For all things Christian
Catholics and Protestants alike are welcome to discuss theology. Try to be polite.
Atheists also welcome, but try to be constructive.
Theme Song: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GmsiKo5deSU
Pastebin for believers and curious folk.
http://pastebin.com/xMQ9wAwW
Possibly unnecessary bumping. Still writing.
Also
>Catholics and Protestants alike
No love for our Orthobros?
>>75996354
But the glaring flaw in your theory is that the Jews as the most generate people. Literally every conservative ideal is upheld by these people. The Jews run the media and have been doing nothing but enforcing strong conservative values until recently. They actually complain the shit liberal ideals we see today are because they unfortunately put non-Jews in some executive roles.
>>75997845
go somewhere else.
we have to many shit threads.
What is the most retarded denomination?
Surely Mormons right?
>>75997972
Orthodox are welcome of course. Usually saying Catholics and Protestants are both welcome covers it.
If Protestants are welcome, then Orthodox are welcome by default.
>>75997845
One thing I Was meaning to ask on the previous thread. Do you feel that there is a connection between Buddhism and Christianity?
>>75998123
It's between Mormons and Jehovahs Witness imo.
But any denomination that denies that Jesus is God comes close.
>>75998146
Don't know a whole lot about Buddhism, but from what I gather, if you meditate enough you can become god-like? If that's the case, that isn't anything like Christianity.
>>75998146
Personally, I do feel that there are moral connections.
Buddhists can get pretty weird though, so it depends on what sense you mean that by.
Zoroastrianism and Christianity are directly connected. The three wise men who came to baby Jesus through their study of the stars were Zoroastrian.
>>75998225
>>75998123
Would say that Mormons and Jehovah's Witness's aren't even Christian, therefore don't qualify as Christian, therefore aren't even a denomination.
Why would you be a Christian, if you believe that the Jews are the true Israelites, when only the Israelites are under the New Covenant?
It be my dream to have celestial wings,guessing when we enter the gates of heaven I can ask
>>75998443
>if you believe that
We don't believe what you just said.
>>75998442
I think once you deny the divinity of Jesus as God you've lost sight of Christianity. So I won't disagree with you there.
>>75997999
>the Jews who run the media have been enforcing strong conservative values until very recently
I'm sorry but what m8?
>>75997845
You're not really a Christian. Its ok, we're all anonymous here, you can admit it.
I get it though, reddit has made the word atheist inflict reflexive powerful cringing upon hearing it so you're LARPing as a religion that you think is counter culture for contrarian sake and because of le hat meme. No one wants to call themselves an atheist now and its understandable because association with that meme is well. .yeah.
But, face it. The bible was translated and the whole world has read it now and everyone knows you're not supposed to do the forceful, eugenic, fascist shit that you want to do.
You can't close your borders, you can't hoard wealth, you can't deport people against their will, you can't DotR, you can't RaHoWa, you can't cease charity etc, etc, etc.
Read a little story about the death of Europe called The Camp of the Saints.
http://www.jrbooksonline.com/pdfs/camp_of_the_saints.pdf
This is exactly what Christ calls you to do because Spengler was right.
>“Christian theology is the grandmother of Bolshevism.”
You don't have to LARP as a Christian to be against faggotry.
>>75998298
From what I gather, it's not to become God, it's to become enlightened. To know that the temptations in your life cause desire, that desire causes want and that want causes suffering.
Unless your thinking about a specific shao Lin, that believe that if you practise martial arts, you can become a god. But I think this is daoism.
I have a few questions.
1. Without a physical body to interpret time and space, we cannot experience perception, so how can we experience Heaven or Hell after death?
2. I listen to Satanic music and enjoy Satanic art. If I follow the gospels and truly love Jesus Christ, am I still permitted to do this?
3. When should I NOT turn the other cheek? How much pacifism is too much?
>>75998354
>Buddhists get weird
True, but so do Christian sects I.e Mormonism, to some degree the Amish. However I admire the Amish.
>>75998992
>3. When should I NOT turn the other cheek? How much pacifism is too much?
You have to help the nigger stab you to death and bless him as he does it. You are not permitted to defend yourself.
>>75998625
Which part? Only the Israelites being under the New Covenant? Read Romans 9:3-4 and Jeremiah 31:31-34.
>>75999195
I disagree. Christ taught us that if a man were to slap you, offer the other cheek.
However you only have two cheeks. Strike once, but make it so hard that they never forget.
>>75999130
It's hard to not admire the Amish desu
> Without a physical body to interpret time and space, we cannot experience perception.
Unless the higher dimensions are not visible unless you are spiritual.
>I listen to Satanic music and enjoy Satanic art. If I follow the gospels and truly love Jesus Christ, am I still permitted to do this?
How do you know it's Satanic?
I mean, I listen to the Beatles, some people would tell me it's from Satan, but that's ridiculous.
>When should I NOT turn the other cheek?
Self defense is fine. Jesus commanded Peter to buy a sword to defend himself with.
If ants had an ant God, It would have the attributes of an ant. For instance "a super stinger to smite his enemy"
"provider of nectar" etc. They would be worshiping an idol of themselves.
The God of jews and muslims has the attributes of men. They worship idols of themselves.
>>75999380
I must ask you to validate your opinion with some scripture.
>>75999551
I was hoping you were Cuba. I'm sad now.
The white, heterosexual, Christian man is what the Jews fear the most. Anyone who says otherwise is a filthy kike.
>>75998102
Take your own advice
Christian threads are /pol/ heritage threads
>>75999610
"You have heard that it was said, 'Eye for eye, and tooth for tooth.'
Matthew 5:38
>>75998828
"But he turned, and said unto Peter, Get thee behind me, Satan: thou art an offence unto me: for thou savourest not the things that be of God, but those that be of men"
Reminder
>>75998828
Jews promoting atheism
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IkVC1gZInxQ
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j0LhabQJ_-w
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4NQOnjswuFI
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jewish_atheism
http://www.haaretz.com/jewish/the-jewish-thinker/.premium-1.669381
http://www.shj.org/
http://www.myjewishlearning.com/article/secular-humanistic-judaism-rejecting-god/
http://www.myjewishlearning.com/article/must-a-jew-believe-in-god/
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/09/23/atheist-jews-judaism-without-god_n_978418.html
http://thehumanist.com/magazine/september-october-2014/humanist-living/jewish-atheists-and-koufax-jews
https://secularpolicyinstitute.net/numbers-the-rise-of-jewish-atheists/
>>75997845
Don't like this thread?
pic related
>>75999933
>75999933
>933
Matthew 9:33
>33 And when the devil was cast out, the dumb spake: and the multitudes marvelled, saying, It was never so seen in Israel.
Very nice
Any LGBT Catholics around? I'm a bi-sexual male who struggles with wanting to romantically and sexually be with another man. I know I'm not going to give into temptation but I was just wondering if there's anyone on this board similar to me in this situation. I pray the rosary to help give myself strength and confidence in my will.
>>75997845
DEAD JEW ON A STICK AHAHAHAAH
>>75999869
That's Matthew, the first book of the New Testament. Are you taking that quote out of context?
“You have heard that it was said, ‘Eye for eye, and tooth for tooth.’[a] 39 But I tell you, do not resist an evil person. If anyone slaps you on the right cheek, turn to them the other cheek also. 40 And if anyone wants to sue you and take your shirt, hand over your coat as well. 41 If anyone forces you to go one mile, go with them two miles. 42 Give to the one who asks you, and do not turn away from the one who wants to borrow from you."
He's telling you exactly the opposite of what you're proposing. Why are you misusing the scripture? Isn't that a breach of the 3rd Commandment?
I'm joining the priesthood (Catholic) soon. Where would be the most interesting place to be a priest? So far I'm considering Chicago (because I live there) and Japan.
>>76000259
I cannot relate with your homosexual tendencies, but I think we can all relate about the temptation of lust. Keep strong, ponder about God's love instead of carnal love, whenever you feel like going into temptation.
I find this prayer useful during the day:
http://www.preces-latinae.org/thesaurus/Cotidiana/ActionesNostras.html
>>76000408
Atheist using Israeli proxy, an autistic israelite, or..?
>>76000408
MAH "STAR GOD" MAH CHILD SACRIFICE.
>Reading Torah at the moment.
>>75998992
Anyone wanna take a crack at my questions?
I need to be cleansed
It's time to make amends
For all of the fun
The damage is done
And I feel diseased
I'm down on my knees
And I need forgiveness
Someone to bear witness
To the goodness within
Beneath the sin
Although I may flirt
With all kinds of dirt
To the point of disease
Now I want release
From all this decay
Take it away
And somewhere
There's someone who cares
With a heart of gold
To have and to hold
>>76000408
t. Palestinian
I guess you aren't a real country, after all. Asianmoot didn't give you a flag. Stop attacking Israel, please.
>>76000712
>I'm joining the priesthood (Catholic) soon.
very nice, anon
>>76000541
Christcucks btfo
>>75997845
I read the 2 Corinthians last night and I had trouble understand what the point of the epistle was, Paul seems to ramble about "boasting" and talks about some sad letter he wrote earlier that I am unaware of.
>>76000712
You could come to Australia and have the easiest job in the world...
>>76000712
maybe In SA a small town would be cool, I love the Spanish style mission churches so much so I am biased
>Is this a depiction (albeit, a mocking one) of Jesus – perhaps even the oldest surviving image of Jesus? These questions are matters for debate about the Alexamenos graffito.
>The image is carved in plaster on a wall in Rome and is dated to somewhere between the 1st and 3rd centuries. It depicts a man looking at a person with the head of a donkey that’s being crucified, and it says, “Alexamenos worshipping God.” It’s believed that this was intended to be mocking the faith of a Christian named Alexamenos.
>>76000762
>there are no atheists in israel
>>76000541
>The scholar Walter Wink, in his book Engaging the Powers: Discernment and Resistance in a World of Domination, interprets the passage as ways to subvert the power structures of the time.[2] He says that at the time of Jesus, striking someone deemed to be of a lower class with the back of the hand was used to assert authority and dominance. If the persecuted person "turned the other cheek," the discipliner was faced with a dilemma. The left hand was used for unclean purposes, so a back-hand strike on the opposite cheek would not be performed. An alternative would be a slap with the open hand as a challenge or to punch the person, but this was seen as a statement of equality. Thus, by turning the other cheek the persecuted was demanding equality.
>Wink continues with an interpretation of handing over one's cloak in addition to one's tunic. The debtor has given the shirt off his back, a situation forbidden by Hebrew law as stated in Deuteronomy (24:10–13). By giving the lender the cloak as well the debtor was reduced to nakedness. He notes that public nudity was viewed as bringing shame on the viewer, not just the naked, as seen in Noah's case (Genesis 9:20–23).
>Wink interprets the succeeding verse from the Sermon on the Mount as a method for making the oppressor break the law. The commonly invoked Roman law of Angaria allowed the Roman authorities to demand that inhabitants of occupied territories carry messages and equipment the distance of one mile post, but prohibited forcing an individual to go further than a single mile, at the risk of suffering disciplinary actions.[3] In this example, the nonviolent interpretation sees Jesus as placing criticism on an unjust and hated Roman law as well as clarifying the teaching to extend beyond Jewish law.[4]
>>75998992
1, We have the word with us.
2, I don't see why not.
3, When common sense tells you so.
>>76000796
Methodist Jew reporting in
>>76001154
Poor Alexamenos was being bullied
>>76001160
Satanism is a form of atheism, I agree.
>>75999533
Actually not, it is the other way around. Jehovah or Allah if you will is a spirit being having no physical or material form. The attributes we have are intelligence, free will and emotional responses.
>>76001170
In context, it makes a lot more sense. However, it begs the question: how should we apply these teachings to our lives now, 2,000 years later? Are these teachings null and void now, or must we find a way to interpret them into a modern context?
Furthermore, why would the ETERNAL word of God present teachings that would become outdated?
>>76001416
So when the Bible says we were made in His image, it does not refer to our physical form but to our metaphysical form?
>>76001384
>"Atheism is, in the broadest sense, the absence of belief in the existence of deities"
Since "Satan" is a deity,Satanism cannot be a form of Atheism when Atheism rejects "Satan" as a deity.
>>76000408
Post your response.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=quTXwTjgfc0
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fxJTEaTkQM8
Who has believed our message
and to whom has the arm of the Lord been revealed? He grew up before him like a tender shoot, and like a root out of dry ground.
https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Isaiah+53
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vyc49kxqRnQ
>Accuse Jesus of Necromancy
>Get Suprised when he Rises from the Dead
top kek Jews your dark magick is no match for us.
>>76001827
Unless Satan is viewed as set of attributes within each human being and not as an actual deity. Ever read Anton LaVey?
>>75998992
>1. Without a physical body to interpret time and space, we cannot experience perception.
That's an assumption. Some accounts of near-death experience suggest otherwise. Also, the Scriptures aren't entirely clear about this subject. We do know that we will be given new bodies when the world will be renewed. I don't know if this will also apply to the damned.
Daily reminder that you are all worshiping Saul's bastardized version of christ,
>>76001799
It means when God looked at Adam, He could see Himself reflected in Adam, because the Holy Spirit of God was living in Adam.
When Adam sinned, and lost that, he and Eve could only make children in their own fallen image, not in God's.
>>76001416
Stick to gunfights; your theology is asinine.
>>76001846
Too long to watch
>the Lord
which one? all 3 of them? :DDDDD
>>76002171
>Also, the Scriptures aren't entirely clear about this subject.
Sure they are. Read Jesus' story about the certain rich man and the beggar named Lazarus in Luke.
>>76002198
We don't like Saul.
We love Paul.
And we worship what turned Saul into Paul.
>>75998102
oh shit christcucks btfo. looks like I'm a #DawkinsMissile now.
>>76001160
There's nothing but atheists in Israel, but for what few Christians strive to warn the people there.
>>76002431
Daily reminder that you are all worshiping *Paul's* bastardized version of christ,
>>76000541
Jesus is telling you what, in addition to keeping the Law perfectly, you need to do if you want to be like God on your own power.
Do you want to be like God on your own power?
>>76002198
>>76002271
Jesus real father was a Roman soldier named Pantera.
The Point of the story was that he was a Regular Man that went on a Quest for Power and found Necromancy and Miracle working.
>Jesus found the True highest God through Sheol and went into Miracle working and sacrificing his free will to be a vessel for God.
>We are all the Heroes and Villains of the story.
Don't get me wrong mate I am not a Christian a gentile or a jew the two people that where executed with Jesus are Alive again.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0ad6RvyX9JI
>>76001645
>how should we apply these teachings to our lives now, 2,000 years later?
By applying its principle
>Are these teachings null and void now, or must we find a way to interpret them into a modern context?
The principle still applies, the way it is applied depends on what we apply it to of course.
>Furthermore, why would the ETERNAL word of God present teachings that would become outdated?
They are not outdated, but he wasn't speaking to people in 2016. Of course the way format of his speeches would have reflected his time so that people around him would understand him.
>>76002372
But that is only a parable. And I would hesitate to make much of it for the reason that those aspects are not its main focus.
>>76002571
Like Saul, I met the living Christ Jesus, and like Saul, I was transformed by the meeting.
Shoo shoo, Jew. /pol/ is a Christian board.
>>76002652
>Pantera
dude sick \m/
>>76000796
*Yahwism
It's Yahwism, not Judaism. Judaism=Talmud
>>76002652
Jesus' real father is God the Father. Jesus is really God the Son. The Holy Spirit of Jesus is really the Holy Spirit of Jesus.
These things do not change based on Strayan' opinions.
>>76002615
>Do you want to be like God on your own power?
I'm not sure what that means.
>>76002705
It is not a parable. It identifies two people specifically and has no higher story to it.
It is a peek into Hades/Sheol, and by saying "it's a parable", you reveal yourself to be either lost, ill informed, or really immature as a Christian.
>>76002790
God states very clearly he is the All father.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=llR_QneXZ-0
>>76002535
>There's nothing but atheists in Israel
And muslims and jews.
>>76002712
Story?
>>75997845
KEK: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rBFzTISZNCE
>>76001645
Of course he brings comandments that are outdated. I mean for fuck said he gave us a new covenant with our Lord of light and our saviour, Jesus Christ.
This is documented in Noah's journey.
>>76002822
The devil told Adam and Eve that they should eat of the fruit of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, do good, avoid evil, and thus be like God.
Everyone who is not saved is trying to do that; they are trying on their own to be like God. some consciously, some not.
God gave His Law to show men that His Law cannot be kept by men; that men cannot be like God. Nobody ever kept the Law but for Jesus.
And being like God requires a lot more than just keeping the Law perfectly.
Jesus taught the Law to people who thought they beat the system. He proved to them they did not, and they murdered Him.
>>76001032
what makes it easy?
>>76002893
Both of those peoples are godless.
>>76001154
>>76001323
>In the next chamber, another inscription in a different hand reads Alexamenos fidelis, Latin for "Alexamenos is faithful" or "Alexamenos the faithful".[26] This may be a riposte by an unknown party to the mockery of Alexamenos represented in the graffito.
>>75999936
I don't know who made that fucking retarded image, but 70% of the people on it aren't fucking Jews.
>>76002652
Pantera was too young to be a Roman soldier in Judaea at that time. This theory has been utterly debunked. Sorry bro.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fJQix1NDruA
>>76002652
Begone jew, there's no shekels here for you.
>>76003099
You'd have a job administering to about 5 old couples a week.
>>76002680
Okay, so tell me what it might look like to apply that principal now. Say I'm being detained by 3 ISIS soldiers and I have my kids with me. One of the soldiers demands I give up my daughter and they'll let my son live. While they're not looking, I have a 5 second window to shoot all 3 of them in the back with a dropped assault rifle. Should I kill them or let them do as they please? Remember, they haven't killed anyone yet in this scenario.
>>76003371
Kill them then repent
>>76002571
Paul speaks a couple of times in his epistles about confirming with the other Apostles whether his Gospel accorded with theirs. He once concludes: "they added nothing".
Paul preached "Christ crucified". That's exactly what the others preached:
>The earliest available Christian texts are the letters of the apostle Paul. Scholars date his epistles from approximately 50 to 60 C.E. Therefore, many individuals think that there is at least a twenty-year gap between the death of Christ and the earliest Christian writings. However, most do not realize that the epistles of Paul contain creedal summaries of early Christian beliefs which possibly date as early as 35-40 C.E.1 The general nature of these creeds includes the death and resurrection of Christ.
https://carm.org/analysis-pre-pauline-creed-1-corinthians-151-11
>>76003051
What if I want to be like Satan instead? Surely that would just be because I'm another ignorant, lost soul among 7,000,000,000 others, right? So would my punishment after death be eternal or would it be proportional to my crimes?
>>76003197
I picked ten randomly and they were all jews.
>>76003607
And I want to post 1 Corinthians 15 too because it's such a beautiful passage. Paul's humility "as to one untimely born" who once even persecuted the Church and the Grace shown to him affects me deeply:
Now I would remind you, brothers and sisters, of the good news that I proclaimed to you, which you in turn received, in which also you stand, 2through which also you are being saved, if you hold firmly to the message that I proclaimed to you--unless you have come to believe in vain. 3For I handed on to you as of first importance what I in turn had received: that Christ died for our sins in accordance with the scriptures, 4and that he was buried, and that he was raised on the third day in accordance with the scriptures, 5and that he appeared to Cephas, then to the twelve. 6Then he appeared to more than five hundred brothers and sisters at one time, most of whom are still alive, though some have died. 7Then he appeared to James, then to all the apostles. 8Last of all, as to one untimely born, he appeared also to me. 9For I am the least of the apostles, unfit to be called an apostle, because I persecuted the church of God. 10But by the grace of God I am what I am, and his grace toward me has not been in vain. On the contrary, I worked harder than any of them--though it was not I, but the grace of God that is with me. 11Whether then it was I or they, so we proclaim and so you have come to believe.6
>>76003371
You are protecting your family so you have every right to shoot them. How is this even a question?
Not using evil to fight evil in this context applies to not persecuting muslims who had nothing to do with your detention after you are freed. Your problem is thinking that violence is always evil. It is not. It can also be righteous, and therefore it is not included in the "fighting evil with evil".
>>76003218
Two methods have been used to estimate the year of the birth of Jesus, one based on the accounts of his birth in the gospels with reference to King Herod's reign, the other by working backwards from his stated age of "about 30 years" when he began preaching: most scholars, on this basis, assume a date of birth between 6 and 4 BC.[1]
Tiberius Iulius Abdes Pantera (c. 22 BC – AD 40) was a Roman soldier whose tombstone was found in Bingerbrück, Germany, in 1859.
>"17 is too young to be having kids in this economy!"
The name Abdes means "servant of God" and suggests that Pantera had a Semitic or even Jewish background.
>>76003261
Not Jewish although Money helps alleviate the pain of having to deal with incredulous simpletons.
>>75998123
Calvinism is the most retarded denomination, because it completely invalidates the purpose of Christianity with mental gymnastics.
Mormons and JWs aren't Christians; they're cultists. If I want to be really nice, Mormons are their own religion separate from Christianity, but derivative from it. It's in a similar genealogical position to Islam.
>>76003553
Then can't I just rinse and repeat? Can I kill anyone I consider to be a serious threat to my family if I repent afterword and truly believe I did it for good reason?
What if they were local law enforcement instead of ISIS? What if they wanted to take my injured daughter to the hospital but I was convinced they were going to put her in some MKUltra experiment and so I blew them up with a car bomb? Would repenting afterword make it all better between God and I?
Chapter II.-Misrepresentation of Peter's Doctrine.
>In order, therefore, that the like may also happen to those among us as to these Seventy, give the books of my preachings to our brethren, with the like mystery of initiation, that they may indoctrinate those who wish to take part in teaching; for if it be not so done, our word of truth will be rent into many opinions. And this I know, not as being a prophet, but as already seeing the beginning of this very evil. For some from among the Gentiles have rejected my legal preaching, attaching themselves to certain lawless and trifling preaching of the man who is my enemy.2 And these things some have attempted while I am still alive, to transform my words by certain various interpretations, in order to the dissolution of the law; as though I also myself were of such a mind, but did not freely proclaim it, which God forbid! For such a thing were to act in opposition to the law of God which was spoken by Moses, and was borne witness to by our Lord in respect of its eternal continuance; for thus he spoke: "The heavens and the earth shall pass away, but one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law."3 And this He has said, that all things might come to pass. But these men, professing, I know not how, to know my mind, undertake to explain my words, which they have heard of me, more intelligently than I who spoke them, telling their catechumens that this is my meaning, which indeed I never thought of. But if, while I am still alive, they dare thus to misrepresent me, how much more will those who shall come after me dare to do so!
2 [This is one of the strongest anti-Pauline insinuations in the entire literature.-R.]
3 Matt. v. 18; comp. Matt. xxiv. 35; Mark xiii. 31; Luke xxii. 33. [This is a fair specimen of the loose method of Scripture citation characteristic of the Clementine literature. Sometimes the meaning is perverted.-R.]
>>76003987
I'll take scripture as evidence for that interpretation if you can offer it.
>>76004101
17 was too young an age to hold such a position as a soldier in Judaea. He may have been a Roman soldier, no doubt, but he had nowt to do with Jesus.
>>76004149
Go ask a priest, I'm just telling you what I'd do.
I'm not going to pretend I'm righteous enough to let some terrorists kill my family, even if killing them would condemn me to hell.
>>76003881
Which ten?
Please note that, if a person's grandmother was formerly Jewish (converted to Orthodox, etc.) - that does not make the person a Jew.
>>75997845
/pol/ is a Christian board.
>>76004352
Then perhaps you don't fully believe in God's teachings. If your faith is in God, it should work itself out right? Death is just a passing, no?
>>75998992
>1. Without a physical body to interpret time and space, we cannot experience perception, so how can we experience Heaven or Hell after death?
There's no such thing as 'Heaven'. That is a pagan concept. Christians believe in the (bodily!) resurrection and the life of the world to come. See the story of Doubting Thomas in Acts to explain what 'bodily' means.
>2. I listen to Satanic music and enjoy Satanic art. If I follow the gospels and truly love Jesus Christ, am I still permitted to do this?
Yes. As Paul said in 1 Cor 1:23: "All things are lawful for me, but all things are not expedient: all things are lawful for me, but all things edify not."
>3. When should I NOT turn the other cheek? How much pacifism is too much?
Any pacifism at all is too much. Pacifism is an anti-Christian heresy, since 'turning the other cheek' is not about pacifism.
>>76002171
The Father gave us flesh to reveal to us our spirit.
Our spirit has eternal life. Their is no flesh in heaven. We can never come back in the flesh no more than we can climb back into the womb.
Our spirit must leave behind the flesh of man. The journey has just begun.
>>76004449
Daily reminder that the men who wore that helm would blood eagle your faggot ass for speaking of Christianity. You can see the engravings of Saxon gods all over it. Your a faggot.
Who /lutheran/ here?
>>76003712
You're already like satan. Just dumber and less powerful.
>>76004326
He was first of Archers and a Flag Bearer.
>A position they give to the newly joined 17 year olds for their first combat mission overseas.
Who's service record he had an illigitimate child with a Nazarene woman.
>Jesus then went on to learn MAGICK which is confirmed in the Talmud as to being real, Healing the Sick ect.
>>76004265
In
Romans 13:3
God tells us to assassinate obama.
For rulers hold no terror for those who do right, but for those who do wrong. Do you want to be free from fear of the one in authority? Then do what is right and you will be commended.
>>75998225
>>75998442
>>76004140
Christianism means recognizing that Jesus was chosen by God (Christ: greek for "annointed" or chosen).
JW do recognize that, they also believe that he was the Son of God.
Just not that he was God himself.
In short: exactly what the bible says and what christians believed in the first centuries before pagan beliefs took root.
>>75999533
>The God of jews and muslims has the attributes of men.
No, it's the other way around. The Christian Man has the attributes of God.
>>76004830
Satan loses all of his power when he goes to hell
>>76004486
I fully believe, but just as I'm not yet disciplined enough to abstain from porn I'm not yet disciplined enough to let my family die. I would reluctantly kill the terrorists as it seemed to be my only option. It is in opposition to what Christ taught, but I am not Jesus.
We all sin, that is why we are able to be forgiven, what matters is whether we do everything we can to try to fix ourselves.
>>76004101
No kidding. There were Roman soldiers in Israel during that time period. I would never have known that just by reading the bible.
>>76004873
Then why are we Baptized in the name of the father, son, and Holy Spirit
>>76004185
Why would you assume that Peter the fisherman understood Paul the scholar?
Maybe this will help:
2 Peter 3
Therefore, beloved, looking forward to these things, be diligent to be found by Him in peace, without spot and blameless; and consider that the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation—as also our beloved brother Paul, according to the wisdom given to him, has written to you, 16 as also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things, in which are some things hard to understand, which untaught and unstable people twist to their own destruction, as they do also the rest of the Scriptures.
Hey look! He's talking about you!
>>76004830
I don't think Satan loves Jesus Christ.
*tips fedora*
>>76004873
>Christianism means recognizing that Jesus was chosen by God (Christ: greek for "annointed" or chosen).
No, sorry that is not true. Christianity involved Jesus being the Son of God, that is, he fills the role of the Son. Jesus is not simply annointed by God, he *is* God.
>>76004924
Because the Holy Spirit is like a spectator with Admin powers on counter-strike.
The Son is the Chosen One for God to act through in a mortal State to enjoy the game.
While God all things at once at all time forever and all ways and all else.
>its viewed this way because people don't realize one can appear as multiple.
Like someone controlling 2 drones all the dumb fucks will just think they are robots while semi intelligent will wonder where the other person is while the intelligent go "Holy shit thats fucking amazing"
>>76002171
It does.
Daniel 12:2 And many of those who sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, Some to everlasting life, Some to shame and everlasting contempt.
Eternal bodies provided to eternal souls to live out eternity.
>>76005082
Because they are the foundation of the faith.
That does not make them some triple-headed monster.
It would run against many different bible texts both before and after Jesus:
"Your God Jehovah is one God"
"The father is greater than me"
"The son does nothing out of himself but only what he sees the father doing"
"No one can see God and live" thus all would have died that saw Jesus
Furthermore all lives comes from God, if God had died on the cross, all life would have ended.
>>76005356
see above texts and:
https://www.jw.org/en/bible-teachings/questions/trinity/
https://www.jw.org/en/publications/magazines/wp20091101/myth-god-is-a-trinity/
>>76004265
>Greater love has no man but this, that he lay down his life for a friend.
It's a good thing to save your fellow man. this would still be the case if you where not to die during your attempt to save them.
>>76002927
Yes, that was the story. Mine was unlike Saul's, but we both met the same person.
>>76003044
Jesus' new commandments were also in the Old Covenant, so no. Love God and Love Neighbor are as old as God.
>>76004966
I fully believe in this candidate, I'm just not motivated to go to any of their rallies, vote for them, or support their policies openly.
>>76004840
He joined the army when he was 22 though. And of course the Talmud would have polemic against Christ: the Talmud is a recording of things said by Rabbis, most of whom probably hated Christianity and Jesus. The passage in the Talmud regarding Jesus and Pantera only says that "Rabbi X taught that..." - it doesn't have much historical reliability. The only thing this evidences is that Jesus existed.
>>76005547
John 1:1 (ESV)
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
>and the Word was God
>>76004449
Why are you calling yourself WHITE anglo saxon ?
Does black or yellow anglo saxons exist ?
>>76004937
Power's not really useful when you're on fire and the flames won't go out.
>>76005703
either way its not the point.
>The point is Magick is confirmed.
>>76005784
He was a miracle worker, yes.
>>76005752
The Betrayer is kept frozen in Ice.
>>76005082
Acts 8:37 kills the JW. They removed it from their bible:
Then Philip said, “If you believe with all your heart, you may.”
And he answered and said, “I believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God.”
>>76005290
I don't think you do either.
>>76005699
>I don't go to confession because I believe I'm perfect
Also He spoke this parable to some who trusted in themselves that they were righteous, and despised others: “Two men went up to the temple to pray, one a Pharisee and the other a tax collector. The Pharisee stood and prayed thus with himself, ‘God, I thank You that I am not like other men—extortioners, unjust, adulterers, or even as this tax collector. I fast twice a week; I give tithes of all that I possess.’ And the tax collector, standing afar off, would not so much as raise his eyes to heaven, but beat his breast, saying, ‘God, be merciful to me a sinner!’ I tell you, this man went down to his house justified rather than the other; for everyone who exalts himself will be humbled, and he who humbles himself will be exalted.”
>>76005184
Galatians 2:11-14
>11 When Cephas came to Antioch, I opposed him to his face, because he stood condemned. 12 For before certain men came from James, he used to eat with the Gentiles. But when they arrived, he began to draw back and separate himself from the Gentiles because he was afraid of those who belonged to the circumcision group. 13 The other Jews joined him in his hypocrisy, so that by their hypocrisy even Barnabas was led astray.
>14 When I saw that they were not acting in line with the truth of the gospel, I said to Cephas in front of them all, “You are a Jew, yet you live like a Gentile and not like a Jew. How is it, then, that you force Gentiles to follow Jewish customs?
1 Corinthians 5:11
>But now I am writing to you that you must not associate with anyone who claims to be a brother or sister but is sexually immoral or greedy, an idolater or slanderer, a drunkard or swindler. Do not even eat with such people.
>>76005356
The Jehovah's Witnesses think Michael the Archangel is Jesus.
>>76005718
This is the only verse in the whole bible that might suggest that God and Jesus are one person, yet it does not even mention the holy spirit as a person.
Upon closer analysis even that falls appart:
In the greek original the text reads along the lines of "and the word was with the God and the word was godly (or of divine nature)"
The second mention of god has no article, making it more general, akin to "godly nature".
Just as if I say you and I are man, does not mean that we are the same man, it simply means that we are both members of mankind
>>76005547
Daily Reminder JW are godless cult members who cannot figure out that the Hebrew alphabet has no "J".
>>76005588
Much more awesome when you die for everyone and then walk out of your tomb three days later.
The risen Jesus Christ talked to people, hugged people, ate food, drank wine, and had a body. A better body, to be sure, but a body.
>>76006021
Pharisees = Catholics
>>76005952
the way I see it is not that its a triune god or what the term is but that its just aspects of the one.
I see it as a blessing in itself but the main thing is the trust and the knowing the indeed Jesus did walk upon the earth and his actions are confirmed by the Hebrews themselves.
>>76006018
Wrong. I'm just not sycophantic. I like asking tough questions.
>>76006355
They don't get circumcized either.
>there are unironical JW in this thread trying to defend their heresy
>>76006052
Yes, Paul openly chastised Peter for acting one way with the Gentiles, and acting kosher with the Judaizing "christians" from Jerusalem.
Paul > Peter all day, every day.
>>76006355
Catholics are arguably the most self-deprecating people on Earth. If you aren't feeling debilitating shame every waking second of your life I'd hesitate to call you a real catholic.
>>76006129
Your cult inserts an "a" into that verse. "...and the Word was a god".
Go ahead and deny it.
>>76006355
but anon, protestants are the ones that have less OT books "because pharisees don't use them"
>>76006376
Yes, the manifestations of God as Father, Son and Spirit are aspects of the One God, as the four faces of Jesus portrayed in the gospels are of one Jesus: Lion and King; Ox and Servant; Man and Son of Man; and Eagle and Son of God.
God has more dimensions than we do.
>>76006064
This is not 100% sure but is most likely
>>76006170
True, it has no vocals at all. Thats why it is not 100% clear that it is pronounced Jehovah, just as it is clear that "Jesus" was not what he was called back ten. Nonetheless both Jesus and Jehova are the pronounciation of the names most people used througought the centuries.
(Jesus was probably called Jeshua or Jehoshua by his disciples)
>>76005952
citation from the appendix of the New World Translation of the Bible:
ased on those master texts, it is evident that some verses of the Christian Greek Scriptures found in older translations, such as the King James Version, were actually additions made by later copyists and were never part of the inspired Scriptures. However, because the verse division generally accepted in Bible translations was already established in the 16th century, the omission of these verses now creates gaps in the verse numbering in most Bibles. The verses are Matthew 17:21; 18:11; 23:14; Mark 7:16; 9:44, 46; 11:26; 15:28; Luke 17:36; 23:17; John 5:4; Acts 8:37; 15:34; 24:7; 28:29; and Romans 16:24. In this revised edition, those omitted verses are indicated by a footnote at the location of the omission.
>>76006542
yeah, that was to emphasise the lack of specific article (the vs. a)
God creates out of nothing. Wonderful you say. Yes, to be sure, but he does what is still more wonderful: He makes saints out of sinners. -Kierkegaard
>>76004924
A Christian man follows the spirit of truth and life, this is the path to the Father.
>>76005736
It's what we are. White Anglo Saxon Protestant.
WASP.
>>76006761
the full link to the appendix:
http://wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/1001061203
>>76006421
I'm not wrong, and you do not understand Christian liberty, or what Jesus was teaching.
Ask all the tough questions you want, but expect tougher answers.
As I stated above, Jesus did not preach the Sermon on the Mount as a primer for Christian living. He taught it to show people lacking in their obedience to Him that they had not only failed in keeping the Law perfectly, but that there was even more to being like God that they failed at.
>>76006535
Catholics are arguably the most bloodthirsty genocidal monsters in human history.
>>76006557
They don't belong. They're not there because they don't belong there.
>>76006129
>This is the only verse in the whole bible that might suggest that God and Jesus are one person
John 8:58: "Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I am."
You're mentally deficient, go troll somewhere else.
Jesus taught all big churches are wrong.
>He pretty much taught Hippie Doctrine.
>>76006761
>(Jesus was probably called Jeshua or Jehoshua by his disciples)
Again, Yeshua or Yehoshua, as Hebrew has no "J".
So God's name is not "J"-something. There is no J.
The 144,000 are not Jehovah's Witnesses.
Michael the angel Jesus made is not Jesus.
Get out of your windowless cult at your first opportunity.
>>76006445
>Then after three years I went up to Jerusalem to visit Cephas and remained with him fifteen days. But I saw none of the other apostles except James the Lord's brother. (In what I am writing to you, before God, I do not lie!) Then I went into the regions of Syria and Cilicia. ...Then after fourteen years I went up again to Jerusalem with Barnabas, taking Titus along with me. ...Yet because of false brothers secretly brought in—who slipped in to spy out our freedom that we have in Christ Jesus, so that they might bring us into slavery—to them we did not yield in submission even for a moment, so that the truth of the gospel might be preserved for you. And from those who seemed to be influential (what they were makes no difference to me; God shows no partiality)—those, I say, who seemed influential added nothing to me. On the contrary, when they saw that I had been entrusted with the gospel to the uncircumcised, just as Peter had been entrusted with the gospel to the circumcised (for he who worked through Peter for his apostolic ministry to the circumcised worked also through me for mine to the Gentiles), and when James and Cephas and John, who seemed to be pillars, perceived the grace that was given to me, they gave the right hand of fellowship to Barnabas and me, that we should go to the Gentiles and they to the circumcised. Only, they asked us to remember the poor, the very thing I was eager to do. (Galatians 1:18-2:10)
>12. The disciples said to Jesus, "We know that you are going to leave us. Who will be our leader?"
>Jesus said to them, "No matter where you are you are to go to James the Just, for whose sake heaven and earth came into being." (The Gospel of Thomas)
>>76006761
>yeah, that was to emphasise the lack of specific article (the vs. a)
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
vs
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was a god.
Absolute heresy and blasphemy.
>>76007066
>They're not there because they don't belong there.
and you think that because Pharisees claim that to be the case.
>>76007017
You're reading some bizarre history books, Protestants are responsible for more bloodshed and atrocities in their short existence than the Catholic Church in its entire history.
Why does God demand worship? It's almost like he is insecure about his greatness.
>>76007274
Those three years Paul spent in Arabia, likely on the Mountain of Moses, talking to Jesus face to face.
Which is why Paul knows more about Jesus than the other apostles combined; why Paul wrote more than the other apostles combined; and why Paul knew more about the New Covenant than all the other apostles combined.
The gospel of Thomas is heretical gnostic garbage.
>>76007088
This is evidence for Jesus and Michael being the same person.
He existed previously in the heaven, confirming also John 1:1 that he was of divine nature, or spiritual.
>>76007202
Yes that letter completely changes everything...
Also some languages call him Ieohoua, Im certain they mean a completely different God...
144000 are merely the ones that go to heaven to form part of the messianic kingdom that will rule of the earth.
The rest of the loyal humans will enjoy endless, perfect, peaceful live here on earth.
>>76007319
again: "of divine nature"
lrn2greek pls.
>>76007416
No, because I read them.
In Malachi, God says He's done. Through. He had already broken His staff and His rod, already rejected all of their sacrifices, and went radio silent for 400 years.
There is nothing between that time and the birth of Jesus that was written that matters. Nor do you consider that NONE of the books in the bible make any reference to these other works.
>>76006934
I wouldn't be asking tough questions if I didn't want tough answers. I don't want my faith in God to be weak, so I ask the questions I struggle with the most so I can be better informed. In fact, I've learned useful things from you in this thread. You are wrong, I do love Jesus Christ - whether or not I understand his teachings as well as you speaks nothing to that fact. However, based only on me asking questions, I don't see how you could accurately asses my understanding of scripture. I could be asking questions I know the answers to to test the knowledge of others or to help inform those just lurking. Indeed, I could be a priest for all you know. Try to be less presumptive, anon.
>>76007435
Jesuit kool-aid tasty?
>>76007516
The natural inclination of a man in boiling oil is to scream until he's dead.
The natural inclination of a man before God is to worship God.
>>76006263
Agreed.
"God does not love some ideal person, but rather human beings just as we are, not some ideal world, but rather the real world." -Dietrich Bonhoeffer
>>76007694
>I am right and literally all Churches (so, not only the Catholic Church) with apostolic succession are wrong
>this is what protties actually believe
the arrogance knows no bounds
>>76007606
There is no evidence for Michael being Jesus except for the verses your cult changed in the bible to call Michael Jesus.
Yes, that letter, J, means that the entire premise of your cult, that God must be called by His proper name, JJJJJJJehovah, is false.
Only God has a divine nature.
Who here is a determinist?
If you're a determinist, tell me how there can be any meaningful judgment of someone who never had anything to do with what their bodies were involved in.
>>76007606
>This is evidence for Jesus and Michael being the same person.
There is evidence that your momma sucks off donkeys for cash. (Just kidding. Or am I? As Mohammed, pbuh, said, "Verily, OP is a faggot who talks shit on the Internet".)
>>76007707
Your faith in God is whatever measure of faith God gave you. You cannot make it stronger or weaker by your knowledge. You were given a certain measure and expected to use it wisely.
Lost people cannot understand the things of God. So when you do not understand the things of God, you're waving a huge red flag that says "LOST" on it. Don't blame me for calling you lost when you're lost; I'm more than happy to have you get saved and find Jesus.
The capacity you lack is the ability to discern from the Holy Spirit whether someone you are dealing with is saved or not. That only comes from Him. I don't presume anything. I just read and remember.
>>76007960
https://www.jw.org/en/publications/books/bible-teach/who-is-michael-the-archangel-jesus/
"At times, individuals are known by more than one name. For example, the patriarch Jacob is also known as Israel, and the apostle Peter, as Simon. (Genesis 49:1, 2; Matthew 10:2) Likewise, the Bible indicates that Michael is another name for Jesus Christ, before and after his life on earth. Let us consider Scriptural reasons for drawing that conclusion.
Archangel. God’s Word refers to Michael “the archangel.” (Jude 9) This term means “chief angel.” Notice that Michael is called the archangel. This suggests that there is only one such angel. In fact, the term “archangel” occurs in the Bible only in the singular, never in the plural. Moreover, Jesus is linked with the office of archangel. Regarding the resurrected Lord Jesus Christ, 1 Thessalonians 4:16 states: “The Lord himself will descend from heaven with a commanding call, with an archangel’s voice.” Thus the voice of Jesus is described as being that of an archangel. This scripture therefore suggests that Jesus himself is the archangel Michael."
feel free to look up the quoted texts in your own bible and see if they are changed significantly.
>Yes, that letter, J, means that the entire premise of your cult, that God must be called by His proper name, JJJJJJJehovah, is false
I am not sure if Im being rused here...
The bible was transmitted to us in Hebrew, Aramaic and Greek.
If God had cared that each and every single letter be preserved and pronounced in exactly one way, he would have said so.
Maybe you are mistaking this faith for the muslim one who think that only arabic is the language used by God.
>>76008071
see above
>>76007088
SO basically Jesus existed before his father and his mother were born.
>>76007892
God does not love sin, and humans as they are are sinful. He loves us *despite* our failures. We are special amongst His creations in our moral culpability. So no, God does not simply love us "as we are" - God loves us but hates what we often choose to do. There is an ideal and God does love it.
>>76002887
>and has no higher story to it.
Hmm you might have a point there. I didn't consider that it does have qualities unlike the other parables. But no matter, as this post points out >>76005501 it's clearly in Scripture. That's a verse I totally forgot.
>>76007606
John 1:2-3 - He (the Word) was in the beginning with God and all things were made through Him (the Word who was God).
John 1:14 - the Word (who is God) became flesh (Jesus) and dwelled among us, full of grace and truth.
John 1:18 - the Greek word for "only-begotten" is "monogenes" which means unique, only member of a kind. It does not mean created.
John 1:51 - the angels of God - Matt. 13:41 - Son of Man's angels; 2 Thess. 1:7 - Jesus will be revealed from heaven with His angels.
John 3:5 - Jesus says without baptism one cannot enter into the Kingdom of God - Col. 1:13 - Paul says this is Jesus' Kingdom.
John 6:68-69 - Peter confesses that Jesus is the Son of God who has the words of eternal life.
Acts 2:36 - God has made Jesus both Lord and Christ - Acts 4:24 - Sovereign Lord who made heaven and earth. This means Jesus is God.
Acts 3:15 - Peter said the men of Israel "killed the Author of Life." This can only be God - Acts 14:15 - who made all things.
Acts 20:28 - to care for the Church of God which He obtained with His own blood. This means God shed His blood. When? When He died on the cross. This means Jesus is God.
>>76008417
>Thus the voice of Jesus is described as being that of an archangel. This scripture therefore suggests that Jesus himself is the archangel Michael."
Sheeet, you've convinced me now!
"Cheap grace is the preaching of forgiveness without requiring repentance, baptism without church discipline, Communion without confession, absolution without personal confession. Cheap grace is grace without discipleship, grace without the cross, grace without Jesus Christ." - Dietrich Bonhoeffer
>>76008551
Rom. 1:1 - Paul is an apostle of the Gospel of God - Rom. 15:19 - Paul preached the Gospel of Christ.
Rom. 7:22 - Paul says he delights in the law of God - Gal. 6:2 - Paul says fulfill the law of Christ.
Rom. 8:9 - Paul refers to both the Spirit of God and the Spirit of Christ.
Rom. 9:5 - Jesus Christ is God over all, blessed forever.
Rom. 11:36 - God for from Him through Him and to Him are all things - Heb. 2:10 - Jesus for whom and by whom are all things.
1 Cor. 15:9 - Paul says he persecuted the Church of God - Matt. 16:18; Rom. 16:16 - it is the Church of Jesus Christ.
1 Cor. 15:28 - God may be all in all - Colossians 3:11 - Christ is all and in all.
Gal. 1:5 - God the Father to whom be the glory forever - 2 Peter 3:18 - to Jesus Christ be the glory both now and forever.
Phil. 2:6-7 - Jesus was in the form of God, but instead of asserting His equality with God, emptied Himself for us.
Col. 1:15 - Jesus is the image of the invisible God, the "firstborn" of all creation. The Greek word for "first-born" is "prototokos" which means eternal preexistence (it never means created).
Col. 1:26 - God's saints - 1 Thess. 3:13 - at the coming of Jesus Christ with all His saints.
Col. 2:9 - in Jesus Christ the whole fullness of deity dwells bodily. He is the whole and entire fullness of the indivisible God in the flesh.
Titus 1:1 - Paul says he is a servant of God - Rom. 1:1 - Paul says he is a servant of Jesus Christ.
Titus 1:3-4 - God our Savior = Christ our Savior = Jesus Christ is God.
>>76008597
Titus 2:11 - the grace of God that has appeared to save all men - Acts 15:11 - through the grace of Jesus we have salvation.
Titus 2:13 - we await our blessed hope, the appearing of the glory of our great God and Savior Jesus Christ.
Titus 3:4 - 3:6 - great God and Savior Jesus Christ = God our Savior = Jesus Christ our Savior = Jesus is God.
Heb. 1:6 - when God brings His first-born into the world, let all the angels of God worship Him. Only God is worshiped.
Heb. 1:8 - God calls the Son "God." But of the Son He says, "Thy Throne Oh God is forever and ever."
Heb. 1:9 - God calls the Son "God." "Therefore, God, Thy God has anointed Thee."
Heb. 1:10 - God calls the Son "Lord." "And thou, Lord, didst found the earth in the beginning and the heavens are your work."
Heb. 13:12 - Paul says Jesus sanctifies the people with His blood - 1 Thess. 5:23 - the God of peace sanctifies the people.
2 Peter 1:1 - to those who have obtained a faith of equal standing in the righteousness of our God and Savior Jesus Christ.
1 John 5:20 - "that we may know Him who is true, in His Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God and eternal life."
Jude 4 - Jude calls Jesus Christ our only Master and Lord. Our only Master and Lord is God Himself.
Rev. 2:8 - the angel of the church in Smyrna wrote, "The words of the First and the Last, who died and came to life." See Isa. 44:6.
Rev. 22:6 - the Lord God sends angels - Rev. 22:16 - Jesus sends angels.
>>76007896
I never got the equation "Believing God = Arrogant".
>>76008019
>Who here is a deist like me who doesn't want to take responsibility for himself?
>>76007520
Where are you getting that from? I'm genuinely curious, because I've never heard that before.
>>76008417
Matt. 4:7; Luke 4:12 - Jesus tells satan, "you shall not tempt the Lord your God" in reference to Himself.
Matt. 5:21-22; 27-28; 31-32; 33-34; 38-39; 43-44 - Jesus makes Himself equal to God when He declares, "You heard it said...but I say to you.."
Matt. 7:21-22; Luke 6:46 - not everyone who says to Jesus, "Lord, Lord." Jesus calls Himself Lord, which is God.
Matt. 9:2; Mark 2:5; Luke 5:20; 7:48 - Jesus forgives sins. Only God can forgive sins.
Matt. 12:8; Mark 2:28; Luke 6:5 - Jesus says that He is "Lord of the Sabbath." He is the Lord of God's law which means He is God.
Matt. 18:20 - Jesus says where two or three are gathered in His name, there He is in the midst of them.
Matt. 21:3; Luke 19:31,34 - Jesus calls himself "Lord." "The Lord has need of them."
Matt. 26:64; Mark 14:62; Luke 22:70 - Jesus acknowledges that He is the Son of God.
Matt. 28:20 - Jesus said He is with us always, even unto the end of the world. Only God is omnipresent.
Mark 14:36 - Jesus calls God "Abba," Aramaic for daddy, which was an absolutely unprecedented address to God and demonstrates Jesus' unique intimacy with the Father.
Luke 8:39 - Luke reports that Jesus said "tell how much God has done for you." And the man declared how much Jesus did.
Luke 17:18 - Jesus asks why the other nine lepers did not come back to give praise to Him, God, except the Samaritan leper.
Luke 19:38,40 - Blessed is He who comes in the name of the Lord. If these were silent, the very stones would cry out.
John 5:18 - Jesus claimed to be God. The Jews knew this because Jesus called God His Father and made Himself equal to God. This is why Jesus was crucified.
John 5:21-22 - Jesus gives life and says that all judgment has been given to Him by the Father.
John 5:23 - Jesus equates Himself with the Father, "whoever does not honor the Son does not honor the Father who sent Him."
trump jonah and the whale. the reluctant messenger towards nineveh which is cuneform for house of the fish.. jeshua being the fisher of men. and trump saying don't go into iraq..(nineveh is ancient iraq) An allegorical recipy of god giving nations whom he wishes to do a certain thing.. second chances..
This is why trump is going to win.. it simply is ordained plain and simple.. You doubt it.. extraordinary :) come and see..
>>76008716
John 6:38 - Jesus says, "For I have come down from heaven."
John 8:12 - Jesus says "I am the light of the world." - 1 John 1:5 - God is light and in him there is no darkness at all.
John 8:19 - Jesus says, "if you knew me, you would know my Father also."
John 8:23 - Jesus says that He is not of this world. Only God is not of this world.
John 8:58 - Jesus says, "Before Abraham was, I AM." Exodus 3:14 - "I AM" means "Yahweh," which means God.
John 10:18 - Jesus says He has the power to lay down His life and take it up again - Gal. 1:1 - God raised Jesus to life.
John 10:30 - Jesus says, "I and the Father are one." They are equal. The Jews even claimed Jesus made Himself equal to God. Jesus' statement in John 14:28, "the Father is greater than I," cannot contradict John 10:30 (the Word of God is never in conflict). Jesus' statement in John 14:28 simply refers to His human messianic role as servant and slave, which He, and not the Father or the Holy Spirit, undertook in the flesh.
So any hope for the catholic church or will the next pope be even bigger cuck?
>>76008751
John 10:36 - again, Jesus claims that He is "the Son of God."
John 10:38; 14:10 - "the Father is in me and I am in the Father" means the Father and Son are equal.
John 12:45 - Jesus says, "He who sees Me sees Him who sent Me." God the Father is equal to God the Son.
John 13:13 - Jesus says, "You call me Teacher and Lord and you are right for so I AM."
John 14:6 - Jesus says "I am the way, and the truth and the life." Only God is the way, the truth and the life.
John 16:15 - Jesus says, "all things that the Father has are Mine." Jesus has everything God has which makes Him God.
John 16:28 - Jesus says that "He came from the Father and has come into the world."
John 17:5,24 - Jesus' desire is for us to behold His glory which He had before the foundation of the world.
John 20:17 - Jesus distinguishes His relationship to the Father from our relationship by saying "My Father and your Father."
Rev. 1:8 - God says He is the "Alpha and the Omega." In Rev. 22:13, Jesus also says He is the "Alpha and Omega, the First and the Last, the beginning and the end." The only possible conclusion one can reach is that Jesus is equal to the Lord God.
Rev. 1:17 - Jesus says again, "I am the First and the Last." This is in reference to the God prophesied by Isaiah in Isaiah 44:6, 41:4, 48:12.
Rev. 1:18 - Jesus, the First and the Last, also says "I died, and behold, I am alive for evermore." When did God ever die? He only did in the humanity of Jesus Christ our Lord and God.
Rev. 2:8 - Jesus again says, "The words of the First and the Last, who died and came to life." When did God die and come to life? In our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ.
>>76008417
This isn't a name change dude.
It's God vs. angel.
>>76008036
God Bless.
>>76008784
>John 10:38; 14:10 - "the Father is in me and I am in the Father"
>>76008591
No one is beholden to tell you about their sin if their sin is not against you. The only one your sin concerns is yourself and God unless your evils are against others - such as theft or murder.
Keep posting cheap quotes.
>>76008534
There's a counterpart in John 5 as well:
Do not marvel at this; for the hour is coming in which all who are in the graves will hear His voice 29 and come forth—those who have done good, to the resurrection of life, and those who have done evil, to the resurrection of condemnation.
>>76008645
that's because I never said that and you are making a strawman. The Pharisees took those books out of their Tanahk because they were further proof Jesus was the Messiah and God was tired of their shit and had given up on them. You are pharisees basically.
Your uneducated interpretation of Scripture is worth nothing
>>76008757
Francis is the last trump card for modernists. Baby boomers are dying and middle-aged lukewarm Catholics are simply not showing up. The youth is orthodox as fuck and the next pope will be a traditional one
galatians 3 one of my favourites.. (faith or works of the law.. and as it turns out.. a 3rd option) :D
"3 Are ye so foolish? having begun in the Spirit, are ye now made perfect by the flesh?"
"13 Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us: for it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree:
14 That the blessing of Abraham might come on the Gentiles through Jesus Christ; that we might receive the promise of the Spirit through faith.
15 Brethren, I speak after the manner of men; Though it be but a man's covenant, yet if it be confirmed, no man disannulleth, or addeth thereto.
16 Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ.
17 And this I say, that the covenant, that was confirmed before of God in Christ, the law, which was four hundred and thirty years after, cannot disannul, that it should make the promise of none effect.
18 For if the inheritance be of the law, it is no more of promise: but God gave it to Abraham by promise." so what was the purpose of the law..?
"19 Wherefore then serveth the law? It was added because of transgressions, till the seed should come to whom the promise was made; and it was ordained by angels in the hand of a mediator.
20 Now a mediator is not a mediator of one, but God is one.
21 Is the law then against the promises of God? God forbid: for if there had been a law given which could have given life, verily righteousness should have been by the law.
22 But the scripture hath concluded all under sin, that the promise by faith of Jesus Christ might be given to them that believe.
23 But before faith came, we were kept under the law, shut up unto the faith which should afterwards be revealed.
cont)
>>76004677
Anglo Saxons are a white Protestant race.
>>76007896
>my church is right and literally all other "churches" are wrong
>this is what cucklics actually believe
B r i l l i a n t .
>>76008456
his adoptive parents, yes.
Just as today it is possible to transfer a fertilized egg from a petri dish into a womb.
>>76008716
the volume of your quotations does nothing.
Saying Jesus is very similar to God (because they worked together for billions of years at least) is different to saying Jesus = God.
Saying the latter opens up a whole can of worms consisting of contradictions that require the scripture to be either inconsistent or copious ammounts of "divine mystery"
>>76008714
From those verses, the three years in Arabia, and the foundering missionary work turning into brilliant missionary work.
Galatians 1:12 For I neither received it from man, nor was I taught it, but it came through the revelation of Jesus Christ.
As was stated above, the so-called "pillars of the faith", Peter James and John, added nothing to Paul's faith.
>>76008757
The Whore of Babylon never had a chance.
>>76009202
two more articles that explains it better:
https://www.jw.org/en/bible-teachings/questions/is-gods-name-jesus/
https://www.jw.org/en/publications/magazines/wp20090401/is-jesus-god/
>>76009095
23 But before faith came, we were kept under the law, shut up unto the faith which should afterwards be revealed.
24 Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith.
25 But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster.
26 For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus."
>>76009064
No, those books were never in the tanakh, which is the entire point.
>>76009202
Jesus is God.
>>76005736
No, Anglo Saxons are the superior sub species of White people.
"And this is one of the most crucial definitions for the whole of Christianity; that the opposite of sin is not virtue but faith." -Kierkegaard
>>76008551
>>76008597
>>76008620
>>76008716
>>76008751
>>76008784
John 14:28 - "You heard me say, 'I am going away and I am coming back to you.' If you loved me, you would be glad that I am going to the Father, for the Father is greater than I.
>>76009202
>the volume of your quotations does nothing.
lmao, ok, don't believe Scripture then.
>>76009176
>all other "churches" are wrong
except none of the Churches with apostolic succession took books out of the Bible. Protestants don't have "Churches", they have "churches", as they have no apostolic succession and are heretics, as it is show by their poor choices for the Canon.
>>76009409
>No, those books were never in the tanakh, which is the entire point.
t.daniel bergstein
>>76009476
I feel like I am talking to a wall, seriously.
"Many Greek scholars and Bible translators acknowledge that John 1:1 highlights, not the identity, but a quality of “the Word.” Says Bible translator William Barclay: “Because [the apostle John] has no definite article in front of theos it becomes a description . . . John is not here identifying the Word with God. To put it very simply, he does not say that Jesus was God.” Scholar Jason David BeDuhn likewise says: “In Greek, if you leave off the article from theos in a sentence like the one in John 1:1c, then your readers will assume you mean ‘a god.’ . . . Its absence makes theos quite different than the definite ho theos, as different as ‘a god’ is from ‘God’ in English.” BeDuhn adds: “In John 1:1, the Word is not the one-and-only God, but is a god, or divine being.” Or to put it in the words of Joseph Henry Thayer, a scholar who worked on the American Standard Version: “The Logos [or, Word] was divine, not the divine Being himself.”"
and of course this text: >>76009531
>>76009616
you are using volume as if it proves anything. You first have to understand those scriptures correctly and in context.
You can fire your arrows from the top of babylon but you can never strike god!
x-men apocalypse satan the fallen guardian/annointed cherub..
http://putlocker.is/watch-x-men-apocalypse-online-free-putlocker.html 1h6m
>>76009732
Jesus?
He's God.
>>76009616
And you know all the books that were in the Bible before were legitimate in being there because...?
I'll never capitalize the "church" in "the cucklic church" because it doesn't warrant even that piddling of respect in word. Illogical absurdity and dogmatism will get no respect.
>>76008387
>Your faith in God is whatever measure of faith God gave you. You cannot make it stronger or weaker by your knowledge.
>So when you do not understand the things of God, you're waving a huge red flag that says "LOST" on it.
Don't blame me for pointing out that contradiction. If I'm given a static level of faith and knowledge doesn't help my faith, then how would you have me get saved and find Jesus? Also, if my knowledge doesn't help my faith, then how does my lack of knowledge hurt my faith again?
>Lost people cannot understand the things of God.
Unless you're saying that you know I don't have faith in Christ because I don't understand the things of Christ. I which case I would ask why you would fault me for God having given me less inherent faith in Him than in you. That also assumes that you understand the things of God, but how do you know you understand them? What metric do you use to verify your proper understanding so you can confirm you are not misled?
>The capacity you lack is the ability to discern from the Holy Spirit whether someone you are dealing with is saved or not.
We haven't even met. I could be a literal fucking shitposting bot, bro.
This is why I ask the kinds of questions I ask. I ask the same questions often and get many different responses. Those responses show me whether I am dealing with someone with an open mind or someone who is blinded by their own assumptions. Guess where you fall.
"When Christ calls a man, he bids him come and die." - Dietrich Bonhoeffer
>>76009853
>praecetom
so it's you, lmao
>And you know all the books that were in the Bible before were legitimate in being there because...?
Because of Apostolic Succession, Sacred Tradition, history.
You, on the other had, believe they were are not legitimate for being there because Pharisees say so
> Illogical absurdity and dogmatism will get no respect
bla bla bla. Your drivel comes right out of the mouth of "the accuser"
>>76009831
he's son of god.. he and the father are one through the holy spirit, the declaration of the trnnity.. the earth is going to be invaded by 10.000 holy ones that will destroy a beast empire and then yeshua will judge the remnant nations.. The trinity is the order of life in the universe.. Satan was a commander of them in this region.. Not his name ofcourse it's a nickname as are many to delineate who worshipped him.. like he is called wicked phrarao of egypt king of tyre (lebanon) cedar of lebanon.. etc. etc.
God gave us free will. That means, he can't be sure about anything if it comes to us. Well, he has never been. That is why he had to punish us everytime. Or even kill everyone with flooding all the planet. Free will is a complete chaos for any determined world.
So why he is so sure about The Apocalypse? Isn't this a cheap try to convince us to his side? Well, who knows...
>>7601016
all will be revealed..
>>76010078
And you know everyone was telling the truth about everything the whole time and there's no way you could possibly be lied to because....?
>>76010172
The apocalypse seems a pretty obvious conclusion to the choices we've been making for the last 3,000 years.
>>76010162
(cont) they would have you believe this is all in spirit.. no.. it is the living god and the meaning of the ressurection is for you to become flesh again.. Not to daddle about in spirit.. The holy spirit created the universe the lord of hosts (heavenly father) are the enforcers we are created in his image and his likeness but fell because of the cherub..)
Once you start to GET that.. all things will start to be revealed to you.
>>76009732
The word is the holy spirit of God.
>>75997845
Ph'nglui mglw'nafh Cthulhu R'lyeh wgah'nagl fhtagn
>>76010274
Because Jesus prevents the Magisterium from teaching error. A house united cannot stand, and there are as many divisions as protestants as there are individuals who believe protestantism. Stay mad :)
>And you know everyone was telling the truth about everything t
strawman. We don't believe Catholics always say the truth, only that Truth is preserved in the deposit of Faith. Therefore, the Pope might say something stupid and/or wrong out of his fallen mind, but when he speaks for the Magisterium and defines dogma Jesus prevents him from teaching error
>>76010172
You can have God's omniscience and free will. They're not incompatible at all.
>>76010551
*a house divided
>>76010551
And you know Christ prevents them from erring because...?
>>76010466
(cont) the bible follows the LIVING GOD.. for a reason.. but due to the cherub our access to the rest of space is denied untill the judgement..
satan was a sub regional commander his watchers were to oversee the seed of earth..
when you "get" this your eyes will be opened like never before.
>>76009319
Heretical. If you cannot comprehend the triune God you need to repent asap or you will burn. It's that simple. Less arguing and less posting links trying to convince others. There's been 2000 years of theology on this. Repent or be cast in the darkness outside.
>>76009954
I would have you use what you already had, and don't know how to use, obviously.
Your knowledge grasp is a fear driven mechanism; something is upsetting to you that may happen in the future, so you want to learn as much as you can about that thing in order to survive.
Faith is not what you think it is. It is not a religious thing at all. It's a human ability, like sight, sound, taste, touch and smell. It's the human ability, given to all humans and only to humans, to believe what you have not seen.
Everyone has this ability, and everyone uses it.
So with no further increase in knowledge whatsoever, you can believe that Jesus is God, because He is, and you can believe that He rose from the dead, because He did.
I'm not faulting you for anything. I'm trying to help you along the road you're on. I was on that road, and now I'm here. So I scoot you along the road you're on, looking for Jesus, until you open your heart and find Him.
I know you think you're very intelligent, but when you're talking about the Holy Spirit you may as well be stuttering IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF for two minutes straight.
>>76010001
Er, yes, that is true.
>>76010638
>le empirical evidence
are you a Christian or an atheist?
The Catholic Church was founded in Matthew 16:18, and there is plenty of scriptural proof about the primacy of Peter.
Jesus would never let his Church teach error, if you supposed he does, then Christianity is a lie. God is absolute Truth, he is not a matter of opinion. Deal with it.
>>76010162
Son of God = God.
Kind begets Kind.
God begets God.
"Present-day Christendom really lives as if the situation were as follows: Christ is the great hero and benefactor who has once and for all secured salvation for us; now we must merely be happy and delighted with the innocent goods of earthly life and leave the rest to Him. But Christ is essentially the exemplar, that is we are to resemble Him, not mere profit from Him." -Kierkegaard
>>76010172
He's sure about everything, and has been from before the creation of the world. Your free will does not include the option "surprise God".
>>76010887
I'm not asking for empirical evidence. I'm asking for a reason why you're trusting someone as opposed to someone else.
>>76010466
Listen yeshua is emmisary
Immanuel.. god of the sky with us.. literaly he was born of virgin but had no human father.. his father was of those from the sky whom he declared..
Replace heaven with sky.. and you have a much better understanding, these are representatives of the holy spirit in the flesh..
immanuel a title of jesus.. god of the sky with us.. anu (sky) el (god) i am with god.. immanuel..
>>76010551
>Because Jesus prevents the Magisterium from teaching error.
Mary was born sinless.
Mary was an eternal virgin.
Mary is co-mediatrix with Jesus.
Mary did not die.
Mary ascended into heaven.
Mary can hear your prayers.
Mary brings us miracles to confirm her divine nature.
Decided in 1854
Yeah, sure. No error.
>>76010552
Yes, they are incompatibile. Free will means - we can do everything by choosing it right here right now.
But God knows that choice from the beginning.
So it is determined anyway.
>>76010887
Matthew was written in Hebrew in the mid-first century.
Roman Catholicism began in 325 AD.
Looks like you just lied again.
>>76006842
>>76009501
>>76010937
>Kierkegaard
You - I like you. Thanks for posting these, Ameribro
>>76011018
(cont) the satan which is not a name aswell but a title or nickname meaning he who accuses god.. was a high annointed cherub.. adorned with medals and perfect in all his ways.. till a flaw was discovered in him.. (job destruction and debasement of primitive man) and many more of these things are to be found.. read and study the bible.. come and see :) The nations of the beast empire are mentioned too i could give them to you and say they are in the middle east and africa.. but.. i will leave it up to you to find them :)
>>76010937
Strongly disagree.
>>76011090
You can choose whatever you like at any given moment. God can know what you're going to pick - that doesn't change the fact that you can make that or any other choice.
>>76010887
1 Corinthians 11:19 - For there must be also heresies among you, that they which are approved may be made manifest among you.
>>76011235
The flaw was revealed before Adam was created; the #1 angel wanted to take God's throne. He staged a coup and lost it in a heartbeat. By the time the sin had crosses his heart, he was already exiled.
>>76010887
>Got BTFO by Paul
>James was shown to make decisions on behalf of the Apostles in Acts
>Was instructed by the other Apostles to do tasks for the church in Acts
"Primacy of Peter"
>>76011090
You're a bit confused. You're saying "because God knows a thing then that thing need not exist".
Your choice as a free agent is unknown to you until you make it.
>>76011377
>in context
Now in giving these instructions I do not praise you, since you come together not for the better but for the worse. For first of all, when you come together as a church, I hear that there are divisions among you, and in part I believe it. For there must also be factions among you, that those who are approved may be recognized among you.
Has nothing to do with heresies.
>>76011090
It is not determined, it is foreseen.
>>76011303
are you so sure about this? that god ordains your every move.. you have misunderstood my friend.. god sees through time. but your choices are your own, he just sees your future at once from a birds eye perspective..
Infact in the old times if someone said they recieved something from god and it did not come true exactly that person had to be destroyed because of trying to mislead people..
God = knowledge of events before they happen.. time is the ultimate weapon..When you control time you are lord.
>>76011000
I am not trusting someone. By trusting the Church God founded and to which he promised the gates of hell would not prevail, I am trusting Jesus.
There is a reason why the CC is the longest standing institution in the planet, why it is always attacked by the storm but God always lends His hand at the moment of most discouragement and saves it from drowning. There is a reason why the dogma is preserved whereas protestants cannot argue on anything. Or rather, they can only argue about hating the CC. Geez, I wonder how it is that the whole world, whether protestants, atheists, or other religions hate the Chuch, must have something to do with the enmity of the world or something...
>>76011083
>Mary brings us miracles to confirm her divine nature.
this is false, we don't believe this. She has no divine nature
The rest are all true
>co-mediatrix
simply means "with the mediator".
>Decided in 1854
Defined as dogma, not decided. We always believed that stuff
>b-but anon, I read the Bible in 2016 and I didn't into those depth of the faith
>so what the Church of Christ has believed since millennia cannot be true
lmao
>>76011219
>Roman Catholicism began in 325 AD.
lmao whatever makes you sleep at night
>>76011509
Acts 8:14
Now when the apostles who were at Jerusalem heard that Samaria had received the word of God, they sent Peter and John to them...
John 13:16 Most assuredly, I say to you, a servant is not greater than his master; nor is he who is sent greater than he who sent him.
>>76006129
>This is the only verse in the whole bible that might suggest that God and Jesus are one person
No. Jesus specifically tells jews that He is God.
John 8:44-59
Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.
And because I tell you the truth, ye believe me not.
Which of you convinceth me of sin? And if I say the truth, why do ye not believe me?
He that is of God heareth God's words: ye therefore hear them not, because ye are not of God.
Then answered the Jews, and said unto him, Say we not well that thou art a Samaritan, and hast a devil?
Jesus answered, I have not a devil; but I honour my Father, and ye do dishonour me.
And I seek not mine own glory: there is one that seeketh and judgeth.
Verily, verily, I say unto you, If a man keep my saying, he shall never see death.
Then said the Jews unto him, Now we know that thou hast a devil. Abraham is dead, and the prophets; and thou sayest, If a man keep my saying, he shall never taste of death.
Art thou greater than our father Abraham, which is dead? and the prophets are dead: whom makest thou thyself?
Jesus answered, If I honour myself, my honour is nothing: it is my Father that honoureth me; of whom ye say, that he is your God:
Yet ye have not known him; but I know him: and if I should say, I know him not, I shall be a liar like unto you: but I know him, and keep his saying.
Your father Abraham rejoiced to see my day: and he saw it, and was glad.
Then said the Jews unto him, Thou art not yet fifty years old, and hast thou seen Abraham?
>Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I am.
Then took they up stones to cast at him: but Jesus hid himself, and went out of the temple, going through the midst of them, and so passed by.
>>76011509
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6KV6PXSODgE
>>76011596
so when you do a certain thing god isn't necissarily ordaining it but the patterns coalesque to a result.. And he acts upon it.. and knows your consequence instantly. because he transcends time.
surprise God
>>76011621
>The rest are all true
They're all heresies and abominations, and nobody believed them until 1854.
>>76011621
*cannot agree on anything
*can only agree about
>>76006129
Deuteronomy 6:4 “Hear, O Israel: The Lord our God, the Lord is one!
>>76010844
>Your knowledge grasp is a fear driven mechanism; something is upsetting to you that may happen in the future, so you want to learn as much as you can about that thing in order to survive.
True in some cases, but not generally. Learning, for me, is like experiencing art. I know that no amount of knowledge I have will keep me safe because I cannot learn everything in time to prevent any random accident from occurring. I have no control. I place my faith in Jesus when I'm looking for safety and emotional support. For me, it feels vague; like I see the light at the end of the tunnel and hear it echoing loving guidance to me, but I still feel as though I'm being watched from an enclosure rather than having God right beside me.
>Faith is not what you think it is. It is not a religious thing at all. It's a human ability, like sight, sound, taste, touch and smell. It's the human ability, given to all humans and only to humans, to believe what you have not seen.
That is what I think of faith. The reason is because I've had faith in many things that have nothing to do with religion throughout my journey. Faith in scientists, faith in nationalism, faith in my pride, etc. Like I said, you assume too much.
>I know you think you're very intelligent, but when you're talking about the Holy Spirit you may as well be stuttering IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF for two minutes straight.
You caught me. I'm having a very hard time dropping my ego. How can I do so? Also, I truly appreciate your time and effort with me.
>>76011303
I can pick anything, but it is already determined by God's knowledge of that choice.
So not anything. Just that right thing.
Free will is a lie. Or God's omniscience. Pick which one. But remember - God already knows what you are going to pick anyway. So you already did that choice in God's mind...
Well, it's a paradox obviously.
>>76011767
>They're all heresies and abominations
wrong
>nobody believed them until 1854.
wrong. Just one example:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sub_tuum_praesidium
>>76011596
Yes I'm sure about this. The likelihood of you having done more work on free will than I is incredibly low. God does not ordain your every move - to imply He does would be to imply God ordains you to sin, in which case His judgment of you would be nonsensical.
God can know what choice you're going to make without forcing you into that "decision" (it wouldn't even be called a 'decision at that point, since there would be no choice to begin with).
>>76011419
Actually sin entered creation after God Adam. We know this by the simple verse where God said after he finished his creation that everything was good.
Everything being good meant Lucifer hadn't deviated yet.
Next scene we are being pained the deceiver being in the garden. So after God created Man and before He disobeyed, Satan sinned itself into being Satan
>>76011744
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5bVEXZ38Vs8
5:32-1:32:47
>>76011745
God knows the end from the beginning, yes. He can chase down an infinite number of fractal patterns instantly.
Gotta get a bigger God.
>>76005900
Isn't that just Dante's 9th circle?
You are the one in a causal universe of cause and effect.. you do things in a linear expression.. everything you do is linear..
God sees the whole line change according to your actions.. of a top down level of the whole line.. for a conceptual explanation.
>>76011621
You are trusting the people who speak to you in church and the books you read. You are trusting the history you're told by other people. You are trusting someone.
Unless you believe God poofed all your understanding of Him into your head, or else compiled the Bible and every other Christian work you trust Himself and just for you.
>>76011563
Matthew 24:24 - "For false Christs and false prophets will arise and will show great signs and wonders, so as to mislead, if possible, even the elect.
>>76011869
It is not determined just because God knows what you'll do. You can pick between lemon or lime icecream. God knows which you'll pick - that doesn't mean you don't have a choice.
Omniscience =/= determinism.
>>76011982
(cont) you are forced to be linear, why they in the past had kronos.. lord of time.. we are chronological time based choice based beings.. And god sees the entire line of all that we are immediately but we only see what is directly ahead or behind us..
>>76010650
To be heretical it has to be contrary to the bible in the first place, which it isnt, thats the problem here.
>>76010887
The whole "you are Peter and on this rock I will found my church" was actually a wordplay and did not establish Peter in any position of authority, which would have contradicted "Do not call anyone father for only one is father, the heavenly one".
The "joke" being that Peter means Rock, but in male form. the rock uppon which the church is founded however has a female form.
Jesus was this rock.
There are no scriptural evidence that Peter was above the other apostles, on the contrary, later Paul sharply rebuked him for his racism/religiosism when he stopped eating with the non-circumcised christians.
>>76011833
exactly.
>>76011834
You're quite welcome. I am enjoying our exchanges. You are wrestling with something that turned the most beautiful angel into the devil himself.
I would suggest knowing where these things come from, and what they are, and why you do them, and for what purpose.
Three types of sin: Lust of the eyes, lust of the flesh, pride of life.
Three sources of sin: The devil, the world system the devil is in charge of, and your own flesh.
Your deep seated needs: Love, Acceptance, Meaning, Purpose.
The reasons you sin: Not allowing God to completely satisfy your needs for Love, Acceptance, Meaning and Purpose.
I would love you to re-read Job, because I believe that Job's initial response to the calamities, and Job's ultimate response to God will help you see what's happening to you. Don't read it with any thought towards patience or suffering; read it for what it is.
>>76011869
Oh, no, you can pick the wrong thing all day long, and then suffer the consequences.
>>76011894
wiki > bible
Every catholic, all day, every day.
“The final aim and reason of all music is nothing other than the glorification of God and the refreshment of the spirit.” - Johann Sebastian Bach
>>76012232
And the bible aswell god is the one who controls time and sees through time.. and this is the vetting of his prophets that they see through time.. thus.. essentially god is the ruler of time where we are set on a seqential and linear even horizon and he sees all immediately and how it changes according to our actions.. you do something something.. it changes your outcome 50+ years later.. and god sees this immedately..
>>76011920
why should I trust the opinions of a man? The other video has scriptural evidence, much superior ;)
>>76012018
>You are trusting the people who speak to you in church and the books you read. You are trusting the history you're told by other people. You are trusting someone.
It's called having Faith. I know it is a hard concept for protestants who basically adapt the Word of God to their own feelings, instead of adapting themselves to the Word of God as he intended it to be lived through His Church.
>Unless you believe God poofed all your understanding of Him into your head, or else compiled the Bible and every other Christian work you trust Himself and just for you.
Are you an atheist or what? You reason like them. God didn't proof my understanding in my head, that is what protestants believe, since they think they can read the Bible and understand it fully just by themselves. I can be wrong about the interpretation of something, but the deposit of Faith of the Catholic Church cannot. The Holy Spirit does not protect me from teaching error, only the Magisterium.
>himself
the Bible was written by men who were inspired by the Holy Spirit. The Magisterium is the continuation of that inspiration.
>just for you
Not just for me. To all those who accept Truth and recognize where it is to be found, i.e., in the Church
>>76011908
Satan's sin was committed in the third heaven; Adam's sin was committed on earth. Adam's sin included all of the creation, but not the third heaven.
It's difficult to compare and contrast two timelines when one doesn't act like the other.
What kind of sexuality is forbidden for christians?
It seems strange to me that we are made in Gods image and SEMBLANCE and we happen to have a nature that doesn't show any SEMBLANCE of his OWN
Oh boy, this christianity you preach sure seems fake...
>>76012464
Why put your faith in those people rather than something else? Why believe they are special and can help you reach the Truth? Why?
>>76012414
>pretending to be so retarded you don't understand the argument
it's ok anon. You are a victim of the master of lies after all
>>76012244
>The "joke" being that Peter means Rock, but in male form. the rock uppon which the church is founded however has a female form.
Jesus was this rock.
So let me get this straight. Jesus used the male noun for Peter to avoid feminizing him, but he gave himself a feminized name. This is what you believe. lmao so much delusion.
The point of the wordplay is exactly to give a mission to Peter. When God changes someone's name, it is not a child's play, it has absolute significance and changes their destiny forever.
>There are no scriptural evidence that Peter was above the other apostles
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6KV6PXSODgE
>>76012196
That's during the Great Tribulation.
There's other verses concerning the antichrists we have to deal with in this age.
You have to learn how to properly divide the scriptures. Here's a hint:
The Great Tribulation
15 “Therefore when you see the ‘abomination of desolation,’ spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing in the holy place” (whoever reads, let him understand),
>>76012464
He goes into the Scriptures after an introduction regarding history. He also quotes Catholic scholars/theologians and the Early Church Fathers. I'm sorry to give you such a long video, but it is the most detailed and informative.
>>76012244
Father is God.
Son is God.
Spirit is God.
There is One God.
One triune God.
>>76012346
God bless you, anon. I don't want to be like Lucifer but I don't know how to give up studying religion from occult perspectives, which has me running through a labyrinth that's sometimes enjoyable and sometimes very confusing. I'm obsessed with darkness but I still feel a divine presence. I guess I really am quite lost. I'm kind to people and I try to help those I love but I'm just getting creepier every day.
>>76012613
I would try to answer this question as it is about Christian liberty, but I note from your flag that you're probably nuts.
>>76012713
ex cathedra statement: 1854
You: Oh, it was before that.
kek
Learn your own heresies.
>>76012713
"At Matthew 16:17, 18, we find Jesus’ words to Peter: “I say to you, you are Peter [whose name means “A Piece of Rock”], and upon this rock I will build my church.” * Was Jesus saying that his “church,” or congregation, would be built upon Peter, a man? Was Peter to be the head of all other followers of Jesus? How did the other apostles present at that conversation understand Jesus’ words? The Gospels reveal that later, on a number of occasions, they argued about who was the greatest among them. (Matthew 20:20-27; Mark 9:33-35; Luke 22:24-26) If Jesus had already given Peter primacy, or superiority, could there have been any question as to who was the greatest among the apostles?"
"How did Peter himself understand Jesus’ words? Growing up an Israelite, Peter would have been familiar with various Hebrew prophecies speaking of a “stone” or a “cornerstone.” (Isaiah 8:13, 14; 28:16; Zechariah 3:9) When he quoted one of them in a letter to his fellow believers, Peter explained that the prophesied “cornerstone” was the Lord Jesus Christ, the Messiah. Peter used the Greek term pe’tra (the same word found in Jesus’ statement at Matthew 16:18) for Christ alone.—1 Peter 2:4-8."
"So how are we to understand the words: “You are Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church”? To understand an excerpt correctly, we need to read its context. What were Jesus and Peter speaking about? Jesus had just asked his disciples: “Who do you say that I am?” Without hesitation, Peter answered: “You are the Messiah, the Son of the living God.” With that, Jesus commended Peter and then added that he would build his “church,” or congregation, on an even more solid “rock,” the one in whom Peter had just expressed faith—Jesus himself.—Matthew 16:15-18."
https://www.jw.org/en/publications/magazines/wp20151201/was-peter-the-first-pope
>>76012713
No, you think Jesus can't communicate properly.
"I shall call you Peter, and upon you, Peter, will I build my church."
--Things never said by Jesus.
>>76012543
Well said
>>76012676
>Why put your faith in those people rather than something else?
My Faith is not in the people themselves, but simply in the office they hold. An office insittuted and protected by Jesus himself.
>Why believe they are special and can help you reach the Truth?
For literally a thousand reasons, some of which I have already touched upon. Btw they are not special, the Church is. Big difference. The Church authority comes from God, and nobody else.
>>76012781
watch the video I posted anon. Also if you actually read the Church Fathers you would realise they quite literally believe in the Church the way the Catholic Church does
>>76013019
>ex cathedra statement: 1854
Ex cathedra statements are more unique than rare, that is the point. They simply ratify what has always been believed by the Church but not made part of dogma. There is nothing to be defined.
Papal infallibility was always believed on the ground that Jesus promised the gates of hell, and that includes heresy and mistakes, would not prevail.
>>76012884
It's just fear driving you bro.
Love drives out fear. Perfect love drives out all fear. God loves you so much that He would rather die than live without you, so He did.
>>76012203
Of course it is. If ke knows thing before it will happen, it is are already determined. It just must happen. We cannot pick anything else.
Seeing things ahead is not an omniscience. Because they are changing, everything is changing.
I hate ignorance. Maybe it's time to convert myself to something more stable in logic...
>>76013220
Event: 40 AD
Catholic Reaction: 1854 AD
B-but we always believed it.
kek
>>76013238
Why does he love us so much? We're horrible.
>>76012965
An insane person believes the first lie he is told without questioning it no matter how much lunacy it represents.
A sane person questions the first idiot who comes making wild claims about what is holy and what isn't excusing himself in a book, as if books justified anything.
Does Spiderman issue #122 justify wearing a green goblin suit and throwing bombs at other people that also happen to be dressed funny?
>>76013035
Jesus referred to Simon as "kepha", which in Aramaic means "rock", it is indisputable and confirmed in John 1:42
In koine Greek, unlike Attic Greek, there is no distinction between petra (a feminine noun) and Petros (masculine ending). "Petros" is merely the masculine neologism created by Our Lord for Simon. Our Lord was making a pun. Would you have had Jesus name Peter "Petra" or "Petrina"? If Our Lord wanted to make the distinction you protestants imply, He would have used the word "lithos", which in koine Greek means "little rock" or "pebble". The conferral of "the keys" and "the binding and loosing" passages have antecedents in the Jewish Scriptures (see: Isaiah 22) for the notions of bestowing authority and judgement over the community, stewardship. See also John 21:16-17. Here is confirmed the above passages by the clear establishment of Peter as the Shepherd of the flock. A shepherd guides and corrects. Protestants have problems with submitting to human authority. It shows a lack of humility, subjectivism, and refusal to accept that Christ established a visible Church complete with governance.. So you scream "Jesus, Jesus", and then oppose His Will. It was to the Peter and the Apostles that he bestowed His authority and the guardianship of His Church, not to a Book.(John 20:22)
You can see the same name change in John 1:42 that you see in Matthew 16:17-18 just before Jesus gives Cehas/rock the keys to the kingdom of heaven, Matthew 16:19 which foreshadows Isaiah 22:22! This is the exact reason you see all the division among protestants! Satan uses your pride to convince you that each of you are right dividing you into thousands upon thousands of man made sects with conflicting doctrine! Your personal interpretations of scripture are meaningless
>>76013440
Christ, the Good Shepherd, called Peter to be the chief shepherd of His Church (John 21:15–17). He gave Peter the task of strengthening the other apostles in their faith, ensuring that they taught only what was true (Luke 22:31–32). Peter led the Church in proclaiming the gospel and making decisions (Acts 2:1– 41, 15:7–12).
Early Christian writings tell us that Peter’s successors, the bishops of Rome continued to exercise Peter’s ministry in the Church. The Pope is the successor to Peter as bishop of Rome. The world’s other bishops are successors to the apostles in general.
To the masses, Jesus spoke in parables, but to His disciples, he spoke plainly (Mark 4:11, Luke 8:10). Jesus had no qualms about identifying Himself in plain Aramaic: "I am the way, the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except tyhrough me" (John 14:6); "Today, this scripture (Isaiah) is fulfilled in your hearing" (Luke 4:21); "I AM" (John 18:5-8); "It is He who is speaking to you" (John 4:25-26) . So, why would He be so coy and convoluted in His speech and logic when speaking with the twelve? He Himself said "let your yes mean yes and your no, no" (Matthew 5:37) Why mention rock twice in the same sentence unless it refers to the same thing? Why rename Peter at all if it had no meaning? Who did Paul go to (Galatians 1:18)??? To Peter.
However, your opinion disregards the very form of the Church - which has perdured for almost 2000 years. The Church is Jeus' earthly, human Body (1 Corinthians 12:27), with Him in charge. When He ascended there was no bible for all believers to read and interpret for themselves.
Do you honestly think that you would have a bible today if Christ had not left someone in Charge of His Church when He ascended? He could not leave the twelve in charge, as they argued amongst themselves as to who was the greatest (Mark 9:33-34).
>>76012734
1 Samuel 10:12 - A man who lived there answered, "And who is their father?" So it became a saying: "Is Saul also among the prophets?"
>>76013297
Stahp.
What God knows, He does not tell you.
What God knows does not impact upon you at all.
Your choices and God's foreknowledge of your choices are independent of each other. Go to eat an apple. Eat an orange instead. God would have known for ages that you were going to switch to the orange.
You have to stop this line of thought that makes you non-responsible, because you're facing a trial without an attorney for your life and you don't have a defense. God's not going to buy this act.
>>76013220
Why put your faith in that office and not literally *anything* else?
>An office insittuted and protected by Jesus himself
You only *BELIEVE* that. But *WHY* believe that? Why should I believe that the cucklic church is super special and not that some form of Protestanism is more correct? Can you give me a *single* logical reason?
As a heads up - appealing to authority and appealing to tradition don't count as logical reasons. They count as illogical, fallacious non-reasons.
>>76013398
Isn't it astonishing? How do we bear all of that love?
>>76013220
The video I posted does the opposite. I'm afraid we're not going to come into agreement here. Agree to disagree? :^)
>>76013401
Okay kookoo for Cocoa Puffs.
>>76013367
>Catholic reaction: 1854 AD
there is no reaction. The definition of Trinity didn't happen in 40 AD anon, and yet the Church always believed it.
You cannot understand this because you have cut yourself off from Sacred Tradition and have lost contact with the promise Jesus made to His Church
>>76012965
Also here, this is a treatment for your mental illness, when somebody has the delusions you have (to call rational people lunatics) this is the only effective medication known to man besides assasination.
>>76013440
>>76013511
While I completely disagree with your arguments, let me tell you that you are one of the most knowledgeable people with regards to the bible and church teachings I ever encountered.
As a JW usually I have to teach the people what they are supposed to believe according to their own church, just to disprove it immediately afterwards.
(Just wanted to say that before the thread is gone)
>>76013440
Bible written in Greek.
Catholic argument falls in Aramaic, fails in Aramaic, and fails harder when you realize that Jesus called Peter Cephus in the beginning of their relationship, not 3 1/2 years later when bestowing on Peter the keys to heaven.
>>76013297
It's not already determined, since you can choose anything. You can choose anything, and God knows anything and everything. Your choices are infinite in character, and so is God's knowledge.
There is nothing more free than a world in which you can choose anything - God can know which choice you'll make, but that's because God can't not know what God knows, which is everything.
Are you familiar with possible worlds theory? Because that fits in nicely with how I talk about how there's no incompatibility between God's omniscience and free will.
>>76013511
Bible: Feed my sheep.
Catholics: THAT MAKES PETER THE EMPEROR OF HEAVEN!
>>76013650
here's your medication, another dose, as you seem upset.
>>76013554
>Why put your faith in that office and not literally *anything* else?
Because I am a Christian and have Faith in Jesus.
>Why should I believe that the cucklic church is super special and not that some form of Protestanism is more correct?
Look at history. The Church always existed whereas every sect of protestantism is an off-shoot of the 1500 reformation
>Can you give me a *single* logical reason?
I already gave you many reasons ITT alone. You simply refuse to acknowledge them. One reason is proof enough though. The gates of hell have not prevailed.
>>76013748
Love you too anon.
>>76013751
>Catholic argument falls in Aramaic
Lmao did you even read?
There was no difference between petros and petra in KOINè Greek. If Jesus wanted to demarcate a difference, he would have used "lithos".
>>76013814
nice strawman. We simply claim that through the apostolic succession, the Bible, that was written by the Church they founded, is to be interpreted.
>>76013657
Elohim isn't in Genesis 1, from 3500 years ago? Oh, wait, silly me, that's a question about the bible. Sorry, I'll try to think of more questions about your fallen church, it's evil leader, and your dubious future.
>>76013662
kek
That guy cursed my boss once.
