Char's Counterattack
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Just finished watching CCA
Can someone help me understand what happened here?
Was it the Nu Gundam's psycho-frame overheating because of Amuro, Char, and the soldiers that came to push axis, or was it because of the will of humanity or some shit like that?
Was Lalah involved in any way, since their final words were about Lalah being a mother figure?
Was Amuro's and Char's feud purposely left opening and inconclusive like that to have the viewer come up with their own interpretations, or is their a direct reason/conclusion to the feud?Or is Tomino a hack?
What was the point of Hathaway and Quess?
They were practically copies of Katz and Puru.
Where were Sayla and Kamille during all this?
Kamille doesn't matter as much, but Sayla had such a strong connection to Char's narrative that it was sin to not include her in Char's conclusion.
Also, Char's counterattack thread
>>14249705
I like to believe it's the Nu Gundams psycho-frame going into overdrive alongside the combined will of everyone else pushing.
The Feud is left open because feuds don't have clean conclusive meanings. I would say Amuro won though. He beats the Sazabi and stops Axis.
Hathaway and Quess are a contrast to the "adults are ebil" Tomino stuff in my mind. They show that while kids are humanitys future, they need guidance and can be manipulated. See: Hathaway thinking with his dick, and Char using Quesses daddy issues to make her a soldier.
Saylas VA was on vacation, Kamillie was done with that shit.
>>14249705
>Kamille during all this
still potato'd
but dem Fa sponge baths tho
>Can someone help me understand what happened here?
A miracle happened.
And that brink global extinction ended the ghost of Zeon and its space independent by force ideology.
>>14249758
What about him running in the beach with Fa?
>>14249705
>Or is Tomino a hack?
Well, Tomino was quite proud of this movie
>>14249784
>pic related
I forgot to ask about that
>>14249786
T
omino
![[Zeonic-Corps]_Mobile_Suit_Gundam_-_41_[640x480_H.264_AAC]_[5539BE20].mkv_snapshot_17.02_[2016.05.19_00.14.14].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/StkDFo5.jpg "[Zeonic-Corps]_Mobile_Suit_Gundam_-_41_[640x480_H.264_AAC]_[5539BE20].mkv_snapshot_17.02_[2016.05.19_00.14.14].jpg")
>>14249722
>The Feud is left open because feuds don't have clean conclusive meanings.
Would it have been so bad to have added a trippy scene that indirectly showed Char and Amuro coming to terms with each other even if they don't agree completely. It would have wrapped everything up so much nicer.
I would have been like pottery.
>>14249796
>>14249705
>What was the point of Hathaway and Quess?
Still gotta put a teen drama in this movie full of rational adults
I do think Quess is Kamille 2.0, a strong Newtype with dysfunctional family that seeks parental figures. Problem is, Char is now a hardcore pessimist, so instead of guiding Quess, he just turned her into a killing machine. Plus, her death triggered Amuro and Char's final bickering and Char's last revelation about him being a weirdo
>>14249800
Yes. The biggest aspect of Char's character in this film was his inability to let go of the past while meanwhile, Amuro couldn't care much less about how crazy he is. There was nothing to work out because there was no real feud anymore to begin with.
>>14249705
Amuro and the resonating Sazabi and Nu Gundam formed a conduit for the collective will of humanity which stopped Axis
I don't think Lalah was involved
It's just a tragic end; their feud was left inconclusive because, despite being Newtypes, they were in the end both people, and couldn't understand each other. If anything though, Amuro won because his ideals of believing in people won out over Char's despair and hatred.
Hathaway and Quess showed how constant war had made the adults unfit to guide the younger generation, who had become twisted as a result
Sayla's VA was on vacation. I read somewhere that early versions of the script had Kamille in there instead of Gyunei, but that was cut.
>>14249784
Was he?I was left with the impression that he didn't like it much but then he always gets self deprecating about his works.
When did he say that or are you pulling this out of your ass.
>>14249705
>What was the point of Hathaway and Quess?
Movies are often obligated to throw in brand new kid characters and waste an ungodly amount of time on them rather than focusing on existing characters we know and love.
See also: the FFVII movie
>>14249834
> Quess
> Kamille 2.0
> Not Lalah 2.0
> When the movie makes it clear Hathaway is Amuro 2.0 and Gyunei is Char 2.0
> When Char stalks about her in the same scene he talks about Lalah
I can't fathom how you came to that conclusion.
>>14250502
More like Lalah 2.0 role is split between Nanai and Quess.
>>14250502
It's way simpler than that. Hathaway and Quess are just Katz and Sarah again. The order in which they die just changes.
>>14249705
>What was the point of Quess?
Licky licky Tomino loves the pussy!
Tge lesson of CCA is that the letter T is the best letter.
>>14249834
>Char's last revelation about him being a weirdo
Is that what most people actually believe or is it just some sort of vocal minority?
I've seen lots of similar opinions around but I don't think I've ever seen a single post trying to disprove them.Or is everyone just going along for the ride because it's funnier that way?
Like the whole pedo meme?
>>14249705
The psycho-frames picked up the brainwaves of the soldiers and resonated.At least that is the most logical explanation.I am not that acquainted with Newtype physics.
>since their final words were about Lalah
It's a motive rant/thematic conclusion.
>was Amuro's and Char's feud purposely left open
In quarrels like that everyone is a loser.They didn't even hate each other.They were just neurotic/depressed much like everyone else in the movie.
>what was the point of Hathaway and Quess
They served a lot of roles from a storytelling perspective depending on their relations to different characters but ultimately it's the same good old children vs. adults theme.
>where was Sayla
That is a mystery for the generations.
I kinda like how Sayla just disappearing ended up, she serves as a nice contrast to Char. It doesn't work perfectly, but that's cause it wasn't intended as such it just sort of works that way.
Char has never been able to let go, he has so many personas it can be hard to pinpoint was is the real him and I think even he doesn't know. He is someone who lived with a goal of destroying an enemy for most of his life and can't stop. He is a petty man who still had mommy issues in CCA.
Sayla on the other hand when nah fuck this. She will act when it is completely necessary (whitebase, telling Bright about Char at the end of ZZ), but really she just wants to live a normal life and moves on. I don't think she even mentioned revenge against the zabis in 0079, it was about saving people and stopping a horrible war.
>>14251035
>a petty man who had mommy issues
I love this meme.
>>14249705
Based on what I know of psychoframe:
>Their glow can be coverted into physical energy, which is why Unicorn's shield can fly around without any thrusters
>They glow brighter when someone is exerting mental effort (?), like when they control funnels
>They are incorporated into mobile suits to control objects (the suit itself, funnels) better
>Everyone wished so hard the psychoframe in Nu Gundam glow so bright they can be seen from Earth. That glow is also converted into physical energy strong enough to push Axis.
Science can go fuck itself
>>14251053
>the glow can be converted into physical energy
kek
>>14251073
Yeah, Kek indeed
>>14251080
>Unicorn
>>14251053
That might explain how the Unicorn can lift the Garencieres into orbit. But how does it explain Unicorn and Banshee stopping colony lasers and Unicorn disabling waves of MS instantly?
Has the properties of psychoframe ever been explained clearly in any supplemental materials?
>>14249705
YOU BELONG TO ME
>>14249843
If there was a feud still in CCA, it was purely on Char's side
>>14251083
>wahh wahh I dont like show so everything related to it is non-canon or bad!
Fuck yourself
You're just as bad as Black Knight denying ZZ
>>14251094
>Has the properties of psychoframe ever been explained clearly in any supplemental materials?
No, which is kind of the point. A big part of the reason psycoframe tech is abandoned and research banned due to the fact that it is too wildly unpredictable to use reliably and prone to doing random crazy shit.
>Was Lalah involved in any way, since their final words were about Lalah being a mother figure?
Char did the whole thing because he was still mad about lalah, but she wasnt involved in any newtype trickery in this movie
>Was Amuro's and Char's feud purposely left opening and inconclusive like that to have the viewer come up with their own interpretations, or is their a direct reason/conclusion to the feud? Or is Tomino a hack?
So they can bring them back if they need the money
>What was the point of Hathaway and Quess?
Lickable pussies
>They were practically copies of Katz and Puru.
>Where were Sayla and Kamille during all this?
Sayla was doing nothing as usual, and kamille was in medical school
>Kamille doesn't matter as much, but Sayla had such a strong connection to Char's narrative that it was sin to not include her in Char's conclusion.
She doesnt really though, char couldnt give a fuck about her
Also she probably didnt want people to know her brother was trying to kill billions of people
>>14251120
Excuse me.I don't particularly mind Unicorn.Maybe >>14251080
is out of context or badly translated because I don't want to think that the writers of Unicorn would be that stupid to want me to believe that
>everyone wished so hard the for psychoframe to glow so bright that they can be seen from Earth
I mean,what is this?Care Bears or something?
>>14251139
>Given explanation
>Kek
>Given proof
>Waah bad translation
>>14251139
That scene was an Anaheim mechanic trying to explain the crew of Nahel Argama what he knew of Psychoframes. I don't think there is any out of context writing there.
>>14251141
If that is the best explanation Unicorn can come up with then I don't see why I should care about it.
This is a thread about CCA that was written way before Unicorn and by a different person.
Explain.If the psychoframe converts green pixie dust into physical energy where does the pixie dust come from in the first place?
>>14251130
> char couldnt give a fuck about her
Right, that's why he gave her a briefcase full of gold.
And why he keeps a photo of her throughout the Gryps conflict.
Certainly the actions of a man who doesn't give a fuck.
>>14251139
>I don't particularly mind Unicorn
>I don't want to think that the writers of Unicorn would be that stupid
Which is it?
I wish Sayla's VA never died.
>>14251151
He was commenting about psychoframes and how they might work. Now you say we are talking only about CCA because Unicorn is not canon?
This Anon
>>14251120
is right about you
>>14251139
>everyone wished so hard the for psychoframe to glow so bright that they can be seen from Earth
What does that have to do with Unicorn?
That happened in CCA. They're playing by the rules Tomino wrote. If you've got an issue with that, shit some more on CCA and Tomino's schlock.
The Psychoframe incorporates thoughts and psychic energy
Almost everyone on Earth and in orbit wished for the asteroid not to hit
The Psychoframe converted those thoughts to energy and pushed it away
What's so hard about that to understand, in a show where people can already control funnels with their mind?
>>14251139
>what is this? Care Bears?
Not, its CCA
>>14251159
>I don't particularly dislike Unicorn
>I don't think the writers are stupid
I see no contradiction.
Of course,whoever came up with the Seed tier cheesy cliche ending probably wouldn't care for giving reasonable scientific-sounding explanations.I can understand this and thus I decide to not look into in any more than that.
>>14251172
I did not say that Unicorn is not canon.I actually
don't give a a fuck about canon.I like Tomino's writing.I don't like Unicorn's writing but I don't hate Unicorn.
>>14251173
I guess I just don't like the term "wish" because it doesn't sound very scientific but what I'm actually arguing about is that the green pixie dust is just a waste product and does nothing other than look pretty and create dramatic effect and I can't understand why you care about it so much.
Why do you people always obsess over insignificant detailsI understand the hypocrisylike and can't deduce basic things about the story and characters.
>>14251263
>I can't understand why you care about it so much.
What the fuck
You're the retard complaining about the "green pixie dust".
>>14251263
>why do you obsess over insignificant details and can't deduce basic things about the story and characters
Says the guy who denied any explanation of a significant plot device because he doesn't like the green pixie dust
>>14249800
Yes, that would ruin the entire point. It's not a fairy tale. This shit is real. Their conflict fucked lots of shit up and Char went far beyond the point of no return, there's no fucking coming to terms here
>>14251273
What?There is a retard other than me that complains about it?
I don't hate the pixie dust itself.I actually think it looks pretty cool.As it is supposed to.I just hate the implication that you guys are autistic enough to think that it or the magical T or any other purely metaphorical elements of the story actually have any material effect because you can only see the things but not the meaning.
You see,nothing personal.Most of you are probably all right.It just triggers me.I guess it's my fault for posting on /m/.
>>14251263
>I don't particularly dislike Unicorn
>Seed tier cheesy cliche ending
>Don't obsess over insignificant detail
>I don't like the term "wish" because it doesn't sound scientific
Wow anon
>>14251307
You're right anon. You are too deep for us to understand. We only see, but you understand.
>are you a newtype?
In what way was Char and Amuro's duel inconclusive? Amuro beat Char in their fight, successfully prevented him from escaping, foiled his plan to drop axis, and even his trust in people won out over Char's hatred when Char's own forces tried to prevent the drop.
That sounds pretty damn conclusive to me.
>>14251307
For me personally, the newtype ghosts scenes are metaphorical. The psychoframe part? That shit is literally used as a mbile suit part. How is that metaphorical?
>>14251118
Not really, Amuro was the less obsessed of the pair, but he'd still spent years hunting Char on the assumption he'd do something bad left alone. He was right, but he still spent that time hunting.
>>14251308
I just don't like it's simplistic stock message and cardboard characters but it's solid and well produced.
>>14251320
No.The psycho-frame is justified.
Are you talking about the magic T.
You know the scene at the end with the magic T flying around.I've heard all sorts of crap about it about it like "So Amuro's spirit must be in it" etc. etc.
Like it is actually supposed to "do" something.It's just a part of the psycho-frame.The psycho-frame that enable human to save earth.It proves that people are not bad.And that's a good thing.Why does it have to "do" anything.
Why does pixie dust have to "do" anything.
You see.It's just artistic expression.
>>14251173
I find it hard to understand simply because the ending implies that a good chunk of people on Earth didn't even know that Axis was about to hit and had no idea what was happening. Additionally a lot of Spacenoids sympathised with Char and wanted him to do it. Which is why his rallies were full of people and the EF was afraid to act. The film states that it's because they're afraid of a Spacenoid uprising to support Char - which happens despite their lack of action, because Spacenoids attack one of their bases in the film.
If all that's true, how could they light be the wish of all (or most) of humanity? I prefer to think it's just the wish of the soldiers gathered at the site of the battle and that Full Frontal was simply wrong in Unicorn.
>>14251341
To be honest, I don't get the magic T as well. However, no one is mentioning the magic T so far, only psychoframes as a mobile suit part.
>>14251341
I think the green light was the light if the human heart that Amuro spoke of wanting to show people and it doesn't have to be or do more than that. He got his wish and, as typical for UC, most people didn't know or understand what it was they were looking at. It falling line with Tomino's thinking during that period of his life in my opinion as well as gives some poetic justice to Amuro, that he got what he wanted, but no-one understood or remembered.
>>14251360
"I" did mention the magic T.It doesn't bother me at all since its just a metaphor.It bothers me that people think it has any special meaning other than that.
>>14251365
Which is also metaphorical.If you wish you could say it was also supposed to show the light in the human heart to the audience.
But it's not actually magical.
>>14251352
> just the wish of the soldiers gathered at the site
That is pretty much it because anything else would be impossible and I tend to get triggered when anyone suggests otherwise.
>>14251381
You should put a space after each period and a ? at the end of questions, even rhetorical questions.
>>14251394
Thanks,teacher.I'll keep in in mind when I hand in my next homework.
>>14251381
So you get triggered by glowing robots and other people's interpretation of a story?
>>14251409
No.I don't get triggered by glowing robots.
But I do get triggered by other people's interpretation of a story when it's wrong.
>>14251404
Or when you post on an English imageboard. It's fine if you didn't know but willful ignorance is pathetic.
>>14251426
What a fucking pretentious elitist
>>14249758
Nah he is in school trying to get his doctorate.
>>14251130
>>14251158
If anything, it is Sayla who doesn't give a fuck about Char.
>>14253610
Sayla is too busy trying to seduce younger girls.
>>14249800
One of my favorite aspects of Zeta, CCA & Unicorn newtypes: even if you can fully understand each other doesn't mean you'll get along.
>>14251341
>Why does pixie dust have to "do" anything.
Because... it does? Because that's the effect created by the resonating psycho frames absorbing people's emotions and thoughts? It's like the effect behind funnels kicked up to eleven.
And you're saying that is if the anons are making it all up, when that's literally the explanation that's given. You're free to think that explanation is silly or whatever, but it's right there, the evidence has been posted.
Things in a story can serve as part of a metaphor AS WELL as the physical mechanics of the universe the story takes place in.
Is CCA better on the second viewing? I watched it like a decade ago after going through MSG & Zeta and thought it was pretty lackluster. Recently I've rewatched Zeta and am going through the recently released ZZ BD's. Should I give it another try afterwards?
>>14253891
Yes.
Actually I think most UC stuff gets better the second viewing, once you know what happens and can pay more attention to detail.
>>14249705
Reposting.
>>14253960
If only the execution wasn't so problematic.
>>14251094
>>14251121
It's fairly simple. The psycoframe lets one manifest psycowaves into energy on a mass scale. Nu and Sazabi only had it in the cockpits, and between the two they pushed Axis away. Unicorn and Banshee have it through the entire body, so they can do vastly more. Neo Zeong had a fuckton of it including a giant freaking ring of it, even more powerful still.
The thing of it is that that level of concentrated energy is basically ripping the fabric of space and reality. Neo Zeong makes Unicorn/Banshee's weapons explode not by some fancy system but merely by Full Frontal wishing it, and the ring making it into reality. ( Which makes more sense from the old 'minovsky is a friendly medium for psycowaves' thing - the intensity of the psycowaves on those items just overloaded the particles inside. )
So when Unicorn overloads its frame and becomes the 'giant of light', it's basically a giant god-machine reality-bending engine. That's why it can just will away the energy (which is again all minovsky) of General Revil's suit corps with a flick of its hand.
>>14254176
But the colony laser is LASER. Minovsky partices shenanigan doesn't block laser. They really could have changed the ending to make the Unicorns push Idustrial 7 away or something for lolhomage.
>>14249705
>Was it the Nu Gundam's psycho-frame overheating because of Amuro, Char, and the soldiers that came to push axis, or was it because of the will of humanity or some shit like that?
The Nu and flying T's psychoframes resonated and created a massive psychofield.
Psychofields grant wishes, and the will of everyone present was for Earth to be saved, and so the psychofield pulled Axis away from Earth. The overwhelming psycho power also made Char and Amuro ascend to true newtypes (purely spiritual beings with no physical form, Lalah is already one), which is why their recovered cockpits were empty.
>>14254409
This is the current official canon according to Unicorn by the way (inb4 trolls going hurrrr suggesting unicorn is canon)
Check out TE spoiler guy's Unicorn interview pastebin for more specifics.
>>14251094
Yes, in the Great Mechanics interview.
They grant wishes.
That's literally it.
They're basically more powerful Lambda Drivers.
>>14251139
>I mean,what is this?Care Bears or something?
Actually it's Ideon. Because the psychoframe is Ideonite.
Fukui said so.
>>14249758
I could have sworn he got better at the end of ZZ.
>>14254427
>>14254418
>Great Mechanics interview
>canon
Only what is depicted is canon. Amuro and Char has always been MIA even when Tomino said they are deadZeta ANT is the true canon. CCA never happened
>>14254460
the fuck? word of creator talking about his own creation has no power?
>>14254460
Unicorn novels and OVA side materials confirm the empty cockpits. The true newtype forms are SEEN IN THE FINAL EPISODE.
>>14254471
Unicorn is also not canon.
>>14249705
Read this.
http://pastebin.com/eT7jMp7N
>>14254471
>Unicorn novels
Bullshit. The novel literally ended with Angelo hugging Frontal's corpse.
>>14254548
What the fuck are you even arguing with?
Full Frontal was made from copying Char's psyche from the recovered EMPTY Sazabi cockpit in the novels.
>>14254474
Will this meme ever end?
>>14249705
So it's pretty much confirmed in the the Unicorn OVA and Beltorchika's Children that Amuro and Char died at the end of CCA. But how?
>>14254632
So then they're not really dead? Just transcended onto a new plain of existance?
>>14254637
It's not even a different plane, it's a physical area. Remember when Char talked about Lalah floating around near Jupiter or something in CCA? It was literal.
>>14254409
So... small scale Instrumentality?
>>14254505
>Fukui has no idea how the moonlight butterfly works, says Tomino probably doesn't either
It's funny because it's probably true.
>>14254816
It is supposed to be extremely advanced alien/space exploring newtype tech. The point is that neither we nor the show's characters know how the fuck that shit works.
>>14254816
It's not even something Tomino made up, Fukui is just daft.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grey_goo
>>14255031
That's not actually an explanation of how it works, it's just the phenomenon on which it's based. It still doesn't explain how it eats explosions or allows flight or causes ion storms or what have you.
>>14249800
BEYOND THE TIME
>>14249780
he can finally move but still mentally ill
>>14249765
am i the only one who likes this kind of shit. i'm not even spiritual in real life but in fiction i love that shit
>>14250665
Yeah
>>14250182
i never understood the character denzel really
>>14254474
Neither is Zeta
