In real life bows take 100-200lbs of force to fire and require a lot of strength while swords need agility and speed to be effective. Why do videogames have it backwards?
Because the bow is a woman's weapon. A man fights his enemy face-to-face.
>>316574964
Because you're wrong and both weapons require both strength and dexterity IRL as well as endurance and intelligence. Try harder.
Only the most exceptionally strong longbows have that kind of draw weight. Reurve bows are much lighter, around 50 pounds.
It's also not just a matter of being able to pull the weight, but do it in such a manner that you remain steady and can hold it on target.
They both require strength, you're thinking of rapiers and shit which didn't get used in large scale combat, and games generally make them use dex anyway.
swords are side arms a weapon of last resort
>>316575105
You're right a baby probably couldn't use a sword well because of his lack of strength, but literally anyone else could.
So most swords should have a strength requirement of about 2/10?
>>316574964
>Reurve bows are much lighter, around 50 pounds.
>taking a faggot tiny bow into battle
Enjoy dying.
>>316575072
>most common weapon in history is a spear
>>316574964
small swords require dexterity, big swords require strength. wtf are you getting at?
>>316575105
Truth. All weapons require a balance of all stats. The human body needs some of everything. There are no dump stats in real life, brah.
DnD
>>316575349
Wrong. Big swords are made to be as balanced as possible, otherwise they would be unusable in combat. It's not like you're swinging around an axe.
>>316575358
>get enough strength/dex/endurance to use to sword
>dump rest of my stats into int
>100% crit chance
>>316575358
That's not entirely true. A bodybuilder is going to be a pretty shitty cyclist and vice versa. There literally are two very different types of muscle mass.
>>316575140
>Reurve bows are much lighter, around 50 pounds.
mongols used bows that were in the same draw weight range as longbows. others did probably too
>>316575258
Recurve bows were typically used on horseback. Mounted archers dominated other standard armies for centuries.
Even discounting them, longbows are still an outlier in terms of draw strength. Most cultures did not use such heavy bows.
>not using a lightsaber or laser sword that can literally cut through anything with no force
>>316575430
It's actually very similar, most big swords were actually bashing weapons. Just because something is balanced doesn't mean it's not heavy, I don't know where you're getting that idea.
>>316575250
Could anyone use a sword? Yes. Could anyone use a sword WELL? Not at all. Your common peasant will lose to a trained warrior every time. Likewise with literally any other weapon. Guns? Any idiot can pull a trigger. But a trained professional is actually going to hit what they're aiming.
>>316575454
Exactly. That's why you need the balance. A body-builder has focused on strength to the neglect of other things. Just like the cyclist has focused on endurance to the neglect of strength.
Balance wins.
>>316575483
>no force
>Jedi
laughing padawans.gif
>>316574964
>Not using a bow with a draw weight so large it warps the spine and muscles to be able to fire it.
Get fucked France.
>>316575151
Rapiers aren't any lighter than the swords that came before them.
>>316575483
>with no force
>>316575454
I don't think he's saying you can't do it, but that you can't afford to if you want to be an effective fighter
I figure you still need to be able to hit shit even with the strength necessary to fire the bow. That a dexterity feat.
>>316575483
Except lightsabers require force shit for brains. The blade gains weight when it comes into contact with a physical object, such as a human. So if you swing it but don't actually put any force into the slash you'd be lucky to even burn their fucking clothing.
>>316574964
Because you need a certain strength to use the bow, but once you're over the bow maximum load, adding more strength does nothing.
D&D gets it right actually. Bows have a minimum strength rating to fire them without penalty. And you can build a bow with a higher strength rating to take advantage of your strength.
>>316574964
>not using glorious 200000x folded nippon steel
>>316575538
And that's why you field armies of thousands of peasants. A veteran swordsman may be more skilled but not even the best can take down 20 peasants armed with pitchforks. They'll overwhelm him eventually.
And then when guns came into mass production, you made firing lines. They can't all miss.
Fuck training. Big armies win errytime.
>>316575596
I literally don't even know how to respond to this.
>rapiers are not lighter than heavier swords
What do I even say to this, I didn't say anything about "swords that came before them", I didn't say "You're thinking of newer rapiers, not older rapiers."
>>316575538
What does being able to use a sword have to do with strength?
The strength required to swing a sword fast enough isn't high at all and how good you are with a sword doesn't scale with strength in the slightest which is what OP is talking about.
Sure there is a strength requirement, but it's so low it's not worth mentioning.
>>316575708
Large armies are a waste of resources. There's more to war than fighting, if you field an army of peasants your economy will collapse.
don't words weigh like 2-3 pounds?
>>316575708
Until you start killing off droves of said peasants with a hail of arrows and catapults, they all get demoralized and terrified because they've never seen real combat before and haven't been trained to mentally withstand the hells of war and all run home to their families.
DEX is far more important for using a sword. Strength is completely unimportant in comparison. All strength will help you with is wrestling and punching/kicking during a swordfight. It's possible that you can become strong enough to cut off someone's limb with a single hand, but that would require quite a lot of strength. Going 50/50 on dex and str wouldn't give you enough str to do that until level 65 or some shit.
45-60lb is good enough only brits really used longbows, asians prefered mounted archery which was light weight as fuck and wrecked everyone.
Mameluke and Hun, to op pls nerf.
>>316575538
>Your common peasant will lose to a trained warrior every time
You can't trick me m8, I've read A Song of Ice and Fire
Getting good with a sword is just practice
>>316575871
That's why women are just as good at fencing amirite? Strength is speed.
>>316575718
A muscular person has far more thrusting strength and is therefore able to use a sword more effectively given the same skill.
>>316574964
shortbows.
shortbows are about practice and agility not a lot of str.
shortbows were used on horseback and raped everyone in the battlefield for a long time.
Longbows are good for arrow showers, and yes of course they require some muscle.
>>316575712
m80 i'm telling you a rapier doesn't require less strength or more dex
That’s it. I’m sick of all this “Masterwork Crossbow” bullshit that’s going on in the d20 system right now. Longbows deserve much better than that. Much, much better than that.
I should know what I’m talking about. I myself commissioned a genuine longbow in England for 2,400,000 Pounds (that’s about $4,000,000) and have been practicing with it for almost 2 years now. I can even shoot through slabs of solid steel with my arrows.
English bowyers spend years working on a single longbow and fold it up to a million times to produce the finest bows known to mankind.
Longbows are thrice as long as European bow and thrice as strong for that matter too. Anything a shortbow can shoot through, a longbow can shoot through better. I’m pretty sure a longbow could easily bisect a knight wearing full plate with a single arrow.
Ever wonder why medieval Europe never bothered conquering England? That’s right, they were too scared to fight the disciplined Bowmen and their longbows of destruction. Even in World War II, American soldiers targeted the men with the longbows first because their killing power was feared and respected.
So what am I saying? Longbows are simply the best ranged weapon that the world has ever seen, and thus, require better stats in the d20 system. Here is the stat block I propose for longbows:
(One-Handed Ranged Weapon)
1d12 Damage
19-20 x4 Crit
+2 to hit and damage
Counts as Masterwork
(Two-Handed Ranged Weapon)
2d10 Damage
17-20 x4 Crit
+5 to hit and damage
Counts as Masterwork
Now that seems a lot more representative of the firepower of longbows in real life, don’t you think?
>>316575974
shortbows raped everyone exactly because of the horseback tactics though, not because of the bowman's skill
>>316575975
I'm telling you they do. Pointed swords are literally the only types that require dexterity at all. Everyone who plays video games for some reason thinks sword combat was this sacred art when in reality it came down to who just happened not to die when the flailing started, which generally had very little to do with anyone's individual skill and more to do with how the battle itself was laid out.
at least thanks to based Lars Andersen we now know how bows REALLY were used.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BEG-ly9tQGk
>>316575707
>not tying it to a pole to cute down everything especially mounted cavalry
Even women could do it
>>316575718
Because in anything beyond dueling, rapiers are shit weapons for actual combat and the crazy fuckoff Scotsman with a claymore is far more dangerous.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ELQqRk0r1yM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ip-_vEPotYo
>ugh all this strfags complaining forever, shut the fuck up already strfags
/thread
>>316575950
A peasant doesn't have time to practice with swords. He's too busy farming, paying extortionate taxes, rebuilding his house after it gets burned down by raiders, walking his goods to market and begging adventurers to clear the rats out of his cellar.
Because swords are literally the penis of history. it is the dick measuring contest of history. The better you are with a sword, the better you sword is, the more of a man you are.
It is, quite literally, the penis as a weapon.
Meanwhile the spear and bow were practical weapons utilized for real war and blunt weapons were more practical in close combat like the mace or an axe.
But having a good sword is like having a good penis. It's a societal thing.
Which is why girls can't use swords because they have no penis. Just like girls can't wear a cod piece because penis. Literally penis.
Remember. Penis.
>>316575974
How the fuck niggas in ancient times could fire bows while riding horses? Holy shit.
Spears>swords faggots, fight me
>>316574964
Because no one cares except Archeryfags, and no one likes archery fags
>>316574964
I bet them gay ass archers never got any pussy. Mirrin them mighty brace swordsman
>>316576164
You have to realize that they weren't really shooting at anyone in particular, units were organized into huge masses that you could basically fire into and probably hit someone.
>>316574964
>100-200lbs
bitch the English Longbows that were strong enough to snap an ordinary arrow in 2 and had to use ones the thickness of your thumb and were used very successfully against plate armored frenchies had 120lb draw weight.
What are you smoking
>>316576142
Are you a feminist? To anyone with sense, a sword is a weapon, a tool. To a feminist, it is a phallic symbol.
>comparing arbitrary RPG stats to real life
>>316576170
>faggots, fight me
depends, if you have a spear and i have a sword, i wouldn't fight you because i'd get raped with literally no chance of winning.
>>316576075
Mongol horsemen were immensely talented and trained from a very young age. If it was even remotely easy to use a bow from horseback civilisations that weren't steppe nomads would probably have been doing it too.
>>316576142
>feminists analyze history
>>316576093
>skip ahead
>talking about how medieval archers could shoot with either hand
>demonstrated by throwing two targets in the air and shooting them quickly while changing hands
what? I thought he didn't want to show stupid trick archery
>>316575956
Wrong. Streamlined movements, that is to say using different muscles in the proper sequence to reach a sum greater then its parts, are the source of speed. That's DEX. It doesn't matter how strong you are if you don't know how to use your muscles correctly. A gorilla would be a shitty fencer too.
>>316575971
Yes because you really need all of that strength to puncture plate or some shit, because that's a thing people did.
How good were axes in real life?
If some warrior had a choice between an axe and a sword or whatever else, would he bother with the axe at all?
>>316576075
That and because it's a lethal ranged weapon.
You could have done serious damage with rocks as well but not as accurate or lethal. Shortbows were great and still are against unarmored or light armored opponents (aka 95%+ of the people fighting)
Range has always been OP through life and this physical universe over all.
>>316575483
Fuck off Nepnep, nobody asked you.
>>316576285
You need strength to bash plate and shatter the skull, which is what swords were ACTUALLY for, retard.
>>316576295
Definitely. Swords are only good against unarmored peasants.
Axes are better at penetrating through armor. The head is more heavy and the edge is smaller, letting you concentrate more force on a smaller area.
>>316574964
Well, most bows actually use Dexterity, which is generally considered a stat thats directly tied to your accuracy, and coordinates with things like picking locks and disarming traps.
>>316576056
Is this pasta? Never seen it before.
>>316576056
How long has it been, copypasta?
>>316576114
Who the fuck is talking about Rapier.
Real life is not a videogame, more strength is not going to give you 20% increased damage. You either hit a motherfucker and cut him because you are using a sword and it's sharp or you don't and nothing happens.
And since when is crazy a stat?
>>316576297
>implying an enemy would just stand there and get shot
Oliver, your bow is silly. Go back to the island.
>>316576295
Well axes obviously have significantly more cinetic energy behind them. A sword isn't going to go through armor in a million years.
>>316576295
Axes are a little better against armor if they have a penerating spike like some modified dane axes or if the soldier isn't a good swordsman, swords require more skill and edge alignment, axes are easier but slower because of the balance, the iron is at the top and the rest is wood.
Also axe's sharpness typically lasts more and can be used as a tool to chop wood if you want.
>>316576367
Dexterity = Hand Eye coordination.
>>316575841
>>316575815
You have the knowledge of the whole world at your fingertips but instead you decide to remain ignorant.
>>316576383
They would on an school shuutin with a bow.
not to mention it would look rad af.
>>316576295
axes are pretty good against armor, but only if you have a shield or wear good armor yourself, because they suck at defending
>>316576170
>mfw the phalanx got rekt consistently by romans with their tiny swords
>>316576232
>>316576270
Niggas please. Swords are weak shit that only had a place in sport and as a status symbol. They're practically useless in the majority of combat situations the average soldier faced throughout history.
Even the precious Samurai only used the katana for cutting off a head for the glorious status kick backs and duels.
Spears, bows, maces, and axes are objectively superior weapons as shown by military history.
Swords are more heroic visually but ultimately just a dick measuring tool unless you've got a big ol' zweihander or something with multiple functions.
Put your hate boner for feminists down for one second before a conscripted peasant runs you through with a shitty spear. Your first clue should have been when I said a girl can't do something.
>>316574964
Videogame devs don't do their research and seem to think that the force of a bow comes from the bowstring being made of elastic or something, rather than the potential energy from the bow being bent.
Take any sort of promotional art for a videogame where the character is wielding a bow and you start to realize just how retarded everything is.
For example is pic related. Once Lara lets go of that bowstring, her arrow will go fucking nowhere because it's limp as fuck.
>>316575712
Rapiers are actually pretty heavy. Just because they're thin, it doesn't mean they're featherweight or lighter than a regular long sword. They actually have a very thick, blade, and a heavy pommel to help pop through things.
>>316576395
>Also axe's sharpness typically lasts more and can be used as a tool to chop wood if you want.
Aren't woodcutting axes different from axes that were used as weapons?
>>316576508
Gladius best weapon.
>>316576532
Figure 2. This one is actually kind of fun to try and find just how many things are wrong with it.
>>316574964
because videogame developers have no influences outside of other videogames
>>316576502
>axes are pretty good against armor
Hm better than swords...
But no in fact they suck if they don't have pointy ends and it's just the blade to chop.
>whats half swording
>whats using the pummel of the sword
>etc
If you are looking to bust armor. Maces & warhammers were the weapon.
>>316576101
>cute down everything
>>316576552
I think that's what a hatchet is supposed to be.
>>316576279
>That's DEX.
Nope, STR in D&D covers all things that are physical conditioning, not just "how much you can bench". Which is why you roll strength for both hit and damage.
DEX is hand eye coordination and that sort of things.
>>316576532
yeah sure thing mate because wood totally bends without breaking, right?
god, you people are retarded
>>316576550
A rapier weighs like 2 pounds bro. An actual battle sword can weigh upwards of 7.
This is a fun thread
Not everyone had the money for plated armor right? What would be more common if you weren't a lord but still fought as an occupation (not a peasant with farm tools).
>>316576626
Oh ho ho, you almost got me.
>>316576379
Rapiers are the only sword where strength isn't necessary for them to be useful. Hitting someone with a sword does not mean you will kill him if you don't have power behind that swing. For instance, a straight razor. You could kill yourself very easily with one, but instead you only cut off hair. That's because you don't put enough force behind it to slit your throat.
Now imagine a straight razor that weighs 50 pounds and is as long as your arm. That shit requires strength to do anything than pathetically flop around, looking like a faggot who thinks he knows how to fight from all the anime he's watched. You would die because your weak ass has no business on the battle field and all the heavily armored motherfuckers will laugh at you as they watch you embarrass yourself and your family.
>>316576572
lol the arrow can never go straight.
>>316576093
Lars Anderson does some cool stuff but literally everything he says is made up or bullshit
>>316574964
You're a shitter. Bows come in weight classes. The correct way to size a bow is based on the user's weight (height sort of matters too).
Get a fucking recurve. Delivers more power for lower draw weights. The most anyone would need on a recurve bow is 60lbs, even 45lbs is good enough for most men that weigh about 180lbs.
I'm not saying they don't require STR, or DEX is more important. I'm saying your opening argument is flawed as fuck.
At the place I work we are designing and constructing exoskeletons to be used in dangerous workplaces such as factories. While wearing an exoskeleton you have the strength of 6-7 adult men, so what would happen if I scaled a longbow up to accommodate for the extra lbs of force?
I wonder if I could actually fire a projectile the thickness of a stake with deadly force.
>not being a master of all trades
baka desu senpai
>>316576652
Plated armor was ridiculously expensive and for royal knights and shit only. Chainmail and hardened leather were the most common types of armor I believe, both able to easily deflect a swing from a sword, but not necessarily a strong stab or an arrow.
>>316576652
Probably something padded, didn't it all depend on how much whoever they fought for could afford?
>>316576652
poorfag with chainmail or gamberson, or both if saved some money.
Those are good layers of armor to be honest... Full plate is slow and hot af, would only wear if I felt like my life depended a lot on it, otherwise fuck it I prefer to go light.
>>316576626
This is bait but you know what a recurve bow without a string looks like
>>316576532
You know how it feels for me when I play Borderlands and deal with those shitty sights.
You're either shooting the moon, or digging for potatoes.
Videogame developers (and Hollywood) suck, and always have at weapon/warfare accuracy. They suck at everything else as well, but hey, this is a thread about weapons.
>>316576718
>lol don't being ur mum's pussy into this lol
>>316576591
You mean the sexy sleek warhammers, right? Not the stupid over-sized ones.
>>316576532
Holy shit that string! its like a long piece of gum! Is her bow made of a faggot of twigs? Jesus
>>316574964
Which vidya has one-handed swords as strength dump weapons?
>>316576532
that bow wouldn't bend, the string is way too long
0/10 apply yourself
>>316576724
Replace
>leather
with
>gamberson
it's way more accurate, warm and easy to make en masse.
>>316574964
>why are video games not like real life
Really retard? We need to explain this to you?
If you stub your toe 100 times do you die?
>>316576754
how did medieval people figure out which combinations of wood had the most potential?
>>316576807
didnt they use leather too though?
>>316576718
> You will never be an English yeoman archer in the 100 years war
> You will never watch the greatest Knights in Europe charging towards you screaming for your blood, only for you and your longbow bros to mow them down
>>316576830
Trial and error, literally.
>>316576784
Of course.
Skyrim got it all wrong, everything is twice the size it should be and unpractical af, except maybe the "steel" weapons.
>>316576710
Like a mounted ballistae or something?
I know you're thinking the dragon bow thing from dark souls but this is more like it.
>>316576786
I think it actually is made of twigs because muh survivalist I CAN DO THIS
Here's her using a...mostly normal bow. Again with a rubberband for a string I guess.
>>316576830
they didn't sit around playing video games 16 hours per day
Devs like to screw this shit up because rule of cool takes precedent over realism
What is the best way to hold a bow that is both cool looking and functional?
>>316575871
>No STR
>Blocks one blow
>Sword flies away
>Wrist broken
this is why i always roll a wizard. just need to whip my dick out and shoot fire and energy beams at people while i slam mana pots. none of this fukken thinking that sword and bow nerds have to do.
>>316576384
Axes are a poor mans mace.
Armored opponents are literally 1% of the army really. No body is rich enough to afford full plate cept knights and nobility.
>>316576883
More like a HANDHELD ballistae!
>>316576830
Trial and error, same as everything else in history.
Trial and error just gets a little more dangerous when things explode upon failure.
>>316576889
that one might work, I think the perspective is making it look dodgy
>>316576896
>blocking a blow with a sword instead of your shield
lol
>>316576917
Well yeah not all peasants had the money or the right to carry a sword.
>>316576807
Didn't gambesons have a lice problem or something like that? The stuffing would get damp with sweat and full of all sorts of gnashing little critters.
>>316576697
>50 pound sword
Where the fuck are you getting this retarded information from? Most swords were a few pounds maybe 8-10 at most if we're talking about great swords which we're not because great swords are fucking shit.
Note how I used the word swords and not rapiers because you keep pulling rapiers out of your ass as if I've ever mentioned them.
>>316576841
very rarely, expensive and hard to make, you had to boil the shit, etc, etc.
Gamberson was literally just the work of a tailor with too much mateiral, super easy to make and comfy. It's a super puffy vest.
Actually if you ever got into a bar brawl and you for some reason were wearing gamberson, that puffy shit would take a ton of damage off. Some Skyrim characters wear gamberson, for example the nobles.
>>316576910
The difference is you have to do all your thinking beforehand and cram it into your head, before releasing it like a fountain of jizz
In real life swords were rarely used. They served as status symbols and for ceremonial purposes.
In video games, this isn't true. Probably because it's easier to program sword combat than it is spear.
>>316576957
I think he meant the strong guy blocks the weak guy's sword, which would end similarly. You ever hit anything hard with a stick or metal pipe or something? That shit HURTS. Now imagine doing that with all the force you can muster with a heavy ass sword. You are gonna have a bad time.
>>316576438
>>316575708
please tell me how Cao Cao beat Yuan Shao I mean by you logic Yuan shao should have won because he had a bugger army. Tell me how the mongloian horde too over much of the known world even though by numbers they should have lost. Or the Conquistadors who took over all of south America with less than a 100 of them. Maybe superior numbers don"t mean a thing when you use superior strategies.
>>316576964
Yeah but maces are pretty easy to make.
And axes are basically farming implements.
The truth is most medieval soldiers carried pikes. Which is just a big long stick made out of wood.
>>316576924
Haha yeah imagine how the guy who invented nitroglycerine must've felt. One minute you're mixing chemicals, you look at the tube like "Hm, wonder what this stuff does" so you shake it and BOOM your fucking face gets blown off.
And that's how nitroglycerine was discovered.
>>316576910
Damn right. Can't kill a god with a pointy bit of metal.
How does shooting an arrow even work? Why doesn't the fletching catch on the bow and send the arrow tumbling?
>>316576889
That is less stupid, there is still an over long string but the bow actually seems to be flexing.
>>316577048
Exactly, axes are very accessible as a tool but also effective as a weapon.
>>316577073
literally 15 seconds in google could answer this question for you
hint: arrows bend
>>316577058
The guy who invented/discovered mercury fulminate was a monk who liked to dick around with chemicals in his spare time.
>>316576990
gambersons and aketons + chainmail was the light armor combo trend for a long while, that shit just works super nicely.
http://bashny.net/t/en/276160
>>316577073
because the arrow bends around the bow when you fire it
literally
it's some fucking crazy medieval magic
>>316577073
You enchant the arrows beforehand.
>>316577004
I was exaggerating. I know swords don't actually weigh 50 pounds. I don't know how much they weigh, to be honest, but I know 50 is right out.
And that doesn't change the fact that you need strength to properly wield a sword.
>>316577094
but they're also heavy and don't have much range.
You need a lot of room to swing it without hitting your friends too.
>>316577058
The guys that invent that shit either do so by complete accident or are aiming for it and usually an assistant is the one that blows up.
The guy that invented it knew it was an explosive. Then Nobel decided to make it better and more explosive.
>>316577142
swords are much longer than axes m8
This kind of thread is interesting to make someone realize just how many medieval nerds there are around.
>>316577140
You need in RPG terms a bit of strength to be able to swing a sword and that's it.
Swords are light as fuck because ofcourse they are, why the fuck would we make them heavy?
>>316575275
It's also the first weapon.
>>316577186
you don't need to swing them around for them to be effective
>>316577048
>>316577094
Axes are incredibly effective as weapons, as were most farming tools. A flail was basically a wheat threshing tool that could break an uppity nobleman's neck/smash his skull through his helmet if you hit him hard enough with it.
>>316577218
Because last time I checked E=MC2.
>>316577216
you mean nerds who played mount&blade and watched a couple lindybeige videos on youtube?
yeah I know that's at least half of you faggots
>>316577140
The heaviest swords were 8 pounds, and we're talking claymores.
50 pounds is more like a full set of plate for a 5 foot 8 dude.
>>316577218
to better hit people with them, retard
if you go slice at somebody with a light as fuck sword, you're not exactly going to cut deep.
>>316577186
You can stab people with swords
>>316577264
Well you're wrong there aswell because it's E2=(mc2)2+(pc)2
>>316577035
Hmm no. It's easier to program spear...
there is just one lethal attack... thrust.
unless it's a partisan or other kind of spear that can also cut but it's a little heavier and worse balanced.
also swords are usually super decorated in videogames... you would take a lot of work off the devs if you suggested them to make spears instead.
What the sword has is that it's easier to carry around than a spear. A spear goes in the back, you can't enter an INN with it without crouching too much, a sword is a side-arm, keywords here: SWORDS ARE SIDE-ARMS.
They were the pistols of ancient history, super comfy to carry around everyday.
Thats probably why it was the main weapon of a lot of RPG protagonists. Historical Adventurers irl probably carried swords not weapons of war like spears, unless they were serious af.
Because not every bow is a english longbow fletched from the world tree and strung with the intestines of your enemies, just like every sword is not a japanese katana made from steel folded a thousand times. Archery was a hobby of men and women, but swordsmanship was something only men did.
>>316577332
a spear is better for that
>>316577329
But you are though you fucking retard.
You honestly can't even argue this, swords were light as fuck because as it turns out if you sharpen a piece of steel it cuts.
In BG/BG2 the best bows take like 16+ strength to use. There's one magic bow that needs 19 strength too from memory.
>>316577186
Poleaxes would like a word with you.
>>316577402
How are you gonna get through armor with a light sword?
>>316577374
Spears are too long, m8.
>>316577419
Yeah but that's just straight up a weapon, we're talking wood chopping axes here.
>>316576627
Actually, long swords(the heaviest kind) were usually about 2.4 to 4.0 lbs, you are full of shit, anon, meanwhile, rapiers weighted up to 2.2 lbs.
>>316576552
https://youtu.be/mxrlR7xBXpE - woodcutting axes vs battle axes
>>316576295
https://youtu.be/PN7s1Uh8rhc - axes vs swords
I really like this guy's channel, he always has the answers to all these questions that pop up on /v/.
>>316577073
the fletching isn't rigid. it bends because its made from feathers.
Psh.... you should all consider.... a real weapon.... not that you could wield it...
>>316576131
>extortionate taxes
it was only 10-25% and 10% as tithe. today people in most countries pay close to 70-80% of what they earn if you include indirect taxes and compulsory social security
>>316577402
Yeah but if you use a heavier blade then you can cut even DEEPER THAN 1 CENTIMETER. And not to mention other adverse effects if you manage to hit someone with a heavy weapon, like staggering and fatiguing
>>316577374
Yeah but you can't hack people up with swords.
Swords are like an axe and a spear rolled into one.
>>316577408
>There's one magic bow that needs 19 strength too from memory.
Yep. I usually bought a pair of ogre strength gloves to go along with that bow. Give them both to Minsc. Now he can swing his sword with greater strength when the enemy get too close, and fire powerful arrows with boots on the end at enemies who are far away.
>>316577445
If you want to stab someone in close proximity, it's better to use a short bladed weapon, like a knife, rather than a sword
>>316576508
Phalanx got rekt by Roman artillery and light auxiliary troops with pilum and other trowing weapons.
poleaxe > spear > sword > mace > axe > warhammer
>>316576896
>blocking an strfag when you the faster dexfag can just cut his fingers before hes blade reaches your body
Counter attacking, especially cutting fingers was super common in sword fights.
Hands are probably the easiest target to hit, if you are fast and precise af (a dexfag). Injured hands and the strfag has literally no chance other than to run or try to kick, I recommend running tho since he is unarmed.
Honestly as weaboo as it sounds in weapon fighting speed, precision and skill is what matters the most.
>>316577570
Nice taste, the only thing I would change is putting dual shields on top of everything else.
>>316577073
Archer's paradox m8
Though modern bows compensate for the issue by avoiding it altogether by offsetting the bow at this point.
But yeah you know that jackass video where they shoot dildos and they're all wobbly in the air? Arrows surprisingly wobble through the air like that too. Floppy dildos.
>>316575879
>45-60lb is good enough only brits really used longbows
F-f-fourty five pounds is g-good enough.
You sound like a faggot.
>>316576741
Also, a common misconception is that plate armor was actually heavy and would slow you down, but that's actually untrue.
to quote a museum about medieval armors:
" An entire suit of field armor (that is, armor for battle) usually weighs between 45 and 55 lbs. (20 to 25 kg), with the helmet weighing between 4 and 8 lbs. (2 to 4 kg)—less than the full equipment of a fireman with oxygen gear, or what most modern soldiers have carried into battle since the nineteenth century."
source: metmuseum.org/toah/hd/aams/hd_aams.htm
>>316577494
If you're using a sword that's so heavy it'll stagger people(which by the way is the exact opposite of what you want to do with a sword) you won't get a fucking hit into anyone with functioning legs and no you won't cut 1cm deep with a light sword you'll cut deep enough to fuck a motherfucker up. We know this because the vast majority of swords ever used were light and they fucked shit up when cutting someone.
>>316577443
If your enemy as decent armour you're fucked with a sword to begin with so you might aswell throw at his face and run.
>/v/ talking about medieval warfare
Cringe thread in disguise?
>>316574964
The only bows with those kinds of poundages were mongolian and english ones. And those bows won their users continents. That's hardly representative of the majority of bows. Native American Flatbows and Japanese Yumis for example had really low poundages and were mostly for hunting.
>>316577570
Historically accurate
>>316577570
Give some context please.
In you are talking about 1v1 open field fight, super light armored or unarmored it's:
spear > poleaxe > sword > axe > mace > warhammer
From lightest and fastest weapon to slowest.
Spear is usually 2 handed and is a stick with a pointy end so it's the fastest also god-tier reach, Poleaxe is heavier but it has the god-tier reach advantage.
And so on.
>>316576702
the arrow cant go anywhere, because the left hand blocks the string from being drawn.
You guys know that we can talk about this stuff all day on >>>/his/ ,right?this is still fun though
>>316577570
Nice.
I fucking love polearms.
>>316577482
That bitch got trolled so hard by /b/ back in the day, that she tried to turn it against them by being as "4chan" as possible and thinking she was an "EPIC TROLL LOL" as well.
>>316577490
I was probably thinking those times of war or other hardship when you get a bad lord who goes around and takes everything from his farmers, leaving them only the barest essentials to survive the winter.
>>316577745
not to mention that bow would probably snap off at the tips
Then again that string is just magically attached to either end so who knows?
>>316577468
Love Skall. Hes wife seems like a SJW through I don't trust her a lot...
>>316577781
we can talk about porn all day on /gif/, /v/ is still a better place to discuss it
>>316577494
making it even heavier won't help it absorb force any better and cutting force is improved just by changing the angles.
>>316577693
Look, if want to cut real good, you want a heavy enough weapon that doesn't let you over-exert yourself, let gravity do the work for you. Swinging a light sword is good and all, but against armor it's basically next to useless, at least with a heavy sword you can clobber fuckers to death.
>>316577516
except without the reach of a spear or the cost effectiveness of either
>>316577781
Technically it belongs on /k/, not /his/.
>>316577875
I don't remember her voicing her opinion about anything, but she does seem like one. But she also seems pretty chill.
>>316577917
Define heavy sword.
>>316575707
I was under the impression katanas were shorter than that.
>>316577942
Medieval weapons can be discussed on /his/, it's a nice way to filter out firearms and all that boring recent shit.
Question: Assuming the reflex on the bow comes from springs, would Serah's sword bow thing actually work
>>316577045
>Or the Conquistadors who took over all of south America with less than a 100 of them.
Mostly because they brought smallpow and other fucking nasty disease that killed around, according to most recent estimation, around 90 or 95% of meso- and south american fighting forces. Also, more came, they didn't do everything with 100 folks.
>>316577917
>but against armor
just use a mace.
>>316577663
Didn't the French get absolutely fucked by British Longbowmen when they sent a bunch of fully armored Knights at them on foot? The Longbows couldn't pierce the armour, but the Knights were so fucking exhausted after running the entire range of the Longbows while getting pelted that they couldn't fight.
>>316577781
How the fuck did I miss this coming into existence?!
We've waited so long for a history board.
>>316577917
>"Look, I don't know what the fuck I'm talking about, but I'm gonna argue hypotheticals with you for hours until you relent."
You should both just save yourselves a lot of hassle and just post the smug girls at each other right now.
>>316575592
Mah Yeoman.
>>316577538
swords are a better all round weapon
>>316578023
There's a notification thing up there, there are other new boards like >>>/aco/ and the fucking useless piece of shit that is >>>/trash/
>>316576532
It's less devs and more the artists sucking. I don't think I've ever seen bow art that actually looks good.
>>316578010
Whatever you say, Anon. I'm not getting in an argument with you over this stupid shit.
>>316577660
And you sound like you don't know what the fuck a recurve bow is.
>>316577917
Are you fucking retarded, deluded or underage?
Why the fuck would I want to slice someone on plate armor with a fucking sword? People invented maces for that, war axes or even polearms, there were no use for the claymore in practical combat, nor in wars, not even in duels, you retard, even daggers had more killing potential close-quarters than any kind of sword, because you could grab the fucker and slice right into his joints.
Here's a demonstration for you, friend.
youtu.be/O9eCzG8AAoQ?t=7m36s
Also, there were no "heavy" weapons, even that shitty sword weighted about 2 to 3 kilos
>>316575454
Body building has absolutely nothing to do with athleticism, unless you're mixing in standard aerobic exercises like swimming and long distance running, your muscles are going to be literally useless for anything other than picking things up and putting them down. Why do you think actual athletes look nothing like bodybuilders, except for those who lift weights as a sport?
>>316578008
Because they are.
That's a nodachi.
>>316575562
It can't be that hard to have the legs of a cyclist and the arms of a body builder.
>>316575454
i like how you say "that's not entirely true" and then proceed to completely agree with them
you're a real genius now kid
>>316578225
>this weakfag can't get through armor, therefore it's impossible!
What's the best weapon for a little girl?
>>316578384
nudity
>>316578225
>there were no use for the claymore in practical combat, nor in wars, not even in duels
Zweihänder were used by Doppelsöldner to break up pike formations.
>>316578021
I didn't know about that specific historical event, can you please link that, anon? I would like to read about it more.
But I don't think knights fully-plated would actually get tired after climbing some stairs after the siege started, on actual field battles that's a possibility, though, and the weather would influence the battle too, since a hot fucking weather would melt the poor dudes wearing the armor.
>>316578415
Why would a little girl have nudity as her weapon?
>>316576845
>You will never go around sacking France with Edward III and Chaucer
>>316577364
>spear
>just one attack
wew check out this historian
>>316574964
Because nerds don't know this.
they also don't know that a skilled archer can fire a bow from the hip, several arrows per second, while running.
Every once in a while, despite the neverending stream of threads about MGS, undertale, life is strange, super smash bros, fallout 4, and indivisible, a thread like this pops up and out come all the incognito fa/tg/uys.
It warms my heart to know that there are pockets offunhidden in the ocean of piss on this board
>>316578474
it would disarm all of her opponents
>>316576532
That bow is beyond retarded. You don't even need to know shit about bows to know that will never work.
>tfw you will never be a horse archer
>>316578447
I don't remember much about it, if i remember correctly it was during the 100 year war.
>>316576253
With a regular sword an nothing else maybe but there are many cases of swordmen with shields rushing in and destroying spear unit, also guys with big sword and harbediers were considered anti spear guys.
>>316578598
Horseback archery is a meme and there is no historical evidence that it was used in war.
>>316578384
Friendship.
>>316576056
>American soldiers targeted the men with the longbows
o i am laffin
>>316578598
ever try to shoot a moving target? ever try to shoot a moving target while you are moving at a gallop? yeah, they were terrible and barely hit anything. Thats why you do not hear much about horse archers in history. The greatest weapon ever was the flail or spear. both are hands down the best weapons.
>>316578419
If we are talking about the 14th century, yeah, sure, but the Zweihänder had largely ceased to have a practical application, being mostly used in ceremonial events. I was referring about the scottish greatsword in my post, not specifically the Zweihänder. Sorry about the misconception.
>>316578312
>weakfag
You can't even wield something about 2 to 3 kilos? Are you that fucking dyel, you retard?
>>316578447
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Cr%C3%A9cy
There's a short comic about it, it's pretty damn good
>>316577663
>" An entire suit of field armor (that is, armor for battle) usually weighs between 45 and 55 lbs. (20 to 25 kg), with the helmet weighing between 4 and 8 lbs. (2 to 4 kg)—less than the full equipment of a fireman with oxygen gear, or what most modern soldiers have carried into battle since the nineteenth century."
With the added benefit that a full set of plate armor is evenly distributed over your whole body.
>>316577179
Nobel made it safer. Having explosives that dont blow up just by moving it around was a pretty great accomplishment.
>>316576056
>World War II
Actually this raises a very good question. Why didn't we use longbows in the first world war? Guns were still shit and the artillery wasn't doing very well. But longbows would have been precise enough to fire into the air and have arrow fall right inside the german trenches.
>>316575454
Neither of those people have the goal of armed fighting.
>>316575592
Too soon.
>>316578675
The Khans, dingus.
Why else would they tell stories of being able to shoot birds out the sky on horseback, carry around 8 horses per soldier, and start riding horses at age 3.
modern people just dont' have the time or the inclination to git gud
>>316578825
Because that takes time exposing yourself and a lot of the time you were shot at for sticking an inch of your helmet out of your trench.
>>316578675
>Horseback archery is a meme and there is no historical evidence that it was used in war.
The mongols were directly attested to by the Chinese to use both horseback archery and lancers as their primary combat units.
Also, the entirety of Japan before guns were introduced.
Stop it, man.
>>316578675
Is it some sort of meta-joke where you try to claim the most preposterous things to see how far you can take it before people stop believing you?
>>316576896
When you block with a sword you use the part of the blade closest to and you attack with the part farthest away, the defender has most of the time a torque advantage.
>>316575509
>Most big swords were actually bashing weapons.
Anyone that actually thinks this needs to get the fuck out. There are far more efficient ways of creating bashing weapons other than a sword. A sword has an edge to be sharpened. A goedendag or an awlpike has has both bashing and piercing capabilities, but are not able to cut.
I know you think you sound knowledgeable by saying some sort of statement that's contradictory to what seems to be typical dudebro knowledge, but use your fucking brain for a second and realize that it's fucking retarded that a sword wouldn't be used to cut flesh and have a pointed tip to pierce.
>>316578693
you here about them non-stop in asian history from Syria to Japan
>>316576093
a god amongst men
>>316578916
>>316578952
[citation needed]
>>316578938
Actually that's a myth. Archers, good ones anyway, can fire volleys of arrows faster than you'd think. We're talking several arrows per second.
The reason they didn't use archers is probably because you have to be /fit/ as fuck to use a bow properly especially for a long duration and the skill level required to use on effectively is also very high.
They didn't exactly have the time to train a regiment of archers.
>>316578675
High Heels were literally invented for the express purpose of making it easier to keep your feet in the stirrups when you stood up to draw a bow on Horseback.
Then women appropriated them because they noticed it made their ass look bigger.
>>316578938
Don't have to stick your head out of the trench. You could point it and fire from the door of a bunker. Straight up and hope it falls in the right place.
>full plate armor is extremely slow and sluggish
Why are people thinking this when the real armor sets are stuill here to proof that it isnt true?
https://youtu.be/5hlIUrd7d1Q?t=52s
>>316579041
Every history book ever? Fuck man learn to read.
Not going to spoon feed you common fucking knowledge you literal nigger.
>>316578621
"Archery was described as ineffective against plate armour by contemporaries at battles such as Bergerac in 1345, Neville's Cross in 1346 and Poitiers in 1356."
Apparently, it was more about tactical use of the terrain and tactics than the longbow men impairing the knights movement per see, I will read into it more, but that was what I could gather about the article this anon >>316578736 linked, and thanks for the link, kind anon.
>>316578736
What is the name of the comic, anon?
>>316578825
they did use bow, as well as halberds and claymores.
>not usimg a 60lb compound bow
U own a fedora bro?
>>316578980
You're fine if you learn to read, m8.
Realistically, how effective are swords compared to other weapons. Why would I pick a sword over something like a pike, or an axe, or a mace?
>>316576093
>targets are several feet away and stationary
lmao, is this a joke
>>316578242
It has, there's a reason why ski shooters, runners or whatever don't lift and build bulk, upper body mass is a larger strain or your legs.
>>316579120
>compound
*tips wheelchair*
>>316579137
You wouldn't, but swords are lethal and light enough to carry as a backup weapon should your pike get broken.
Ideally you'd want a pike for most faggots, a sword in case that breaks, and a knife for platemail just in case.
>>316579087
This is great
>>316575140
>Holding on a target
Confirmed for not knowing shit about bows. You never hold.
>>316579137
Swords were 90% ornamental 10% sidearms. They were expensive, showy and fragile. The most common and useful weapon among the general populace across many different countries was the Quarterstaff. Cheap, easy to get, and in the hands of someone who knows how to use it, absolutely deadly.
>>316578825
>wwII
>Guns were still shit and the artillery wasn't doing very well.
wtf
>>316579047
It doesn't matter how many you can fire in sequence when 20 marksman will kill you before you can even poke your body out long enough to even ascertain a target. If you want to lob something into a trench you use artillery or grenades, because neither requires exposing yourself at all. By the way machine guns commonly were fired at long ranges where the bullets arched through the air, the arms race was competing for the longest shot out of a gun.
>>316579103
It's simply called "Crecy"
This is one of the pages: >>316576718
I don't think it's available for free but should only take a few seconds to pirate it
>>316579137
It depends mostly on the era you wish to fuck shit up. Against naked enemies even an arming sword is fine, against a fully plated knight you would be better with a war hammer or some kind of blunting weapon.
>>316579047
>We're talking several arrows per second.
source
Say loud: "44"
Thats one second.
>>316579267
Because an arrow travels further than you can throw a grenade and you can do it without leaving the trench.
It's just impractical when you can hand a man a rifle and have him trained in a month vs handing a man a bow and have him trained in a few years. Especially when it's not good for any other situation in trench warfare.
Max strength, max dex, max con, negative charisma.
>>316575509
>>316576343
>most big swords were actually bashing weapons
>bash plate and shatter the skull
>swords were ACTUALLY for
What the fuck am I reading?
Sword is not designed to bash just simply because it's made for cutting and thrusting unarmoured targets. You can use it for fighting heavy armoured enemy by using half-swording and using sword as mace or thrusting in weak spots between plates. Maces and pole-axes were specially designed to deal with armoured enemies an much more effective than sword in that respect. Also sword is not the best weapon to use during the battle, just because reach is the most important thing in the fight, you can defend yourself more effectively with long metal stick against knife than with another knife just due to reach advantage. But the reason why swords were so popular is because it easy to carry around, that's why it's called side-arm. Just imagine carrying spear 24/7 all the time, it would be really uncomfortable and awkward looking, although spear is more effective weapon.
>>316579267
Didn't have to poke your head out of the Trench to shoot m8. The entire argument is invalid.
>>316579137
If you want something that will really fuck someone's shit up, jury rig a macuahuitl with razor blades. I don't see the blades lasting more than a couple of hits, though.
>>316579393
that's very high charisma tho
>>316579393
>Guts
>neg Charisma
Nigga literally won people over with his heart
>>316579087
>wearing dozens of lbs of metal
>for hours at a time
>climbing and fighting, sometimes up and down hills/stairs
>still completely useless against bodkin arrows
I think you're a fucking idiot.
>>316574964
>I've literally never shot a bow in my life: the post.
It's so funny when you guys try to discuss weapons in real life because video game weapons are literally nothing like real weapons
>>316579361
This guy isn't even half as good as real archers were. He's just doing it as a hobby.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BEG-ly9tQGk
>>316579279
imgur.com/gallery/XqJod
Found the full comic, I'll give it a read later, thanks for the info.
>>316579137
Well, historically speaking, you would have a pike, axe, or mace, the second two probably with a shield, and a sword as a sidearm in case shit got hairy. You'd probably also have a dagger for the same reason. Very few military units in history just had swords, though they do exist.
>>316579137
swords > axes > lances > swords
So it depends on what your enemy has.
>>316574964
no, they dont unless your using some oversized hunk of garbage made to pierce an elephants rock hard dick
>>316578825
This nigga right here killed a Nazi with a longbow
>>316579156
You didn't watch the video
>>316579445
>>316579448
Everyone's fucking horrified of him when he's wolfmanning it up.
>>316574964
It's because IRL there doesn't exist the concept of a "STR weapon" or a "DEX weapon." Literally E V E R Y single weapon in the world is quality.
No matter what weapon you have, hitting harder with it will ALWAYS produced dividends. Hence, literally every weapon ever has STR bonuses
No matter what weapon you're using, using it with more skill and/or increasing your training with it ALWAYS yields dividends. Hence, literally every weapon has DEX/SKL bonuses
>b-but muh hammers and maces
>b-but muh brutish blunt weapons
even hammers take a great deal of skill to use effectively. Go ask any novice gardener or housekeeper how easily they can aim a hammer when driving in nails for whatever yardwork they're trying to do. OR consider the fact that your goal isn't just to swing the weapon, it's to swing it and aim for a precise location, without throwing yourself off-balance by the momentum of the swing
>>316575358
>There are no dump stats in real life, brah.
Where is charisma needed in sword fight?
>>316579467
Lars is a mememaster
autistic Korean archers can put 6 arrows in a spot the size of a quarter at 90 metres
>>316579576
they show extreme reaction when he is around, be it good or not. that's high cha.
>>316579518
This isn't Fire Emblem fag
>>316579398
That anon is a fucking retard, don't bother.
>>316579410
That has nothing to do with my argument. Show me an image of a bow shooting an a reasonable angle to hit an enemy trench while unexposed. Of course rifles were fired from safe positions, because rifles are capable of doing so.
>>316579398
A two-handed sword is closer to a pole axe in terms of reach, weight and balace compared to a longsword.
>>316579620
To not join the fight. :`)
>>316579620
if there's a crowd you could shame your opponent into acting rash or bait him into showing off.
>>316579250
>in the first world war
>>316579620
You need charisma for feints and shit. Misdirect your enemy and get them to leave a gap in their defense.
>>316579451
>still completely useless against bodkin arrows
1. Only britain used longbows (with the necessary power)
2. It takes years to train archers (Thats why the shitty early guns replaced bows)
3. Non fitted plate armor was actually cheaper than mail (we have sources: price lists of merchants and armor workshops)
4. A guy with a suit of armor wants to engage you in battle. Do you fight him or flee? (routing not killing the enemy force was the main reason of winning a battle)
5. Fuck you.
If /v/ had was rolling a tower shield + spear/sword, and encountered a guy in full plate, how would they deal with them?
>>316579925
MAGIC MISSILE
>>316579620
Old chinese proverb applies to this.
It's about kung fu but whatever it applies.
Young guy and old guy are on a boat.
Young guy wants to fight old guy because he has a reputation as a skilled fighter.
He's bragging and asks the old guy "What's your style?"
Old guy says "the way of fighting without fighting"
Young guy gets pissed and challenges him.
Old guy says "Ok but not on the boat ok? Let's take a row boat to that island over there"
Young guy is so ready to fight that he immediately gets in the row boat.
Old guy grabs the rope holding the row boat, drops the boat in the water, and unties it
He then yells down "Submit or I'll let you go."
gg no re
>>316574964
Take a 1.25kg weight and swing it around like you would a sword for 10 minutes.
Now take a 3-5kg weight in your left hand to simulate a shield.
Now imagine carrying another 15kg of mail and helmet on your body and fighting like this for half a day.
I hope all your retarded questions are answered.
>>316579925
Poison. The kind that gets applied just from hitting the enemy, even if the strike itself gets blocked.
>>316579794
>Maxim
>Enfield
>Mosin Nagant
>Springfield
>Shit
>>316579914
>Thats why the shitty early guns replaced bows
I played Shogun 2: TW and the guns are pretty shit there (not in the expansion obviously)
I think Medieval 2 had some gun units as well that just misfired all day
>>316580019
how the fuck are you meant to apply poison to a guy in full plate when he blocks your attack? Is it supposed to diffuse through the steel and skin?
>>316579925
Drop the shield, halfsword and try to work it into his armpit or up the gauntlet. If that doesn't work try to take him down and stick him in the throat or the armpit with a knife.
>>316580053
don't just mention guns m8, the thing about artillery supposedly not being effective was just as retarded
>>316580000
fucking destroyed
good quads
>>316579794
Guns were not shit during WW1. The K98, Springfield and Enfield rifles were used in WW 1 and 2.
>>316580086
dropping the shield isn't going to work if the full-plated knight has a longer weapon than a sword, you're now at a huge disadvantage. It would be better to use the shield's protection to bumrush him and knock him to the ground with a bash, and then stab him with the knife
>>316578304
This is the dumbest post i've seen this week- so i'm reading it as sarcasm
>>316580075
Didn't you mean in a videogame?
>>316580181
Probably what you'd have to do.
That or get close enough that you can clinch and trip.
>>316579925
call my friends because why the fuck would I be on my own with a tower shield
>>316580053
>>316580176
I wasn't disagreeing with him, he just read that guy's post wrong.
>>316578825
This is such a horrible idea I don't know where to begin.
It would have been very easy to install countermeasures: cover the trenches with nets or planks.
The density of soldiers in trenches was nowhere near what would have been needed to make sure it's an efficient tactic. You don't raze whole squads with arrows, you just hit a few of them to wear them down. You wouldn't even KNOW whether or not your arrows hit someone.
And if it's about defending from a charge, then rest assured I'd rather oppose a charge with a machine gun than a squad of archers.
>>316580267
because you're an adventurer who has to go up against all sorts of bizarre magic and fantastical threats, so having a sturdy defense against the unknown is important
>>316579991
this senpai
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zng5kRle4FA
>>316579907
real life is not a video game battle you fucking nerd
>>316580410
then I'd be mage-specced myself
melee is for fags
>>316580439
I will never get tired of this audio file.
>>316574964
Longbows are like, field battle weapons though
shit you see in fantasy games is like some kind of recurve bow
>>316580505
>not training both body and mind
Even if you're a mage, having a large, sturdy shield is important if you aren't sure what threats you'll face. Only now, you have the skills to enchant the shield to increase it's magic DEF. Why dodge when you can block?
Besides, when you're a muscle wizard you have the option of carrying a melee sidearm and not being useless with it
What was the last European battle where people actually still tried coming at the enemy in full plateand got rekt by guns?
>>316580589
Mages require the use of both hands for making arcane gestures a lot of the time.
Why block with a physical object when you can shield yourself with magic?
>>316580621
There was actually bullet proof platemail it just never got popular.
>>316575358
>balance of all stats
So, which part of the sword is wielded with my suave nature and eloquent speech?
>>316580589
Muscle wizards are best wizards. Punching people with fists of fire, enchanting your body for extra power and all that shit.
>>316580719
because what if the incoming spell/projectile is designed expressly to defeat magic shields? Like an enchanted arrow or the like -- if you don't have some solid, physical object behind that magic protection you're SOL. And don't tell me that would be a rare situation, either. If I were an enemy and I saw an unarmed mage walking towards me I would switch to all my magic-piercing weaponry
>>316578020
This.
Why do people go all nuts over katanas and european swords when a mace is all you want in a fight.
Any dumbass can use a mace, breaks bones, smashes armor, easy to use and almost no training required.
>>316580782
The part where you talk your enemy into fighting you without a sword because he's so much stronger than you.
See my excellent shitpost here for further details
>>316580000
>>316580854
There's also magical attacks designed to pierce physical objects so you're damned if you do, damned if you don't.
It might be worth it to carry a small shield on your back or be able to summon a magical shield but generally speaking in fantasy it takes too much time to get good at fighting like a warrior and fighting like a mage to be good at both.
>>316580941
>easy to use and almost no training required.
famous last words
>>316575708
Oda Nobunaga defeated an army of 40000 man with 3000.
>>316580621
There was not one moment.
They just stripped away more armor as time went on. Started at the legs and then the arms while the breast plate got more massive to be bullet proof.
At the end the cuirassiers used armor breast plates. The napoleonic wars were the last time when it was used in larger scale.
At the start of ww1 the french curassiers went into battle with the armor plate.
>>316580854
>enchanted arrow
>projectile that can easily break or miss and be lost
>spending more time and components enchanting a consumable than any battle wizard would on their trinkets and robes
>>316575708
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Cr%C3%A9cy
?
>>316580996
Which is why you layer them on top of each other: strong shield + strong magic enchantment.
>it takes too much time to train as both a warrior and a mage to be good at both
is there any way to spec pure mercenary? As in, you took the time to learn combat, and combat-related spells, so you have an extensive knowledge of combat magic, but none of the more well-rounded education that mages would traditionally have? Like, you can cast magic missiles and fireballs and magic shields, etc. but you don't have knowledge of any spells that don't relate to battle
>>316580621
The polacks charged panzer Is with horses
>>316581078
Alrighty then, compared the most simple weapon in existance, a 1 handed bloody iron club to a european sword and the weaboo special, 2 handed heavy as shit expensive fillet knife.
>>316580941
The most used weapon was always the spear.
>easy to make
>uses less resources to make
>gives you greater reach
>easy to learn how to use it
There is also a psychological reason.
The reach of the spear is better for the morale of non warriors. They dont have to get "close" to the enemy.
>>316581178
Depends on the game but not in most tabletop games.
D and D being the most popular I'll use it for the example of what you describe. You'd start at level 1 as either a fighter or a wizard. You'd only have so many good attributes so your combat abilities or your wizard abilities would be substandard compared to a pure wizard or pure fighter.
Then at level 2 you'd have to take either fighter or wizard.
By level 20 you'd be a fighter 10/wizard 10
You'd never be as good at fighting as a level 20 fighter and you'd never be as good at wizardry as a level 20 wizard. You would have more options as you say but you'd be slightly hampered in a sword vs sword or magic vs magic fight.
>>316574964
It really doesn't take a lot of poundage for a bow to be efficient. 70lbs is easily lethal at any accurate distance.
I would also like to point out that this guy is about to lose a lot of skin off his jaw if he ever fired an arrow like that.
>>316581343
Meant to say compare, added the d by mistake
>>316578012
You'd need a crack team to figure out what is supposed to be happening in the first place before you discover that
>>316574964
>Why do videogames have it backwards?
cause its fantasy
let's say you had to outfit an adventurer (solo) with a set of gear that would give them the greatest odds of walking out of any situation alive, if not the most specialized for any of them. What do you pick?
>>316576093
This is high-functioning autism.
He even looks a bit downsy.
>>316581386
I was mostly just saying in the context of that discussion, I do know how amazing spears are, and you are correct in all of those fronts but I also just have a bit of a thing for clubs.
The simple art of beating the shit out of motherfuckers with a heavy stick has pretty much been with us for as long as spears.
>>316574964
is it pronounced as Sord or Sword?
>>316576093
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rDbqz_07dW4
>>316581679
clubs were for primitives who were either fighting unarmed civilians, or who had not yet realized the glory that is the Spear
>>316581343
Reminder that knights trained with maces just like they trained with swords. If you can't deflect enemy attacks or aim your blows you are just as dead with a mace as you are with a sword
>Not using pic related
>>316574964
>increase strength
>guns deal more damage
>>316581808
Spear might be glorious, but clubs are a good weapon nonetheless.
Plus, primitive or not, if it does the job its good.
>>316581825
Got some source for that pal?Could use a good read.
>>316581907
I'll give you 1000 gold for it
>>316581807
Stopped at 2 minutes in.
She's completely wrong, of course the pictures and manuscripts are the best method. That's why they made them, to teach you how to do things.
For fuck's sake there's an entire organization, HEMA, that's mastered this.
>>316581807
>video by a woman without any credits that has 50% dislikes
wow you sure showed him
>>316581807
the fuck is this
>>316576572
>String is literally not tied to anything. It just begins and ends
This is official art? Jesus.
>>316580000
Isn't that from the Enter the Dragon?
>>316575708
>Big armies win errytime.
>Iron Bow
>Steel Bow
Why?
>>316581091
nigga had guns
>>316582054
>>316582108
>>316582185
Lars isnt doing new. He is just trickshotting. The stuff he does is done since ages.
>>316581907
Awkwardly shaped curved short that doesn't even have a stabby end? Wouldn't wield.
>>316581807
>literally Fedora-tipper: The Channel
>>316582289
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8iLTA43MBuA
>>316581807
>he uses historical images to look at how to arrow, this is dumb and wrong
>modern archers have lots of resources to draw from
>it's all pictures
I thought you're not supposed to base your technique on pictures?
>>316582252
I don't know man
>Gold better than iron and steel
>>316581907
>Runescape
Fag
>>316582252
If you're in a fantasy game and have the mythical strength to draw a steel bow, that should have way more impact than a wooden one, right?
>>316582571
>Hating on runescape
>>>/trash/
>>316581807
She is complaining about Click-baiting titles in internet article. Lars himself never said "everything you know is a lie".
>>316582592
Metal doesn't act like wood.
>>316582592
wood is far more elastic than metal, so even if you had the hypothetical strength to draw a metal bow, it wouldn't rebound and launch the arrow like a normal bow would
>>316582024
Late medieval knights fought each other mainly with maces, morning stars or similar weapons because swords were ineffective against late medieval plate armour.
Swords were for show and stabbing peasants.
>>316582630
Runescape was garbage for poor people.
>>316582757
they fought with polearms, which usually had at least 1 blunt head on them
>>316575841
Tell that to Russia in WW2. One of the main reasons they were able to soundly defeat Germany was because they just would not stop throwing millions of untrained men at the problem.
>>316582213
Yeah, bruce lee incorporated a lot of martial arts folk tales in his movies. Nigga had a degree in philosophy and it shows.
>>316581807
>all of his assravaged fans
>i-it doesn't matter if he makes up "historical facts"
>>316574964
there's a wide array of swords and bows you stupid shit, try using a claymore with "le agility and speed" meme
>>316582950
actually, by the time that Russia turned the tide and started to roll the Nazis out of their country, their commanders had gotten gud at warfare and were employing competent tactics against them. The whole "hurr suicide rush" meme only applies to the first stages of the Eastern Front. Once the Soviet's greenhorn commanders learned the ropes, they quickly overwhelmed the exhausted and poorly-supplied german units
>>316582950
I thought it had a lot more to do with lack of supplies as the Germans advanced into Russia during a harsh winter.
>>316582108
She both credits herself at the end of the video and if you are judging something by the amount of dislikes something has, I think you have just proved you are from reddit.
>>316583336
he's also implying that the germans didn't employ human wave attacks or send assloads of people into the country as a means of overwhelming the Russians
>700,000 german troops in Stalingrad
>>316582757
how are blunt weapons more effective against armor?
>oh shit I can't cut throug hthis, better distribute the force over even more area
>>316582108
>implying his autistic fans didn't bomb the video with dislikes
>>316581648
Why does modern /v/ hate dedication?
>>316583453
Because blunt trauma is a thing
Your brain will still slosh around if you get hit in the face and give you a concussion, your armour can get dented and hinder your movement, the constant impacts fuck you up in general
>>316583453
Are you actually daft or just pretending to be retarded
>>316583167
>they quickly overwhelmed the exhausted and poorly-supplied german units
Isnt it sad that those exhausted, poorly supplied and with less numerous guys still had a k/d of 2?
>>316583453
>implying that blunt weapons aren't riddled with spikes for piercing
>implying that if someone hit you in the head with a hammer, you wouldn't get concussed through the helmet
>implying that bones wouldn't be broken through the armor
>implying that internal bleeding wouldn't happen
read a book and stop being so silly
>>316583343
I thought the arrows were in the ground purely for storage. And good way to keep them upright and within reach. And to share with your fellow archers.
Instead it's for delivering infectious wounds to cause maximum pain and guarantee a slow death, is it?
Delightful.
>>316583498
how are you supposed to pull off the arrowhead and then put a new one on? Wouldn't that make the head prone to falling off on it's own during flight?
>>316583453
Are you retarded? Goddamn I hate this place.
>>316583557
>>316583540
>>316583528
Why not just hit them in the head with a sword then? That'd have the same effect
>>316583343
>Knows about the existence of germs
Immersion ruined
>>316583498
>>316583343
>>316583281
What IS the name of this book? I've seen it posted in parts so often, I want to read the entire thing but I can't find a source. I think it was written by Garth Ennis.
>>316583553
Not really, once you consider that the german weapons and armored cavalry were consistently superior to those of the Soviets, so even with acceptable tactics they were fighting troops who had WAY better technology and weapons then them, supplies notwithstanding
>>316583615
I'd imagine that rotten carcasses would be much better to put some poison on your tips
>>316583656
There is much more mass in a hammerhead/etx
>>316578825
If the bow and arrow wasn't used in the Napoleonic Wars, Civil War, and Revolutionary War, you know that they're must have been some sort of advantage to using muskets
>>316583697
Crecy
some anon linked the imgur album earlier
>>316583591
>>316583615
The comic artist loves to suck English dick. I'm pretty sure that no one knew about germs n shit in the time the comic takes place. It was most likely the storage thing.
>>316583656
I know you're baiting but I'll bite for posterity.
A sword is not weighted or designed in a way to be able to efficiently inflict blunt trauma, because it's a fucking sword made for slashing and stabbing.
>>316583697
>I think it was written by Garth Ennis.
Warren Ellis.
>>316576784
Good taste mein negger.
>>316583656
Best tool for the job
A mace is way easier to swing and hit properly if your goal is to blunt force him to death, with front-ended center of mass and whatnot
>>316583680
Even back then, they knew wounds had to be washed with clear water.
>>316583680
maybe not exactly germs, but later on he says they rub their daggers so that any wound they inflict gets infected
I have no problem believing that
>>316583656
Oh lord its serious.
How cute.
>>316579518
Fuck, theres a reason the weapon triangle didnt exist in the first place.
>>316584002
rub their daggers in shit*
>>316577226
[citation needed]
>>316583656
Is this b8?
>>316575454
i am an actual competitive bodybuilder
for anyone reading this your muscle doesn't actually morph into some different version. bodybuilders also do a shit ton of cardio, but it is replaced by low impact stuff like stair stepper/treadclimber when you are 280 and shredded. running at that weight would absolutely destroy your knees.
>>316584002
>>316584078
That's nasty. I suppose ''knightly honour'' was limited to aristocrat poofs playing warrior in the courtyard
>>316578825
>world war 2
>guns were still shit
no they werent, what what the fuck?
>>316583709
That'd be pretty good. Keep a load of arrows with their heads in a dead horse. An army will likely have a few dead from fatigue and accidents.
>>316584223
I thought that for professional weightlifters/powerlifters, wind sprints and other high-intensity cardio exercises don't interfere with weight training, but low-intensity exercises like long-distance runs do
>>316583369
She isn't a fucking historian in archery
>>316584332
war has no rules, honor is something that's defined by the winners
>>316584354
>Why didn't they use bows in the first world war? Guns were still shit
>first world war?
Mind you I am not that anon and don't know whether guns were actually shit in WWI
>>316584354
He explicitly said World War 1.
>>316577063
>Can't kill a god with a pointy bit of metal.
Bitch please i do that all the time...and i have a friend in my anger management group that kill gods with his fists...you girly mages arent suposed to be smart?
>>316584449
>war has no rules
of course it has rules you idiot.
Ever heard of rules of engagement that every modern militar has?
>>316584473
This is some good shit anon, good job making the thread better.
>>316584376
it turns into a "do what works for you" honestly but if you watch any documentary on the big bodybuilders like ronnie coleman, jay cutler, kai greene, you'll see they always have to walk on the treadmill etc for 1-3 hours before going to bed.
while i don't doubt kai could do wind sprints, the risk of injury or pulling something is just too great and too big of a strain. off season these guys are literally over 300 lbs
>>316584223
>>316575454
Yeah I'm pretty sure endurance has nothing to do with "another type of muscle mass".
Cardio increase endurance via way of actually training your heart, increasing your oxygen intake, and your concentration of certain proteins like heat shock protein.
>>316584449
Even in the time of the ancient Greeks rules for war were frequently discussed in reaction to the slaughter of civilians
>>316577482
i still dont know where is th handle of that thing
>>316584546
Raulo also draws the best porn.
>>316584494
guns were definitely not shit in WWI
I'd take a bolt-action rifle over a bow and arrow any day
>>316584597
What he means is that there are two types of muscle fibers in your body, and each are optimized to do different jobs
1. Fast-twitch fibers are good at high-intensity, short-duration exertions like weightlifting and sprinting
2. Slow-twitch fibers are good at low-intensity, long-duration exertions like distance runs
As you train weightlifting, your body builds more fast-twitch fibers, and as you train distance runs, your body builds more slow-twitch fibers. However, do this for long enough, and the body starts to destroy some of one type of fiber to make room for the other
>>316581807
>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rDbqz_07dW4
She seems to miss a lot of points trying to rip it apart for some unknown reason.
>>316584712
>>316584772
this is why you slap armor on warhorses
Need to kill some knights but your arms get tired from swinging your axe through so many peasants before you get them? What you need is a weapon cuts footmen like butter but steal pack the punch you need to knock out a knight! Look no further than the Falchion™.
Seriously though, my friend does historical martial arts and he put a 1/2 inch dent in a 14 gauge steel helmet, with a falchion.
>>316584946
We got a bouncer boys!
>>316584494
>>316584506
still, what the fuck?
the bolt action rifle was nearly perfected, and you probably already know how devastating the machine gun was. sure there were a few ineffective designs but for the most part weapon technology made leaps and bounds.
>>316584946
>These aren't my glasses
>>316585092
>implying that the medieval English weren't as autocratic towards the peasantry as the medieval French
I want angloboos to leave
>>316585092
> mercy giver
fucking savages, i sware
>>316585041
He probably had a mental image of pre-WWII guns all still being one-shot wonders that are manually loaded using gunpowder, but history shows that they progressed beyond that alarmingly fast
>>316585092
>le potent peasant class struggler
When will people stop blatantly inserting their ideology into historical stuff
>>316575483
>laser sword
>>316583510
Because the Autism meme scared everyone into being casual secondaries.
Just look at this fucking shithole. Used to be you could be thankful that all the AAA fags, the MMO players, and the Halo/Cowwadoody players would be chased off.
>>316585369
It is absolutely baffling to me that these days /v/ is 90% AAA-games and casual shit
>>316585303
>expecting anything different from Garth Ennis
he ruined a Punisher arc with that shit too
>DURR lemme blow up a yacht with 100 innocent people on it to kill 3 villains, nobody will care because stockholders are ebil!!!
>>316575483
Weeaboo faggot
>>316585341
I'm not sure how accurate that was, but it was fascinating.
>>316583793
That's not true. They had an understanding of infections, and diseases. They just didn't know that it was microscopic organisms causing it.
They used to hurl dead bodies and shit over walls for a reason.
>>316585457
garth ennis and warren ellis are different people
i know, i was as surprised as you to find that out
>>316585213
propaganda's a hell of a thing
small folk's hearts can be won with small gestures
>>316585473
>muh superior English Yew bended over 1000 times can shoot through anything
>>316585524
I guess it's a European thing then
>>316585448
>these days
Are you trying to imply that /v/ hasn't always been filled with threads about new AAA games?
>>316585558
>m'lord
>>316585448
All the indie hate when there used to be daily indie/freeware threads really show how we've devolved.
>>316585448
The reason is the split into /v/ /vr/ and /vg/
>>316585369
>the Autism meme scared everyone
you retard. halo came out 11 years ago, modern warfare 8. generations are growing up with garbage and you think the memes did us in
>>316585723
It only showes how the indie developer scene devolved
>>316585667
No, I am implying that there is a disturbing lack of threads like the one we are in right now
>>316585558
acutally, it was forbidden to export english wood to other countries because it was so superb for making bows
>>316585778
>halo came out 11 years ago
14
>>316585213
Peasant hate aristocracy, but they can't relly risk complaining about their own, you know, so when they are getting the opportunity to kill foreigner aristos, they'll be happy to take it.
>>316585902
you're right, don't know where that 1 came from
>>316585731
No, /vg/ was made to contain pokeautism flooding the board. Whether or not that was a good idea is questionable.
>>316585792
Nah, /v/ hates games based only on whether or not they're indie now.
>>316585303
You don't think some peasant wouldn't be happy to finally kill some nobility?
I don't see how that is an issue.
>>316585448
Most of these dumbasses grew up in the post-casual era of video games. Nobody wants to play anything that takes dedication, time, and trial-and-error to master. So they stick with AAA games which are designed so that even your mom can beat them.
Then you got the ones that are scared of being meme'd at. Or the faggots that desperately clamor for yet another TORtanic because they think 4chan is all about screaming like howler monkies at everything and throwing your shit everywhere in place of discussion.
>>316585987
You're thinking of /vp/, which came before /vg/.
/vg/'s creation was 100% fueled by constant fighting game, League of Legends, Dota 2, Starcraft 2 and most of all Katawa Shoujo generals on both /v/ and /jp/.
>>316585778
Yeah. Eventually you snot-nosed brats were gonna start showing up here.
However, being old doesn't make Halo, or any game for that matter, good, you little shit.
>>316586028
Not with this ham fisted anti-calssicist phrasing. It is very clearly a modern invention.
People from that time apparently didn't have much of a 'the man is keeping us down' mindset. Which is kinda surprising if you think about it.
>>316586045
I'm 25 and I stick with AAA games or grand strategy games because they don't require a huge initial time investment to even start to git gud
>tfw too proud to become a NEET
>>316585667
>filled
You assertions might be correct if you think /v/ was made in 2012.
>>316577226
the first weapon for man was throwing punches
>>316586286
Grand strategy is more hardcore than shit like AssCreed. You at least need a brain to play them.
>>316586353
Do you actually believe that?
>>316586432
not really man, I learned how to play them 8 years ago and now it's easy to get intotoo bad modern Paradox is shit
>>316580941
why fight when you can murder?
just use a poison tipped spear and laugh your balls off
>>316586286
You don't need to become a NEET or invest a great deal of time compared to AAA-games to have some taste. I work a full-time job and still finish obscure DOS-RPGs.
You're just making excuses for being a filthy casual
>>316586045
I've read so many posts where some mongoloid is complaining about how impossible a game is and it's something as simple and child friendly as The Legend of fucking Zelda. It's heartbreaking.
>>316586129
you can't even read
>>316586553
>start playing RPG on the weekend
>don't have time to play all week
>continue next weekend
>absolutely no idea about anything that happened in the story anymore
>>316586506
Yes. I do.
>>316586647
Not quite. It's not difficult to fit in an hour or two every other day. The tighter your schedule, the more you realize how much time you waste on stupid shit that could be done quicker to free up time for your hobbies.
>>316583625
wax was used to hold arrow heads together
it was also a good way to prevent your opponent from reusing the arrows if they were to hit a tree/shield/grass since the arrow head would just stay stuck in whatever.
>>316586553
>obscure DOS-RPGs.
You sound like a hipster.
Oh cool sword thread, thinkin about buying a 40inch german bastard sword from windlass. Want a buckler too but i dont know what kind or where i can go wrong there.
>>316586754
True, but anybody able to run something on DOS-box without turning up their nose because ''shit grafix'' is such a rarity these days, that I feel justified in using it as an example.
>>316586754
This is another meme that hit this board hard.
>"Like something that's old, or not popular? HIPSTEEEEER!"
I believe that if you only allowed the following words to be posted on /v/:
Casual
Indie
Hipster
Faggot
Fedora
Butthurt
NeoFAG/GAF
Sonygger
Nintendrone
Xbot
Autist
There wouldn't be much of a drop in overall quality of discussion.
>>316585029
whoever wrote this was jerking off the entire time.
>>316587157
Yeah, it's a bit of a fanwank. There were far more significant battles than fucking Crecy.
>>316587325
Yeah, if England had been as great as presented in that comic, they wouldn't have lost the damn war
>>316586282
>Not with this ham fisted anti-calssicist phrasing.
It's really nothing ut of the ordinary.
I can easily see them going this way.
![ui6T3MV[1].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/xWXqXc9.jpg "ui6T3MV[1]")
![Jackchurchill[1].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/l3R8cyr.jpg "Jackchurchill[1]")
