Big Blue Edition
Old thread: >>48211049
>RESOURCES
>Official Site: Contains deck building rules and the current ban list.
http://www.mtgcommander.net
>Deck List Site: You can search for decks that other people have made. Authors often have comments that explain their deck’s strategy and card choices.
http://www.tappedout.net
>Another resource for commander discussion; they have an entire forum dedicated to discussing decks. People often make primers, which go into detail about how they built and play their deck.
http://www.mtgsalvation.com/forums/the-game/commander-edh
>Statistically see what everyone else puts in their commander decks based on what is posted to the internet.
http://www.edhrec.com/
>Find out what lands you can add to your deck, sorted by category, based on a chosen Commander’s color identity.
http://manabasecrafter.com/
>CARD SEARCHING
>Official search site. Current for all sets.
http://gatherer.wizards.com/
>Unofficial, but has GOAT search interface
http://www.magiccards.info
Post your favorite card you think no one else uses. Bonus points if it's not normally posted here.
This bastard with +1/+1 counters is a giant pain in the ass. He's my mimeo's best friend.
How fun/good is Zur, the Enchanter?
Any recommendations for this guy? I want to make it "destroy everything" with a side of voltron.
I threw together a jank Jalira deck that I'm considering running. It's got a price tag, but it's relatively budget for commander.
The general premise is to spam tokens, steal shit, and sacrafice your tokens or the opponent's creatures to Jalira to cheat out big dudes.
Any advice is appreciated, it's an early prototype.
http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/jalira-edh-aka-stealing-and-cheating/
>>48227298
Quite good, miserable to play against.
>>48227297
I think Blighted Agent is a better option, personally.
>>48227308
Illusionist's Bracers and Rings of Brighthearth.
>>48227347
Oh, sure it is because you can actually play blighted agent, and it gives it true unblockability, but the draw back is that it's only a 1/1. I think it's easier to drop 7 +1/+1 counters than 9.
>>48227297
>>48227298
Incredibly powerful, however no one will want to play with you, he's borderline Derevi/Narset levels of unfun.
>>48227347
Bracers are in there, Rings are aquireboard. It's pretty expensive.
>>48227298
In order, how do you rank the 3-color combinations from strongest to weakest?
>>48227505
BUG > WUG > RUG > the rest.
>>48227297
People usually get BTFO when I play this. Then everyone shits their pants after reading it.
>>48227398
I use these with Scry lands in my scion edh. Love em.
>>48227597
Probably more of an availability issue than a choice.
>>48227623
Also the fact that it's not TERRIBLY great in most decks. It's harder to build a "Recruiter package" than a Sunforger package or a Bellower package, and there's not as much value.
But I run a Clone tribal deck, so that card is 100% gas.
>>48227643
Seems like a perfect fit for an Alesha deck.
>>48227651
Like I said, 'most decks'. It's super spicy tech in the decks that can use it, but elsewhere it's not terribly impressive. Great for Alesha or Hydras though.
>>48227505
>Tier S
Sultai
>Tier A
Bant, Temur, Abzan, Jund, Grixis
>Tier B
Esper, Jeskai, Naya, Mardu
>>48227643
You're simply wrong on this, recruiter is much easier to build around than sunforger or bellower (green creatures only)
Imperial recruiter is perfect for setting up low to the ground creature combos
>>48227643
Yea. Its not all inclusive.
I use him in daretti to get squee for free card draws. Plus flavor win.
>>48227696
Its less inclusive than Bellower. Every green deck will have eternal witness.
>>48227297
It always comes out of fucking nowhere.
>>48227659
I feel like a lot of decks have utility creatures with power 2 or less.
>>48227505
Anything with UG > pretty much everything else > Anything with RW
>>48227699
>recruiting a squee for free discards
You have my respect, sir.
>>48227297
I have no idea why I don't see anybody using this guy.
>>48227751
Holy friggity fuck, I've never seen that before and I would absolutely run it.
>>48227505
Depends on the commander. I can name some awful colour combinations with excellent commanders, like Uril, it just depends on what you want to build.
But in general, UGx > WBx > the rest. In UGx you get all the land ramp and card draw that you want. In WBx, you get all of the removal that exists.
>>48227798
The Anti-Red commanders this year will be fun
>>48227843
I'm more excited for anti-white and anti-blue. Fuck that shit. White is the only colour I can think of that's useless on its own, but amazing in just about anything. Blue can be neat, but fuck mono-blue and UR combo players hard.
>>48227870
If Eldritch moon didn't have all those white Eldrazis, I would make Anti-White Eldrazi Tribal
>>48227892
Also, Eldrazi "I'm really worth $40 as soon as a combo breaks me" Displacer is pretty cool. I'm pissed that devoid cards have a colour identity. Literally why? I have to run some 5 colour bullshit just to use cards that are explicitly colourless? That's some meta-bullshit right there.
Top tier:
Esper, Sultai
Mid tier:
Mardu, Naya, Jund, Grixis
Low tier
Temur, Bant, Jeskai, Abzan
>>48227959
>UGx
>Low Tier
>>48227959
>I haven't been playing magic very long: the post
>>48227724
I've gotten a table flip from this card before
So gloriously salty
Thinking of doing a falcon deck with banding, what do you guys think?
>>48228146
Falcons don't exist in MTG, anonit's Birds
>>48228029
Longer than you kiddo. I'm basing my answers off of my local meta. Most are 2 color decks.
>>48228175
Then the people you're playing with are fucking morons. In no universe is "where is my card advantage" Mardu better than UGx.
>>48227298
>fun
not
>good
very
all of your games will be "play zur, attack with zur, get some enchantments that make you impossible to disrupt and you just keep doing that until you win"
its boring as fuck to play
>>48228146
>what do you guys think
Well, it will obviously be awful, and doesn't even get blue birds.
I'd start with ways to recover from wrath effects. Such as pic related.
>>48228190
I didnt say it was better. When there's more Zurgo and Kaalia decks than there are.... What even are the go to Temur legends?
Then my experience and opinions will be different. Is this all new to you?
>>48228338
To ad, in a vacuum I know ugx is the most versatile and dominate combo.
There's a diverse meta where I live. Not everyone net decks the top deck. That would kill the format pretty quick. I'm sorry that your meta is stale.
>>48227298
He is wicked fun and is super power. If you don't like quick combo than it is best to stay away
>>48228387
A Tier list is about the top decks though....
You make no sense
>>48227584
I saw that in a previous thread and immediately bought one.
I'm requesting help on this deck I'm building
http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/daxos-enchantment-lord/
Halp. Please. I'm begging.
>>48228529
>http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/daxos-enchantment-lord/
>begging for help
>has 12 basic lands
Yup, you get nothing with that optimized deck list.
>>48228529
>902$
>Halp. Please
>>48227297
It does some very silly things sometimes. One of my favorite is plucking lands out of an Extraplanar Lens.
>>48227505
Esper jund and sulti are the most powerful because they have the best commanders. Then patriot bant and rug are the next best. The others are hardly worth playing for competitive use
>>48228475
What do I care what top decks are in Chicago or Japan?
I gave a personal opinion based on experience. Get over it
>>48228529
>2x no mercy
JUDGE
>>48228719
I'm not the same person you were arguing with, sorry I made you upset, I was just saying, if you already knew that UGx was the best, you're thought process makes no sense to me
>>48228719
the question wasn't about your personal experience or your local meta though.
>>48228667
You're dumb dude
WUR has bad commander options which contradicts your post, also claiming that WBG isn't worth playing is dumb
>>48228797
>WUR has bad commander options
>Narset, Zedru, Shun Yu
>bad
choose one
>>48228834
Narset is the only one of those that's good, whereas zedruu and shu yun are just playable
What is must have utility to run in Mardu (WBR) and specifically for Kaalia?
Here is my list and I just can't help but feel like it's missing something, aside from literally missing 5 cards.
http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/26-03-16-work-in-progress/
>>48228797
Besides karador name one good commander
>>48228885
While Narset is clearly the strongest Shun Yu is certainly more than playable.
>>48228964
anafenza and Ghave are pretty good as well.
imo wbg also is the best color for reanimator decks and you don't even need to run Karador as commander.
>>48228610
>>48228646
It has 40 proxies, so far. I'll most likely never actually get to that value, especially taking in account roughly 200-300$ are in the land base. The version I'll be playing will have more basics.
Regardless, I'm looking for help more on the enchantment stuff. This is the second deck I'm building, my first one was a mono black goodstuff, so I don't really have much of a clue regarding this. I think I should try to include what I put in the maybeboard, but I have no idea what to exclude. Also increase the land count to 35, maybe. I've been playtesting this in a vacuum, I think maybe I won't have to change anything with the lands, but we all know a vacuum doesn't mean jackshit.
>anyone thinks that Naya is not top tier
moo
>>48229085
>40 proxies
Stop.
>>48229016
We are talking competitively, no they are not
>>48229120
How else am I supposed to test this before knowing it's worth getting the cards? Online with playgroups that don't resemble mine at all?
>>48228795
>How do YOU rank
You can STOL embarrassing yourself now.
>>48229110
I love how it was errata'd between the time it was printed and the time it actually shipped.
>>48229110
>Moo
>Not "b'aaah"
>>48229171
If your deck is so heavily based around your meta that online testing means nothing, then I have bad news for you.
>>48229175
What the fuck is STOL and why does my phone auto correct to it.
>>48227231
Anyone use any online deck builders? (or even ones for your phone?). GOOD being top priority, Free being next.
If so what do you use?
>>48228663
Welp I have known about this card for a while now, but I guess I never actually thought about it, because thats genius. Excuse me while I go spend some money.
How good is this in mimeoplasm? Anyone test it out or experimented with it?
>>48229199
It's more like the few times I've tried playing online, maybe I was just unlucky, but I just found players that didn't do jack shit or played with the jankiest shit ever. However, my experience seems to be more consistent both in my playgroup and at a store in a different town. So I yeah. I'm kinda wary of online testing.
>>48229241
Tappedout
>>48229253
Wew
>>48229242
A couple times people have been about to remove an Oblivion Ring to get something back and you just Pull it out from under them. I've also had a lot of fun with people going out of their way to exile combo pieces and then I just Pull them right into place. It has a lot of versatility and all of it is just stuff that's seemingly really dumb and unexpected.
>>48229110
I think that Rith is baller
>>48229276
How much do the cards you proxy cost?
>>48229370
>>48229120
>guy in my group has a nath deck completely proxied sans the basic lands
>he's been playing it for 5 months now
I mean I don't mind it cause he barely wins but seriously the deck is maybe $80 its just laziness at that point
>>48228338
>Zurgo and Kaalia
>Strong
>>48229370
Total? Like 550$ according to the prices on the tappedout links. Roughly 200$ of these are in lands alone (Scrubland, Marsh Flats, Fetid Heath and Maze of Ith being the most expensive lands I don't own). I'll probably take over a year to fully assemble it, considering I'm just a student with no job yet.
>>48229487
>proxying the og dual lands
There's nothing wrong with this and I own tropical island. Prices for the dual lands are ridiculous
>>48229507
I honestly wish I had started out playing mtg years before. Maybe I would've had the good sense of buying a couple of those before their prices went up.
>>48229507
I don't think there's anything wrong with proxying cards that cost more than $50 in EDH. If you're kitchen table, who gives a fuck? If you're going to a flgs, it's just smart to proxy duals in case your deck gets stolen.
>>48229319
Ew...
>>48229542
I pulled the island, never got the others.
>>48229610
My LGS is cool on proxies, hell vintage and legacy they don't care whatever you proxy unless its something then you're just be a jackass. I don't care about proxies of obviously expensive cards but proxy of cheaps cards or cards that are pricey but your deck doesnt like how not every blue deck needs consecrated sphinx
Hey do "When you cast" effects happen even if the spell gets countered?
>Pic
>>48229723
It does. That's a trigger that goes on the stack and resolves before the actual spell even gets to resolve, fyi.
>>48229723
yup!
>>48227298
People saying Zur can't be fun are just butthurt. I play a toolbox-y Zur deck and it's tons of fun. The only thing that is really douchey in it is Enchanted Evening + Aura Thief, and I've gotten that combo off once in dozens of games played with the deck. It's specifically built to not be super overpowered, but it can still win if it goes unchecked. It's mainly enchantron and pillowfort, with a few "fun" cards that help my overall game plan, like Dovescape.
>>48228663
that's fucking savage
>>48227297
no one ever expects green to crush creatures like this. The surprise has been cheapened now that Beast Within and Song of the Dryads exist, but I'm not complain about green getting such obscene removal
I don't know why I mind proxies of expensive cards. I guess in my mind, expensive cards are expensive because they are broken as hell.
I don't know why it suddenly becomes okay if they spent a lot of money on it. I guess in my mind, I can't ask people to not use expensive cards, but I have free reign over proxies.
Pretty douchey on my part.!
>>48230018
to my knowledge no other /tg pastime has the kind of shit about proxies that MtG does. You'd get fucking laughed at if you brought proxies to a wargame.
>>48230073
Implying you can tell my chinaman castings apart
Also, fucking everyobody was crying out their ass for KD:Monsters scans, how is that any different?
In fact, I'm pretty fucking sure we have semi-regular pdf sharing that is essentially a giant piracy circlejerk.
>>48229982
now even better with the new Sigarda's Aid
>>48230241
>Flash Lignify/Song of the Dryads
>Flash Oblivion Ring/that all players oblivion ring in C15
jesus christ my dick
>>48229140
Competitive ghave is on the same level as competitive Narset and way way better than shu yun
>>48230261
O-ring isn't an aura tho
>>48230280
Fuck I forgotFlash Darksteel Mutation then?
>>48229851
>tons of fun
>dovescape
>>48230321
Alesha is actually R/W/B.
She's pretty stronk, too.
Along a similar vein, maybe check out Marchesa the black rose.
hey guys i'm a big retard and still somewhat new to mtg, can you recommend me a sick cool EDH commander?
things i like:
tribals
resurrection
commanders that are hard to kill
low prices
colors i like:
red > white = black > green >>> blue
the deck is mostly going to be for multiplayer. so far, i've been looking at alesha and wort, boggart auntie, but i don't know about the first one and the latter one seems to be for expensive tryhard combo decks
help guys lmao
if you saw my identical previous posts, i deleted them because i made bad mistakes
>>48230321
Wort is fun and dirt cheap
>>48230313
that works
>>48230321
Alesha is WRB
also, i would go for Horde of notions
it's big, tribal, graveyard themed, and a lot of elementals from Lorwyn with not terrible effects are pretty cheap
i personally use Maze's End and RTR Guildgates as an alternate win condition and very inexpensive color fixing, and lots of panchromatic mana rocks
>>48230339
Reconnaissance isn't terribly expensive and works wonders with alesha
>>48230360
>i made bad mistakes
hi yes hello welcome to EDH
Is there anything worse than whiffing Whims of the Fates on an overcrowded board?
>>48230399
yeah i guess i'll go for a wort but refrain from the "here's my 2000 dollar deck that inf combos at turn 4 and ends the game" autism and go for some cheapo cards instead
any tips to building this thing with the best cost/effectiveness ratio? i'm somewhat poor but more than that i don't want to spend too much money on cardboard
>>48230468
What attracts people to randomness?
>>48230561
Depends on how cheap you want to go
Edh is pay to win, or at least, pay to have options, if you want to win on an extreme budget, your choices are limited to a few established gimmicks that work
Whereas if you're willing to spend $200-$500 on your deck, you can make almost any commander work
>>48227302
I'm not sure there's enough white arcane/spirit spells to make it work.
>>48228663
Pull from Eternity and the elf that does the same thing on etb are my favorite cards for fucking with people. So many niche uses.
>>48230643
my friends aren't making pay2win decks either. most of them are in the 100 dollar range as far as i know. so i guess that's as far as i'll go.
i copied some deck i found on tappedout and took all the tryhard shit out of it and i got this. about 30 cards short
http://pastebin.com/EvQ5qcdz
expensive nonbasic lands and combo decks can suck my dick as far as i'm concerned
If you could remove a single commander from the game, which would it be?Oloro is for fags
I'm planning to make an Augustin IV stax deck soon.
Anyone have any hot tips before I start?
>>48227584
Fug I wanted to be the one to post this. This card is a ton of fun.
>>48227584
> with scry lands
Fug that's a good idea. Why have I never thought about that?
>>48227302
Is it bad that my first thought upon seeing this card was 'huh, I wonder if there's any arcane or spirit spells with cmc 0'
>>48230996
Unfortunately, Conspiracy is black, so it won't be in that deck. Otherwise, that + Memnite or Ornithopter would work.
>>48230468
honestly the worst feeling would be getting blown out by such a shit card
>>48230643
>twentydollarsplusshipping.jpeg
>>48230996
there are, but good luck casting them in mono-white EDH
>>48228529
Take out the bad cards and put in good cards.
>>48231121
there's that one, blue arcane spell without a mana cost that's supposed to be spliced. But yeah, you'd need blue and red for that.
>>48231041
Are you kidding. My mono red shenanigans edh loves that card. And when I go all into one pile people are like weeeeee all in. Usually kills one player. Sometimes two.
>>48231220
Gladly!
>>48229140
What are you on about? Boonweaver Karador is one of the signature decks of competitive edh.
>>48230360
Alesha is cute, my friend has a fun deck but one combo he uses whenever someone is open really pisses me off, especially considering the amount of "Indestructable Alesha + Nuke" effects he spams.
A guy runs her with Master of Cruelties, She swings at an opponent, paying 2 mana to get Master into play attacking, circumventing his "attack alone" clause. If they can't block, he is removed and their health is set to 1. Then Alesha resolves her combat damage.
>>48231700
as fun as that sounds, i'm not sure i want to make a combo deck that just 100-0s people to death. i tried a combo deck out in cockatrice once and it just pissed everyone off
I'm thinking of doing something I've never done before. I'm thinking of straight up ordering an entire deck list worth of stuff rather than digging through my stuff, driving to local shops and trading.
Anyone ever do this? Any things to look out for and avoid? The deck is only 200 bucks-ish.
>mfw my sphinx ambassador arrived in mail today
Time to add the finishing touch to my old Isperia deck
>>48231896
I try to not spend money and im lazy (store is like 5 mins walk away) today i needed more sleeves for a deck, i could have gone and bought some but instead i went through my binders and use any black sleeves i had in there and replaced them with penny sleeves
Alright lads, we all know EDH is fun as shit, but sometimes you just need to build a deck to be a royal asshole.
It is now that time. I need to become that asshole. What is the best commander and archetype for becoming No Fun Allowed incarnate?
>>48232317
just play a lot of cards "search your deck for x card and shuffle" and make your turns last 30 minutes on average
>>48232317
>newzuri
>all the ramp and draw
>sprinkle in standard removal suite + counters
>add a sage of hours and deadeye navigator
spend all your turns bouncing an acidic slime
>>48230567
It's fun sometimes when you manage to make someone sacrifice their entire board with Tyrant of Discord.
>>48232317
Izzet Chaos. I have had a single turn take almost an hour. In a 6-man game.
People scooped.
>my 200 cheap foils arrived in the mail
HAHA TIME TO GET HIGH OFF ACETONE
>>48232317
Crab Umbra on Soldier of Fortune with infinite mana. Activate it until all your opponents concede.
>>48232605
even if you're making foil proxies, I cannot imagine what deck you would need 200 for.
>>48232629
You are an evil man and I love you
Why don't people play this? It's so fun
>>48232605
Is it easy to make proxies from foils?
>>48232317
Derevi stax. Stax in general.
>>48232655
Because someone could topdeck free removal
>>48232317
PHELDDAGRIF STAX
No one expects to get buttfucked by a happy flying hippo.
>>48232651
Decks.
>>48232656
Would be easier if office depot still carried window decals
Spicy Dralnu tech coming through if anyone wants it
>>48232755
shame Dralnu doesn't have red in his CI so you could play Shaman's Trance.
>>48232837
Holy shit
Wow that would have been cool
>>48227302
too color restrictive
>>48232837
>Shaman's Trance
SHIT is there any way to give every graveyard flashback? That on Mizzix would be baller.
>>48232865
Yawgmoth's motherfucking Will
>>48232892
You should probably read Yawgmoth's Will again
>>48232570
So it's not really the randomness but the small possibility of extreme value
See mind twist seems great to me, you can whiff on a huge hand, but for the most part, the randomness is a positive, tyrant of discord is kinda similar, whereas a lot of these "heads you win, tails you lose" red cards seem really stupid
>>48232911
It's in combination with shaman's trance
>>48233038
Oh jeez that's actually pretty neat
I should never have doubted you, pls forgive
>>48233106
Yeah, only problem is the original poster wanted it for mizzix,
>>48233014
The extreme value is only the bonus, the main thing is seeing the salt in your opponent.
>>48232655
I once enchanted a guy with Curse of Exhaustion when this was out. The lock was frightening.
>>48233265
Oh Jesus that's evil
>>48233038
>>48233137
fuck, I was thinking about building Sedris, now I know what needs to be done
>>48232656
>>48232737
Print through FedEx on transparency. $4 for 9 cards, and it's thinner than the original decal method.
Just wanted to thank the Anon that helped me update my Roon lands deck. It runs much more smoothly now. Had a game with Titania, Amulet of Vigor, Roon, and Myroad Landscape on the field and more or less pulled every basic out of my deck (no one else in my meta runs LD) and a small army of 5/3 Elementals on my side. It's hardly a powerhouse, but damn that was fun.
http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/roon-of-the-awakened-realm/
>>48232656
>>48232737
>>48233372
>Making fake foils
I didn't think it could get anymore retarded
>>48227297
Stupid fuck trying to target one of your permanents with removal? Dumb fuck targe5ing the wrong thing? Gay fuck trying to counter one of your spells? This card solves.them all, fo4 the low, low price of 2 mana! Best part is, nobody really ever sees it coming.
http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/the-great-cycle-v20/
how much more tuned can this get? i know i can replace sisters for sidisi, and evolving for overgrown tomb, but aside that, ive gotten better results with the banshee than shriekmaw
>>48233755
Garbage
>>48233265
Nice. I brought out nicol bolas and karn in two turns with it once.
>>48230719
>>48230996
>>48232858
The list is actually progressing fairly well. A voltron deck where every other card is a miniwipe is neat, and it's at that sweet spot where it's good enough to win, but weak enough to be somewhat ignored, especially if you can get something like ghostly prison down.
>>48234544
How so? Not the anon who posted it but interested in hearing your reasoning.
>>48233755
That's the best part of Imp's Mischief. Nobody ever expects this effect from monoblack.
>>48234622
I'm not sure if it's been brought up, I'm going to bed after I post and I don't feel like digging through the reply chain, but the way I see this most done is W Tokens, since your tokens survive the wipe, and just play a suite of well-rounded cmc arcane spells
>>48234877
That makes a lot of sense, but I think I'm going to try it as aura voltron first, just for fun. Are there any indestructibilty things I might be missing?
>>48230360
>>48230829
>>48231885
What's with all the combo hate? I like 4 hours of durdling as much as the next guy, and it can be obnoxious when a deck combos out consistently on turn 3-6, but there's nothing wrong with ending a game efficiently.
>>48234904
Its really a matter of meta. I honestly don't mind combo if, and only if, all players are playing with that sort of shenanigans in mind. This means several players splashed in blue, plenty of counter magic, and people purposely watching for and disrupting combos.
Nothing worse than sitting down with 3 other people, one is combo, and the other two are oblivious (even worse if the combo player politics them into doing stupid shit.)
Personally, I don't find it fun to just play 2 cards and say "I win". But that's an opinion. Since my good friends like to play dumb creatures and token swarm, I'm fine with never comboing at all. If I play at my local store, its either combo, control, or combo/control, however.
>>48234904
I don't get it either. Games need to end at some point, and combo is the best way to do it. Look at it this way, without combo, one person is more likely to get killed and have to wait for hours while the game finishes. I've seen it happen, and its happened to me. It fucking sucks.
What happens when someone combos? Oh no! We shuffle up and play again! The horror!
>>48234968
>combo is the best way to do it
>>48234968
>>What happens when someone combos? Oh no! We shuffle up and play again! The horror!
until someone combos again
the problem with combo decks is that they're not very dangerous until they get their combos, at which point they end the game. it's just anticlimactic to have a battle going on with a guy and then some guy just says "ok i have krenko and blah blah i win now gg no re"
and i say this as someone who has been playing combo decks in the past
I just discovered that my only EDH deck is tier one competitive with around 6-10 changes, so I want to build a more casual deck for when I don't want to play archenemy. What's a fun and reasonably cheap commander with a neat gimmick that hasn't been done 10000000000000 times before?
>>48235088
The best combo decks have game outside of the combos
>>48235172
tell that to Oloro players
>>48235254
I'm honestly very tempted.
>>48235193
Oloro was not a very good example, it is a true control deck while it's not comboing. Just because you don't like control doesn't make it not count
>>48235088
Most decks I've seen that win through an infinite combo are more controlly and essentially win by attrition but instead of winning over 10 turns with the game essentially locked up already they have a combo somewhere in the deck to close it out quicker
My playgroup allows all infinite combos and we've never had a player make a deck that was all combos except one person, he made an ultra high power storm deck that is pretty fun to play against anyway because it's archenemy no matter what, none of us can afford to give him a single turn of respite or we all lose at once on turn 5
I didn't say I don't like control.
My point was that Oloro is a commander that relies on combo win.
>>48235088
I play splinter twin in RUG. People have only got salty at me when I cast tooth and nail with counterspell backup.
>>48235354
I thought we were taking about commanders that do nothing until they win with an infinite combo, i.e. Some kind of gimmick deck like a hermit Druid deck
Oloro is usually a control deck that wins by an infinite combo
>>48235354
Pretty much every control deck has a combo to win. That same deck can probably beat one on one without it, but to win a four player game it's necessary. That's generally how it works for me playing Teferi, where I can win by beating down with an Eldrazi backed by counters in 1v1 but it's not possible in multiplayer. If it's a control deck with a combo wincon, it isn't a dedicated combo deck where it does nothing but combo. This is the same principle that makes aggro not work in multiplayer as well. I wasn't under the impression the criticism was having a combo at all, but decks that do nothing but combo, which there are but most of the good ones do something else until or if it can't combo.
>>48234282
bumping for opinnions
>>48235404
>>48235405
My criticism is for commanders that rely on nothing but combo for their wins.
Oloro has no game outside of comboing out. Sadistic sacrament him and the player just sits their doing nothing for the rest of the match
>>48234282
Morkrut banshee is fine but there's really no excuse for not having Shriekmaw in the deck
Also maybe you prefer the banshee because it hits indestructible and black creatures, but Shriekmaw is the superior card (with great art too)
What other cards should I add for my Sidisi tutor deck?
http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/danse-macabre-4/no Triskelion pls
>>48235525
wurmcoil engine
>>48235525
Bitterblossom/Ophiomancer + Contamination lock.
>>48234958
That makes sense, I play in a few consistent metas, so we all kind of know who has combos, and how they play, so they're manageable. I could see how combos could be obnoxious when no one knows when or who is gonna drop them. The way I see it there are 2 types of combos:
Incidental combos, where each of the pieces are powerful or synergistic on their own, like Kiki-Jiki/Conscripts (from my own Zada deck). Each piece is great on it's own, and if you get both they tend to win the game.
Shoehorned combos, where one or more pieces are nigh useless on their own. My friend has a nekusar deck that used to run the Mindcrank/Bloodchief ascension combo. The ascension is extremely strong on it's own, and works well with the rest of the deck, but mindcrank has none of these synergies, and he just added it for the chance to combo out. I suggested he replace the crank with duskmantle guildmage, which still goes infinite and works well with all the wheels he runs.
>>48235088
If a combo deck can't protect itself, and relies on pity or nut draws to win it is shitty and degenerate, and they deserve to have their shit pushed in. When you see those decks, gang up on them and take them out before they win anticlimactically. Hell, if there is only one combo deck against 2-4 fair decks, you should gang up on them anyways, leaving them alone is just letting them win. Either they learn to make an interactive, powerful combo deck, that can deal with hate, or you convince them that combo is not worth playing. No matter what they do, your meta is improved.
>>48235500
That's not my experience vs oloro decks
Sadistic sacrament does nothing vs a deck that draws constantly and plays a board wipe and a counterspell every turn
You can beat down for the win with trinket Mage and oloro himself once you have the game locked up, most people just prefer to combo, it's more powerful and effective against other good decks that are hard to control indefinitely
>playing nekusar against daretti player
>typical daretti fag, sneaking shit into his graveyard under the pretense of "discarding 2 mountains to draw 2 mountains" until he gets darksteel forge, clock of omens, unwinding clock, etc.
>play this meh-ish as soon as I see forge and omens in his graveyard
>complains about R/B having bullshit combos and scoops
>>48235500
See, no, this is wrong. oloro is a control deck. It wins like control decks do. Commander decks just have the convenience of having access to the eternal card pool to put together combos that can win easier at a 4+ man table than beating down with a Snapcaster Mage or Vendilion Clique
>>48235525
Also Undying Evil for an extra tutor
>>48235575
I've never seen Oloro be cast in any of my playgroups
>>48235606
Well, in the context of my playgroup, you're wrong. The Oloro player just pillowforts until he can either get a sanguine bond/exquisite blood loop or generate infinite mana for an exsanguinate/force draw.
>>48235659
Oloro crumbles to tainted remedy, brosef. Have an oloro player in my group and always gets targeted no matter what everyone else has. Honestly oloro is overrated
>>48235659
Sounds to me like you're confusing "pillowforting" with just being a control deck. Also his color identity includes Bue and Black and his combo of choice is fucking Sanguine Bond/Exquisite Blood?
>>48235500
1) if a deck that is 100% reliant on combo lets you resolve a sadistic sacrament, they deserve to lose.
2) I play oloro, and the only combo is Skirge Familiar/Confessor/Oloro (and Test of Endurance, if you count alternate wincons). The main win condition is grinding them out with Oloro, Palace Siege, Triskadekaiphobia, Retreat to Hagra, Psychosis Crawler, etc. I've also got a minigame going where each person who loses to Triskaidekaphobia has to sign it. The goal is to get 13 signatures. I'm super excited for Cryptolith Fragment.
I know it's not the optimized build, but I've already got a decently tuned Teferi deck, and I like having different power levels across my decks. It holds up well against mid level decks, and is tons of fun.
>>48235693
>Tainted fucking Remedy
>>48235716
Hey just because you can't use it in your deck because you have a group of shitters doesn't make it a bad.
>>48235696
ghostly prison + propaganda + dissipation field + windborn muse isn't pillowforting?
>>48235748
It's controlling, and the point is that playing cards isn't doing nothing until you combo. Also I'm sorry but this sounds like a really shit Oloro deck.
>>48235659
That's the fucking point you tard
He doesn't cast oloro because it's easier to just combo off, but if he didn't have the combo, he would still be able to win like any other control deck, just answer everything, "pillow fort up" and eventually win with incremental advantage
>>48235779
those are textbook pillow fort cards
>>48235748
Why does that not count as doing something?
>deck does nothing until it combos
>here's 4 spells he plays while he's doing nothing
>>48235798
Nigger at what point did I give the impression I didn't know that?
Of course he doesn't cast him. This whole discourse was started over someone saying that Oloro has a reliable gameplan outside of comboing out, which in my exposure to him, isn't the case.
>>48235826
by "doing something" I mean win conditions
>>48235907
Propaganda is a wincon
>>48235924
>doesn't deal (commander) damage
>doesn't force draw/mill
>doesn't give poison counters
>doesn't have a "win/lose the game" clause
no, it's not
>>48235877
The game plan is to control the game and prevent everybody else from winning
How the oloro deck actually closes out the game is irrelevant, that's what you're missing
In other formats, control decks often win just by decking the opponent, they get some sort of card draw tutor engine going and overwhelm their opponents with too many board wipes removal and counterspells for them to win
A combo deck is different, a combo deck is all in on the wincon, they forego disruption and try to win through redundancy and speed, to overcome all disruption
>>48235959
My Azami deck often wins by venser + deadeye navigator bouncing as many spells and permanents as I have mana for
Like ostensibly I'm winning through damage (nav is a 5/5 after all), but everybody scoops before that anyway and it would be silly for me to say my Azami deck wincon is deadeye navigator beatdown
You gotta learn to think outside the box, preventing your opponents from winning is not really much different from dealing 40 damage to them
>>48236053
none of that makes propaganda a win condition
>>48236053
>deadeye navigator
I have never seen anyone not be a massive fucking faggot with that card. I hope you contemplate your life purpose
>>48236021
You're missing that this entire discussion is about how Oloro closes out the game, which makes it quite relevant.
>>48236151
Haha, I'm sorry it bothers you
maybe you should respond to the soul bound trigger with a kill spell ??
If it makes you feel better I prefer the more stylish play of archaeomancer + venser + ghostly flicker to do the same thing basically
And I can tutor all 3 of those whereas I don't run any tutors that can grab deadeye nav
>>48236088
I wasn't the person saying propaganda is a wincon, but really, propaganda + card draw + counterspells, etc IS a wincon
>>48236185
Well you use it in mono blue, you're still a faggot but at least you're honest about
>>48231896
If you buy from tcgplayer you might end up getting like 15 packages. I try to buy all my cards from one website
>>48227505
>best
Sultai
Bant
Temur
Esper
Abzan
Grixis
Jund
Naya
Jeskai
Mardu
>worst
UG(x) is overpowered in commander.
>>48235593
>rakdos charm
my nigga
feels good to cast it when someone goes off with twin or kiki-conscripts
>>48236247
Have you ever played mono blue? It's a lot of fun
Bouncing your own guys to use them again and what not, drawing lots of cards so you always have options, clones give you even more options
>>48236329
>Have you ever played mono blue
No because I have jack shit commanders of mono blue. Doesn't stop me from laying beatdown on my mono blue friends
Should I?
>>48236372
How do you acquire commanders?
I just build decks off of ideas, with the list online, and only then do I buy the commander
If you're just going off what you open in packs I can see how that would limit your options, unless you've been playing for like 10 years
>>48236400
Don't be a pussy, do it.
>>48236400
if you do, Sundial of the Infinite is your friend
>>48236422
I buy most of my commanders, only have 4 decks but I have at least 40 legendaries. Just that my mono blue choices ain't so good
>Jin-Gitaxias, Core Augur(used in my sultai deck)
>Uyo, Silent Prophet
>Alhammaret, Grand Arbiter
>Lorthos the Tidemaker
>>48236488
Just play Lorthos. Lock the opponents out of the game, then beat their faces in when they are helpless. High mana cost means nothing, the game is going to last forever anyway if you're playing mono-blue.
>>48236516
>Just play Lorthos
Can almost guarantee he would get hated on in my group before he was even out. I could just get the teferi precon and edit it to hell but I can't work up the energy to do so
>>48236582
Anyone in their right mind is going to hate on mono-blue anyway.
>>48236582
>>48236631
Anyone in their right mind should "hate on" everybody who is trying to win
I mean they are literally trying to make you lose the game, why wouldn't you stop them?
>>48236582
>the teferi precon
That makes you a massive autist
>>48236631
Just the more reason to not make one
>>48236647
They say commander is a casual format...
>>48236682
>That makes you a massive autist
Does this apply to buying the other precons as well?
>>48236725
No. Mono blue in general is for massive autists. Most mono blue commanders have some stupid unfun infinite wincon. Because of this every mono blue fag thinks they have a crazy cool/unique win con but some infinite draw+ Mana+ counterspell lock is just fucking boring. Essentially just masterbating on the table.Teferi is easily one of them.
I really want to make a warrior tribal deck but I can't decide who I want as my commander. I was thinking either Zurgo, Alesha, or Kresh. What do you guys think?
>>48236582
Are you shitting me? What kind of shit decks are in your playgroup that the priority is to hate out fucking Lorthos? Do octopi trigger you? That's the only fucking reason I could possible fathom. You would probably go after anybody else with blue in their color identity before monoblue fucking Lorthos.
>>48236779
We are all masterbating on the table, it's a game, we play for pleasure
>>48233679
Foils are standard card sized and can be made to be comparable to actual magic card thickness. Its better than printer paper on a land and costs about the same for much higher quality proxy.
>>48236781
Probably Alesha since a creature based strategy benefits from her even if she doesn't explicitly support warriors. Zurgo is not good for a creature deck and kresh has a narrower build around in the sense there's less overlap between small warriors and warriors that care about dying
>>48236779
But what if this is my commander and I want to have fun?
>>48236779
Most good commander decks feature a combo wincon, and that includes Craterhoof
![35[1].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/zf0Vus6.jpg "35[1].jpg")
