Do Americans seriously consider trigonometry or calculus advanced math?
>>57382550
>when it is almost completely useless in most fields besides mathematics and teaching
Someone hasn't heard of STEM fields.
These are the kind of people who want to "bring back" manufacturing jobs.
>>57382550
trigonomety and calculus does have spesific subjects that counts as advanced mathmatics
What percentage of people need calculus to perform their function in life?
This is the sort of question you ask to determine whether it's specialized academia or knowledge that a common person needs.
it's math almost all college students have to take
diff q and graph theory is usually intro specialization
>>57382550
Because that's where most people stop taking math courses in their lifetime.
>>57382788
> What percentage of people need calculus to perform their function in life?
Considering you don't need an education to breathe, eat, drink nor shit so 0%
>>57382787
No one calls it calculus when it gets advanced. It's analysis as soon as it is rigorous.
I have the feeling this is a thinly veiled STEM vs non-STEM retarded shit-flinging thread
>>57382550
Those 'Americans' also took basic trigonometry and calculus and used it to put man on the moon.
I regret not taking advanced math (calc/adv. tri) etc back in high-school.
>>57382799
Do people take algebra (I'm not talking about modern algebra) or trigonometry in college?
>>57382864
Substitute "function in life" for job autismo
>>57382936
yes because not all hs have the same standards so they have to get up to speed in their bachelors degree
you can skip calc 1 and 2 (before multiple integrals) if you get good score on your sat/act
>>57382936
Algebra is the lowest math class available at university. Everyone had to take it in high school, but they offer it for the morons who never understood it in high school.
>>57382846
Pretty much. The ones who go beyond that are those that choose to take advanced math courses in highschool. Those are the people who become scientists and engineers.
Usually, there's no motivation for a high school student to challenge themselves because their overall grade is so integral to the college they go to.
>>57383028
>get flying scores in bullshit subjects
>go to Harvard
>>57383234
your family needs to know people to get into places like that
>>57383234
People actually do that if they also get a good SAT score, except they then promptly fail out of Harvard because the workload is so strenuous.
Most high schools dont prepare people for college, because 20 years ago nobody expected them to go unlike today.
in high school you only have to take up to I think basic geometry, though I did all the way to multivariable calc
idk it's really down to what you want to do and what you're able to do, you're only limited by your own laziness (you can go to community college and take classes that give you high school credit)
>>57383234
Those people fail out of Ivy leagues and wonder why they weren't prepared for them.
>>57383374
So Murikans don't look at relevant scores like physics and mathematics in high school for physics field in university when one is applying? Isn't that kind of dumb? Wouldn't that actually help those motivated kids to study things they see as relevant instead of inflating their scores with easy bullshit courses?
>>57383014
What do you mean by algebra?
If its a typical linear algebra course that involves stuff like vector spaces, linear transformations, matrix theory etc., then it's a pretty advanced level for a high school and normal for STEM university courses.
>>57383283
that's how it was maybe like 20 years ago but not anymore
they're trying to break away from the old boys club image
>>57383506
no, he means like quadratic equation algebra
>>57383374
You went to a shit high school lmao
>>57383494
Americans don't apply to fields, but to universities.. I think their system is preferable desu.
>>57383668
In Finland you apply to a field in one particular university.
>tfw applied to 30 universities
>only got into 10 of them
>>57383717
Same here as you guys, they apply(undergraduates atleast) to universities and choose subjects once they're in a given uni. It just seems to open more choices to me, and as such would be better than what we currently have.
>>57383494
>So Murikans don't look at relevant scores like physics and mathematics in high school for physics field in university when one is applying?
Most people don't apply for physics in Uni because it's too difficult. You apply to a school and then choose what you want to major in here in the U.S.
>Isn't that kind of dumb?
It isn't fair for those who went to a shit school, but it's just how it works.
>Wouldn't that actually help those motivated kids to study things they see as relevant instead of inflating their scores with easy bullshit courses?
The ones who are motivated and want to challenge themselves are few and far between. Most of them just want to get into university In the first place and have no direction once they get there and just take whatever courses are required.
I blame the schools themselves for not actually having a focused curriculum that all students should have to take.
>>57383781
>tfw applied to one university
>Got accepted
>Got a letter from university of Pitt asking me to apply
>>57383599
I'm just saying how it is for most people. Your average college student is totally unprepared for an advanced degree.
>>57383781
>applied to 4 universities
>got into all 4
tbqhwyf, high schoolers need to take it easy with muh university shit. they put too much pressure on themselves. at the end of the day you're going to learn the same shit and not use 90% of it once you get a job.
trigonometry is the dumbest fucking shit.
Whenever it came up in school I just didn't do any of it
Fuck trigonometry
>>57383781
applied to 4 got into 1
i might have overshot myself doe
>>57384127
>at the end of the day you're going to learn the same shit and not use 90% of it once you get a job.
Non-STEM majors are truly laughable
>>57384257
it's when maths started to become interesting and not menial work as I remember it
>>57384310
i graduated with a computer science degree from a top 20 university in the world. 95% of the stuff i've done at work came from on the job learning.
>>57384257
trig identities are fun but only if your understood the concept
>applied only to the best university in country
>got in
>dropped out after 1 year
>applied again only to the best university in country
>got in
>done nearly all the required courses
>have to only write final thesis now
>no motivation whatsoever to even start working on it
>>57382550
I never took either trig or calc in high school, and I've never been to college.
I graduated high school 8 years ago, so even basic algebra is forgotten to me by now
>>57384310
>t. undergraduate STEM student
same holds true for STEM majors, most of it is learning how to learn.
>>57382550
>I dont even know what the fuck you people are talking about
>>57384475
just some math courses after geometry and algebra, apprently in europe the classes that comes after this is all taken before college as well, while this may not be true elsewhere
>>57384768
No wonder i dont remember the names of any of that useless (to me) shit.
Calculus was a separate class in my Highschool.
There was "normal" math class, and Calculus class.
Only people that took calculus were people trying to look smart or did it for college/university stuff
>>57384952
did you go to school in Ontario?
>>57384991
Manitoba
>>57384839
t. working_mans
>>57382550
Trigonometry and Calculus are objectively advanced math courses, yes. Not sure what you're trying to prove here.
>>57385086
1/6th of the total arc, this one doesn't even require math
>>57385074
Mulle on riittäny iha kertotaulu +- setit, tottahan se on että osa ei käytä/tuu ikinä käyttään nuita "kato oon iha vitun matikkapää" settei mihinkään.
Tunnen jopa tyyppejä joilla on 10 matikka mutta muuten ne on ihan vitun kehareita, että eikait siinä.
>>57383374
>fail out of Harvard because the workload is so strenuous.
Harvard is not a difficult school
People at my college took organic chemistry at Harvard over the summer because it was so much easier. Fully 1/3 of their class was from my school
>>57385466
Don't you guys grade after the normal distribution? Better students means harder courses here, becuase of this.
>>57385226
Troll or no, this is personally embarassing to me. So let me simply say it before someone else does:
>American Education
I genuinely cannot into math/problem solving. I'm great at chemistry, writing and every other subject but I've always had trouble with math. The only chapter I understood fully was the Pythagorean theorem. I got an A+ on that test but every other chapter was such a struggle for me.
>>57385086 for example. I don't even know where to start. P sure I have a learning disability.
>>57385604
It's an objective fact you fucktard.
Basic math, algebra, geometry = standard
Trig and Calculus = advanced courses
>>57385638
Just look at the drawing. How much does each wall need to cover for no airflow? Divide the rest into two doors
Yes we do.
If I recall correctly, you only need to go up to Algebra II to graduate from high school in California. Trig and calc I and II are optional, but most people from my school graduated having at least taken one year of calculus.
>>57382788
What percentage of people need the knowledge of history to perform their function in life?
Or basically any other school subject.
I don't get why people always dismiss maths as useless, but don't complain about other school subjects.
>>57385737
I thought trig was a highschool class? Calculus was the only one set aside as a college level course in my school.
>>57386297
Both were available in my school, but they weren't mandatory.
>>57385737
All right. I bear in my conscious mind that this could be a troll. However, as I am triggered, I am going to give free rein to my feelings.
FUCK YOU, YOU FUCKING IDIOT! YOU CALL ME A FUCKTARD WHEN YOU ACTUALLY BELIEVE THAT TRIG AND CALC ARE "ADVANCED MATH"? HAVE YOU EVER BEEN ANYWHERE ELSE? DO YOU READ BOOKS MOTHERFUCKER! DO YOU! DO YOU GO OUTSIDE! DO YOU STAY INSIDE AND STUDY ANYTHING, EVER!
If you learn something BEFORE you go to college (do you know what college is?), or if it is FEASIBLE for you to do so even if you anecdotally, your shitty school anecdotally, etc, DIDN'T, then it is a priori NOT an advanced subject, but you wouldn't know that because you're a stupid fucking mongoloid. Most of Europe, large swathes of Asia, and parts of the USA (i.e. THE FIRST FUCKING WORLD WHICH IS WHAT'S UNDER DISCUSSION HERE) learn elementary calculus prior to a university education, you benighted quadroon. Fuck, large swathes of the rest of the world do the same. Now, don't bother pointing out your post-secondary education if in fact you have one. Because if you DO have one and you still have this stupid wrong faggot opinion of yours, then that's not a credit to you, it is instead an indication of how badly your education has FAILED YOU that you don't KNOW ANYTHING ABOUT ANYTHING and it would be a sad vindication of the AMERICAN EDUCATION MEME. YOU STUPID FUCK.
(This has been an original piece of ranting. You are welcome to save it as a pasta :^)
For my part, I'm glad for the Americans. Mathematics was the bane of my life for so many years, that I'm now proud to be able to say that I don't even know what algebra or trigonometry is anymore. I wish I had never known in the first place.
>>57386542
YES I FUCKING TRAVEL ALL THE TIME YOU FUCKING IDIOT. AND YES I READ FUCKING BOOKS. I JUST FINISHED READING A COLLECTION OF LOVECRAFT STORIES. AND I LEARN LANGUAGES ON MY OWN, AND I READ ABOUT HISTORY ALL THE TIME. I'M JUST NOT FUCKING GOOD AT MATH AND ALSO
TRIG AND CALCULUS ARE OBJECTIVELY ADVANCED MATH COURSES, YOU SLIMEY PIECE OF FUCKING TRASH. JUST BECAUSE I DON'T UNDERSTAND THEM DOESN'T MEAN I'M NOT SMART FUCKING REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE I PROBABLY KNOW MORE ABOUT THE ISRAELI PALESTINIAN CONFLICT THAN YOU DO.
>>57386542
y u mad tho?
>>57384392
know that feel, polebro
one of the top cs unis in germany and i just cant be arsed to finish my thesis. its like 50% done or so and only 2 month till the final deadline. even got an e-mail from the dude who is watching over my thesis to send him the newest version and had to tell him that i did nothing since our last meeting.
>>57386050
The inclusion of mathematics in school curricula is often justified by the theory that it teaches one how to think, as it's the study of abstractions. However, common math pedagogy often defeats this purpose by presenting it as a bunch of formulas to be memorized and problem "types" to crunch through on standardized exams. The vast majority of students don't learn _why_ the Pythagorean theorem is true or why complex numbers aren't just an arbitrary plaything for idle minds. So it ends up being a waste of time for most.
>>57383781
>underage faggots
>>57387170
We have different settings here in Grorious Finngoria
I don't use 80% of the mathematics I learned tbqhwyl.
Statistics is far more applicable.
>>57384392
>doing my bachelor thesis
>just one exam left
feels useless though, all this work with school, when nothing in life matters anyways
>>57387127
funny, i do cs too
i can't find motivation to do thesis because i know that those hundreds of hours i would spend on it, i could spend better by actually learning to do useful stuff
but then again, i am too lazy to learn useful stuff as i treat the "i should be doing my thesis in this time" as an excuse to not do anything at all
>>57387737
you are literally me.
except i will find a new excuse once i am done with my thesis.
>>57387737
>>57387868
the same field and the same feel lads
>>57387868
>>57387974
let's not kid ourselves, we got into cs because it's has the best payout/effort ratio out of all possible career choices
especially here in poland, programmers can actually earn a western wage
i'm working as IT support doing literally nothing at work but browsing 4chan and playing games, and i still earn above average salary here
>>57387170
>teaches one how to think
This is probably the best reply in this whole thread
It teaches you how to problem solve given a set of rules and a described situation as well as to think abstractly. I don't understand what's so hard for liberal arts majors to understand about that, yet they justify their field by saying it's used in everyday life, when often it's not.
But yes, standardized testing ruins the original intention
>>57388389
liberal arts shit is used in daily life if you engage in homosex and political arguments in a leftist circlejerk daily
>>57388291
Yes, out of greed and lazyness. I regret it so much.
>>57384310
>at the end of the day you're going to learn the same shit
>Non-STEM majors are truly laughable
So I take it you've never gotten an internship or co-op, eh?
>>57388461
i always enjoyed humanities subjects more, i went CS to actually get a job
once i'm done with bachelor cs degree, i'm planning to do masters in history
should be much more fun, and can't wait for reaction of my family (literally everyone has STEM masters degree, and i was expected to do the same)
>>57387170
But people at least understand the point you're making. This is why we're seeing the introduction of the common core curriculum.
>>57388785
The same reason I went into STEM, my family all have similar degrees(from the same uni im currently attending) and I knew it was a guaranteed job. I should've studied languages and history or law.
>tfw only good jobs are in stem
>tfw shit at science technology engineering and mathematics
>>57389540
It's not an inborn talent, bud. Hit up Khan Academy and betterexplained.com to mend the damage of >American education.
>>57389283
my dad is an ex marine officer and used to be physics lecturer at military academy
my mom is a dentist who managed to go from rented doctor's office to owning own clinic
i'm a massive underachiever, who despite being top student from primary to high school, lost all motivation to do anything at all after going to uni and became bottom of the barrel student
>>57389540
The human mind wasn't designed for complex shit like equations. The people who go study STEM are mutants and oddities of nature, which is also why STEM courses are always lacking for students.
>>57389746
I am in the same position. I never needed to read, so when I got to uni and lectures were no longer mandatory, everything went to shit
Been most insightful reading, thanks guys. I'm gonna graduate as math teacher some time now.
By the way, the right way to do it is to spice it up. Study some Taoism, Buddhism, Freemasonry (Morals & Dogma by Albert Pike is good, even if his character is questionable).
All this trig and quadratics and goes back to sundials & the calendar.
>>57390108
>and lectures were no longer mandatory
i think it's one of the top reasons of my downfall
i just simply can't give a shit about anything that's not mandatory, so i never went to any lectures
i also often went with "fuck this shit, i don't care" route in the middle of semester by going on 1 week vacations on a seaside without telling anyone, despite having obligations at the uni
>>57390266
Is it true that in Finland teaching is regarded as a rather high status profession? What is required of grades to teach at primary, secondary and high school?
I am furious at Norway having this shitty educational system when we are a social democracy with a gazillion barrels of oil.
>>57382972
For people who make 100k+ only
McDonalds workers need not apply
>>57390845
Being a teacher really isn't that prestigious, and the pay really isn't that great either. I guess it's an okayish job though.
You need to have a masters to teach at middle school level, though afaik the math masters for instance are more like minors in math.
>>57390272
Have you read Lockhart's Lament? It would be cool to have some more exploratory math before university.
>>57390845
There's many dimensions to status. Not much money in teaching.
It's a German sort of vibe, passing the torch from Medieval monastic schools. A religious kind of respect for self-sacrifice for a noble cause. We'll see how that fares in the future...
>>57382550
For high school? Yes. Calculus is usually the last math subject taught in American high schools before graduation, to the point that many less proficient students never make it.
The idea behind the anti-calc movement is that most schools teach barebones/low level versions of every subject that are useful in a wide variety of scenarios, except for math which is given dedicated advanced study despite limited use.
It's a bullshit argument, but it's not entirely baseless, and it definitely isn't deriving from "math is hard" memes like this picture represents.
>>57391168
Yeah, I read it some time in the past.
It's good to have noble ideas about teaching free thinking, but how can you have a stable society with that? A big function of school is to churn out wagecucks.
Calculus is pretty hard desu. My calc professor was from Russia and he was very strict.
>>57382663
>Someone hasn't heard of STEM fields.
No, I'm pretty sure everyone's heard of memes before.
>>57382550
I never ever studied Calculus in my life. I don't even know what the FUCK it is.
In my province you can avoid it if you don't go into Natural sciences.
>>57391994
it's really goofy math. it's all about lines and curves and trends.
Because we don't have a standard education system. Calculus wasn't even an option at my high school, I took "pre-calculus" which is just algebra and trig
>>57391994
Basically it's about change
is there any math advanced enough to solve ma girlfriend
>>57392324
Yes, but the only book about it is between my legs.
>>57392324
*"me a" not "ma"
>>57391672
>My calc professor was from Russia and he was very strict.
Had a russian professor of theory of signals subject, he really brought some top tier polish russian banters. One of the funniest and most informative classes I ever attended.
>>57391035
There are several hundreds of fields of work in between, retard.
>>57390273
Same here. Flunked out of uni for the same reason.
>>57392914
>Same here.
Did you also take 1 week vacations at the seaside?
I'm in my first year of college for music technology and game design. I'm taking Calculus I and a bunch of gen eds, finding motivation to keep doing my work gets harder every day. I think that will change when I actually start taking classes for my major though.
In my high school, everyone took pre-calculus and if they're not smart, they went to statistics, and if they were, they went to calculus. If you passed the standardized test at the end of the calculus course, you don't have to take it in college. I went to a pre-professional art school though, so maybe it just depends on the environment whether calculus and above is considered "advanced" math or not.
