What is wrong with the Eurozone?
Is there a way to fix it?
remove east and south europe
Remove kebab
make eastern europe our slaves
attack china
trick america
colonize other planets
build a galaxy spanning universe
no, currency is supposed to reflect how an economy works not multiple ones with different laws and culture
Germany playing monopoly
PIIGS playing hide and seek
France too busy itself to care
Other countries being unheared
>>56144830
Fuck off, we're contributing much more than your shitty weed country
It expanded way too fucking fast.
It should had been Germany, Denmark and BENELUX only. That would have made it an awesome currency to remove USD.
1 everything
2 remove it
>>56145481
You forgot the Baltics
>trying fundamentally different economies to the same currency & monetary policy
Bad enough, but then not following through with centralised fiscal policy and associated transfers.
Net-exporting Northern European EMU-states have benefitied considerably, at the expense of peripheral net-importers.
The eternal Germanic strikes again.
>>56144830
>>56144902
>>56144984
>>56145250
Memes
>>56144955
Indeed the EZ is not an optimal currency zone.
It's lacking mobility of workers across countries and more regional transfers to absorb asymmetric shocks.
On the mobility it's a long term issue. The main brake is the difference of languages and culture, if Spain is going through a slowdown it's hard for a Spaniard to move to more dynamic Estonia or Poland, much harder than from a guy from Michigan to move to texas for example. There are some.stuff like the bologna process to harmonize diplomas and recognize them across Europe but it's only the first step. There needs to be emphasis on languages learning across all Europe and this will take time.
Also fucking up schengen would be the death of the Euro, it cannot survive without mobility of goods and people.
Also, in order to limit the importance of asymetric shocks, transfers need to be much bigger. Ideally the scale to determine that would be small, like region or provinces to avoid fueling nationalistic rethoric with givers and receivers.
Probably impossible politically for years to come, Germans and French will never agree to subsidize unemployment benefits in Poland or poortugal.
Also tax and benefits harmonization would help, also very hard to pass politically today.
In the end the EZ needs more Democratic representation and transparency urgently. A directly elected proportional assembly seems essential to help people feel represented and heard. Without it none of the needed measures will ever be accepted.
>>56145481
That would have turned into an even more expensive nordic-mark, killing any competitive advantage in Germany and any chance of exports from NDL or DK
>>56144830
>>56144767
remove everybody
>>56144767
Europeans
No
>>56145804
the Eurozone or the EU is pretty much a wreck. They pay every country huge bunch of credits to keep them alive. Foremost Poland, even more than greece as for now. As if they had some sort of economical crisis, but they played it down. Also, they are pretty much dead in terms of making decisions. They failed horribly in foreign relations aswell as in terms of refugees. Every country is doing it's own thing now, but the EU parliament still gets payed it's super big loans. It's a bunch of useless liberal bureaucrats who force stupid laws, like the bending of fucking bananas. It needs to go.
>>56145904
it's bullshit. The Mark was more competetive than the Euro now
>>56144767
>What is wrong with the Eurozone?
The same currencie being shared by different countries with different wealth and different economies.
I don't know why euro happened.
>>56144902
>Remove kebab
>make eastern europe our slaves
>attack china
well, wish you luck on that
And
>trick america
>colonize other planets
>build a galaxy spanning universe
More like things you literally could achieve
Baby boomer generation.
The real problem is the aging population. As the proportion of pensioners grown and the proportion of the working population decreases, there will not be enough wealth to pay pensions. The welfare state will be reformed. And it is the values and norms that underpin the welfare state that constitute the 'European way of life'.
Europe can be fixed by exterminating the Baby boomers. The best would be to make them work until they die.
Or increase immigration. But then you get the problem of social exclusion. The current population must welcome immigrants and get them comfortable and working asap. When the current population exclude immigrants from society (racism, marginalization, inequality) then immigrants don't get into work fast enough and they put more pressure on the welfare state.
>>56147036
>The real problem is the aging population. As the proportion of pensioners grown and the proportion of the working population decreases, there will not be enough wealth to pay pensions
Why? That's not a problem of the EU. There wouldn't be any problems, if you turn everything to private pensions.
>>56146571
EZ =\= European union
Also the EP doesn't receive any big loans?
I do agree that the union is a political mess right now and that Poland has been the major recipient of European funds in the latest years while showing little to no will to do anything to help.
I am slightly more optimist (or less pessimist to be more correct) after Merkel accepted to shut down the rapefugees influx and turn them back to turkey.
European norms will always exist even if the EU is dismantled, or it will be the US or Chinese technocrats that dictate us the bending of our bananas btw
what's wrong with eurozone? Europeans.
Is it fixable? Eu shouldn't exist so the answer is no.
>>56147462
It wont happen, because Merkel looses power, due to her mistakes. The euro sceptics get more power (AfD with 14% in latest elections) and the EU will burst most likely. Not that if it's a bad thing.
>>56147120
The changing demographics of Europe is a fact. Aging population means the median age of the population is rising.
F.ex. the population of Germany (and Finland) is declining due to low birth rates. This means that soon there will be significantly fewer people working and paying taxes then there are people who are retired and old and sick. Lots of old sick people are expensive.
>>56147939
All poor countries will most likely end up like Belarus or Ukraine after the fall sovjet union. Now you scream to abolish the EU, but in the end you will suffer without help.
>>56148292
If you have less people, you need to pay them less too. The only problem is the intergeneration contract. You have to get rid of it. Our country tries to get away from it more and more.
>>56148460
>intergeneration contract.
Good we agree on the problem then. Soon, the fewer young working people have the burden to support more retired and sick old people.
But, since the older population is selfish and politically powerful, rather than reducing the cost of social security, they will reduce the social security for the younger people (you and me) by reducing our health and education and unemployment protection. So we will not have the same protections in our lives that the baby boomers enjoyed in their lives... unless we get rid of them or get more workers.
>>56146765
>>56146765
You have little or no understanding of how currency work do you?
If you had a currency covering Denmark Benelux and Germany, as the anon to who I was responding suggested, it would mechanically be much higher than the remaining currencies in Europe (franc, pesetas,lira etc).
As well as the mark would automatically appreciate against any other currencies in Europe if the euro were to disappear.
What change ratio the mark had with USD back in 1999 has little to do with that.
It's just that German economy is stronger that its neighbours and people know that. This strength is part of what makes the euro strong (or maintain it around the USD level currently).
To grossly oversimplify imagine that the current level of the Eur is the ponderated average of what markets think each currency of Europe would be. Germany is above this average and drags it up while the pesetas drags it down for example.
>>56144767
It was a shit idea. Different economies, different demands and no fiscal union.
>>56144767
Good idea that was applied too soon.
Was introduced into some countries with too unstable an economy when waiting for the situation to get better would have been profitable for both the already existing eurozone and the country entering it.
>>56147992
What won't happen?
EU being dismantled would mean recession and years of economic woes. And that's pretty clear for everybody across the economic specter.
What we need is strong reform or maybe even an overhaul of the whole institution but coming back to closed individual states with different currencies and borders would be an economic disaster.
>>56149119
If you invest into other countries or expand you keep it low. It still is possible as in the Eurozone right now. It worked before the 1st world war and worked with the DM. (The DM was worth less than the Euro) China, Japan and Switzerland do the exact same thing and keeps you flexible and independent.
>>56144767
of course, dispose the fucking muslims
>>56149036
>>56149036
This guys speaks the truth.
Ageing demographics means lesser young working people for more old crippled retired.
Obviously the repartition system today can only work with a certain ratio of active/retired. If we go down below certain threshold we are fucked.
So two solutions are possible: importing labour through immigration, or starting to breed much faster. Because every generation needs to be larger than the previous so perpetual growth of population.
I'm in favour of the second option of course so strong natalist policies.
Private pensions wouldn't solve anything BTW, it'll just make current active people even poorer.
The fact that the old are conservatives, hold more power and are willing to cling to it fucks us hard in the ass. We need reform before they are too many or we are doomed lik in Japan.
>>56145481
>the western shitheads still don't realise how much they export to the east
>they think their countries so benevolent they "saved" eastern europe by taking them in
not to mention whole of europe is standing on its feet due to american rebuilding in the first place
And they, who actually did take from themselves to help you, do not cry about it like you cocksucking benders do
>>56149493
What?
China grossly manipulate its currency with illegal tools to maintain it low artificially. CHF has been strongly appreciating for ten years and is the perfect example of what I am describing.
Japan is in an awful liquidity trap and printing gazillions of yens to no use, you don't want to be like them.
Only option would be for Germany to print shitload of marks to avoid it raising too much but that would cause bad inflation for Germans. Unless you have deep demographic and demand problems which would lead to an horrible Japan style trap.
Germany is hugely benefiting of the euro and that's common knowledge. You might discuss the benefits of being part of the EU but on the economic plan the euro is a net gain for you.
Adjust law and police forces to match the criminality rises that come with immigration, make immigration easier but just blacklist africa and the middle east forever and ever.
Also eliminate the welfare system to stop the indiscriminate robbery of the middle and upper class
>>56149851
You can't breed till infinity. There are resources and at some point they are exhausted. You have to switch sooner or later. And private pensions will solve it, as you pay for your own generation, you wont have issues with with disparity. The only problem is transition phase.
>>56150124
>Germany is hugely benefiting of the euro and that's common knowledge
It's not even remotely benefiting. We can't even effort to repair our roads anymore as everything goes to others. Read a history book about the expansion of the old German empire and how they solved the problem and how the UK solves the problem. (video related, I won't translate)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mzVWpBc4TVs
Create a new world wide currency headed by United States and Bong Land
>>56150124
I understand tho, this is what most of the economists are saying, also part of the reason why greece was so helpless back then, or more helpless than it would have been if they could have adapt their currency to their needs.
But int is mostly oblivious, you're better off talking with people on reddit than with these memers here
>>56144830
East is not in the eurozone
lay of the weeeeeed brah
>>56150537
Yep, when I see meme-spouting kids like this one
>>56150290
It kinda depress me. Sometimes I wonder what use it is to make elaborate arguments here but I do hope some of it sticks one day.
What really saddens me is how people cannot accept that things aren't black and white. If a thing is bad (nukular energy, GMOs, European union, migrations), it doesn't mean that everything about it is intrinsequely bad.
I understand that younglings are passionate and lack a nuanced view of the world buy it gets frustrating sometimes.
I know that the current afflux of rapefugees is bad and that the commission was wrong about it yet it has nothing to do with the respective merits and effects of the single currency so being yelled at with arguments about it gets old very fast
Same goes for economic theories. When i point that Keynes was spot on on the gold standard and its destructive effect on the world economy does not mean that I advocate for permanent deficits, it has nothing to do with the point at all and I always get surprised at why people would make any connexion at all with these two separate things.
>>56152651
just don't entagle yourself with people who are obviously joking/teasing, if you do find someone who's willing to talk serious ok, but this is a fun site, not let's educate ourselves and change the world
>>56152651
There, I found a video with english auto translation for you, from the official data.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=21oykVBJSp4
>>56152944
>>56152651
There are different attempts. And it seems the EU and Euro is more likely the wrong one.
>>56152651
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V_aN9_IAl1I
