Since this happens in pretty much every Souls thread, (and there's been a lot of Souls threads recently) let's let it all out here.
Dark Souls Lore thread
Ask questions, share theories, debate what the other thinks is fact, or try to sum up the lore in one or two sentences. I'll start
What exactly is Frampt?
Old whitering snake
He's jewish
>>335442839
But where is he from? How does he get around?
>>335442949
I knew it
FOR THE LAST FUCKING TIME
BEING AN UNKINDLED DOES NOT MEAN YOU ARE PHYSICALLY INCAPABLE OF LINKING THE FIRST FLAME
IT MEANS YOU WERE A MASSIVE FUCKUP IN YOUR ORIGINAL UNDEATH AND FAILED TO LINK THE FLAME. YOU ARE BASICALLY A CRESTFALLEN WHO GETS RESURRECTED BECAUSE YOU'RE THE FLAME'S C-TEAM.
>>335443168
>We're the bunch of surly midgets to A and B team.
makes sense, considering everything in this game is taller than the PC as well
>>335443168
uh like this desu
anyone here tired of unkindled privileged folks getting the attention they don't deserve???
>>335443327
I caught that reference.
Nameless King in DS3 is Ornstien
This is just my theory.
>We know Ornstien ditched sometime before or During DKS1 by reading Smoughs armor
>We know he went to find Nameless King (Gwyns firstborn)
>Gods dont hollow, Gwyn only hollowed when his soul was sacraficed
>Nameless King looks hollowed
What I think happened is the same as with Gywndolin. With the fire fading, NK took ill too. Ornstien was being loyal to him the entire time. Ornstien then knew someone had to protect Archdragon peak from the Dragonslayers, so he takes up the Mantle of Nameless King and wears the Armor.
>>335443635
Ornstein's lighting was nowhere near as powerful as Nameless's.
That and you kill Ornstein in 2.
>>335443742
>kill Ornstein in 2.
No, he died to Nameless king.
>>335442745
was gwyn's soul keeping the flame lit before you killed him and took it away?
i've played every soulsbourne except demon souls and i have no idea whats going on in any of them. is the lore mostly in item descriptions?
>>335443742
Ornstein in 2 was either animated armor, or a fanboy cosplayer
>>335443917
its mostly a lot of npc conversations that you can only get from doing certain things
How come hollowed npcs die permanently but not regular hollows?
What's up with the Usurp the fire ending? Sure, I'm the Hollow Lord now, but is the cycle over?
Can some random schmuck fuck my shit up and take over my Hollow Lord title?
What do they mean by make Londor whole?
What was going on with the sun?
>>335443886
That and the environment. Noticing what kind of gear the corpses have, proximity to things. Its all very complicated. Arin Hanson mentioned something cool, female corpse with a unique twin soul item, bitch was pregnant. Stuff like that.
>>335443980
this was for
>>335443886
Where the fuck have the serpents disappeared to? I want to kill both Fraampt and Kaathe, those manipulating faggots
>>335444105
>What do they mean by make Londor whole?
Knowing Miyazaki, probably a Marker.
>What was going on with the sun?
The moon was awakening, you triggered the Convergence.
I don't want to make an entire thread for this. so here I go.
Is Dark Souls 1 still offline? are the servers still down for everyone?
>dark souls "lore" thread
Since there's no real lore in the game and you pretty much have to make it all up yourself why not just write your own stuff from scratch?
>>335444471
no its back up, but still kinda lousy, but has good mods to make it bearable
>>335443859
It never says that.
>>335444618
>says
>I can't come to conclusions based on environment details
Sure thing
>>335442745
Thank Gwyn Ds2 is practically retconned out of existence outside of a few references.
So why exactly don't you immediately hollow upon death like in the other two games?
>>335444510
Wrong. Dark Souls has tons of lore but no story.
Learn the difference.
>>335444321
At least one of them became gods, probably Frampt. That's why there's a statue of him at the archives. Kaathe is hiding out somewhere, directing Yuria.
>>335443635
Yeah, I'm sure a guy known for hunting and killing dragons would be super into protecting their worship spot.
>>335444747
The only thing I can think that was fully retconned from DS2 was that Drangleic is a future Lordran, because if that was true that would mean they rebuilt over Lordran and then decided to rebuild some shit like Anor Londo for giggles.
>>335444747
Cycles the main idea of 2 is in. Nothing in 2 is retconed
>>335444921
Kingdoms that were long gone in 2 are still around in 3
>>335444069
I second this question.
I was wondering about this earlier today.
>>335444069
They come back when you go to a fire tho
>>335444069
gameplay mechanics aren't part of the lore
>>335443635
>Gods dont hollow, Gwyn only hollowed when his soul was sacraficed
>Nameless King looks hollowed
Coincidentally, the firstborn lost his godhood when he got kicked out.
Frampt is a primordial serpent, like Kaathe, and all those guys that show up at the end of the Dark Lord ending of DS1
As for what a primordial serpent is, you can make up any bullshit you want. All the serpents seem to be on the side of Dark, considering 8 of them show up in one of the endings.
Maybe the serpents are all extensions of the Abyss, separate heads of the same dark creature. They have no real bodies, and dissolve directly into the void. But being connected means that they know what the others know. Kaathe knows who you are when see him, and Frampt immediately knows that you've switched sides after joining Kaathe.
>>335444903
Only anor londos castle is erect, it could have literally emerged from the ground. Makes sense when u take not that das 3 world is built on mountains
>>335444967
Wasn't there an item that says something about the king from 2 and says it was in a faraway land?
>>335444903
Didn't the oriental fella say Drangleic was in a completely different geographical area to Lordran? Like opposite end of the planet different.
>>335443886
Yes.
>DaS1
>world is cursed with undeath because Lord Gwyn has extended the Age of Fire for too long instead of letting the Dark come in and consume life, letting the world sleep
>after dying enough times and losing the will to fight an undead becomes Hollow, basically insane
>you kill Gwyn and reignite the First Flame with your own body, burning and letting the cycle continue while halting the greater cycle
>DLC has you going into the Abyss which is the Darkness caused by humanity prolonging its existence
>The Abyss is spreading and mutating life
>DaS2
>a large chunk of the world is consumed by the Abyss
>the lesser cycle has kept going, the curse continues
>the player finishes off Vendrick and Queen Nashandra, who was consumed by the Abyss and caused Vendrick to basically fight a war for the Throne of Want
>this has some connection to the First Flame
>the DLCs have you killing old kings and fusing their's and Vendrick's crowns into one, which halts Hollowing upon death when worn
>implied that the PC halts Hollowing
>DaS3
>Bearer apparently succeeded because you don't Hollow on death and many Hollows can retain their sanity
>you're Unkindled, meaning >>335443168
>the First Flame has not been linked for such a long time that it starts to resurrect the old Lords of Cinder in a hope to get them to bring it back
>the lesser cycle of linking the fire has stopped and the greater cycle is basically getting impatient
>the Lords are Hollowed and flee
>the Flame brings back the Unkindled and starts pulling the lands of the Lords physically into it
>you have to go kick the Lords' asses and force them to feed the fire
>the Abyss is spreading and starts eating the sun, everything is fucked
>endings have you link the fire in a weak attempt to sustain it just a short time longer, extinguish it and allow the world to basically die and await rebirth, ortake the Flame and Dark into yourself and destroy the greater cycle once and for all
>>335444069
theyre just visitors in your world. When you kill them, they respawn in their own worlds and, understandably, dont wanna fuck with you anymore.
Guys, listen...
Ashen One actually is Ocelotte.
Discuss.
>>335445078
Maybe they are related to this "Deep" in Ds3
so ocerios fucked his wife after turning into a dragon? are there any hints about the whereabouts of ocelote? some people say hes an invisible dragon baby in his arms
>>335444967
Not a retcon. History doesnt remain lost forever, for one. The whole lore in the series is a mess
>>335445078
I always kind of assumed that frampt and kaathe were two heads of the same serpent.
>>335445085
I don't think it emerged, I think everything else sunk. Look at Duke's archives. And Aldritch built all his shit to lead towards Anor Londo.
>>335445085
That's a little far fetched. So you're saying Anor Londo sunk into the ground like a prairie dog and then decided to come back up for some sun a few thousand years later? Retconning dark souls 2 makes more sense, especially when you consider this post: >>335444967
>>335444747
While 1 has more returning characters, 3 is far more influenced by 2 in regards to its concepts. Especially the cycles.
>>335444789
The Dark Souls 2 protag is implied to have had something to do with that.
>>335445220
Yeah but honestly do you think the that Ds2 is anything like what the director of the original and 3 would have wanted?
>>335445135
Is Dark Souls 3 set in the Age of Dark then? Or the very end of the Age of Fire?
What's Kaathe's angle with the shit going on in Londor?
What the fuck is up with those guys?
>>335444967
You have dead people coming back to life from all ages, not shocking to see histories and kingdoms peserved because of this
>>335444069
They stay dead when killed as humans as well, it might be like the way people see ghosts off each other but on a greater scale, that they can speak to each other.
Kinda like how you summon dusk of oolacile but all she does is sell you things like a normal npc merchant.
>>335445293
If anything then 3 is just replacing 2 by telling its story better
>>335444471
been playing recently, definitely still down for me. i haven't seen a single soapstone message
>>335445260
The geograpgy around 3's anor londo is completely different than 1s
>>335444471
I was connecting to nodes yesterday so it seems online again
What if frampt and kaathe are at risk of hollowing as well?
So they send an unlimited army of undead at gods and watch the aftermath, simply because theyre starting to get bored.
The default "End of Fire" ending of Dark Souls 3 is the only "good" ending in the game.
The "Link the First Flame" ending is simply the status quo.
The alternate "End of Fire" ending has you striking down and expressing cruelty to the Fire Keeper, followed by the narrator reciting lines from the beginning of the game in a tone that's essentially calling you a bastard.
The "Usurpation of Fire" ending is pretty much a copy of the DaS1 "Dark Lord" ending and following the wishes of Kaathe, who's a bad dude regardless of whether or not his rhetoric about the "true form of Man" is to be believed. There's also the matter of the path to this ending being filled with deceit and murder.
The Fire Keeper does freak out upon first being given the Eyes, but all of her dialogue that follows the ritual with the Lords of Cinder presents a calm, understanding demeanor. More importantly, I find that the "End of Fire" ending uniquely gives a sense of hope, not just in the talk of embers, but also in still being able to hear the Fire Keepers soothing call in the amidst the total darkness. This doesn't seem to me like an Age of Dark with darksigns, hollows, decay, and general misery, but rather a return to something more like the Age of Ancients, a calm, quiet time without the conflict of light and dark where something new will eventually be born again.
I hope the DLC will elaborate on the mysterious, "heavenly" Queen of Lothric (who some suspect to be Gwynevere), as I get the feeling that she's a supporter of the "End of Fire", considering her visitation to the Untended Graves and even leaving a ring in your coffin explicitly for you to find.
Amusingly enough, Prima Games, who replaced Future Press and wrote the awful official guide this time around, apparently refers to the "End of Fire" ending as the "true ending".
>>335445260
Time always gets weird when the Cycle is about to end. Kingdoms and people that existed in different times from one another come together, even long-destroyed ones.
>>335445461
You can still see Duke's archives in its normal spot. Just that everything else in front of it sunk.
>>335445351
He, for whatever reason, wants to usher in the Age of Dark.
Some speculate he's doing this because he realizes what Gwyn did was bad news bears. Others say it is because he is manipulating the CU/AO into ending it so his own plans to rule can happen instead.
Which is true is intentionally left unclear.
>>335445170
I really want to see fanart of Oceiros spiking a baby into a ground like a football after scoring a touchdown. Perhaps I need to visit the drawthread...
>>335445135
Perfect
>>335445170
>Cry sound is actually Ashen One's memories
>Untended Graves location starts literally where Oceiros room ends
>Ashen One spawns there
What the fuuuuuuuuck
so is it even supposed to be feasibly possible to encounter Kaathe without a guide?
I joined the mound men and killed the guy who invades you out side the white tree
Why does he die in the mound guy covenant area?
If you say cause he's insane xD I'm gonna flip
Is the Untended Graves in another world already consumed by the Abyss?
>>335445351
He's just a friendly angel, dude.
>>335444747
Not even close.
>>335445765
My Ashen one is a woman.
They have all other NPCs refer to your gender when the dialogue calls for it.
Ocelotte is a boy.
Sorry not sorry.
>>335442745
im more interested in gywndolin
>>335445316
It doesn't change the fact that he made 3 with DaS II events in mind tho.
>>335445519
Linking the flame is the good ending because you preserve order without harming any innocent besides sacrificing yourself. The most moralfag choices generally aren't the most satisfying, but they are usually the safest.
>>335445135
What exactly is the Throne of Want?
I can't imagine it's the Kiln since the thing didn't erupt into flame but IDK.
The game did sort of imply that Vendrick was trying to find some alternate way to prolong the cycle rather than link it himself. Was the Throne an attempt at an alternate way to do that?
>>335444967
2 is set way far away from 1 and 3
>if you fuck up Anri's questline but let her make it to Irithyll, you find her in the Darkmoon tomb, where someone else has already married her
>this means at least one other person is on the table to be the Lord of Hollows
Who is it, /v/?
>>335445208
>invisible
It's just not there. He's fucking nuts. His wife took the baby.
>>335445194
The Deep is the Abyss, one of the item descriptions mentions that if I remember correctly.
>>335445317
The ass end of the Age of Fire, and you're seeing what it's really like when the Age of Dark happens.
The Age of Fire should have ended countless millennia ago, but the Chosen Undead burned himself and let it continue, as has everyone else who has Linked the Flame. Thus, once the Flame weakens and stops restraining the Abyss, the world becomes extremely fucked extremely quickly. The sun is a Darksign, the Hollows become trees that ascend into the sky, and eventually everything in the world is compacted into one horrific mountain of rubble
>>335445519
The Usurpation of Fire is what Vendrick told the Bearer about; using the Abyss and the Flame together to do what so many have failed to do with just one. You're breaking the cycle so there is no Age of Dark or Age of Fire, meaning the world can be reconstructed and the Darksign, a product of the Age of Fire, eliminated.
The End of Flame merely lets the world sleep for a time before the cycle continues, effectively resetting the entire series.
>>335445884
The UG Shrine Maiden's dialogue implies that it's far in the past. Or the near future.
>>335445351
Londor is something like a kingdom of sane Hollows, what Kaathe always wanted. Or at least says he did.
>>335445519
>considering her visitation to the Untended Graves
wat? And on that subject, what the fuck was up with the Untended Graves? I heard some speculate it's an alternate world where the first flame has died.
>>335445984
Can you use 'him' as to 'child'?
Was Anri really hollow? Why couldn't he/she come back since she still had a goal in mind.
>>335445351
Londor is Drangleic. Hence the obsession with being a "true lord," having a spouse and the two weapons people from Londor using being Dark Drift and the Mannikin claws.
>>335446224
>effectively resetting the entire series
>tfw this is the true ending according to bamco so they can reboot the series without from soft
Where was Drangleic in relation to Lordran, and where is Lothric in relation to both of the former?
Similarly, how is Anor Londo in Lothric; is it the exact same place we went in DaS1?
Is the answer to everything just "Speedforce, I don't gotta explain shit", but with 'time is fucked'?
Are the Carthus Catacombs just the DaS1 Catacombs? Is the Profane Capital church with the hand monster the same building that Ingward is on top of?
Is Irithyl of the Boreal Valley just Eleum Loyce?
Is Irithyl actually THE Boreal Valley, or is the Boreal Valley the collective nam eof a wider group of areas? Is there "the city of [x] of the Boreal Valley' and 'the marketplace of [y] of the Boreal Valley'?
whats priscilla's backstory?
>>335445067
Does it say that? I musta missed that
>>335444875
>Yeah, I'm sure a guy known for hunting and killing dragons would be super into protecting their worship spot.
You realize Gwyns firstborn was a known dragonslayer too until he defected, right?
>>335445562
Kaathe is a fucking Jew snake that wants eternal darkness no matter the cost. Frampt is a fucking Jew snake that wants eternal light no matter the cost. They're both psychotic retards trying to spite the Dragons at the expense of Man.
DO NOT LISTEN TO JEW SNAKES
END THE CYCLE
So does being a Lord of Cinder mean you have already linked the flame, or that you're powerful enough to link the flame next time it's needed?
Who is Yorshka? Did someone defile Priscilla?
>>335446525
seath put his scaleless weiner somewhere it didn't belong
Listen if Drangleic and Lordran had two completely different geographies, if Drangleic was meant to be Lordran even with the difference in geography it's safe to assume Lothric was built on Drangleic. It's even in the name Lothric = Drangleic + Lordran. And there's multiple things from Drangleic in Lothric, Human Drang Knights in Anor Londo as a stand out
>>335446525
Gwyn's son, The Nameless King, betrayed his father and sided with the dragons. NK + dragon poon = Priscilla. To protect her from Gwyn, NK sent her to the Painted World.I think.
>>335446705
yes.
it was probably gwyndolin. and if the thought of that doesn't turn you on something's wrong with your dick
>>335446746
why is she in the world of painting?
will we see more of her? (im still playing DS2)
>>335446680
Well Gwyn was a Lord of Cinder before he linked the flame...so....
>>335443635
eh
there's too many references to Gwyn's son as a God of War, and the Nameless King is referred to as a God of War too. Add that he dresses like Gwyn, and is "Nameless", while Gwyn's son also had his named removed from the annals of history, it's pretty hard to for me to see Gwyn's firstborn as being anything other than the Nameless King
>>335446149
It's worth noting that the structure around the Throne of Want resembles a literal kiln, but I hold the less popular idea that sitting upon it doesn't necessarily link the flame. It has the power to, yes, but you can choose otherwise and go for an Age of Dark. The Emerald Herald's dialogue, even as you're taking the throne, suggests that there's still a choice to be made, so in a sense, this one ending (the only one DaS2 originally had) actually comprises of multiple endings depending on what you WANT to see be the result.
The additional ending that was added later is then a third option to continue seeking Vendrick's alternative rather than choosing between Fire or Dark.
>>335446217
The sorcerer guy is apparently aiming for Lord of Hollows. But that's just what Yuria says and she's not exactly trustworthy.
>>335445316
Doesnt change the fact it exists and that he needs to work off it. M never even evinsoed das2 or a 3
>>335446705
Yorshka is Gwyn's other kid, probably a bastard since she was locked away. I heard some people talking about her existence being the cause of the occult rebellion but I don't know where they get that from
>This spot marks our grave but you may rest here too, if you'd like.
What did he mean by this?
>>335446867
No he wasn't. He was the Lord of Sunlight. "Lord of Cinder" was the title he got when he set himself on fire.
>>335446867
He was the Lord of Sunlight before he linked the flame. He was Lord of Cinder after.
>>335446823
because she's a freak of nature and has weird anti-god powers and was locked away along with other things the gods wished didn't exist like the god destroying occult ember and bonewheel skeletons
>>335446867
fucl off, he was a lord of sunlight
>>335446883
Did you even read my post?
>>335446783
Also Creighton and Alva in Anor Londo. The lore is strange
>>335446934
Lothric is a savage qt.
>>335446934
he's inviting you to a threesome after you respawn, if you change your mind about the lordseeking thing
>>335446005
gwyndolin is ultimate QT
>>335446525
Daughter of Seath and someone. Locked away because they didnt want 1/4 dragons taking over the world
Yorksha is calling Gwyn father as an honorific. Like a priest. Jesus Christ don't be so goddamn literal.
>>335446127
Linking is probably the worst ending because prolonging the Age of Fire will just make the inevitable fall worse, and Linking doesn't do anything to the Abyss besides slow it down. The world is utterly fucked and the sun is still dying.
>>335446149
The Throne is implied to be a method of translating desire into reality. In that big wall of text I was going to include it but I hit character limit. Vendrick really just didn't give a shit about anything and Nashandra wanted the Throne to finally bring the Abyss forth to consume everything. The Bearer, who is shown to have lost his family to the curse in the opening, has more personal reason than any to try and stop the Hollowing. That's why he can claim the Throne.
>>335446467
Drangleic was far away from Lordran. Lothric is where the universe basically is being pulled together by the First Flame's sentience. Anor Londo is not naturally anywhere near Irithyll, which is not anywhere near Profaned, etc. Profaned was Yhorm's kingdom, Anor Londo was where Aldrich fled and devoured Gwyndolin, and so on. There was no Lord in Drangleic so that's why you don't see Drangleic shoved up everywhere.
>>335446680
The former. In this emergency, the cinders of the Lords can be used to force an Unkindled into the Kiln, the last possible shot at stopping the Abyss from consuming all.
>>335446783
Drangleic was nowhere near Lordran. It's entirely possible that Lordran became Londor, but we don't have enough information to make that leap.
>>335446867
Gwyn was the Lord of Sunlight. He became the first Lord of Cinder as he burned in the Flame. Thus, when he's dying and insane at the end of DaS, that's his boss title.
>>335446967
I feel like the gear and characters from 2 being present are just the Flame's collateral damage.
Why is soul of cinder protecting the kiln? Is it to power up the mc by adding more fuel?
>>335447085
not even that, she's literally reciting gwyndolin's darkmoon oath word for word.
>>335445519
the end of fire ending isn't actually the end of the fire. It's the Age of Dark, which, like the Age of Fire, is only temporary. Even if you choose the End of Fire ending, sooner or later the fire will reborn and the cycle will continue.
The Usurpation of the Fire is the newest ending. Which is interesting, because while Kaathe is gunning for this ending, it's actually different from what he was plotting back in DS1. Maybe he learned something in the in between
>>335442745
>Where the transitory lands of the Lords of Cinder converge.
So anything from the past kingdoms can just show up? Explains Irithyll and the profaned capital.
>>335446797
how many children does Gwyn have?
>>335447045
but why is she happy to be locked away? she even told you to go away because the place is peaceful
>>335447026
i want gwyndolin to be by my side
>>335446525
She has some power that is scary to the gods. The Painted World also has the occult ember which lets you make godkilling weapons so I imagine it's where things the gods don't want to deal with gets put away.
>>335446705
yorshka is ocelotte, the son the consumed king oceiros. come on, it's not that shocking, yorshka was raised by gwyndolin after all
>>335447149
>Maybe he learned something in the in between
He probably learned that bringing upon the Age of Dark and letting the fire fade isn't enough to stop Gwyn's wild ride.
who the bloody fuck is rosaria?
>>335446372
There are a few items that talk about the Queen of Lothric and her involvement with the Untended Graves, particularly Divine Blessing (notably also a DaS item associated with Gwynevere), Hidden Blessing, and the Ashen Estus Ring.
>>335446942
>bonewheel skeletons
why do they even exist?
>>335447187
>but why is she happy to be locked away?
she felt she had no place in the real world
>>335447334
sometimes nito feels like being a dick
>>335447303
some say she is gwynevere
>>335446224
U hear the baby's cries tho
I'm gay
>>335447127
The Soul is the concentrated power of all the Lords that the Unkindled must defeat. Since there's nobody manning the Flame directly, the Flame manifests its own guardian.
It's possible that it's a test to make sure nobody too weak can hold the Flame. Or that the Flame is resisting being touched by an Unkindled, who are literally the lowest of the low in the "hierarchy" of the Fire.
>>335447290
Or that a world populated by mindless monstrosities is pretty fucking lonely.
>>335447187
>how many children does Gwyn have?
his unnamed first son (imo the Nameless King; others think it's Solaire), Gwynevere, Gwyndolin and then depending on your interpretation of the word 'brother', Yorshka.
So either three, four, or five.
Was that Gilligan's corpse in the Profaned Capital bonfire or just an innocuously uniquely modeled corpse used for scenery?
>>335446005
>"Gwyndolin is said to behave like a sullen, brooding goddess"
>>335447476
There's a reason there are ladders everywhere.
>>335447396
A manifestation of Oceiros's own insanity. That or you're hearing the battle from his ears.
>>335447476
I think it's more purposefully Gilligan, considering he's surrounded by several ladders in that broken tower...
>>335447476
It was Gilligan's Isle
>>335447434
he probably adopted her as a sister because she's a freak just like him
>>335447476
The ladders make it clear it is Gilligan. He was there to steal all the gold laying around him. e either fell to his death, or just died like so many in the Soulsverse do.
>>335447285
>yorshka = ocelotte
Yorshka is female and Ocelotte is male.
>>335447476
He built so many auld ladders that he died of exhaustion.
>>335447149
>Maybe he learned something in the in between
This is one of the most interesting things about DaS3 to me. I legitimately cannot tell if Kaathe is trustworthy at this point, I don't know what the fuck he wants.
>>335447290
so he learned the same shit Aldia did. Interesting, especially since Aldia may have been the one to talk Lothric into not linking the fire.
>>335446956
yeah I did, I don't buy that the NK was Ornstein in disguise. In this case, I feel the simplest answer is probably the most correct, which is NK=Gwyn's Firstborn
>>335446525
Seath fucked Gwynevere, and Gwyn was so ashamed of the abomination that they threw her in the trash (AKA the painted world)
What the fuck is up with archdrake peak? Why are there so many dragon people corpses everywhere? Why does ringing the bell summon the storm king?
>>335447303
My newest waifu.
>>335447572
try reading the post
>>335447187
1. disinherited first born son (former war god) with unknown name
2. Gwynevere, qt princess of sunlight
3. Dark Sun Gwyndolin, born as a guy with snake legs and moon light magic powers. Got raised as a daughter because reasons.
>>335447395
She is channeling that mad titty game, I'll give her that.
>>335447572
Wouldn't be the first trap in the series.
>>335447623
They aren't corpses, they bleed if you hit them. They're meditating.
>Why does ringing the bell summon the storm king?
Because the Path of the Dragon is 1v1 me fgt the covenant. Ringing the bell is how you challenge the champ.
>>335445984
just means you used something like the coffin in DS2,
boyo
>>335447570
Nah, Gwyn knocked up Priscilla.
Which means you killed a pregnant woman for no reason in DS1.
What was the First Sin?
Did Aldia succeed?
What the fuck was his problem?
Also, what the fuck is wrong with his face?
Why does everyone think that the status quo is bad when everyone had great lives under gwyn and after each linking
>>335447541
>gywndolin's voice
>>335445170
That's actually...
Oh shit...
What the fuck happened to Izalith? Did the Old Demon King and what appear to be his progeny fucking murder all the other demon inhabitants? What the fuck were the giants doing down there with a siege engine? Was that the Pontiff's doing?
>>335447791
He wanted to join the Dragon covenant but his dad wouldn't let him.
And as for his face, he went hollow.
Drangleic Lordran and Lothric are all around the same area or are either different places
>>335447303
One of Gwynevere's handmaidens, who is also a distant cousin of hers.
>>335445519
>The "Usurpation of Fire" ending is pretty much a copy of the DaS1 "Dark Lord" ending and following the wishes of Kaathe
I agree with most of your shit but not this one. It's very obviosuly not the same, as the Dark Lord in DS1 has you not interacting with the flame at all. Here, your status as an Unkindled allows you to combine both and make londor great again
>>335447857
>Gods
>Go Hollow
I bet you think Gwyn was hollow too.
>>335447791
He's old as all fuck.
>>335447784
Gwyn is dead don't talk about my waifu like that.
>>335447541
would you polish gwyndolin's knob while xe quietly protested?
>>335447801
They're Chaosfags.
>muh world of strength
>>335447843
The Chaos Flame was flawed and the Demons were doomed to go extinct eventually. All the demon items refers to them as a dying race, and no one is in a hurry to save them.
>>335447801
Because the status quo isn't maintained. Taking souls from other beings in Lossy. Compare linking the fire ending in 1 and 3.
DaS1
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kPXMR1DioZU
DaS3
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I_XhXDaCEpc
The fire is burning out even though it's being linked.
>>335447801
>Why do people think getting invited to a serial killer's house is bad? You have a great meal, maybe some steak and it's pretty good. He might fucking murder you in horrible ways right at the end, but the beginning and middle were good!
i still dont understand why solaire want to kill you in DS1, did he go hollow?
>>335447954
Are the Ghru goat headed guys demons or abyssal creatures?
>>335448012
>food analogy
>>335447801
It's not sustainable.
The End of Fire at least has the possibility of another Gwyn coming along and making the world anew.
>>335447786
The First Sin was the genocide on the dragons, more specifically Seeth's betrayal of his own, who was a scientist; like Aldia.
Yes or no?
Is Solaire anything in this family?
Is the Nameless King the first born references in the first game?
Who is Gwyn's wife; was there a wife at all?
>>335447771
>you wake up in a coffin
Deepest lore.
>>335447786
"First Sin" could refer to the Chosen Undead's first Linking of the Flame, pulling out an unnatural Age of Fire longer than it should exist.
>>335447801
Linking doesn't cause the Darksign to vanish or the Abyss to recede. It keeps the Abyss from taking the entire world extremely quickly, but that's all it does.
>>335447951
>muh world of strength
That's what we have now though. Everyone knows they're dying, so they fight to make the best over everyone else. Look at the fucking Pontiff, or for a less horrific example, Patches. With a true Lord of Hollows and an end to the cycle, the world can finally have a real, permanent society.
>>335448059
Demons.
>>335447786
>>335448114
I thought the first sin was linking the first flame to humanity.
>raised as a girl, probably against your will, because ''dude the moon lmao''
>overshadowed by your siblings
>forced to remain in a abandoned city and guard your father's empty coffin while all of the other gods leave, watching an once great kingdom fade into obscurity
>meet your end by being slowly eaten by a lovecraftian horror to allow your literally who sister to escape
Being Gwyndolin is suffering.
didn't we kill the mario bros. in DS1? why then is ornstein's armor in archdrake peak? smough's armor also implies he tried to defend the castle against aldrich, so he somehow survived the encounter in DS1?
>>335448159
No
Probably
Doesn't matter
>>335448163
Go to bed Kaathe.
>>335448159
Nameless King is the firstborn, yes.
>>335447791
>What the fuck was his problem?
It's his mountain and you fucked with his dragon bros. He was a dragon killer for his dad Gwyn until he switched sides and became bros with the dragons. Dad didn't like it and disinherited him.
>Also, what the fuck is wrong with his face?
He's just some undead dude wearing a scarf because it's windy up there.
What was the lie that Aldia mentioned in 2? His ramblings seemed pretty cryptic.
>>335448159
>Yes or no
Possibly, there's some stuff pointing towards Lothric's queen being Gwynevere
>Is Solaire anything in this family?
No
>Is the Nameless King the first born references in the first game?
Armor set
>Who is Gwyn's wife; was there a wife at all?
The bloody atmosphere
>>335448214
>linking the first flame to humanity
What is this meme?
>>335448159
Seath is not gwyn's son then?
>>335447954
Still, it looks like they were invaded and murdered. Old Demon King has piles of corpses that still bleed when you cut them. What's that all about?
>>335448159
No.
Solaire is nothing in this family.
Yorshka is Priscilla's kid, sickly and sequestered away from the world. She speaks of Gwyn as her father, and Gwyndolin and Gwynevere as her older siblings.
>>335448054
After he had the sunlight maggot on his face? He was falling into despair pretty much the whole second half of the game, then he thinks he found his "sun" and is driven mad.
>>335448264
That the Fire can be kindled and will stay around. It's going to go out regardless, every time it's linked it gets weaker. Aldia was trying to find a third way, for Humanity to continue without the fire.
>>335448221
Smough's armor doesn't mention when exactly he died, saying he defended against Aldrich is only speculation.
Didn't we kill Gwyndolin in DaS1? What was left of herto devour?
>>335448221
Read the thread. In Ornstein's armor description it states that he went to find his master, the Nameless King. The one you fight in 1 is likely an illusion like Gwynevere was.
Can we all agree putting Ornstein's armor in 3 caused more trouble than it's worth?
>>335442745
Is it all the same world in a different cycle? Lordran fades, turns into Drangleic, fades (or lights up and THEN fades), turns into Lothric. Is that true? Can it be understood like that? Should I get into the lore more? Or will I lose nothing?
>>335448221
The ones you fought in DaS weren't real, they were illusions.
>>335448298
Why would Seath be Gwyn's son..? Is that a theory anywhere?Legit curious.
>>335448360
Optional bosses are considered alive in canon. Gwyndolin was optional.
I just dont get why from was so obsessed from changing the abyss from being something good in DS1 to basically turning into the absolute world ender in ds3
>>335448214
It can't be though, humanity has always been linked to the first flame. Humanity is the Dark Soul, and the Dark Soul is another Lord Soul. While it's the antithesis of the other Lord Souls, it's still a product of Fire. It's why the Age of Dark, the Age of Humanity, is still part of the cycle, and will eventually see the Age of Fire reborn (just as the Age of Fire will eventually fade into the Age of Dark).
>>335448364
I just wanna know how the fuck Havel's armor keeps getting around.
>>335448360
Technically he was optional, so the "canon" story may be that the Chosen Undead never killed him.
>>335448304
Prince Lorian fought a war against the demons, though all the carnage could be from that or even further back. I think the gru are just squatters and tangentially related to the demons in some way.
All the 'real' demons are in poor shape in the game.
>>335448430
You're fucking retarded.
>>335448403
It's all the same world, but Lothric is weird because time and space converges on it. The lands of the Lords of Cinder are transcendental, and the High Wall of Lothric literally just appeared at some point.
>>335448454
>Dark Souls 1 abyss
>Good
u wot?
>>335448328
Gwyn is dead retard. She speaks of Gwyn as her father because her Uncle Adopted her niece as his sister because sister complex.
>>335448159
Firstborn is Nameless.
Solaire was never anything more than a man.
Gwyn's Wife is a totally unknown character who may or may not have actually existed.
>>335448221
At most you killed Smough if you believe the CU broke the illusion but didn't kill Gwyndolin. You definitely did not kill Ornstein.
>>335448304
>corpses that bleed
Don't they all have this? Isn't it just some kind of weird bug with the models? I doubt there's lore here.
>>335448338
>Aldia wants to find out how humanity can continue without the fire
>the Bearer gets the Crown
>they manage to stop the Hollowing's insanity and make it manual
>Drangleic as a kingdom is fallen
>the groundwork is laid for a Hollow King
Wait, does this mean that Londor could be the kingdom the Bearer created over Drangleic's ruins?
>>335448403
They are all completely separate locations.
>>335448454
>he didn't play the DLC
>>335448417
>they were only illusions
>they still pushed my shit in
Ornstein's fate is really ambiguous though. He seems to have a different ending in each of the three games.
>gets killed by the Chosen/Smough
>that was only an illusion, he survives, ventures off to find Gwynavere and gets fucked up by the abyss somehow, then gets finally killed by the Bearer of the Curse
>that didn't happen, he actually went off to find the Nameless King and somehow died off-camera
Which one?
>>335447921
Okay, it's not the exact same, but the main point is that you're doing what Kaathe presumably wants, and I don't think that's ever a good idea unless you're into being ambiguously evil, too.
>>335448495
People keep finding it and want to prolong the legend.
It's 2tuff to be destroyed and it won't rust.
>>335448454
>something good in DS1
It was never good. It was ambiguous in 1 because both serpents were lying to you, but look at all the evil shit it did to Oolacile, and then Manus and the queens from 2 obviously weren't cuddly fluffy bunnies just looking to spread fucking sunshine and rainbows.
>>335448495
I wanna know who the fuck put Havels armor in the Swamp after I left.
>>335448542
I don't understand.
>>335448495
Given that there was a slight chance the Havel in 1 wasn't the Rock, I think the one hanging over a dragon corpse in 3 can be assumed to be the true Dwayne.
>>335448529
The descriptions of gru weapons say they are "descendants of the acolytes of Farron Keep"
So how did you get ornsteins soul in DS1
>>335448495
Havel has followers, by the description of Havel's Ring. It's implied Havel, despite fighting against the dragons at one point, both admires and emulates them.
>>335447786
The first sin seems to be Gwyn linking the first flame, and doing so by linking it to humanity. Aldia managed to rip himself from the cycle, which is implied when you fight him in DS2. He doesn't drop any souls or his own soul, and he continues speaking with you after he "dies".
>>335447801
>great lives under gwyn
To quote Aldia: "Once, the Lord of Light banished Dark, and all that stemmed from humanity. And men assumed a fleeting form. These are the roots of our world. Men are props on the stage of life, and no matter how tender, how exquisite... A lie will remain a lie."
Dark is the true form of humans. Remember those humanities chilling in the Chasm of the Abyss? Or even those humanity like things in Irithyll? The flame forced these humanities to assume a fleeting form, hence it fucked with the very nature of humans. Now flame isn't all bad. It's warmth, ambition, love, but dark is peace and unity. It's all very buddhist, which is not unreasonable for a japanese game.
>>335448216
i want to comfort gwyndolin
>>335448587
>Wait, does this mean that Londor could be the kingdom the Bearer created over Drangleic's ruins?
No. The Bearer of the Curse is just that. After uniting the four crowns and becoming the true Monarch, he bears the Curse of all the undead so they don't go hollow anymore. Him ruling a kingdom of Hollows makes no sense when people have to go out of their way to create an artificial Darksign to go hollow.
>>335448610
Wait, Havel's armor is in the swamp? Fuck I've trudged all over that place several times while looking for the pyromancer merchant, but I never found that armor.
>>335446705
I think it's the other way around, she's probably Priscilla's mother.
>>335448417
>>335448359
>>335448361
>>335448587
Well that sure takes away a lot of the meaning from the fight, all for the sake of appealing for MUH NOSTALGIA.
>>335448631
He surely wasnt. He dropped havels ring, which is only for his followers(, since he had ultra giga nigger strength, i guess.)
>>335448586
Yes, Gwyn is dead. Priscilla could have been pregnant before we killed Gwyn, even before he went and linked the flame the first time.
Are sorcerers good for pvp? Any tips on making a good build?
>>335448631
Or that could just be the Summon of a dead necromancer, possibly flattened by the wyvren.
It makes me think that because you find Havels armor far off in Farron keep, not on the body of the Havel you just killed
>>335448587
Ok, I get the separate locations, but what about all the same bosses?
Wolf - Wolf - dunno what
Hammer/Spear duo
Etc. They basically recycle the same bosses, that's why I had a hindu reincarnation thought.
>>335448545
OK, thanks.
>>335448730
Kill the Havel undead in the Archdragon Peak, then go to the wolf bonfire in Farron Keep and take the elevator up. It's right where the Stray Demon was if you already killed it.
>>335447765
There's a message on the ground that clearly state that to walk the path of the dragon, you have to not ring the bell, if I remember right
>>335448653
Maybe he left it behind in Anor Londo.
Maybe it was just a big soul used as the core for Gwyndolyns illusion.
>>335448495
Even Havel in 1 was just one of his saints.
>>335448606
>talking shit about Alsanna
Fuck you?
>>335448673
Fuck that, only an idiot would rather be mindless goo than a human.
>Muh true form
Fuck that shit
>>335448730
After you kill Havel in Arxhdragon peak, its where you fought the Stray demon
>>335448730
It's not. It's in the same place you find the Stray Demon on the broken bridge. It's there after you kill Havel in Archdragon Peak.
>>335448752
Yeah you're right. I'm dumb.
>Jesus Christ at the amount of dragons they dentisted the fuck out of.
>>335448787
Good old Jimmy.
>>335448589
Pretty sure he's an illusion in 1, in 2 heide is founded by gwynevere and the blue man group put a guy in ornstein armor. People were theorizing both of those things long before 3 even released.
I really doubt dks2 ornstein is the real deal. He's shit tier.
>>335448787
I've had good results using the greatsword and flashsword spells, nothing else works out for me though.
What was up with Archdragon Peak? Why were there apparitions of Havel and Ricard, as well as that other guy I didn't recognize?
>>335448907
Kek
>>335448787
No they aren't. Magic in general is shit for PVP.
>>335448264
>What was the lie that Aldia mentioned in 2?
Mankind's transitory nature, and the fact that they're originally hollows. He questions both Linking of the Fire, but also not linking it in his dialogue.
Undead Crypt:
>Once, the Lord of Light banished Dark, and all that stemmed from humanity. And men assumed a fleeting form. These are the roots of our world. Men are props on the stage of life, and no matter how tender, how exquisite… A lie will remain a lie. Young Hollow, knowing this, do you still desire peace?
>*player can answer Yes or No*
Dragon Shrine:
>Peace grants men the illusion of life. Shackled by falsehoods, they yearn for love, unaware of its grand illusion. Until, the curse touches their flesh. We are bound by this yoke. As true as the Dark that churns within men. All men trust fully the illusion of life. But is this so wrong? A construction, a facade, and yet… A world full of warmth and resplendence. Young Hollow, are you intent on shattering the yoke, spoiling this wonderful falsehood?
>*player can answer Yes or No*
>>335447927
If gwyn wasnt hollow why does he attack you without even speaking to you first?
>>335448982
They all went to find Gwyn's firstborn or follow the path of the dragon.
>>335448875
I think it's more Nirvana, understanding and unity with the whole world than being a mindless goo. This whole situation reminds me of Arcanum, and it's final boss. If you ever want to play that game then skip the video, if not check this explanation out: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cMZi217RUUY
What's the lore behind being able to carry all those items in your inventory without being encumbered?
>>335448854
Aside from that one, it was obvious that the rest of Manus's virtues were garbage and downright harmful.
>>335442745
>Souls lore thread
>No mention that OP is Vaati asking for content for his new videos
You guy have disappointed me.
>>335449037
Game mechanics.
>>335449032
He's old and VERY crispy, not in the mood to chat.
>>335449069
Karla isn't half bad either, quite useful actually. Have to wonder why Alva was searching for her though.
>>335449032
He told his knights to not let get anyone close to the kiln
You got close
So you killed his pals
I'm so shit at figuring out this lore, please enlighten me, /v/ on these matter:
- What exactly the implication of linking the fire? Why do all the lords refuse to cooperate in doing it besides Ludhels?
- What will happen to the world at usurpation of fire ending? I thought it is pretty similar to the alternative ending for the end of fire. Also, what's the implication of holding this power anyway?
You know what I really don't get is, if there was going to be one reoccurring character or thing outside of Patches in the Dark Souls games. I fully expected the Primordial serpents to be in all three, but no. Some reason they're no where to have been seen in Dark Souls 2 and Kaathe only mentioned in 3. Since they pushed the cycles bit, you'd expect to see something that exists outside the cycles and the most likely candidate for something like that would have been the serpents. Just something odd I never got about the trilogy because how prominent the two were in the first game.
>>335447927
Gwyn was ded at that point. Gwyn was exactly like Soul of Cinder, haggered, burnt and had no eyes.
Hense Gwyn you fight was just a manifestation of the flame itself.
In DSIII Soul of Cinder is chosen undead and Gwyn, the two that actually linked the flame.
>>335449037
the lore is that they remembered how obnoxious inventory encumbrance was in demon's souls and how it added nothing to the game but annoyance
>>335449161
Karla was a shard of Manus? Sauce me nigga.
A lie will remain a lie
>>335448710
>artificial
The Sigil is latent within all Undead if Yoel is to be believed. If the Bearer found a way to use the Darksign as a source of power rather than a source of retardation, then it's entirely possible that he built a kingdom based off of that.
>>335448875
Better temporary mindless goo than permanent rotten corpse driven insane by your inability to stop suffering.
>>335449032
Just pretty burned up and ready to die.
>>335449097
Let's have a nice comfy lorefag thread without that autist being brought up, pretty please?
>>335449032
Hes probably not hollow in the way humans do, but he probably went mad all alone in the Kiln. And he's definitely not gonna let anyone walk in and fuck with the flame he sacrificed so much for, so he attacks. No questions asked.
>>335446525
obviously seathe and velka's babby
>>335449097
I bet you are Vaati, trying to force the meme that Vaati steals all the lore theories from chinese cartoon forums, so people look you up and give you views. Can't trick me, Vaati.
>>335449217
http://darksouls3.wiki.fextralife.com/Karla's+Ashes
She also talks about how she is a child of the Abyss.
>>335443865
yes, that's why you're not allowed to just go fuck off and become the darklord without killing him first
>>335449172
Because they all had other motives.
Aldrich worshipped the Abyss.
Yhrom wanted to put out the profaned flame
Abyss Watchers were infected with the curse
Lothric and Lorian wanted to bring upon the age of dark
They all hated Fire (except the Abyss Watchers)
Why the fuck were the abyss watchers fighting each other?
>>335449035
Did Ricard have to be naked for this?
>>335449103
>>335449197
that's pretty lazy
they could've given you a bottomless bag or something
>>335447939
>xe
You did that on purpose, right?
H is nowhere near X
wtf exactrly is manus
>>335449331
>Individually too weak to link the flame
>Have big battle royal
>Last man standing has the Souls of the entire Legion and uses that as a source of strength ti Link the flame
>>335449331
Man how dumb you gotta be
Their clothes are covered in black goo and some of their eyes are red, what do you think?
>>335447334
berserk reference
Was Irithyll built around Anor Londo, or was it Anor londo itself, just with a different name while under Gwyndolin's rule?
>>335449161
Karla was Alva's qt witch girl companion mentioned in dark souls 2. he's looking for his waifu
>>335449331
They're undying and their numbers were corrupted by the Abyss. They kill the Abyss wherever it spreads, meaning their own.
tfw the dragons will never come back to make more qt half dragon girls
>>335449172
>Why do all the lords refuse to cooperate in doing it besides Ludhels?
because they don't fucking wanna be burned alive?
also aldrich is like pure evil and the abyss watchers are cursed and crazy.
>>335449428
Different witch.
Karla is an actual child of the Abyss.
>>335445519
This.
Also, i like how the ending of fire ending is analogous to the souls series 'ending', with a possibility of a resurrection in the future.
>>335449503
Ocelotte was a half dragon.
Why are the Dark Wraiths right outside the Legion's door? I always pegged them for the kind that attacks civilians over straight up attacking their enemies.
>>335449172
Linking the Fire prolongs the Age of Fire and stagnates, but does not reverse, the progress of the Abyss in consuming the world. It's too late to effectively link it in 3 because there isn't too much left to keep from being consumed. The only real option is to rule over the Abyss with the power of Dark and Flame. And the Lords were Hollowed, except for Lothric who was just a bitch. Also >>335449316
The power of Dark and Flame gained by Usurpation allows you to destroy the cycles the world has been in since the first game, end the Darksign (a product of the Age of Fire dragging on), reclaim the Abyss, and generally allow the world to move on from being permanently stuck in the Medieval Ages.
>>335449424
Irithyll and Anor Londo are completely unrelated and are only near each other because of the Flame fucking with geography.
>>335445884
it's just a past version of firelink shrine during one of the ages of dark, so it wasn't needed
>>335449424
Irithyll is mostly that lower part of Anor Londo you see in DS1 but never go to. The huge fucking wall around Anor Londo broke because of transcendental land.
Why does the soul of cinder try to hinder you in linking the first fire?
Didn't they do it in the past themselves as well?
>>335444875
But aren't there two statues of the serpents?
>>335448748
>its a hologram
stellar move
>>335449716
Test of strength id Assume.
>>335449565
Not confirmed.
Ocerios was only that way because he did profane experiments with dragon shit.
Prince Lothric is also implied to be unnaturally born, the process of which the Elder Prince willfully crippled himself to enact.
>>335449716
Test of strength? It's afraid? Final boss needed?
>>335449716
the soul of cinder is a mindless amalgam of the power of those who linked the flame, it doesn't have higher intelligence, it just tries to kill anything that goes near the flame
>>335449716
It's either a test of your soul, or it doesn't want you possibly ushering in the age of dark.
It makes a lot less sense than when Gwyn did it.
>>335449590
Irithyll architecture has a lot in common with anor londo though, not to mention how the pontiff knights' attire seems heavily influenced by gwyndolin's. And the fact the city is in a perpetual night.
>>335449716
It's a manifestation of the First Flame to protect itself. At that point you could still let the fire die or usurp it rather than link it.
>>335447187
>how many children does Gwyn have?
well considering he's made to be similar to zeus who's famous for sticking his dick in anything resembling a vagina, probably a fuckton
>>335448359
>>335448361
Grotesque armor associated with Smough, the last knight to stand in defense of the ruined cathedral.
Boasts extremely high defense and can be donned by humans, but not without great difficulty.
Both of them were illusions, Gywndolin is really fucking strong, and if Gywn was an illusion who's to say that even if you killed him that wasn't an illusion as well, maybe keeping up the illusions made him "ill" and unable to defend himself in III. Once aldrich was coming Smough came back but Ornstein was on his master quest and Smough died because his bro wasn't there to back him up. Sad as shit.
from O&S armor description in 3 I've kinda come to this theory about dark souls 1.
>Chosen makes it to the cathedral
>the fight was a trial to see who is worth of the lordsvessel
>chosen obvs win the fight, killing smough but no ornstein
>ornstein allows chosen to go to boobs and ornstein leaves
>essentially making fatboy "the last to guard the cathedral" like in his armor descp.
>orn leaves in search of nameless king which time passes etc. find and dies to him.
>Chosen proceeds to take lordvessel then slay Gwynevere's illusion darkening anor londo
>trap gets pissy but chosen never goes to slay him
>anor now in darken state has no light causing it to fall under very cold temperatures
>becomes the boreal valley then irithyll
this is just my shitty head canon.
half the fun of dark souls is figuring the lore and making your own twist on the story.
Honestly the worst thing about 3 is that there are too many open mysteries such that the DLC would have to be entirely about them. Oceiros obviously has some great lore, as well as the Princes, yet all we know is what comes out of that one fight. Not to mention Gwyn's family or how we never directly interact with the Abyss or find out where the tree bird zombies are going.
>>335449424
Irithyll was built around Anor Londo, with only the centre being preserved over time.
>>335449716
Same reason Gwyn tried to kill you.
1) you could conceivably be threatening the first fire
2) it's what's currently burning to keep the fire linked. In order to link the flame it needs destroying first
Is Andre some kind of deity? I mean eons have passed since Dark Souls 1 and he looks exactly the same.
What does ringing the bell at archdragon peak imply?
Why does that make nameless king upset and want to kill you?
>>335449748
My favourite part is that it took him 18 hours to come up with it.
>>335449987
It's pretty obvious what happened. Ornstein was an illusion, Smough wasn't. SMough dies to CU while Ornstein fucks off to Drangleic, presumably isn't killed by the Bearer of the Curse, and dies in Archdragon Peak looking for Nameless King.
How did gwyn link the fire twice
>>335449987
Grotesque armor associated with Smough, the last knight to stand in defense of the ruined cathedral.
Boasts extremely high defense and can be donned by humans, but not without great difficulty.
That's smough's armor description, both O/S were an illusion by Gywndolin to test you, who was commanding the serpents to both lie to you because whatever choice you picked he won.
>>335449987
It would make more sense that Ornstein was an illusion but Smough wasn't. Would explain why Smough was so pissed off with him in his animation where he absorbs Ornstein's power (apart from him just being a massive sociopath). I doubt Gwyndolin would want to force the long term company of Smough of anyone, let alone one of the most prestigious and loyal knights of his father.
>>335450090
Time shenanigans. For all you know you could be an Unkindled from the very first cycle.
Shit, you could be that first hollow soldier by Firelink.
>>335450167
>gwyndolin
>winning when you pick the choice that fucks over gods
?????
>>335450159
He didn't.
>>335442745
A primordial serpent.
To elaborate, he is a serpent that is primordial.
>>335450159
He didn't, the lord of cinder in III was basically the amalgamations of all of us who have linked the fire since the souls game have parallel universe/dimensions that run alongside eachother.
What is an Unkindled exactly?
>Dark Souls 3 final boss is the amalgamation of everyone who linked the flame
>None of it's armor set is recognizable as anything previously in the series
>they didn't think to just make it a burnt together mashup of the most iconic armor sets
>>335449987
I really like how this game leaves enough holes to where I can have my own head canon (which you would probably hate) and you have yours (which I do hate).
>>335449763
He literally says it was a Child born of dragons, and didnt go to the achrives until after the mother and ocelotte disappeared.
>>335450230
He thought that he wins at the end, because kaathe was lying to him that they would still serve him as gods, basically DS1 kaathe and seathe were playing everyone, really wish they were or will be in III.
>>335450291
Failed Chosen Undead.
>>335449172
>What exactly the implication of linking the fire?
A new Age of Fire begins. Humans and lords will have another age of prosperity, will build great cities upon the ruins of the old ones until the fire starts going out again and everything repeats itself.
>Why do all the lords refuse to cooperate in doing it besides Ludhels?
First of all, it kills them off again until they get resurrected for the next linking. Doing suicide for the common good is kind of a shitty deal and they are all dicks in the first place. Also what the other anon said.
>What will happen to the world at usurpation of fire ending?
An Age of Dark will happen. Basically the world will go back to Age of Ancients, everyone is kind of immortal because Life and Death rely on the First Flame to function properly. Everything will stagnate because there is no real change if everything stays the same all the time. Humans become god-like immortals, but they will go mad over time because they aren't made for that kind of existence.
The only difference between letting the flame go out on it's own and you taking it for yourself is that you will rule over humanity as it's last real god until your power fades. The outcome is basically the same for humanity as a whole. You just get a better deal out of it.
>>335450296
But it is anon. It's the EK set burned and twisted over the years.
>>335450296
It's literally a burned up version of the Elite Knight set. I recognised it straight away from the shoulderguard.
I'm curious which bastard wore this armour originally. The Dragonslayer was clearly a dude who engaged in the arch dragon hunts that ended the Age of Ancients, but I'm not sure that its the Nameless King or Ornstein, despite both of them being refereed to as Dragonslayers.
The reason for this is the description of Sacred Oath, which says:
>Miracle of those chosen by the Sunlight covenant.
>Temporarily boosts attack and damage absorbtion for self and those in vicinity.
>This is the tale of the Sun's firstborn, his faithful first knight, and the brave dragonslayer who served them both.
The key bit is the last section. The Sun's firstborn is Gwyn's firstborn, the Nameless King. We can assume this thanks to the DS1's Ring of the Sun's Firstborn, which states
>Lord Gwyn's firstborn, who inherited the
sunlight, once wore this ancient ring.
>Lord Gwyn's firstborn was a god of war,
but his foolishness led to a loss of the
annals, and rescinding of his deific status.
>Today, even his name is not known.
and that the Nameless King's Soul mentions him
>The Nameless King was once a dragon-slaying god of war
there's way more in the way of Nameless King and Gwyn's first born connection, but there's no need to quote them all
So the story of Sacred Oath is the story of Gwyn's Firstborn, his first Knight and the Dragonslayer who served them both
now, DS3's Leo Ring has an interesting description
>Ring associated with Dragon Slayer Ornstein, one of the Four Knights of Gwyn, the First Lord.
Strengthens thrust weapon counter attacks.
>Ornstein was the first knight of the sun's eldest born, and his cross spear is said to have pierced scales made of stone.
Ornstein was the first knight of the sun's eldest born, ie the Nameless King. So two figures in the Sacred Oath miracle are accounted for, the Sun's Firstborn (Gwyn's child/Nameless King) and his First Knight (Ornstein), so who the fuck is the brave Dragonslayer that served them both?
>>335450156
could be like that, in Ornsteins travels he gets corrupted by the abyss like Artorias, either he becomes mindless and bearer "cures it" or it's just an out of place side boss because b team was lazy.
>>335448159
>mfw retards still thinking gwyn only fucked one other person
how many zeus parallels need to be shoved down your throats for this to sink in
>>335450327
I think I heard this from one of famous writers.
He mentioned that the story is his story until it is read by the readers. Then it become the readers' story.
>>335450426
No, the dragon armor in 2 is a fake, it isn't pure gold and he's a pussy, either it's an animated armor set, or a fanboy. Or one of the last remnants of the dragon knights. Probably animated.
>>335448214
Has no one here played the fucking games?
The first sin was Gwyn fucking with the cycle of nature and FORCIBLY prolonging the era of fire. Nature's response was turning humans undead in an effort to get them to fix that shit.
The real question is where the fuck is Ornstein's plume?
>>335450409
Possibly Ornstein being the Captain of 4 knights also had his little legion of dragonslayers and that fag was the best one.
>Link the fire
>Nothing happens
>No giant eruption
>Fire doesn't swirl around you
>NADA
Guys, I think the first flame is fucked.
>>335450159
What? Gwyn was the one who constructed the Kiln of the First Flame. He linked it and burned until the CU granted him death.
>>335450291
You set out to link the flame in your time, failed, and went Hollow or met semi-permanent death. You're a colossal fucking loser and the Flame is only calling you because every other possibility is exhausted.
>>335450393
>Age of Dark is the same as taking control of the Dark
Fuck off Kaathe. The Age of Dark is letting the world die for a while. The Usurpation is ending the cycle permanently and letting the world become an actual world that will eventually be able to advance beyond swords and metal armor being universal.
>>335450409
Dragonslayer ARMOUR. Armour. There is nobody inside it, it is a construct, like the Iron Golem.
>>335450393
>An Age of Dark will happen. Basically the world will go back to Age of Ancients, everyone is kind of immortal because Life and Death rely on the First Flame to function properly. Everything will stagnate because there is no real change if everything stays the same all the time. Humans become god-like immortals, but they will go mad over time because they aren't made for that kind of existence.
Is this an Evangelion reference?
How the fuck does a human sorcerer manage to imprison a god? I mean I understand Aldrich being able to kill Gwyndolin, since lords of cinder are usually OP as fuck. But Sulyvahn?
>>335450409
His first knight and the dragonslayer are referring to one person.
>>335450593
>Kaathe false flagging
The Usurpation is Kaathe's goal in DS3.
>>335450595
the Boss Soul of the armour mentions
>Use to acquire many souls, or transpose to extract its true strength.
>The Dragonslayer Armour, controlled by the Pilgrim Butterfly, lost its master long ago, but still remembers their sporting hunts.
the boss is like the Golem, but once it was worn by a Dragonslayer, who I'm fairly certain is neither Gwyn's firstborn nor Ornstein. I'd love to know who that nigga was.
>>335450593
>The Usurpation is ending the cycle permanently and letting the world become an actual world that will eventually be able to advance beyond swords and metal armor being universal.
So usurpation will make the world turn into a modern age era?
Where did you pull this out from?
>>335450593
>The Usurpation is ending the cycle permanently and letting the world become an actual world that will eventually be able to advance beyond swords and metal armor being universal.
Where do you have that idea from? Did you just make that up?
>>335450713
Probably the real Havel.
I really enjoyed the fight against Soul of Cinder, considering it's the most challenging final boss From ever made, but I was kind of disappointed there wasn't a third phase. I was half-hoping for the game to scan for DS1 saves and generate a boss based on a character you made that has finished the game, as wishful as that is.
>>335450667
The concept of God is not something that you would find in today's religion.
With enough worshipers and words of mouth, you can become a God, in name anyway.
>>335450762
>dragonslayer armour is a mix of Ornstein's and Havel's
Huh. I didn't notice that.
>>335450678
it's says the Dragonslayer served them both. In the context of this sentence, it means he served both the First Knight and the Sun's Firstborn. He thus can't be the first knight.
>>335450762
Havel served Gwyn directly, he was always referred to as Gwyn's bro.
>>335450790
Miyazaki should pull another old monk mechanic.
That shit was brilliant.
>>335450667
He didn't have any homeward bones.
>>335450564
They weren't kidding when they were saying Unkindled were worthless. They're said to be even less than Hollows. Despite having inherited the flames of the Lords of Cinder, you're still not good enough.
DaS3 firekeeper was the most qt, matched only by the Maiden in Black.
>>335450840
>>The Dragonslayer Armour, controlled by the Pilgrim Butterfly, lost its master long ago, but still remembers their sporting hunts.
Sounds pretty brotastic to me.
>>335450871
>Not Maria-chan
>>335450593
>The Usurpation is ending the cycle permanently and letting the world become an actual world that will eventually be able to advance beyond swords and metal armor being universal.
>tfw no cyberpunk futuristic dark souls
>>335450667
Same way a Chosen Undead can kill one. The Gods aren't all powerful and can be captured and killed.
>>335449331
>sworn to stop the abyss wherever it spreads, in the name of their dead leader Artorias
>every single one of them is infected by the abyss (except hawkwood who fucks off from their group) after years of fighting it, and are undead, so they keep coming back only to be killed by eachother
it's a fucking gnarly end
>>335450790
are you me? back when dark souls 2 was coming out I had that same thought
little did we know we wouldn't be getting anything remotely close to it.
>>335450943
Chosen Undead have the power of plot plus a fuckton of souls stuffed up their ass though.
>>335450564
>>Link the fire
What the fuck did you expect to happen? You're on the last patch of land that hasn't become part of the Abyss, and the series has always been adamant that linking the fire does NOT cause the Abyss to vanish or recede.
>>335450715
>>335450740
It's not going to just grant instant boons of technology, of course. But without the Curse causing civilizations to decay from mass Hollowing or just violence within a span of a few hundred years or so, you'll be able to have things like philosophy and science not based in magic develop. Drangleic, Lordran, and Lothric were all great civilizations that fell to the curse. The curse is caused by the age of Fire. Once the Age of Fire is gone, the curse goes with it. So everyone isn't fucking losing their shit constantly.
>>335451006
All undead are chosen. "Thou who art undead art chosen". The vast majority fail.
What are the time lines of the games? Would the story and lore make more sense if you move them around independent of release date?
>>335450493
No, its probably Ornstien. Side bosses are not Canon kills.
>>335451006
The point about Gods still stands. They were only Gods because they have Gwyn's power to back them up.
What in the fuck is the Pilgrim Butterfly?
>>335449331
Anyone talking about the abyss is just making up fanfiction.
They were going hollow. The blood of the wolf keeps them hanging on, but they're all automatons now destined to fight everything around them until they meet a worthy challenger.
>>335451069
Time does not flow normally or consistently in Lordran.
>>335451069
No, the timeline goes by release.
>>335451103
The pilgrims on the bridge are cocoons. That's what they look like when they hatch.
>>335450667
Gwyndolins power comes from the fire.
With the fire burning low, Gwyndolin fell ill. Thats how Pontiff was able to beat him.
>>335451142
Well holy shit, why are Pilgrims turning into fucking butterflies that look like flying Beds of Chaos?
>>335451116
There are traces of the abyss all over their armor and capes.
>>335450156
Well, you say that he dies.
I thought it was interesting that you find the Dragonslayer set just on the floor, rather than on a corpse. That suggests to me that he took it off and left for... somewhere.
>>335451078
What is probably ornstein? In dark souls 1? No because it's said he left, and considering we find his armor near the nameless king which says that he went out to look for we can only assume that in Dark Souls 2 it isn't ornstein. Simple.
>>335451142
The neck guys like Yoel? Those guys are pilgrims who come to Lothric so they can die, since the Fire is the only way to die.
The things you're thinking of come from the Hollow trees on the High Wall.
>>335451123
>>335451141
So which is it? Is it possible different parts of each game happen during parts of others? Like a fucked up puzzle since time flows inconsistently. Also, are demon souls and Bloodborne part of the DaS timeline?
>>335451123
Have we ever gotten an example in the lore of this, or was it a throw away line to integrate multiplayer?
I don't really count Oolacile, that seems more Manus himself fucking about with time.
>>335446224
>the Chosen Undead burned himself and let it continue
So ending 1 is canon?
>>335451229
My theory is
>>335443635
>>335451253
I mean, the butterflies are literally called Pilgrim Butterflies.
>>335450564
no shit, linking the flame this time around is pointless, it's probably going to still poofout of existence 5 minutes after the credits roll
Just how for long has the flame been fading in DaS3?
I mean lothric is supposed to be the world's current major capital and it was already in a pretty shitty state by the time the unkindled got there.
>>335451212
In Undead Settlement there are Hollow corpses turning into trees which look similar.
>Pilgrim Butterflies are spores created from Hollow
>They settle and become archtrees
Everything is returning to its original state before Gwyn found the Flame.
>>335451265
Probably.
But it might be possible that CU went dark lord, only for some other guy to show up and link the flame anyway.
>>335451236
How can we assume the Dragonslayer in 2 isnt Ornstien. 2 is the bridge between 1 and 3. It doesnt take place at the same time as either, and Old dragonslayer isnt a must kill. You dont even ever have to go to Heides tower.
>>335450790
I squeeled like a little girl when the Soul of Cinder did the Dark Wood Grain Ring backflip from Dark Souls 1 at one point, it's been years since I've seen that flip animation
Reminder that SOTFS is a non-canon spinoff and the ultimate casual detector
>>335451258
Timeline is fucked in Dark Souls yes, but events fall chronologically by the release of each game. Dark Souls 1 is the immediate first cycle after Gwyn, Dark Souls 2 is long after than in a land apart, Dark Souls 3 is even longer after than in an almost post-apocalyptic world where the flame has been linked so much it takes five fuckers to do it now, not just one.
Demon's Souls and Bloodborne are not part of the Dark Souls continuity. Any allusions to them are easter eggs.
Why the fuck did one of the Pilgrim Butterflies control the Dragonslayer Armour though? What were their purpose in trying to stop the UO?
>>335451259
>the best exampleis in the gameplay. Other npc's we meet seem to have their own versions of your world where they are the main charactes
>>335451432
Except DaS3 makes direct references to Aldia, the Emerald Herald and the Bearer of the Curse.
>>335451265
Absolutely.
>>335451258
No, lad. DS1 happens. Then 2, many hundreds or thousands of years later. Then 3, likely a shorter time later but still a really fucking long time. Timeline is up here. >>335445135
>>335451309
Perhaps because they are making a mass pilgrimage into the sky or regions unknown? Take a look around once you get to Lothric after beating all the Lords.
>>335451432
Scholar is the only way 3 makes any sense at all.
>>335451381
Because ornstien is a badass and old dragonslayer isnt
>>335451265
which ending the CU chose didn't fucking matter, as is evident in dark souls 2, since its all a cycle. if cu chose ending 1, someone along the line would've chosen 2, if cu chose 2, someone wouldve come along and chose 1 again
>>335451491
Solid reasoning...
>>335451479
Where is Aldia or the others referenced? I know Vendrick is referenced but don't remember seeing the others.
>>335451265
>>335451379
You clear the way for anyone to link the flame so either ending can be 'canon'
You were a pretty shit Dark Lord though since you let someone link it anyway
Reminder that Solaire is a loser that never did anything
>>335451486
Alright. Thanks for clarifying the time line.
>>335450515
No you ass. People were going hollow EVEN before Gwyn linked the flame. It's something that happens whenever the light starts to fade.
>>335451468
Why did any boss try to stop us?
>>335451381
Because the armor and the intensity of the fight isn't how Ornstein is. The armor is a complete different shade of color and why would he even be there dude? Why is ornstein there when the Nameless king is in lothric. Makes no sense.
Irithyll and The archdrake peak were one of the comfiest areas in the series.
>>335451550
Nigger when someone chooses 2, that brings about the Age of Dark. The Darksign exists only because the Age of Dark was NOT brought about.
>>335451597
He supposedly linked his own flame.
>>335451616
>even before Gwyn linked the Flame
Gwyn linking the Flame started the fucking Age of Fire. This happened not very long after the dragon war. He did not actually rule Anor Londo for very long.
>>335450515
The Hollow state of being are the They that came from the dark and found the initial Lord Souls. It's the natural state of Humans, Gods, Giants, Witches, anything that wasn't a Dragon or a Serpent in the Age of Ancients.
>>335451552
Ornstien should be at least as powerful as artorias. Old dragonslayer is one of the weaker bosses. Just b team reusing assets
>>335451639
Noone knew where the Nameless King was.....thats why Ornstiens set says he went out to FIND the Nameless King.
>>335451474
>everyone who plays the game has their own little world where things converge and diverge between players to the point where someone can kill gods in their own world can do it again countless times in the worlds of others
>every world is as real and true as the next
I think I'm diving a bit deep in my brain here.
>>335451751
The Age of Fire is whenever there is fire. He didn't create the fire or the AoF. He prolonged it.
>>335451787
>I think I'm diving a bit deep in my brain here.
Not really. Miyazaki confirmed that if you saved Solaire via the Chaos Covanent shortcut that he would go on to defeat Gwyn and link the fire in his world.
Why are the pontiff knights so lanky?
>>335451571
Can you imagine how embarresed Kaathe would be.
>plot for a thousand years against the flame
>find a powerful human who agrees to bring the age of dark
>defeats Gwyn and you hail him as the dark lord
>some dude sneaks into the kiln and links the fire when you're not looking
>>335442745
take my survey senpai
http://fullerton.qualtrics.com//SE/?SID=SV_6EgjZmbmaqnnLEh
>>335443168
>IT MEANS YOU WERE A MASSIVE FUCKUP IN YOUR ORIGINAL UNDEATH AND FAILED TO LINK THE FLAME.
Wait, do we really know that for sure? I thought Unkindled were the jobbers who died for real (AKA didn't get branded by the Dark Sign) and were revived by the bell of awakening.
Where did the first flame come from?
>>335451787
Here is a slightly related phenomenon.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quantum_suicide_and_immortality
>>335451920
>it wasnt even a proper age of dark anyway
>>335451780
Except that still doesn't make sense because the trek to go to dranleic would be the last place you would check because you knew that Gywn's firstborn was hanging out with dragons and the easiest place to deduce would be archdragon peak in lothric. Why THE FUCK, would he go to Drangleic to find the Nameless King, again it makes no fucking sense.
>>335451751
>that brings about the Age of Dark
It's supposed to but it's possible someone else linked it, note that this is lame as fuck though so might as well just go with link the fire
>>335450667
Gods were basically just dudes with parts of Gwyn's Lord Soul or holders of Lord Souls of their own. Gwyn made a lot of people gods by sharing parts of his Lord Soul.
What kind of powers you can share depends on your Lord Soul. Gwyn had powers over Light, so he could give people powers over forms of Light like sunlight, moonlight, etc. The other Lord souls had different powers like Nito had power over Death and the Witch had power over fire. All demons share parts of her Lord Soul.
The fourth Lord Soul was the Dark Soul, which got split among all of humanity. Which is why default humans start out rather weak when they are born compared to gods who hold bigger parts of Lord Souls.
>>335451779
Aldrich literally ate gods and Is beaten rather easily.
Difficulty is relative.
No Im not saying ODS was hard for me, im saying you cant say "Ornstien was tough this guys simple" since Ornstien wasnt even that tough. If you fought ornstien alone he would be a rather weak fight
And Artorias was even easier than ODS.
>>335451953
The methane from all the dragons shitting in one place eventually ignited.
>>335451953
one of the dragons fell asleep cooking french fries
>>335451979
Archdragon peak is a secret place you nimrod. He probably went to find THE DRAGONRIDERS that was Vendricks army. If anyone knew about some Dragonfucker god, youd assume it would be them
>>335447786
doesn't seem to be an agreed upon answer to these
Which waifu canonically has the best feet and why is itRosaria?
>tfw dark souls 2 was shit because there were no barefoot waifus
>>335451896
If Aldia exists outside the cycle now, I'd be interested to see him appear in a DLC again.
Is there anything on the caged "angel" up in the archives?
>>335451751
>Gwyn linking the Flame started the fucking Age of Fire. This happened not very long after the dragon war. He did not actually rule Anor Londo for very long.
Wrong. Age of Fire began after the defeat of the Dragons. Gwyn had enough time to build Anor Londo and a divine dynasty to rule over humans. The Witch of Izalith and her people made Izalith. Things were prosperous for a while, with the Dragon Hunting and shit. Some fucks in Oolacile messed with the Furtive Pygmy and made Manus and brought about the Abyss but that's about it. Then the First Flame started to die out, so the Witch of Izalith tries to use her Lord Soul to make a new flame, which made the Flame of Chaos, and so the Bed of Chaos. Gwyn fought these demons with a bunch of his knights who became the Black Knights from the chaos flames. After that Gwyn would link the First Flame, burning the Black Knights a second time, making them naught by spirits inhabiting charred armor.
>>335452095
You people should be put in camps
>>335452095
God I don't want to jerk off again tonight
>>335452118
What caged angel?
>>335452083
Except again that is fucking retarded considering that Ornsteins set is found in Archdragon peak and the "ornstein" you fight in 2 has different armor with completely different aesthetics. And the armor you find in III looks like his illusion in Dark Souls 1.
>>335452095
Go to bed Quentin Tarantino.
>>335451479
>Emerald Herald
Where was this?
>Firstborn walks in, tells his dad he wants to ride with dragons
>Gwyn spent countless years fighting dragons, ain't having that shit
>Firstborn insists, Gwyn puts his goddamn foot down
>Proceeds to have a divine father-son dick measuring contest so huge the firstborn is nearly completely erased from history
I bet that was a hell of a thing to see
>>335451751
>Nigger when someone chooses 2, that brings about the Age of Dark.
which, like the age of fire, is temporary, because the cinder from the first flame will start to burn into a bright flame again when enough time has passed
p l a y t h e g a m e s mate
>>335451953
No explanation, just popped up out of nowhere.
>>335451751
>Gwyn linking the Flame started the fucking Age of Fire.
The first Age of Fire begins with the Lords finding the First Flame and their Lord Souls. Fighting the dragons happened during the first Age of Fire.
>>335452193
I said angel but it's a big word. It's a corpse with feathers scattered around in a huge cage hanging from the ceiling of the archives
>>335452251
It's temporary but it results in the Abyss swamping everything.
The fact that you find shit from the first game in 2 means it didn't happen.
>>335452193
There's a cage with white feathers in it in the Archives. You can't reach it without fighting two golden angelic fat knights.
>>335452270
>>335452193
Maybe the sorcerers in the archives started unlocking humanities divine potential before the abyss came in and fucked everything, remember, they locked the archives off from the world when the darkness started coming.
>>335452267
Nothing just "pops up out of nowhere", what kind of explanation is that? There must be some creator or something.
>>335451758
>THIS MEME AGAIN
FUCK OFF KAATHE NO ONE IS FALLING FOR YOUR BULLSHIT ANYMORE
>>335452270
There's a miracle, Pillars of Light I think? The fat knights use it.
Goodnight, /v/irgins. I'm glad I finally got to experience one of the famed comfy lore threads.
>>335452386
Nigger look at the goddamn cinematic of the first game. What are those fucking things that come out of the darkness toward the First Flame? Sure look like fucking Hollows to me.
>>335452206
Are you literally retarded? Who cares if its found in Archdragon peak. Dark Souls 2 and Dark souls 3 dont take place at the same time. Considering DS1 Ornstien is an illusion, he is never canonically killed by the Player.
>Leaves Anor londo
>finds The dragonrider army
>They dont know anything
>Probably goes other places
>hears rumors of Archdragon peak
>goes there
>>335451953
Where did the Big Bang come from?
same idea
>>335449590
This makes sense considering the area you fight Soul of Cinders is all fucked up. Like kingdoms were stacked on top of each other, all pointing towards the flame
>>335452496
Which is completely fucking retarded because the armor looks completely and I mean completely fucking different from the one found in archdragon peak. God you're stupid.
>>335452372
If there is a creator, then the games don't tell you who it is.
Quote from the first game:
In the Age of Ancients the world was unformed, shrouded by fog. A land of gray crags, Archtrees and Everlasting Dragons. But then there was Fire and with fire came disparity. Heat and cold, life and death, and of course, light and dark. Then from the dark, They came, and found the Souls of Lords within the flame.
>>335448875
it's about balance you extremist fuck, hence the whole point of the cycle and not staying in one age too long.
>>335448991
pyromancy is OP if you freeaim, but it takes a lot of practice
This has been a pretty rad thread. Why can't all lore threads be this way and not devolving into LOL GUYS WHO HAS THE BEST FEET IN THE SERIES, like that one fuck up there earlier tried to do...I mean its obviously Gwyndolin...
>>335452726
The casting time is often too slow.
>>335450515
>>335451751
>The first sin was Gwyn fucking with the cycle of nature and FORCIBLY prolonging the era of fire. Nature's response was turning humans undead in an effort to get them to fix that shit.
>Gwyn linking the Flame started the fucking Age of Fire.
Rewatch DaS1's opening movie:
Archtrees and Everlasting Dragons > Fire poofs literally from nowhere > Fire creates concepts such as Life&Death, Light&Dark > Proto-Mankind (Hollows) is born from the Dark and finds the Lord Souls within the flame > Defeat of dragons and start of the Age of Fire > Later on Fire starts to fade and everything reverting back to how it was (including turning mankind back into hollows as they originally were) > Gwyn lights himself up to prolong the Age of Fire > Link of Fire cycle
Vendrick in DaS2 also talks about mankind's true form being hollows.
>One day fire will fade and dark will become a curse. Men will be free from death; left to wander eternally. Dark will again be ours and in our true shape... We can bury the false legends of yore. Only... is this our only choice?
So does Yuria in DaS3
>Thine heart is fix'd upon the linking of the fire. But brave usurper, I prithee, wrest the flame from its mantle. So that we Hollows, in most honest shape of man, may have it for our own.
Prolonging the Fire doesn't cause hollowing, the Fires fading turns people into mindless hollows because that's mankind's original form.
>>335452607
No it doesnt.
His armor in DS1 looks Gold.
His Armor in DS2 looks darker
And his armor in DS3 looks a mix of both
Its like a pale bronze.
>>335451920
There is nothing about that sentence I don't love.
>>335452779
Gwyndolin doesn't even have feet
I'm sure they'd be pale and perfect though
What SL is good to stop at? 100? 150?
>>335452872
People seem to be torn between 100 and 120
>>335452868
I consider his tentacles as feet, oh god what am I doing, literally turning into cancer the more I type, better to just stop
>>335452837
Pale bronze because of the elements making it that color from gold, not fucking Gold then gray then bronze you fucking tard.
>>335448221
Okay okay,
Hear me out
Alright hear me out.
Aldrich is the chosen undead
>>335452607
Only a fucking Autist cares about colour pallet in a game that takes place over thousands of years
Look at Artorias set vs Wolfknight set
Let me guess, not the same armor?
I dont even think Old dragonslayer and Ornstien are the same person but your arguement makes you sound autistic
>>335452956
those aren't tentacles they're fucking snakes
>>335452115
im pretty sure the dlc will explore das2 and have the sotfs ending as the canon ending for bearer of the curse
>>335452998
Hollly fuck, you basically just blew yourself the fuck out, you based your argument on that color pallete and now are say that it's dumb to argue about it because it's just a game? You are fucking retarded and thanks for agreeing with me.
>>335452970
>Grey
Are you colourblind or retarded? Old Dragonslayers armor is just dark gold.
>>335453091
What? What arguement? That fighting over colour makes you sound autistic? Im not even the anon youre arguing with
Jesus christ, no wonder everyone hates this board
>>335450090
All you need is a goal and souls to remain sane and well as a hollow. nigga's only goal is smithing, and everyone needs a smith.
Why does the Ashen one offer the Flame to the eclipse thing after you kill the Firekeeper for the secret second ending? is he giving it to the abyss? is he taking it for himself? (with that said it looks pretty badass how he kills the firekeeper, stomps her head and takes the flame)
>>335446127
The "order" you preserve when you link the flame is the current status quo, and the current status quo is absolute shit. Linking the Fire is not the moral choice, it's the fear of change choice. Yeah, letting the fire die is going to suck for a bit, maybe for a while, but it at least allows for progress and future prosperity.
Why'd Horace go spear-crazy on you? Why'dAnri ALSO go sword-crazy on you?
>>335453119
>dark gold
HAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH
>>335451265
>the Chosen Undead burned himself and let it continue
Chosen Undead was Oscar of Astora
You can tell, Soul of Cinder looks like EKS but burned up and blown out
>>335453264
They were hollow.
Same reason every other human who attacks you is crazy
>>335453276
why do you people do this? its the laziest shitposting ever
>>335453276
This poster is why everyone makes fun of /v/
Autism runs wild here.
>>335453362
because that desperate last attempt to prove that the armor looks like it could've been bright gold at that point and then bronzish gold in III is so fucking stupid it actually made me laugh out loud.
>cycles
How I wish this concept was retconned away.
>>335452372
>nothing just pops out of nowhere
again, it's like the big bang
People either believe that there was some great force behind it, or it was the one beginning event that didn't have a cause so that everything after it could finally have a cause
Is it really that far fetched that there could be several dragon-slayers from Anor Londo who wore the same kind of armour?
Or how about:
Time shenanigans made it so some dude took/found Ornsteins armour, wore it for long enough for the colour to get stained or something, and then was fought in DaS2. However in the world of the Unkindled Ornsteins armour ended up in Archdragon Peak instead.
>>335453416
Noone ever said it was Bright gold at that point.
That anon even says its dark gold. You even quoted those exact words in your shitpost.
>>335453306
Chosen Undead is just a myth used to trick foolish humans into burning themselves.
>>335453306
Protagonist always wears the posterboy armor.
Fluted armor was the poster armor of Demon's Souls but Ostrava clearly wasn't the hero.
>>335452372
Basically the point is that it doesn't matter where it came from. They found fire, it made them strong and now it's dying. Anything that happened before that is irrelevant to the overall lore and themes.
>>335452779
Well, most of the kids and shitposters are asleep now, so it might help a bit
>>335453597
That's the whole argument you fucking retard, if you are going to reply read the whole thing. The argument is that it's not fucking ornstein in 1 2 and 3, only in 1 and 3.
thanks for the thread guys. there's a lot of debate and opposing opinions, but there's enough middle ground stuff to make the story a lot more complete.
Who is the best Souls character and why is itVendrick?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5xCLVj2jgtA
>>335447983
man, DaS1 looks like a ps2 game compared to DaS3
>>335453805
The arguement that anon made is the armor is a different colour in all 3 games. You seem to think its the same colour in 1 and 3, which it isnt.
All 3 are a shade of gold though.
>>335453820
>Vendrick
>Not the ever so lovable and trustworthy Patches
>>335453820
for some reason everytime i think of a true vendrick fight i imagine him fighting like link
>>335453836
That's the console version of DaS1 vs the PC version of DaS3.
what is the difference between the age of dark and the time before the flame, or are they one in the same? they imply fire always comes back after the age of dark, being the cycle that it is, so where does breaking the cycle put us?
>>335453898
Except in two it's more of a grayish tone, and the argument was made once he started saying that the armor itself could've changed color due to time. Which makes sense if you look at 1 and 3 considering the gold tint turned to golden bronze after the elements made it that way. But gold to dark gray to bronze? Fucking retarded, sorry.
>>335453820
>Who is the best Souls character
Tarkus
>>335454027
The former has very little going on. Just "Archtrees and Everlasting Dragons".
The latter is the abyss full-on swallowing the world, which depending on where you stand may or may not be a good thing.
Okay get this, so Aldrich is the Chosen Undead. Let's say that the player chose the dark ending. What happens after it?
This is just speculation, but what if the player character after the dark lord ending was captured and then forced to link the first flame?
>>335454027
An age of grey where things just sort of exist. No heat or cold, life or death, light or dark.
>>335454083
It just looks darker to me. Which is weird, but not unheard of. The elite knight armor has more vibrant colour in Dark souls 2, but goes back to being paler than 1 in Dark souls 3.
I feel like the entire colour scheme in Dark souls 2 was off by a bit.
>>335454007
You do realise the DS3 video gets a fucking PS4 achievement after the ending, right?
>>335448875
You do realize that gwyn forced humans to assume this false form because that way they would want themselves to prolong the flame?
The love you think you are feeling is just a lie, a illusion created by gwyin to trap humans in this wretched form.
And Aldia never said we would be mindless, humans would inherit the world by becoming something more than the gods, but gwin would never allow another race to be greater than his own, and so he forced humans to become something else, something weaker, something that is only useful in liking the flame.
Priscillas parents - we know one of them was a dragon, I'm just gonna pressume it's Seath. The two most common mother-theories is Gwynevere or Velka. Velka because of the Painted Worlds crow theme + the statue you turn that is right next to the church is holding a child with a tail. Gwynevere because the painting is in Anor Londo, specifically in front of Gwynevere's massive statue. I'm gonna say I'm personally leaning more towards Velka here.
Yorshka in DS3 is obviously directly related to Priscilla somehow. The Princess ring names Gwynevere as "the eldest daughter" of Gwyn, and Gwyndolin is named "the youngest son" in another description, so we can assume Gwyn had two daughters and Princess ring is not referring to Gwyndolin as that daughter, thank goodness.
Yorshka names Gwyndolin as her elder brother and Gwyn as her father. So obviously either Velka is Priscillas mother, or Gwyn did the incestual boogie with his granddaughter. I don't know where I'm going with this, I just wanted to write it down.
>>335454156
Why did CU become a canibal?
Why did they make CU a cleric?
Why did he become a weak bitch instead of the badass he was in DaS despite eating people?
Who captured him?
How did anyone even manage to bring him to the Kiln without his consent, considering you need the Lordvessel or a serpent to get there?
>>335454396
>The two most common mother-theories
How do you know that wasn't Seath? Have you seen his wiener?
>>335454396
>either Velka is Priscillas mother,
wait no, I take that back. Her mother could technically be whoever the fuck you want, there's no proof for anything. But my point is either Gwyn fucked his granddaugther, or he didn't
>>335454156
>Aldrich is the Chosen Undead
I've heard a theory that Aldrich was originaly Petrus of Thorolundbut thats a massive stretch
>>335454330
>You do realize that gwyn forced humans to assume this false form because that way they would want themselves to prolong the flame?
>And Aldia never said we would be mindless, humans would inherit the world by becoming something more than the gods, but gwin would never allow another race to be greater than his own, and so he forced humans to become something else, something weaker, something that is only useful in liking the flame.
You completely misunderstood Aldia. Aldia questions BOTH the Linking of Fire AND Age of Dark, implying that neither is a good choice for mankind.
Kaathe is the only one who says "lol dude, end the fire, Age of Dark = Age of Man", which isn't technically lying, because mankind will be immortal in their mindless hollow state.
See >>335449013 and >>335452825
So let me get this straight:
You never actually fight Ornstein ever in this series?
He's an illusion in 1. A copycat in 2. And in 3 he's just dead somewhere in Archdragon Peak?
>>335454519
In that case, are you saying Seath and Gwyn porked? That would be cool, but Seath is a boy, no matter how hard you stuff his holes he won't get pregnant
>>335454156
Except they have a backstory for Aldrich.
>>335454568
Seems so.
in the age of fire are people just normal and there are no undead walking around?
as the fire wanes, the undead start walking around, still sane, but dead?
and if you're undead for too long you go hollow? do I have that all right?
what is the curse from DSII? Just the concept of going hollow? or is it some sort of unavoidable hollowing, unlike normal where you can stave it off with souls and being willful or having a goal?
>>335454027
They have the same properties. No life/death, no light/dark and therefore no real changes in the world. Everything would stagnate pretty shortly after the flame goes out. The world would be in an eternal undying state of stagnation. This would give humans immortality but a rather dull form of existence, probably leading into madness and hollowing over a long enough period of time.
Apparently Ages of Dark can't last forever though. The flame can't disappear completely, embers remain and a creature with a sould can rekindle it and start a new Age of Fire.
This would suggest that the natural state of the world is a flip-flop between Ages of Fire and Ages of Dark. Alternating in a regular interval. But that is just a theory, they don't really give us enough information about the world to know this for sure.
>>335454429
>Why did CU become a canibal?
I'm leaning towards bloodlust and hollowing
>Why did they make CU a cleric?
That's a very good question. I know he is a cleric, but why doesn't Aldrich then use any cleric spells during the boss fight?
>Why did he become a weak bitch instead of the badass he was in DaS despite eating people?
I think it was because he was only a mere human, consuming that much power doesn't really make you stronger and (only speculation) I think he can only use the powers of people he recently consumed, for example the bow and lifehunt scythe (might have consumed Priscilla)
>Who captured him?
I don't know, but it says that he was forced to be a Lord of Cinder, so someone obviously did it.
>How did anyone even manage to bring him to the Kiln without his consent, considering you need the Lordvessel or a serpent to get there?
You can just drop past the serpent down to the Kiln of the First Flame in DS1. I'm guessing Aldrich already placed the Lordvessel and the door had opened.
This is all just speculation, any other theories would be good.
>>335454735
Dark sign starts appearing whenever the fire is fading, so there are no undead during the ages of fire.
I'm guessing, and I think I read some lore theory that I trust a while back that put it like this.
>>335454652
Where? Which items have more backstory? All I remember were that he liked eating people, Pontiff fed Gwyndolin to him and he dreamt of a little white girl while consuming Gwyndolin
>>335454737
>no light/dark
Well I'd say it's somewhat implied that the Age of Dark has in fact quite a lot of Dark. The Age of Stone (or whatever you want to call it) is absolute equilibrium. The Age of Dark is absolute imbalance (towards Dark), presumably caused by the ambitions of the Pygmy and/or Dark Lord.
>>335454735
The curse in 2 turns you into a moldy zombie with Alzheimer's.
>>335446454
>Mfw Dark Souls 4 will happen
>Mfw it will be set in the Age of the Ancients
>>335454558
Where is Aldia anyway? He could travel inside the flame in ds2, I am pretty sure he could get to anyplace in ds3 real easy.
Since Aldia is the only one with a plan he should be in one of the dlcs, both him and the bearer of the curse are immortal beings who can exist outside of the flame or the dark.
>>335454735
Once you lose hope, you go hollow. In theory an undead could live forever without going hollow but in practice it never happens
>>335455045
Who is the one holding the rights for dark souls anyway? Scamco or from?
>>335454546
Interesting theory, does really fit with the cleric part, but the cannibal part? I think that needs more confirmation.
>>335454735
>>335455109
And that is why the player character never goes hollow. Because you play him. Unless you stop. I like the notion of considering this the third end to DS1.
what was the chosen undead chosen to do, and by whom? If I understand this right, gywn was the one to bring about the age of fire and keep the fire lit, but that shit can't last forever so was the CU there to kill gywn and put out the fire?
>>335455264
Depends on who you ask. According to Frampt/Gwyndolin you're supposed to kill Gwyn and succeed him as the guy who keeps the fire going. According to Kaathe you're supposed to kill Gwyn and let the flame go out.
>>335455264
The real secret is that there is no "Chosen Undead", anyone who escapes the asylum is considered "Chosen Undead"
>>335455010
this is different from hollowing?
>>335454735
>in the age of fire are people just normal and there are no undead walking around?
At least the number of the undead decreases a lot, it's not sure if the curse disappears completely. It would make sense though, since life and death is fueled by the power of the Flame.
>as the fire wanes, the undead start walking around, still sane, but dead?
Seems like it. Certain undead characters seem to get revived when the fire runs out. Like Siegmeyer of Catarina. And of course the guys who linked the Flame in the past apparently, so the new guy can use their souls to become strong enough to link the fire himself.
>and if you're undead for too long you go hollow? do I have that all right?
You go hollow if you have no purpose in life. Given enough time, that would basically happens to everyone.
>>335454990
I think the "dark" in "age of dark" is metaphorical. It means the people who wield the Dark Soul (humans) will reign over the world rather than the people with the Lord Souls (Lords, also known as "Gods").
The First Flame seems to just represent imbalance. It's not just Light, Life or Heat. So, the lack of the flame causing literal darkness wouldn't make any sense. It should cause a muddy gray twilight form of equilibrium between all forces.
>>335455173
The idea being this...
>Petrus acts as a guide for Way of White undead pilgrims
>has a stash under the elevator with red eye orbs
>because of his attitude toward Rhea and the extrapolation of his red eye orbs, it can be assumed that he waylaid and killed undead pilgrims as a way to survive
>Oswald alludes to this
>Might have some sort of connection with Lautrec (who is some kind of enemy to the Way of White)
>basically Petrus is a serial murderer and a liar who preys upon peoples trust
>>335455506
>I think the "dark" in "age of dark" is metaphorical.
In part. DS1 lets us take two glimpses at the Abyss and I can confirm that it is also quite literally dark in there.
what's the general consensus about there being three different versions of firelink shrine?
>>335453560
>Is it really that far fetched that there could be several dragon-slayers from Anor Londo who wore the same kind of armour?
With the way the games present their information everything has to be supported with something.
You could say Gwyn actually didn't hollow but when he kindled the fire it made a duplicate of himself while the real Gwyn became the bonfire itself.
But you need something to back up your claims, even if it is deducing shit.
So when you choose the Darkness ending and the Firekeeper asks if you can still hear her voice, is this supposed to represent the Age of Dark? A world without flame? You can move around as the screen fades to pitch black, showing the fire fading. How did anyone EVER link the flame again or do ANYTHING if the Age of Dark is pitch black? How can they see or get around?
>>335455571
I can see where this theory is going, and you find homeward bones under the elevator. This is a big stretch, but that might be a reference to his cannibalistic actions.
What's with Nashandra and the Old Iron King's Throne in Irithyll?
>>335455812
I don't know
>>335455706
you don't, you fade. it's loosely implied that everyone starts to take different forms (assumedly Humanity) and you live like that. It's not the same as just living in houses and daily tasks, it's something else entirely. also, as she said, she saw embers down the line, hints that the flame may grow anew.
>>335453264
Horace hollowed falling into the lake, Anri hollowed/just plain wanted to kill you over Horace dying.
I don't get why people act so surprised over this, Anri's dialogue makes it pretty clear they're crazy about Horace.
Why is Guts's ragedog here?
What the fuck is it?
>>335455812
I wanna say Irithyll is a kingdom far far in the future from the events of 1 and 2, and characters like nashandra and the old iron king are simply legends to be remembered, possibly misunderstood.
why is the throne of want so powerful? how is it related to the first flame?
>>335455706 The age of dark doesn't last forever, like the fire keeper says:
"The First Flame quickly fades and darkness will shortly settle in, but one day tiny flames will dance across the darkness, like embers linked by lords past"
So the flame will reignite at some point, just like the first flame. Nothing will change and all will play again.
What the fuck are this protomanuses doing here?
They are old profaned capital citizens why do the have Manus heads?
Was the profaned capital engulfed by abyss?
>>335456037
Manus didn't have a hand for a head. They look absolutely nothing like Manus.
>>335456024
I think it's just a kiln, and it's really no different.
I'm thinking it's just referred to as Throne of Want because Nashandra is a greedy cunt
