/k/ is discussing military conscription
>>30009635
Is it the only hope EU has for defending itself against the upcoming russian expansion?
European states with conscription: Denmark, Finland, Estonia, Lithuania, Switzerland, Austria, Greece, Belarus, Moldavia, (Norway, Ukraine)
>inb4 muh NATO
All it takes for the inevitable NATO collapse is for russia to pull a crimea on latvia or lithuania and the US would be too scared of putin to act on it
>>59668042
>cuckscription
its a joke here, can see it abolished with next president elected
Soldiers who only go under conscription stand no chance against actual proffessional soldiers
>>59668158
Why is it considered a joke?
Inproper funding?
Lack of motivation?
Lack of national pride?
>>59668268
Perhaps, but there is strenght in numbers. Two conscripts may very well stand a chance against one proffesional.
Maybe the best is a combination? Getting the expertise of proffesionals while maintaining a large number of reserves for war?
>>59668042
Conscription is extremly costly and useless in today's world, where you don't need to wage huge, conventionnal wars.
We have to fight muslims in fucking hills, you need small, professionnal militaries if you intervene abroad.
>>59668285
>Why is it considered a joke?
>Inproper funding?
It's viewed as corrupt, most of the money funneled into the pockets of the people in charge
>Lack of motivation?
training is basically running in the woods, we have little to nothing to operate
>Lack of national pride?
There were few conscripts deaths recently due to the fault of medical staff and officers.
We are all sick of governments fear mongering, I think it's going to backfire and we are getting more pro Russian as a people due to this.
>>59668417
You dont have to fight muslims in hills, you just want to
We're discussing national defence not killing muslims for show
>>59668042
>on latvia or lithuania
regardless of your army no one's going to start a war over the baltics
>>59668485
Seems like a bigger problem than just the conscription itself.
But wouldn't consctiption help build a stronger sense of belonging to the country, hence diminshing pro-russians?
>>59668601
That's exactly the point, once russia takes control over a baltic nation and no one bothers to help, NATO is fucked.
>>59668797
the point is no matter how strong your army is, no one cares about the baltics enough to fight over them
>>59668042
i don't know why the fuck we need conscripts
we haven't been in a war for like 100 years
>>59669226
Russia does.
They have historical ties, they contain a large russian population, they give easier access to the atlantic. Russia gave enough of a shit about crimea to literary invade it with armed combatants, they will have no problem doing the same with a balt.
And you are aware the baltics are all NATO members right? Your country has agreed to defend them using your own military power if they get invaded. Once you inevitably realise they're not worth it NATO fails.
>>59669479
Yes. Only Russia actually cares. That's the entire point. What don't you understand about this?
>>59669593
>Your country has agreed to defend them using your own military power if they get invaded. Once you inevitably realise they're not worth it NATO fails.
do you read posts before you reply?
>>59669630
Yes. Do you?
>>59669709
Did you actually have something to say or are you just dumping reaction images?
>>59668042
>upcoming russian expansion
>>59669754
I'm content.
>>59669754
Do you support military service in Sweden?
In your case, it make sense because of russians and muh aerial attack simulation in Stockholm...
But in other countries like Chile, Brazil, Bolivia, fucking Guatemala... Is a waste of money...
>>59669911
>Civil war in Ukraine
Of course lil' bear will partake of this, it's right in their frontier.
If you wanna get technical their intervention and annexation of crimea were legal under international law.
We're stil very far away from the point where they are able to invade europe again.
>>59668042
>All it takes for the inevitable NATO collapse is for russia to pull a crimea on latvia or lithuania and the US would be too scared of putin to act on it
NATO was literally created to assfuck russia if they pull bullshit with any member.
It's the other way around, Putin would be too scared to touch any NATO member.
Anyways, i do think it's a nice initiative to arm yourselves instead of depending in the yanks, perfidious albions or krauts, so suit yourselves
>>59669963
Yes I do, and a surprisingly large ammount of swedes do. It's just that everything in politics gets kinda overshadowed by the immigration crisis right now.
I think conscription would be most effective in europe but could still be useful in other countries.
It wouldn't have to cost a lot of money, it's more about putting the population in the right mind and unifying its population while creating a stronger sense of national belonging rather than spending lots of money on fancy weapons like the US.
Although the US is not a good case for consciption since their army is pretty well balanced.
>>59670228
>Civil war
The "Civil war" was very obviously started and fueled by russia. You know the "rebels" in crimea where shooting blanks right?
Its a straight up war between russia and ukraine, and everyone ignores it.
The thing is, the west doesn't want to call it a war so that they can justify not helping, and russia doesn't want to either for obvious reasons.
>>59669911
>Pro-Russian always equals Russian
No
>>59670404
>The "Civil war" was very obviously started and fueled by russia
>>59670442
Pro-Russian = going to get taken over by actual Russians once the fighting calms down
>>59670484
I really can't prove it, but to me it makes the most sense.
Then again you really can't prove the opposite either.
>>59670404
That's just the way everything works. USA, EU and Russia all have blood in their hands. Everyone is financing and fighting for the side that favors their national interests.
That's the way it has always been.
That's one of the reasons i think russia won't dare touch europe, at least not in the next decade or so. Getting into a war you can't win works against any interest you could have.
They have a low fertility rate, they are poor, and more than half of their territory it's just an unused wasteland (hence they were literally giving free land in siberia) to be annexing more territories all willy nilly.
Imo it's pretty shitty to force people waste a year of their lives playing boyscout.
If someone doesn't want to put his life on the line he's going to be a godawful soldier and a waste of supplies, better just have a smaller, properly equiped army with people who actually like being shot at. And if a country is having trouble meeting meanshiled quotas then forcing people to do it is not going to make the job any more popular.
>>59670724
They're crazy about clay, that's the reason they got siberia in the first place. They take every chance they get to expand (crimea, kazakhstan, afghanistan)
>>59670846
This chilebro knows his shit.
We have here mandatory conscription unless you are disabled or study and graduate from university.
Our military is fucking full of dumb and undisciplined rednecks. Every time there's some bullshit happening there, and if you see videos of their activities you see they don't even know what they're doing.
>>59670912
>crimea
I told you, it was legal under international law.
>kazakhstan
Huh? I know they have the eurasian economic union going, but it's not that different from your own EU.
>afghanistan
Do you mean the stuff in the 80s?
The USSR died a couple of decades ago, you know.
>>59671029
>The USSR died
I think this is your main problem
Yeah I don't know how it's elsewhere but here conscription is just lip service to the army, nothing at all will happen if you skip it, unless you want to be a cop for which it is a requisite, and it's not real boot camp, first of all it's only half day on saturdays, mostly marching and exercising and you never fire a gun or even wear a military uniform, in fact sometimes there's no marching at all and you do community service instead.
>>59671105
What, do you think they're still commies too?
>>59671462
nop, but the russian aggresion never dies, it just sleeps
>>59670717
Haha the PM and Government in February 2014 during Euromaidan was pro-Russian. He himself struggled with speaking Ukrainian.
Why would Russia start the civil war that overthrew him, destroyed the pro-Russian party's credibility, and led to a massive economic recession in Ukraine/Russia?
That's my proof.
>>59668042
>Ukraine
For some reason I doubt that they still have such plans... Or are we talking about Russia taking over Ukraine and abolishing their military?
>>59668042
>ukraine
no such state
