I posted about a possible happening at Stone Mountain for the past couple of days, and had a few people interested in it. The main problem was that the protest was organized by Jodi Calhoun, who was a member of the Klan. She didn't bill it as a Klan event, though, and nobody knew how many Klan members would be there. I went alongside the media and tried to stay pretty neutral about it.
I'll be posting if you guys are interested at all.
Did anything happen or was it a non happening happening?
>>55772309
Gibs
>>55772309
Right away there was a militia, they were there when I got there an hour early. I talked with reporters from local WSB Radio and AJC who were all really cool people, and learned these guys show up every time.
They're Three Percenters, not sure what to make of them. They're founded on the idea that only 3% of American revolutionaries rebelled against the British. In an interview with the leader, he said they were there because they were personally friends with the person who organized the event, but they don't support the Klan and were there to separate Clansmen from them.
>mfw the person who organized the protest was in the Keystone Knights
>>55772309
do it up, op.
need a domestic thread.
>>55772417
I got worried when the police started to scramble and shut the gate, they sent off a bunch of patrol cars and motorcycles. The lot where the protesters met was a ways away from the park entrance, so I had time to set up near the street to try to get pictures of the counterprotesters driving up.
I heard their radios that they had just entered the park, but they didn't show. Then there was word they were on top of the mountain waiting, but BLM wasn't there either. There was one guy holding an anti-protest sign, a quote from the Mississippi Declaration iirc, declaring that the reason for separation was slavery - That was it, apart from a few weird looks on the trail. Nobody spoke up because the militia was armed to the teeth.
Police were genuinely cool though. One of them talked with me for a while, he said that if anything gets serious he'll be off to the side. I'm glad to have good guy cops.
Trying to scale all these photos, my camera makes them so big it's crazy. Also it was hard trying to stay off to the side. Because this group was organized by some extremists, it attracted a few more crazies, skinheads and Clansmen than they usually do. I was told by a park worker that there have been 4 protests in as many months, but this is the first extremist one like this. Early on when there was only the militia there, I'm pretty sure a drone flew by. It was low, a white plane with a black box under it.
brb Pewdiepie
>>55773758
Keep it bumped every 10 minutes or so, I'll be back if you guys are interested but I have to go take care of something.
>>55774003
Just make new thread if else. I'm interested, I live in L'ville/Suwanee btw.
>>55773148
More pics of militia QTs plz
same guy from duluth here from last thread. nothing is happening
Respectfully I wish folks would stop using Stone Mountain as a political rally site.
I don't want leftists to get crazy ideas and destroy the carvings.
>>55773534
those fancy boi mediafags seem so out of place next to mountain man
Was it something that could incite a response from UGA students? I'm in Athens and my number one worry right now is that we turn into the next Mizzou with that letter our SGA released
black guy that was gonna buy the quadcopter. car was in the shop yesterday and they had to keep it over the weekend so I couldn't make it. Also with the events in France I was a bit upset anyway.
>>55774217
This
>live in sw florida
>brother was supposed to go on "hunting trip" in northern Georgia this weekend
>had to cancel trip cuz work(owns construction company)
>says nigger all the time
>once said nigger in Mexican restaurant
>black 1 table over
>look at black guy
>black guy says I heard him
>black goes back to menu and orders fajitas
>nothing happens
>mfw
>>55774451
yeah lol.
fucked posture because he sits at a desk all day.
>>55773534
what are they protesting?
>>55772309
How many ppl you estimate were there?
>>55773148
>female militia
Adorable.
>>55773534
>dat black guy in the back
>>55774871
>alabama women
No sir.
Would not.
Do not want.
>>55774982
>Stone Mountain
>Alabama
>>55774698
>Live in Georgia
>Hour drive to Stone Mountain
>Did not attend, do not care
>Didn't even make the local news
Happening right?
>>55774982
Georgia peach.
>>55772309
Go on......
>>55774217
I'll be posting more militia pics, going in order.
>>55774316
Yeah it was mostly a dud, still, tacticool unorganized militias who hate the federal government
>>55774537
The only black guy there was a security guard from UGA wearing his uniform. He posed with the militia and a Gadsden flag
>>55774576
>I was a bit upset anyway
Understandable, anon, at least you have a heart. There weren't any counterprotests anyway, so you would have looked more like a goof than anything else.
>>55774827
The plan to build a monument to MLK on top of the mountain.
>>55774862
About 40 protesters and 15 Militia.
do they understand they're hurting their cause? every time some klan or neonazi fuck waves the rebel flag they ruin it for the rest of us.
another 48 hours of libkeks pasting some 5 man march all over the news tying it to racism and the kkk
>>55775130
I think the women were from the Alabama Three Percenters Militia. The unusual part was that there were Georgia Threepers, Alabama Threepers, and a couple of guys with black bananas wearing all black. The GA 3% leader told me they were all together, but something struck me as off with the black-wearing militia guys. They were strung out looking and tried to be in the back of a lot of my video.
>>55775168
It's going to be in the AJC tomorrow because of all the hardliners hiding in the ranks. You see them if you know what to look for.
>>55774871
You misinterpret my meaning. Female militia are adorable the same way a puppy is adorable.
>>55775304
>that nose
>>55775542
Meant to quote; >>55774982
>>55775472
Even if the klan or a neonazi didn't show up to wave the flag they'd just post a stock photo on twitter or edit one into the background.
Honestly I just find it hilarious how you can even mention the klan is coming to town and blacks everywhere get scared.
>>55775498
At least the AJC is doing actual journalism and less opinion pieces, now if it had been announced before hand that might be a happening.
>>55775304
The nose knows lmao
I wasn't gonna counter protest idgaf about either side. I just wanted to fuck with people with the drone
I liked this guy's shirt, but another guy there who was pretty cool pulled me off to the side and told me not to start anything with him. This guy said he was a reformed skinhead, and recognized the other guy as a radical. "He's fucking dangerous, consider staying away from him."
He was wearing boots with white socks and red laces. Skinheads who wear white laces symbolize white supremacy, and but red laces symbolize that they either have or are very willing to commit racial violence. He also had a lot of broken teeth, I wonder how they got like that.
At one point during the rally I mentioned to another person in a conversation (which he started, btw, so I felt open to speak a little more freely) that it was a shame how the media was crowding around the guy with the 14 Words shirt.
>Yeah, he seems nice but it's a little cra-
>WHAT'S CRAZY ABOUT THE FOURTEEN WORDS
I think the skinhead was just fucking with me though, he never gave me any problems and I even shook his hand and told him I wasn't a radical and didn't intend to inject my opinion.
I want his shirt, though. 10/10
>>55775948
Any hot grills?
>>55772309
You the black guy that was gunna get a quad copter?
>>55775675
they don't get scared, the klan hasn't hurt anyone in 50 fucking years. They just go into victim mode so they can slurp up those liberal crocodile tears.
>Blacks attack whites
dats right whiteboi da black man aint no pussyassbitch
>Whites say mean things to blacks
boo hoo muh racism why u so meen to me issa done nuthin help me obama
>>55775948
>Stormfag
>Drives a gook car
>>55776021
No, that's me. My car is in the shop for repairs so I couldn't make it.
>>55776018
I really doubt there any that would be attending this rally in Georgia, maybe as protesters.
>>55776021
No, he's somewhere else in the thread. His car needed repairs.
>>55776026
A lot of the people there were talking about how they were worried it might be majority Klan, but it was a few low-key guys. One of them said "If you put all the Klan members in Georgia - I mean active Clansmen, it might fill a small Waffle House."
>>55776077
topkek there were a lot of those cars.
>>55775948
Pic of the boots, btw
>>55776026
Live in the Fort Benning area and theirs been at least one good threat of a chimpout or purge da white folks as the local blacks put it a year since poor baby traytray.
Every single time its defused when a rumor is spread the Klan is in the area looking to kill a brother, granted most white people start conceal and open carrying even more than usual and the older blacks in the area insist on reminding the younger blacks that not a fuck will be given about shooting every single one is they actually start some shit.
>>55776077
kek
i noticed that too
guess affordability was pretty important
>>55776499
Kia popped up on the GA/AL border and its been open season on korean cars since.
Kia Souls everywhere
Here's a patch with the Saint of Travelers, I'm not an expert on militaria but I think this is more of a motivational one.
>>55776704
>Saint of Travelers
Whoops, I was thinking of Saint Christopher. I'm not well versed on religion.
Here's their GA unit patch. The Alabama had a similar patch I think, or just the Alabama flag.
>>55776704
>snowman
>>55776846
Georgia Security Force? Never heard of them, actually never heard of any Georgia based militia except when a group ended up on the news for planning some terror attack.
>>55776638
I weld parts that go into the Optima.
Souls are made in Korea, but are going to be made in Mexico next five years. Kia is building a big plant down there. We were supposed to get it but Mexicans stealing everything as usual. Larger than the West Point factory.
>>55776704
type 3's are supposed to be controlled uniforms. i'm surprised they're not in trouble for having those and not being in the service
>>55773148
not one of the people on the picture looks like a fit soldier, how will they stand a chance against anyone serious?
I know at least one person there must have been a liberal in disguise.
>the fucking filesize on these photos
I had to re-size it 6 times
>>55777103
They're losers that were too unfit to join the military and want to play army man
>>55776940
They were talking about those, saying they got a bad rap from them. The Georgia Security Force isn't an actual militia, just a branch of the larger Three Percenters group.
After interviewing him, their leader gave me his business card. I'm not visiting his website, but you can feel free to.
>Gen.BLooDAgenT
>Christopher Hill
>Commanding Officer, GSF III%
>georgiasecurityforce.com
I asked them how they communicated, if it was through email or online or radio nets. They said radio, but said no comment when I asked for their frequency.
>>55777054
A lot of them were in either the Air Force or Navy Seals, if you believe the patches. Some of them have been out, the average time they've been in is around 6 to 10 years maybe, so I'm assuming they get out of active service and have nostalgia for it.
>>55776704
stolen valor.
fowarded this thread to domestic terrorist investigation. this is a threat to national security.
>>55776846
Oh shit, are they part of Stargate Command?
>>55777162
So someone from Little 5 Points?
Is this continuing tomorrow? Might go up there
>>55777439
>I'm not visiting his website, but you can feel free to.
No thanks I don't want an alphabet soup of law enforcement outside my house.
>>55777514
Kek
>>55777483
Most of these guys are ex-military. At least a couple people at the rally were obvious drug addicts, and one of them was very drunk (carrying around a bottle with him and emptying it half way up the mountain), but the Threepers weren't associating too much with them. Like this pic >>55777439
They mostly just stood off to the side, spoke to the media to clear up negative perceptions that people had about the unorganized militia, and at the march up the mountain they stayed behind the stragglers. They also had medical supplies in case there was a shitstorm. Understand that there were a lot of trolls in the original group, and that it would have been very possible for a tense time between armed BLM members and Klansmen.
Also the Threeper group is pretty well-established, they may actually be exclusively military.
I have no strong opinions one way or the other, desu
>>55777578
No, but you can bet there's going to be a big rally up there on February 22nd I think, Confederate Memorial Day. Ever since Charleston shootings, people have been all about their heritage, and so naturally a lot of shady people also get involved. If you're interested in general activism, have a day off of work and are willing to drive a little, there's a large protest outside the Western Hemisphere Institute for Security and Cooperation, where they train South American soldiers and commanders, with classes on Psyops and Torture. Of course, they're on the far opposite end of the political spectrum.
The guy in this pic was cool, btw. We catted on the way up, he joked that I was a liberal but could still learn. I told him he didn't know anything, he couldn't even see he was flying the rebel flag upside down and he kek'd.
The thing I'm learning is that the more protesters I see and the more I learn, the more they all seem like genuinely nice people, just with different opinions.
>>55776443
Man, fuck Columbus. Anything past exit 5 is alright, but I'd only go to Victory Drive to go to Ranger Joe's or some shit.
March up the mountain stared here, police officers stood around the group and I tried to stick by media so I wouldn't be all over the news.
>>55778184
That's hardly surprising, maybe people in the south don't take their protesting that seriously.
>>55775857
eh that's not even a jew nose
not meaty enough
>>55778480
Yeah, it was pretty loosely organized. The police had to ask the group to slow down so the back could catch up. One of them made a sarcastic joke, "Oh they're herding us up, wake up sheeple!"
The militia took up the back.
>>55772309
If the SJW's and #BLM go after Stone Mountain, I will completely flip my shit. I am barely sane as it is. I say this even as a Yankee.
>>55776704
this niggas name is snowman lol
>>55778647
this is just as what I'd imagine these people to look like lol
>>55778647
>a bunch of overweight stormfags larping in the mountains
lol....
So, give me the TL;DR: What exactly are these guys protesting about, who are the 3%'ers, and are they actually legitimate?
>>55772656
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N5Ub55qx2wQ
>>55778657
I think a tasteful monument would be fine, so long as it was really well thought out and planned. I've been to the one in DC, I have no problem with it, but it wasn't well planned. The marble is too white, it's sort of an eyesore compared to the other monuments there. The one is planned here because MLK said that freedom will ring from the top of Stone Mountain. Plus, Stone Mountain wasn't a Confederate battle site, the reason MLK said it is because it was used to establish the second Klan and the carving was funded by the Klan, and the mountain was open to them for their cross burning ceremonies.
Pic is the only counterprotester I saw.
>>55778922
jews and black people lol
stone mountain is beautiful how it is, why put on monument on top of another fucking monument?
>>55778876
>group called Defend Stone Mountain creates a Facebook page for the event
>people in the event find out that the woman who organized it is a member of the Klan
>death threats start being thrown around
>rumors in the comments section that up to 80 Clansmen might be bussed in
>members start posting "AKIA" and "14/88," white nationalist and Nazi slogans
>many people start posting that they'll oppose any racists, a lot of them consider it just heritage and are tired of extremists ruining it
The Threepers' militia goes to every rebel flag protest because they believe in a really limited federal government. But they came here especially because they were worried there could be a big conflict, which is why I went there in the first place. You have the possibility of a Klan faceoff with Black Lives Matter, with rival Klans, militias, police and general 'heritage not hate' people in the middle.
Glad everything stayed safe.
>>55779279
>because they believe in a really limited federal government
>extremist libertarians
Were the Articles of Confederation not enough to show these guys why it's a bad idea?
Glad nothing heated up out there, anon.
>>55778922
the stone Mountain monument to Confederate heroes already exists. I am not sure what your point is.
With that said, I find delicious irony with the fact that the MLK memorial is made from a white colored stone rather than an ebony variety. Who approved this? It is a thumb in the eye to #BLM. Their hero is memorialized in white stone. MLK is memorialized in white.
>>55779193
It's called cultural genocide. Countries all over the world do it.
>>55779279
"Dent Myers" here, from your yesterday post. Glad it went well, I did yard work all day.
>>55779193
I honestly hate it, the monument near the base is okay, here >>55779279
Because it's a war memorial, pavilion, and it doesn't detract from the whole mountain. The carving is just ugly imho, it's not large enough to look good like Rushmore is, and it isn't carved deeply enough into the mountain to make it look like a statue. It ruined one of the best granite monadnocks, they're interesting and unique mountains and it was cool for being pretty well out of the way of other mountains, and now there's an ugly seal stamped into it. You still have Panola Mountain, but it's not nearly the same.
>>55779549
I am sorry that stone mountain does not fill you with sufficient white guilt.
>>55779428
What's wrong with extreme libertarianism? If you believe in freedom, it's the natural ideological reaction.
>>55779667
I'd advise you to read about the problems with the Articles of Confederation; that's what happens when you believe in "freedom".
Also, being opposed to libertarianism doesn't automatically make someone an ultra-authoritarian Stalinist; it's far more likely that they're just pragmatic.
>>55779279
Is that a nigger flying the don't tread on me flag?
>>55779759
There are only problems with the Articles of Confederation if you want an Empire, not a Republic.
>>55779667
The entire body of libertarian principles is a bunch of gay thought experiments.
It never has and never will be a viable real world philosophy.
Babby's first ideology, now with 0 actual economics education required.
>>55779882
Wrong, there are only problems with the Articles of Confederation if you want anything more than an agrarian backwater unable to legitimately defend itself from a determined aggressor.
And, in any case, having the constituent states be sovereign in all but name is also a recipe for a volatile and unstable greater nation; it's good for the states to have a long leash, but they need a leash all the same.
>>55772309
Interesting thread. Another UGA anon here who can only imagine the reactions to this event if it gets publicized here. I hope we don't witness a Mizzou 2: Electric Boogaloo here.
>>55780147
>Another UGA anon here who can only imagine the reactions to this event if it gets publicized here
U r raciss, aon.
>>55779759
>get asked honestly by people at the rally what my opinion is
>say I'm just here to photograph, but tell them honestly I'm libertarian and starting to lean left
>they joke with me and are generally cool about it, even the reformed skinhead guy
I started out super nervous, even shaking my voice when I was talking with the Nazi guy, but by the middle of it realized they were all cool so long as I didn't insult them.
desu I'm trying to give up politics, and show up just because I like the idea of people protesting, especially separatist movements. I want to photograph any sort of protest, but when you hear what the separatists say, it's got so much more passion to it. And even though I don't agree with these guys, I love that America is probably the only country where unorganized militias can walk up a federally owned park armed to the teeth and advocate a separatist movement, and the Army isn't called out on them. Freedoms.
>>55779495
I wonder if he's ever posted here. He's the first guy that taught me that not all racists are douchebags.
Pic is a lady who said she didn't like them but wanted a pic. They all laughed and let her in.
>>55780118
You are truly a moron. The landed aristocracy of the US were all, shockingly, landed. There is a very good reason why the founders limited Federal voting to white male property owners.
>>55780346
Yes, and? That was a thing during the early years of the U.S. constitution, and I don't entirely disagree with the sentiment to be honest.
Saying that the Articles of Confederation was good simply because a single portion of it was good belies a total lack of understanding of policy, history, and shows that you care more about single-issues or ideology than actual politics and pragmatism.
Helicopter flyover, the police were on their radios trying to find out who it was with.
>>55780221
But anon, I'm a minority and minorities can't be racist. :^)
Seriously though, I do enjoy the sanity here compared to all the shit going down in Missouri. With Christmas Break coming up, I just want to finish up this semester in peace.
SOON.
Top of the mountain, I liked how the granite blended in with the sky.
>>55780505
The articles allowed the states to have autonomy. The Constitution forced national homogenization.
If you look in early US history text books, the US was referred to as "These United States" after the Civil War the Country was referred to in books as "The United States" There is a monumental difference between the two descriptions.
can someone give me a tl;dr of all this?
>>55780561
You are not uncommon. Most people will gladly trade liberty for security.
Got a lot of militia pics on top of the mountain
>>55780880
Touch that mountain with sandpaper or explosives and there will be consequences.
>>55780830
See >>55779279
>>55780776
Yes, and this is exactly why the Articles were a horrible idea, and the Constitution a great one.
Allowing the states to remain sovereign would have, ultimately, reduced America to something like the EU, except without the benefit of being formed by developed, post-industrial 1st world nations. America under the Articles would have been an irrelevant agrarian tumor, clinging to the East Coast, and would have not enjoyed a fraction of the success and prosperity of the United States.
Putting ideology before pragmatism and history is the surest sign of delusion.
>>55780864
Funny that you mention Franklin's quote; it turns out that he didn't actually say "Those who trade liberty for security deserve neither"; in fact, he said "Those who trade essential liberty for temporary security deserve neither"
Take that as you will.
You guys need to stop arguing about politics and have a beer with Militia Leif Garrett
>>55781104
Excuse me, the actual quote was "Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety". My apologies.
>>55781104
I was not directly quoting Franklin. I am fully aware of the full context of that quote. I am suggesting something far more radical than Franklin.
>>55780725
>>55780880
>>55781008
>>55781130
You know, this reminds me a lot of Enchanted Rock out near Fredericksburg, Texas. Beautiful country out that way.
>>55781210
And it is of my opinion that the implications of your suggestion is, pardon my french, absolute bull that would befit a religious zealot, not a patriot who truly cares for his nation.
>>55781014
I suggest that you read the "Anti-Federalist Papers". It is published as one book. It reads like the inverse of the Federalist Papers. Every fear that the anti-Federalists had, eventually came true, chapter and verse, so to speak.
>>55781309
You are, in my limited estimation, oblivious. Following the revolution, people identified as citizens of their state, primarily, and as US citizens, secondarily.
>>55781400
Regardless of whether their fears came true or not, what remains to be seen is weather those fears truly have any merit.
Even though I know of the Anti-Federalist Papers, to save both yourself and I time, would you care to elaborate on some of the more poignant fears the authors had.
>mention libertarians
>flamewar
Why can't we all just get along, brohs?
>>55781521
Yes, they did; I fail to see what relevance this has to the modern age ("It's 2015" meme aside); or whether such a identity hierarchy was desirable.
>>55781647
You know, I honestly don't know. Considering the fact that the US Communist party has had more historical success than the Libertarian party, I'm not even sure why I'm worried about Libertarians.
>>55781528
Here is a cursory summary:
https://mises.org/library/antifederalists-were-right
Going page by page to prove how the fears of the anti-federalists were justified would require a Doctoral Dissertation.
I apologized to this one guy for if I asked him a question too aggressively earlier in the day. It was about his Nazi shirt; I don't agree with it but I didn't want to be a douche to him, so I shook his hand. Noticed he was wearing a Klan ring, he let me photograph it. Pretty cool, actually.
OP awesome thread, i'm following it to the end.
Everyone is armed. Keeps things much calmer.
Not much to see at the GSF III% site posted, some Pics youtubes and Facebook links Etc.
bumpin 4 burgers n freedom
>>55781877
>disagree with wanting to protect whites
>>55781739
>"It's 2015" meme aside
That is however, all that you have to hang your hat on.
These United States were meant to be a free and autonomous collection of independent districts.
The United States turned them into an homogenized collective.
>>55781974
>plot twist: OP is a nigger
Man, I live here in Georgia and I didn't know this stuff was going down. honestly, I wouldn't care if they had a MLK statue here but I don't think it should be ON Stone Mountain. Like this anon said>>55779193
It is also nice that the OP was able to have a civil conversation with people he disagrees with. I am pretty sure 95% of the people here couldn't do that.
>>55781844
First off,
>mises
Secondly, it only says that the federalists won and got what they wanted, and the anti-federalists lost and things happened they didn't want.
Again, this says nothing about whether the anti-federalists fears were legitimate, or what they didn't want to happen was actually bad, or any thing of the sort.
You can say "I warned you that X would happen!", but that has no bearing on whether I think X is bad or not, or whether X truly is bad or not, only that you think X is bad and that it happened.
>>55782136
"legitimate" in this context only means, "were their predictions correct?"
In almost every regard the fears of the anti-federalists were made manifest.
>>55781990
>That ... on.
Au contraire, I have the entirety of global history AND the modern world to hang my hat on. Should the(se) United States maintained the Articles, ceteris paribus, the(se) US would likely have been just as poor and undeveloped as it was after the revolution, and not have grown into the global force it is today. Can you imagine something like the Louisiana Purchase, or national policies to legitimize Manifest Destiny, happening without the federal government?
>These ... districts.
Again, that says nothing of their worth or desirability. The US was/were meant to be British Colonies, does that mean that they should have remained so?
>The... collective
And rightfully so, I may add.
>>55782245
Fine then, let me rephrase:
Why should I care about the fact that their fears were made manifest, and why should I consider them anything more than the paranoid ramblings of people who shouldn't be taken seriously, and are in fact antithesis to the concept of a strong, civilized nation.
>>55782121
Thanks brah, I don't post too much on /pol/, but I like to travel and I'm trying to learn more about things like this. So if I ever visit any political places, I'll post here and try keep it more of an interesting discussion than a flame-war.
I've tracked down that there's an Imperial Klans of America compound, but it's pretty far away and I'm not sure exactly where it is. Plus if I went, I'd only photograph the signs painted outside (I'm not a retard, kek). There's also Muslim cultural villages around the southeast that were wrapped up in conspiracies in the mid-2000s that I want to see. And any political events that I have time to see, I'll see. Problem is college and work, plus daylight savings interferes with me going anywhere after classes.
>>55782331
>Should the(se) United States maintained the Articles, ceteris paribus, the(se) US would likely have been just as poor and undeveloped as it was after the revolution, and not have grown into the global force it is today
That is what I said, above. You want an Empire. All that I desire is a Republic, if we can keep it.
>>55782468
Since you're near that part of the US regardless, have you checked out the USS Alabama down in Mobile? It's a wonderful vessel, and I'm sure /pol/ would appreciate some pics.
>>55782415
We need to understand their arguments and take them seriously now, if there is to be any hope of restraining the federal government to the limited powers it was actually granted in the Constitution, or even anything close to them, given its current tendency to accelerate its growth beyond them.
>>55782415
Can you honestly say that you are pleased with the Federal Government and its expansive powers?
I am genuinely curious.
>>55782498
And I am saying that the desire for a simple republic, in its classical inception, would be and is disastrous for the American people as a whole, and should be avoided and ridiculed at every chance possible.
>>55782594
Yes actually, we camped down there with Boy Scouts when I was like 8. It was cool, but there were so many rat droppings over the bed, nasty lol
I have to say my favorite place in the southeast is Oyotunji an the moment, an African village that started as a commune in the 1970s to practice Yoruba. I posted a thread about it a while ago, they're chill people.
And that's the end of the pics, guys. Glad you enjoyed the thread!
>>55782741
Why? Really? What is the basis for your glee for Empire.
Sure a simple Republic, would not be an expansive and global force. I get it.
Are you saying that we are better off as a nation constantly involving ourselves in war rather than just engaging in commerce?
>>55782880
I did enjoy the thread. If anyone ever threatens to deface Stone Mountain, please sound the alarm on /k/ and /pol/. Thanks.
>>55782604
>pic
The founding fathers were great men, but they were not gods, and their words should not be taken as holy truths. To do so would cheapen the men that actually said them.
>If there... beyond them
But why? I am truly distraught to see this "on or off" mentality floating around on /pol/; the "it's our way or no way" rhetoric that is constantly thrown around.
>>55782609
That is a complicated question, and I will respond with a simple answer.
I do not care if a government is small or big; A small government is fine so long as it is effective; a big government is fine so long as it is lean.
It is easy to make a big government lean (which I do not oppose, and heavily approve of); it is very difficult to make a small government effective, in the sense of it being able to effect it's will and law on the nation as a whole, as well as guide it.
>>55782761
Hah, I was in the Boy Scouts as well, and we always camped in the Lexington down in Corpus Christi. I'll have to look up that African village, it sounds interesting.
>>55782880
That look on the security guard's face "Oh god, I hope they'll let me go after this"
>>55782925
>What is the basis for your glee for Empire.
A little bit of Romabooism, a little bit of a desire for nation self-determination, a little bit of this and that.
>Are ... commerce?
I am saying that it is good that we busy ourselves with both; commerce with those who are alligned with our interests and values, and war (or at least heated competition) with those who are not.
>>55783030
>do not care if a government is small or big; A small government is fine so long as it is effective; a big government is fine so long as it is lean.
...but we have neither, just as the Anti-Federalists predicted. Our federal government is both inefficient and fat. Once more, and more importantly, it has become completely unaccountable to the people.
>>55783092
He was with GSU, actually showed up much earlier than most of the other guys. If I remember right, he showed up with a woman and a priest. And when the media was talking about racism allegations, another guy (the reformed skinhead) said he had three black children, and another guy had an adopted African child. They aren't completely closed off to the outside world.
>>55783214
Is obesity being bad justification for anorexia to be desired?
Again, I am not satisfied with the current state of American government, but to say that the entire entity should be scrapped is absolutely preposterous. Extremism is wrong regardless which side of the n-dimensional political spectrum you lie on.
>>55783121
>commerce with those who are alligned with our interests and values
Regardless of your spelling error, we must determine values first. What are our values? In our discussion, there are two options, though more exist in reality.
1. Empire
2. Republic
The values of each are distinct and incompatible.
>>55772309
>>55783274
Why a militia was there?
>>55783386
A republic is incapable of enforcing its values on those who do not share them, and is at the mercy of those who can (regardless if they share them or not), and so an Empire is to be preferred.
It is worth mentioning at this point that I am not arguing from a deontological point of view, but rather from consequentialist one.
>>55783321
>but to say that the entire entity should be scrapped is absolutely preposterous.
This is curious to me. I am saying that the current form of the US government is contrary to the wishes of the Founders.
That is to say, I am not scrapping something which is fundamentally beneficial. I am not throwing the baby out with the bathwater, so to speak. I am suggesting, instead that we return to our core principles as a Republic, not an Empire.
>>55783531
Because we have the freedom to defend our leafs from the Maple Bandit.
>>55783623
You imply that ALL the founders were marching under the same banner, so to speak. The very existence of the anti-federalists and the federalists is enough to show otherwise.
Hamilton and Adams were as much founders as were Jefferson and Monroe.
>>55783771
>as were Jefferson and Monroe.
as Jefferson and Monroe were*
>>55779279
Being white isn't an extreme position
baka
>>55772309
Fuck, Kennesaw fag here how have I missed this
>>55783771
>Hamilton and Adams were as much founders as were Jefferson and Monroe
True. And both, Anti-Federalist and federalist would have stood in horror viewing the scope, power, and unaccountability of the current Federal government.
My point is that even the most rabid Federalist of that era would now stand in shock, viewing the expansiveness of the Federal government.
>>55784106
Rather, I would believe they would stand in shock at the amount of corruption, identity politics, and sheer BLOAT of the federal government.
Again, I am not opposed to big government so long as it is lean, and I feel that Hamilton and others like him would agree with me. I am not concerned with those who look to Jefferson and Jackson, because they and I share entirely different political platforms.
>>55784227
>I am not concerned with those who look to Jefferson and Jackson, because they and I share entirely different political platforms.
You just uncovered our fundamental divide. I am not sure that there is any way to bridge this gap.
It has been a pleasure, however, having a civil and thought-provoking conversation.
Thank you.
I will continue to converse, but I think that we might be talking past each other.
>>55782880
Thanks for the non biased journalism. And they say we are a hugbox...
Georgia looks like a nice place with all the trees other than the city skyline as seen here >>55780880
>>55784386
Yankeefag who lived in Georgia for 5 years. It is beautiful. My hikes on Kennesaw Mountain are among the most pleasant memories of my life.
>>55784358
Same for me, as well. It's refreshing to have a conversation that doesn't devolve into ">MUH ROADS" and "STATIST".
In any case, my general position can be described as "whatever works"; If it makes the populace happy and prosperous, is able to adequately defend the nation and promote her interests, and is able to secure its own existence, I have no problem with a state; I just don't think a libertarian state is capable of meeting those criteria.
>>55784546
I am more of an idealist. I gather that you are more of a utilitarian or pragmatist.
>>55784590
Of course; you believe in rights as fundamental, metaphysical things that cannot be broken; I consider them more to be "heuristics", things that shouldn't be broken as doing so almost inevitably leads to bad consequences, but aren't absolutely sacred things.
Apologies for the provocative title, but this provides a reasonable explanation of something similar to my position.
http://raikoth.net/libertarian.html
These are CIA agents. One of them is obviously a kike. The rest are travelling in foreign made cars.
>>55783642
I will never understand the americans...nice thread btw
>>55784711
I bookmarked the link. I will read it. If I take the time to read it now our conversation will stagnate.
You said:
>you believe in rights as fundamental, metaphysical things that cannot be broken;
I am curious, what is your view of rights? If they are not immutable and natural, they are, by definition, not inalienable. This makes any right just a mere privilege as far as I can see.
>>55784714
Yeah, I know. At least the majority are FBI. And some of them are with troll groups, I heard the protesters talking very loudly a few cars over from some guy with a Dylan Roof looking haircut from behind, saying he was one of those guys that goes to rallies around the country and causes trouble.
I'd say 5% of the Klan members are actually in the Klan, the rest are either working for the police or would be an informant in a moment's notice if it would save themselves.
Re-the red shoelaces: The nigger woman has red shoelaces on. So fucking retarded. It's just like how an earring in your right ear meant you were gay. Pure false flag faggotry.
>>55784977
In all fairness, red shoelaces don't fit those boots at all other than to make a statement. Plus I was told this by someone who claimed to be a reformed skinhead. I may be reading too much into it, though.
>>55775304
>>55784878
>This makes any right just a mere privilege as far as I can see.
Well, from my point of view, they are. The right to free speech is a privilege that is vehemently defended, even to the point of rebellion, because people LIKE to the right to free speech. Thus, it is in the state's best interest to gurantee this right, as infringing on it leads to less than favorable consequences.
The nation would have to be in some truly dire situation, the scope of which I can scarcely imagine, where infringing on free speech was decided to be a necessary evil.
>>55784796
It is a good thread.
Honestly, however, what aspect of the conversation is getting "lost in translation", so to speak? I am genuinely curious.
>>55785232
Well, we are back to our fundamental rift. I view legal rights as a written manifestation of natural rights. That is to say, the right pre-exists civilization. It is the right of the individual before, during, and after any social compact.
>>55785456
And I, on the other hand, take a purely positivist standpoint, and consider the concept of "natural rights" to be fallacious at worst.
I find it particularly interesting when these basic, philosophical schisms spring up and truly illustrate the differences between political thought.
>>55785456
What I mean is that government merely has the job of recognizing and protecting our natural rights. The government does not grant our rights.
>>55785716
I understand; I consider the state to be the method by which humans legitimize any desired rights, with all law ultimately being descended from "might makes right".
Allthough I don't agree with him on many accounts, Hobbes makes an excellent argument of this, saying that man's only "natural right" is the right to use force to impose his will.
>>55785714
Natural rights is a philosophical idea that means "Any thing you would be able to do in a state of nature [stateless society] assuming no one physically stopped you".
According to social contract theory, certain of these rights [such as right to rape, murder, and steal] are voided in exchange for the benefits of civilized society, while others are irrevocably retained. By retained, it is meant that one already had them, and if one lived outside of any given nation-state, one would still have them.
In legal terms, they act as a reverse of laws. Laws are things the government says we cannot do without fear of punishment. Rights are things that the government cannot forbid us from doing.
It is, of course, a social construct, a kind of political arrangement, that hypothetically could be torn down and replaced with something else, but its core idea, that of "Things that the state can not do and can not forbid you do" is the basis of the concept of liberty, and thus is the foundation of liberty itself.
The term "rights" has been co-opted by progressives to mean something more akin to "entitlements" and "duties" or "privileges", and this has severely damaged the concept.
>>55785296
A militia...a fucking militia...why they exist? It's a ego trip? What are their contributions for the us society? Also all this circus for a inoffensive MLK monument? I can't understand this culture (maybe because I'm not even canadian, I'm belgian and probably a degenerate commis in usa standard)
>>55786136
No, the militia is a long standing tradition in the US.
The National Guard is not the militia. There are even states that legally make a distinction between the military and the public militia.
That is to say, every able bodied male above the age of 18 is, by definition, a member of the state militia, whether they realize it or not in some states.
Texas, for example, actually makes it a point to have its own official state militia that is separate from the National Guard.
>>55786136
It's mostly just because they want to provide protection and feel like they're doing the right thing, plus the power trip aspect.
Anyway, I don't want to sign up for any accounts and post stuff on Youtube because it'll be there forever, but I'm ripping the audio off a few of my videos for you guys and posting Vocaroo links. It might take a while but I'll post the one from the Militia leader if I get around to it, it takes a while.
>>55786136
>why they exist?
1. as a final defense of state sovereignty against federal Tyranny.
2.as a final defense of individual and inalienable, natural rights against state of Federal tyranny.
>>55786077
Ah, that is where I disagree. There is no natural right to rape, murder, property, or speech, there is only the right to use force to impose your will.
Civilization necessitates that we limit this right (such as rape and murder) in favor of having a stronger party (the state) "guarantee" the rest; I have not yet found a satisfactory philosophical argument on the inalienable nature of the right to property, but there are very many obvious arguments on the pragmatism of granting that right.
That is not to say, however, that it cannot be taken away. Eminent domain is an example of a (theoretically, depending on your point of view) good use of retracting the right to property so that public improvements may be made.
>>55786136
>Belgian
Eugh.
>>55786136
>why they exist?
1)The police and national/state guard can't be everywhere at once.
2)The founding fathers had the wonderful idea to throw a bone to any and all potential rebels.
Okay, here's the audio of the guy in the 14 Words shirt.
http://vocaroo.com/i/s0LNvN2wTMM8
>>55786467
>>55786136
>>why they exist?
>1. as a final defense of state sovereignty against federal Tyranny.
correction:
>2. as a final defense of individual and inalienable, natural rights against state OR Federal tyranny.
>bunch of evil white people that are violent and hateful gather to protest with guns
>no incidents, everyone just kinda hangs out and does their thing
but the libtards told me there would be violence!
kek
>>55786360
>>55786424
>>55786467
>>55786485
>>55786536
>>55786754
I find this extremely strange even a nonsense (
without offense ameribro). Thanks for the answers.
>>55787235
I'm trying to convert my videos to mp3 now, so I can get a Vocaroo of the militia guy explaining himself for you. It takes a while, though
>>55782880
micnig went to GA?
>>55787291
Ok, I'm very openmind
>>55787291
Fug, I have 20 minutes left for it to process.
Anyway, the audio will be scratchy because it was windy, but he basically talks about how there's a difference between state militias, organized and unorganized, and how they provide protection from extremists on both sides of politics.
>>55786485
>Civilization necessitates that we limit this right
On this we agree. Please re-read my post. The fact remains that anything that you can do in the state of nature is a right. This includes homicide and rape. We choose to abrogate some rights (like rape or murder) in favor of the benefits of civilization with which those rights are incompatible.
We always retain all of our natural rights, however. these rights preceded the state and will outlive any government. We merely choose to exercise them, or not, according to rational criteria.
>>55787550
>We always retain all of our natural rights, however.
Actually, we disagree on this part, but it's a very subtle distinction. I believe, that should a citizen choose to exercise his natural right (I refuse to separate it into things such as a "right to rape"), and such use of his natural right is prohibited by the state in which he is a citizen of, then he is no longer part of that state. He has broken the proverbial social contract, and thus receives no further benefits except those which are offered by the state as a measure of pragmatism, and is, for all intents and purposes, treated as a foreign entity.
So, in short, I do not believe the right to free speech "exists"; it only "exists" when someone (you) or a group of someones (the state) opts to use the singular, natural right of force in order to grant the right to freedom of speech to those it so desires (you in the case of you, and the citizenry in the case of the state).
Should the state no longer wish to grant the right to the freedom of speech, then it is under no metaphysical obligation to do so. However, the people who disagree with this always have the natural right to impose their will through force, in which is included defending whatever "rights" they desire.
>>55787788
You are a pragmatist/utilitarian, correct?
I will lay down the definition of natural rights for you according to your own philosophy.
Surplus energy is the key.
The economy always determines social morality. Typically, moral changes are grounded in economic considerations and given the window-dressing of morality.
The high EREOI of oil has allowed a standard of living unprecedented in human history. It has made child labor unnecessary and freed the female from the chores of domestic households.
Let's be realistic for a moment, women and children only have rights because males allow it.
In a state of nature women and children, being significantly weaker, would, for the most part, be in a subservient position.
I am not making a moral judgment. No one ever claimed that nature is just.
On some level all women must realize that their rights are almost wholly dependent upon the temperament of their male contemporaries.
Luckily for females, children, the weak, elderly, and infirmed, they live in this age of abundant energy.
Cheap energy and abundant resources breeds mercy and a more nuanced social conscience.
Take that away and the the required level of brutality necessary for survival will return.
Excess energy in any social system is always the bottom line. Excess energy defines the political, economic, philosophical, religious, and cultural systems of each and every era.
That is why there is a perception that human beings are progressing in a sociological sense. Social morality is becoming more sensitive, complex, and nuanced because males, for the most part, have become more and more adept at acquiring and harassing energy to meet and, more importantly, exceed that which is required for survival.
Bottom line is, however, that any act that a person of either sex can do in a state of nature is a natural right.
>>55787235
>I find this extremely strange even a nonsense
I really don't get it. It's like you and I are seeing the same words and interpreting something completely different.
What about anything that I said in >>55786754 is nonsense? I am really curious.
>>55788155
>You are a pragmatist/utilitarian, correct?
Yes.
>Let's be realistic for a moment, women and children only have rights because males allow it.
Or rather, because women have convinced men so.
>The rest of your post
Of course, and I completely agree. However, this era of surplus energy is unnatural to a large degree (not that this is bad), and the fact that this requires the suppression of a large amount of "natural rights" (which, again, boils down to doing whatever you want if you're strong enough) shows that something being a "natural right" is not justification for it to be a "lawful right".
>>55788322
In any case, I must be off since it's nearly 4 in the morning and I have work to do tomorrow.
Thank you for the riveting conversation, anon.
>>55788448
Nice chatting with you.
>>55772309
thanks for the thread op, good pics and I'm glad everyone was civil to one another even the white supremacists and the scattered black guys. what a weird time
>>55787483
Well it's processing.
But in the meantime, I found their videos, sort of a mix of sad and scary.
>>55788293
>as a final defense of individual and inalienable, natural rights against state OR Federal tyranny
You leave in a civilized western country, thing like that is impossible (in my point of view)
>>55772309
>>55788792
>what a weird time
>>55772309
So, this is the state and not the country? Cool Cool
Just sayin there is a country not state which has.. Elvish as their real language. OMG idk.
მიხარია საქართვე
S'like, Arabic only pruddy.
>>55788811
Forgot link
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z1IQXq9Vfbk
>>55788847
Implying that the US military wasn't defeated in Iraq by Taliban insurgent goat herders using small arms and improvised munitions.
Implying that Iraq ended in anything more than a stale-mate between the US military and insurgents armed with AK-47's and IED's (improvised explosive devices).
Implying that the US military was not defeated by the Vietcong using mostly small arms and guerrilla warfare tactics.
You see, the Second Amendment, the right to keep and bear arms, is absolutely fundamental to the retention of liberty and the natural rights of the people.
>>55789100
Steady on.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uAE6Il6OTcs
>>55789100
>leave>>55788847
oh boy, blame the weed dude lmoa and my poor english...
But you are not in Iraq, South Africa or Russia, you live in USA. Things like that are useless
>>55787483
http://vocaroo.com/i/s1ZET65eu7GE
Well this is anticlimactic, forward to around 4:20. This is the leader of the local III% militia.
>This is my sign, can you read what it says?
>Uh, 'R-10, R15--"
>No
>>55789439
thanks and good night
>>55789526
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gDDQuavCa3Y
>>55789434
>But you are not in Iraq, South Africa or Russia, you live in USA. Things like that are useless
You english is very good. I took French in high school. I wish that I still had a command of that language.
With that said, we fundamentally disagree about government.
You take an optimistic view. I take a pessimistic one.
If push comes to shove, as a patriot, I will use my weapons and ammunition to oppose tyranny.
>>55789580
Zardoz, Prisoner.
>>55789903
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tra3Zi5ZWa0
>>55789672
well, I understand your logic, I respect your opinion but I'm totally disagree with you.
>>55789979
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NrmOy-EwCkI
>>55789994
You are number 6.
Do not question.
>>55788811
>>55788956
>sort of a mix of sad and scary.
why?
just a little freedom and 2nd amendment
>>55772309
The klan needs to rebrand to the national association for the advancement of white people.
>>55790100
There's a based tune. I can't remember their name. barrel organ and half Animated. Catholic stuff.
>>55789994
>I respect your opinion but I'm totally disagree with you.
What part of opposing tyranny do you disagree with?
>>55790455
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AufQINNTbNc
as powerful, maybe not as powerful.
>>55788926
you are an interesting person.
>>55788926
Sweet Jesus, I dare you to make less sense.
