Is playing with unpainted models in a tabletop wargame bad etiquette?
>>46664030
No but those dice are.
>>46664030
It is frowned upon as it implies you don't care about your army beyond its capacity to win
>>46664030
Does it not if they acknowledge that they're shitty painters and would be too embarrassed to show them if they did?
>>46664030
This is the most soulless and depressing picture of a wargame that I've ever seen.
>>46664040
Which dice? Still fairly new to tabletop.
>>46664042
>>46664072
I'm fairly bad myself, but even a thin basecoat>drybrush>wash looks ok from across the table.
>>46664030
Kind of? Like I can understand if you don't want to fuck up the models you paid good money for.
But at the same time it's part of the game. You can also strip and repaint if you have something like infinity models. Also bettering yourself and opening up a new medium to express yourself is actually pretty fun and cool. It's like learning an instrument, you may be good at first, you may be average, or you might just be plain bad, but there's ALWAYS room to improve and there's literally hundreds of people making tutorials for free just so you can improve.
I mean, I don't paint very well, but there's an enormous amount of satisfaction when you put your fully painted army on the table. Especially when you did it all yourself.
Also that table just looks sad and depressing..no terrain or paint is just to much.
In the end I feel it's shitty to call people out of it. But at the same time I don't feel bad if some dude at a tournament loses points for bringing a grey horde y'know.
>>46664156
>I mean, I don't paint very well, but there's an enormous amount of satisfaction when you put your fully painted army on the table. Especially when you did it all yourself.
You know, everyone talks about this, but I never got it. I painted a fully army for myself even though I hate painting, and then, I put the army on the table, looked at it, and went "fuck, I regret wasting all that time."
>>46664183
It's more the uniformity, also you're always going to be your harshest critic.
I mean, my Infinity dudes are super average if not bad and I'm still moderately proud of them. They don't look amazing but at least they look like a cohesive unit.
>>46664072
>Does it not if they acknowledge that they're shitty painters and would be too embarrassed to show them if they did?
God I hate this 'bawwwww I can't paint, it looks better as just plastic than anything I can do." Bullshit. Take a look at that photo. Now, tell me what the hell half those models are supposed to be at a glance while they're just primed black.
Bitch, 3 colors with barely any effort and a wash would still look better at tabletop distance, and at least then I can actually tell what the fuck your army of primed Marines are supposed to be. Hell, buy a primer that covers the main color you need and you need maybe 3 pots of paint total.
I don't care if you've got crippling assburgers and the tremors, I've seen guys worse off than that paint and it was still passable at tabletop. You can always strip the models later as long as you're not using fucking industrial latex paint or something.
Seriously, we all sucked when we started out. Stop bitching, grow a goddamn spine, and actual give it a try you spineless shit. Most beginner sets will give you all you need to paint for 30 bucks. The only guy who will give you shit for poorly painted models is probably hated by the rest of the group anyways.
If I saw a guy who had a crappily painted army, I'd probably congratulate him just for actually putting in some effort to field a painted army. I'd offer advice if he asked for it, but I'm not gonna insult some guy because he's new to painting and actually has the drive to try and power through that awkward beginning period.
So yeah, I'd probably get pretty annoyed hearing someone say that.
I can kinda see both sides. On one hand, who gives a fuck what another man does with his toy soldiers.
On the other, painting is what you'll probably be spending most of your hobby time doing, and if you aren't into it, maybe wargaming isn't for you.
>>46664156
I pulled that off the wikipedia page for 40k https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Warhammer_40,000 if that makes it any worse.
>In the end I feel it's shitty to call people out of it.
I'm not sure about it myself, that's why I made this post. It looks much worse and especially with infinity, you have maybe 20 guys at most usually to paint. With warhammer I guess its more excusable with how many dudes you have.
I'm split between They put zero effort into making them presentable and Some people just play for the game, and are turned off by the hobby aspect. The mechanics would function the same if we played with paper stands.I'd honestly prefer paper standups to grey armies
>>46664183
At least you tried, and you have my respect for that.
>>46664217
It more the not feeling embarrassed by fielding unpainted models for me
>>46664030
It is. It's not a big deal unless you're playing in tournaments with a painting score component, but it's still considered bad etiquette all the same.
>>46664030
Yes, but only if you show no signs of willingness to fix it. IE: all of your dudes were unpainted last week but this week you have the bulk of a few squads basecoated.
As long as you're making progress, no matter how slow, it's fine
>>46664359
>I pulled that off the wikipedia page for 40k https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Warhammer_40,000 if that makes it any worse.
That's wild.
>>46664341
I feel that with the growth of more prepainted games players like this may switch games. I know a few people who prefer xwing over the traditional wargames simply because they don't have to paint and glue stuff.
>>46664417
I find it more 'bad ediquette' if there's things you actually should mark. Like facing on infinity models.
If they're not painted because painting is in progress - okay.
If they're not painted because you don't like painting, painting is too hard, paint is expensive, you don't have enough time, other BullShit excuse - go fuck yourself.
>>46664030
That scenery might actually be more horrible than unpainted armies.
>>46664100
yep, me too. And the lack of painted models is the least of my concerns.
Where did you get that picture?
>>46664476
>If they're not painted because you don't like painting, painting is too hard, paint is expensive, you don't have enough time, other BullShit excuse - go fuck yourself.
>actually getting upset over someone else's toy soldiers
I mean, i'd think it's pretty weird to get into wargames if you don't like painting, but whatever you're into.
>>46664487
I thought this too. Also I think unpainted models are fine. Just makes my models look better and makes me feel better about my painting abilities.
>>46664476
>paint is expensive
>go fuck yourself
I think you need to go back to Tumblr where all the other self-entitled babies are.
>>46664572
Really, you're going for the "I can buy all these models but I can't afford a few bucks for paint and brushes" argument?
The ridiculous excuses for not painting are more annoying then the unpainted models.
>>46664537
thats the only picture of people playing the game on that page. Can somebody put at least a vibrant picture, where you own the rights up. This picture there is too depressing, turns people off.
Fuck maybe we should email GW so they put a better one up.
>>46664546
Clearly they led the idea of painting or they'd have picked something else. I guess they just decided they were too lazy or pussied out on learning to paint.
>>46664572
Not him, and I disagree with what he says, but:
>complaining about paint being expensive when you drop $100+ on minis and figures
I get it, that money's usually saved up, but you could also just play with the unpainted figures until you save up the money for paint
>>46664572
>paint is expensive
you can usually do quite well with just like 5 colors and a wash that fits. After that you need to do something about the base and you are fine Won't win competitions but looks adequate.
>>46664609
Clearly they liked the idea of making terrain, or they'd have picked something else. I guess they just decided they were too lazy or pussied out on learning to build terrain.
>>46664030
what's also sad is that the defiler actually looks like a badass conversion, but he isn't painted.
>>46664610
Paint costs too much money, waah, waah - fuck off
I'm going to paint them as soon as I can get some paints and stuff - no worries
>>46664572
I was about to agree with you but bruh Vallejo is like 3 buck a bottle? and you'd need like 5-7 to do a decent army ($21) and that's literally less than a GW clampack including some average 5 dollar brushes.
If you wanted to really invest you could get a nice air compressor+airbrush for as much as a baneblade. Or less than half a kingdom death box.
>>46664637
thats a soulgrinder
>>46664630
Yep, totally.
Who hasn't built some terrain?
>>46664585
>Implying I bought my army
Just calm down, take a deep breath and remember only a neckbeard would get this angry because someone can't afford to paint toy soldiers.
>>46664655
I think anon means the other one
>>46664662
Do you have a reading comprehension problem? I don't care if it's not painted. The ridiculous excuses for not painting are the annoying thing.
>>46664655
you can see the battlecannon
>>46664030
When ever I read a story about tau being bullshit OP OP, this is the table I imagine them playing on.
>>46664304
the hobby doesn't just belong to you, i'm not going to get my panties in a twist if someone doesn't paint their models
all you're doing is showing yourself for the dick you really are
>>46664767
Excuse maker detected.
Oh painting is too hard waah waah is just a shitty excuse.
Just say that your too lazy.
>>46664767
It's not the painting in particular that pisses me off, it's the excuses.
If you just told me "I don't want to paint" fine. I probably won't want to play against you because for many armies it's hard to tell what models are at tabletop distance when they're just primed/bare, but that's your deal.
It's when you say "bawwwww I'll just ruin them if I try to paint them, I won't even try." That pisses me off. It's the whiney, self pitying bullshit because they just don't even want to try to see if they can even do it in the first place and give up.
>everyone whining on both sides about the painting is hard argument
painting is hard, but fuck me if i will sit down and paint the one similar looking model 40+ times. Thats what toy companies pay to do and im not going to put down money to get carpal tunnel
>>46664040
>>46664134
still no-one has said what is wrong with the dice
they just look like everyday, plain, white dice to me
>>46664815
painting isn't hard*
fuck me
>>46664030
No... as long as you show progress. So bringing unpainted models to a game once is fine. But by the next game, at least get them primed and get some basecoats on there. Just keep working at them, even if it's just doing one or two things a week and it's fine.
>>46664662
>can't afford
If you really can't afford $30 for paint and brushes perhaps you should be looking for a second job (or a first job?) instead of playing toy soldiers?
>>46664658
It always makes me sad to see nicely painted miniatures, and then the terrain they're playing on is god awful.
Then again, the way it works is generally gonna be "the thing I like about the wargaming hobby is the most vital and important, and everyone who doesn't meet my standards is a lazy little shit who doesn't deserve to play against my finely modelled army / against my finely painted army / on my finely sculpted terrain". It's just that paintfags are the most vociferous of the bunch.
it's only bad etiquette if you're never going to paint them
>>46664030
Back when I actually played 40k around 2008-2011, that's more or less what tables looked like, though we had more space and terrain. Most armies weren't painted for a number of reasons; laziness, not owning enough paints so you feel like you couldn't do it justice, feeling like the model itself is a WIP, and having no intention to actually paint them yourself were probably the big ones. I was usually the one that had more paint on their models than the other guys, but basing was almost unheard of.
>>46664881
Actually I think the "I've got a shitty army but refuse to adapt to changing editions so everyone else has to tone down their army to accommodate me otherwise they're bad people" are the most vociferous.
>>46664895
Just a crazy wild guess here - you were playing in the US?
>>46664881
Isn't terrain often provided by the gamestore that's being played at? And even then, most people will handwave terrain because it's hard to make amazingly good without being expensive, and as long as something looks relatively like it should and isn't collapsing, it works, right?
>>46664902
Depends on the local meta really. If everyone at the club or whatever is happy playing at a level that mightn't be competitive at tournament level, but one guy rocks up with the hottest new codex netlist then he's clearly the dick.
>>46664926
Playing at stores is a shitty experience in a whole variety of ways.
Play at home or at a club. That way you can have good terrain, good opponents and anyone that causes a problem of some kind can be ejected from your gaming group.
>>46664941
Totally but if you're playing pick up games at a store (why the fuck would you?) then complaining that people are bringing armies too good for your army that wasn't great in 5th edition is retarded.
>>46664030
For me, its a time thing.
Is the unpainted army new? Is it still being built - both physically and in terms of lists?
I don't mind if someone has cracked out their brand new army to play, being excited by it and all. However, if the army is months or years old and is still grey... Then it gets a bit less acceptable.
That said, what do I know? I mostly play with friends at one of our places - I haven't played a game in a local store environment for years.
>>46664030
Nah.
>>46664304
>>46664795
Wow ok faggot you got FAR too invested in the assumption that I don't paint my minis. I do, but one of the few people I play with has fairly bad eyesight and she has a condition where her spine acts up if she sits at a desk for too long, so her army is unpainted. But you went so completely overboard in screaming about how great your work ethic is that I will take comfort in knowing that your opinion is negligible because no one that absolutely fucking autismal isn't banned from every game store on the planet.
>>46665075
He was talking about excuses, though. I'd assume it's different if you actually, physically can't paint.
>>46664926
>as long as something looks relatively like it should and isn't collapsing, it works, right?
Although painting models is hard to make amazingly good without being expensive in terms of time, so as long as a model looks relatively like it should and isn't falling apart, it works, right?
But, no, not everyone plays at a store. Given the choice between playing at a club or a store, I'd prefer a club. Given the choice between a club and playing with friends on the kitchen table, give me the kitchen table. Wargaming with friends just seems to work better than playing with strangers.
>>46664907
Yep. Half of us were relatively teenagers, the other half had been playing since at least the mid 90's. Actually, the most veteran guy of us all (who had all painted models, shit ton of conversions and a scratch-built, to-scale Emperor-Class Titan) was the reason it all came together and why it all fell apart. He moved and the older guys lost interest. They lost interest and us younglingers just sort of went our seperate ways.
Still sitting on a bunch of partially-built, partially-painted OOP Dark Eldar I was putting together around the time everyone stopped going to the LGS.
>>46665243
>Half of us were relatively teenagers
I really need to proof read posts better. I meant "Half of us were teenagers".
>>46665075
You really aren't reading my posts.
I get pissed when a perfectly normal person gives the "woe me, I'll never learn to paint, I'll just ruin these models forever
because super glue can never ever be removed and simple green doesn't exist" excuse when they clearly just want a pity party and don't want to bother trying. The people who act like no other painter ever sucked when he started out, that we didn't have to practise our asses off to get even remotely decent at it, and gives up after 5 minutes. Aka the whiney pieces of shit that I unfortunately have to count as my generation.
If you physically can't paint, or you're mature enough to admit that yes, you could paint, but you're lazy and you don't want to, I'm much more OK with that. Obviously the latter I'm not going to want to play with, but at least he's willing to admit he's just lazy and isn't making bullshit excuses. I find it hard to believe that a person who can assemble models can't paint for some odd reason, but hey, I don't know what kind of physical stuff they're dealing with so who knows.
I've said this 3 times now. I don't see how you keep missing this. Please read my posts before you get that riled up. I get pissed at normal people who have no excuse making up random excuses and giving up before they try. Thats it. Read the goddamn posts again
>play wargames with paper circles with the name of the unit and the height of it written on them
Roast me m80s.
At my local wargames club it really seems to depend on the game. For example, 2 people have been playing SAGA with each other for months and as far as I can tell have painted 3 figures between them, most remain unprimed, however I have never seen a game of Napoleonics or Ancients in any rules or scale (6mm-28mm) with a single unpainted figure fielded.
I think the culture and player base for some games makes them more likely to play with unpainted figures.
>>46664030
>tfw when you bring unpainted/halfpainted armies because it takes so fucking long to paint each model.
at least my eldar army is almost done. wondering if i should bring more then 3 fire prisms.
>>46664030
Yes. Next question?
>>46665296
In Our FLGS, tournament are 100% Tabletop +++ only (or disqualified) and in regular game, the unpainted model cost twice as much as it would (so a Bloodthirster is nearly 600points if unpainted for example).
It's as been widely regarded as both new customer and old as the best freaking rule ever.
People like in your post account for like less than 2% of the yearly income anyway.
> the shit i deal with at my FLGS
>>46664030
you can paint very fast and very cheaply and have a decent model. the problem is you need to know someone that can show you how to do it.
i painted 120 gnoblars in 24 hours one time as a challange.
http://www.ogrestronghold.com/forum/index.php?topic=18738.msg260337#msg260337
ignore the cringy writing it was some time ago.
anyway they ended up looking pretty good for the amount of time i put in.
this is a washing example but the same can be done with drybrushing.
hell you can paint all your models in flat colors with no highlights and they will still look decent, it isnt that much work.
>>46665425
1992 models, still unpainted "B-but anon, i don't have time!!"
then he comes the next week and tell you how awesome Daredevil season 1 & 2 were. I can't stand it anymore. 30 hours/year looking at shit TV show and unpainted models since 1992
>>46664476
>playing a game as a hobby
>don't like an optional aspect
>somehow that's unacceptable
You are autism.
>>46664183
>"I regret wasting all that time"
Most of these things are hobby first, game second. That is what most of my friends have told me anyway. So, what are you doing with your life anon? Why do something you hate?
>>46664878
How often do I need to remind people of this: if you are buying models/cards etc., you aren't in financial difficulty. Just because someone has no money left over after paying bills and having some time doesn't make him poor.
>>46665440
30hours/week*****
>>46665447
>Painting figures is optional
Why is this an opinion that exists? Painting figures is part of the hobby, no one is expecting golden daemon standard but at least some effort.
>>46664640
So I can just keep telling you that and never buy paints, and it's fine?Not that I'd play with you.
so what do you do when someone shows up with absolutely terribly painted models he actually put a lot of time into?
>>46665117
Oh come on, anon, you know there's a difference between models and tabletop terrain. Most people go out of their way to avoid officially made terrain pieces and tend to make their own, and it's not too hard to make something crappy/decent without cost, even if the wall isn't fully to scale and the corners are a bit raggedy.
>>46665489
How do you know he put time in it ?
>>46665489
Play a game with him?
What, am I supposed to get snooty over his models once they're actually painted? That'd be like critiquing someone's homework assignment once they finally turned it in.
>>46665489
OP here, I was more curious about putting effort in vs not even trying. From across the table, how much is that detail are you really going to see?
>>46665467
I paint mine, but you need to realize that it is an optional part. You can play unpainted, and people do, therefore painting is optional.
>>46665489
Play a game with him and offer lots of painting help and advice if he asks for it.
>>46665518
Homework is meant to be critiqued.
>>46665533
Its optional in some environments. There are plenty of clubs and events where it is not optional and this is a good thing.
I understand why unpainted models are looked down upon. I honestly don't care though. If everyone painted their stuff then I wouldn't get nearly as much props for having painted all of mine well. Players can do what they want, but I like mine painted for the praise, and people know that that army is mine, my dudes, when I put them on the table.
>>46665533
You can play with cut out paper, and people do (rarely admittedly) so is having figures an optional part of the hobby?
No, it isn't. Everything is "optional" because we can't force people to do things, but painting IS part of the hobby. It might not be part of the wargame, but it is part of the hobby.
>>46664042
depends. if they're new minis and you're steadily making progress painting the army up it's completely fine.
If the whole army is still grey plastic after a half a year or so then not so goodm
>>46665518
Bad analogy. Homework is intended to be critiqued.
>>46665460
If you've got no money left after paying your bills then you are living way beyond your means and you either need more income or to cut your outgoing.
Of course most of people using the paints are too expensive approach are spending loads of money on models, books, alcohol, etc and it's a BS excuse.
>>46665545
I'm not his teacher, I'm a fellow student.
>>46665489
what if they have parkinsons?
>>46665548
In those environments, it is non-optional, yes.
>>46665560
Yes, it is. If I can play the game as a hobby without figures, then I can have the hobby without having figures. Therefore, optional.
>>46665447
>some other lazy faggots don't paint
>that means it's totally okay not to paint.
>>46665573
By "having some time" I meant spending the leftover money on luxuries/saving it, as in using it to do things other than buy toys.
>>46665575
if you were his fellow student you would not care if he actually turned in his homework
>>46665254
He doesn't miss it. He's just deflecting because he's one of the excuse making faggots.
>>46665587
You do not need to paint to play the game, therefore painting is optional to the game. You can't argue with basic logic.
>>46665575
Then it's a team assignment and your partner shows up with a paper he obviously wrote haphazardly just before the class while you took your time. A game takes two.
>>46665582
>Yes, it is. If I can play the game as a hobby without figures, then I can have the hobby without having figures. Therefore, optional.
Frankly I think you are clutching at straws here. You can play football (soccer) without a ball using tin can, I've done it, but that does not stop the ball being an essential non optional part of the game.
You couldn't turn up to a match and say 'sorry guys I've only got a tin can' and when people complain "wow you can't get annoyed when people take the option to not use a real ball, if it is possible to do it then it is an option I can take!"
>>46665604
Then your hobby is gaming and not miniatures and you waste your money on models that end up as glorified counters and not armies to lead. Your loss.
>>46665604
Actually there are lots of events and venues where you do need to paint to play the game.
Perhaps you should have been honest with yourself about being too damn lazy and started heroclix instead?
Wargaming is a niche hobby. We spend lavish amounts of money on detailed figures because we want to create a beautiful game- and the aesthetic is an important part of the experience for so many wargamers.
A couple of painted armies fighting over nice terrain is something wonderful, but without painting it looks as soul-less and bland as the OP image. At that point you may as well have saved yourself the bother and expense and used chits and tokens to represent your army.
If you arrange a game your opponent sets aside time in his busy week to meet you somewhere. Perhaps even in his home. He brushes up on a couple of rules, prepares his list and gets his army ready for play. An army that he has taken the time to paint. Then when he gets to the table, he is playing against a dull grey army. The illusion of a little battle in space is destroyed by the bare plastic. No, it's good manners to paint your army to give your opponent a good experience. It's only fair since he's taken the time to play you.
tl;dr: routinely playing with unpainted models is poor manners.
>>46665296
You're only 17, so when you get a bit older you might understand the 'not having time to paint' excuse when you have some responsibility in your life.
>>46665628
to be fair though football is often played without proper goals, grass, boundaries, referees etc.
>>46665591
If he's spending it on luxuries then he totally could have afforded to buy painting supplies and it was just an excuse for being lazy.
>>46665628
No, because a tin can does not function identically to a ball. An unpainted model functions the same way as a painted one.
>>46665630
>implying your "armies" are not also glorified counters
>>46665638
See >>46665582
>>46665657
You have autism.
>>46665596
And I also wouldn't care what quality of homework he'd actually turn in.
>>46665609
But I'm not going to get a 'bad grade' just because someone comes to the table with badly-painted models. What if he's really good with the rules, while the guy who's been painting for five years still needs someone to help him understand the rules?
>>46665646
If you've got kids then you have half on an excuse. With full time work plus commute plus a couple of kids to look after it was difficult to find time to paint but not impossible. I still managed to paint an army a year.
Now that I'm kid free again painting time is no problem at all.
>>46665664
You are apparently an idiot.
I can't afford to buy paint is not a valid excuse for never painting your army if you really meant I'm spending my money on other luxury goods.
Just say you're too lazy.
>>46665685
the result of someone getting his infant kids to paint his armies would be hilarious
>>46665646
i'm already full time working tho, quit the study.
The people who tell me they have no time to paint are playing 10H/week in the store faggot.
The other are so rich they could hire a commission painter (given how low is the cost) and have a 10K painted army the next month, that they didn't even have to assemble.
>>46665703
Between a nice night out and some money towards a future vacation/honeymoon, and some paint for your toys, which do you think I'm going to choose?
>>46665664
>No, because a tin can does not function identically to a ball. An unpainted model functions the same way as a painted one.
The game is not the hobby. Usually when people refer to the hobby they also mean painting and modelling, hence why shops that aid this sort of thing (and stock military models which aren't necessarily intended to be used for wargames) are called hobby stores. For the game unpainted models are functionally identical, but then so are cardboard chits, this does not make them identical from a hobby perspective.
>>46665715
I've seen what happens when a four year old gets into your paints and decides they want to paint some models like daddy...
She also painted my mouse, my mug, some of the paint pots...
>>46665726
How much do you think paint costs nigger?
>>46665729
The game is the hobby for every player that I've ever met, even the ones who spend hours painting their models would say the game is the hobby.
>>46665646
look at this
>>46665436
you can paint models really really fast, they dont look top notch but they will look decent.
>>46665726
Honey moon. Then once this one in a lifetime is passed, painting.
Don't tell me you go on vacation with $100, if you are that poor, just stop Wargame entirely
>>46665726
Every single month? There's never a month where you have thirty bucks spare?
BullShit.
You could totally afford to buy some paint and brushes if you weren't too damn lazy.
>>46665726
Honeymoon everymonth ? Vacation everymonth ? You don't have $40 lying around at a daily basis then you just hard failed at adulthood.
>>46665739
Well I've had conversations with people about whether they enjoy the 'hobby aspect' or the 'game aspect' more. Perhaps we are just coming at this from very different view points.
>>46665726
A couple of drinks less on one of your nights out and you've paid for your paints and brushes. Shitty excuse.
Throughout this argument, please keep in mind that my armies are painted.
>>46665735
Do you understand that when you're saving for something big, you put in as much as you can? Or, the choice could be a nice date at a restaurant or the paints.
>>46665749
Vacations, raising children, etc.
>>46665751
With that $30, I want to buy models, not fucking paint.
>>46665731
>mouse
computer or small furry animal?
Its a 4 year old, this is a valid question.
>>46665767
>With that $30, I want to buy models, not fucking paint
And there we go. Just admit that you're too lazy to paint - it's not that you can't afford paint.
>>46665767
If you think thirty bucks is a nice date at a restaurant then you need to raise your standards.
And why are you going to restaurants if you're trying to put everything into saving?
>>46665780
>Please keep in mind that my armies are painted.
Can you read, nigger?
>>46665795
I don't believe you.
>>46665795
So you've managed to find the time.and money required to paint multiple armies but you're here arguing that people have perfectly valid excuses to not be able to do that purely as hypothetical arguments?
>>46665771
Computer. Had the hamster been in same room who knows what might have happened...
>>46665767
If you can't afford a once every year or two expense of 30 bucks because you're paying for vacations and raising children then you are living beyond your means.
>>46664030
yeah it's bad etiquette and manners, but if you still want to play the person or the store/tourney allows it then play them. It's simply bad manners because the fact of the matter is that a good portion of the community cares for the visuals of the armies and the tabletop. If you aren't handicapped or have physical problems to paint, and all you do is buy buy buy the newest models, then you are disrespecting this part of the community, whether you agree with them or not.
>>46665767
>my armies are painted
>With that $30, I want to buy models, not fucking paint.
Nice one tyrone, you totally ddon't need to back your word with photo, that bike really is yours
I approve of it IF the person shows that he/she is improving even a little each time they come and play. I don't care if you only have painted the tank tracks, but something else better have happend to the tank besides the tracks next tome you play, etc
>>46664030
Yeah because it makes it a lot harder for your opponent to see what your models are at a glance.
>>46664030
Depends on the game and group.
>>46664030
No, it's a warGAME not a fucking expo.
The key is to PLAY, everything else is an extra.
>>46666119
It's a miniatures wargame so prepare your miniatures properly.
There are plenty of counter based wargames if you don't want to do that.
>>46665447
>painting is "an optional aspect"
You're kidding right?
>>46666119
Nope.
>>46664304
It's tau crisis suits double burst cannon, fire warriors with pulse rifles, a hammer head, a piranha, and a half painted suit that I have no idea what's going on so I'll guess plasma shas'el
>>46664030
>GUO, Bloodthirster, 2 defilers
>Tau player has not a riptide to be seen
What a fucking uphill battle, I feel bad for the guy
People can do whatever the fuck they want, but seeing two fully painted armies square off is a sight to behold.
Humans are visual creatures and neckbeards even more so. Gaming with painted miniatures is just plain more fun.
>>46666171
That is the hobby part
Is this an American thing?
Where I am in the UK I'd never even consider playing a game with grey models, unless I'd literally just bought them that day or something. What about tournaments? Even the smallest ones here generally require 3+ colours and basing.
It's easier than ever to get stuff painted to "tabletop standard" these days, even GW sell washes, "foundation" paints, medium and all that.
I don't really understand the "They were expensive and I'll ruin them" argument, you've got to crack a few eggs to make an omelette. Buy a few monopose plastic Marines or Heroquest or whatever and just have a go.
>>46666348
I don't play myself but it seems like lazyness. Painting the models is part of the hobby isn't it
>>46664787
i said no such thing, i paint my models, what i said was
>i'm not going to get my panties in a twist if someone doesn't paint their models
>>46666367
I don't believe you.
>>46666388
okay
>>46666348
You see it in some communities in the UK but it does seem to be much more common in the US.
>>46665566
this
>>46666367
And I said that the shitty excuses for not painting are worse than not painting. What does the status of your panties have to do with peoples ridiculous excuses?
>>46666416
i said i don't care about the state of other peoples' models, you call me an excuse maker, i point out i made no excuse, you move the goal posts
And the post you replied to wasn't complaining about lack of painting it was complaining about shitty excuses.
Which makes your post look like you're making excuses for them. If you weren't trying to do that perhaps you should have replied to a different post.
>>46665296
Jesus fucking christ.
Now, I havee a good 3rd of my ork army unpainted because I buy minis faster then I paint them, but that dude puts no effort in. Crack down on his base only shit.
Once you play with painted armies and proper terrain its hard to go back to grey minis and flat green tables. Its the optimum way to play and literally half of the hobby.
If you dont like it thats your prerogative but then why the hell are you playing 40k? GW even said they're a modelling company first and gaming company second.
>>46666434
oh ffs quit being so fucking pedantic
>>46666348
It's a enviromental thing.
If you mostly play in stores, especially GW stores, chances are high that there'll be a lot of kids. Kids don't paint for shit, so you pick up the attitude that it's okay not to paint. And that attitude is then perpetuated further by yourself.
>>46664030
Yes if you're playing with white male terrorists.
At the end of the day if you're so embarrassed by your lack of skill at painting just pay someone to do it for you, I'm sure there are people that offer that sort of service.
>>46664100
If this is truly your benchmark for soulless you haven't seen anything yet.
>>46664030
It used to be.
Personally I prefer the look of unpainted models to ones with a basic three color coating but I'm also a sculptor who can appreciate the beauty of a well done model.
>yfw someone tries to paint michael angelos david
Not the best painter, but not only is the painting side of the hobby more fun (for me), its also a matter of respect to your opponent. I want that both players have a good game experience, so even if my army composition may be shit and I play bad, atleast it should be nice to look at. Seeing both player armies painted on the table is cool and afterall one of the things that got me started with 40k afterall.
That pic is kinda old, painted quite a few more models already, including a 1750+ all nurgle daemon army. Maybe it will never see play, but I'm proud of the effort I put into it, even if it could be improved.
And to all those people saying "muh models would just look like shit": No. Unless you deliberatly paint them to look like crap everything is better than unpainted / primer only.
>>46666518
Even Greek sculptures were originally painted, desu
>>46666481
In our GW store, you deployed, then rolled a dice for every unpainted model. On a 1 they were removed from the table before the game started.
That got kids painting.
>>46666586
>a dice
>>46666574
Thats roman though.
>You are still correct.
>>46666518
Except a lot of classical sculpture *was* painted, numbnuts.
>>46666597
Is it an american thing to not say "die" anymore?
>>46666597
http://www.oxforddictionaries.com/definition/english/dice
>Usage
>Historically, dice is the plural of die, but in modern standard English dice is both the singular and the plural: throw the dice could mean a reference to either one or more than one dice.
Pedant.
>>46666574
They didn't even thin their paints. Fucking savages.
>addendum;
>addendum;
>addendum;
NoPaintFags are officially Not OK and have bad attitudes.
>>46666618
I'm English and I say dice. Blame GW.
>>46666574
This >>46666606
>>46666612
I didn't say they were never painted, I'm saying that I would react in a shocked and saddened manner if someone tried to slap paint onto michael angelos david.
Also they look like shit with paint on them, obviously the right figure is over exposed but even done properly they all look kinda crappy.
The way you responded makes it seem as if you think pointing out that some classical sculptures were painted refutes my statement, was that your intention?
>>46666627
Not him, but when I learned (british) english as a foreign language. I was taught a lot of stuff you apparently don't use anymore.
>>46666636
Agreed, people who refuse to paint are definitely not okay and have bad attitudes.
>tfw just started 40k
>only have half a squad of fire warriors completed and painted
>the rest are just legs and torso
>Ethereal is just half a drone and a flag on a base
Feels bad man, do you think people will be forgiving when they see I am in the middle of painting?
>>46666666
>>46666674
>>46666675
>>46666678
>>46666681
>You will not post any of the following outside of /b/: Trolls, flames, racism, off-topic replies ... ... post number GETs ...
>>46666666
Same for anyone learning any new language formally, hepts-kun.
>>46666697
>You will not post any of the following outside of /b/: Trolls
>>46666674
>>46666675
>>46666678
FUCK YEAH, I AM MEGA-SATAN!
Will brag in front of friends with that one.
>>46666666
That's actually very common, my Japanese friends all tell me that I speak like an old man.
>>46666735
>>46666698
Yeah ,I believe it has charm though.
Also helps make a good first impression if you use words that some native speakers dont know.
As long as it comes naturally and doesn't look like you are trying to be a dick.
>>46666689
If you're making an effort that's great anon.
>>46665425
>>46665440
>He has goddamn vostroyans - still unpainted
>>46664030
New models - no. Five-six months later - yes.
Also, bad painting is better, than no painting.
>>46666666
>Taught alot of stuff
like pro gets
>>46666204
The crisis suits have a burst cannon and a plasma gun, I think you just proved the other guys point with your post.
>>46664030
Some people don't like painting. Who cares what other people do with their models?
>>46666827
Those are Valhallans though.
My biggest shame is that I bought the Valten mini from Storm of Chaos when it came out, the one where he gets all pimped out.
I never painted it.
I never dared to, fearing that I'd fuck it up.
>>46666348
We had the same thing in our gaming club, that you need to atleast have 3+ colours to field that model, unless it is brand new.
It actually made people paint their models, some where bad some where good, but the battlefield looked awesome.
>>46665646
That's why commission painters exist.
The excuse that anything in this hobby takes too much time or is too expensive is an empty one.
>>46666888
there are many many people who care very much about what other people do with their things. The rest of us call them assholes.
>>46666666
Neat!
>>46665329
Try hex and chit games, shit's tight.
>>46667037
I already play TFT.
>>46666968
They can do whatever they want with their models providing that they're playing somewhere that tolerated their behaviour but they can keep their lame excuses to themselves.
>>46666888
I don't care what they do with their models as long as they aren't on my table.
>>46665422
Tabletop only I could understand, but tabletop +++? Seems like a good way to keep new people from playing at the store, and that's pretty shitty.
>>46664030
Been playing 40k for almost 15 years now (god that's depressing) and this pic is probably the most accurate portrayal of every gaming store setup I have ever been to. Yes that includes GW stores as well as FLG stores.
I can count on one hand the amount of pickup games I've played against a fully painted list. Wargaming seems to be the hoarders' hobby. If you wanted to paint figurines all day there are better (cheaper) avenues.
So no, I don't consider it bad when I play against another "Primer White" chapter or hivefleet. Annoying maybe, but a game is meant to be played. I care about playing with my army first and finishing it second. If I wanted painted figures, I'd build model airplanes.
>>46666550
looks really good anon. I'm jelly of how chaotic, but still cohesive the army is. So many chaos players don't stick with a color theme, but I'm glad that you did.
>>46667300
Seriously, stop playing pickup games and find or start a decent community (which almost always means not attached to a store - a store based community doesn't get to be selective).
>>46664030
Maybe, but grey is better than a shitty paint job. It is easier for the next owner to actually paint them when they don't have to soak that shit off. Pic related is a fine example of a model that would look better if the owner would have never tried to paint it
>>46667541
The store doesn't get to be selective, but an individual sure as hell can be. It's how I've survived this long at my own FLGS, which while a great place to shop and play, has a handful of pretty awful people interspersed throughout 40k/AoS, WM/H, and so on. It's easier for me to show up and play against my friends, or people I know aren't shitters, than try to set something up out of my, or one of my friends houses.
>>46667564
That model would look better if it would not have been assembled. At all.
>>46664030
>Be an ork player.
>Spend most of my painting time riveting looted wagons.
Only da boyz know my pain.
>>46666689
If you've only started most people are fine as you wont even be 100% on the rules yet.
6 months down the road that shit should be done or mostly completed though.
>>46666827
It's even worse. Valhallans are like 6 years older than vostroyans.
>>46667796
But they might have been bought of ebay.
(Vostroyans are still on sale, btw)
>>46667564
>learning things is hard, it's better to not even try.
>>46667653
Pretty sure I could have painted my guard amy in the amount of time I've spent building my ork one.
>>46667564
That model is appalling assembled. Look at the tracks for fuck sake.
It would've looked terrible regardless.
>>46667585
I would argue the experience of playing at home or at a club is better than playing in store but what you described is still way better than pickup games.
>>46664818
They might be referring to them being Opaque. Opaque dice are very often badly weighted.
>>46667564
>It is easier for the next owner to actually paint them when they don't have to soak that shit off
If that's your mentality I don't think miniature wargaming is for you.
Even that baneblade wouldn't look too bad with the tracks sorted out, a bit of neatening, and some washes, maybe a bit of weathering.
Sure, maybe it was too advanced a kit for that person, but rather then going "fuck it, grey and metal it is", give something else a go. You can only learn.
These are your dudes to love and play with, not gaming chit #4634
>>46664767
If you play warhammer but have no intrest in painting you're in the wrong fucking hobby dude
>>46667564
The next owner is going to soak that shit off regardless of how you paint them since they won't match the rest of his stuff.
This argument only makes sense if you're a flavour of the month faggot. I.e. Precisely the person that has made a lot of gaming groups look down on people with unpainted armies.
>>46664030
The only people who thinks it's okay are people who do it themselves, and their opinion doesn't count because they're not human.
This is like asking if it's okay to scream in the library, you already know it's not, you're just hoping for some other barbarian like yourself to validate your desire to be lazy and piss on the people who are actually into the hobby, and not just looking for a game where they can pay to win.
Inb4 hurrduurr, muh playtesting, muh desire to test out my new mini before painting it, like rest of the army.
>>46665646
If you have got time to play you've got time to paint
>>46667564
That's not an argument for playing with naked plastic, it's an argument for taking up a game or hobby that doesn't require you to paint shit, or to practice more.
>>46665646
Are you American by an chance?
>>46664030
Even a shit job with some genuine effort looks nicer than grey
>>46667300
>a game is meant to be played. I care about playing with my army first and finishing it second
The problem with this argument is that only a fucking moron would play 40k for the gameplay, there are way better wargames, and way better boardgames that don't require you to paint shit.
Every time someone argues that they're only in it for the gaming you know that person just wants to be able to tryhard, netlist, and then sell his grey plastic and buy the next horribly imbalanced army when a new edition rolls around.
If you cared enough for the gaming side that you don't even bother with the hobby side, you'd have picked a better game.
There are no GW games currently in print that are worth it just for the rules, the good ones are all discontinued.
>>46665646
>I'm a fucking retard who picked an incredibly time consuming hobby that requires me to assemble toy soldiers and then meet up with other people in real life to fight tedious battles with them, but somehow also claim that I have so little time that I can't paint them.
Play board games or videogames you fucking sperg, there are GREAT games that don't require you to paint shit, that you can enjoy without being a fucking pleb.
>>46666481
>Kids don't paint for shit, so you pick up the attitude that it's okay not to paint.
Being kids doesn't excuse their actions. If I was able to find time to paint my 4 rather large armies, do odd jobs so that I could pay for all the models and supplies on my own, and get all As in all AP/honors courses at a prestigious Jesuit college Prep while also doing the 300 hours of community service required for said college prep when I started wargaming 10 years ago at age 16, then they have no excuse.
>>46668482
Christ this, warhammer is hardly a good game by any stretch of the imagination, but you tollerate because pushing your dudes around is fun, if you aren't in it for the hobby you're playing the wrong fucking game
Why are some people desperate to defend laziness and shit on people who have standards?
They are free to not paint if they don't care but anybody who gives a shit about the hobby is free to not play them and you have no right to criticise them for it. Doing so just makes you an awful person.
>>46668721
No, no. They're entitled to play against you if you want and how dare you paint shame them.
>>46666652
>Also they look like shit with paint on them, obviously the right figure is over exposed but even done properly they all look kinda crappy.
We don't really know how they looked painted. The modern reproductions we see are most likely inaccurate; I doubt they used such oversaturated colors. It's reasonable to assume that they looked very looked nice back in their day.
>>46668949
#GreyMarinesMatter
>>46668529
Right?
Now Epic Armageddon on the other hand, I'd play that with you in a heartbeat even if your army was just colour-coded bottlecaps.
But 40k? Sheeeit. The only good thing about 28mm games with that many models on the table is that it looks good and is fun to paint, if you take that away what's the point?
People who don't want to paint their minis should just meet up in an empty parking lot and jerk each other off to pictures of space marines instead.
>>46669064
#Fyourpaintstandards
#endpaintshaming
#grayisbeautiful
>>46668482
My armies tend to suck because I pick all the shit I love and shoehorn it into a list.
But god damn do I like playing that more than some auto win all grey net list.
>>46668361
Kek
Also if you were play testing you just proxy something along side the rest of your actually painted stuff. If you already got the model you know you want it and should start painting it.
>>46664030
For some. If you have a good group that paints their stuff then you don't need to play against greys. But if you have no friends and are desperate for games then you play them because it's the best you can get.
It's a lot like survival of the fittest or looking for sex. If you get laid a lot you with beauties (painted), you don't have to settle for the uglies (grey).
>>46667828
>>46667796
>>46666891
>I'm still mistaking Vostroyans for Valhallans
>I'm still mistaking not-cossacks in space for not-soviet space master race
Hell, I need a break.
>>46669508
This hobby needs more people like you.
I've seen a few of those guys around my LGS, these fucking personifications of /v/ who show up looking grumpy, slap their grey minmax armies on the table and proceed to play like grinding a fucking mmo, utterly devoid of anything resembling fun or enjoyment in the game.
They treat their opponents like they are an AI, mostly just focusing on the game and occasionally whining at the opponent to hurry up.
Then when they lose they just angrily slam their minis back in the case and fuck off and if they win they mostly just do the same fucking thing. I absolutely can't understand those people... On the other hand I understand the people playing against them even less. I personally never want to waste time playing with someone I don't like.
No use wasting your time playing if there is no enjoyment in the game. Its the mood, banter and immersion thats the best part of the hobby, along with the modeling aspect.
>>46669763
Damn, I thought those people only existed in Magic tournaments. This is sad.
>>46664304
Fuck the haters you have good points. I get tried of the fucking "oh but my best friend can't paint because of x y z" strawman shit. The vast majority of people could at least try but are too fucking lazy. If you don't want to and are just in it for "the game" why even buy models at all? Play vessel or something. Or a fucking board game. Or a video game.
I too get tried of the shit bags trying to whine shame people who put in the time and want a good experience. It seems to be a millennial thing.
>>46669763
These types of people are using 40k as their competitive outlet in life. For me I play a few sports that I'm good at and use 40k to relax, not compete. There's nothing wrong with being competitve, but 40k has some terrible rules for it though...
>>46664455
This. All day.
No one is asking for "pro painted" (or whatever that bullshit means). Just show progress
>>46664572
Shouldn't you be waiting for a government hand out somewhere? And does your mom know your wasting all her data to shit post?
>>46664649
Just buy the washes. Normal apple barrel paint is fucking cheap at Walmart man. 90% of players don't need top shelf shit.
>>46664795
Right on anon.
That whiny give up bitch attitude is going to kill this country.
That and every little bastard trying to be some fucking youtube star.
>>46664030
Unpainted models don't roll as well. It's a proven fact.
The way people react will be individually. You'll definitely get some people giving you guff. Some won't care.
I've known quite a few players that primarily play (warmachine in this case) for gameplay and can't spare the time to keep everything they buy painted. Though they still have some painted models.
As someone that has owned a mostly unpainted army for some time. It's annoying even as the owner. It gets hard to separate the models from eachother in a crowd and it drags on your mind over time. Getting at least some stuff painted every so often would be good.
I will also say that it is far better to go super basic then bare metal/plastic. A single color coat across your entire army actually makes a difference and may be achievable with just some spray paint. A little more color variation or a second coat goes even further.
Alternatively just don't worry too much how it looks and focus more on just getting stuff painted.
>>46665254
Anon you have made you point and your 100% in the right fuck that troll
>>46664030
Only if you're unemployed.
>>46664818
>>46664134
An experiment made showed that the GW sold dice (that type with rounded edges) have a average of 33% chance of rolling 1s.
Compare that to a Casino die with an equal 16% split.
Google it.
>>46665394
It's because guys into that kind of wargame seem to really care about all aspects of their hobby and the 40kids aren't there to dilute the experience.
>>46669863
It is so god damn easy as well. Play once a week? Show up with a basecoated squad one week, paint the weapons/helmets the next, then the skin or whatever, give it a wash and then you are fine for most purposes.
And it would take less than an hour over a whole week to do each step.
On a broader note, I am sick of this harmful, nonsensical attitude that there is no value in striving for better and trying to encourage people to improve makes YOU the asshole. The sheer level of outrage from offended children that one time a guy said his club gives painted models preferred enemy against unpainted ones and that anybody who disagrees can play somewhere else was astonishing.
>>46670020
Well, I think the appeal of Napoleonic IS the uniforms. Though shako hats are too silly looking for my taste.
>>46670132
>Though shako hats are too silly looking for my taste.
Why don't you come over here and say that to my face, see what happens.In seriousness though, yeah for Napoleonics the uniforms are a big deal, but surely that is true in warhammer too??
