What about all the monks, Christian and buhddist, who live in monasteries for hundreds of years, were they also MGTOW?
what social conditions do you think led them to seek out monastery life
do you understand how much influence they built on the world
what bout the Monks on the Swiss alps who made beer and bred St Bernards, we still use those today
many monasteries actually made alcohol and sold it in Europe
and what about Gregor Mendel, whose studies on inherited traits on pea plant breeding are still an essential in middle school and high school biology
monks lived that life to be closer to god, it had nothing to do with women not wanting to fuck them or any of that stuff.
i don't know anything about buddhists or why they would live like that, but it's probably for similar type of reasons, but no god involved, more about self growth.
Then there is Nikolai Tesla, died a virgin, unmarred, had a whole range of emotions and life events, how much he gave us the modern world
wasn't he and MGTOW?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nikola_Tesla
>>27062521
>>27062563
All those places where men had good reason to group up without women? A great place for dicklovers in times where you would be killed on the street if it was known you were a faggot.
>>27062570
yet there were monarchs and businessmen who also claimed to be "real close" with god, so much they could charge you money and tax you and take away your communion or call for war. people who lived rather well for the time
Now that religion is really less relevant in western society today, I think MGTOW is the equivalent to seeking self improvement. and funny enough is i see many robots looking for a quiet serene place, often called "comfy" that they would love to go to and figure life out, improve and learn
then i also see robots talk about opening a theoretical house for other robots, while it is just banter, is sounds very much like what I imagine the first monks thought about
>>27062588
far point, especially seeing how the catholic church still operates today
now what about Buddhist monks, two societies really too far apart to influence each other enough for these kinds of things
you actually still see them travel around the world together, that is literally a group of men going their own way
note I am not pushing one side or ideology over another, I am curious at the larger phenomenon of MGTOW and R9k.
both thinking that they are unique and blaming "recent degeneracy" for all their woes, just "waiting for the happenings" and talking about the current state of how much society sucks and women are terrible and they are socially awkward and or lacking money and high level education
MGTOW of the old days compared to MGTOW now is like first wave of feminism compared to today's feminism.
>>27062582
perhaps he was more of a robot, he gave us electricity , and eventually the internet
>>27062773
so are they both driven by narcissism and selfishness?
or by something no one fully understands?
how similar are they to r9krs
>>27062773
Too true.
All the previous "MGTOW groups" did not isolate themselves from women for the sake of isolating themselves from women. They simply saw a "higher purpose" for themselves or whatever that did not allow for time with women.
MGTOW fags are obviously just thirsty for pussy and seek to "improve themselves" in whatever vague manner in order to be more attractive.
>>27062829
so if people don't care about whether you are self improved or not, then why are Robots on r9k not doing better in life when they openly admit they need to improve in life, and blame their lack of improvement on all their problems
>>27062582
>>27062829
BASED Tesla saw the development of electricity as his higher purpose for society
look where we are now
>>27062521
>>27062563
Everyone used to be MGTOW back in time, women would generally stay out of men's business entirely.
>>27062829
Some days I wonder who is really more thirsty for pussy, MGTOW fags or Fags who refer to themselves as Robots on r9k
>>27062521
as the author wrote for alyosha's character he preferred to eat bread and stay in a small cellar all day as opposed to going to a school and leading the life of a wealthy nobleman (his father even gave him 2,000 roubles to fuck around with but didn't).
he was more or less robot jesus, a 'r9ker' who could only love and not hate.
>>27062810
Narcissism and selfishness for $500
>>27062521
They weren't mgtow because they weren't stupid losers who think they're fooling people by saying they are lonely virgins by choice.
>>27063047
Have you heard of Diogenes, one of the fathers of Greek cynicism and stoicism
came from a money lending family, left them, lived in a barrel, masturbated in public, fascinated Alexander the great, wanted to be thrown over city walls when he died and eaten by wild animals
and trolled Plato and Socrates lectures non stop
you know, he is more like R9k In some instances, although he could also be considered MGTOW
>>27063059
but wasn't religion bullshit , and dint they choose to be that. who many on r9k fall into that category
and again
>yet there were monarchs and businessmen who also claimed to be "real close" with god, so much they could charge you money and tax you and >take away your communion or call for war. people who lived rather well for the time
i make the comparison to tesla because only one person brought him up,
both dedicated themselves to something that society though was relevant, but did they do it out of desperation, out of giving up on society, or out of passion
>>27062876
The thing with what this >>27062829 anon said
is that MGTOW now talk a lot about self improvement but they mostly just lurk through internet communities and rant about how women are evil and MGTOW life is so fantastic. Some of them are even spending their time and money on escapism i.e. "I can watch all my anime and fuck hookers whenever I want".
"True MGTOW" is busy achieving his goals, he doesn't care if everyone knows that he is MGTOW. Their vision was not influenced by women, Tesla even said that there were times he regretted sacrificing so much for science (regarding him never having family).
MGTOW movement is more focused on showing women that there are men who acknowledge their games and who won't be used than it is about men who sacrifice their life to pursue something greater. It's centered around hating women and any self improvement it may involve is only for the sole purpouse of bragging infront of women saying "Look what you will never have."
>>27063242
>Some of them are even spending their time and money on escapism i.e. "I can watch all my anime and fuck hookers whenever I want".
ahh the "manchild" and "animefag" problems everyone seems to complain about
I kind of want to make a venn diagram because there seems to be so much crossover and similarities among the groups, maybe this weekend
>>27063127
forgot wiki link for people wanting to read, quite funny actually
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diogenes_of_Sinope
It was an unconscious MGTOW back then, men rightfully couldn't care less about women themselves besides sticking their dick in them and reproducing, so if they weren't really interested in the latter they would go their way automatically.
Now women infest almost every aspect of society, so modern MGTOWs are more conscious about their decision.
>>27062521
theres always been virgin losers, just now they have more cognitive dissonance and a platform
>>27063310
>I kind of want to make a venn diagram because there seems to be so much crossover and similarities among the groups
That's because many MGTOWs come from sites like this one.
>>27063524
and yet they are all not the same
i think in order to break through the stalemate of shitposting and degeneracy and wangsting that has invaded r9k and to return to having original and intellectual thought, we need to take a closer look at these groups
>>27063432
Good point
Now what about Robots? if they are different than MGTOW, then how many of these guys were robots?
further more, how many robots would like to live like this if they could?
what is the difference between a robot and a MGTOW?
>>27063127
>left them
I'm fairly sure his father got banished from their city because of a large money scam.
>>27063127
>>27063624
Diogenes = This pepe
>>27063623
I think the defining characteristic of the Robot lies in his inability to be part of society rather than unwillingness, conscious or not, to be part of the latter. There's some overlapping with the two, but fundamentally many robots want to NOT go their own way and be part of normal society, they just are unable to and are pushed away.
How much of this inability can be changed or not is debatable, I think the answer lies in the middle.
I'd say that since society worked differently back then, the number of actual robots was lower since in a way or the other they would've found a place.
>>27063781
maybe this should be a new general thread: Tracing robots through history using the internet
educates people, gets them reading, brings up other areas of discussion encountered, exposed to philosophy, economics, perhaps warfare, literature
maybe there are other things than just monasteries where the historical equivalents went,
personally I don't think society actually was too different than it was today, in fact, some days i even people being "different" from today is just a meme, but that is for another thread
>>27062521
A large percent of the male population has always been unsuccessful with women, or unwilling to bother with the social games required to have sex with them.
I think the main difference is back then those groups just sort of went "women are shit, am i right?" then dedicated their lives to more noble pursuits while satisfying physical urges with prostitutes, while modern MGTOW is full of men who say the same thing but have no easy or socially acceptable access to prostitution (because patriarchy i guess? lol) then dedicate their lives to further complaining about how much women are shit and trying to convince others of this, and don't actually do anything worthwhile with themselves.
>>27064252
no, the difference back then is that whores and brothels were still a thing and those unsuccessful guys just got their rocks off with whores and went on with their life
that's not the case anymore so those guys just fill their lives up with distractions, porn, and hobbies
>>27064290
that's literally what I said. except modern men are incredibly undisciplined compared to aesthetes of old. no amount of porn or distraction can satisfy their basic biological imperative, and because it goes unfulfilled you get sexually frustrated communities like modern MGTOW bitching about women and life being unfair nonstop.
>>27064252
>>27064290
>>27062961
qft
Trying to label as MGTOW people who lived before the advancement of feminism is pretty meaningless.
I also seriously hope you guys don't think that only losers and faggots became priests and monks because they could not get women...
>>27064393
Frankly, women are pretty shit nowadays. The average American woman is an obese entitled bitch. At leastn in the past they weren't fat. And they were probably less entitled due to the poorer economies and standards of living.
>>27064593
Ok, but I will ask again, what is the difference between an MGTOW and a robot?
>>27065725
I think there is a special snowflake problem in both groups that blames their "modernity" on all their problems
>>27065795
unless of course, "MGTOW" and "Robot" are just modern labels for a very long and constant phenomenon in society and religion witnessed in both the "West" and the "East'
Monks and priest tended to keep mistresses. Hence why the Reformed and Eastern churches allowed their clergy to marry.
Buddhist monks were similar in places where they had power. Although I take groups like the Ikko-Ikki and Cathar Perfecti as models for ROBOT9002.
>>27066017
and it just so happens the East/West divide in the church led to the split of the Roman Empire
and notice how many robots on this board are from the remnants of the western half
now tell me, where did the renascence and enlightenment values that our modern "western:" societies are built on originate from?
pic related
Let's be real guys. I agree with MGTOW, but let's be honest for a moment.
How many actual 8/10+. 6'2"+, good looking and popular guys call themselves MGTOW? Fucking none whatsoever.
It's not "men going their own way", it's Men SENT their own way. Just lol.
>>27065850
They're not. Because monastic life is usually an active life choice that someone makes, its constructive with the union of life and work, and choosing to forgo a family in pursuit of some kind of higher purpose.
MGTOW and robots are just betas who can't get a gf, who then choose to base their entire identities on not being able to get a gf, and then delude themselves into thinking that it was their choice and that they didn't want a stupid gf all along. Posting on the internet about it isn't constructive. Its literally just sour grapes wrapped up in a bunch of garbage-tier excuses and rationalizations.
>>27066087
>now tell me, where did the renascence and enlightenment values that our modern "western:" societies are built on originate from?
That's probably more because the Byzantines spent the 8th century onwards getting dumpstered by the Muslims. And then Venetian crusaders sacked Constantinople for a laugh. Its hard to have a renaissance when you're getting fucking wrecked by everyone. I doubt that clergy being allowed to marry was a thing. The Roman Catholic Church wasn't exactly progressive in fostering western values, but at least they paid a lot of money to have their ceilings painted nicely.
>>27066149
and yet I see robots who want to essentially check out of society,
and i have seen threads about theoretical living in a big house
and "comfy threads" living in serene places like a monastery
but then there are people like Tesla who also dedicated his life "Science" and didn't get marred or laid, and wasn't that also a choice?
isn't MGTOW a choice, despite the mental gymnastics and rationalizations, which in of itself is kind of a redundant statement ?
>>27066291
but it is that religious aspect that many robots were raised on that "Chads" get to circumvent
how many MGTOW and Robots feel they are entitled to a GF or marriage because they went through all the religious morale bullshit they once believed in whole heartedly before getting Red Pilled
all those "nice guy " values that we are fed by education and the media,then people come here and complain about double standards and hypocrisy and degeneracy. all those values that children ave to follow or else they are punished by their alpha parents unless they choose to lie, or manipulate their beta tier parents
>>27066408
if you transplant this back in time
how many monks came from upbringings like this
On behalf of the Chads I would like to thank you Beta MGTOW cucks for making it super easy to get laid and for giving us the the future via or offspring(which will also be chads).
>>27066307
>and yet I see robots who want to essentially check out of society,
You can check out of society by being a reclusive autist. They've always existed too, but they got burned because the normies thought they were witches.
>isn't MGTOW a choice
No.
>>27066148
I am literally that 6'2 8/10 (according to soc rate threads, anyway, take that as you will) popular guy.
To be fair I only half count, because MGTOW comes and goes in phases for me. I'll go three, four years at a time not giving a shit about women, not thinking about them, not pursuing them, not complaining about them, just doing my own thing, but every once in awhile I'll meet a girl who shatters my perceptions of normal women, and I'll end up with her for a year or two, but when it ends--and I make no illusions that no matter how smart she is, no matter how loyal she is, no matter how different she seems, she'll eventually "fall out of love" and it will inevitably end; I have yet to be wrong about this--I fall right back into that comfy MGTOW groove.
>>27066408
Being a niceguy is a symptom of a shitty upbringing and not getting your emotional needs met as a child.
Here, read this
https://7chan.org/lit/src/Robert_Glover_-_No_More_Mr_Nice_Guy.pdf
>>27066495
ok, but what about Nikolai Tesla?
what about religious monks?
>>27066580
wow, this needs to spread more here
the content from other chans is bubbling up,
i think its the right time
>>27066580
and again, how many monks in history became monks because of this
and then Tesla, if he didnt have this background, he still chose to dedicate his life to science and "went his own way"
>>27066603
>>27066732
>I-I'm j-just like Nikola T-Tesla!
This has been a meme on r9k for years.
Where are your inventions? You're not Tesla, you just have shitty social skills.
>>27066580
>>27066732
well, life was pretty shit back then
>>27066087
>now tell me, where did the renascence and enlightenment values that our modern "western:" societies are built on originate from?
Renaissance happened because of Eastern Romans like Gemistos Plethon fleeing the sack of Constantinople and ending up in Italy.
>>27066291
> the Byzantines spent the 8th century onwards getting dumpstered by the Muslims.
Not really. The ERE actually looked poised to reconquer a lot of territory, but things went South after Manuel Komnenos died, then the Empire descended into civil war and ended up with a string of incompetent emperors (the Angeloi), the bickering of whom set the 4th Crusade up effectively.
> Its hard to have a renaissance when you're getting fucking wrecked by everyone
On the contrary, the ERE had numerous 'Renaissances' in art and culture, but the thing is that the stuff which enraptured Erasmus and other Westerners had always been available to people who spoke Greek.
Hence why, when Plethon and Co. went to Italy after 1453, the texts they brought with them and the lectures they made got the ball rolling in the West.
TL;DR the Renaissance never began/ended in the East.
>I doubt that clergy being allowed to marry was a thing.
Habeeb it.
>The Roman Catholic Church wasn't exactly progressive in fostering western values,
Depends on what you mean by Western values. In any sense you're wrong, really. It seems 'regressive' to us, but in its prime, the Catholic Church ran an international court (the Rota Romana), established houses of charity and did the bulk of the record keeping and administrative work there was to be done.
They also ran all the hospitals, and introduced the idea of ethical equality to a culture which previously held hierarchy to be sacred. Erasmus was very important in fostering Western values, he was a Catholic scholar, and religion was important to him.
As with all progressive things, they are surpassed when circumstances change.
>>27066894
>The ERE actually looked poised to reconquer a lot of territory
*in the 12th century.
>>27066732
tesla was a zoophile that wanted to fuck birds. it's not "going your own way" when women literally don't even register as sexual beings to you.
>>27066831
I use him as an example because he is well known so people will be interested in discussing the thread topic
All mgtows are the most pathetic people online
>>27063432
So you just hate women? Typical.
>>27066937
He never once called himself mgtow
>>27066935
ok, looked it up, fair point,
but i don't want to turn this into a thread about beastiality, although that could be an interesting tangent we could learn from maybe another board would be better for that
but the dedication to something higher than ones self is the common theme between tesla, monks and religious followers in general
>>27062521
I have a deep call to become a Christian (Catholic) monk but I hate waking up early and these monks wake up at 4 or 5am.
>>27062521
>>27062563
>>27062582
>>27062643
>>27062698
>>27063127
>>27063432
I came here just to post this picture
>>27066149
May as well post the tumblr edit.
MGTOW is reactionary crybaby tumblr-tier bullshit. It's not men going their own way, it's men zigging when women are zagging, it's waiting on feminists to do or say something so that they can take the opposite stance.
It's not even a real belief system. It's based on what they're not, rather than what they are.
It's just so stupid. LOOK AT HOW MUCH WE DON'T CARE ABOUT WOMEN, WE CREATED AN ENTIRE MOVEMENT AND IDEOLOGY BASED AROUND HOW MUCH WE DON'T CARE ABOUT THEM
>>27067035
the question was, is MGTOW a recent phenomenon, or is it just a modern label for something that has been around for a long time, including before Tesla was even born
>>27062521
true MGTOW first probably don't identify as MGTOW, and secondly don't obsess over women. This movement and ideology is a fucking meme that's based on how much you can hate bitches. Not on building yourself up
>>27067100
thanks for the bump, but your attempt at trolling is not contributing to the thread topic
>>27067124
and what about "robots"?
are they also a recent phenomenon, or are have they been around for much longer as well
what are the commonalites and differences between "Robots" and "MGTOW"
>>27067014
abloo bloo cry me a river faggot
>>27067138
are there any robots in this thread or is it all normie trolls?
>>27062521
Men were always going their own way. It's only nowadays that most guys were conditioned to be beta faggots who subject themselves to female domination.
>>27067140
>trolling
senpai you're retarded at least half the posts in this stupid thread are echoing what I wrote.
MGTOW are like atheists who really really give a shit about religion, probably moreso than a lot of actually religious people. They care more about what women & feminists do and think, just so they can be contrarian and do the opposite.
>>27063432
now about marriage, who is it that pressures men to marry now, who was it then
who is it that shames men for "cheating" then and now
who is it that turns a blind eye to "chads" then and now
who is it that condemns people for acting like "chads" then and now
>>27067266
and what exactly is wrong about that if they believe their fellow men could do better and shouldn't fall for the vaginal jew?
I bet you are just that edgy contrarian kid who believes himself to be above everyone else because he doesn't take any strong stance on anything.
>>27067318
>now about marriage, who is it that pressures men to marry now, who was it then
that's where conservatives and women agree on the matter I guess, just open a thread on /pol/ about MGTOW and see for yourself
>>27067266
and when religion, which I am sure most here now see as bullshit, is used as a tool to divide and conquer and shame others, are atheists supposed to roll over and let others act out hypocritically, be rewarded for it, encouraged, and get ahead in life while if you do the same you are condemned
>>27067336
If you want to be gay that's fine, there's no need to hide it behind some sort of pseudo men's right nonsense.
It's not even men's rights either, it's just pic related. Like Tumblr landwhales who have that same "LOOK AT WHAT ALL YOU PATRIARCHAL SCUM ARE MISSING OUT ON, YALL CAN'T HANDLE THIS MUCH REAL WOMAN" delusional attitude. Go, go march on your "own" way. No girl wanted to fuck or date you in the first place lol At least most or some MRAs still have the common sense to date women and be in relationships with them and not be sour grapes about it all.
>>27067385
and we here in the remanent of the west roman empire, which evolved with the enlightenment that eventually spurred the American and French revolutions, (and you know the history before, during and afterwards) are the ones where"robot" and "MGTOW" seem to be complaining the most
>>27067210
I doubt there exists a precise definition of MGTOW since everyone has a different one. I think the basis is to recognize that marriage is shit and that society fucks man over. I'm not sure that MGTOW necessarily means that you must not fuck woman.
A robot is a loser or someone who lacks social skill ?Idk
>>27067471
TL; DR I'm assblasted and have no arguments.
We get it, thanks for stopping by.
>>27067471
>calling someone gay because you disagree with him
>>27067531
how do robots view marriage then
do they think society fucks over men, or do they have some sort of hope but can't get out of a depression
>>27067100
>>27067266
>>27067471
I would argue that there are men who are "mgtow" without even realizing it. The core values of mgtow do apply to some men who genuinely don't care about marriage or women.
In an ironic twist, the guys who proudly proclaim they are mgtow are actually the opposite of what the movement stands for. They are so angry at women they want to believe they are hurting them by being single.
A real mgtow probably hasn't even heard of it being a movement, that's just how they wanted to live their lives. They aren't trying to hurt anyone or make a statement. They just want to he happy.
Mgtow is alright, I think the values have been corrupted by frustrated guys who want to be with a woman but just aren't good enough for them.
MGTOW makes bots look like chad
>>27067626
>A real mgtow probably hasn't even heard of it being a movement, that's just how they wanted to live their lives. They aren't trying to hurt anyone or make a statement. They just want to he happy.
do religious monks (christian, buddhist or whomever) fall under this description then?
>>27067565
>>27067566
>not wanting to stick your penis in a vagina
So, what then if you're not gay? You're into animals?
You're "asexual" you little tumblr snowflake?
It's not being assblasted or disagreeing with someone, it's a very fair assumption to make that if someone says "vagina? No thank you, I am far too enlightened for that!" that they must dreaming about dude's assholes instead.
Unless they're castrated. Is that the end goal of MGTOW?
>>27067647
I would say no, because the motivation was higher than worldly pleasures.
A mgtow wants to have a fulfilling life on earth. A religious monk wants to have a fulfilling afterlife in heaven.
>>27067625
I really doubt robots have a uniform view of marriage.
>>27067667
women are eventually going to hit the wall on their looks
they are going to want to settle down
if they are born with good looks or put a lot of effort into still looking good, they will want a rich cuck or some poor nice guy to marry, and then they may still cheat
chads are not marriage material for women
then there are the rest of us
>>27067626
>the movement
>mgtow
>the core values
>it has been corrupted
senpai, the ENTIRE premise of this stupid ordeal is "look at how much we don't care about women! Okay? Are you guys watching? Ladies? We do NOT care. We'll be counter-protesting feminist protests and writing long-winded thinkpieces and posting on 4chan about you, but we totally don't care at all. No sour grapes here. We don't care, just to be clear"
>>27067667
>MGTOW = asexuality
stop, you are embarrassing yourself, you don't even know what you are discussing
>>27067667
Different anon here.
I'm absolutely sure there are mgtow who never would have gotten laid in their lives. You could say they have "given up"
I wouldn't say they are gay. It's more of a "why do I keep chasing after tail? I'm obviously not good at this" and then moving on with life. I know it's hard for you to imagine since you're so cool and have so much sex on a regular basis, but you can live life without worrying about getting laid.
>>27067714
>MGTOW = MRA
>>27067713
It's like you're replying to a completely different post. I didn't ask what you thought about the cycle of women getting married and Chads and whatever else your post was supposed to be about.
I asked you very clearly if you are into women, if you are gay, or if you have some other meme sexuality which would explain your affiliation with MGTOW
>>27067714
I agree that the guys who say "I don't care about women, I'm mgtow" are full of shit.
I'm just saying those guys took a set of values and twisted them to act like it's an attack on women. True mgtow was supposed to be about living a non traditional life, just like the "strong independent woman" however, instead of having sex with strangers, mgtow do solitary manly stuff like camping in the mountains and building cars.
The mgtow I know is being misrepresented by angry virgins.
>>27067694
but now there is a growing number of people who are turning away from religion because their faith is pretty much gone and there are not "rewards" by being "conservative" in all terms and circumstances, which the current generation of under 30 Red Pillers were raised to be , also referred to as "cuckservatives"
yet despite this, i see on r9k a desire to essentially take up a monastic lifestyle if it were realistically possible
so I'm wondering if many monks really were believers, or if they joined to find faith again, or they didnt know any better but tried to be good people,
of course there were variations, but that is why i brought us Gregor Mendel, who contributed to biology and inherited characteristics, and all the monks who brewed alcohol , or raised St.Bernards, developed language script because they were the most educated people at the time, architecture
more things i have probably not read about yet
i just se an interesting connection that "robots" would probably settle for, and got thinking
>>27067749
Nah, MRAs are actually concerned about self-improvement and still date women and have sex with them and get married. They actually seem reasonable in comparison.
MGTOW is just sour grapes "look at how much effort we put into not caring about women"
>>27067742
>and then moving on with life
Well I don't know about that part when they form and join a club that's based around their lack of sex.
>>27067735
that picture applies more to your post than it does to mine senpai.
>Is it older than we think?
No
>What about all the monks, Christian and buhddist, who live in monasteries for hundreds of years, were they also MGTOW?
No
>what social conditions do you think led them to seek out monastery life
A mix of vocation and the promise of steady feed.
>>27067760
you didnt see how my oat was relevant to to conversation, did you
you don't see the big picture many others do
>>27067863
Please originally see >>27067817
>>27067863
>maybe if I strawman hard enough I won't look completely retarded
>>27067817
>I agree that the guys who say "I don't care about women, I'm mgtow" are full of shit.
How is that any different from what you described in the rest of your post as being the "true" MGTOW? It's still making a big deal about how much you don't care about women, and then running away from them.
>>27067888
typo, not oat, *post
I went to school at a Benedictine monastery, and the monks were similar to the type of people you would meet on /r9k/. Of course, due to their religious beliefs, they were more on the verge of being "normal," but they were social misfits all the same. They always came from strange, sometimes abusive or foreign backgrounds, and often had mental illnesses. One of them was schizophrenic, in example.
They also had difficulty even getting along with each other. The Abbot did not remember the names of the younger monks, and only a few of them commonly spoke with other monks. They'd often get into squabbles as well, as one monk didn't enjoy the organ playing of another monk, and this would result in them cutting each other off.
It was peculiar, and I don't know how happy they were. One young monk got kicked out because he got into a relationship with a young catholic girl who was also a student there. It also seemed like a hard life, as they just worked around the clock and prayed, and beyond that, they had to give up common pleasures like video games or internet.
>>27067942
Women weren't supposed to be a focal point. It was encouraged to sleep with women if you are into that and obviously capable of doing so, but mgtow was supposed to be about focusing on yourself as a man, growing, learning and changing. It can be a permanent lifestyle or a phase.
Many young men go through a phase of "I never want to get married! I want to party and work and spend time with my friends" that's roughly mgtow. But it got twisted into "I don't want to get married because women are whores!"
Original mgtow was not concerned about women's actions or behavior.
>>27067863
>Well I don't know about that part when they form and join a club that's based around their lack of sex
see
>>27067817
>mgtow do solitary manly stuff like camping in the mountains and building cars.
you mean like living in a monastery
repost for typos, fuck this stupid post system
>>27067915
None of what I wrote is a strawman. Maybe you should spend more time thinking critically and less time scrounging up reddit-tier reaction images.
>>27067913
>>27067934
You can still go camping and lift weights and building cars and fart really loudly while working a in coal mine or something equally stereotypically manly, and still be in a relationship with a women or even just have casual sex.
What's with the whole "I'm allergic to pussy" attitude?
>>27068031
but are religious monks a type of MGTOW
>>27068021
but it's the name of it senpai.
Men Going Their Own Way i.e. away from women.
It's intrinsically concerned with women, otherwise it wouldn't be called "MGTOW" it would just be called "self-improvement"
>>27068031
Casual sex is encouraged in mgtow, it's the commitment of marriage that goes against it.
It's not because you hate women, you do it to spend more time on yourself.
I don't understand why you guys automatically assume one is angry virgin because they don't want to get married. Sure it's annoying when people act all high and mighty for their choice (or lack of) but to throw a blanket stereotype over a lifestyle is just shitty.
>>27068057
No, because Nuns exist as well. A monk's or Nun's existence isn't based on gender politics.
>>27067986
now the thing that is interesting is that the backgrounds to r9krs is probably similar, especially throughout history
but it was built around religion that is now falling out in the "west" and there is no place for those personalities to go
>>27068084
I wouldn't say it's concerned with women, it's a movement away from the responsibilities of being in a long term relationship with a woman.
>>27068109
but people keep comparing MGTOW to modern feminism
>>27068147
Because they're inherently the same thing. 'X is bad therefore we should be dismissive and derisive toward them despite claiming to be free of them in our own lives.'
>>27063432
I think the problem with that pic is that you guys don't have "those nights". Believe it or not most guys slut it up more than most girls. I know on the internet that's absurd but it's he truth if you have ~20 partners her 10 seems like child's play
>>27068147
and gender politics is the hole reason religion exists in the first place
and politics is bullshit, nepotism, double standards and hypocrisy that result sin certain groups getting lied to, manipulated and fucked over
Why not date traps? no bullshit, no games, no drama, just sex and fun.
>>27068109
that does not dismiss monks as not being MGTOW
it shifts the topic to women
>>27068211
See:
>>27067471
There's also no need to hide your homosex behind women's clothes and make-up.
>>27068265
personally i think the ladyboy phenomenon in Thailand is a way for the men to scare off foreigners from picking up their women as sex slaves/prostitutes
they know they cannot realistically fightback, so they become ladyboys
Their attitudes couldn't be more different.
Monks seek a spiritual life, and avoid women because they know sexuality is a hindrance to the spiritual life.
MGTOW avoid women simply because of antimony, and have selfish goals.
>>27068240
They're not MGTOW because there are WGTOW doing the exact same thing. You're trying a little too hard to slap the MGTOW label on other people's efforts and accomplishments that have absolutely nothing to do with this reverse-tumblr movement.
Like those Mormons who went around "baptizing" historical dead people and claiming them for their church.
>>27068342
Monks don't really avoid women, they just don't search for them, improving their spiritual life comes first always.
>>27068357
so you believe MGTOW is just a modern label
now do you think the phenomenon is new, or has it been around for a long time
remember that religion is really no longer there to take in people
no both are completely motivated by different things
however monks believe that contact with woman reduce their "pure" capacity, if you have experience in religion you can somewhat understand this point of view
and i have to agree, woman do corrupt your mind at some level which we can't fully understand
>>27068057
They are MGGW. Men going God's way.
Functionally its the same thing, but rather than deciding to abstract themselves from 'worldly' affairs based on a very worldly hatred of women, they are in theory at least following an ineffable purpose which would be diminished were it put into words.
I'm sure that some monks probably cloistered themselves out of misanthropy, but that will be beneath layers of religious sublimation.
I don't like quietism, so the monk life doesn't appeal to me. If there is a reason for wasting yourself on ideals, then its out there rather than in your heda.
Hence why I'd rather be one of those saintly, emaciated Naxal cadre than a complacent, internalist hermit.
>>27068342
>woman goals are not selfish
always make the comparison
>>27068342
both of those deal with believing in so called higher values,
one to god, which happened for many years but is now fading out because many people no longer believe in or follow god
and the other is the result of trying to have values in the "god is dead" world.
>>27062521
Marriages were arranged in the past
The only people who joined religious orders due to their sexuality were fags
>>27067863
no mgtow is about understand why you should get away from woman.
deciding not to marry is a big deal and there is alot of discussion needed to fully understand the reasons behind it
>>27068565
marxism sought to destroy the nuclear family
the discussion is related to politics and history , and how marxism developed, which coincided with the biggest change in human interaction, jobs and families known as the industrial revolution, which brought on first wave feminism
>>27068454
It's not a belief it's a fact
https://www.google.com/trends/explore#q=MGTOW&cmpt=q&tz=Etc%2FGMT%2B5
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Men_Going_Their_Own_Way
>>27068604
>marxism sought to destroy the nuclear family
fucking rofl
please post the /pol/ infographic you got this shit from lmao
>>27068642
someone has not read the communist manifesto
BRB
>>27068633
ok, but has the phenomenon been arodun for a long time,
1950s
1880s
1780s
1680s
1492
1330
1100
ect
>>27068660
please literally copy paste me here right now the a quote FROM ANY BOOK where marx put the word destroy together with family / nuclear family
protip: you cant, /pol/tard
>>27068604
it was the third wave feminism in the 90's that completely dismantled men in marriage
>>27068660
ok read pages 15-30
https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/download/pdf/Manifesto.pdf
here is a snippet:
>On what foundation is the present family, the bourgeois family, based? On capital, on private gain. In its completely developed form, this family >exists only among the bourgeoisie. But this state of things finds its complement in the practical >absence of the family among the proletarians, and in public prostitution.
>>27068781
>Nothing is easier than to give Christian asceticism a Socialist tinge. Has not Christianity declaimed against private property, against marriage, against the State? Has it not preached in >the place of these, charity and poverty, celibacy and mortification of the flesh, monastic life and Mother Church? Christian Socialism is but the holy >water with which the priest consecrates the heart-burnings of the aristocrat.
>>27068681
No, that is you trying to fit the label on things that had nothing to do with it.
MGTOW is a modern luxury, beause men today can afford to have sex with high-tech latex sex dolls since they don't need to get married in their early 20s and start making babies before they end up going to war or facing a drought/poor harvest on the farm that they live on.
Mgtow is the act of telling everyone you aren't interested in women as a way to get women. Obviously it doesn't work.
>>27068750
true, but it was a 100 minimum year mission by dedicated socialists inserting themselves in the media and education and stirring shit up across the world
combined with , at a minimum because there is equal fault on the other side for letting ti ge to the point that it did
hypocritical religious people, weak cuckservatives, unjust and poor treatment of others based on your religious values, cheating, jobs and economy
>>27068833
words evolve with time to describe the same feelings and phenomenons that are constant over human history
>>27068833
My lincoln is a luxury. Having sex with a doll is just pathetic.
>>27068886
No mgtows are new. Men haven't been big entitled babies before, so they weren't mgtows.
>>27068886
>the same feelings and phenomenons
Except that they're not. MGTOW is entirely modern and entirely sour grapes.
You had recluses and geniuses in the past who died lonely virgins and/or secretly gay but that's because they were focused on their craft, not on getting away from women because marriage is a tool of Marxist oppression or whatever.
The bourgeois family will vanish as a matter of course when its complement vanishes, and both will vanish with the vanishing of capital.
Do you charge us with wanting to stop the exploitation of children by their parents? To this crime we plead guilty.
But, you say, we destroy the most hallowed of relations, when we replace home education by social.
And your education! Is not that also social, and determined by the social conditions under which you educate, by the intervention direct or indirect, of society, by means of schools, &c.? The Communists have not invented the intervention of society in education; they do but seek to alter the character of that intervention, and to rescue education from the influence of the ruling class.
The bourgeois clap-trap about the family and education, about the hallowed co-relation of parents and child, becomes all the more disgusting, the more, by the action of Modern Industry, all the
family ties among the proletarians are torn asunder, and their children transformed into simple articles of commerce and instruments of labour.
But you Communists would introduce community of women, screams the bourgeoisie in chorus.
The bourgeois sees his wife a mere instrument of production. He hears that the instruments of production are to be exploited in common, and, naturally, can come to no other conclusion that the lot of being common to all will likewise fall to the women. He has not even a suspicion that the real point aimed at is to do away with the status of women as mere instruments of production.
>>27068959
i would post more but the fucking posting filter s screwing it up
pgs 24 25 26 are a good focus
https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/download/pdf/Manifesto.pdf
>>27068945
>marriage is a tool of Marxist oppression or whatever.
yeah, no
communism is actually an enemy to religion
>>27068945
so slang does not change and evolve
insults do not change and evolve
names we call each other do no change
>>27068833
how long has pornography been around for, and prostitution
and doesn't MGTOW mean you are not sexually active because you don't care, so why are you using a sex doll or porno
>>27068604
>marxism sought to destroy the nuclear family
Not at all, the nuclear family was dissolved by capitalism's regular functioning, has been happening since the first man was put out of work by market fluctuations while his wife worked at the factory.
You have your silly, childish Disney image of the family, as a relationship of love and cuddles, then you have the historical family, a relationship of mutual benefit and protection by the breadwinner, as all MRAs will tell you.
Industry dissolved this necessity early on, its only when smug, mincing ponce creatures in the middle class took notice of the effect this was having that all the preening shitbag moralists squirmed out of the rot to squawk about it, as though it were evil commies who had done this.
We are living in the aftermath of 'female emancipation' at the hands of imperialism, they are now free to labour for a wage just like men are. Solution? You tell me.
>>27062829
What if they wanted to isolate themselves from society or be neets and just gone by with all religious stuff? It was a closest thing to neet possible back then if you werent rich.
>>27069265
marx believed families are exploitation
pgs 24 25 and 26
https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/download/pdf/Manifesto.pdf
>>27069097
Men were not pathetic enough in the past to be mgtow.
>>27069265
>Industry dissolved this necessity early on, its only when smug, mincing ponce creatures in the middle class took notice of the effect this was having that all the preening shitbag moralists squirmed out of the rot to squawk about it, as though it were evil commies who had done this.
bro, you even grammar?
>>27069337
there were no beta males in the past, only alphas, and everyone was ripped and talked in a tough gruff manly man voice and had crazy beards and wrestled with bears and wolves
got it
>>27069402
Nobody said that. The betas then were still miles ahead of mgtows. You gotta realize, an mgtow is worse than any omega.
>>27069508
No, there just weren't fat antisocial nerds jackin off to cartoon children in their mom's basement.
>>27069515
>>27069508
>subscribing to anything beyond alpha-beta
i guess some here accept that
>>27069557
There are levels. Just nothing below mgtow
>>27069554
they probably weren't fat, but the japanese have been drawing that for a LONG time
>>27069594
>there are levels
just stop
>>27069330
I'm well aware. I'm describing the conditions which bring about the end of the family, by way of dissolving its necessity.
All exploitative social relations developed out of circumstantial benefit, but the contradictions are sharpened when these relations of exploitation become obsolete in light of developing means of production.
So goes the family.
Also, I don't know if you are actually interested in Marxist theory, but read Engels' Conditions of the Working Class in England for the 'material' which influenced Marx's opinions of the family, and of course the Holy Family for a more formal presentation of the ideas you'll see throughout Conditions of the Working Class.
If you are, then good. That /r9k/ isn't our base already is a testament to the efficacy of /pol/'s propaganda.
>>27069383
Grammar is for the dispassionate. I have too much zeal to care for shit like that.
>>27068177
>Confusing Chad for "most guys"
>>27069651
You're just mad you're worse than cucks
>>27069627
I didn't say drawing
>>27070006
how else would cartoons exist for basement dwellers?
>>27070034
They download them
>>27069987
no really
this is as bad as claiming there are other pills out there other than red pill blue pill
>>27070089
its being consumed, thats what is important
its not like porn was inaccessible before the internet
>>27070092
Oh only losers use that pill shit.
>>27070130
>literally missed the point
>>27070136
you frequent 4chan but don't believe in red pill blue pill,
yet you believe not only in alpha beta, but also gamma omega whatever else?
>>27062521
MGTOW, like many other kinds of unwarranted self-importance and various whiney-faggotires, is mostly a modern phenomenon associated with the rise of the internet. The internet has provided human beings the ability to instantly communicate 24/7 their stupid fucking bullshit that literally no one cares about. While in the old days if you wanted to complain about how much your life sucks you either had to be personable enough to have other humans physically present to talk to or what you said had be well thought enough to justify the costs of physically printing it. With the internet there are no longer any obstacles to people spewing their crap at each other. The end result is the very platform we are using to talk each other right now.
>>27070171
in order for cartoons to be put on the internet they , oh idk, have to be drawn first...
accessibility was still possible pre internet
so unfortunately this thread got side tracked
it appears that MGTOW And Robot are more so labels to describe something that has been around for a long time, but because of modern technology and the now absence of religion, the internet has evolved this phenomenon into a narcissistic group without a place to go, and has divided itself into "MGTOW", "Robots" "AimeFags" and "man children" with varying degrees of overlap.
all groups seem to subscribe to a set of values that they hold high, and their activities do not constitute all of their beliefs. however, their activities appear to complement their "highly valued" beliefs, and reflect that they are much more liberal than "religions" of the past
perhaps what we are seeing is the same segments of society that have always existed in the past trying to find some sort of meaning in the modern world where indeed "God is dead", which has had a profound impact on the concept of religious marriage and morals that western civilization is built upon and was taught for a long time, and now to confirm that god early is indeed dead, rather than continue to follow in ignorance, they will hold true to the systems they have developed with the same fervor of those who practiced religion before them
perhaps we do need a venn diagram, but that is for another day
>>27062521
Hey I know those guys
They are about an hour north of Santa Fe NM in Chama Caynon, they are Benedictine monks, The Monastery of Christ in the Desert, been there since 1964
You can stay at the monastery and eat, pray with them for a small fee, been there a couple of times, pretty restful
If I believed in g_d, I could see joining the order
The guy in the front is Abbott Phillip
For more information:
https://christdesert.org/
>>27070810
so its about seeking a higher purpose
non of the groups above are seeking higher purpose
its all degeneracy
and normies are degenerate
all the above wand to partake in the degeneracy, whether it is out of a sense of community or selfishness, but either way they are not able to practice the nepotism others are privileged with and partake in it.
those who are are called "normies, NEETs, and Chads"
MGTOW, if they are just a modern flavor, claim they are seeking a higher purpose, but they have not proved anything yet.
maybe its because of bullshit trying to convince others they are special, just like all the other groups ,or maybe it is simply because of age that coincides with the age of the internet where they were born
as for Robots, they are like MGTOW, but I can't put my finger on it
>>27070810
>"MGTOW", "Robots" "AimeFags" and "man children" with varying degrees of overlap.
None of those terms actually mean anything, their just fucking meme adjectives. Your need to affix labels to things is clouding your ability to see through the bullshit.
>>27071209
> "muh white privilege"
>>27071274
I'm only speaking in the terms that the majority of people use here
hence the quotation marks
>>27071302
in part I guess you could say I'm trying to point out the absurdity of it all
>>27071281
its privilege held by all cultures, its the same old shit everywhere you go
always has been always will be
