what is the answer /sci/?
>>8178915
1 kg. Are you retarded or something ?
>>8178920
It's .5kg you brainlet.
>>8178924
Explain your reasoning, at least
>>8178924
You put a kg jar on scale, whatever is inbetween the glass and the scale isn't taken into account. It's 1 kg. Do it at home.
>>8178915
If they never touched the sides: 0 kg
If you forgot to reset for the jar: 1.5 kg
If you forget to reset for the jar and the flies didn't touch the sides of the jar: 1.0 kg
If they touched the sides and reset for the jar: 0.5 kg
>>8178928
Depends on whether the flies are sitting down or flying.
1.5kg if the jar has a lid on, somewhere between 1 and 1.5kg if it doesn't
>>8178932
And "If" your mom step on it : 1000 kg.
That's too much "if" just to justifiy a pseudointellectual response. According to the text and the drawing, it's 1 kg.
>>8178939
This.
The flies have to create a aerodynamic force to fly.
Just imagine a helicoper takeoff. Stand underneath it. What happens?
>>8178939
Congratulations on being the first intelligent post in this thread.
>>8178954
helicopter has to create thousand of lb's of force.
>be me
>be in military on aircraft carrier
>stand underneath helicopters all day fucking everyday
>nothing happens
hmmm, i'll take what is air and heat dispersion for $1000 alex
>>8178915
Looks like the lid is on. Weight remains average 1.5kg regardless of flying or stationary flies. 1 wing beat down applies pressure, the up stroke removes pressure, the average weight during this total cycle of 1 up-down wing-beat causes everything to be the same weight that everything is when the flies are not flying.
>>8178959
>what is air and heat dispersion
It's a closed system in terms of everything but heat, and the heat is negligible, brainlet.
>>8178959
And thats the reason why you are in the military, because you can't understand basic physics.
Where do you think the force is created? What happens with it?
You will feel a pressure — it will not squeeze you to death, but you will feel it.
Thats because you are outdoor and the air will distribute the force in a wide area. But the highest pressure is right underneath it and if you are in a closed environment, you will be able to weigh the pressure.
Puzzle thread?
>>8178915
the flies counteract the force of gravity on themselves
so 1kg
>>8178981
>thats why ur in the military. can't understand physics
I'm the military since I produce and test military aireborne equipment like prototype helicopters and drones, but keep projecting ;^)
>>8178981
Guess what stupid, the air is accelerated by the blades of the helicopter
This takes energy itself. The air doesn't need to hit something for it suspend the helicopter
>>8178915
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lVeP6oqH-Qo
>>8178996
Woosh, you've missed the point. The air trapped inside the container carries force nearly equal to the weight of the suspended flies down towards the bottom. Again, it's a fucking closed system aside from negligible heat.
>>8178915
My 11 yr old daughter says 1.5 kg
>>8179032
your 11 year old daughter has autism, i'm sorry to report
>>8178959
>i dont understand the concept of pressure
It's average mass reading is 1.5 Kg, with instantaneous readings above and below that mark.
>>8179058
>I shitpost on an algerian spoon sorting forum
>>8179062
>still hasn't figured out the answer after several different approaches to explanation
>>8178982
turned on, mass is a property of energy XDDD
>>8179501
>You have advanced to level two.
>>8179549
Slightly to an increasing degree of slightly?
>>8179549
What the actual fuck?
>>8179567
>You have advanced to level three.
>>8179580
stop asking the same fucking question over and over
>>8179580
Yes, very slightly
>>8179586
>You have advanced to level four.
>>8179583
The thing is that they are not the same question.
Friendly reminder that the question isn't "What's the mass of the jar with it content", but "What does the scale read".
The scale read 1kg + m * (0.5 / n), where n is the number of flies, and m is the number of flies sitting at the moment of read.
If you wait a few weeks, the number tends to go toward 1.5kg.
>>8179593
>do electrons have mass
> 8179591#
They weigh the same. HD uses magnetization to write memory, which weighs nothing.
>>8179596
>being this much of a brainlet
>>8179595
>doesn't understand the concept of a system
>thinks that if you have a closed system that mass can just disappear
>what is the 3rd law of motion
>>8178915
1-1.5kg (max 1.5kg theoretically)
don't forget the force the flies exert by flapping their wings
If you were to remove the jar, but the flies stayed in the same area above the scale, would the scale read 0.5 kg? Of course not.
So the scale would read 1 kg UNLESS a fly lands on the bottom of the jar.
Checkmate.
>>8179598
>You have advanced to level five.
>>8179599
He's right though..
>>8179600
>if you have a closed system, mass can just disappear
Read my first sentence.
The question isn't about the mass, but the readings. The readings are made from the force the jar and its content puts on the scale. Nothing more.
Of course, the mass is always 1.5kg, but you can't always measure it.
>>8179610
>Read my first sentence.
>read my last greentext
>>8179609
That isn't the question in any of those. They assume electrons do have mass merely by how they are worded. Only a simpleton would think otherwise.
> EMBARRASSING
Harddrives, at least non solid state drives, don't use transistors to store memory. It uses metal discs.
Does a north south polarized magnet weigh more than a south north magnet of the same mass? No.
>>8179608
They should weigh the same, superpositions don't change mass it only exists in several different states right?
>>8179618
>/sci/ in charge of knowing how hard drives work
lol Holy shit.
>>8179619
since weight is the deciding factor, the electron in superposition will weigh every weight
the observed electron will weigh only 1 weight
>>8179613
>3rd law of motion
The flies can't always be flying toward the "up" axis, and always be creating a reaction that pushes on the scale, so on average, the flies movement will cancel each others.
>>8178964
only correct answer so far
What do you guys think of this?
>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SqF_Iy0lz_M
>What is the tunnelling probability of an alpha particle in the nucleus of a polonium-212 atom each time it oscillates back and forth in the nucleus?
You get a free t-shirt if you submit the right answer to these guys btw.
>>8179628
The biggest problem here is there isn't a correct answer since that branch of science exists only for getting grant funding and is complete hogwash.
>>8179580
No, the electrons were still there they were just in the other node, the charger just provides a potential difference for them to go back
>>8178982
Slightly more, because according to mass-energy equivalence an object that carries energy(even in form of electricity) should have more mass than it's copy at rest.
>>8179549
Slightly less, because according to mass-energy equivalence energy stored in batteries has mass that is emitted as flashlight discharges.
>>8179580
They slightly do, see above.
>>8179591
They are identical, since both of these states are merely dependent on the magnetization of positions on disk which do not change weight of HDD at rest.
What do I win, /sci/?
>>8179641
That's not why it's heavier
If the fly is flying and going up then its providing enough lift to go > .5kg or the force by which the Earth is attracting it.
The scale will read 1kg if the fly is not touching it.
>>8179622
that's why i said the average should read about 1.5 Kg, because sometimes it's less, and sometimes it's much greater
>>8179604
jesus you retard
>>8179664
only if the lid is off. if the lid is on, the scale will make minuscule fluctuations above and below 1.5 kg, but the average will be 1.5 kg
>>8179778
But why? due to the fly maneuvering in the enclosed air?
>>8179656
>particle in superposition cannot have mass
It has all mass variables. It is in all possible states.
>>8179628
I can't watch the video right now, but you can work backward from the half life and the decay energy. The decay energy tells you the energy of the alpha particle, from which you can derive its velocity, and then the frequency at which it oscillates in nucleus. The half life tells you how long until it has a 50% chance of escaping. So, (1/2) = (1-probability)^(number of oscillations in one half life.)
>>8179796
But how can mass of a particle in superposition be expressed mathematically, then? m∈(-∞;∞)?
>>8179608
what are these words
>>8178915
>what is the answer /sci/?
1.5
If you have a bathtub half filled with water on the scale and it weighs 1000kg and you float a 10kg toy boat on the surface of the water what is the total weight?
In this case its buoyancy that keeps the boat from resting on the bottom of the tub but all will agree that the total weight after the addition of the boat is 1010kg.
The flies do not use buoyancy, they use aerodynamics to counteract gravity so they don't rest on the bottom. These forces in a downwards direction transfer to the jar.
If the scale is sensitive enough you might see small fluctuations.
>>8178959
>i will take what is air and heat dispersion for $1000 alex
Have you never even heard of jeapordy? Thats not how it works.
>>8178982
>weighs
hot bulb -> low density air around bulb -> rises?
>>8180673
Weight describes the gravitational force due to mass, not the overall upwards/downwards force due to all factors.
>>8180685
Why wouldn't the question use mass then
When I see the word weight in a question over the word mass, I assume they want the "number on a scale" answer
It's not as if the question was being asked from multiple areas of gravity
Flies exert downward force on the air, air exerts downward force on scale. 1.5 kg
Stop posting
>>8180700
>Why wouldn't the question use mass then
Because it is asking about weight, not mass. Which is why so many people get it wrong.
>>8180673
The bulb doesn't change shape. Hot gases expand and create an area of lower pressure so they rise. Cold gas in a light would have the same volume as hot gas in a light.
>>8180728
IIRC they minimize the air inside the bulb, I was referring to the air around and below the bulb rising
>>8180728
>Because it is asking about weight, not mass. Which is why so many people get it wrong.
If the correct answer is that the energy is a function of mass or whatever, then the answer is "the lit one has more mass" what does gravity have to do with it
>>8178915
that is not an absolute scale, so i do not know. but if the scale shows 0 with nothing on it, it would show 1.5 kg with dead flies, more if the flies are moving.
>>8178939
I was about to lose my eyesight from cringing so hard at the posts before yours. Thanks for saving it!
>>8179591
My disk drive containing 1GB of Djent is heavier than both.
Should I feel bad if my first hunch was 1 kg?
>>8182750
Nope, human intuition has to be corrected over time. There are likely plenty of intuitions we have as a society today that we don't even know are wrong in general.
>>8179793
each upstroke of the flies wings will lessen the reading a little bit, each downstroke will increase the reading a little bit
[math] \color{#681c93}{\text{i}}\color{#591da0}{\text{ }}\color{#4d21ac}{\text{j}}\color{#472bb6}{\text{u}}\color{#4235c0}{\text{s}}\color{#3f41c6}{\text{t}}\color{#3e4ecb}{\text{ }}\color{#3e5bcf}{\text{s}}\color{#4067ce}{\text{p}}\color{#4273cd}{\text{e}}\color{#447ecb}{\text{n}}\color{#4887c5}{\text{t}}\color{#4c91bf}{\text{ }}\color{#5099b7}{\text{a}}\color{#569fae}{\text{ }}\color{#5ba6a5}{\text{r}}\color{#61ab9b}{\text{e}}\color{#68af91}{\text{a}}\color{#6fb388}{\text{l}}\color{#77b67e}{\text{l}}\color{#7eb875}{\text{y}}\color{#87ba6c}{\text{ }}\color{#90bc64}{\text{l}}\color{#99bd5c}{\text{o}}\color{#a2bd56}{\text{n}}\color{#abbd51}{\text{g}}\color{#b4bd4b}{\text{ }}\color{#bdbb48}{\text{t}}\color{#c5b944}{\text{i}}\color{#cdb541}{\text{m}}\color{#d4b13f}{\text{e}}\color{#daac3c}{\text{ }}\color{#dea43a}{\text{m}}\color{#e29c38}{\text{a}}\color{#e59337}{\text{k}}\color{#e58734}{\text{i}}\color{#e67b32}{\text{n}}\color{#e56e2f}{\text{g}}\color{#e25e2c}{\text{ }}\color{#e04f29}{\text{t}}\color{#de4027}{\text{h}}\color{#dc3024}{\text{i}}\color{#da2121}{\text{s}} [/math]
ONE POINT FIVE KILOGRAMS
>>8178915
1 KG.
Why is this even a question.
>>8183818
Holy shit, TeX color tags work???
>>8178915
I don't feel like answering this but the correct way to do it would be to use an average fly length to get the volume of the jar minus the volume of the flies then calculate for the weight of standard earth air in the jar plus the weight of a jar of that size plus the weight of the flies.
>a fly that weighs 100 grams
Where the fuck did you find those?
[math]\color{#5e1d9c}{\displaystyle\text{n}}\color{#4b25b0}{\displaystyle\text{e}}\color{#4137c1}{\displaystyle\text{w}}\color{#3e4cca}{\displaystyle\text{f}}\color{#3f62cf}{\displaystyle\text{a}}\color{#4276cd}{\displaystyle\text{g}}\color{#4888c4}{\displaystyle\text{s}}\color{#4f97b9}{\displaystyle\text{ }}\color{#58a2aa}{\displaystyle\text{c}}\color{#62ab99}{\displaystyle\text{a}}\color{#6eb388}{\displaystyle\text{n}}\color{#7cb778}{\displaystyle\text{'}}\color{#8abb69}{\displaystyle\text{t}}\color{#99bd5c}{\displaystyle\text{ }}\color{#a9bd52}{\displaystyle\text{r}}\color{#b9bc49}{\displaystyle\text{a}}\color{#c7b843}{\displaystyle\text{i}}\color{#d3b13f}{\displaystyle\text{n}}\color{#dda73b}{\displaystyle\text{b}}\color{#e39938}{\displaystyle\text{o}}\color{#e58634}{\displaystyle\text{w}}\color{#e57030}{\displaystyle\text{t}}\color{#e1562b}{\displaystyle\text{e}}\color{#de3b26}{\displaystyle\text{x}}\color{#da2121}{\displaystyle\text{t}}[/math]
>>8183838
because retards like you exist
A Jar is a closed system.
You can't just make something hover without it interacting with something else.
1.5 and .5 would both be correct answers. It depends entirely on your measuring procedure and the scale.
>>8178915
Assuming you don't zero out the scale when you place the jar on the scale, the answer is either 1kg, or a little bit over 1kg since the jar also has a top (assuming that top isn't part of the original 1kg).
As long as the flies don't land on the sides of the jar, collide with the jar, or concentrate their wing beating air disruptions on one side upon a single spot, their weight do not count.
Their flying about mixing the air inside the jar around shouldn't matter as well.
>>8184251
I watched the mythbusters video, and although the weight varies significantly through the process which the flies are in the air, it averages itself out to weighing the same. I was wrong.
So technically, yes it does weigh less...OR weighs more....depending on what micronic interval of time you measure.
>>8184152
>2 different weights are equal lol :^)
end your life
>>8179608
>Implying the electron in superposition have mass
kek
OMG are all retarded here?
The flies are flying so the scale can't read their weight. Also their wings can generate pressure in the walls of the jar changing the weight a bit but is practically nothing.
>>8184354
>the flies are flying so the scales can't read their weight
the lid is closed, you subhuman.
>>8184333
"would both be correct according to different procedures" =/= "are equal"
you are beyond help
I see no reason why it shouldn't be 1kg. A scale doesn't show anything if a bird flies above it either.
>>8184879
read the fucking thread, it's a closed system, did you even take high school physics
>>8184880
I still don't get why pic related is wrong. Enclosed system shouldn't change anything.
>>8184128
Wtf
>>8180707
Underrated post.
>>8184128
teach me your ways
>>8184888
Let's say the lid is closed and airtight. The flies are sitting on the bottom of the lid, the scale reads 1.5 kg, correct?
Now, let's say the flies start doing their thing (i.e., flying). The lid is still closed, it's an enclosed system still. Why should the reading on the scale change?
>>8184984
>has never right-clicked TeX output before
>>8184997
thank you
>>8179608
>>8179591
>>8179580
>>8179549
>>8178982
>>8178915
>these and the answers people are giving
>>8184992
But flying creates turbulence and dissipate the force of the flies in different directions, so the scale won't be reading the full weight of the flies.
>>8178935
This man knows what he's talking about.
>>8178915
If the flies are hovering then they're still exerting downward force equal to their own weight. It's 1.5.
>>8178915
the scale reads off the charts, because there is a human soul trapped inside the jar which is the equivalent of a average human body.
rate my memedrive
>>8178915
Scales can't read, dumbass
>>8186285
To overanalyze your joke, pretending that the device is extended large enough to have a measurable effect, heat generated will not be dissipated in space. This is bad.
If a fly weighs 12 mg (first result on Google), and there are 5,000,000 mg of flies in there, then there are 41,667 flies in that jar. Presumably some flies would reproduce among these thousands, but mass within the jar would be conserved. Any traces of moisture would be quickly consumed, and the flies would die out quickly. The measurement would be at 1.5 kg for sure after about a week, but with so many flies, you should have an approximately constant percentage of flies on the walls of the jar, leading to consistent readings that slowly grow as the flies die out.
>>8178915
Each fly is 500 gram? Wtf those are some huge flies.
>>8189147
Not necessarily. They can be just very high density.
>>8186285
I know you're just telling a shitty joke, but that's a surprisingly convincing way to prove that it's 1.5kg
As an analogy stick a jar with vacuum on a scale and it'll weigh 1kg, stick a jar with air in it on the scale and it'll weigh slightly more than 1kg, stick a jar with water in it it'll weight significantly more than 1kg. This is because the average density multiplied with the volume changes the mass in the closed system. Having flies mixed with air is equivalent to some substance that has exactly the average density of flies and air. It's 1.5Kg. I thought sci is meant to be smart.
