DO NOT LINK THE FLAME
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>DO NOT LINK THE FLAME
DAILY REMINDER THAT LINKING THE FIRE HELPS LITERALLY NO ONE AND ONLY CAUSES PAIN FOR EVERYONE INVOLVED
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=koCVr5mg6mw
>DO NOT LINK THE FLAME
>>335527856
What the fuck
what do i do instead then?
>mfw linked the flame
>>335527992
Cuddle up to your waifu in the eternal darkness.
>I told him to link the flames and he actually did it the absolute madman!
>>335528483
Which one? This game has the most canon waifus of all.
>>335527856
How do you trigger that?
>>335527856
as if linking the flame actually means anything and isnt some bullshit gibberish from pulled out of miyazakis ass to fool you into thinking there is a point to dark souls
>>335528483
>implying you'll be able to cuddle with her once you turn into a fucked up formless being
Vendrick was on the right track. Hope you choose the best ending, anons.
>>335529102
Murder his face, he'll respawn.
>>335527856
What the fuck did you think would happen?
It would feel like butterflys?
>>335527856
I never understood why would somebody ever link the flame, even in the DS1, all the shit it DS world came from the Gwyn faggot and his shitty flame, the cursed thing should have been extinguished long time ago.
how am I supposed to not link the flame if I can't even hurt enemies? this bug is really annoying, specially since a lot of these enemies just roam around making it difficult to find their spawn
>>335530180
I actually thought so yes, and the "burning" was only symbolic of your souls being burned away and not a phsyical feeling of burning.
Chosen Undead doesnt even fucking flinch when he sets himself on fire in DaS1 after all.
>>335527856
Dude it's a video game, nobody is in pain
Jesus christ, it's Undertale all over again
>>335530559
>"guys im so cool Im so detached from my emotions look how unique and edgy I am"
no shit it's a videogame, kill yourself
>>335530274
>He believes the Jew Snakes and unironically believes that the fire is the cause of all the bad occurrences in the world.
>>335530931
I'm a pretty emotional guy actually, and I really enjoyed both Undertale and DaS3, but acting like this is just plain retarded, it's just a video game.
>>335527856
Why do people still think not linking the fire is good? We've seen multiple times now how absolutely fucked everything goes when the flame goes out, far worse than linking the fire.
>>335527992
buy the dlc which will probably add a bullshit 5th ending
>>335528483
my waifu isblind
>>335531324
what happens when the flame goes out?
it's not really much of a surprise that sacrificing yourself to a primeval flame hurts like a bitch.
usurption of fire is the best endingeven if you're helping the snakes.. just like the dark lord ending.
>>335531570
I doubt you're helping the snakes.
>>335531532
you know what untended graves and chasm of the abyss looks like? You know those weirdos in lothric castle that explode in black cocks? It's that, but everywhere.
>>335531756
>>335531756
I say bring oblivion. And hope to hell the end births a better tomorrow.
Fuck maintaining an unending cycle of purgatory.
>>335531725
Yuria is one of Kaathe's pawns, and guess who goads you into doing all the edgelord shit in the game?
>>335529348
>level up with yore 4 times
>he won't let me level up a fifth time
>go fuck around in all other areas I possibly can to see if that triggers it
>he still won't let me level up a fifth time
>ok maybe I miscounted because I've literally and painstakingly done everything before catacombs
>walk 2 feet in catacombs, go back to firelink
>he's dead
>yuria never shows up
FUCK YOUR ASININE QUEST REQUIREMENTS FROM
RUNNING THIS BLIND WITHOUT MISSING SHIT IS FUCKING NEAR IMPOSSIBLE
FUCK
>>335531725
How are you not helping the snakes? Londor practically worships Kaathe, you don't think he influenced them?
>>335531725
I wouldn't know. apperantly if I get the hollow girls setI don't mean anri. it alludes to the snakes. never got the armor myself though.
>>335531867
I personally believe thatthe age of dark is really just a transitionary age as everything sinks into dark and the only thing left is the grey archtrees, and the age of dragon is born again
>there are people who somehow think continuing the age of fire is worse than just letting the abyss rape everything
>>335531756
You're gonna have the "humans are darkness" snake sympathizers on you any moment now.
>Oolacile completely fucked over after accidently encroaching on Manus' lair
>literally fucking everything that went down in New Londo
>Darkness supporters include horrifying abominations, edgelords, lying serpents, and a giant evil monkey man
Linking the fire and sacrificing yourself for the greater good is the only proper ending.
>>335531867
It's a cycle anyway so someone will relight the flame again sooner or later. Seeing how people tried to keep it lit suggests it's better that way instead of being a abyss blob.
>>335532086
well that is what starts to happen towards the end of dark souls 3
then ashen one goes and fucks everything up because he's an idiot who ruins everything
is it shitty to live in londor? how big is the world of dark souls?
>>335532020
He was drawing out Hollow Powers. How do you think you could unlock more Hollowing?
>>335532086
My outlook was that the age of fire has been sputtering and dying for a long time.
Instead of stringing it along on life support, I just felt it was time for things to die with a little dignity.
I'd like to think my character is sitting in the dark with the Firekeeper waiting what is to come.
So did anyone find a merchant that sells covenants item in the game yet?
>>335532365
I should have noted, I committed suicide a good deal so I already had enough hollowing.If you're wondering why I knew all of this in a blind playthrough, friend spoiled me on it.
>people will defend the abyss and darkness despite every game showing the abyss as nothing but a world unfit for anything that isn't a mindless monster.
The darkwraiths are the only humans that can live in the abyss and that's only thanks to some serpents mercy. Darkfags literally want to be slaves to some serpents.
>>335532306
Oolacile seems like it's been aight for a while, go live there
>>335532306
Fairly large. Several nations and peoples existing over the seas and from distant lands have been mentioned throughout the series.
Personally, I'd love to see them riff off the classic "Journey to the West" and have a player from their far-east analog have to do a great journey ending up at Anor Londo. It would give them a chance to explore some new territory while keeping to the themes and mechanics we've all come to love.
>>335532574
>Darkfags literally want to be slaves to some serpents.
Darkfags confirmed for kikes.
>>335532020
You have to accumulate a certain amount of hollowing before he gives you a level, ie you have to die alot.
>>335532020
You only level up when you die 2 times. Every 2 deaths you can level with him again to 5.
>>335531418
Good taste anon
>>335532574
>burning yourself is good for everyone but yourself
>not burning yourself is good for you but sucks for everyone else
>it's all a cycle anyways
Shit sucks everyone dies etc except serpents for some reason
Maybe we need to kill the serpents?
>>335530274
when the fire fade, the curse spread.
linking the fire = stopping the curse
not linking the fire = god lose strength, humans go hollow. environment dies and everybody starved to death.
>>335528483Attack the firekeeper after defeating the Soul and stomp her head and steal the first flame for yourself.Like I did.
>>335532862
Serpents just want to rule the whole world and to do that it has to be turned into the abyss.
So is giving the Fire Keeper those eyes supposed to be a bad or unwanted thing? Her dialogue and the music seems to imply that, or is it just because you're not doing your job like a good goy?
>>335532306
Well for one thing, there are no normal people in the Dark Souls universe. Only undead or other fucked up beings.
>>335532958
>linking the fire = stopping the curse for a while
is just a waste of time
>>335533027
It shows her horrible visions and makes her go mad.
>>335532574
As opposed to the countless nations and the entirety of their population falling over and over again because everyone within it turned into a mindless monster once the fire starts fading? They're both fucking shit but at least the fire will probably be reborn with full force during the age of dark.
>>335531570
this anon is right though.
>>335532157
You don't think it's telling at all that the age of fire has clearly hit diminishing returns? The fire you get if you link it at the end of 3 burns so weakly, it's clear it's not supposed to continue burning much longer.
>>335531256
>I really enjoyed Undertale
Autist detected
>>335533004
Maybe they don't want to rule it but they are the only things that last forever and prefer everything to be fucked up instead of fire. They are 'primordial' serpents after all, they are probably assholes from before/outside time who just want to fuck shit up to make everything comfier for themselves. You know, like a lot of stuff from lovecraft.
>>335533053
Not all humans turn undead, at least not right away.
What's his dialog there have to do with anything?
>>335533243
That sounds exactly like the thought process of any dickhead being who would come up with a covenant like the Darkwraiths. Although Frampt seemed like he was perfectly content going against the grain and helping you link the fire.
I desperately want to know more aboutOCCELOTTE. I hope he is a major player in the dlc.
>>335530274
Wrong.
Within the Flame they found the Lord Souls. The Furtive Pigmy split the Dark Soul and created humanity. When the fire starts losing its power by fading, this connection is obviously weakened. After all, the Dark Soul, which makes them human, came from it and thus they start to hollow, which is humanity's natural state when the influence of the fire is lost on it. Linking the fire is the only logical conclusion, unless you want to support the idea that becoming a mindless zombie will amount to anything.
Daily reminder to ignore serpent shills.
Well who the fuck is real big and evil boss of dark souls, if all linking the fire does is stoping the curse what the hell is causing it? Do we gotta fight like saten or some shit?
>>335532062
literally kill yuria and she says "I failed thee, Kaathe"
>>335533446
don't you see the snakes are literally playing both sides?
>>335530274
Fuck off kaathe
>>335532170
Linking the Fire created the Curse.
>>335532862
>>335532958
>>335532441
https://youtu.be/EnKP62ejnWk?t=296
>>335533513
You don't get it, our natural state is one of neither good nor evil. With the Flame it creates light and dark, good and evil, life and death. The only way to win is to remove ourselves from the equation. Otherwise we will continue to struggle through existence forever.
>>335533513
the flame dying is just a natural course of history, but some fags out there want to cling to it and extend it a bit longer. The age of fire has been literally in life support for too long
>>335533513
It's universal entropy, it can't be fought, only delayed. Miyazaki likes his depressing nihilism.
>>335533225
Explain yourself
>>335533813
5.40 is best ending
>>335533738
To expand on that, Aldia finds in dark souls 2 that Hollows are the true state of humanity and that humans we know them were only possible with the linking of the fire.
>>335533513
Everything dies in the end
>>335533813
No thanks anon, I want to earn them.
>>335533881
Do not go gentle into that good night. Rage, rage against the dying of the light. Fuck any darkness fag that just wants to give up and give in.
>>335533513
See >>335533486 and >>335533954
The curse doesn't mean anything, it's just humans returning to what they actually are. Humanity is the anomaly here, even though it's certainly better.
>>335527992
Do what Vendrick and Aldia seek to do, and take Fire and Darkness together. Break the cycle.
Or just let the world experience the heat death of the universe. Both are better than linking the flame
>>335533513
The real evil boss is Gwyn, who committed the first sin by artificially extending the Age of Fire. The world going to shit is his fault.
>>335533513
>Well who the fuck is real big and evil boss of dark souls
there is none
>>335533513
When Gwyn linked the fire he broke the natural progression of the world and that caused the curse of hollowing.
When the hollows stopped linking the fire, the fire created the unkindled.
>>335534085
>literally nothing existing anymore and perpetual hellish darkness is better than giving humanity a chance to prosper and live normally
yeah, right
>>335534249
*Cough Pontiff cough*
Pontiff was actually a despicable piece of shit antagonist that I felt satesfied killing.
>>335527856
I think you guys are forgetting that even if you don't link the flame, the firekeeper herself says she can see tiny flames in the darkness. There is literally no way to stop the fire because this is a typical cyclical Japanese story.
the dark souls world as we know it has always been a state of fading fire. and it sucks dick. all linking does is extend that. things should just progress naturally into darkness.
>>335533486
Aldia thinks you're full of shit
If DaS is truly a appropriation of ideas already present in DeS then the lords soul found in the flame probably has the same properties as the soul given to man in the intro to DeS. Thus both humans and the lords owe their "clarity" or general self awareness to them without the souls or the flame everyone would be mindless just like hollows are.
>>335534321
>When Gwyn linked the fire he broke the natural progression of the world and that caused the curse of hollowing.
See >>335533486 and >>335533954
>When the hollows stopped linking the fire, the fire created the unkindled.
Not really. From Miyazaki's interview two days ago:
Q: Previously, the protagnist was called 'Undead', in Dark Souls 3 he/she is called 'Unkindled'. What is the difference between the two?
A: Dark Souls 1's protagnist is Undead, its story is about linking the fire. But Dark Souls 3 depicts the Undeads who didn't succeed in linking fire and becoming cinder, but failed and burned to nothing. Unkindled is born out of their remaining ashes. Unkindled exist to inherit the past and put an end to this cumulative tale.
Source: https://www.reddit.com/r/darksouls3/comments/4gg3jg/april_23rd_hidetaka_miyazaki_interview_in_taiwan/
>inb4 le ebin /v/irgin anal prolapse because muh leddit boogeyman
>>335534350
the world fades into nihilism with the flame
good and evil only exist when living isn't suffering
>>335534329
>Believing Gwyn's lies
>>335534040
and yet you are going to have to read an online guide just to get them
>>335534507
CU confirmed as a chump underachiever as he's not a lord of cinders in the game. Unkindled is literally the second chance of CU to not fuck up.
all i got from this thread is Miyazaki is a hack...
>>335534656The chosen undead is the first form of the soul of cinder
>>335534507
You just proved literally what I just said you sperg
>>335534656
various CUs join together in the sould of cinder.
>>335534576
Exept Pontiff was an actual evil mother fucker
>Mind rapes an unknown daughter of gwynever and turns her into his personal dancing whore
>Sieges anor Londo when Gwyndolin is ill to free his master and then force feeds poor gwyndolin to aldrich after doing god knows what to her.
Fuck this dude, death was too swift and kind for him.
>>335534612
You mean Aldia? Because he's the one who found out that hollows are the natural state of humans.
>>335534656
the Chosen Undead is the final boss bruh
>>335534690
we know it a long time ago, m8. he cant even keep dark souls 2 following his vision despite being the boss in Nipland of all places.
>>335527856
>game is called Dark Souls
>some faggot asks you to start a fire so it would stop being so dark all the time
>what's the worst that could happen
>>335534745
>>335534798
Those might as well be failed undead that just used the bonfires. After all the ashes in the bonfires are from dead undead so it could have just channeled that as a warm up before calling on the power of a real lord of cinder - Gwyn.
>>335534489
No, that fits perfectly with what Aldia said.
It's just that Aldia thinks that having any of the Lord Souls and not just being a world of hollows is a sin.
>>335534804
>gwyndolin
>her
>>335535085
Are you saying Gwyn is a liar? He only had two daughters.
>>335535085
Yes her. This maymay is getting really old. If she didn't want to be a girl anymore she'd have stopped a couple thousand years ago.
>>335531418
>not giving your waifu sight
You truly are a terrible husbando. . .
did dancer had a hard life?
Fuck the cycle.
Just end the suffering.
>>335535367
Yeah... and it makes me real sad thinkin about it :(
>>335535367
Yeah, she was forced to dance with those two swords to mimic flames while Pontiff sat and jerked off imagining fire. Sick fuck.
>>335535475
You would still suffer only then everyone would be a mindless hollow along with you.
>>335533930
He's a shitposter, dude. Have you not been here for the past...well, since Undertale came out?
>>335531256
Tell me Sif waiting by his buddy's grave and protecting it didn't make you feel anything because it's just a game. Especially with the music, and when he started limping and falling over.
Tell me that and I can tell you that you have autism.
![360CF25D46CFAC4FF082D9EFCA987BC39BCF8FDF[1].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/4OZ8LL9.jpg "360CF25D46CFAC4FF082D9EFCA987BC39BCF8FDF[1]")
>>335532020
>Usurp the fire totally blind
>Have no fucking idea what's going on or why
>Uninstall shortly after
>>335535591
literally can't suffer if your mindless dude.
>>335535490
>>335535485
Knowing what happened with dancer I wish we had an option to drop our weapon and give her a hug while gently saying"you're suffering is over, sweet one".
>>335533513
The Dragons are the ultimate bads.
>opposed Gwyn and his forces
>planted Seath as a double agent among the lords
>fucks with humanity via Seath and the serpents
>responsible for Nameless King's betrayal
Fuck dragons.
Just finished my play through. Being off the internet for 4 weeks was suffering. Found a surprising amount of stuff for my first play through. Only missed Archdragon Peak as far as areas go. Finished with 15 +8 flasks. About to reroll as a magic user.
>>335535291
Where do I get that pose???
>>335535654
Dude I've been worried about having autism since I was 14 years old because of several reasons and this now might just confirm it
If you don't link it someone else will.
>>335535708
We actually don't know that. We never see what the dragons were like before they were attacked and overthrown.
>>335535740
Shit. I thought I was good with 12 +5 flasks. You must be a lot better at checking areas than I am.
>>335535668
Well hollows are mindless compared to normal humans but they don't attack themselves so there's clearly a speck of will in them. It's not explained like in DeS why hollows(soulless people in the case of DeS) are hostile to only sane people.
>>335534329
Humanity wasn't supposed to exist for starters, age of ancients ending was a mistake.
>>335535654
>If you don't care about fictional characters you have autism
>>335535969
>hurr what is empathy
retard
>>335535957
Dragons are the biggest victims of DaS
>>335535903
because they are naturally attracted to what the lack. like a moth to a flame.
>>335535903
Because literally video games. Imagine if every enemy started killing each other and you sat from a distance and watched then carefully walked by picking the drops?
>>335535895
It took me like 65 hours to beat the game I did a lot of searching. I missed the one estus shard off the skeleton ball in the catacombs.
>>335535669
Mebe in dlc we can have something like an alternate Sif cutscene in Dks1... I mean it'll still be sad but like... at least something. Post Dancer pics to cheer me up ;^;
>>335535224
Pretending to be a girl, even for thousands of years, doesn't mean you're actually a girl, anon. He was born a boy and died as one.
>>335536003
Lemme just feel some empathy for this chocolate bunny I'm eating oh no it looks so sad I can't eat it the feels :(
smash dat fukkin like button if u agree
>>335527856
booerns
>>335534237
What Gwyn did by linking the fire wasn't really any more artificial than the Lords' war against the Everlasting Dragons in the first place. It's a pretty typical mythological cycle, of gods rising to defeat primordial, unformed chaos, and then proceeding to create the world, life, and mankind, which requires sacrifice to be sustained and kept in prosperity. The Age of Fire is probably part of a larger cycle itself, eventually it exhausts itself fully, but inevitably it comes again.
>Skull Ring description
Yeah, I don't trust what burnt Lieutenant Dan says.
>>335536080
And what do hollows lack? protipit's not humanity as DS2/3 doesn't even have that
>>335536190
congratulations on literaly having autism
so... shit happens to dancer and what not, real question is... how flexible is she?
Are there even humans in the Dark Souls world? I don't even know if anything is worth saving.
>>335536283
stop enabling him, hes obviously baiting you.
>>335536243
Problem is the dragons literally sat in place doing nothing. I don't see how they blocked the creation of a new world if they can live perfectly fine in the age of fire.
>>335535708
>Fuck dragons
>dragons were just chilling and fucking around, not bothering anybody
>Gwyn and his Faggot Brigade just show up and decide to throw lightning at them
man fuck gwyn
>>335536274
did it literally says an effigy restores humanity. while in ds3 you aren't a true hollow, you're unkindled. or if you go a certain path, a artificial hollow.
>>335536018
>just exist around
>do nothing wrong since there's no other beings around they could even want to hurt
>some shitstains find fire
>start wagging war
>lose because one faggot felt too different
>even now some beings still realise how stupid that was and how their only hope of salvation is to aspire to become a dragon
>>335536486
I still feel a bit bad for gwyn, I feel like he never intended any bad to come out of all this.
>>335536390
>baiting you
I'm the one being baited here. Baited by these NEET pieces of shit who get moved by their cartoons and videogames. It's downright upsetting, anonymous.
>>335536116
>dlc we go into some memory magic in the Deep cathedral
>Dancer is doing a lapdance for Pontiff
>Dancer mesess up, Pontiff gets up and beats the shit outta her
>Say's she has an hour to get it right and he'll be coming back
>Dancer is laying down sobbing uncontrollably
No thanks.
>>335527856
>not taking the flame for yourself while killing the fake Firekeeper abomination simultaneously
mfw best secret ending
The narrator getting asshurt at you along with no achievement/trophy cancer confirm it as best ending
>not being like the Bearer of the Curse and telling the cycle to go fuck itself
>>335536486
>even after winning they hunt down pretty much every dragon until they believe them to be extinct
gwyn is hitler
>>335536387
Yeah, Carim, Catarina, Vinheim and the swamp seem to be okay and with humans. Other kingdoms not so much, but who knows how large the world is?
>>335536684
I wonder what that asshole is up to anyway while some other guy goes and does his job ending the cycle.
>>335534237
>world going to shit is his fault
>world would never be able to go to shit if Gwyn hadnt made things better by linking the Fire in the first place
>world was shit in the first place
>some how world being shit forever is better than world being not shit for periods of time that depend on the fire being linked
i want dark fags to fuck off and die
>literally the whole game is fighting the minions of darkness
>kek don't link the flame guys
>>335536737
If he is Hitler why does a jew tells you to succed him?
>>335536827
world wasn't shit in the first place. it was literally nothing
>>335536420
>>335536486
I wonder who's behind these posts
>>335536840
Linking flame is stupid, take the flame.
>>335533486
>>335534832
We knew that from DS1 intro. Both Lords and Humans natural state is hollow. Yes, Gwyn, Nito, etc were all ugly hollows at first.
>>335536636
keep it coming friendo i welcome it i love it
One thing about the everlasting dragons.
Where the fuck are they? They're everlasting. They're neither alive nor dead, so how were they killed? The whole lightning spear barrage and the festering disease from Nito shouldn't have done anything. It's like trying to kill a rock.
You know why dragons where beaten because they were a bunch of limp dicked lefties. If there was a dragon Hitler he would have never allowed for the birth of a disfigured abomination like Seath. The dragons forgot to safeguard their racial and genetic purity and that lead them to their defeat. So to sum it up Hitler did nothing wrong.
>>335536916
your argument is basically equivalent to you not wanting to be born if you start suffering towards the end of your life, because when you're suffering life sucks, even though you're totally ignoring any happiness you had before you started suffering
>>335536931
So who is the furtive Pygmy? Dlc when?
>>335530274
In DaS 1 it was clear no matter which you chose it was fucking pointless, only in DaS 3 can you take a definitive end to it all because if you let the fire end naturally and allow a new world to eventually be born in the current one's absence since theres no other shmup alive besides you with the strength to save it anymore. OR you can just absorb it entirely and put a complete end to cycles to the current world and let the world continue without experiencing a complete heat death.
>>335537009
They were betrayed by Seath, not sure how, but he might've held some secret knowledge about a weakness they had.
>>335536918
Gwyn pls go back to you bonfire you faggot.
>>335537058
Obviously Manus. Furtive pygmy is tied with the abyss, dark and humanity. Humans can ascend to become wraiths.
>>335537058
MANUS
A
N
U
S
>>335537009
they are everlasting in the way that they will always have followers.
>>335537009
>It's like trying to kill a rock.
Well, when the molecules of a rock vanish, it's pretty dead then
>>335537058
>So who is the furtive Pygmy? Dlc when?
Furtive Pygmy was just another hollow. He gets the name becuase all the lords went from hollows to super cool giants with god like powers. He just turned... into a tiny weak human. A prettier smarter version of a hollow really.
The Furtive pygmy himself is not important.
He might be Manus. And we killed him ages ago.
>>335527856
Age of Ancients = Primordial dragons
Age of Fire = Gwyns god complex world
Age of Dark = Real humanity not cursed to be gwyns fire cock slut.
The choice is basically if you want to be a linking the fire slave or not.
>>335536931
Nope, that's wrong. Gwyn, Nito & CIA are not humans. They are Giants. They aren't even affected by hollowing, otherwise we wouldn't literally have beings such as Yorshka or Gwyndolin still existing in dark souls 3 after multiple cycles.
Humans are what resulted from the split of the Dark Soul. Gwyn and everybody else already existed prior to that.
>>335537058
DLC come and gone, anon. Furtive Pygmy is dickass monkey man, and defining proof that darkness is shit, has always been shit, and will continue to always be shit.
>>335536931
no nito was a skeleton
>>335535786
just play the game, it's not missable, it's right next to a main area bonfire
>>335537149
The only weakness dragons had were their scales, Seath only pyrpose was to tell Gwyne to peel their scales off and you kill a dragon.
>ash lakes trees are all burned down
>stone dragon nowhere to be seen
>no dragon covenant just an anorexic dragon form
ITS NOT FAIR
>>335537170
>Humans can ascend to become wraiths.
Wrong only humans serving the serpents are darkwraiths the dark hand is a serpent technique.
>>335537009
Is a rock alive? No, is it dead? No.
>>335537009
The first game tells you they where immortal because scales, Gwyns tears of their scales, the witch burns their homes, Nito kill them in mass and Seth went Rambo on their ass.
>>335537247
>do I want to be a mindless insane prune
>sure, let's let that fire go out
>don't worry, these cool snakes and this crazy fire man told me it was all good
>>335537268
Dark Souls 3 even reassured us the darkness is fucking shit. Just look at how the firelink in the dark age looks like with that zero fucking light anywhere and zombie dogs roaming about.
Dark a shit.
>>335537149
>>335537009
>>335537235
The fan theory is that Seath told Gwyn the secret of their ever lasting life was their scales. Remove the scales and you can kill them. Gwyn's lighting bolts are able to peel back their scales. This then left them open for others to attack them. The Knights, the miasmas, the flames.
Seath was rewarded for this, and since he was a scaleless dragon and would die, he began researching another way to not die.
They could also be literally immortal and regrow after time.
>>335537319
Well, apparently that was enough to turn the tables. Gven how Gwyn linked the fire, witch tried to recreate it and Nito gave no fucks, it's safe to assume they weren't the brightest bunch.
>>335535003
Its explicitly stated in its Soul description that the Soul of Cinder is the manifestation of every single person who has ever linked the fire including Gwyn and anyone that has ever chosen the Link the Fire ending in DaS1, which is why it uses so much of our own shit.
>>335537352
Well no shit he is nowhere to be seen, that nigga has to be long dead.
>>335532157
>link the fire in 1
>CU catches fire like some bootleg fireworks
>link the fire in 3
>few embers fucking around
>probably run out by the time the credits roll
Clearly works well and isn't just a fluke
>>335533486
>The Furtive Pigmy split the Dark Soul and created humanity
<Citation Needed>
>>335533513
The default state of the DaS universe seems to be everything being awful. It's not all bad, because of some heroes who've upset the status quo. Now you have to kill them all, along with some utter madman, to keep the legacy alive. But it doesn't matter because it's all going to shit anyway, just a little slower.
There's like 3 types of beings you kill, I've found. The monsters, like Aldrich, Seathe and the demons. The fallen, often good guys gone crazy like hollows, Yhorm and so many others. Then there's all the still sane good ones you kill just because they're in the way like Sif.
You have some real wicked guys around, but they don't matter any more than the good guys and you have to kill them all, more or less. So no, no big bad who killing would make the world good again.
>>335537382
Well the serpents are beings if the dark abyss. So if thry embrace the dark enough they can ascend into becoming a darkwraith.
>>335537435
But that's what the fourth ending suggests I think?
I'm not positive but the reason snakemans way never worked was because there was always a piece of the fire to be linked.
Now that you literally become the living vessel of fire and theres nothing left for a random cursed undead to link the age of humanity ushers in.
>>335537391
That was my point. They should be like rocks, but they're portrayed as endless beings.
If it's scales that make the dragons immortal, what about Kalameet? He's a true dragon, not some pussy drake, not a weak dragon either. It seems he's a pretty feared one, he brings calamity. You could polish him off quite easily using a wooden club.
>>335533465
He's the nameless king
>>335537251
>Nope, that's wrong. Gwyn, Nito & CIA are not humans. They are Giants.
Look at the intro. it talks about them finding the Lord souls. And who does it show, hollows going towards the First Flame. Why would it show a totally random image of unrelated hollows? It's obvious that these are the ones who the narration is talking about. These are the hollows who became the Lords.
Lords are immune it seems to hollowing. For what ever reason.
There is no "giant" race. There's just hollows, and what those hollows can in turn, turn into, like humans or lords.
>>335537274
Nito was a hollow who, once he got the Lord Soul turned into a skeleton guy. And he probably added more skeletons to him.
>>335533513
>all the replies
>no single mention of Kaathe and Frampt
>>335537541
What the fuck do you think the Humanity of dark souls 1 is you dumbfuck?
>>335536823
To be fair all the Bearer of the Curse wanted was a cure to the damn curse, the Emerald Herald manipulated them into thinking taking the Throne of Want would be the answer.
Thankfully through the Lost Crowns series we can get all of the Crowns and have a cure for ourself from it, then proceed to tell everyone to fuck off.
>>335537780
nope, literally says Gwyn's first born.
>>335532574
Daily reminder serpents are incomplete dragons.
>>335537806
>There is no "giant" race
>>335537880
But he was given that crown for a reason, what a selfish asshole.
>>335537812
>kathe and frampt
>same voice actor
>this is found in the firelink graveyard near frampt
I've never seen anyone else pick up on this?
>>335537705
>Usurpation ending
>good
Now this is snake propaganda. Londor are explicitly the puppets of the serpents, and Kaathe in particular. That "age of humanity" is a crock of shit fed to you by said serpent and Aldia.
Why do people blame the flame that wavers and not the thing that wavers it?
>Series is called Dark Souls
>Pygmy uses the dark soul to create humanity.
>The series is a challenging series of obstacles
>A test of perserverance, skill and ingenuity.
>The game is literally about the human struggle, the struggle of the "Dark Souls", i.e. Humanity.
>Mfw just like the players with the games themselves, mankind in the game will cycle the universe until they find a way to overcome their hollow nature, becoming stronger and better than before.
>Mfw the argument of linking vs not linking is just another example of Humanity struggling to find the best way to beat the boss of mortality, meaninglessness and hollowing.
>>335537806
no nito is literally just a skeleton, the ones you see around him aren't physically attached to him. He just wears them like armor.
>>335538026
Kind of hard blaming the natural force of entropy.
>>335538042
They've already beaten mortality, as long as you have the will to live you will respawn sane.
>>335538104
Nah he's a dedicated skeleton cosplayer.
>>335538104
>not just joining the gravelords and siding with based nito for all time
He is the only lord soul owner who still has any sort of mind to him. I think he is the best option.
>>335537705
End of fire ending suggests the embers will come back and eventually reach vessels and everything goes back, only now those lords fuck your shit up.
You can't end the fire permanently, nor the dark, period. The world itself will conspire to keep those things going for its own sick amusement after Gwyn, as Aldia said, commited the first sin. The whole point of the series is realising you can't go back, accept it, but still realise one should keep fulfilling their porpuse, whatever you think it is.
If there is an actual way out, and I mean for most of the world and not specific individuals, no one said so.
>>335535903
Hollows are fully sentient.
Londor is made up entirely of hollows, and they wear special rings to disguise themselves when dealing with other folks.
Hollows in all 3 games fight with weapons and a speciic fighting style, back off and drink estus when hurt, use items like firebombs, or set traps.
Hollows are entirely sentient, they just don't take kindly to you non-hollow folk.
>>335532020
>walk 2 feet in catacombs, go back to firelink
this is the problem, the quest autofails if you go to the catacombs
>>335538026
because blaming time for making stuff fall apart is stupid
>>335535903
Yes it is explained
They want to steal your humanity
They dont attack other hollows because they dont have any
>>335538273
>tfw can't beat the game without facing my bro
You'd think a guy who dedicates himself to death in a deathless country would be worshipped as a savior.
How did Dancer have a hard life?
>>335530559
Pain is just in peoples heads too an electrical impulse just like the ones that make games "exist".
>>335538273
>Cower in his catacombs like a little bitch while waiting for the world to end
What an example to follow.
>>335538425
so why do they attack you endlessly in ds1 & 2 even when you're fully baconized and have 0 huge manitees?
>>335538273
>sitting in his coffin because he got BTFO by fucking PINWHEEL
>My face when /v/ didn't take the best ending
Why set yourself on fire or be the lord of the faggots when you can just walk off with the first flame?
>>335538475
Yeah but does every character in the video game have a functioning brain which can produce said electrical impulses that cause them pain? No
>>335536420
Actually it is possible that their mere unchanging existence was the block. It seems like there is only X amount of life in the world. Maybe by living the way they were, the dragons were hoarding life an minimizing the amount of other life forms that could be on the planet.
Perhaps they are meant to grow and live eternal during the dark times with the undead and etc, and only when it is finally time for an age of fire do they get killed off to release life into the world.
I don't know, there is a lot of stuff that doesn't make sense but hidden behind "SO DEEP", but maybe the dragons were meant to live so they could die. Maybe once more people start dying off in the new age of darkness dragons will start living again.
They never killed off the one, last TRUE Eternal Dragon that was sitting in that nest in DS1, right?
>>335532020
1: When you first meet him in firelink
2: 2 Hollowing
3: 6 Hollowing
4: 12 Hollowing
5: 16 Hollowing
You turn wrinkly at 15 Hollowing, and that's when Yoel determines you are properly hollowed and is done drawing out your strength.
>>335538468
See
>>335535490
Was forced to be Pontiff's personal whore.
>>335538468
was part of the irithyll royal family before the pontiff came and fucked everything up
then she was made a "dancer"
(that's a polite way of saying sex slave)
So does the cycle end if you choose the hollow lord ending? I mean the flame exists within you and is no longer influencing the world right?
So this is the best ending no? Save for the fact that everyone becomes an ugly hollow.
Is there no greater feeling than helping a summoner in need?
>>335538584
Player characters are only truly hollow when theygive up playing forever
This is entry level stuff mate
>>335538316
Hollows follow a sloth path of degredation. They start as just undead. Then they become more mindless and violent. Over time they wear less armor, and weapons, until eventually just rags. The oldest just go mad.
>>335538425
All hollows carry humanity it's just a rear drop from them. So that dosen't add up.
>>335538584
cuz it's a video game and it would be boring if nobody attacked you
>>335538595
because of the line in the very beginning of the game that specifically says you yourself can't even do anything with the first flame. The only ending that will have any meaning as an unkindled will be to rule over the hollows.
Do you think we would ever see a souls game before everything went to shit or where everything completely fixed?
I love the souls series but theres a constant nagging always, and its mostly because of me wanting to see these giant cities filled with people and not shit that wants to slaughter you.
>>335538587
They never really explained how pinwheel pulled it off, its also a theory that pinwheel wasnt fighting with his full power since he was using his magic elsewhere.
>>335538495
Would you rather be firewood?
>>335538669
>you do literally all the work for them
>host 'helps' by occasionally hitting for mediocre damage but mostly stays far far away
>>335535654
I was more upset about the giant blacksmith being dead in anal rodeo than sif
Sif just died really fucking fast so I'm not sure I even saw the limping
>>335538783
Rats also give humanity but they arent humans
Definition of a hollow is someone who has lost every scrap of their humanity
>>335538802
Problem with that is if the game takes place before the flames start to fade, if you die that's it. You can't come back because you arent undead.
>>335538791
Can I get a good wife at least? This why that ending puts me off, Kaathe never forced some shit tier bitch on me.
>>335538617
Neither can your brain, it needs an input. Characters in the game react negatively when hit just like your brain when something is hit which you call pain.
I agree. You should NOT link the fire.
>>335538669
People who summon for Nameless King, Artorias, Manus (only summon acceptable is Sif), Gwyn, and Soul of Cinder are humongous faggots and need to die
>>335538923
>Rats also give humanity but they arent humans
You do know that's because they eat human corpses right?
>>335538937
Do people not like Anri?
>>335538669
I prefer helping as a grape, escorting the host to the fog wall then letting them take care of the boss. Why I liked the small white soapstone in 2.
>>335538930
just make it so you are THE first undead in history and you are the one who makes the gods freak out over everything.
>>335538862
Well Mito should have done SOMETHING! Did he honestly believe his dinky little catacombs would keep him safe from the things that dwell in the dark abyss? He'd be fucking swarmed by Darkwraithss and hollow's. Not to mention lords get sick when the flame is dead.
>>335537806
The intro is just a metaphor retard.
>>335539004
Yes, thats pretty obvious
>>335539094
But then you'd spend the rest of the game locked away in an undead asylum. Also there arent any bonfires to rest/respawn at.
>>335538987
There is nothing about that sentence I don't love.
>>335538930
I wouldnt mind a hardcore playstyle like that. As long as it would get away from the edgy everything is shit and will kill you theme.
>>335538878
>>335538995
I enjoyed him solo, but I can understand different people want different things.
>>335539110
Nito does do something with you and the other gravelords. Think of it, he is a massive target for his lord soul. It would be safer to have undead who literally can't die no matter what do his work.
>>335539110
>skeleton
>getting sick
he could probably just endlessly raise skeletons for all eternity and make a new society
>>335536827
The fuck are you talking about? Before the flame the world was a comfy and grey forest. Dragons would just comfortably nap all day without worrying about death or destruction because these concepts did not exist until the flame and the use of the lord souls.
Wouldn't you just want to relax and be comfy in a cave and just watch the grey skies all day snuggling with a female dragon?
Well gwyn ruined that.
And humanity would've still been there since manus was there. He just needed something to fuck.
And abyss/dark age is not the same as the dragon's age.
>>335538668
It has about as much guarantee of stopping the cycle as the Dark Lord ending ever did in DaS going forward so there's literally no way of knowing until the potential Dark Souls IV.
People worked on the idea of
>You keep linking the flame it'll just be an endless cycle man
>But snuffing it out? See now it's probably gone forever you solved the problem
Then DaS 2 comes out and says fuck you to that idea and we're back to the same line of thinking.
>Snuffing out the flame? No man that'll just keep the cycle going forever
>Now turning it into the Dark Sign humanity weird thing in some vague as shit ritual? That's sure to solve the problem ONCE AND FOR ALL
It's jumping the gun to an insane degree to even make assumptions given endings that last literally two seconds after you do "the thing".
>>335539113
Why would the intro talk about the lords finding the lord souls in the First Flame, while its showing hollows approaching the first flame and then cut to the Lords?
Why this random set of imagry? They love hollows and just throw them into videos for fun?
>>335537009
Dragons were Everlasting Dragons because their scales made them living statues. They basically just sat around slowly growing until they reached adulthood. They apparently had a society, but that clashes with what we know.
Basically everything DS tells you conflicts with what it told you 5 seconds ago. The origin story is out and out false because it completely conflicts even with itself.
>There were only trees and dragons...
>But there was also a thriving kingdom "lords" that is a race of giant-human hybrids that was large enough that an army of 100 silver knights could accompany its king to battle...
>And a race of giants, one of which was the first to die and thus has a special link to death...
>And a land ruled by a Witch and her sisters...
>And apparently the dragons had a society and didn't just sit about doing nothing, because they were able to alienate one of their own for a birth defect.
We will never know what actually happened because they don't have the writing chops to actually create a real timeline or a real origin story. They will just keep veiled references to the main McGuffin of the game, and continue to build interesting stories in a new version of the world.
>>335539281
>And humanity would've still been there since manus was there
Manus didn't exist until someone tortured the pygmy and he went full berserk. humans would not exist, humans did not exist back then. Just hollows that lived like worms.
>>335539273
Mr.Skeletal my name is Osteoporosis
>>335539029
I wanted Yuria 2.0, she's even got dark sorceries and all, but instead they force a character whose only thing she did was be incompetent, lose a bodyguard, be even more of a failure she can get captured by a pilgrim who was a vase.
Go on, try punching and aggroing Yoel and tell me that could kill a sane person.That's my opinion, mind you, but I really didn't like that NPC, as far as female ones went, Karla and Irina were better and both could plot wise be used for that ending with some effort, but I guess I'll just let the firekeeper take off the fire.
>>335539273
He's a god and the illness that affected gwyndolin was unspecified but I'm betting because their souls are linked to the first flame, they slowly start to die.
>>335531532
Unending Darkness filled with eldritch abominations killing everything living.
It's a nightmarish world, even worse than the decaying one we play in.
>>335539240
>>335538669
Why even post if you use shit like greatswords or longswords?
Seriously, get some swag on your dick before you post a screenshot.
>>335538975
But do they react negatively because they were programmed or because they have a brain which produces electrical impulses that cause them pain?
>>335539348
>And apparently the dragons had a society and didn't just sit about doing nothing, because they were able to alienate one of their own for a birth defect.
You don't need a society to tell cripples to fuck off. Animals already remove freaks of their own volition.
I mean honestly that's some "who changes the tires on the batmobile" territory you're stepping into with those things friend.
>>335539348
I find it hard to believe someone could pay such little attention.
Before the fire, there WAS only grey and dragons and trees. Then there was fire, then souls, lords and their domains. This is literally stated in that exact order.
>>335532441
Except the Firekeeper even mentions that she sees little embers of flames out in the darkness, she knows that eventually the flame will reignite on its own.
And it starts all over.
>>335539348
>But there was also a thriving kingdom "lords" that is a race of giant-human hybrids that was large enough that an army of 100 silver knights could accompany its king to battle...
Stopped reading there, are you an idiot? none of that existed until the flame appeared and Gwyn took his soul, there was no kingdom, they never show a kingdom, the silver knights are just constructs of souls created by Gwyn.
>>335539498
It's only nightmarish if you cling to the old life, if you're human you can hook up with the serpents, embrace the darkness and ascend into becoming a darkwraith so you can live in that new world safely.
>>335539226you'd be the one making the bonfires that you find in later games
>>335539469
>Karla and Irina were better and both could plot wise be used for that ending with some effort
Karla would take no effort at all, considering the shit she already says.
>"This is a land of monstrosities. And I am no exception."
>"But I am guilty. A wretched child of the Abyss"
>>335539632
I wonder who's behind this post?
So if the whole world is completely fucked then why don't they just build spaceships and leave the planet?
You guys think Orntein look for the NK to fight or to join him?
>>335527856
Wtf does that even means? I just assumed this was all cryptic bullshit only meant to sound cool and there was basically nothing more to it.
I mean, it really doesn't strike me as having a well built coherent narrative
>>335539469
That is fair enough.
Anri is one of my favorite characters, but I like her story better if you kill the assassin and advance that way.
>>335539756
Should just hop into the next portal and go to Yharnam, I hear you can be a slug around those parts.
>>335529348
I wish people would stop overlooking the fact Manus messed up Olacile and not the abyss; seriously, all it does is turn things dark.
>>335539756
I think DS universe is just a flat plane, and things like the sun/moon are just magical entities
>>335539795
I want to say look for him. If he wanted to fight him, why would he leave his soul behind in the Anor Londo? The dude just wanted to find his old master
>>335533148
No, it lets her see a world without flame. It shows her what would happen if you don't link the fire.
Even then she still tells you she sees tiny flickering flames in the darkness.
>>335539806
He had a nightmare about being on fire
Wow real fucking cryptic
>>335539795
I like to think he went to try and convince him to come back, with shit falling apart back at home. Then Nameless King, being the fight happy jackass that he is, just decides to take the opportunity to get a serious fight with Ornstein and kills his (former) bro.
>>335539795
Join him probably I would even go as far as saying that one was the others mentor judging by their choice of weapons.
>>335539918
no he's remembering when he linked the flame himself.
>>335539918
I meant "linking the fire", obviously.
>>335539795
I think he wanted some sort of explanation, found NK, talked to him, decided that was enough of a closure and left his belongings he didn't need anymore in his care. Probably assume S and the trap could keep Anor londo safe and lived his life.
But then, I also like to think Siegward not died and other hopeful endings to some of the storylines.
>>335539978
He's either the "faithful first knight" or the "brave dragonslayer" mentioned in Sacred Oath. But then who is the third guy?
>>335539859
The abyss messed up Oolacile.
Oolacile is literally the reason New Londo was flooded, to prevent that shit from happening again.
>It just turns things dark
The games told you from the first one the abyss does not fade and grows as the fire dies. Seriously do darkfags are just edgy or have selective memory?
I don't entirely believe the crap that the flame makes us human as we are. It's just that in DaS, humanity, those DARK sprites, that creatures of the DARK abyss have all the time is what has your character revert to their human form.
What I've heard is that hollowing or any phenomena like it is when humanity goes wild. At least with Oolacile. So maybe the flame just helps humans control their humanity. But if control is all that's needed then surely there must be another way than following the jewgods or jewsnakes.
>>335539994
So, again, he had a nightmare about the time he linked the fire (was on fire).
>>335540005
You throw a strong guy on the fire flame and it keeps going and the world stays in an age of "everything isn't a fucking zombie". When the flame starts to go out you then go back to the age of "everything is a fucking zombie" culminating in "wow it's fucking dark and spooky". Not complicated.
so do the serpents show up at all?
Daily reminder that Pontiff Sulyvahn is the most evil character in the Souls series and that he domestically abuses the Dancer
>>335540086
Maybe Solaire is the faithful first knight? I'm not sure honestly.
>>335540102
>there must be another way than following the jewgods or jewsnakes.
Taking the fire for yourself.
>>335535475
Heiss was a faggot who gave into despair. Instead of agitating for a solution to that cycle, he RAN and led to the deaths of countless people.
Stocke had more balls in one finger than Heiss did in his entire body.
>>335536663
>Not killing pointiff again and taking the dancer as your waifu and living happily ever after as she lets you do whatever you want with her cute ass
The fuck are you doing?
>>335540214
Only in name, sadly; I think there was a statue too.
>>335540214
They're angels that visited Lothric (you can see statues of them) are influenced scholars and some knights into doing weird shit.
One lady works for Kaathe
>>335540214
They do as statues scattered around Lothric. They look pretty strange.
>>335539540
What's the difference? You can say your brain is programmed to react negatively to certain inputs which we call pain.
>>335539621
>>335539631
Gwyn had his knights before they found the flame, Nito was already first of the dead, and there was an Izalith for the Witch of Izalith and her coven of sisters to exist.
In the origin Gwyn isn't some naked dude that just gained power, he is a full on king with an army.
Maybe I misunderstood, in which case Gwyn royally fucked up everything by grabbing the power of the flame because the world seemed pretty happy and progressive up until he decided to kill all the dragons with it.
Maybe the message of the game is that someone far in the past could have already started the world on the path to destruction and all you can do is prolong it, but never truly save the world.
>>335540220
He probably had his way with Gwyndolin's boypussy before feeding him to Aldritch.
>>335540220
Sulyvahn is a dick in the current time, but he doesn't have anything on Kaathe, dick of ages.
>>335535669
Except that outrider knights are cursed to become beasts. It even says in her stuff's description that she turned into a monster and her armor fused to her hide.
She was huge because she's actually descended from the royal family, (she's part god).
>>335533591just like the jews
Something I don't getSmough's armor in DAS3 says he was the last to guard Gwynevere. Ornstein's armor says he left Londo to seek the Dragonslayer king. Does this confirm that the ones you fight in DAS1 are illusions? And that's the real Ornstein in DAS2?
>>335540371
>having sex with your boss's steak
>>335540086
Ornstein armor says he is his first knight.
>>335540362
You completely missed the timeline of the opening. There is a massive timeskip from when the flame first appeared to when the Lords decided to take out the dragons.
>trailers and all info before release has extreme emphasis on discovering what humanity and the dark truly are
>final game barely covers it at all and it's back to stale old link or don't link fire
what the fuck happened mid development? It's like someone had a major argument about how they wanted the direction to go and everything got changedwhen the fire nation attacked
>>335527856
too late :^)
>>335538669
Only boss I had to summon for on my sorcery character. I felt sad, but the guy I summoned was cool as fuck and handed Nameless King his own ass in the second phase with a greatsword.
>>335540361
Nobody programmed it though, unless you say my mom programmed it, but then you'd be saying Dark Souls characters are the sons and daughters of the Dark Souls programmers
>>335536507
You are a creation of the flame itself, raised from the ashes of faggot hollows who failed.
>>335540096
The Abyss is mutated dark. Not it's natural form.
Also the people in Oolacile weren't human(most likely Gwyn's race) so of course Dark would poison them
>>335540362
You really need to go back and rewatch the opening. Everything you listed happens after they get the Lord Souls. It doesn't show Gwyn with his army prior it shows all of that shit after which renders anything you're saying moot.
I mean it's literally
>just dragons and trees and hollows
>Some pick up magic power souls
>Then they get to be a lightning guy and a super witch and a skeleton man
>Then they fuck up the dragons
The time between them picking up the souls could have been a day or it could have been years before they were ready to take control from the dragons but there's a clear order of events you're missing.
>>335540371
>Fucking food
>When you have an infinitely better option
>>335540445
Smough was real, ornstein was fake. Makes smough smashing him while he is still alive a bit more understandable.
>>335540362
Yes, you misunderstood. All the jerky-looking hollow things rising up in front of the fire is the beginning of the Lords.
There is nothing at all to suggest the lords had their armies and shit before they found their souls.
>>335540652
>Also the people in Oolacile weren't human(most likely Gwyn's race) so of course Dark would poison them
How is it talking directly out of your ass?
>>335540553
Buy the DLC goy.
>>335540445
Snough in 1 was the real deal, Ornstein an illusion.Notice how he is voiced but Ornstein is silent.
2 could either be an impostor or not, I don't see concentre proofs for either since you do find the armor in 2 and 3.
>>335540362
>Gwyn had his knights before they found the flame
Based on what you say this? The intro literally tells you there was nothing before the fire and then what existed thanks to the fire.
Never they show you kingdoms, or knights before the fire existed nor they mention something like that. You are pulling this literally from your ass.
>>335538987
This shit is fucked
>>335540445
We never fight the real Ornstein. The one in 2 is obviously a fake, with different colored armor, a different element, and guarding some random fucking cathedral with no ties to Anor Londo. The one in the original might have been the real deal, but probably wasn't.
>>335540445
Here is the best explanation for Ornstein's story in DS1 and DS3. Sacred Oath mentions there's actually a 3rd Dragonslayer so he's so inconsequential that DS2's Old Dragonslayer is most likely him
Before DS1, Ornstein relinquished his Gwyn-granted soul to find Nameless King. Gywndolin used his soul to create Illusion Ornstein. CU defeated Smough first so Illusion Ornstein absorb his powers to become Super Ornstein but left Smough alive, hence you not getting Smough's Soul. Smough then gets promoted to be the last knight in Anor Londo
Ornstein found the Archdragon Peak and then astrally project himself like you did to find Nameless King. His physical body was used to make Dragonslayer Armor and the Astral one took off his armor and became a Dragon Monk or maybe even the Stormdrake.
>>335540445
It confirms that Smough was the last one. That could mean both were illusions or that just Smough existed but it doesn't matter.
Maybe Old Dragonslayer was Ornstein or maybe he wasn't also doesn't matter as at the very least Ornstein left Anor Londo and found the Nameless King.
>>335540445
Ornstein in DS2 is just a copy.
Venom Ornstein, if you prefer.
>>335540721
>2 could either be an impostor or not, I don't see concentre proofs for either since you do find the armor in 2 and 3.
You only find the armor in 3. You can never actually obtain the armor in 2.
>>335540712
Just look at the way Elizabeth and Dusk refer to you. It's pretty obvious to me senpaiÃlia.
>>335540096
The openings for these games are from the perspective of Light lovers, of course they're going to call the unknown Abyss bad; the only reason Londo and Olocile had a bad dark was due to circumstances.
Londo was filled with power hungry kings and Olocile was fucked by Manus's rage.
>>335540819
Smough... I'm already a demon.
>>335540134
But what is this fire? Where does it come from, how does it behave? Why are there even undeads to begin with?
Who the fuck are the Lords of Cinder? Why every body call me the ashen one? Are the ashen ones supposed to be some kind of beings meant to relink the fire? Where do they come from?
>>335540652
>The head of an Oolacile resident whose humanity went wild after being devoured by the Dark of Manus, father of the Abyss.
So now Gwyn race have humanity inside them?
how likely is it that the DLC will make DSA purchasable/obtainable?
>>335540945
What place has had a good experience with the dark friend?
>>335540971
>Why every body call me the ashen one?
See >>335534507
>>335534507
>Unkindled is born out of their remaining ashes. Unkindled exist to inherit the past and put an end to this cumulative tale.
So how the fuck does Anri, who apparently is a hollowed person, have a history and life in Astora?
>>335539348
Retard.
>>335540971
On that note why the fuck do all firelink shrines have the same thrones for the same five Lords of Cinder? Shouldn't there have been different lords throughout the ages?
>All of these responses as to whether or not Ornstein is or isn't an illusion or some shit
It's a suit of armor. He has no lines. He barely has any lore. He isn't even really a character.
AlsoHIS HELMET STILL HAS NO PLUME
>>335541045
Don't ask such difficult questions, friend. Just trust your old pal Kaathe.
>>335540970
epic dude
>>335540872
>It's pretty obvious to me senpaiÃlia.
Can you explain because I'm not at all seeing what you mean.
>>335541045
We don't get to see it, because what's the point of a peaceful time in Dark Souls? The closest we'll get to seeing it is in Dark Souls 3.
Well, we've already seen what the dark does to everything it touches in Oolacile. If it's between that and some little weak faggot getting burned, I'm choosing the latter.
Just got to Lothric Castle but also went left after dancer and beat oceiros getting the dragon gesture to get to archdragon peak. Should I continue in the peak or go back to Lothric Castle first?
>>335540102
You nailed it.
The dark is fucking EVIL. By this point in the series it's unfucking deniable. The very first human turned into fucking Manus, and that thing was a raging monstrosity.
Oolacile's residents, by simple proximity to some of the dark had their humanity go rampant. This turned them into monstruous things with giant arms and hands, claws, and shitloads of eyes.
Humans aren't evil, all they need is a little dark to retain their normal form.The age of Dark would just see everyone turn into horrific monsters.
>>335540827
>armor
My bad, I meant to say the spear, sorry.
>>335540971
>why are there even undeads to begin with
Just look at the fucking darksign. A hoop of fire with darkness in the middle
The Undead are clearly created by the Flame so one of them gets so strong he can link the flame again.
>>335540971
Ashen ones are literally ashes of failed hollows that were brought back to find candidates who can link the fire because they can't do it themselves and the first flame is calling out to the world for help.
>>335537251
Except Gwyn is hollowed when you fight him. Lords and "Gods" are just people/beings who have immense power from souls.
People go hollow when they have nothing to keep them anchored/focused.
>>335540971
Nigga did you even play DaS?
The fire was just there. There's no real reason for it to exist but it's the magical plot device. You want some bullshit fantasy DaS textbook going back to the big bang?
The fire just is what it is and it do what it do.
>>335541145
>The closest we'll get to seeing it is in Dark Souls 3.
>Shit is basically the apocalypse
Yeah ok
>>335540652
You're retarded.
Consumption of excess humanity causes it to go "wild" mutating people into a beastly form.
The same way the Old Blood in Bloodborne brings out the beastly nature in men. It's a recurring theme in the series.
>>335540102
Hollowing is basically losing your "humanity" that dark stuff. Humanity is the mind in a way, without it, all that's left is the physical shell.
Retaining your humanity require a focus to keep you sane, although becoming obsessed, rather than focused, also leads to hollowing.
The physical shell, the hollows, were birthed from the first flame and it wasn't until the Pygmy split the Dark Soul and infused it into the hollows that "humans" as we know them were born.
The Pygmy probably did this so that the Dark Soul would survive Gwyn's Age of Fire and then reconstitute once darkness had returned.
>>335540335
Well I was going to continue...
>Decide to gently lay hand on Dancer's weeping head
>She instinctively twitches back and freezes out of fear
>Lay another small hand and start rubbing
>She slowly raises her head to see Ashen one displaying kindness
>Grabs onto you and hugs you tightly while beginning to sob again
>you do best to calm her down and ask where Pontiff went
>You decide to ignore time travel rules and confront the evil piece of shit
>Slam open the doors with a mighty kick to reveal Pontiff in a bathrobe jerking off to a bonfire
>Pontiff shout's agressivley saying he doesnt want interruptions only to cut himself off upon seeing you
>Silent and furious you rush into combat with determination
Cont?
>>335541230
>lights go out
>THE WORLD IS OVER
Yeah, ok.
So who exactly is going to stop the abyss after DS3 when only weak faggots are left
>>335541119
it's not a plume, it's his hair
>>335539297
Well fuck. Ideal ending would be to go back to the age of dragons and make humans look good.
Wait, why not have a large number of humans time travel, kill gwyn and his faggot brigade before he gets the lord souls and then build a civilization and just live happily ever after in the time paradox. Its not like fucking around with the past has any future consequences anyway for some reason so humans won't magically turn hollow.
And we know that time travel exists too.
>>335541145
You sound like a Darkwraith that just wants to fuck my butthole in the dark. Fuck off and burn in the light you fiendish piece of shit.
>>335527856
Fuck you, I know what ending I'm choosing now.
>>335541119
>HIS HELMET STILL HAS NO PLUME
I WILL NEVER NOT BE MAD
I BEAT THE NAMELESS KING FOR THIS
>>335539554
HOW'S IT FEEEEL SEATH
>>335540971
>whoaaa Dark Souls is a shitty subseries with no story and filled with easter eggs that reference itself, absolutely no attention to detail and early access releases
Play a good game, anon.
>>335541193
>>335541198
Ding Ding Ding.
The first flame seems to have also created the Firelink Shrine we use, because the real one was consumed by darkness.
>>335537806
>Lords are immune it seems to hollowing. For what ever reason.
I agree that Gwyn and company are probably hollows prior to finding the souls. I think all of the souls lose power, but the soul the pygmy laid hands on in a little different way. The lords don't seem to hollow except for Gwyn who burned his own soul. But the fire fades, so maybe they are hollowing, only as a collective. That they would eventually turn back into hollows once the fire has completely faded, and the lord souls that made them what they are have lost all of their power.
For the pygmy's soul, for mankind, hollowing is obviously something natural but it's also more individual. We don't hear that it's fading as a whole. Now I think it is, and the curse/dark sign is an effect of that but that's not the point. Some people still turn hollow, while others are fine. That's the point, we don't see that in those who don't hold the pygmy's soul so it's probably a unique innate quality of it. With humanity as a consumable and the darkwraiths being the soulsucking assholes they are I think they meant to set up a contrast between man and the gods. The gods having to be altruistic and self sacrificing by virtue of their souls, and humanity being a cannibalizing mess of selfishness of greed by virtue of theirs.
>>335541176
It really doesn't matter. I did the peak first.
>>335539451
Why would you torture the poor guy? He looks so lonely and harmless in the opening.
>>335541294
Stop.
Death is a mercy.
>>335541336
It's very clearly a plume, From are just lazy shits. it's the same reason the red cloth around the bottom isn't there either.
>>335541054
Maybe they don't, and just think they do.
Or maybe Anri isn't actually an unkindled.
They are referred to as being hollow after all, maybe they're just crazy?
>>335540971
Are you the type to skip cutscenes and then ask what's going on?
So... In the dark lord ending of DaS1 there's a shitton of serpents. And despite being at odds with eachother, Frampt and Kaathe both offer to serve you.
Is Frampt just taking pity on humans and helping them continue linking the fire while Kaathe thinks that's a dumb idea? Why are they so invested in the flame that Kaathe develops Londor and Frampt possibly guided Lothric.
What are these sneks up to, just toying with an inferior species? Why didn't Gwyn wreck their shit like the dragons? Are they just playing both sides so they always come out on top? Can dragons finally get some peace and quiet once the flame goes out?
>>335541117
Pls respond this shit is confusing.
Even your Chosen Undead isn't on there and he's certainly a Lord of Cinder.
>>335541462
kaathe told them they'd learn cool magic, and being the fanatics they are, they jumped on that asap.
>>335541181
And the various disgusting creatures and monsters I came across in the Age of Fire were so much better right? Fuck off.
>>335541305
>All the monster and black goo eldritch shit everywhere
>Guys it's just dark get over it
There has never been a single instance of the age of dark being something positive in none of the three games, only Kathe bullshiting you about it and then you got to see it in full force by first hand in Artorias DLC, even Aldia tells you shit is not worth it.
>>335541437
Gwyn didn't hollow, he straight up died and the flame took over his empty shell
>five fucking games
>covenants are still broken trash
>>335531324
Why every fucking one forgets why Oolacile went so bad? It's not because of the "Age of Dark". It's because they fucked up the pigmy with torture and stuff. The pigmy is the original Dark Lord, he has a shitload of influence over the humans. He got so insane his own soul went wild and so he did with all other Oolacile dudes, that's why they became monsters n shit. It's all stated in items, but I don't really know the items by now.
>>335541242
I'm glad someone realized the link between the two. There is an inner beastly/dark nature to people, and the moral here is that reveling in your baser desires makes you less than human.
>>335541305
Imagine a world with absolutely no light. Shit is fucked ip. No flame, no nothing.
>>335541546
They're playing both sides. Why? For kicks I guess.
>>335541587
only one FLS is real, the firelink shrine is for the most notable lords of cinder, CU's whole shtick was he did everything but got none of the credit for it.
>>335540662
>you will never impregnate the dancer
>>335541604
What the actual fuck. Is Kaathe the saten of DaS? Why the fuck would you do something so fucked?
"Here please torture this harmless fellow to death and you'll get some cool as fuck powers"
Fuck, can you kill kaathe in DaS?
Why do you try to stop the inevitable?
>>335541501
None of this is explained in any of the cutscenes. All the game tells you is that you're a zombie who's supposed to mess with some fire while killing all sorts of weird dudes.
>>335541772
>wanting to have sex with a living suit of armor
>>335541319
If you choose not to link the fire and summon the firekeeper, she says she can see embers of flame out in the darkness and eventually they'll ignite into a new flame.
>>335538316
depends how long they've been hollow for.
the mindless zombie hollows have likely been hollow for a very very long time. But NPCs that attack you and still retain their capabilities are a recent hollowing.
I don't think they are sentient or have the capacity for thought tho. just acting on instinct and reflex/reaction.
>>335538304
>End of fire ending suggests the embers will come back
It does no such thing. Firekeeper just gets poetic about the "flames" in men slowly coming back out of the darkness.
>>335541747
But at least the ruined shrine at the first flame is real, and the thrones have the same five lords engraved on them.
Can we all agree that everyone who believed Kaathe that the dark lord ending was the "good" ending in DS1 was a massive tool?
>>335540068
>siegward
>doesnt die
you can literally watch him keel over after the yhorm fight
>>335541546
>Frampt possibly guided Lothric.
If he's still flame loving he probably didn't do Lothric because the end result of the serpents fucking with Lothric is that Prince Lothric doesn't want to link the flame and be a Lord of Cinder.
The serpents have always been weird outsiders who just do things because ??? and have an end goal of ???
>>335541831
You're a moron.
>>335541816
not normally, but with CE/debug you can. No special dialogue, just a buggy animation
How about we just let the shit runs it's course.
You can't light the flame, you're ash, you don't burn.
So fuck that.
Fuck taking over as some edge shit.
Let the damn flame burn out, as it will, and when it comes time for the flame to return, it will.
>>335541437
Kek he fell for Frampt's propaganda
The gods are literally evil. They're selfish and they see themselves above humanity for their power, even though some random ass Undead can just come after them and murder them to death.
>>335541193
The curse of the undead appeared when some sorcerers messed with the "abyss".
>>335541694
Because you forget that while that is true the abyss never disappeared, it became a constant that grows as the fire fades, spreading the dark is spreading the abyss, this was stated in the first game. The only argument people have left is
>Muh true form
As if being a mindless husk or dark goo was better than being a functional person.
>>335541709
Yeah it's just a theme Miyazaki likes to toy with.
The one thing that irks me so much about Dark Souls 3 is how vague and how little it expands on the Dark.
I still don't know if the Deep is supposed to be an evolution of that theme or something different.
>>335541646
>All the monster and black goo eldritch shit everywhere
Caused by Manus's rage, did you see any of that in Londo? No, because the Dark doesn't do that.
>Aldia tells you shit is not worth it.
He just wants to help you break the curse of hollowing, which is caused by the war between light and dark; he's just a selfish old tree that doesn't care about the world's affairs.
>>335541546
Well, if Kaathe is to be believed, and that is a big if, the Primordial Serpents seek to return the world to darkness and Frampt is a traitor, desiring to retain the political power of the Lords.
Now, that seems to make sense to some degree, but what Kaathe's true game is, who knows. He certainly has no love for humans, considering all the terrible things he's caused.
>>335541938
>Selfish
>Yeah here humans have a kingdom right next to my own
>Oh and have all these kingdoms outside of the playable world
>MUWHAHA GWYN IS EVIL HUMANITY MUST RULE GET RID OF THE FLAME CHOSEN UNDEAD :^)
>>335541208
I wouldn't expect anyone to retain their appearance after burning out for what is an eternity.
In any case, they are not members of the same race and there is no such thing as a hollowed out Giant in the game, which is the race Gwyn and etc belong to.
>>335541868
that one is the real one, that's why the first flame created the illusion of the fake one. To find someone who was strong enough to rekindle it, except it probably didn't expect someone who's actually incapable of linking it to arrive so it sent the soul of cinder after you.
>>335541607
A few creatures here and there versus an entire world of endless darkness and abominations.
Please remember that we only experience these worlds as the flame is weakening. By the next cycle there won't be any demons, for example. All those hollows you fight? Those wouldn't be there as they'd be normal.
>>335531324
>We've seen multiple times now how absolutely fucked everything goes when the flame goes out,
if by multiple, you mean zero, then yes.
>>335541652
Just Ludleth died amirite?
The LoCs are clearly still sentient, wich makes me think the only reason Gwyn attacks you at the Kiln is because he realised it's all hopeless. Linking the fire would only lead todos suffering. Let it all fade.
Im ready for the dlc ending where champion of ash learns the true path from aldia and bearer of the curse
>Go dark age
>Get rid of the abyss
>Link the flame again
there we go, abyss is gone and everything prospers
>>335541719
We'll make our own light, we just won't have the first flame cursing us; we know there's a moon regardless of what you do so there has to be a sun.
>>335541915
Nah you're just crediting the game way too much for something it clearly doesn't have. Which is a strong and coherent narrative.
Give me an example of a DS3 exposition cutscene or be quiet.
>>335541772
Man, being the Pontiff must have been awesome until you died
>Personal army
>Bros with a guy who eats gods
>Almost everyone does what you say
>Power of the Profaned Flame
>Sorcerer
>Hot personal dancerthat you later exile
>Can summon a God damn stand
>>335542219
The Abyss persists.
You can't just get rid of it.
>>335540335
Fuck why is the dancer so cute? I don't even try to kill her when I fight her I just want to see her keep dancing with those blades.
>>335541982
>As if being a mindless husk or dark goo was better than being a functional person.
"But a lie is STILL A LIE!"
>>335540214
Londor and some of Lothric worship them as angels. Feathers are one of the signs of their influence.
Actual appearances are being saved for the DLC.
>>335541421
>the real one
That is just firelink in the past during an age of dark you mong. Time is convoluted at the base of the castle and the maiden there even says that the bells haven't rung yet. Plus just read Iudex Gundyr's armor. It states an unknown hero beat his ass long ago and that unknown hero is you, which is the very reason he doesn't drop a soul, after all, you already picked it up at the untended graves.
There is no such thing as "real" firelink. It's just that time is convoluted.
>>335542243
I didn't credit shit, I just called you a moron. Which you are.
So its accepted by this point that the dark firelink was an age of dark long past right?
>>335542261
downside:
>no face
>have to have a fucking tree growing out of your back to use your full powers
>you went batshit insane from looking at the chaos flame as a child
>Dragon age
>no shtity linking sacrifices
>No abyss
So why exactly are you guys not pro dragons? None of this shit even existed before Gwyn and the pygmy fucked with nature
>>335541938
>The gods are literally evil
When and how this meme started, no seriously people ask abut slavery and how gods hated humans but nothing in the first game shows you anything like that or is mentioned.
The closes thing is just the serpent saying lords are afraid of humans and he is just talking about the abyss. Did Vati or some other lore youtuber made a video about their speculations and people treat it as canon?
>>335542261
And yet i came in with my battle axe and smashed his head open.
>>335542357
yes
you know what you guys need?
>Link the Fire ending
it'sfuckingnothing.jpg
>End of Fire ending
A true reset to the cycle, the flame is eventually reborn and won't be as weak as it is now
>Usurption of Fire
You're gonna become a power hungry monstrosity
>Lord of Hollows
The serpents japed you, they will be the true lords
End of Fire BEST
>>335541646
It's even more evident in the absence of something very important: Dark and the Abyss are not creative or constructive.
They don't have grand civilizations from the dark. There are no noble heroes from the Age of Dark. There are no epics, no architecture, etc... from that Age.
Why? Because Dark is nothing but savage, hungry, destructive, evil. Even the name is both figurative and literal. Your are sightless, ignorant to all around you. Dark is described, repeatedly, has heavy and viscous. So an oppressive, heaviness that robs of sight, and prevents you from learning and applying knowledge.
Great fucking accomplishment, Darkfags. A world that is shit forever versus one that is shit occasionally.
>>335542396
Nameless King was pro dragon. And he got to chill for thousands of years with his dragon butt buddy until the Ashen One came over and fucked everything up.
>>335541646
We've never seen an Age of Dark. Meanwhile Ages of Fire seem to be filled with the most horrific shit imaginable.
But, of course, we've never seen an Age of Fire at its peak either.
>>335542371I'm ugly in real life:^(
>>335542415
Are you mad nigga in the oolacile dlc in das1 everyone who isnt a human treats them like shit, and all the giants are slaves
>>335542396
Fuck yeah, dragons.
Archdragon peak is in the sky because dragons are literally above the struggles of light/dark and gods/humanity below. There's no burnt out sun or twilight sky, only cool blue and a distant moon.
>>335534085
Oceiros tried doing something to break the cycle as well, but with eugenics instead of SCIENCE, didn't work out either.
>>335542550
you can't eat or smell anything though, I don't even know how he sees honestly.
>>335542415
So why would the humans rebel against the gods if they were as kind as you believe? Read some of the effigy shields and havel spells.
>>335542304
While it is a lie, is it really such a bad thing? Aldia himself says that while life is just an illusion, it's brought about good things. It gave people a purpose.
>>335527856
>telling people how to play their game
I'll do all the endings just because I can.
>>335542396
I'm totally down with an age of gray mang.
>>335533513
Patches
>Chaosfags
Age of Dark, muh strength, muh individual
>Lawfags
Age of Fire, muh god
>Neutral fags
Age of Dragons, muh hot half dragon chicks
>>335541987
Well, the translations make it clear that From is differentiating it from the Abyss. Both of which have very distinct terms in the Japanese version.
Some entries reference an "Age of Water" which the church are all working to prepare for. They don't care one whit for the Age of Dark or Age of Fire.
>>335530274
>I never understood why would somebody ever link the flame, even in the DS1, all the shit it DS world came from the Gwyn faggot and his shitty flame, the cursed thing should have been extinguished long time ago.
Evidently things are pretty good during the time period after the flame is lit to just before it starts to fade. Since the player only shows up when things start to go to shit we'll never know.
>>335527856
REMEMBER USURPER ENDING IS YOU BECOMING A BITCH TO THE SNAKES.
REMEMBER DO NOT TRUST SNAKES.
SERPENT RING TELLS YOU SNAKE A SHIT.
>>335542636
"This is the work of an enemy stand!"
>all this debate on who's good or evil
There is no good and evil, are you all so braindead not to see that this franchise is about perspective?
>>335542742
>Age of Dragons, muh hot half dragon chicks
Sounds good to me.
>>335542719
Then begone, we're busy giving Vaati his views.
>>335542641
Because kaathe abyssed them
>>335542396
Age of Dragons has even less going on than an Age of Dark.
The Dragons just kind of, existed, not doing anything. At least Gwyn finally gave them something to do.
>>335542314
I want Aldia and serpents in DLC
and alsoGwyndolin's helm
>>335541437
>I agree that Gwyn and company are probably hollows prior to finding the souls.
He is not Hollow because only humans hollow. He's a member of the race of Giants.
They even already had the concept of family ties, after all, Gwyn has an uncle called Lloyd and you wouldn't expect a hollow to know fuckall about anything since it's just a mindless zombie.
They don't hollow out because it only affects humans when the fire is waning. Humans are tied to the darkness because they came from the split of the Dark Soul, hence the tiny shards known as Humanity. The Lord Souls came from the flame, so it's only natural to expect them to lose power when the fire is weak, hence the curse that is pushing us back to our true nature (hollows), since humanity as we know it is an anomaly, as discovered by Aldia.
>>335542219
No one in universe has yet to figure out how to kill the Abyss, or if that's even possible.
>>335542562
Gough and Ciaran treat you well though. And they're pretty much the closest thing we get from Gwyn's own words.
>>335527856
>>335542803
AGE OF DARK IS L I T E R A L L Y the best ending. Prove me wrong.
>>335542742
where would the end of fire ending be?
>>335542357
no, firelink shrine only exists when the fire is fading and needs to be relinked, there is no use for a firelink shrine during an era of Dark
>>335542641
Those tell you nothing. Havel miracles only state he did not trust sorcery and he hated Seath and the other just talks about a specific group of people who wants to kill gods.
Then you have Catarina who speak of Gwyn as a god.
>>335542773
>the age of water is just all the female dancers assembled in one room for the pontiff and aldrich
WHY IS THERE NO EVERLASTING ENDING
BIG M PLEASE
Why don't the Lords of Cinder just keep the Age of Fire going forever? Clearly they can just resurrect to relink the flame whenever they need to, but were just being jerks this time, except Ludleth.
>>335542182
The guy has been burning out for a thousand years. Do you expect him to sit down and have tea with you or belong like a madly aggressive clusterfuck?
>>335542371
The fuck is going on with his face anyway?
> Tfw all the demons are dead and the Chaos flame got extinguished
I want more chaos flame stuff. It was the wild card in the Fire vs Dark fight.
I would love a DLC where we actually get to show up to a hub world atleast that is heavily populated atleast compared to the norm and stop some shit from happening.
In the end it feels like you're cleaning up shit in a world that isn't worth saving. Id like to visit even a small kingdom that isn't shit right when i get there even if it falls to shit part way during the DLC upon return.
>>335542978
Didn't work.
>>335542707
Well, that's the debate isn't it. Warmth and resplendence or the truth?
Which is more important?
My guess is, that'll be different for everyone.
People shit on DS2, but SotFS really made it something worth playing, if just for Aldia and Vendrick.
>>335542978
If the flame is any indication, there's gonna be diminishing returns. After all why aren't we still just burning Nito, Seath, Four Kings and Bed of Chaos?
>>335541982
>mindless husk
They still went and took the souls from the First Flame, anon. I'm not so sure about this mindless thing
>>335542641
>So why would the humans rebel against the gods if they were as kind as you believe?
Because bad people exist. It's no different from real life, there's always going to be someone who wants to ruin a good thing because they're selfish.
>>335542894
>no, firelink shrine only exists when the fire is fading and needs to be relinked, there is no use for a firelink shrine during an era of Dark
Provide some sauce with those noodles or you're full of shit.
>>335542319
Fun Fact: If you die to Champion Gundyr, you can go to Iudex Gundyr's bonfire and pick up your souls.
Time is fucking convoluted.
>>335542945
Best ending, if we were in their place
Maybe people would appreciate the fire more if from ever showed us an actual still existing human kingdom
>>335527856
>inb4 ludleth wasn't actually a powerful lord
>inb4 a powerful lord overthrew the lords of his time, and linked the fire by burning a small feeble man in his place instead
Ludleth is the most tragic character in existance
>>335542978
Because it fucking hurts ? Because dying in horrible agony only to be resurrected later to do it again for a bunch of assholes you don't know is a shit job ? There's a reason the only one who didn't fuck off is the guy with no legs.
>>335542884
Remember the pilgrim butterflies?
Remember all the exploding dark hollows?
Remember Oolacile?
Remember Manus?
Imagine a world full of nothing but that and countless other horrors humans will undoubtedly mutate into.and they could always be within 2 feet of you but since there's no light youll never see them
>>335543106
Fuck really?
That's cool as shit if it's intended.
>>335542989
he probably melted it off trying to make out with a fire.
>>335543124
Catarina has been unfuckable forever. I wanna see Catarina.
>>335542995
Catarina seems like a good fit.
Everything points at them still being fine. And not shit tier like Carim.
>>335543146
>the pilgrim butterflies?
Those were the assholes that shoot shit at you during the Dragonslayer Armor fight correct?
What the fuck are they?
>>335542004
>Caused by Manus's rage, did you see any of that in Londo? No, because the Dark doesn't do that.
Yeah, because the Untended Graves, aka Firelink in the past during an age of dark, just looked great with that pitch black darkness and zombified abominations running around, didn't it?
>>335542429
>using axes
firekeeper is the bestest most purest waifu ever
>>335541181
The humanity inside them goes wild because they revolt against their shells, which are something that are not meant to be.
Humans in Dark Souls are different from what we perceive as humans, like Aldia says, humanity assumed a fleeting form, which is what we call "humans" in the game's word, and no matter how tender and exquisite, which refers to how prettier humans look compared to the abominations of Oolacie, A LIE WILL REMAIN A LIE!
>>335542894
The shrine would still exist, it just wouldn't be used.
>>335543243
It looks like branches to me like his wings. Did he stick his dick in the Chaos? Isn't that was the profaned flame is?
>>335542978
Why should they have to die and resurrect forever just for you faggot? Plus Aldritch is probably barely sentient at this point and only goes where he goes similar to a dumb animal returning out of instinct. Watchers are probably in the same boat too. Yhorm is just a prick you'd think he'd have some words before charging you and the Princes are Abyss fags.
>>335542884
Considering what Londor pilgrims turn into and how Londor goes about doing things.
No age of dark is a horror move 24/7 where only the batshit insane survive.
>>335543274
ANCIENT DRAGON NERVOUS SYSTEM MADE OF TREES
>>335543067
>Which is more important?
Don't know you tell me, you tell me.
What would you rather be right now? What you currently are or an animal
>>335541871
no, because the Canon ending was linking the fire, and look how the world turned out?
>>335542545
>We've never seen an Age of Dark
We literally go to one past era when the age of dark is at full force right after Oceiros due to the convolution of time and it looks like fucking shit.
>>335543274
I think it's the pilgrims turning into whatthefuckarethose things in the irithyll dungeon after they finish mutating, some people think it's the trees on the high wall taking flight.
>>335543274
Undead apparently.
>>335543135
I always figured that since all the actual lords of cinders are fucking powerful, Ludleth had to have something going for him.
I expect him to be some sort of super powerful sorcerer or something.Or a soul feeding abomination as implied by the ring he drops.
>>335542989
It's a mask.
How come nobody is mentioning this in any thread?
They hid it in a mundane item you wouldn't check the description of. Clever girl.
>>335543181
you can also place messages in dark firelink and they'll appear in light firelink and vice versa
what I really wanna know is what the other 2 endings mean, usurpation and lord of hollows
in one you take the first flame to do what exactly?
and the other is vague as fuck
>>335543274
probably the pilgrims dead at the bridge
>>335541409
Nice bait mong.
>>335543315
You do know the LIE line is referring to the Flame, right?
>>335543431
>you can also place messages in dark firelink and they'll appear in light firelink and vice versa
Neat
>>335542348
Still no substance in your post. I guess you're the only moron here.
>>335543330
The profaned flame is some weird even more corrupted chaos flame that drove people insane, including the pontiff.
>>335542874
>>335541652
He looks hollowed and he's lost his mind. Why do you say he can't be hollow, that's his original state before he got a lord soul. The soul he later burned, turning him into the hollow looking mindless wimp we fight at the end. I agree they don't seem to hollow naturally, but that wasn't natural. Dude burned his own soul. It makes sense for him to be(mostly) hollow, and that's how he appears and acts.
>>335543274
Remember how all the pilgrims wore those giant stone shells on their backs and had something like roots poking out from under them.
I think the Eclipse transformed them into giant flaming tree butterflies.
>>335541373
But anon, sodomy in eldritch goo and darkness is fun.
>>335542992
It wasn't extinguished, it's simply running out of gas since it's not eternal like the first flame or darkness.
The only reasons it exists is because the Witch of Izalith used Flame Sorcery to make a fake First Flame. No way kindling that flame.
Also, Demons are evil and destructive.
So what the fuck was that snake shit corrupting Gundyr and some random undead? Just "the abyss?"
>>335543394
>looks like fucking shit
Maybe if you're a casual.
It's pure comfy dark spooky tough area.
I bet you want to link the fire so the next game is all bright and easy as fuck, you casual pleb.
Please never visit Londor, you are not welcome here.
>>335543124
What would be the point of a Soul game in a happy setting? Maybe people should remember the games are set in the ending of the age of fire and all the bad things happening are not a constant and only happen after who knows how many decades.
I'm looking through the dialogue from Frampt and Kaathe now. This may just be a helpful refresher. I've certainly forgot a lot.
Kaathe
>"I am the Primordial Serpent Darkstalker Kaathe
I can guide thee, and illuminate the truth.
Undead Warrior, conqueror of the Four Kings, is this not your wish? To know the truth of men, and the Undead? "
>"If you wish, I shall grant the art of Lifedrain,
the legendary power of the Dark Lord.
It can preserve your humanity while Undead,
and cast off the shackles placed upon your brethren."
"After the advent of fire, the ancient lords found the three souls.
But your progenitor found a fourth, unique soul.
The Dark Soul.
Your ancestor claimed the Dark Soul and waited for Fire to subside.
And soon, the flames did fade, and only Dark remained.
Thus began the age of men, the Age of Dark.
However… Lord Gwyn trembled at the Dark.Clinging to his Age of Fire, and in dire fear of humans,
and the Dark Lord who would one day be born amongst them,
Lord Gwyn resisted the course of nature.
By sacrificing himself to link the fire, and commanding his children to shepherd the humans,
Gwyn has blurred your past, to prevent the birth of the Dark Lord.
I am the primordial serpent.
I seek to right the wrongs of the past to discover our true Lord.
But the other serpent, Frampt, lost his sense, and befriended Lord Gwyn.
Undead warrior, we stand at the crossroad.
Only I know the truth about your fate.
You must destroy the fading Lord Gwyn, who has coddled Fire and resisted nature,
and become the Fourth Lord, so that you may usher in the Age of Dark! "
So there was an age of dark, perhaps briefly, before dark souls 1, the pygmy waited with his dark soul and presumably became the first dark lord? It mentions the dark lord has yet to be born but your ancestor is said to have waited for the flame to fade with his dark soul. The serpents also welcome the return of the dark lord during the dark lord ending.
>>335543289
>zombified abominations
Please elaborate, are you referring to the hollows, the grave keepers, or the crow worshipers? Also, it wasn't pitch black, you could see the floor and surrounding area just fine.
>>335543424
Who's Edmond?
>>335536678
>He doesn't know he's a snake bitch.
Someone din't look into Yuria's gear and special dialog.
>>335543181
Yup, works the same way with messages. It's some wild shit, there's some crazy time shit going on.
So let me get this straight, the things that first found the souls in the first flame are the "Lords" or gods, and they are a different race from humans?
And then Manus/Pygmy made humans with the Dark Soul? I'm trying to get my lore down. Did humans help at all with the dragons? Did humans just pop up overnight and for some reason the gods were cool with that because they now had subjects?
>>335542992
The new wild card is Deep, which is possibly more powerful than the first flame or humanity
you were supposed to pick on this when Deep was referneced 200000000 times in the game and Deep was a strong enough power to kill and eat gods etc
>>335541373
anon he wouldn't be able to find your butthole in the dark, he wouldn't even be able to find his own. The age of dark is LITERALLY pitch black darkness everywhere until the first flame decides to pop again.
>>335543524
>Why do you say he can't be hollow, that's his original state before he got a lord soul
Yeah and he had a nice family with his uncle Lloyd while being a mindless zombie?
The guy just burned for a literal thousand years. Do you expect him to not look like a burned corpse?
>>335542992
I'm more interested in all these deep shenanigans. People are saying it's another word for the abyss but all the things related to the deep make it seem so much different. Like those fucking bugs inhabiting it, or how it's actually not a bad place, just a gutter for all the wicked things in the world to drain into
Is the first flame sentient?
>>335543659
>the Deep is the chosen undead when he picked the dark lord ending
>Invade a host three times
>they have a giant seed every time
Why?
>>335543431
>>335543479
>>335543106
>>335543181
If you get to the top of dark firelink, Pickle Pum is dead and the illusory wall is still there with different loot.
The firekeeper you make at the top of the tower is dead too, and iria if you make her one.
>>335543627
bad motherfucker. from a game they cannot legally use the lore from
they found a way and, as a final kiss goodbye, showed us that they're the same universe after all
all the shit happening in dark souls games is only *one part* of a world that is INCREDIBLY fucked up in many different ways
>>335543571
"Pus of Man" is the name of it. Humanity seems like a good word to replace man with, so.
>>335543274
The dark is turning humans into all sorts of shit: Black writhing abominations, trees, horrifying brains with nervous systems for wings and tails.
>>335543627
Blacksmith from Demon's Souls.
Why does some faggy flame going out make the whole world dark? The sun doesn't give a shit that some faggy metaphysical bonefire isn't burning anymore.
>>335543763
sentient enough to sense it's own demise and summon undead to try to preserve itself.
So here's my understanding of the Undead Curse based on DaS 1 and 2
>Gwyn is fearful of the dark/humanity, so reignites the First Flame with his own soul
>In doing so Gwyn and/or the First Flame curses humanity with Undeath
>The curse appears whenever the flame grows dark, so humanity is compelled to reignite the flame
>Even if the flame fades and someone becomes the dark lord, eventually it will reignite (maybe at the hands of an undead)
>Thus it becomes an endless cycle
>In short, good job Gwyn, you fucked up everything
Is that about right? Does DaS3 add anything
>>335543414
You can even see this in a section of the Undead Settlement that's seemingly abandoned. Most of the undead there are also turning.
>>335542261
>>335542371
So, is the Profaned Flame the Chaos?
Because, lots of stuff hint that the Chaos died out. All the demons barely have any flame left, and its mentioned that it went out.
But what's left of Izalith still has magma and the Profaned Flame exists under Irithyll, which is built on New Londo, and is described as never dying. Plus Sulyvahn is all tree-y.
>>335542989
dancer farts are corrosive
>>335543854
the first flame is the sun, your torch, that spark you make when you hit a wall, that guy who set himself on fire to try and kill you, it's the source of ALL fire and light in the souls universe.
>>335541831
Game tells you that there was an age of primordial creatures and that the world was formless and then some dudes found a powerful flame and souls and they usurped the world from those primordial beings. Which is basically lile classical greek myth.
However by using said flame and souls they set an expiration date on it and they tried to prolong it which leads to all kinds of problems you see throughout the entirety of the game in many different locations, bosses and items.
Its not hard to understand and the flame doesn't need an explanation because it's interest comes from its mystery. Not everything has to be categorized and thoroughly explained to you.
>>335543913
Replay DaS1 again m8, the curse appears before Gwyn links the fire, the curse is just humans manifesting their true form since the fire is fading.
>>335543831
Then why didn't we see that stuff in the Dark Shrine? The flame is causing all this stuff to happen, those dark snakes are crazed humanity.
>>335543297
>purest
lmao. You aren't the only unkindled, buddy. She "tends" to everyone and I'm sure that's she's gotten several good dickings.
>>335543819
>and the illusory wall is still there with different loot.
what? you mean the chest with silver serpent ring?
that has been open to me everytime I checked
>>335543971
yes, I'm guessing it embedded itself in the pontiff when he was younger and gave him some obscene powers but made him completely bonkers.
>>335543854
Then why is it fucking MELTING
>>335543376
Is humanity animalistic? Humanity is what stops humans from going hollow. There's nothing to say that humanity in its natural dark form is animalistic.
>>335542878
It's simple. Artorias greatshield held it off with its' barried.We build a wall.
So, everything sucks and absolutely everyone did everything wrong except the dragons, right? At least that's what I got from this thread.
>>335542881
Ciaran dont, she literally has to hold back from judging you because you are human. The lords were dicks of the hughest calibur
>>335543913
A cycle doesn't imply something is fucked up. Self sacrifice for the survival of a species is just something that happens. Its like why do you eat everyday? You're just going to have to eat again.
>>335544118
It's bleeding through the Dark created by the first flame.
>>335544130
that doesn't work when the dark starts sending flying tree monsters after you
>>335544130
Pull and Ivory King?
>Snake that could have been, but never was, a dragon.
>Snakes are known as creatures of great avarice, devouring prey even larger than themselves by swallowing them whole.
>If one's shackles are cause for discontent, perhaps it is time for some good old fashioned greed.
No snake has your best interest at hear if you link the flame you lose if you take it you also lose.
>>335543315
>A LIE WILL REMAIN A LIE
I love how Aldia delivers that line, he is someone who have seem it all, and knows all the wrongs turns that the world took, he hates how taken to those fleeting forms people are as they link the flame to prolong the suffering and his voice shows his frustration over the current state of affairs and his inability to do anything about it.
He says that life is so beautiful that it enchants people to the point of obsession, it blinds them to the pain and suffering that will follow as they seek to perpetuate the lie, even through its impossible.
Peace grants men the illusion of life.
Shackled by falsehoods, they yearn for love, unaware of its grand illusion.
Until, the curse touches their flesh.
We are bound by this yoke.
As true as the Dark that churns within men.
Damn I really want an Aldia DLC, I think hi, and the Furgitive Pigmy might become the key for all this.
>>335542874
>He's a member of the race of Giants.
Lords. The term "giant" does not appear in Dark Souls in reference to them. Giants are those other guys, like the Giant blacksmith.
>>335537967
woah,. I wonder if that is actually intentional
>>335543346
While that seems unlikely, the idea of a nervous system just existing on its own and moving about is terrifying.
>>335542396
fight clubs are boring
>>335544160
In that case it just makes Gough a massive bro. Everyone around him is a dick to humans, but he still talks to you, wishes you good luck in your travels, thanks you for helping Artorias and tells you to live your life as you see fit. On top of helping you out with that dragon situation.
>>335544160
Well humans fucked up her husbando royally after the whole abyss thing
It probably worked better before
>>335544149
Yes Vaati, now go make your video.
>>335544196
Tree monsters are chaos though
>>335543604
>Also, it wasn't pitch black, you could see the floor and surrounding area just fine.
The sky itself was pitch black EXACTLY like what you see in the ending where you let the fire fade. In any case, did you expect them to make a literally full black level and expect you to progress normally? Of course not, for video game reasons.
And I'm refering to those zombified dog fucks and corvian shits lying there. There's never been a single indication about anything good coming out of any age of dark ever in this series and if we let the fire fade we lose the ability to remain as the thinking human anomalies that we are.
What is better, an age where everything is guaranteed shit with nothing but Raccoon City and 0 lights everywhere or an age where humans as we know them can actually exist, build entire kingdoms, cities and live normal lives that is only occasionally bad until someone lights shit up again? In any case, the flame will ALWAYS come back due to the cycle bullshit and the age of fire will restart itself regardless.
>>335544050
>the curse appears before Gwyn links the fire
It did? I don't recall where it said that
>>335544327
FREE FROM THE CONFINES OF THE BODY
OF THE BONE
>DS3 answered nothing and closed nothing
>>335544119
>Is humanity animalistic?
pic related.
Without humanity you are a husk but too much turns you into an anima. The fire keeps humanity in check without it everyone is at the mercy of the abyss.
>>335544361
no I mean the pilgrim butterflies
>>335543330
When Yhorm linked the fire, at that moment a massive flame came down and incinerated every human being.
Eleonora's description says that the "descendants of a certain Oracle" were the ones who created the Profaned Flame.
But yeah, it seems to be an even more evil version of the Chaos Flame. The Jailer women seem to be using it in their lanterns, and it has fucked up effects on things. The creepy spider women who are horribly mutated, the hand babies, the pale things in cells, etc...
>>335544419
I know, and their attacks even look like chaos pyromancy
>>335543648
>So let me get this straight, the things that first found the souls in the first flame are the "Lords" or gods, and they are a different race from humans?
Giants. Yes, a different race.
>And then Manus/Pygmy made humans with the Dark Soul? I'm trying to get my lore down. Did humans help at all with the dragons? Did humans just pop up overnight and for some reason the gods were cool with that because they now had subjects?
Descendants of the Furtive Pygmy, who had nothing to do with the fall of the dragons. He just fucked off never to be seen again.
>>335544206
Well he did fuck up the Chaos flame.
>>335544295
Aldia already solved the cycle issuefor himself, pygmy is the cause of everything in the series both good and bad
>>335544380
The moment the fire started to fade was the moment the curse appeared, the moment things started to get ugly was when Gwyn fucked off to link the fire keeping it barely alive.
>>335532020
>going in blind
>literally missed every single quest besides some basic stuff like loretta bone and fire keeper eyes
why do they do this? literally no one in their right mind would ever be able to get to dragon peak if they played fully blind
>>335543571
Humanity going out of control as the power of flame weakness and darkness strengthens. Instead of mutating people (like in Oolacile), it's straight up burst out of them and manifesting physically.
>>335543585
What that formatting sucks dick, well here's some Frampt
I am the Primordial Serpent, Kingseeker Frampt, close friend of the Great Lord Gwyn.
Chosen Undead, who has rung the Bell of Awakening.
I wish to elucidate your fate.
Chosen Undead. Your fate is… to succeed the Great Lord Gwyn.
So that you may link the Fire, cast away the Dark, and undo the curse of the Undead.
Heavens! You have done it! You have retrieved the Lordvessel!
After a thousand years! It is you, it is really you!
Magnificent… You are the righteous successor to Gwyn, the new Great Lord.
And I am Kingseeker no more…
Your acquaintance was an honour.
I must admit, I am fond of you humans.
May you enjoy serendipity,
And may the Age of Fire perpetuate.
Frampt outright states he's fond of humans. Refers to the dark as a curse to the undead, whether that's a literal curse or simply a pain the ass from his point of view, who knows.
>>335544485
other way around m8
>>335544479
>Giants. Yes, a different race.
This is all fan theory.
Giants are a distinct race.
The beings pictured finding the souls in the First Flame are shown as Hollows. They move, look and act like Hollows.
Lords, for whatever reason, don't' seem able to go Hollow.
>>335544402
There is literally nothing wrong with what Manus became. He became strong and didn't rely on the power of the flame to survive. His only fault was being autistic and losing a piece of jewelry an throwing a fit over it.
>>335544359
Thanks. I'm actually kind of lost with all these Aldia talk because I haven't replayed Dark Souls 2 since it released.
>>335544391
You'll find closure once you buy my dlc.
>>335544513
das2 is retconned bruh. didn't really happen. a few people like lucatiel had strong enough souls to remain a part of history, that's it.
>>335544535
because the point of the fucking game is for you to play it over and over again over NG+ cycles to find out shit you missed.
>>335544479
They are not giants. Giants are a different race altogether. The lord souls are giant in size because they are lord souls.
>>335543414
Or he's just the demon souls protag like the ring implies, and he's been burning for a longass time making him look like the gimp he is.
>>335543315
Yes we should all just become beef jerky, that's what he actually are after all.
I'm sure everyone in the game is being brainwashed to not desire that fate and keeps linking the fire.
>>335544607
>Lords, for whatever reason, don't' seem able to go Hollow.
really bro
>>335543659
It's pretty obvious that From is building up to something since, as you said, they make painstaking efforts to keep a distinction between Dark, Abyss and the Deep.
You'd expect there to be Abyssal monstrosities in the Church of the Deep, but instead they seem to be worshipping something else entirely and they're explicitly said to be killing off Dark shit that shows up.
>>335544772
A corpse controlled by the flame =/= hollow
>>335544479
Basically went like this. 3 lords found 3 souls, they decided to keep the souls because it made them powerful, but overtime the souls started to fade out, losing their power.
Another lord found the dark soul, but instead of keeping it to himself, he created a race with it, and when the race started to spread and multiply the total power of the dark soul increased, even if each individual piece doesn't do much.
Then you get stuff like Manus, beings that have accrued a lot of humanity, or the abyss, humanity without a vessel, that just seeps into everything.
>>335544772
gwyn deposited most of his soul into the first flame, does this count as going hollow?
>>335544637
Aldia was Vendrick's brother that was THE top scholar/scientist in their kingdom. He worked with Vendrick to find a cure to the curse but Vendrick realized how extreme he was going so he cut all contact and support for him. Aldia however kept going and eventually found a way to break the cycle, but only for himself. Now even he's not sure what will happen to the world because he can no longer influence it being outside of it.
>>335544772
Gwyn's a weird case. He could just be burned.
You seem to need the Dark Sign to go Hollow. Lords and humans when killed just normally die. But with a Dark Sign, you turn undead and eventually Hollow. No Lords have Dark Signs.
>>335543763
It seems to be. It raises the dead with the purpose of reigniting it. When the dead fall, knits together a new champion to reignite it.
It also seems to have some control over time, as the Firelink Shrine we use is not connected to Lothric (or the real world) directly.
>>335544960
That's not necessarily sentience. Plants have self-preserving mechanisms but they're not sentient.
>>335543585
>>335544584
Kaathe is lying to you, he doesn't give a fuck about humans and knows the cycle will continue, he just likes chaos. That's literally some of the descriptions in him in game.
Frampt is the great serpent Kikeenstein. He lies to you as well, he doesn't like humans, he doesn't give a fuck either way, he just knows that he and his bro kaathe will be chillin under Gywndolins rule for a bit and probably get the better deal. They are all the same entity, literally all of them are one serpent, it is all disinfo to coddle you into two specific choices that don't change anything in the end.
>>335542874
Gwyn et al are not Giants, they are hollows, like humans who, instead of being given a part of the Dark Soul, found the souls of Lords instead. Thus, they became Lords, and are linked to fire, because they have Lord Souls, not Humanity.
The Lords can totally go Hollow, not by losing theit humanity, but by losing their Lord Soul, and it's pretty certain that Gwyn has gone Hollow since he used his Lord Soul to link the fires.
>>335544653
Aldia and the Bearer of the Curse now known as "he who went beyond death" are why the Dark Sigil is no longer a natural component of the Darksign wen it comes to strong Unkindled.
>>335545034
we still know virtually nothing about the first flame really so nobody can make any accurate guesses. It could actually be a really powerful cosmic entity that just feeds on souls and bleeds realities dry before moving on.oh wait
>>335544903
>You seem to need the Dark Sign to go Hollow.
no, hollowing is not related to the dark sign. you go hollow by losing your way/losing purpose/meaning etc
>>335544346
Gough is a Giant, they're the niggers of the Dark Souls universe, of course he doesn't judge you like the high-borne cunts do.
>>335544180
First Flame doesn't make Dark. The first flame's power is weakening, which makes dark (a physical thing), ooze out of the fucking sun.
>>335543456
Nope, this is what Vaati said, and it makes no sense.
Vaati then goes on about how Gwyn "used" the humans as pawns to feed the flame and personally placed the curse on them and some nonsense like that.
When literally all of Aldia's dialogue refers to how everything that is as Gwyn wanted it to be, is not what it meant to be, men assumed a fleeting form because of Gwyn linking the first flame, they are props on his stage because they are "proof" that what he did was rightful and just, while he is the great hero, the main character of the his grand play, even through he did it for his own selfish reasons, which is his fear of the dark. This is what he meant, not that nonsense Vaati said, the curse wasn't put on humanity by anything, the curse is a result of the lie that is life, life is an illusion, its not meant to be in the world of Dark Souls, the curse is simply the dark souls (humanity) reverting to their true forms and escaping their outer husks that humans became so taken to.
And because humans won't abandon those fleeting forms, and yearn to live, love and die, even through its not natural, and so Aldia seeks a middle ground.
>>335544903
Hollowing is just being extremely depressed and giving up, literally that empty feeling you feel in real life when something goes wrong.
>>335545086
Nope they are not. Again, Gwyn already had a family and even an uncle called Lloyd. Hollows are mindless zombies, uncapable of such deeds, which supports the notion that they already had civilization before, but it was just suppressed by the ironclad rule of the dragons.
The beginning of the game is just metaphorical anyway. After all, it says that the flame created disparity and concepts such as death and life, yet we have a guy that was already the first of the dead finding a soul.
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