>>342847948
No, even by your definition it's a 3D game because it satisfies all your conditions for height, width and depth to a T. You just don't want to admit that you've been proven dead wrong.
>>342847829
It's like a racing game set almost entirely in a more high-res mode 7.
So yes, it's a fucking 2d game, just like f-zero on the SNES.
>>342829492
i had both, seriously. Fuck you
>>342848114
No it fucking isn't, because you can move freely in 3 dimensions. How dense are you?
>>342848073
There's pretty obviously no depth. When and where do you travel into the background?
Oh, that's right, you don't, because that is indeed a background set on a different layer, with sprites being rotated and rescaled to give the illusion that racers are getting closer.
Just like fucking f-zero and mario kart.
>>342848073
No it doesn't. It only has two dimensions. The background isn't even 3D.
>>342848316
OK, so your definition of 3D is quite literally "has to use a certain rendering method". Anything short of that isn't 3D, despite obviously being 3D. Got it.
>>342829492
Mega Drive was by far the most popular console in western continental Europe, everyone had one.
>>342848343
Who's talking about the background? Do you think Mario 64 is 2D because it uses those static backgrounds?
Banjo-Pilot plays like a fully-fledged 3D game, and yet it's not according to you. You're all retarded.
>>342848449
If it has no depth it isn't 3D.
>>342848640
But it very clearly and obviously has depth. You're not going to go on about how the background being static (despite many fully polygonal games doing exactly that) makes it not 3D, are you?
>>342848595
>plays like a fully-fledged 3D game
In what sense? That foregroubd sprites are scaled in accordance with movement on the 2D plain to simulate three dimensional movement? That's not 3D. That's 2D.
>>342848808
Why isn't that 3D? It works exactly like any typical 3D game. The only difference is it doesn't use polygons. Your arbitrary definitions are so ingrained into your mind you can't see the obvious, it's honestly saddening.
>>342848802
The background is what the sprites, in the foreground, move and scale in front of. Mario 64 uses 2D sprites and 3D polygonal models in tandem in a 3D environment.
>>342848971
So? What does that have to do with anything?
Banjo-Pilot manages to satisfy everyone's definition of what a 3D game is and yet nobody will admit it's a 3D game.
>>342848935
Faking a third dimension with a cheap effect doesn't make it three dimensional.
>>342830521
>Not poor
>Not black
>parents divorced shortly after buying a genesis
Jesus christ you're still going on about this
>>342849114
No it doesn't. It has only two dimensions. That means it is 2D.
>>342848449
Can you define something based on its HEIGHT?
Can you define something based on its WIDTH?
Is it possible to travel 'into' or away from the background, aka DEPTH? Would you say that the background isn't actually a background, but a world?
If you can't do all that, then it's not a 3d game. Here is a 3d game. While the graphics may not be all that great, it's a 3d game. The 'rendering method' has nothing to do with it.
There's no depth in the secret of Mana Flammie flying map travel. It's the same exact thing they used for those dumb mode 7 stages in SNES contra, f-zero, many of axelay's stages, and etc.
It could possibly fool a child, but once they've played even the most primitive 3d game, they'll understand the difference without needing an explanation.
Flammie doesn't have depth. There's no real height to anything. There's not even a world to block your advance. In Mario 64, you're not locked on an axis. You can go in whatever direction you want. You can go into a basement, up into a tower, up stairs, down stairs, jump from wall to wall, reposition your 'camera' in the 3d world space, walls, doors, enemies, and pillars of flame can be whatever height or width they wanted them to be.
Do you want me to draw you a crayon diagram?
>>342830712
>all that trash
>No contra
>No thunder force
>>342831792
>saturn bad.
While you're not completely wrong, it did have a good amount of great titles.
>>342849149
Yes it does, just look at it. It's 3D. Your arbitrary definition of having to use polygons doesn't make something that looks 3D and functions 3D not 3D.
>>342849270
Are belt-scrollers 3D?
>>342849235
Will you just look at it? It clearly has 3 dimensions. You cannot and will not even try to prove otherwise.
>>342849270
>THE BACKGROUND MUST BE A WORLD
Why in god's name are completely random factors like this the deciding force in what makes a 3D game 3D? Everything about the game I linked to is 3D. End of discussion. You're not even attempting to make this a reasonable discussion.
>>342849314
Any object with depth, width, and height is 3D. Banjo Pilot has no depth. You've been fooled by a cheap trick.
>>342849365
A what now? As long as it has all three dimensions, then it's 3d. If by 'belt scroller,' you mean something like the Flammie travel, then no. It doesn't have a third dimension. Specifically, it has no depth.
>>342849830
Do you know what depth is?
>>342849838
>i-its just a trick!
Yeah, you know what? A raycasting or raytracing engine is just a trick, too. That's a fact.
>>342849943
Yes, but apparently you don't.
>>342849870
A belt scroller, like Battletoads or Turtles in Time
>>342850090
Define it for me.
>>342849984
All it is doing is scaling the sprites to make them seem larger or smaller based on your position on a 2D plain.
>>342842696
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=apPi9eC6Nxw
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5dt1-3rc1g8
>insert every sonic game
OST time?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C1HwVKrdeKY
>>342850172
No, but it's probably the most convincing pseudo-3d, especially the games that incorporate parallax scrolling that lets you seemingly throw things 'at' the screen, like the foot clan soldiers in TMNT.
Largely forgotten games like swordmaster on the NES used very advanced (for the time) multi layer parallax scrolling to great effect.
>>342850327
Depth, at least on a raster display, is the illusion of being able to perceive an object as being a certain distance away from the screen. How does 2D sprites simulating this not count as 3D? Nobody has been able to answer this.
>>342850842
>illusion
No. Depth is the horizontal distance from front to back. What do you think the horizontal distance is from front to back of a 2D sprite?
>>342850809
The real reason why I ask if it's 3D is
>Can move left and right
>Can move up and down
>Can also jump
is that not 3D?
>>342850842
Depth isn't an illusion.
In f-zero, you can never travel into the world.
In quake, you can travel into the world.
It's the difference between being locked to a plane, like a 2d game (which is what f-zero is) and a real 3d game, like quake. Even when you have depth, it might be limited, like how you can't travel down or up in wolf. Then you're just another 2.5d game.
A bit closer to 3d, but not quite.
>>342851182
I don't think you know what "horizontal" means, buddy. And if this is your definition, then the trees in Mario 64 aren't 3D because they're sprites that scale to simulate depth, despite being in a 3D environment.
>>342851284
>In quake, you can travel into the world.
using this logic, isn't Doom 3D? When it isn't?
>>342845772
Who isn't jewish?
>>342851450
I think I already told you that about Mario 64.
But please, tell me how you know more about depth than every mathematician ever. The guy who thinks scaling 2D sprites is 3D.
>>342851284
Depth is an illusion when it's on a raster display. Depth does not exist on a 2D screen, and no amount of memes will make this any more true.
You can't travel "into" the world in Quake any more than in F-Zero. In fact, the only difference there is that Quake lets you travel vertically, which if that is really your definition of 3D, then Banjo-Pilot has to be 3D too.
>>342851739
It looks 3D.
It acts as if it were 3D.
Therefore.
It's 3D.
This is not rocket science, and if you think I'm wrong, then polygonal graphics aren't 3D either.
>>342851757
>3D isn't 3D because it's on a screen
>>342829432
You're garbage.
>>342851183
No, you need to be able to travel from front to back. If you have your character at position Y, and moving you 'forwards' will carry you into the world, say to place X, that's depth.
Whereas in mode 7 games, or parallax scrolled games, this isn't possible. You're always at a set distance from the world. In battletoads, you can travel up and down, but 'up' and 'down' aren't up and down the way you'd walk up and down stairs, but merely a 2d playing field that gives the illusion of being 3d.
When you move Zitz 'up,' he doesn't travel into the world. He simply moves into the top row sprite layer, which may or may not have other obstacles and enemies on its row. When you play quake and you tell Ranger to move towards the portal and down the corridor, he does indeed travel down it, and eventually, you'll reach the portal.
Games like battletoads, swordmaster, and snake rattle 'n roll are superb at creating the illusion that they're 3d, but they're clearly not.
>>342851945
Until we make true 3D screens, it's not and never will be. Give me a single reason why depth isn't an illusion when you're just looking at a flat panel.
>>342851943
>It looks 3D.
To a child who has never seen 3D, maybe.
>It acts as if it were 3D.
It does not.
>>342852072
>To a child who has never seen 3D, maybe.
Why would said child be wrong about seeing 3D where it exists?
>It does not.
It very clearly does.
>>342851984
>When you play quake and you tell Ranger to move towards the portal and down the corridor, he does indeed travel down it, and eventually, you'll reach the portal.
This could be said about Doom
but Doom is a 2D game
>>342851984
Stop talking about the "world". You act as if that's a special concept when it really doesn't exist in the realm of computer graphics. It's always just a background, either rendered as a static image, a static image transferred into a 3D environment, or polygons rendered in 3D.
>>342851540
It uses a 2d floor plan, walls can only ever be drawn a certain way, at a certain height, at a certain width, line of sight is locked parallel to the floor, and it's not possible to put one room above another. Stairs and slopes also aren't real, because it's not possible to set things at a different angle. Like duke 3d's infinitely big rooms, stairs and slopes in doom are the result of engine limiations.
>>342852557
Yes, thank you for reaffirming what I said, Doom is 2D.
But your logic for why Quake is 3D can be applied to Doom. Yet Doom is 2D, and Quake is 3D.
>>342852557
And that's not 3D because?
>>342852698
Because by definition, it doesn't work 3 dimensions.
Compare doom to quake. One game lets you climb bricks in the wall to get up to a higher plane, the other doesn't. Hell, one of them essentially doesn't let you look around the world, while the other is entirely freelook enabled.
>>342853056
Who cares? Doom still functions as a 3D game. I don't care how it renders that illusion, it accomplishes its purpose of putting you in a 3D environment. I feel like I've stated the obvious hundreds of times at this point.
>>342853056
And you're right. Doom is 2D.
But using your logic found here >>342851984
>When you play quake and you tell Ranger to move towards the portal and down the corridor, he does indeed travel down it, and eventually, you'll reach the portal.
That logic says Doom is 3D.
Doom can't possibly be 2D and 3D at the same time.
inb4 people say that this game was shit[spoiler/]
>>342837760
GROOVY!
>>342853663
>talking about the Genesis
>in this thread
kek
![zero-tolerance-05[1].png](https://i.imgur.com/Y4Bklhz.png "zero-tolerance-05[1]")
