Corruption edition
Discuss the l/ore and viability of the Warcraft universe in tabletop.
old
>>48260715
Why is Blackwing Descent's design so based?
I'm really glad I took a break during cata cause I'd probably hate BWD if I had to do it when it was relevant content for months and months.
>>48287262
its a volcano fortress. Its hard to fuck it up.
>>48287195
He swam, obviously.
>>48287262
ELEVATOR_BOSS
>>48287195
I wonder if the ogre juggernats from the secnod were built and/or crewed by ogres, and when the horde fell various ogre tribes just spread across the world of azeroth using those ships.
If they built the ships they could've probably built new ships as well even if they didn't have any juggernauts left.
But yeah the ogres are very spread out for a draenor species.
I think Rexxar could've gone on a goblin ship.
In lordaeron between wc3 and WoW with the scourge roaming around I can see more desperate alliances showing up, and more ships abandoning the continent so maybe he even manage to get on a human ship.
>>48287195
ogres have a limited hivemind, and the most complex thing they're capable of at the size of the average ogre mound is ship building and seafaring
t. head canon that probably isn't true, but makes sense given our limited knowledge about ogres
>>48286980
End Times takes place in a universe where the raiders in Dragon Soul failed any time after killing Morchok. Deathwing makes it to Deepholm, does the dastardly deeds he meant to do there, then dies himself somehow
Hour of Twilight and Dragon Soul take place in the present right after one another, they're just in the CoT because it's convenient after End Times/Well of Eternity
You're actually going to talk about using this stuff in an RPG this time, right?
You're not just a bunch of fuckheads who are better off in /vg/, right?
>>48287984
>he disregards the canon just because he doesn't like it
>>>/v/
>>48287991
>>he disregards the canon just because he doesn't like it
That's what you should do when you run a warcraft game.
Because the novel canon and the game canon from the last decade is shit.
>>48287966
its more like the ogres will probably be led by their two headed mages because they are smart enough. The presence of the ogre legion and merc camps means that ogres were smart enough to hire themselves out as hired muscle.
>>48286680
the funny thing about the draenei = protoss thing is that Blizzard's taken it so far that in WoD we find out that the draenei even had dragoons before the Horde destroyed Shattrath and Auchindoun
Ezarch Artaanus when
>>48288607
>the draenei even had dragoons before the Horde destroyed Shattrath and Auchindoun
U wot? You mean those new constructs they have? Pic related.
>>48288708
yeah, they're supposed to have draenei souls inside them
>>48288720
So they're like Eldar Wraith constructs? That sounds somewhat out of character for the Draenei.
>>48260859
Is it really Thorium..or is it Tiberium?
>>48288708
Are those shields? Damn..my boner's gonna split if they are. I fucking love shields
>>48288828
shields that they punch you with
>>48288785
from the dungeon journal entry for the first boss of Auchindoun
>The greatest warriors of the draenei may be called upon for one final service as they stand on the precipice of the afterlife: inhabiting one of the armored constructs that serve as the eternal protectors of Auchindoun and the draenei civilization on Draenor.
you also see one of them get made in HFC (and then fuck it up and kill the soul going into it)
>>48288849
>shields that they punch you with
shit anon I just came everywhere
>>48288785
The Draenei use Vigilants mainly for defence in Auchindoun. They're not used as warriors, nor are the souls tormented in any way.
>>48287679
Or got a lift from some giant flying animal.
>>48288607
Draenei becoming more protoss and old gods becoming more like zerg.
>>48288952
Yeah I guess.
I mean it's along way, but he is a beastmaster, already has a bunch of animal companions, there are stops like broken isles.
He could've had boat by himself and then if he got in an accident he could've flown away with some animal.Headcanon is now that he freed a horde war turtle from the second war and used it to get to kalimdor
How do you see the armies of the seven kingdoms in relation to eachother around wc1-wc3?
>>48288672
These please me.
>>48288672
dragons with human forms was a mistake
>>48288785
They did weird soul shit since the beginning, but we only seen the ruins of it in BC. I think it was a pretty good way to show how advanced they were with both technology and magic. Even the ethereal are attracted to their stuff like flies to shit.
>>48289055
>Stormwind
outstanding cavalry but their infantry is poor at anything other than holding the line until someone saves them
>Lordaeron
unskilled conscripts bolstered by foreign auxiliaries and extreme faith in King Terenas and the Light
>Stromgarde
an unbroken warrior tradition dating back to the first human in the EK, man for man the greatest infantry force to ever exist
>Kul Tiras
effective marines that are basically useless when not supported by a fleet
>Gilneas
pretty average troops that look good because they never go on the offensive and therefore always have an advantage
>Alterac
peasant rabble, their mountains are a more effective defense than any army they'd ever raise
>Dalaran
powerful mages supported by neighbors with a vested interest in not seeing the most powerful foci of magical energy outside of the Sunwell fall to hostile forces
>>48289246
Nice thanks.
Mostly similar to what I have gatheredand prefer.
I'm not sure I agree with Stormwind having especially poor infantry, but maybe you have some good reasoning for that?
I agree with their cavalry, I think Lordaeron has good cavalry too especially through paladins come the second war.
My impression was that Azeroth/Stormwind was the most powerful nation. While Stromgarde was a martial nation, Dalaran a magic nation, Azeroth was a large nation with a bit of jack of all trades master of none deal going on.
I think a stromgarde footman is the most likely of all footman to beat down a grunt 1vs1.
>>48289377
>I'm not sure I agree with Stormwind having especially poor infantry, but maybe you have some good reasoning for that?
it's pointed out quite a bit that the only thing that stopped the Horde from burning Stormwind directly after exiting the Dark Portal was the Brotherhood of the Horse's knights. Every engagement where cavalry wasn't brought to bear was a crushing defeat for Stormwind, but other kingdoms managed to hold their own much better with infantry based armies
>>48289456
I thought that had more to due with them not knowing who they were fighting. The orcs were beaten back by the knights in the prologue and then the campaign started.
You might be right, I'l definitely keep poor infantry into account.
>>48289523
>I thought that had more to due with them not knowing who they were fighting.
that was probably a factor, Stormwind's infantry might have not been as bad as I make it sound, but if they aren't then there isn't much to distinguish them from Lordaeron since both make use of capable but not noteworthy infantry buoyed by outstanding knights
>>48289561
>but if they aren't then there isn't much to distinguish them from Lordaeron
I guess religion, but Stormwind is probably #2 in religion anyway.
Navies are possibly comparable.
They're the largest nations, so not sure if anyone can claim a major numerical advantage.
I think maybe their differences may have less to do with military.
Stormwind has more of a special dwarven relationship, while Lordaeron has an elven relationship.
Stormwind is perhaps a softer gilneas on the isolationist scale, while Lordaeron is very diplomatic.
Pic: some quick brainstorming
>>48289749
How well do you think the Quel'thalas navy compared to the human kingdoms? 2nd best, beaten only by Kul Tiras, or 3rd best with Lordaeron and Kul Tiras beating it?
And how much of their navy survived the Scourge invading?
>>48289749
that looks pretty good, but I think Alterac's natural borders give it more than a 2 in fortification, and their diplomacy should probably be a 5 considering they negotiated a peace treaty with the Horde
>>48289831
the elves built the best small warships in the world, but they didn't have any capital ships like the human navies do. Very few of their ships survived the Third War, most were left to rot in port or taken to Kalmidor
>>48289831
>How well do you think the Quel'thalas navy compared to the human kingdoms? 2nd best, beaten only by Kul Tiras, or 3rd best with Lordaeron and Kul Tiras beating it?
I'd say 2nd.
As for how much of their navy survived.
The scourge invaded by land, killing 90% of them.
Maybe most of those 10% survived by fleeing to the ships or large parts of it was already lost during the second war.
Shame blizz kinda gloss over the navies in wc3 and beyond.
>>48289848
Yeah fort should probably be higher.
I gave alterac high intelligence partly because of the horde negotiations, that they could keep it hidden. I think I'll move it up to four at least.
>>48289927
>>48289959
I also remember WC2 lore saying the Horde's small ships (Destroyers) were made by the forest trolls. So perhaps the high elves and forest trolls had constant naval skirmishes in form of the trolls doing Viking style raids? Maybe including going upriver in their small boats?
>>48287231
The Afterlife!
>Like the Emerald Dream, the Shadowlands are tangentially linked to the world of
Azeroth. Yet whereas the Emerald Dream represents life, the Shadowlands
represent death. They are nightmarish realms of decay, labyrinthine spiritual
planes teeming with the souls of the dead who have passed from the world of the
living.
The origins of the Shadowlands remain uncertain, but they have existed ever
since mortal life first arose in the physical universe. Many believe that mortal
souls are drawn into this dark place at the point of death, where they remain
forever after. Still others hope that their souls will go on to a brighter place, rather
than languish for eternity within the cold confines of the Shadowlands.
So.. do we all go to Warcraft Hell now? Or is this purgatory, where we're all judged?
Lets say you're a follower of the Light, what happens when you die? You suffer just as Kel'Thuzad supposedly does?
>>48290102
>in form of the trolls doing Viking style raids
Damn.
I can see a light ship going down river, being chased by elven ships.
Then they embark and the trolls start moving the ship across land and down another body of water where that elven party can't follow them.
>>48290286
the Shadowlands are purgatory for people with souls and hell for those without. You either suffer there for eternity, or you chill out until The Light/Bwonswamdi/the Wild Gods/etc. come to pick you up and take you somewhere better
>>48290434
You'd be my savior if you had a source, m8. Really.
I've been on the search for this answer for so long, it'd bring tears to my eyes.
>>48290485
I'm pretty sure it's a combination of Chronicles and the short story where Sylvanas kills herself. The problem with the concept of the Shadowlands is that it's Blizzard trying to give a lore justification for gameplay mechanics 14 years later, so it'll always be a wonky idea
>>48290485
So I'm guessing it's easier for necromancers to bind souls from the Shadowlands, before they're taken from the realm of whatever belief they believe in?
>>48290563
Wait, the Chronicles talks about the Light taking the souls of the dead? Where?
>>48290290
It's pretty fun to try and fill in gaps in the lore. Which I've figured was half the fun of being on a RP server, or trying to set up a campaign in the setting.
>>48290574
I guess, yeah. Seems most souls that Necromancers take are from those that didn't really have much belief in anything else if there sentience, which is hard as hell to pull back from death..
Or its a corpse thats been animated, and not really all that smart, I believe.
>>48290581
>the Chronicles talks about the Light taking the souls of the dead?
no, but it's where the whole "Shadowlands is purgatory and not hell" thing comes from, and there's people that refer to "becoming one with the Light" at death
like I said, the whole idea of the Shadowlands is inherently kind of fucked and nonsensical
>>48290631
It's really just Blizzard suddenly deciding that they need a lore explanation for something that's been a blatant OOC convenience for ten years. Next they'll be trying to give an explanation for hearthstones and the dungeon finder.
>>48290909
hearthstones are extremely rare in the lore. IIRC, anduin has a HS given to him by jaina.
>>48290909
>>48290631
So.. basically through research and interaction I've learned some interesting things.
The Light isn't sentient, any more than Arcane is. It's just another force.
But Void? Apparently has sapience, its also evil.
Worship is meaningless in warcraft, and you all end up in hell regardless of anything, unless you've made an even darker bargain.
God, this is just like Warhammer now..
>>48290936
nah, warhammer has a lot more sense than wow
The naaru are light personified.
>>48290909
>It's really just Blizzard suddenly deciding that they need a lore explanation for something that's been a blatant OOC convenience for ten years.
exactly, it's like people asking about why headcrabs don't one shot Gordon Freeman despite him not wearing a helmet. because enemies one shotting you is a huge pain in the ass and in lore Gordon never gets hit anyway
>>48290964
Nope, theres nothing to personify.
Apparently Elune is also a real God. Like Judeo-Christian God.
But was created by the Light, which is non-sentient.
>>48290936
I don't think Void is any more sentient than Light is (both seem to have some ability to react to things, but no true mind of their own). However, Void has Void Lords, which are pretty much personifications of the Void. Light has the Naaru, which might be similar but are much less powerful (since if the Void Lords got into the universe, they'd apparently fuck everythigg up). Maybe there's also a direct equivalent, which like the Void Lords exists outside the universe, but nobody's heard of them because they don't do anything (Void Lord want to consume the universe because they're personification of nothingness and seek to turn all things into nothingness, but hypotethical "Light Lords" would probably be fine with the universe being a thing and have no need to mess with it).
Although the Chronicle cosmology makes the Naaru turning into Void-beings upon death a bit weird. Does the same work in reverse?
>>48291064
No, the theme about Blizzard's lore is its all Nobledark.
If the heroes don't pull snowflakes every couple of years, the whole universe gets munched instantly.
>>48291062
Eh, the naaru are giant light elementals, and Chronicles goes so far as to say that the humans started worshipping the light because naaru mindfucking.
>>48291064
>Does the same work in reverse?
yes, AU Velen kills himself on a void being to turn it back into a naaru in WoD
>>48291062
Thought it was all but confirmed that Elune is the worldsoul of Azeroth (ie. the soul of the unborn titan that Azeroth will turn into). The Well of Eternity is literally supposed to be the titan's blood (apparently titans bleed pure arcane energy), and it's mentioned that early night elves (or the trolls who became night elves) believed that Elune slept in the Well when she wasn't being the moon. In the Legion prologue questline Magni explains that he telepathically spoke with Azeroth's worldsoul after being turned into stone, and describes it as being female. There's pretty strong evidence that Elune is Azeroth's worldsoul, or at least the night elf intrepertion of it.
>>48290964
>warhammer has a lot more sense than wow
Sigmarines.
>>48290909
Ehh, I dont think people mind hearthstones existing and being a rare but not unusual magical relic, we had plenty of those over the years. I just hate how hard they are pushing trying to explain every single little thing in detail to billy mccasual who wont give a shit anyway. Like that retarded chronicles book laying out gods and myteries of creation and cosmology like a recipe for apple pie. Where is the mystery, the weight, the discoving of finding clues about how the universe ticks?
>>48290936
>Worship is meaningless in warcraft
Unless you're a night elf worshipping Elune
>>48291164
>Sigmarines
My god.. Demon Hunters.
Welp, yeh, thats it. I'm cancelling my sub. Been a good 4 years on and off, but this thread convinced me it's not worth.
To all the WrA shilling, ignore. It's shit. The lore, that is, WrA is an amazing server.
Warden is the night elf answer to a dex paladin
>>48291164
>Sigmarines.
...and?
>>48291477
Something like that has been running through my head. It would be the same deal how Gwyndolin's Darkmoon miracles in the Dark Souls games deal magic damage, only it scales off faith instead of intelligence. It also puts more of an emphasis on retribution compared to other faiths.
Night Elf paladins (be they Wardens or Priestesses of the Moon) would deal arcane damage instead of holy damage. On another note I also remember one of the TCG night elf priestess being a shadow priest, with her flavor text being along the lines of referencing the dark side of the moon.
Maybe it could be an aspect of the Light that favors vengeance over compassion and justice?
>>48291164
>Sigmarines.
you know, no one mentioned AoS
>>48291762
Oh and I also forgot night elf priests had Starshards (it was a DoT that did arcane damage) as their unique racial until Cata removed all that cool stuff.
>>48290909
Tbh I don't think the problem is them giving a lore explanation for the corpse run world itself. The concept of something called "shadowlands" already existed (DK mount quest involves being transported there, and I think there's also another quest in Wrath where you enter it to kill some shades). Making it a sort of purgatory where souls go on their way to their afterlife even makes sense and would explain why resurrection spells (which do exist in the lore, although are obviously much rarer and difficult than they are in came) don't work on everybody: the spell only works if it can catch the soul while it's still hanging around in limbo and hasn't entered its proper afterlife.
The problem is that they explanation we got is very vaque and mostly just raises questions nobody previously asked (like whether the Shadowlands is a purgatory/limbo state or the entirity of afterlife, and how do various ideas what what happens after death tie into it), while mostly answering stuff nobody really gave a damn about (everybody's always assume the corpse run world is a purely game mechanic thing).
>>48291860
>>48291762
It was just a game mechanic, night elves hated everything arcane related.
>>48292086
Presumably it's the same deal with Darkmoon miracles in Dark Souls. For whatever reason, lunar faith being mistaken for magic has always intrigued me whenever they do that in fantasy settings.
>>48288672
>... much like Illidan
wat
>>48288785
Well, it IS Auchindoun.
>>48291860
>>48292086
Blizzard decided that moon magic does arcane damage for some reason. Balance druids have the same thing with their lunar spells
>>48292190
So where does moon faith magic come from? The Light? Or does it likely come from Elune. If the theory that Elune is the Titan world-spirit of Azeroth is true, and Titans had unparalleled control of the the arcane, does that mean Night Elf Priestesses and druids in general have been using the arcane granted to them through a Titan? This is all just speculation on my part though.
>killing Turalyon and Alleria like some bunch of secondary characters
>handing Ashbringers left and right to every retardin out ther
>Random ass demon killing Tirion
>>48292329
its a night elf only thing, at least it was in the lore.
Priestesses of the moon had starfall.
>>48292431
>the two biggest Mary Sues in Warcraft history get BTFO and we take over for them
based Blizzard
>>48292471
>Turalyon and Alleria
>Tirion motherfuckign Fordring
>mary sues
Nigga, those characters predate Warcraft 3. If anything, our own characters are mary sues for taking the limelight from them.
>>48292329
it comes from a shitty retcon
>>48292549
Which one?
>>48292329
Faith isnt a thing any more. Its like Arcane.
Light/Holy/Divine is all the same, its a different flavor of the same magic kool aid. Its kinda what drove me away from WoW was they cant even get a simplistic pantheon/faith based magic lore correct. Or, at least with less holes than the rest of their lore.
>>48292548
Tirion kind of became a sue in WotLK. Original Tirion (the one in the story, and the one you meet in Plaguelands in Vanilla) was a guy so devoted to his duty that he was willing to have his rank stripped and be ostracised by all his friends to help an orc who had saved his life and shown to be an honorable person.
Wrath Tirion is Lord High Lord Super Paladin, who mostly acts pompous, holds a fucking fair on the Lich King's backyards, and killsteals Arthas.
>>48292548
That's always been one of the biggest problems with WoW. When you don't write the personality of the character a player controls, you can't write an arc for them. If the game were still an RTS, Tirion Fordring would be your hero unit, and no one would complain about him being plot important.
Instead, the players create their own self inserts to play, that the writers then have to slip in between the plot they write and the actually fleshed out characters they write, and can only hope that the players don't get upset about being narrative middle-men.
>>48292727
Argent Tournament was all kinds of stupid. The only good thing was that it gave Anub'arak a fight slightly more befitting his importance.
>>48292762
What would you have done to avoid that problem? I've never liked the idea of my characters being a huge mover-and-shaker in WoW rp, so big lore characters stealing the show never bothered me too much. As far as I'm concerned, I'm just another Blood Knight in his order. But that's just me.
>>48292849
>Argent Tournament was all kinds of stupid.
some of the fights in Wrath were ridiculously stupid. Who the fuck thought the gunship battle was ok?
>>48292927
It was even more stupid because of how pointless it was. The landing crew gets unceremoniously killed off by Saurfang and the ship just disappears instead of giving fire support or anything. Same with all the lore characters huddling in the basement. At the very least I've expected Muradin, Malganis, Sylvanas, Mograine and the King/Warchief take a part in the fight. Or tirion doing anything instead of killstealing us.
ICC was a clusterfuck of wasted potential. It had nothing but empty blue hallways. Just compare it to Naxxramas. Naxx was a fucking base with barracks, factories, research labs and dance floors.
>>48292849
Me as well. Never really saw the point of making Your PC (tm) the Chosen Hero. Like how in WoD every PC is the commander of Alliance/Horde forces on Draenoer, and in Legion every PC is the leader of his class. Seems just kind of dumb to have 900 paladins running around with the Ashbringer, claiming to be the high lord of the Silver Hand. What's the point of it being an MMO, when the fluff is presented so you alone are the only guy that matters? If I'm the commander of Draenor, where the fuck did these 24 other guys I'm raiding with come from, and why am I taking orders from one of them?
I much prefer it when multiple PCs are aknowledge to exist, and they're treated as powerful heroes but not each of them being One True Savior of Azeroth.
Like in Wrath, lorewise the Lich King was killed by Tirion Fordring and his hand-picked group of elite soldiers (ie. us); if it were an RTS, Tirion would be the hero unit and we would be the rest of the units accompanying him. In WoD, most bosses are canonically killed by the Alliance/Horde commander (ie. you, specifically) and some random chucklefucks (everybody else).
Blizz talks about "class fantasy" a lot these days, but when playing on my warlock, the whoe setup in WoD just felt stupid and annoying. Like, I can see my Alliance paladin being the commander of the Draenor garrison; paladins are respected and often hold position in the military (they're pretty much knights with holy powers). I can't see that for a warlock. Damn, it I want to be treated as that guy nobody likes or trusts, but people keep around because he's very good at unleashing hellfire on the bad guys, not have everybody treat me as a paragon of respectability while ignoring the literal demons I have in tow!
>>48292849
I wouldn't have made an MMO in the first place, but that's partly just me being salty. While I do think that the players being important movers and shakers in an MMO can work, I also think you have to build for that from the ground up; it worked for EVE because EVE was never anything but an MMO. Warcraft's historical scale has never been suited for it, and the change was poorly thought out. Ideally they should have set WoW a hundred years after WC3, not a bare handful of years.
>>48293024
>dance floors
If Blizz ever introduces those fucking dance studios (christ those were announced almost 9 years ago), they better reference Heigan.
>>48293048
Yeah, it's a shame how classes that would normally be shunned don't get treated as much. It always annoyed me when you'd have warlocks (especially in WoW's earlier years) who would IC'ly have their demon out in cities and towns that ought to have lynched their summoners on sight. It really did make me appreciate those few warlocks that did hide the fact they were warlocks even more.
>>48293080
The time compression of events in the lore is another thing that annoyed me. I find it incredibly hard to believe the entirety of the Second War took place over the course of one year.
>>48287703
I designed a way to completey circumvent elevator bosses forever. Find some way of justifying creating a "High speed swimming" area in every dungeon with a vertical movement requirement.
>>48287896
>>48287966
Ogres were mostly the crews and cannon loaders, but yeah they still had access to a lot of ships at the end of the second war.
>>48289163
Bah, Knaak was mediocre but some of the dragonflight stuff was decent.
>>48292431
>>killing Turalyon and Alleria like some bunch of secondary characters
they are alive and immortal and like matt ward's grey knight who is killing demons in the warp.
Following situation.
>You are Uther
>Arthas explains the disease and demands the massacre of Stratholme
>You refuse.
>Arthas asks for an alternative. (At the place of "You are now a Traitor!!!"
>>48293681
I wring my hands and act like a pompous know it all elder.
>>48293681
Surround the city, quarantine it, and wait for reinforcements.
>>48293681
Arthas didn't explain shit. He said they were too late, so they have to purge the city. That was the beginning and end of his explanation.
>>48293251
I think this just make it worse.
>>48294225
its alright. they were losing their 1000 year war against the legion that illidan was going to win for them in an exceptionally ott style, but then illidan was killed off.
>>48293181
>Bah, Knaak was mediocre but some of the dragonflight stuff was decent.
Knaak was awful at plots and storytelling, but his general lore ideas were pretty decent. I've yet to see anyone name a flaw with them aside from "they were written by Knaak".
>>48294530
>but his general lore ideas were pretty decent.
Time travel is too powerful.
Thousand year old dragons who can appear as any humanoid they want diminshes the humanoids.
>>48294783
The whole onyxia/bolvar thing in vanilla was fucking awesome though tbf it just can't be overused
>>48294932
yeah. thats the thing with blizzard. they run everything into the fucking ground.
>>48287262
Are you insane?
The whole idea of Blackwing Descent is showing how inconsequential and neglible Nefarian is in comparison to the other evils of the expansion. It starts with the name and just goes as a theme throughout the raid, with Maloriak and Atramedes being straight examples. ¨Mustn't fail again.¨ and ¨This miserable existence finally ends.¨
And Nefarian takes note of himself: ¨Defeat has never tasted so bitter.¨
He has no power anymore, is outshined by the old gods and daddy. Just a glorified pinata to be smacked for loot and quickly forgotten by new players.
>>48295316
eh, the raid/dungeon looks pretty cool. thats about it. the entire idea of that raid is dumb.
One of the most intelligent creatures on azeroth becomes a meme.
>>48295316
>despite being dead for an extra 4 years, Nefarian's corpse still looks way better than Onyxia's
Varian sure did a number on her I guess.
I hate BWD just because of Metzen narrating everything. There's enough of that in Dragon Soul
>>48293048
I'm fine with it. I mean, assuming you played from the start of vanilia until now. Your character pretty much saved the world at least 40 times. I like how the game actualy fucking acknowledges your importance.
This does bring up the problem that a very large amount of players did nothing special. And yet are still greeted like the second coming.
Frankly. Final Fantasy 14 did the whole "The player character is the best ever" thing infinitely better.
>>48295486
how did the nips do it?
>>48295316
BWD did have one great thing going for it: It was a playable saturday morning cartoon, in the best possible way.After a few rounds of patching, that is.
The voice clips alone had me laughing out loud.
So show of hands: If someone was recruiting for a Warcraft campaign, how many of you would actually sign up and not drop out?
>>48295486
>Final Fantasy 14 did the whole "The player character is the best ever" thing infinitely better.
A shame the main plot takes fifty levels to get remotely interesting.
Some of those class quests, though. Rogue quest chain was just non-stop fun for me. I once meant to take a half hour break from my main job to do one rogue story quest. I wound up spending hours leveling just so I could do the one after it.
>>48295379
Yeah, you can call it dumb, but it's just plain true.
If you think about what you just came out of, from a story AND player point of view.
It is an in joke about revamping and reusing old encounters and a nod to how the the stakes changed step by step.
>>48295536
>Slayer of Stupid, Incompetent and Disappointing Minions
Oh yeah it was.
>>48295587
I might sign up, sure!
Skype?
Only question is if we're using the '''new''' lore of the Chronicles or not, because that stuff is weird.
>>48295627
>>Slayer of Stupid, Incompetent and Disappointing Minions
>tfw running BWD before raid night to get the title
>>48295587
Give me a time and date and I'm in. I'm about to start working, so I don't know what my schedule will be though.
>>48295587
What system and when?
>>48295506
Well. For starters everybody has to clear the vanilla main quest line before doing expansion content. So your incredibly reputation in universe is very much justified.
More importantly however is that while everybody is the chosen one. There's a actual good in universe reason for that. So you don't run into the problem of having thousands of people be something that only one person could be lore wise.
Well, besides maybe the class quests. But that's rather secondary.
>>48295587
Yes. As much as i like FF14. I will admit it takes a while to really get going.
And yeah, class quests are awesome. The lancer quest line was probally one of the main things that kept me going until things started to get intrestring.
What do you guys think of this?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=1117&v=AwPko_wYTQk
does it mean anduin will get shit done?
>>48295587
>So show of hands: If someone was recruiting for a Warcraft campaign, how many of you would actually sign up and not drop out?
Sadly I wouldn't.
Would like to, but can't promise my time and I would most likely have too hard a time to not dm in a warcraft campaign.
>>48295587
depends on the timeline
A post second war era would be fun, or outland post TBC would be fucking amazing.
So, while we are at it, how would you do Atramedes on the table?
>>48296426
keep a tally of how loud they're being. Dashing or moving too loud in general, talking, casting or attacking all makes it easier for him to find them
>>48292849
Argent Tournament was originally supposed to be in Crystalsong Forest, that's why there's Sunreaver and Silver Covenant base, but no quest or anything interesting going on. At the last moment, Blizzard decded they move it elsewhere, because Dalaran was in the general area and it would mean too many people concentrated in a single location.
>>48293024
You know, I've mused how funny would be if instead of fighting Arthas, Skybreaker would drop that fuckhuge bomb from its hold on his head, as he's sitting on top of the ICC, open to the sky.
Same with Deathwing in Dragon Soul... instead of jumping on his back, just bomb that fucker. With Theramore-yield mana bomb, you were messing with the focusing iris already anyway.
Who needs Tirion and green Jesus when you have magical nukes?
>>48295587
I would be up to it, depending on format, timezone and system used
>>48296618
they probably had Deathwing blow up Orgrim's Hammer specifically so that people wouldn't ask "why didn't they just shoot him?" and then forgot Skybreaker had that xboxhueg bomb
>>48295587
I'd be up for it, depending on day/time. And which system. Is it Warcraft, World of Warcraft, or the WoW 5e homebrew posted a thread or two ago.
Question for alternative warcraft setting: How to get the night elves as allies of the horde (rather than as allies of the alliance)
>>48297099
Thrall does anything but go "lol accidents happen, keeping chopping trees" to the Warsong after Hyjal
>>48289749
Where you by chance planning something with that table Anon?
>>48297099
Thrall is not a retard after the events of WC3 and just keeps up the existing alliance. Everything the warsong and the forsaken did in vanilla and Thrall refusing to redress any of those grievances was fucking retarded..
If you want to go real alt-setting have him disband the horde into a loose confederacy of orc, tauren and troll clans and relinquish the position of warchief instead of trying to build an empire.
>>48297192
Just made it to give a clearer view of my perceptions of the different nations in that conversation, specifically how Lordaeron and Azeroth/Stormwind may be more distinct in other ways beyond military.
Made a similar thing in the past and will probably keep it and look at it while working on a wc3 project though.
>>48297250
Thrall and his horde staying within the confines of Durotar would've been nice.
>>48295986
Pugilist quest line was top notch. Too bad the monk one sucked shit.
>>48297350
Nah, let them spread around Kalimdor but make them diverge in flavor. You can have traditionalists retaking old clan names and rites like Bonechewer and Laughing Skull and break off into Feralas and Un'goro to fight shit, new clans forming about new ideas and identities, like night elf-friendly ones based in Ashenvale or anything you like. Even Wc2 throwback demon-worshipping revanchists who want another go.
>>48295587
I'ed be all over this anon.
>>48297439
>Laughing Skull traditionalists get mad that Durotar isn't dangerous enough and start wandering around Kalimdor trying to find somewhere as death world-y as Gorgrond
>their face when Un'goro Crater
>>48297553
Don't really see why laughing skull would be part of thralls horde to begin with.
They weren't in the second war.
He wasn't part of Ner'Zhuls campaign, in fact they helped the alliance expedition on Draenor.
Is there any mention of them crossing over to Azeroth later on?
>>48297665
>Don't really see why laughing skull would be part of thralls horde to begin with.
they wouldn't be, that guy just mentioned them and I thought it'd be funny
>>48297665
Clans were all abolished except the Warsong and Frostwolf, the Horde was always meant to be a temporary thing by the original orcs. It was always weird how they remained full warmode and attempted to rearm and wage war immediatly despite Thralls constant and ineffectual calls for peace. It was completely within his power as Warchief to call an end to the campaign, disband the horde and let clans re-form from scratch. The Shattered Hand did that even in the main universe as a brotherhood of assassins.
It would be a great excercise in worldbuilding and orcish culture to show how these new clans form. Most of the time they would have very little to do with their original incarnations as most young orcs cant even recall draenor, but formed form a desire of connection and culture of their homeworld. Plus you'd be free to make shit up as you go and use everything from MU, AU and everything that was retconned before as you like.
>>48297850
Was the alliance not also a temporary thing?
>>48297943
It was, but Terenas kept it together as long as he could. Gilneas got the fuck out as soon as they could and the elves and Stromgarde left because Antonidas and Terenas refused to genocide the orcs and kept them in camps trying to cure them. I cant recall shit about dwarves and gnomes joining and leaving so fuck knows.
I really hate how Alliance essentially means Stormwind now in the game. Vanilla was fully with implications how the night elves will be soon the ones calling the shots and Lordaeron remnants like Southshore were never adressed.
>>48298034
During Ner'Zhuls campaign in the wc2 expansion it is mentioned that Kul Tiras is no longer part of the alliance.
I think in the wc3 manual it is said that first the elves leave the alliance and that prompts Gilneas and Stromgarde to leave as well.
IIRC the wc2 expansion manual says that Stromgarde and Gilneas leaves there already, will look it up.
If that is the case the wc3 manual retcons it so the elves leave first.
The elven sorceresses in wc3 are from Dalaran and the elven priests are religious volunteers from quel'thalas btw.
>>48298171
Oh and I find it peculiar that Northeron/Aerie Peak/Wildhammer dwarves are part of the alliance in wc3, since in wc2 they are mentioned as being there just because they are allied to the elves, but the elves leave the alliance yet the wildhammers remain.
>>48297332
Oh that's pretty cool then, that being said to that Anon wanting to run a game, is he still around or?
>>48297850
Hrm, then would we have new clans forming up from scratch then or would we have clans that are brought back but the orcs who form them have no idea what the clan is really all about aside from mumbled oral recordings from the veterans who have to reach back far into their blood lust ravaged minds to understand what they had saw and even then they didn't see all of the rite and ritual of their clans since they were just grunts?
Some ideas that thought of that would be cool for clan names for Azerothian orcs.
>Scorpid Eaters
Farms and uses Scorpids as pets and main stay of food, rite of adulthood and passage would be to eat as many venom sacs before passing out or voiding stomach, current record so far has been fifteen by Cheiftan 'Iron Belly' Norgrun
>Boar Hunters'
Despoiler's of Quill Boar territory and makes good use of the pig meat they harvest from the Quill Boar's livestock, will often use the quills from their slain enemies as arrow heads or as needles for inking their fearsome facial tattoos.
>Plains Runner
Orcs that felt a deep spiritual connection with the Tauren and their ways deciding to forgo most if not all sense of permanent settlement these orcs make a living following their mixed herds of gazelle, kodo, storm lizard and even a few giraffes. They are also adept raider's when the times calls for it using their wolf mounts to great effect at herding or raiding. Basically orcs who are tauren-weiabous
>Hot Foot
Living out in the most harshest regions of Durotar, a deep seated self loathing of their previous actions this clan is formed from old war veterans who make due with scarce resources. In the meantime the orcs meditate and ruminate upon their past actions believing that by living with the bare necessities they might redeem themselves of the horrors they had committed.
>>48298171
>IIRC the wc2 expansion manual says that Stromgarde and Gilneas leaves there already, will look it up.
>>48298190
Thats a retcon for you. Then in cata they got retconned again but that can be forgiven because their Twilight Highlands villages look far better and more characteristic than their dinky little Hinterlands one.
>>48298251
I dont like any of those :^)
But I respect your opinion and you are completely free to do whatever, its not like names like Black Tooth Grin or Bonechewer were heights of creativity either.
>>48298171
>If that is the case the wc3 manual retcons it so the elves leave first.
Says here that Kul Tiras remains as well so I assume it retcons the departure of Kul Tiras in beyond the dark portal as well. Or they came back. probably the first one.
>>48298251
>Anchor Swingers
These fuckers are looked upon with a no small amount of digust, they are a clan of pirates who sail the high seas, yet despite their dishonorable ways a tenth of the loot they plunder is always given back to Ogrimmar which is used to help build the city for the orcs to meet and have a place to call their own. It is because of this that Thrall does not banish this clan for it's reckless use of baiting the remaining forces of Kul Turis' expedition into battle time and again. From the small outpost upon the shores of Durotar to the island chains that lead all the way back to the great merchant City itself. Their standard is of a fist holding an anchor by it's chain.
>Ghost Howler
A group of orcs who have settled into the business of breeding wolf mounts for the raider's of the Horde. Though with the disbanding of the official Horde these orcs continue to keep their wolves strong and proud to bear the weight of any orc worth his tusks. Bloodlines are meticlously kept for the most vicious and deadiliest mounts that the orcs can raise. These orcs are always trawling through the world looking for new breeds to integrate.
>Raptor Riders'
Orcs that rather enjoy the Trollish way of life and as a result have taken to many of the same practices save for voodoo and cannibalism.
>>48298330
That's fine, it's also in my power to call you a little shit who can't into creativity, but that's just common courtesy of course. Got any ideas to offer up?
>>48298340
And then in TFT Daelin returns clearly part of the Alliance commanding an Alliance navy, speaking in the name of the Alliance holding an Alliance rank. Guess they just didnt care. When metzen can go around forgetting entire races everything can happen.
>>48298340
>says here
Posted the wrong page
>>48298251
>>48298389
>Forest Brothers
an offshot of the Warsong that deserted when Grom drank Mannoroth's blood. Since Hyjal they've been wandering the forests of Ashenvale and Azshara trying to eke out a living trapped between the night elves and demon remnants
>>48298623
Oh that's good, What about like a Geomancer clan that is full on venerating the ancestors so they try to do as many rituals and chores for the Elements? Sorta like a zealot for the elements instead of the Light.
>>48298389
I'd not try to reinvent the wheel but use and repurpose existing clans. Even WoD failed to use them all.
Ancient and well-established clans like Bleeding Hollow and Blackrock should certainly attempt to reform and stay pretty much the same. More focused, class based clans like Shattered Hand for rogues and Shadowmoon for casters would survive with its identity more or less intact. Then the last tier, clans that have nothing to do with the original one except a single, overarching concept the clan is built around. Like Bonechewer, I'd just run with the cannibalism and bone fetish theme and make them trollaboo voodoo orcs, or Laughing Skull becoming a neutral mercenary faction open to any race or Whiteclaw orcs outright advocating alliance with the uhh, Alliance. Even new clans would be introduced related to existing ones, either as offshoots or founded by strongmen attracting clanless orcs.
I'd also make my campaign about exploring how clans and their different philosophies interact instead of making donut steels. If I really had to I'd make one thats l a huge extended family of fishermen living at some secluded place. They dont like to fight(too much) but they like fishing, the sea, and watery blue paint markings and tattos. They have literally nothing special except some "secret" baits and family gumbo recipes. Not every orc has to be some kind of shaman or ultra-specialized fighter. Then name the clan the good old warcraft way, some nounverber, like Seastrider or Wavedancer clan.
looks like the end begins next week
>>48298885
That's fair, the reason I was going for the donut steel clans was that I remember there being some thread a while back that had a bunch of crazy orc clans that spawned all over the place with crazy stuff, like one clan that had fought killed and settled in a lich's domain and that the clan cheif is decided by the one who can hold their hand the longest over the flame that continues to burn down below in the lair that has yet to go outSecret is that hte flame is the lich's soul stone and is slowly rebuilding his strength from the partly sacrifices from the orc's hands.
>>48298892
Thank fuck.
Goodbye WoD.
>>48298892
Are there any pre-expansion events?
>>48299787
demon invasions and a notZombie Plague where you get to be a dreadlord
>>48299787
>>48299856
Unfortunately, the pre-launch event is not going to be released upon patch day. It's pushed back a couple of weeks, supposedly so players can adapt to the class changes.
>>48289456
Brotherhood of the Horse never forget.
>they will never actually be mentioned
>>48290936
I've always seen the Light as off-brand Christianity with 2 parts of the Trinity filed off. Leaving the Not!Holy Spirit to run around granting blessings and answering prayers n' such.
>>48292685
>homogenizing every philosophy, religion, and magical tradition into differently flavored mana
blizzard no
>>48301198
>TFW both my posts
Yea, lore is now off the shitter and into the box of aids needles.
The Light doesn't do that, never has, apparently
This is what just got me to leave wow, but think of it this way..
As you must focus and gain 'intelligence' for arcane magic and such, '''Holy''' is merely the power of belief. Thats it. No higher power.
I feel like Metzen fully donned his fedora on this one, my worst fear is now true.
Oh, but the BBEG of the Void? Yea, thats sentient. And when you die you're its bitch.
Subscribe today ! :^)
>>48297099
>>48297129
>>48297250
>Thrall is not a retard after the events of WC3 and just keeps up the existing alliance.
That's actually what I'm doing in my campaign. Nelfs are still trading partners with the Horde.And the Forsaken are off crying in a hole while hoping no one attacks them, since the Horde has no reason to want a foothold on the Eastern Kingdoms. They've washed their hands of the continent.
Great part of tabletop games: I don't have a mandate to stick to red vs blue faction lines.
>>48302329
>Great part of tabletop games: I don't have a mandate to stick to red vs blue faction lines.
People like you are why warcraft can still be a lore filled setting. It's past can be salvaged, its future is gone
>>48301924
metzen doesn't even do anything anymore. He is developing 'lore' for overwatch.
>>48303163
This post makes me hopeful for legion.
>>48298034
>Vanilla was fully with implications how the night elves will be soon the ones calling the shots.
Sounds fun and logical. In Warcraft 3 they were a faction on equal footing with the Horde and the Alliance with many allies.
Would that have a cultural influence on the alliance?
>>48303250
kek. Kosak is in charge of lore, along with neo-blizzard team of fame that determined the story of SC2.
Remember those scenes where jimmy was a drunken wreck trying to get his shit together and failing miserably?
that was metzen.
The cowboy from SPESS who rides into town and saves everyone from the ebil mengsk, protoss fanatics and the zerg is neo-blizzard.
>>48303267
Which one was behind Cata lore?
>>48303254
sent too early.
>+ the kingdoms were massacred by the legion and the scourge. So already severely weakened.
Now it is complete.
>>48303297
Kosak and metzen and a bunch of other people.
>>48303254
Soldiers reacting with a mix of widly different emotions at their new thousand year old purple amazon leaders. Plus that one guy trying to pet fairie dragons.
>>48303267
Mengsk not being a brilliant bastard still makes me buttmad. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X6bVj-nTkiU
>>48303254
What ever did happen to those large number of elven allies? Mountain Giants would be mighty useful these days.
Or all those badass night elves focused on throwing weapons? Still feels weird to have Night Elves and Trolls as races and not have a Throwing Ranger or Throwing Warrior build.
>>48303254
probably start influencing the alliance by demanding enclaves in EK lands like the greenwarden grove in the badlands. It would be cool to see a sentinel outpost in the elwynn forest or westfall, doing mad druid experiments.
>>48303326
they would all be confused boners.
>>48303341
They'd probably be in Duskwood, STV, Hinterlands, and Wetlands mostly.
>>48303367
watching droods trying to cure duskwood would be cool
>>48303341
Its interesting how pragmatic elves actually are in WoW. They are completely on board with their allies strip mining and harvesting wood during a war instead of breaking into vegan lectures. They even put up with allied magic users.
>>48303339
>Or all those badass night elves focused on throwing weapons? Still feels weird to have Night Elves and Trolls as races and not have a Throwing Ranger or Throwing Warrior build.
Yeah I was really disappointed back in vanilla how you couldn't be a troll focusing on chucking spears.
Throwing weapons were a thing in all of the rts games so just so odd.
Orc spearthrowers in wc1, troll axethrowers in wc2. Argueably gryphon riders as well.
In wc3 you have headhunters, huntresses, dryads, all the neutral troll creeps, shadow hunter and spellbreakers,
>>48303341
>probably start influencing the alliance by demanding enclaves in EK lands like the greenwarden grove in the badlands. It would be cool to see a sentinel outpost in the elwynn forest or westfall, doing mad druid experiments.
I don't see them as imperialistic as orcs, humans, forsaken and dwarves though so I'm not sure they'd start setting up outposts in westfall and such.
>>48303370
Some druids coming do duskwood to heal the land is plausible though.
I mean that's why even high elf priests in wc3 came to Lordaeron.
>>48303827
I can see elves and Alliance focusing on Plaguelands Quel'thalas. In WC3:FT, nelves were friendly to blood (high) elves, and they would likely try to help their kin, especially as belves turning to fel was a fault of one of their own. Malfurion saw what happened to the land and I'm pretty sure he would want to help, even if Tyrande was less friendly to other races.
If there was no needless antagonism between Horde and Alliance created to explain PvP, Alliance could spend more resources to deal with undead (both Forsaken and Scourge). Sylvanas could propably make some deal to create a truce until the Scourge is dealt with (similar to what she did with Garithos in FT). It wouldn't last, but it would give her some more breathing room.
Scarlet Crusade, supported by Alliance (in vanilla, they had an ambassador in Stormwind and worked with Alliance in Desolace) would turn out a less paranoid and xenophobic, as they wouldn't be on their own, and dreadlord's influence would be lessened.
It would mean the Lich King would become target sooner than in WoW, before he could gather so much strength. (BC and WotLK shoud've been released the other way around anyway). Unless the demons reopening the Dark Portal intervene, Arthas would be dealt with... RAS wouldn't get so much time to prepare their coup, Forsaken wouldn't be a part of the Horde, and Garrosh would still be emo in Outland, so the peace would hold.
I can see Dark Portal leading to a new demon invasion during the Northrend campaign, which would mean Alliance attention would be split between two threats. Horde wouldn't be threatened, but orc would want to reconnect with their homeworld. There would be lesser support to demons amongst belves, as with Alliance help on Azeroth, they would have less reason to go to their "promised land". Kael'thas would still join with Kil'jaedan (that was about personal power), but his armies would have less elves and more demons.
>>48304252
cont.
That would potentionaly make him more dangerous (if he recieved more support from the Legion), but it would also mean the elves would rebel against his rule sooner. Alternatively, he'll just be weaker overall.
Aftermath of Burning Crusade would see some strenghtening of the Horde, as orcs from Outland would want to migrate to less shitty lands in Azeroth. That would create a change in balance of power between the factions (and bring Garrosh to the Horde), but Alliance would still be stronger. Not sure if draenei would ally themselves with the Alliance or the Horde, I can see them remain neutral in a world with less mutual hostility. They may go along better with belves, if the later refrain from Naaru-sucking shennanigans.
>>48301924
>Oh, but the BBEG of the Void? Yea, thats sentient
No it's not.
>>48303339
>What ever did happen to those large number of elven allies? Mountain Giants would be mighty useful these days.
they only help the elves when the entire planet is in danger, otherwise they just want to be left alone. There's a questline in Cata Feralas where you go and reenlist all of the night elves non-sentient auxiliaries, but you can't find any chimaeras because they all died in the Cataclysm
>>48304333
void lords are actively trying to use corruption(tm)
>>48305532
>void lords
Are guys who live in the void.
The Void is no more sentient than the Twisting Nether or the Great Dark Beyond.
>>48303381
They hate a lot things more than arcane magic. Legion, Satyrs, Qiraji.
>>48305799
Yeah, but many fan interpretations paint them as screaming greenpeace/peta fanatics instead of the laid back, harmony and cycle of life focused druids who look at the bigger picture. IIRC one of their first quests was killing random wildlife because they have overspread and even their ancients in WC3 ate trees to heal themselves.
>>48304252
I think that was more because of the circumstatnces, some desperate elven warbands met in a sea of undead focused on some other shit.
>Scarlet Crusade, supported by Alliance (in vanilla, they had an ambassador in Stormwind and worked with Alliance in Desolace) would turn out a less paranoid and xenophobic, as they wouldn't be on their own, and dreadlord's influence would be lessened.
IIRC Brother Anton was one of a kind thing, he remained a cool guy while all the other cool guys left and formed the Argent Crusade leaving the core of screaming fanatics behind.
>>48305799
And I think generally their view on arcane magic has been "we don't use it because the last time we did we fucked up the world", rather than "all mages are evil and must be purged". Considering what overuse of magic seems to do to elves (see what happened to blood elves once the Sunwell was destroyed, and what happened to the nightborne elves in Legion), that was probably a very smart decision. Humans seem to be able to use arcane without major problems (although occasionally some mages turn to fel magic because they want Moar Power), but elves get addicted to it to the point where they devolve into twisted, near-mindless creatures if deprived from it after the dependency has manifested.
>nelves
sexy purple skin
long hair
shun mage shitters
pure
>blood elves
players use shit tier tan skins
whores
too many short hair styles
lots of mages
nelves best elves
>>48306323
>nelves
keep ruining the world
bang animals
>belves
cute
have sweet robots
>>48306360
>>48306360
>nelves
Hypocritical luddite furries who hate magic yet worship the source of their magic
>belves
edgelords fedoras
>High Elves, Quel'Dorei, Children of Noble Birth
Beautiful and graceful. Respectful of nature and good magic users.
Worships the light.
Allied with the best dwarven clan.
Keeps their magic hidden from the legion with their runestones.
Help humans to keep their magic hidden as well, and even form a council with them to stop more demons.
2/3 good windrunner sisters who aren't defiled by Knaaks greedy hand.
>>48306459
go to bed Vereesa
>>48306504
Vereesa hates herself?
>>48306459
>High Elves
I'm sure all ten of them left in Azeroth appreciate you remembering them
Besides, we all know the best elves aretrolls
>>48306560
>I'm sure all ten of them left in Azeroth appreciate you remembering them
There are no canon numbers in warcraft.
When there were, there were more high elves left in Stormwind than there were trolls in the horde.
>>48306568
>tfw no qt high elf neighbor in the old town to gossip with.
>>48306541
Vereesa is a high elf isn't she?
>>48306244
Think the ease by which elves become dependent on arcane energy derives from the fact that it's part of their origins as a race? Whether or not you like the official canon of night elves being descended from dark trolls who lived by the Well of Eternity, one way or another night elves emerged primitive humanoids living next to the Well. So them, using arcane magic is part of their heritage, so not using it is akin to cutting off a limb. Never mind that "limb" only appears after you exercise it.
>>48306664
yeah, and she was literally made to be knaak's Self insert's wife.
>>48306723
every female character in Warcraft post-WC2 is Knaak's self insert wife
>>48306742
not maiev.
or liadrin.
Shit, fell asleep and forgot about the thread.
>>48295628
>Skype?
Probably Roll20, text only.
>Only question is if we're using the '''new''' lore of the Chronicles or not, because that stuff is weird.
As I don't have the book, probably not. And the stuff I'm aware of, like the baby Titan thing, won't even come up.
>>48295712
>>48295943
>>48296738
>>48297084
>>48297467
4e D&D and the current schedule is leaning towards Tuesdays or Thursdays, around 5 or 6pm EST.Yeah, 4e. We work with the tools we have.
>>48296242
Current plan is to start around either the end of vanilla or very beginning of TBC, then play until it gets boring. By beginning of TBC, I mean the portal just opened and the first session would be holding the line against a demonic invasion.
AU timeline, so some details will differ from canon, but not too much. Factions and politics are more complicated,This is definitely not an excuse for forgetting any of the lore, honest. I'm a shitty liar.
>>48306905
Why 4e and not the 5e homebrew stuff?
I'm just curious. Is there a WoW thing for 4e?
>>48306964
>Why 4e and not the 5e homebrew stuff?
I don't have any of the 5e books, so running 5e would be difficult.
>Is there a WoW thing for 4e?
I think I saw a PDF with homebrewed warcraft races a few years back. Not that I'm using it.
Mostly I'm just reskinning existing races and making a few adjustments to make them fit. It's a bit of a kludge fix, but it works. Agonizing over details keeps campaigns from being run.
>>48307017
>>48306905
Welp I'm out, I work those times Anon. Hope you drop some story times if nothing else.
>>48307017
>I don't have any of the 5e books, so running 5e would be difficult.
The core book is easy to find in a 5e general, and it's not exactly a hard game, and the wow conversion looked pretty goodI'm not arguing, I'm just being an asshole and throwing out ideas
>>48306690
I think it had more to do with the absolute dependence on the Sunwell for millennia. The dragons helped out the night elves with the Nordrassil helping to channel the energy of the well of eternity into immortality but the high elves just wasted it on random magic shit.
The blood elves were just full retard edgy idiots out of desperation.
>>48306905
Thursday works for me.
>>48307130
can I just browse the page?
>>48287231
>new lore
Wtf is all this about the Light being nothing more than the force?
Seriously it sounds exactly like the force to me and now it's just 'faith' based casting essentially? Fuck so priests and such are just hopeful idiots the
>>48307218
what?
>>48307288
>Fuck so priests and such are just hopeful idiots the
Anon, did you have stroke?
>>48307288
Light's pretty much been the Force since practically forever. The way it was described in the RPG books makes the Church of Holy Light sounds more like Buddhism that's borrowed aestethic cues from Catholics.
>>48306905
Those times and days sound pretty agreeable to me, but I can't make any definitive promises until I find out my work schedule.
>>48307409
idiots then*
>>48307446
I just never knew all we had on the matter was that Naaru, as corruptible and weird as they are, are the highest level of sentience we have
Where as void lords arent purifiable as far as we know, and everything is consumed by the Void (TM)
>>48307408
I want to see someone run a warcraft campaign up close.
>>48307699
I'm not the one running anything though.
>>48290286
If Kel'Thuzad is suffering it is most likely due to to extreem boredom. I doubt Bolvar indulges any reaserch.
If I were him I would ditch the scourge and go back to Dalaran (in disguise) or go see if he can use the garrosh portal to goof off
>>48306568
To be fair. I'm pretty sure the Darkspear tribe was supposed to be near extinct in Wow. Even though the game doesn't support that in a any way.
>>48308928
Yeah. They were supposed to have always been one of the smaller jungle troll tribes in Stranglethorn, whcih is why they eventually got muscled out by the other tribes and had to move to the small island Thrall found them in. And on the island they were almost wiped out by murlocks of all things.
Although it should also be noted that at least one of the Warcraft RPG books had by the devs' own admission an extra zero on all the population figures for Stormwind. It's supposed to be a big city with a large population, but the numbers they gave in the book make the population of the city larger than that of every other capital city combined by almost an order of magnitude.
>>48307993
I hope they bring him back to work with the Ebon Blade in Legion.
As opposed to forever doing nothing or working with the Legion.
>>48310016
He is canned for the inevitable Scourge 2.0 expansion.
>>48310050
I can't wait for Naxxramas 3.0 where we fight the 4 horsemen we just fucking raised in Legion.
This thread is just a way to talk about a vidya on /tg/. Fuck off.
>>48310137
Nah, someone totally offered to run a warcraft game if he ever comes back.
I don't want to go into it right now cus I'm in an Exalted game but I've been forming a theory that the Shadowlands are created by the Old Gods as a convoluted ploy to capture and destroy all life for the Void Lords.
>>48310311
My theory is that its just another poory thought out retcon out of blizzards autistic drive to "tie things together" to make lore "accessible" instead of having a lot of little mysteries here and there. I really loved the DKs fucking around with shadow magic and spirit realms, it reinforced the idea of undeath is not just a physical thing but a spiritual one too without hammering it in.
>>48310311
>>48310311
go on.
>tfw you realize that Garrosh did du stuff wrong but that's why you like him
second best villain in the setting after WoW made Arthas a retard. It's too bad they handled him so poorly in WoD
>>48310456
I was thinking of making a youtube video explaining it, but maybe I'll post a cliff notes version here later.
>>48310156
Still working on it. It'll probably take another week or two at minimum to get it started.
I'll get around to making a Roll20 page and post a link eventually. Maybe tonight, maybe next week. And if I'm being realistic, it'll probably take another week or two of discussion with potential players to hammer out a campaign that will please everyone.
Assuming enough people stick around for to be workable. I've been working on ideas for the campaign for a month, but half my regular group had their work schedules change. Hence the public casting call.
>>48310519
Having a discord room or something for potential players to chat in wouldn't be a terrible idea.
>>48310559
You're right, that's probably a good idea. But it'll have to wait until after coffee and possibly twelve hours of sleep.
>>48310663
Rad as hell, keep us posted.
>>48310016
Seeing how he fought against the legion, I find it hard to believe he would now work with them.
I just want him to be present in the story, preferably as a snarky ally.
Why can't I be KT in heroes of the storm?
>>48310720
>Why can't I be KT in heroes of the storm?
because he's not an advertisement for a game Blizzard cares more about or something that'll encourage people to draw porn
>>48310765
Not an excuse, HotS has the lost vikings and the necromancer from diablo 2
all I want is blackthorn and the playable silicon & synapse logo in there now
>>48310720
>>48310879
I think a lot of the issue is that he doesn't do anything unique so they are having a hard time finding a role for him.
Jaina is there for ice blasting, D2 Necromancer/D3 Witchdoctor for undead minion pushing and even Arthas is sitting there on 'Necromancy + Ice'.
They'd need to find a thematic role for him that isn't just overlapping with other heroes.
>>48310482
He'd been OK if his characterization was more consistent instead of him seemingly being written by 5 different people with no communication between each other.
On a basic level, most of his actions seem to stem from the belief that, as said by the God-Emperor of Mankind himself, no action taken to ensure the survival of humanity (or ork...anity, in this case) can be evil, no matter how vile it may seem. Everything he did, he did because he thought it benefited the Horde. Whather it actually did is a very different matter, but that's how he justified it. It is better for the Horde if any potential enemies are completely eliminated, regardless of what it takes, and since he has the best interests of the Horde in mind, anybody that threatens his position must also be eliminated for the good of the Horde, even if they're also members of the Horde.
>>48310720
I'd love for Kel to be a frost mage follower. Or frost DK, which would make more sense. Considering some of the crap Bolvar is condoning, it's not like letting KT do his thing is too much of a stretch.
He's loyal, hard working and great at frost magic. He'd be a great ally, so long as you're willing to let him practice necromancy.
>>48310311
Cant be.
They want eternalpain and suffering. nightmarish wrapping of reality
>>48310915
He could be like a support guy I guess? Buff/debuff everything. Or a healer
>>48311001
I'd like to see KT and Anub'arak brough back working for Scourge World Police. Both are definitely capable underlings who would be very useful. Although KT's devotion to Arthas and desire to undeathify everybody might make it hard for him and Bolvar to work together (he probably doesn't accept Bolvar as his new boss, and Bolvar wants to keep the Scourge under control, not go around killing and raising everybody). Anub'arak on the other hand, he hated the Lich King, so if Bolvar gave him more freedom he'd probably be fine with occasionally helping him out.
>>48311123
>I guess
Yeah, that's the issue. You can kinda push him into a role but most of the roles he more naturally falls into are taken.
I'd personally see him in a very 'Inevitable death' sort of way. He grinds shit down, not blows it up as a really tough specialist. Lots of debuff and DOT.
Mind you, seeing old-school Death and Decay as an ult would be fantastic. A massive %HP DOT AOE (At the cost of it ticking rather slowly)
That and The Plague as his other ult. For a brief while, healing instead is damage. Global.
That's a nice fountain you were about to use.
On the topic of Kel'thuzad and WoW liches, is it possible to become a lich without being affiliation to the Scourge? If so, what do you think the requirement to become one independently is?
>>48311184
Curse from the banshee, maybe a frost armor buff, the ability to corrupt a heart with plague would be awesome
>>48311410
Yeah, frost armour/curse would be nice on a buff/debuff caster.
What do you mean corrupt a heart with the plague?
>>48311458
I think he means the little hearts that drop heroes can use to regen health.
>>48311483
Oh, right. Could be a weirdass passive, turning all of those that drop in an aura about him into ones for his team.
Doesn't mean much in a straight fight but it does mean that he's murder on anyone trying to lane against him.
But then, I just generally like the 'Grind them down' theme for him as not many heroes do it currently.
>>48311370
it's possible in theory, but in practice the only necromancers powerful and connected enough to arrange becoming a lich end up joining the Scourge anyway. It's hard to tell the exact requirements but it seems to require a large amount of energy and someone on the other side to pull you back
>>48311612
>>48311370
also, the amount of energy it takes to bring someone back as a lich scales depending on how long they were dead, which is why Kel'thuzad needed the entire Sunwell to become a lich while others made do with a few mid level cultists helping
>>48311062
The Shadowlands are described as a labyrinthine realm of total despair, and it is said the Void Lords can't manifest in the physical world without significant power. The basis of my theory is partially that the Void Lords could want all of the souls of mortal beings (consider that mortality is more or less an invention of the old gods) attracted to one realm, the Shadowlands, a place where the Void might be able to manifest and indulge in torture.
The theory makes more sense if I build up the key points which I'll do when I am not busy.
>>48310720
>Why can't I be KT in heroes of the storm?
His pre-Wrath voice actor is doing Xul, so you can kinda pretend you're KT.
>>48311747
Still a total waste of time to make sense of the neo-lore. WoD should have been the final nail in the coffin.
>>48311766
>His pre-Wrath voice actor is doing Xul,
and Arthas, and Uther. They just need to add Warriv and all the classic Michael McConnohies are covered
