The other day, we had an argument over what constitutes a "Western" country.
I think this is fair and should satisfy all concerned, don't you?
Didn't we agree that Latin America was it's own thing and that having two distinct poles is stupid?
Slovakia is not western country
Not so sure about Central America
>>59164687
The Southern Cone should count as Western since most of the populace are descended from Southern Europeans and there's little Indian influence in the culture. Peru and Bolivia are mostly Indian, so they don't count as "Western" at all.
>>59164761
Why is the Most developed country in South America grey?
>>59164761
chileans are mostly mestizos
>>59164949
Even with invisible sage, I can still easily tell that...
>Poland
>>59164628
I thought capitalism was a requisite for being "west". I don't think Russia, Cuba and Venezuela consider themselves "west".
I think your map represents better the historic term "Christendom", even if many of the countries are mostly atheist/agnostic, they are "culturally Christian".
Why are the Balkan countries not dark blue?
>>59165320
You realize this is 2016, not 1965, right? Socialism died a quarter of a century ago.
>>59164628
This map is 100% accurate.
>>59165320
Western means your country was primarily shaped by the Christian religion, classical Greek philosophy, the Renaissance, and Enlightenment.
>>59165325
The problem with those countries is that they were busy choking on Turk dick during the Renaissance and other important events that shaped European civilization.
third world category is better than being in same as koreafuckeater
>>59165392
Yes, but the term "west" is itself a relique from the Cold War.
>>59165505
Wouldn't it be stupid to put Greece as dark blue? I mean...
First world and 2nd/third world stopped being useful names ages ago.
Westernization=/=modernisation but idiots conflate the first being a requirement for the latter
>>59165297
2nd this
I wasn't here, did we make it to the western world yet?
>>59165583
All countries that you'd actually want to live in are in the US sphere of influence.
>>59165564
You mean, Greece is one of the pillars of the west Civilization? You mean we shouldn' exist without them? So you're right.
>>59165508
>>59164837
Fixed up Europe for you.
Would Rwanda be western if it modernized to around SK levels in 15 years?
To be honest, I wasn't sure about Colombia and Venezuela but I never heard of them having any significant Indian influence (were there any Indians there except ooga boogas?)
>still including south africa
let it go lad.
What makes Mexico partially western country?? They are the same shit as Centro America.
And what makes Colombia, Brazil and Venezuela western countries?? I can't with this map
>>59165905
In 20 years when the last helicopter leaves Pretoria ala the Fall of Saigon as a horde of ravenous AIDS-infected monkeys are descending on the place.
>>59165713
Fixed again.
>>59165713
How is Greece not fully Western, though? They literally founded fundamental Western thought/society.
>>59165947
Brazil really doesn't have much Indian cultural influence, does it? The only Indians they have are ooga boogas out in the Amazon.
>>59165954
Croatia and Slovenia weren't raped by Turks or Russians and they participated in all the major European events such as the Renaissance.
>>59165998
"You won't achive cultural victory without guns big enough"
modern Polish proverb by myself
>>59165998
The same for Centro America... Our biggest year holidays are not native American influenced but European influenced (Catholicism). The only native American things that we partially conserve is some traditional food but other than that, well, nothing sadly.
>>59165996
I am not taking into account history, just actual situation.
Go into Copenhagen or London, and then go to Athens.
After that transition, you will understand that you cant really bag Greece together with Denmark or UK.
>>59166043
how is that relevant
Fix'd
>>59166108
Isn't Guatemala Indian as hell?
>>59166108
Then again, one of Mexico's biggest holidays is an Indian one. On the other hand, Indians aren't the dominant culture there like in Bolivia, they're the poorest class of a country where your social standing is mainly determined by your whiteness.
>>59166262
For all I know it's holding its spot among 3 top worlds countries by homicide rate for decades, along with San Salvador and Honduras. I'm 90% positive it's true
>>59166214
>>59165954
>>59165713
>uruguay
>different than argentina
?
OP's map is correct, although northern brazil could be changed to light blue and the mestizo parts of argentina (I don't know where they are) could too.
People on /int/ forget that "western" doesn't mean white. The founders of western civilization are the greeks, one of the darkest (if not the darkest) peoples in Europe.
I'm pretty sure the only Europeans who lived in Central America were colonial administrators since those places were used for little more than resource extraction.
>>59166262
Ok maybe they conserve a lot more their Native American traditions but the rest of Centro America is pretty cucked by Spanish influences.
>>59165519
Not really. It derives from the western civilization, which is based upon greek/roman values
>>59165564
Is this the level of american education?
>>59166437
>OP's map is correct
If he changes South Africa and Sweden to non Western/non white shithole.
>>59166451
hai, how many people did you kill this month?
>>59166390
CCC- vs BBB-. Would you put Uruguay in the grey?
>>59166334
>one of Mexico's biggest holidays is an Indian one
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/All_Saints%27_Day
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/All_Souls%27_Day
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Day_of_the_Dead
Next thing you are going to tell me that la Virgen de Guadalupe is amerindian.
>>59166506
South Africa as light blue is correct though. Sweden is on its way to becoming non-western really fast, but I guess they still count as blue.
The only parts I can be sure about is that north/northeast of Brazil should be light blue (especially Bahia, which has a strong nigger culture)
>>59166508
>>59166484
>Not really. It derives from the western civilization, which is based upon greek/roman values
Take for example Russia. They weren't really influenced by European culture or even considered part of Europe at all before the 18th century and then it was mostly the upper class, also there's a good deal of Asiatic culture there.
How the fuck is South America western?
Especially Brazil?
>american
Oh i see.
>>59164628
>South Africa
hahaha what
>>59166334
>Then again, one of Mexico's biggest holidays is an Indian one.
If you're talking about DÃa de Muertos it also resembles the Spanish DÃa de Todos los Santos.
(although it has a heavy indian influence)
>>59166605
You posting toilet make me think that I've hit the soft spot.
So, dunno, sorries?
>>59166574
Mexico has a fucked-up mix of Catholicism and indigenous religious beliefs, so...meh.
>>59166663
Which is exactly why we should be light blue. But it is by no means, amerindian.
It was the way Spaniards cucked amerindians out of their culture.
t. Non WE WUZ, non muh Spainard blood, Mexican
>>59166619
Novgorod and Kievan Rus were in contact and traded with Europe ostensively, that's why they're light blue I guess
>>59166643
>european language
>european religion
>roman set of laws
>almost everyone has a european ancestor, some 25-30% are almost full european
southern brazil was pretty much 99% white before internal migration in the 80's. is germany non-western because of all the immigrants you're receiving now?
Alternate solution to the Latin American question.
>>59166108
The only Western Central American country is Costa Rica which is 90 % white.
>>59166794
Like I said, Brazil doesn't have much of any Indian cultural influence or a significant native population.
Shouldn't Turkey be at least light blue?
>Venezuela and Cuba commie shitholes as western
>Paraguay not western
Paraguay is the purest capitalistic point in LA.
>>59166870
Yes, I know.
But krautbro over there is butthurt that his private club has sudacas in it.
>>59166845
There should be 2 new categories instead of light blue
>Mainly western, but significant non-western influece
>Mainly non-western, but significant western influence
Bolivia and South Africa would be part of the second group, as an example.
>>59166921
This
>>59166794
>european language
>european religion
Everyone can borrow those, look at Africa
>roman set of laws
Which are merely there for decoration
>almost everyone has a european ancestor, some 25-30% are almost full european
Ok LOL
>>59166845
I like this more. But again to me a western country is simply a developed country with hight number of educated people so to me there is no such thing as a "western Latin American country".
>>59166853
First off being a western country (by the definition of the people in this thread) is not about race.
And secondly you're delusional if you think Costa Rica is 90% white kek not even Uruguay is that white.
>>59164628
Honestly I think that all of latin america and Russia can be considered as western. There are just a lots of subvarietys of "western".
Also as of today pretty much everything should be at least light blue. Western culture is present everywhere. Even in North Korea communism is an importation from the western world that is mixed with the local culture.
>>59167038
>I like this more. But again to me a western country is simply a developed country with hight number of educated people
Eastern Europe was turned into a post-apocalyptic wasteland by the events of the 20th century (sadly) yet they should definitely count as Western countries.
>>59167038
If you don't include immigrants then yes, it is 90 %. Where do you think white people come from?
>>59167055
Russia is a confused country that's been culturally at war with itself since Peter the Great.
>>59167168
>earth
>white
>>59167014
In Brazil and the rest of Latin America (except Bolivia and Paraguay) the european language is actually used instead of some fucked up crioulo.
If you had any knowledge about South America whatsoever you'd know that the portuguese and the spanish literally cucked everyone into oblivion.
Native American men were wiped out and slave men were so tired from working 16+ hours a day they couldn't do shit, so where do all mixed people come from? Do the math.
>>59166853
>>59167186
>Native American men were wiped out and slave men were so tired from working 16+ hours a day they couldn't do shit, so where do all mixed people come from? Do the math.
The obvious exceptions being the Andean countries which are ethnically majority Indian and where Indian languages and not Spanish predominates. Bolivia is no more of a Western country than Thailand.
>>59167257
Black people and indians are better at soccer, so what?
>>59167312
Pretty surprising for being 90% white that not even one of those are.
Besides
>amerindians
>good at fooball
>>59167273
Yeah, I mentioned that.
>>59164628
>Romania
>Western
Nice meme you dip
>>59167312
Idians aren't particulary good at football, mate. Tbh neither do blacks.
>>59167133
Countries like Russia should indeed be considered western because they have contributed a lot to what we know as western Europe, but I really don't know that much about the other eastern European countries desu
>>59167168
What the hell are you talking about
>>59167448
All of the Orthodox areas got ass-raped by Mongols and Turks, so they missed out on the Renaissance and a couple other important events that shaped Europe. Romania is a slight exception since they weren't directly an Ottoman province, only a tributary. They still got torched by the Mongols a few centuries before that though.
>>59167445
In Centro America they're better than mestizos and castizos desu
>>59167257
Don take national football teams as a racial representation of the country. Ecuador´s team is like 90% african black, and thats really the case here
>>59167273
>Bolivia is no more of a Western country than Thailand
I'd say it's more like India or Africa where they got colonized by Europeans and some European influence was left behind, but the native culture was largely left intact.
This is basically fucking retarded in all regards
>>59167186
And if you had any knowledge about european countries you would know that everyone would notice a BIG difference when entering an european country and a south american one, shit like Russia/Japan are barely considered western.
Orange only regards countries western because theyre first world, SA isnt even that.
>>59167647
Non-dark blue country detected.
>>59167647
Pretty much
>>59167542
btw. any of your indians made it to the good ligue? I'm not trying to pick on you, honest question.
>>59167689
>Orange only regards countries western because theyre first world
Japan does however have a lot of Western influence, South Korea less so, and Taiwan and Singapore are very un-Western outside of HDI index.
>>59167178
Yea but it's a confusion between 2 types of western culture(direct importation of western culture from other western countries or transformation of western culture). Well except for those asians and caucasian tribes but they can be compare with the amerindians in the USA that don't have any relevant influence on the mainstream culture of the country. Anyone that thinks that asian/chinese/mongol/muslim culture had and has a huge impact on the current russian culture is dreaming.
>>59167774
I don't even know what "the good ligue" is...
>>59167178
This.
>>59167849
in my book that'd be Premier League, Primera Division, Bundesliga or Serie A. We can negotiate this, tho.
we aren't western, we're too diverse geographically and culturally for that. we have 60 different indigenous ethnicities, many isolated communities living in the countryside, etc.
for one, a lot of people only listens to local/Latin american music, never Anglo or European music.
Colombia is westernized (laws, institutions, etc) but not just "Western".
>>59165320
Russia and Venezuela are capitalist countries obviously. Cuba too, partially.
>>59167831
That was true in the days of the RE, but the Soviets elevated all ethnic minorities to equal status so that ethnic Russians are actually dying out and slowly being replaced by Tatars and churkas.
>>59167981
Nah not really the last time a Salvadoran football player was pretty well known was "el magico Gonzales" who is pretty well known in some parts of Spain (he played in Barcelona).
>>59168001
Like I said, I was not completely sure what Colombia and Venezuela should be categorized as.
While we're at it, what do you think of my definition of "white country"?
Basically, the following are NOT white traits:
>Slavs
>Celts
>Mongols
>inbred islander monkeys
>new worlders
>any country which was "OOGA BOOGA" tier for most of its history and has invented nothing other than a cheese slicer
>gypsies
>countries with a significant Muslim population
>countries which accepted over a million """""Syrian""""" """""refugees"""""
>countries which lost two world wars
>countries which are "YES"
>anything east or south of the Alps
>Latins
And of course, places such as Belgium and Luxembourg are non-countries, and therefore they by definition cannot be white countries.
This leaves us with the two following countries:
>Netherlands
>Denmark
Denmark I feel is definitely more arguable. Therefore, I think we can all agree that the Netherlands are the whitest country.
>>59168167
Now that's the great team. We had no player in this tier of team for decades (if ever).
>>59168215
Netherlands has 1 million Muslims. Sorry.
>>59168001
This is true for Brazil as well. The strongest american influence we have is cinema. The rest we consume is pretty much all locally made.
>>59168049
The last 55 years aside, Cuba is definitely a Western country as most of its population are pure-blooded Europeans and all their Indians were wiped out early on.
>>59168253
>2.3% Turks
>2.2% Moroccans
>2.1% Indonesians
Jesus fucking Christ, I didn't realize they were also like this.
Does this mean there are quite literally no white countries, except MAYBE Denmark?
>>59168293
Wha...you don't think people in Germany/Spain/France watch German movies or listen to French music?
Posting my idea from the original thread, "Sometimes seen as the West" doesn't reflect my own ideas so much as countries that I frequently see being called Western by others.
How does this work instead?
>>59168553
>Cuba
>>59168520
Much better.
>>59168553
If you're going to put Bolivia as purple, you may as well put India or other countries colonized by Europe in that category as well.
>>59168776
Meant to reply to >>59168520
>>59168553
>Cuba
>Brazil
>Chile
>Poland
>Slovakia
>Romania
>Western
Stupid American.
>>59168776
>>59168805
I'd argue that even largely indigenous nations like Bolivia and Peru still have far more Western influences than India. The differences in religion and language alone are pretty drastic, not even getting into cultural and legal systems.
>>59168520
China and Japan should be the same color. And that category should be called more what it is in OP, because every country has heavy western influences, without exception.
Hmm maybe though China should be half grey and half japan's color
>>59168553
If Argentina is a western country then we don't want to be western.
>>59169039
Poland-tier optimism, good job and may god have mercy upon you
>>59168951
Maybe it should be changed to "Heavy Western influences"? The idea I was going for is that the countries either adopted or were forced to adopt a large number parts of Western culture, like language and religion in the Philippines or broad cultural and societal changes like in Korea and Japan.
>>59168944
Perú and Bolivia have strong indigenous influence and are similar, however Perú is still a majority mestizo country like most of Latam while Bolivia is majority indian which makes it pretty unique.
And not only that but they are changing their legal system and administration to fit traditional native law.
>>59169139
>And not only that but they are changing their legal system and administration to fit traditional native law.
That's fascinating
Details?
>>59166748
>t. Non WE WUZ, non muh Spainard blood, Mexican
their should be more im a CHI and even though im a legit mestizo(purepecha)but i dont cling to the aztecs nor do i hate spain.
the aztecs and maya are gone and nobody cares about spain.
Mexicans need to be actually be proud of being Mexican
>>59169139
>And not only that but they are changing their legal system and administration to fit traditional native law.
Really? That's pretty interesting, is it like a modern attempt at de-Westernization?
F I X E D
Thing is people who say South Africa was western during it's Apartheid years was that it still had a fuck ton of Blacks and Coloureds during that time.
South Africa still has the same western based institutions it had back then.
>>59169258
This article speaks a bit about it.
http://www.dandc.eu/en/article/bolivias-pluralist-justice-system-combines-state-and-indigenous-law
Basically since Evo Morales became president there has been a push to make Bolivia more indigenous rather than spanish colonial. It changed the name of Bolivia to "Plurinational State of Bolivia" along with those legal and administrative changes.
Why is the US blue? If living with false freedom and forced to live as brainwashed slaves by neo feminists and the liberal agenda is considered Western then I suppose it is right. Fuck being Western.
>>59169424
Japan is literally western, their whole post w2 government was planned and structured by the USA
>inb4 weeb
not remotely wew
>>59169480
*post ww2
>Why is the US blue? If living with false freedom and forced to live as brainwashed slaves by neo feminists and the liberal agenda is considered Western then I suppose it is right. Fuck being Western.
>>59169531
why do you post these memes
>>59169480
I consider Hong Kong more Western than Japan since they have english subtitles in their movies. Also Japan's economy is Western but their people is not by a long run.
>>59169424
>Kuwait
>UAE
>civilized
Get lost, Ali.
>>59169587
that's true i guess, only political/economic structure is western, their traditions and culture aren't so much.
and yeah I forgot about Hong Kong, i agree t b h
>>59169439
That could be really good for it
My theory on latin america is that most of the countries have a confused national phyche. Culture plays more of a role in society than people think, even if it's totally subconscious. If Bolivians can start identifying as native it would work in reversing Spanish Casta of long ago, and then the country would just sort of get better given the national solidarity.
>>59169629
Though Japan has been influenced by American culture to a much larger extent than South Korea or Taiwan.
>>59169480
>Japan is literally western, their whole post w2 government was planned and structured by the USA
Japan kept most of her existing institutions intact after WWII. The continuity of government there was in stark contrast to Germany.
>>59169634
Keep in mind however that Bolivia is a very special case since half of its population is racially and culturally indian.
In the majority of Latam indigenous influence doesn't go beyond 10% (or for example my country where they were exterminated and has 0%) and are majority mestizo so don't really identify as indian but at least as something born from spanish and native.
>>59169686
Is it because Hollywood stars always seem to have starred in at least one Japanese commercial in their career?
>>59169599
How are they not civilized? Silly spic.
>>59164800
which is?
>>59169743
Peru and Ecuador are quite Indian though, no?
>>59164628
Western = OECD
>>59169782
>Pisslam
>Western
>>59169480
They pretty much are Western since the 1860s really.
>Ireland
>Western
>>59169686
Taiwan is mostly just the same thing as Hong Kong. South Korea...despite 70 years in the US sphere of influence, they haven't been Westernized too much, for example they don't really listen to rock music or produce pop culture that's exported to the West.
>>59169804
yea but there's definitely a reasonable amount of people that look quite european (spanish descent obv)
>>59169889
Antarctica's not that large mate
>>59169823
Mexico confirmed for western.
>>59168836
chile is literally usa but poorer, there is no culture shock if you travel from western europe or usa to Santiago, the only difference is the lack of niggers and whites
>>59169871
Did I say that they are western?
>Christianity
>Western
Why are Americans so fucking stupid?
You know, it's almost laughable how during the Gulf War, our media portrayed it as a struggle for the freedom of Kuwait against Saddam's tyranny when Kuwait is an absolute monarchy with a really quite bad human rights/personal freedom record.
>>59169804
Yes but not as Bolivia:
Bolivia:
>The ethnic distribution of Bolivia is estimated to be 30% Quechua-speaking and 25% Aymara-speaking. The largest of the approximately three dozen native groups are the Quechuas (2.5 million), Aymaras (2 million), then Chiquitano (180,000), and Guaranà (125,000). So the full Amerindian population is at 55%; the remaining 30% are mestizo (mixed Amerindian and white), and around 15% are white.[8]
Perú:
>According to the National Continuous Survey (Instituto Nacional de EstadÃstica e Informática or INEI 2006) (limitedly reliable, being a self-identification survey), 59,5% self-identified as Mestizos, 22.7% as Quechuas, 2.7% as Aymaras, 1.8% as Amazonians (Yanesha people), 1.6% as Black/Mulatto, 4.9% as White and 6.7% as Others (Chinese, Japanese, others).
Ecuador
>There are five major ethnic groups in Ecuador: mestizo, white, Afroecuadorian, Amerindian, and Montubio. Mestizos constitute more than 70% of the population.
The only country where indians are the majority is Bolivia.
>>59169945
Well maybe not the US, more like Southern Europe.
>>59169954
>OECD
the post ww2 American propaganda machine is one of the most powerful tools in the world IMO
>>59169945
>South West America and Chile now are culturally the same
>killmefam
You can't have a gdp lower than 20k and be western.
I thought that Bolivia and Paraguay are the only countries where an Indian tongue is an official language.
>>59170008
wew didnt mean to quote there
>>59170028
Mexico actually has more than 60 official languages.
>>59165739
Yes, same with Botswana.
>>59170028
In Paraguay guaranà is widely spoken along with spanish but they are overwhelmingly mestizo.
I think their indians were mostly killed in the Paraguay war.
>>59168293
American music also has a huge influence.
>>59170073
>China
>>59169895
>produce pop culture that's exported to the West.
What is K-pop?
>>59169945
[muffled Reggaeton blaring in the morning]
>>59170028
no, in Colombia we have over 100 indigenous languages and they are official in the indigenous territories.
>>59170073
Get lost, Wang.
>>59170073
>Venezuela
>>59170073
Holy fuck
Americans are only posting maps like these to le trolll xd us right? Y-You aren't that stupid right? RIGHT?
>>59170073
>china
>venezuela
what
these are two nations that have opposed western civilization for years, and definitely aren't civilized
>>59170108
I was going to say...rock/metal are huge in Brazil and the Southern Cone. Kiss played in front of 250,000 people in Rio in 1983, their all-time concert attendance record and that was pre-Internet.
>>59170162
the whole map/thread/idea is just retarded. sorry.
>>59170220
>>59170187
That's a diaspora chink, you dumb dummies.
>>59170222
colombian metal is very famous, especially its brutal death metal scene.
>>59170271
Quality>Quantity
Finland>Norway>France>Germany>Britain>everything else
>>59170271
Popularity of rock music is actually a fairly good indicator of whether you're a Western country or not; I don't think there's too many Slayer fans in Pakistan or Sudan.
>>59170369
You invented metal but haven't done anything worthwhile with it since the 80s. Continental Europe and the US completely overtook British metal.
>>59170380
Here there's a pretty long tradition of rock.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Uruguayan_rock
They usually play in Argentina tho because they get more money there.
>>59169946
>Religion central to the development of western culture for over 1500 years
>Not western
Why are Britbongs so fucking stupid?
>>59170380
There are if you count the playboy sons of the ruling dictator in those countries since they don't seriously follow Islam anyway and consume the same Western pop culture as you and me.
>>59170472
Each country has it's genre it's just that ours is dying out.
>and the US
Holy fuck American bands are fucking trash
>>59170511
He's a shitskin diaspora.
>making a map showing the UAE as "civilized"
>>59170511
>muh past
>>59164628
Honestly, the West as a concept on its own is too vague to use it as a term to clasify societies and countries.
>>59170380
Aside from Japan but of course they're strongly influenced by Western culture. Countries like South Korea and Taiwan don't have much of any rock scene and they're mostly known for girl pop groups who poorly imitate Japanese artists.
>>59170023
yes, you can
actually you did like 20 years ago
>>59169993
no, actually is california but as I said, poorer
pic related
>>59170576
>Yew disagree with me boy? u mast be a sheeeeitskin let me tell u dat
How are they not civilized?
>>59170563
>>59170472
Brits just had that initial first wave of metal bands from Ozzy's generation and then after that...nothing.
>>59164628
Bad thread
>>59170628
>Money hasn't changed one bit since the 1990s
Your dumb savage side is really coming out.
>>59170661
>what is Esoteric?
>>59170633
No country with Pisslam as the majority religion can be considered civilized.
>>59168520
Thank you.
>>59170668
>muh bantz
are all brit posters like this ?
>>59170661
I only listen to doom,black and industrial metal but I'll bite
>Who was Wodensthrone or Winterfylleth
It's just like America with doom metal.
>>59170661
Weren't Cradle of Filth British?
>>59170687
They aren't a shariah state moran do you really think that a country with biblical laws would be considered western today?
>>59170751
>I only listen to doom,black and industrial metal
me too, also, some progressive, and a lot of sludge.
>>59170727
>Money hasn't changed since the 1990s
Are all Chileanish people this moranic?
>>59170023
Our gdp per capita is around 24k tho
>>59170828
yes, as much as you are pirates
>>59170963
feels ok
>>59170796
Yup. Diaspora.
>>59170963
PPP, nominal it's 14k
>>59170222
Oh yeah, there's that. I was thinking more of pop music, like Taylor Swift, Beyonce, wtv, but people here sure go crazy for rock shows too. Paul McCartney, Rolling Stones and other classic rock acts like that may come here every month and they will be sold out every month.
>>59171976
A lot of rock acts spend more time touring in Europe and LatAm now than North America because rock has kind of died out here since 2005.
>>59171976
>>59170222
And Mexico.
I don't think South Korea should be allowed.
It's a pretty fucked up place. Shooting teachers in the street and changing history books to make it look like North Korea never invaded South Korea successfully and shit.
>>59172223
They're less than 40 years from having been a Third World dictatorship. It may take another generation or two for them to completely shake off that legacy.
>>59172223
But shooting teachers at school buildings is just fine, yup?
>>59172262
Once they shake that, then fine, but they haven't yet.
>>59172331
Government was the one shooting the teachers in South Korea, but I'm sure you guys don't understand what the difference is anyways.
>>59172369
I failed to spot that "goverment" part, my bad.
>>59172369
Porn is still illegal in SK, I think they're the only developed nation to still have legal restrictions on porn involving consenting adults, but that might change when the older generation is gone.
pls dont bully china :(
>>59164687
the values of most SA countries are western, also the basis of their fundation, liberalism, freedom etc.
Also South Cone is getting cuck'd like Europe for a reason.
In a few hundred years or so our cultures will have evolved and become distinct enough that this terminology won't matter
>>59165996
hellenic=/=greece
there is like over 1k years of disconnect in between
>>59172646
During the 19th century, Latin America went through the same political struggle as Europe of pro-clerical monarchists versus secular republicans.
>>59172741
Which varied a bit by country; Chile was the most successful at establishing a stable republican government and managed to avoid dictatorships until 1973.
>>59172862
then we had to get in the middle of two super powers. why god, why?
>>59172862
I thought Colombia didn't have any dictatorships after the 19th century.
>>59172949
Nobody avoided it since the Cold War was the first time in history where technology and communications had advanced to the point where an ideological conflict could be waged on a global scale. Whereas previous such conflicts like the Reformation were localized and nobody in China had ever heard of that shit.
>>59167312
Dude I have costa rican friends and most of them are mestizo/castizo. Your country is not 90% white, i'd say it's around 40-50% at most.
>>59173038
See Gustavo Rojas Pinilla
He did a decent job but got cucked by democracy and then M-19 happened
>>59172223
We do not care about how western we are. Is it good to be western?
>>59175199
Hi, English teacher.
>>59175598
Thank you for complimenting my engrish.
>Latin America
Why are some "Western" and others not. They basically have the same culture. CA countries are pretty much Mexico 2.0
I would consider Latin America western. They speak a western language, follow western religion, their women are treated relatively well, and many values and morals of the western world are very well implanted into their society.
Wester=/=Rich/successful
According to you, the Islamic balkan countries are western?
>>59168520
Latin American on the same category as Korea and Japan.
No dude. Latin America is western.
LatAm is more like Eastern Europe than anything.
>poor
>butthurt (in their case at the US and Britain).
>loves Germany (esp. the Southern Cone)
>>59164628
>brazil
>western
>>59164628
Colombia is not western, you idiot.
We might be backward savages but don't put us in the same bag as you.
>>59176119
>CA countries are pretty much Mexico 2.0
Not Costa Rica.
>>59176972
If we trick the world into thinking Brazil is a Western country maybe all the Mexicans, Cubans, and other beanshitters will flood into Brazil instead of here.
>>59177373
Why would we do that? Brazil and Mexico are pretty much in the same conditions.
>>59176119
Western lost all meaning. Who wants to be in a group that suddenly includes Puerto Rico, Bulgaria, and Armenia.
>>59177280
FARCfag detected.
>>59165880
I'd say we are half western
>>59177488
Armenia are Christians and speak an Indo-European language. That at least counts for something, right?
>>59170271
meh, brutal death scene is huge but the bands are shit, but the black/thrash scene in SA, especially Brazil is patrician as fuck
Christianity is an important part of Western civilization, though merely having a significant Christian population does not make you Western, else South Korea and African countries would qualify and they're certainly not Western.
Another factor might be the Roman Empire since most of European civilization derived from that, although we should also be wary with this because the RE also included parts of the Middle East and North Africa which are now Muslim and not Western at all.
On the other hand, we could also name one of the important ideas of Western civilization being limited government and separation of power. This has always been a fundamental part of Europe since antiquity, that a king was merely first among equals and should rule with the advice of his great men unlike the Asiatic notion of an all-power god king.
Latin America is one of those things that tends to cause arguments about how "Western" or "European" they are and certainly for some countries like Chile and Uruguay, there's no question that they're basically an extension of Southern Europe. Other countries and especially those with sizable native populations become slightly more hazy.
LA isn't Western because they're all brown reggaton shitholes.
/thread
The Southern Cone is mostly comprised of Spanish, German, and Italian descendants and there are very few natives there. I don't see how they don't count as "Western".
Japan is more Western than most Latin American countries but isn't considered Western because people mean white when they say Western. Plain and Simple.
LatAm is poor, but this is mostly the legacy of the Spanish colonial system; unlike North America, there were large, settled Indian populations which the Spanish mostly enslaved/intermarried with. Not many Europeans settled there except colonial administrators and their aim was resource extraction rather than settlement. The result being that a middle class didn't develop in those countries and you ended up with a small white elite whipping the Indian/meszito masses. Then post-independence brought decades of civil wars and dictatorships as oligarch families battled each other for control. Due to the lack of any industry or middle class, capitalism could not develop.
This is unlike North America where the native population was smaller, did not have large urban settlements, and which was primarily used to settle Europeans who wanted to kill the natives and take their land. Also Britain was a much more liberal country than Spain and this affected the mindset of their colonists.
>>59168049
>Russia and Venezuela are capitalist countries obviously. Cuba too, partially.
This is bait right? Russia is crony capitalism at best and kleptocracy at worst, Venezuela is full blown socialism, and Cuba is still socialist as well. Just because you have some paper money which you can use to buy crappy food from a food court doesn't make you capitalist, otherwise mercantilism would be considered capitalism as well when it is clearly not.
>>59177593
Romani is Indo-European. Urdu is Indo-European. Haitian Creole is Indo-European.
Christianity is a sandnigger religion.
>>59168049
>Venezuela
>Cuba
>Capitalist
There's a reason why Venezuela is a shit hole lad.
>>59178178
Russia is too poor and doesn't have any middle class outside certain parts of Moscow and St. Petersburg.
>>59178166
Good answer.
And we need to stop using antiquated Cold War terms like 3rd World. The definition was to say whether or not a state was aligned with the US or Soviet Union.
What strikes me in America is how little we pay attention to this region or even understand this region's history. I was barely exposed to Latin American history until I was about 16 or 17. It's no wonder we as a country are oblivious to Latin America.
>>59178166
>Japan is more Western than most Latin American countries but isn't considered Western because people mean white when they say Western. Plain and Simple.
Vat. How does Japan count as Western?
>not white
>not Indo-European language
>not Christian
>not influenced by Greco-Roman or Enlightenment ideas at all
