Is there any real basis for being a vegan?
I mean is there a practical way to get all the proper amino acids and proteins etc. from a completely herbivorous diet?
You could probably check it on your own if you really wanted to know the answer.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Essential_amino_acid
>I mean is there a way to get all the proper amino acids and proteins etc. from a completely herbivorous diet?
Yes, absolutely
>is there a practical way
No, not really. I mean you COULD go out of your way to breathe only from scuba tanks whose contents were collected in Cambodia, but...Why would you when the alternative (Just, y'know, breathing like humans normally do) is not only moral and ethical, but less costly and more effective?
>>8153884
No. Only if you apply the same ethnical standards to animals that you have for humans. This is something most vegans seem to randomly do.
You are an omnivore and shouldnt ignore your nature
Some people just like to be cunts. Is there any real basis for being a person that uses his phone in the theatre?
>>8153917
>moral and ethical
That's very relative, but this is /sci/ so I don't really wanna start a debate about the moral aspect.
>less costly
I doubt it
>more effective
Maybe, but it does have some other avantages, like getting your reference daily intake of proteins without exceeding that of saturated fatty acids.
>>8153928
> eating animals are the same as not eating animals
meathead grasping at straws
>>8153938
>eating animals are the same as not eating animals
what the fuck are you even trying to imply? I never said any of this
>>8153928
>some people just like to be cunts
Yeah like you guys aren't.
I don't give a fuck about animals and it was indeed amusing at first, but now I'm pretty tired of the constant vegan bashing. On the other hand I've literally never been annoyed by a vegan without asking for it first.
>>8153952
Vegans are against the slaughter of animals for the purpose of getting meat for your burgers, Benefiting from animals without harming them is not something vegans oppose.
>>8153928
>a vile
vial
>>8153965
Vegans are against the usage of ANY animal products in ANYTHING. Try to motte and bailey less.
>>8153977
the milk, it kills a cow
the egger, it kills a chicken
>>8153977
In French we'd say something like "vegetalian" to call someone who just doesn't eat animal products but still uses them for other purposes. Isn't there a similar word in English?
>>8153884
>Is there any real basis for being a vegan?
The only basis I agree with is the environmental one. A vegan diet has a much smaller carbon footprint than one with meat.
>>8153965
thats wrong. you confuse vegans with vegetarians
>>8153884
it is literally degenerate to not eat meat.
>>8153928
>Poisonous snake
Fucking hell
>>8154032
adjective poi·son·ous \ˈpȯiz-nəs, ˈpȯi-zən-əs\
Definition of poisonous
: causing sickness or death by entering or touching the body : containing poison
: capable of putting poison into another animal's body by biting it
: very harmful or unpleasant
>>8154044
The actual obvious point you missed is that most vegans openly value their lives over that of an animal and wouldn't hesitate to break their vegan lifestyle in that situation just like you would slay your pet if you needed to. Thing is, most of the time they don't need to and therefore do their best to limit any kind of unnecessary suffering.
Your picture is assuming veganism is a strict religion with strict dogmas. It isn't.
>>8153977
Yeah apparently I was confusing those.
thanks :^)
![maxresdefault[5].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/X939cB9.jpg "maxresdefault[5].jpg")
>>8154095
Why do people have vegan mentality ? What do they think they are achieving by leaving the animals untouched in their own habitat ?
>>8154083
Snakes are venomous not poisonous.
>>8154095
No shit. I'm pretty sure the picture is hyperbolic on purpose just to show how hypocritical vegans are. I'm sure most of them already use a lot of "animal products" without even knowing it.
Vegans also seem to assume that they are the authority when it comes to define what "unnecessary suffering" means.
>>8153884
http://nutritiondata.self.com/facts/fruits-and-fruit-juices/1966/2
look at that, a fucking ORANGE has a complete amino acid profile just like every other fruit and vegetable
btw you only need 8 anyway and you can synthesize the other 12
ive been a vegan for a year and havent lost any muscle or gains but my erection quality and pooping quality is better.
ill be vegan for life, meat is disgusting anyway.
just my 2 cents
>>8153884
>Is there any real basis for being a vegan?
No.
>http://chaosandpain.blogspot.com/2010/07/vegetarianism-and-veganism-best.html
>http://chaosandpain.blogspot.com/2010/07/vegetarianism-and-veganism-are-as.html
>>8154142
enjoy your low testosterone levels and inefficient meme diet
You literally fell for a meme
>I've been a vegan for a year and havent lost any muscle or gains but my erection quality and pooping quality is better.
Bullshit shilling at best that you can't attribute to your meme diet in any shape or form. And whatever gains you have will always be inferior to meat eaters. Veganism/vegetarianism has no scientific basis and has been repeatedly debunked
>meat is disgusting anyway.
More bullshit. And meats not disgusting, your just a pussy..
>>8153996
vegetarian
>>8154167
You cant debunk a superior moral choice.
Really the best reason for vegetarian-or-veganism is that you don't have to rear animals farting up a methane storm or consuming tons of space.
If we would eat insects that would make sense because you get lots of protein per area of farming, whereas a cow needs massive area To produce each kilogram of meat. We don't *need* meat anymore because we've finally produced crops nutritious enough to live healthily on plant matter alone.
>>8154142
if it is easier for you to stay fit and dont like meat anyway, thats fine. But some vegans feel the need to be huge cunts about it and think they are morally superior
> is there a practical way to get all the proper amino acids and proteins etc. from a completely herbivorous diet?
It's a completely legitimate lifestyle. In the US approx 1% (~3.3 million) of people are vegan (Wiki states 2% self ID as such but IMO everyone is breakin for donuts if they live somewhere there isn't a vegan bakery). So the numbers seem to suggest that it's do able (indeed it's growing), and adjustments are relatively sustainable.
That's the answer, simply put for a simply worded query. But there's more to it, obviously. So once you put aside that the diet is sustainable and practical, the real answer about the nature of veganism in society lies on the intersect of socioeconomics and culture.
>>8154187
>OP Image
>But some vegans feel the need to be huge cunts about it and think they are morally superior
An asshole is an asshole, and asshole vegans would be asshole accountants if that's what got their mojo going. At some point you gotta realize that if some one is being really shitty, it might not have all to do with their lifestyle if their are thousands more ascribed that aren't militant.
I also, however, decry this notion that it's only or specifically vegans. As far the image in OP, it's like, veganism is by definition an exclusionary diet. You have to define those boundaries when they come up, and if you are a human being with normie friends and junk you're constantly a squeaky wheel because you don't want to eat at texas roadhouse or sonny's or whatever. You can't fault some one for being noisy because they have to specify their diet at all those moments.
>>8154226
Those are all fair points and all but I said only some vegans are that way and I think the asshole approach is not really helpful. Of course there are assholes are everywhere but that doesnt mean other people have to accept the way how they are assholes.
Also, if you genuinely believe that what other people are doing is morally wrong and terrible, are you really an asshole for stopping them? I think some of them just have a faulty understanding of how conscious works and just want to stop the "animal holocaust"
>>8153972
wow you can think! would you like to take a magical journey to whom made that picture and tell him it is vial?
>>8154187
I cook meat for people at social gatherings, just choose not to eat at. never been a cunt to anyone, if they ask why I dont eat meat i just say i prefer not to.
>>8154167
t-levels are fine dude, had em checked. erection quality better too despite being almost 30. better now at 28 than they were throughout early 20s when I ate meat daily and drank fucktons of milk and ate other dairy.
meat is disgusting, think of how many times you eat meat with no seasonings. you would never do it. it will always be seasoned with sugar, salt, fruits or veggies. meat needs vegan food to make it palatable. weird....
>>8153928
I think vegans would be fine with using snake venom and most vegan would probably have eggs anyway
>>8153884
yes there is, it makes unintresting stupid people think they are special
>>8153996
Yeah, vegetarian. The sane cousin of vegans.
>>8154125
Ecology, health, religion, general welfare, saving money... And above all, empathy. No one's asking you to show some, but at least keep this shit out of /sci/, boards like /his/ are probably more appropriate for that.
>>8154134
>how hypocritical vegans are
So meat eaters that care about animals aren't? I don't quite see how disrespecting your beliefs without knowing it is hypocritical though, you tell me. And does the fact you'd kill your pet dog in a situation of distress even though you love him means you're being hypocritical as well, or you just don't know what "hypocritical" really means and use it in any situation? Cause I'm pretty sure 2/3 of the planet is, by your standards.
>Vegans also seem to assume that they are the authority when it comes to define what "unnecessary suffering" means.
So what does it mean to you?
>>8154545
> ecology
so the other predators eat the cows rather than us ?
> health
meat has protein, iron and many other stuff that your body requires...
> religion
...
> general welfare
eating animals are tasty and selling animals brings profit
> saving money
people who want that can do it already
> empathy
they empathize the lions that chew the cows to pieces alive ?
Every reputable nutriologist will just tell you to avoid certain foods but eat them every other time except if you are already a fat fuck with diabeetus
>>8154581
>I havent done research beforehand and just wanted to reply
>>8154552
Yeah. Vegans don't eat animal products but still use animal products in day to day life. I don't know of an English word for someone who doesn't use any animal products.
>>8153965
No, a vegan is someone who doesn't eat animal products - that's it! They might hate animals and want to kill them all, and see them as so disgusting that they refuse to eat them. Such a person would still be a vegan, because being a vegan has nothing to do with philosophy (of course, most vegans are idiots and don't realise this).
My wife is lactose intolerant and allergic to egg, and doesn't generally like the texture of meat. She's nearly a vegan, despite having no real problem with slaughtering animals. She doesn't sometimes eat meat, though. And a lot of fish.
The point is that if she disliked meat even more, and disliked fish also, she'd be a vegan for completely non-philosophical reasons, just like the animal hater I presented earlier.
>>8154354
>to whom made that picture
muh feelings
>>8153884
Can you?
Yes
Practical?
No
Animal protein truly has every essential amino acid in abundance, they are a high quality protein source for a reason
Every plant source has a negligible amount of some amino acid, some algae or lentil might be considered a complete source of protein, but their amino acid profile is very unbalanced and tends to have a weak link.
Animal products are the biggest reason we're able to prosper, such cheap and ample supply of fats and protein and completely versatile in use, go make some fried eggs and then make a meringue to top your yogurt parfait.
>>8154142
Using you website, an orange has 84.6mg of Lysine
Chicken breast has 1501mg
http://nutritiondata.self.com/facts/poultry-products/696/2
What is comparable is eating an entire block of tofu
http://nutritiondata.self.com/facts/legumes-and-legume-products/4408/2
Unless vegans are eating nothing but tofu and quinoa, they are eating more calories to meet their protein needs than what someone eating a balanced diet would eat
I am not going to even touch the logic behind comparing an orange to an organism that had a lifetime of cells systematically create a network of dense protein
>>8154394
>Bacon needs seasoning
>Burgers need seasoning
>Salmon needs seasoning
Whoa animal meats have their own fat that already gives them flavor
Really make you think....
>>8154394
in all fairness people use salt in most cases as a reflex. we used to store food by drenching it in salt so it would last longer. most people put salt on their food before even tasting it. and you do it too when preparing meat for your social gatherings.
also you're being a real cunt about how I season my food. think of how many times you ate a potato without seasoning.
vegetables are not VEGAN FOOD they are food.
>>8153884
Being a vegan is generally very bad for your health even when you're taking the proper supplements.
>>8154545
>dat pic
is it trying to make a point? does it not understand we have an emotional conection to our pets (we also legaly own them)
>you love him means you're being hypocritical as well
no. because I'm not a vegan who acts morally superior all the time and I dont have problems with animal products otherwise
>>8154545
>dogs are the same as cattle
found the chinese
Dogs have a special place among humankind. They were with us from the beginning. They're the only species we domesticated before the neolithic.
>>8157740
You're a moron.
OP don't listen to these idiots, 99% of people here are meat-eaters so of course they will try to push their ill-conceived agenda. Fuck meat and fuck meat eaters.
Here, see this video.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FX58PyQwrcI
>>8157772
yeah, yeah
all the vegans on the internet always tell you how they dont need supplements at all and that their food is so much better
>Fuck meat and fuck meat eaters
just means
>fuck all the domesticated animals and fuck humanity
not a ill-conceived agenda at all, hypocrit
>>8157773
No, fuck you. Go and visit a slaughterhouse. Do it right fucking now. Then go and buy some meat and try and enjoy it. Sick fucker, calling me a hypocrite. You're the one that's totally blind to the reality of what you put on your dish. You should feel ashamed, but since you're in the majority it's easy to diss everyone that opposes you.
So again, go and fuck yourself.
>>8157777
yeah, one of my buddies is a butcher. Watched many times. Cant say it is pleasant, but why should that stop my eating habits as an omnivore.
You are a typical vegan here. Assuming people just dont know what they put on their plate, being condescending and trying to shame people and overall being very "morally superior"
>>8157784
>Cant say it is pleasant, but why should that stop my eating habits as an omnivore.
Good question. Think it through yourself.
>You are a typical vegan here. Assuming people just dont know what they put on their plate, being condescending and trying to shame people and overall being very "morally superior"
I'm not morally superior to anyone. But I choose to act on my morals, unlike you that just ackonwledge their existence. I've been vegetarian for 13 years, vegan for 5. All your vegan myths are fairy tales you tell to yourselves so you can feel good about eating rotting flesh pumped with antibiotics. You're doing yourself an insane amount of damage, but whatever, meat is good, right? Your grandma said so, must be true. If you can't change your habits purely because you believe you will otherwise get a disease, become weak, or whatever the fuck it is you think veganism does to you, it just shows your own inability to research. You can be a perfectly healthy vegan, and it's not even hard. And you'd be doing yourself and our so called civilization a great favor.
>>8157777
>muh feelings
>>8157793
>everything is a meme
Enjoy being young, it won't last forever
Yes, because it's been scientifically proven that being a vegan gives you superpowers.
Hitler rose to power as a vegan.
Most serial killers are vegan.
PETA has become a power cult and most of them are vegans.
There is a common misconception that vegans become weak, but in reality, while they lose muscle mass, their brain stops maintaining the part of the brain that has to do with human empathy towards other humans [due to a lack in Omega 3 fatty acids and GABA and Glutamine].
This turns vegans into sociopaths.
But their new diet is often high in mutagens such as caffeine and veggies/fruits that contain natural carcinogens [making raw vegans even more prone to mutation/sociopathy because boiling would otherwise break down the chemical compositions].
Interesting that when you google "mutagen" a picture of veggies and fruits pops up.
Hmmmm....
>>8157789
>Good question. Think it through yourself.
I did. although it was a rhetoric question
>I'm not morally superior to anyone
...
>don't listen to these idiots
>ill-conceived agenda
>Fuck meat and fuck meat eaters
>Sick fucker
>You're the one that's totally blind to the reality of what you put on your dish
>You should feel ashamed
>go and fuck yourself
>But I choose to act on my morals
>it just shows your own inability to research
No, it seems like you are just insufferable and think people who dont share your picky eating habits just need to wake up and that they are only doing this because they are stupid and/or morally inferior to you.
thats not how it is. You are not the only one who chooses to act on his morals. Other people just have other morals
>veganism is doing our civilisation a favor
except we wouldnt have a civilisation if people didnt eat some juicy meat
>>8157789
If humans were not omnivores then they wouldn't be, but throughout all of human history, on all continents, they have been.
But facts don't appeal to stupid people, so fuck you for being a pathological doxic.
>>8157789
>You're doing yourself an insane amount of damage
No, not eating the diet you evolved to eat is causing you damage.
The [math]typical[/math] omnivore might not have that diet, but absolutely no vegan does.
>>8157805
You know what? I am morally superior to you. You're an moron. That makes me the smart one. Enjoy your rotten food.
>>8157798
what meme? are you lost?
>>8157809
I'm not that anon, but you are quite literally an undeveloped human that is a walking, talking stereotype.
Google these please:
1.) Doxa
2.) List of logical fallacies
3.) List of cognitive biases
4.) Personality disorders
All 4 apply to you.
That aside, here is a the counter argument:
We are factually omnivores, and there is nothing wrong with being an animal on earth that evolved to eat other animals.
Eating is not an ethical question, torture is, and they're not the same.
0% of the animals we eat are self-aware and therefore do not suffer emotionally.
What you think you're seeing have been scientifically been proven to be auto-nerve responses to physical pain [for themselves] and exploitation loss [of members of their own species].
>>8157809
classic vegan argumentation there.
Stick your fingers in your ears and yell "la la la I'm better than everybody else! I can be a huge cunt to all the people, because I'm the smart one! la la la"
good points, my emotionally well balanced friend
>>8157816
You can go ahead and google "superiority complex", you dumb-ass piece of shit.
>We are factually omnivores, and there is nothing wrong with being an animal on earth that evolved to eat other animals.
Sure, I mean mass processing of animals has been around for millions of years.
>Eating is not an ethical question, torture is, and they're not the same.
I don't even know what your point is with this.
>0% of the animals we eat are self-aware and therefore do not suffer emotionally.
If you told that to my face I would literally bring my dogs to chew on you. I mean really. What the fuck is your problem? Ever looked a dog in the eyes? You see no emotion there? No intelligence? How about the fact that pigs are incredibly intelligent and can even solve simple puzzles? They're not self aware? Are you fucking kidding me? Are you self aware, you pathetic little worm?
>What you think you're seeing have been scientifically been proven to be auto-nerve responses to physical pain [for themselves] and exploitation loss [of members of their own species].
Yeah, same as when I beat the living shit out of you with my fists. Just neuro responses. Fucking dumbass.
>>8157817
Go and suck on a horse's dick.
>>8157816
there are also enough ways to acquire meat without supporting "factory farms".
Cows can have a nice, safe cow life that ends with a painless death, so there isnt necessarily torture involved either way
>>8157821
Sorry, I dont love animals as much as you do.
And again, very good point. Really showed your emotional maturity
>>8157820
Go home onision, you don't belong here.
>>8157826
In case it's not blatantly fucking obvious, I don't want to argue with you. You already showed your lack of intelligence in your previous posts, so just shove it.
>>8157820
>Sure, I mean mass processing of animals has been around for millions of years.
1.) False equivocation fallacy
2.) Moving the goalpost fallacy
Therefore: Argument is illogical; discarded
>I don't even know what your point is with this.
1.) Personal incredulity fallacy
Therefore: Argument is illogical; discarded
>rage bullshit that isn't an argument
1.) Proof by verbosity is a fallacy
2.) Appeal to intimidation is a fallacy
3.) Appeal to to emotion is a fallacy
Therefore: Argument is illogical; discarded
>Yeah, same as when I beat the living shit out of you with my fists. Just neuro responses. Fucking dumbass.
1.) Same as above
2.) Shifting burden of proof
Therefore: Argument is illogical; discarded
How come you didn't look up
>list of logical fallacies
Like I asked you to.
It takes 10 seconds and quadruples you IQ, guaranteed.
>>8157829
Then why are you replying to him?
>>8157825
>there are also enough ways to acquire meat without supporting "factory farms".
1.) Auto-conflation fallacy
2.) False equivocation fallacy
I never spoke of factory farming.
Therefore: Argument is illogical; discarded
>>8157832
Epistemology isn't a circle jerk.
It's:
Empricism + Lack of Logical Fallacies + Deduction = Factual Statement
Are you one of those idiots that keep spamming appeals to authority while confusing sophism with epistemology because you're not intelligent enough to understand demarcation?
How often do I have to correct people like you?
Not Epistemology:
>Sophism
>Extended Existential
>Postmodernism
>Critical Theory
Epistemology:
>Empricism
>Deduction
>Induction
>Fallacy Checking
>Positivism and Falsificationism
Do you get the difference?
Do you have the adequate intelligence for decoration and correction?
Hello?
We're speaking SCIENCE here.
Science IS empiricism.
>>8157839
*demarcation and correction?
>>8157829
You use fallacies and claim to be intelligent?
If you use fallacies, then by the very definition of intelligence, you're what doctors would diagnose as a Moron, and that's an actual medical term.
>Gee doc, I don't know how reality works
>Aren't all my thoughts auto-correct?
>What do you mean I have to "prove" my beliefs?
>>8157839
Listen. You just said that animals have no self-awareness. Whatever you say from that moment onward is irrelevant because I already consider you a total fucking dimwit.
>>8157832
>Calling Phd classes a circlejerk
>Calling weeding out bullshit a circlejerk
Deduction is the opposite of a circle jerk.
How do you not know that?
>>8157849
I claim to be more intelligent than you. That is all. Sorry it hurts your ego I guess.
>>8157833
>I never spoke of factory farming.
are you autistic or cant you read?
I clearly just added something to your post. I was agreeing with you
And how was my argument illogical?
>>8157851
>I already consider
No one care about that.
We care if you can prove your stance.
And you can't.
Therefore all of your arguments are illogical.
It's clear you don't understand the scientific method, nor the Gettier Problem, which is why you are clearly doxic [mindless drone that uses flawed anchoring heuristics].
I also find your lack of adult and scientific vocabulary mildly disturbing, if not amusing.
>>8157856
I can prove my stance. Just allow me to punch you a few times in person. You'll see how your neurons being activated feel like. Do we have a deal?
>>8157851
most of them dont have self-awareness. Are you going to deny scientific facts now, or are you showing us a study/test that clearly indicates that cows are self aware?
>>8157859
How about if I kick you in the balls instead? You don't seem to have any self awareness either. Let's apply your own principle and make it a test.
>>8157854
You don't even understand what deduction is.
How can you claim to be more intelligent than I?
I have no problem with people being intellectually superior to myself, but they would have to at least know the following to be my equal:
>Epistemology
>Scientific Method
>Logical Fallacies
>Cognitive Biases
>Induction and Deduction
>Coherency and Consistency
>The Burden of Proof
>The Problem of Induction
>Common Misconceptions and Doxa
At the very, very, very least.
You just pull shit out of your ass and attack people, as if ad hominem fallacies and personal incredulity fallacies meant anything other than pure "circlejerk" material as you call it.
And then you engage in crystal clear psychological projections by claiming everyone else is less intelligent than you while you don't even understand any of the above.
How scared and sad you must be.
Do yourself a favor and learn what empiricism is.
>>8157829
>hurr durr u dumb
absolutely convincing
>>8157858
You do realize animal brains have been scientifically proven to be exceptionally different from human brains in regards to functioning, right?
>>8157864
I know logic, I studied it. This is not a logics problem. This is a "what life is about" kind of shit. Go and get a puppy, or something. Maybe you'll develop some empathy for animals that way.
>>8157862
Humans are indeed a self aware species. Good, you are starting to learn.
Other apes and some dolphins are too. It is debatable with some very clever birds.
But cows are dumb as shit. They dont understand the world around them, nor are they aware of themselves. Their brain just isnt capable of that. It doesnt have to be.
>>8157866
Sure. Now go and fuck yourself. Preferably with street light pole.
>>8157864
you are a fucking imbecile truly
it's amazing that so many idiots like you spouting buzzwords come to /sci/ to pretend to be smart when it's completely transparent
>>8157871
You seem to react to simple scientific facts very emotionally and cant explain your position for shit.
I heard tumblr is a good place for people like you.
>>8157870
You are dumb as a rock and hardly worth debating, but:
>But cows are dumb as shit.
Please research this statement. Do it for your own sake.
And stop spreading goddamn lies.
>>8157876
And you're a sick hypocrite that eats processed meats, filled with antibiotics. I think I'd rather have my explosive rage and intelligence, thanks.
>>8157877
>You are dumb as a rock
well, you say that, but at least I make points and you cant point out how/why they are dumb
>Please research this statement
You should, if you think cows are self aware. Because thats wrong. Objectively.
Of course they are not literally dumb as shit. But they lack the cognitive functions to have a comparable (to human) level of consciousness.
>>8157864
Look, if you're still going to troll or act retarded, that's fine.
- Swear
- Ad hominem; Call people names
- Don't provide counter-arguments
- Reject realism and the scientific consensus
That's ok.
Just don't loop.
Looping is cancer.
Personal incredulity and the argument from ignorance are fallacies. You're ignorant.
You imply you have no knowledge of the other kinds, therefore they don't exist.
That is wrong irrational.
:D
>>8157880
that """point""" was already adressed.
are you lost?
>>8157886
I take it you don't have high reading comprehension?
I can post a test to check your knowledge of scientific principles and you can share the link of your results, timestamped of course.
:D
You have offered zero counter-point, zero counter evidence.
Therefore I see no reason to continue with you if only I have something to intellectually contribute.
Your denialism is fallacious.
>>8157884
>Of course they are not literally dumb as shit. But they lack the cognitive functions to have a comparable (to human) level of consciousness.
You have no idea what life is about. Guess what? I'm more qualified to talk about science than you are, most likely way more educated than you are. But that doesn't blind me from the fact that I can form meaningful, long-lasting relationships with animals which involve emotion, intelligence, friendship, trust, sorrow and above all fucking love. Apparently you have no idea about these. I've formed relationships with birds before. Cats. Dogs. Farm animals. You're living in a bubble of abstractions if you think you can formalize friendship. And when you live through it and you see how animals respond to you, how they form attachments the same way you do, how they feel bad the same way you do, how they have bad and good days, and so on, you realize beyond a shadow of a fucking doubt, that they're intelligent and self-aware.
But keep throwing words you don't understand around. Amuse the folks here. I'm done with your douchebaggery. You'll grow up one day and then the bubble will burst. I just hope it's not too painful for you.
And once again, kindly, fuck off.
>>8157897
the other anon is retarded but you're a fucking autist
>>8157908
Autism is correlated with high intelligence. I guess that's a compliment.
ITT:
Logical Fallacies Instead of Poof Based Arguments and Counter-Arguments
>>8157897
>I'm so much better on every level, bla bla bla
typical vegan
>>8157945
>majority needing a support group
That's not how reality works. It's always the minorities that require support groups, because they're, well, minorities. Which makes that image pretty dumb
>>8157947
thats a dumb reasoning. It's always people who require support that require support groups.
fuck off with your minority narrative, tumblr
>>8157954
It's actually rock solid reasoning.
> It's always people who require support that require support groups.
That's not even a coherent sentence.
i think being vegan is the worst thing
Why do vegans seems to think insect lives don't matter? Do they have any idea how many insects we have to kill to produce their daily meals?
>>8157956
>rock solid reasoning
lmao, it isnt
So let me repeat myself for you. You dont go to a support group, because you are part of a minority. You go to a support group, because you need support.
People of the exact age of 43 are a minority. There is no support group for them.
>>8157963
Insects lives do matter, they're one of the most important thing in the ecosystem. No insects means no animals and plants. So in a sense, they're more important than we are.
But to answer your question, it's the same reason we pick plants. They grow in abundance. And they don't scream in agony when you kill them, making them far less relatable to humans.
>>8157963
yeah true.......in uganda people eat grasshoppers as they very high protein content
>>8157956
>That's not even a coherent sentence
I mean, there are no commas, but this is still very coherent, if you are not a retard
>>8157970
You go to a support group because you need support. And you need support because you're in minority. If you don't eat meat, and 99.5% of people you encounter in your daily life do eat meat, then you might feel alone. Having a support group alleviates that. By contrast, if you're a meat eater, your support group IS your environment. Nearly everyone you encounter supports your decision to eat meat.
I don't even know why I'm explaining this. Are we really arguing over a dumb and childish picture?
>>8157971
So it is only because you consider them abundant and they hurt your personal feelings less.
>>8157765
So killing a stray dog would be fine then, or you're just being a hypocrite again? Cause I'm pretty sure most people would mind, see pic related.
>because I'm not a vegan who acts morally superior all the time
But they are, they can't help it. Also your point doesn't make sense.
>>8157769
>we care about them because we decided to care about them
You're retarded
>>8157977
Right. We invent up our morals, after all.
>>8157976
>And you need support because you're in minority
No. I explained it 2 times already. Do you want me to list more minorities that dont need support?
Do you think AA meetings happen, because alcoholics are a minority? No, they happen because they need support.
Vegans need support, because of their eating habits. Nearly everyone you encounter supports your decision to eat vegetables. So it seems that they are very wimpy for having a "support group"
I don't even know why I'm explaining this. Are we really arguing over a clever and precise picture?
>>8157985
Trolled softly. Congrats, I didn't know it up until the last sentence. 7.3/10, but you could have kept me going for way longer.
>>8157963
I doubt insects can feel pain, but more than 2/3 of all agricultural land is devoted to growing feed for livestock anyway, so I'd say you should go vegan if you really care about the insects.
>>8157981
>So killing a stray dog would be fine then
really depends on the reason for doing so.
>But they are
yeah? so? No problem with vegans. The "acting morally superior" part, is what nags me.
>Also your point doesn't make sense
good point. totally convinced me
>>8157986
I think you are trolling me with this retarded backpedalling.
If someone points out your flawed reasoning, just pretend he is trolling, right?
>>8157996
Nice try. Almost got me.
>>8157981
>people love dogs
>people want to save dogs
>hypocritical
what
Daily reminder that what doesn't kill you, makes you stronger.
>>8157999
Thats really emberassing.
I would recommend you a support group, but aparently you have to be part of a minority to visit one
>>8158003
I've graduated the trollcademy, you can drop the act now
I know the first thing they teach you is to keep trolling once you've been exposed
>>8158010
(You)
>>8157994
>really depends on the reason for doing so.
YEAH EXACTLY, just like killing a snake would be justified for a vegan in that very critical situation.
>the "acting morally superior" part, is what nags me.
They're not just acting this way to boost their ego though, there are hundreds of stuff they'd rather be doing if they did not genuinely care about animal rights.
>good point. totally convinced me
There's not much else I can answer to utter nonsense. "The fact you'd kill your pet dog in a situation of distress even though you love him doesn't mean you're being hypocritical because you're not a vegan who acts morally superior all the time?" Care to explain? Actually don't, replying would be useless at this point.
>>8158000
Most of them really don't care about the other animals, some of them yet being able to show just as much affection and intelligence as dogs. Annoying the Yulin locals just because it's the social norm to love dogs in your country is retarded and hypocritical.
>>8158021
>hey're not just acting this way to boost their ego though
I'm not sure about that. It might be a vocal minority among vegans, but how does stuff like
>>8157809
>>8157772
>>8157777
(for example) advance animal rights? If anything it makes veganism unpopular or makes people eat more steaks just out of spite.
> "The fact you'd kill your pet dog in a situation of distress even though you love him doesn't mean you're being hypocritical because you're not a vegan who acts morally superior all the time?"
I never said that.
If someone acts morally superior all the time, but is as likely as the people he criticises to justify killing, it makes him more hypocritical than someone who isnt preachy about it
Anyway, it was an image meant as a joke in the first place. learn to take a joke
>>8158029
People saving dogs, because they love dogs is still not hypocritical.
Or are you implying we should value every animal equally?
>>8158057
I sure hope that's what he's implying, cause he would be right
>>8157981
>we care about them because we decided to care about them
------->point
your head
We care about them because they were with us when we were a bunch of weird monkeys close to extinction. We might have gone nowhere if not for the interspecies collaboration.
You understand that Paleolithic dogs weren't fucking pets, but essential elements of our survival, right?
>>8158101
he would be retarded
do you abstain from swatting mosquitos too?
Ayy
>>8158146
Oh I'm sorry I thought you meant the opposite. I thought you were saying that we should not consider all animals equally as in dogs are more important than cows
>>8158156
also notice how we have forward facing eyes.
a very common feature for animals who actively hunt other animals
>>8158174
Are you implying we should treat all animal equally, as in mosquitos are as important as dogs?
>>8158183
Ooohh. Than yeah. We technically should. We just chose not to because dogs are a lot more fun to have as pets than mosquitoes. And they are less annoying. I mean I don't quite see why you would kill a dog unless you want to eat it, but there's many a reason why you would kill a mosquito.
>>8157777
>oh man gaaaaaaawd animals die for meat
Yes, welcome to our past 20+ thousands years of human history
>>8157839
Hello hello?
>>8158057
>>8158146
>do you abstain from swatting mosquitos too
>I don't try to understand the extents of other people's words and nitpick on terminology instead
Why do you even bother replying if you don't have anything smart to say? Is that some kind of elaborate trolling attempt?
>>8158144
>we currently care about them because we decided to care about them
>>8158257
>all the same shape
wew piggo that wasnt very hard though
>>8158257
>piggy so smart!
Kek the same animal that will eat its own balls after you neuter them and throw it in front of them
t. farmer family
plants feel pain too
only fruit is actually ok, and it's only ecologically sound if you shit outside
fruit eating shitting outside masterrace
>>8158257
That's cute a shit.
>10/10
>Would eat with pancakes and syrup
>>8158257
>we currently care about them because we decided to care about them
Is that what you read? Because I've clearly written "we care about them because we owe them".
There must be something disfunctional between your eyes and your hands.
>I don't try to understand the extents of other people's words and nitpick on terminology instead
What the fuck are you talking about? I asked if you abstained from swatting mosquitos. Or is your argument that by "animals" you only meant "mammals"?
>>8158325
>curry eating shitting in streets pajeet race
ftfy
>>8158332
it's true you stupid fuck
>>8158331
DESIGNATED
>>8158333
what is?
>>8158336
pajeets eat curry and shit in the street
>>8154174
On what basis do you even fucking claim that. The superior moral choice. Fucking brainless cunts
>>8158342
stop using 4chan like your street you shitter you're stinking up the place.
When are you gonna learn ?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_peUxE_BKcU
>>8158342
it's true you stupid fuck
>>8158316
Sorry then. I don't think we have to value every animal equally, but there has to be a right balance between that and treating some like your progeniture while butchering another. Or at least, I'd expect people not to treat the Chinese like monsters just because they didn't choose to attribute the same values to the same animals.
>>8158342
>India is the country with the highest number of people practicing open defecation: around 600 million people.[3] This is 47 percent of the population (13 percent of urban dwellers and 70 percent of villagers). The other countries with a high number of people openly defecating are Indonesia (54 million people), followed by Pakistan (41 million people), Nigeria (39 million) and Ethiopia (34 million).[3](p19)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Open_defecation
>>8158329
>we care about them because we owe them
Yup, that's an arbitrary criterion, and it's not even true. Do you guys owe cats as well?
>or is your argument that by "animals" you only meant "mammals"?
Yes, why would I give a fuck about mosquitoes?
>>8158350
>I'd expect people not to treat the Chinese like monsters just because they didn't choose to attribute the same values to the same animals
thats really a fair point and I agree with that
>>8153884
Here's a better one
>>8153884
>>8153928
>poisonous snake
>vile
I want to die
>>8158463
Have you heard of evolution? That omnivore clearly hunts its own prey, with it's own body. Humans don't need to do that anymore, we just used stone tools because we were weak af back in the day of the 'cavemen', as they're known.
>>8153972
>>8158453
Even better
>>8158469
Like this?
>>8154179
but we CAN eat insects......
>>8158612
except this never happens.
it is getting really desperate
>>8154008
Not really, if you factor in the fossil fuel fertilisers necessary to grow crops.
Those numbers only work if you're grain feeding meat, which is less "carbon efficient".
