Poles and Italians raging. What's the matter?
They don't realise that sanctions area compromising policy to pay lip services to their vendettas.
>>52404010
everything
>going through all the international waters (longest route possible), just to get all the money
germans are even worse than jews
>>52404169
Circumnavigating Ukraine would actually be the best way to increase European energy security. It means Europe can't get fucked over in supply every time Russia fucks with Ukraine. So that's a good thing.
The gas must flow.
>>52404196
>longest route possible
whats italian beef in this matter? are you got paid by CIA again? or is it just bitching because last BungaBunga party was in Crimea?
>>52404196
Errm Russia is getting all the money as they provide the gas. You don't like, don't buy it.
>>52404248
>Russia fucks with Ukraine
>>52404323
Lots of Italian companies invested in the South Stream, but the EU pressured for it to be canceled because of the sanctions against Russia. On the other hand North Stream, in which German companies invested, was not.
I think it'll be canceled the same way the south stream was... otherwise balkans would seem complete retards.
>>52404422
Gee, it's almost as if the EU was a German scam organization or something.
>>52404367
no one said that in government. but putinbots shill hard with menes.
send us another jet ivan. we will test something ;)
>>52404367
The Russian-Turkish row is the funniest thing in foreign policy since a couple of years. Two authoritarian maniacs who bullied smaller nations for years are now damaging each other because they have to confirm the image they built of themselves while not being able to do anything serious as military action is prevented by the nuclear stalemate. It's hilarious. I hope both go into a spiral of sanctions against each other to damage each other even more.
>>52404422
>Italian companies invested in the South Stream
by all means Italy did nothing to stop EU and americunts crashing the south stream.
>>52404496
go kill yourself shlomo
>>52404513
>Two authoritarian maniacs
stopping to talk with you Shlomo.
>>52404422
>because of the sanctions against Russia
That's just not true. Russia failed to comply to the European Energy Charter as it withdrew its signature in 2009. According to the Charter there may not be a total control of supplier and distributor. It had nothing to do with sanctions. That's the lie Italians tell themselves in order to rage against the German pipeline.
>>52404513
well, I honestly anticipate that both putin and erdogan regimes will fell when the both nation buttmad patrots would realize they won't do a shit because they only can 'talk the talk, but not walk the walk'
>>52404552
Haha, sulking Spätaussiedler deteced. Putin and Erdogan are shitting on their countries to uphold their image of strongmen. It's glorious. I love it.
>>52404606
Indeed. But both hold their population's minds hostage with media control.
Law of inverse relevance: "The less you intend to do about something, the more you have to keep talking about it."
>>52404574
>Russia failed to comply to the European Energy Charter
>Customer
>tells the seller how bring his cake to his home
irony is that Putin made deal with chinese for 100 Dollar a m2 gas and then muricunts dumped the price down to 40 dollars.. kek. at chinese and americans.
>>52404425
The goverments here are full ballless retards indeed.
>>52404616
>Putin and Erdogan are shitting on their countries
rolf kek. nationaler slomo getected.
>>52404676
>Putin made deal with chinese for 100 Dollar a m2 gas
Lol! No deal has been finalized precisely because the Chinese are much harder in price negotiations than small European nations. 100$/m3 is hilarious. Did your handler in the St. Petersburg troll factory tell you to spread this lie to make Europeans jealous?
>>52404705
Hahahaha. Look at this Russiaboo not being able to do anything against the downslide of his favorite country because it's being led by an idiot.
>>52404425
>otherwise balkans would seem complete retards.
balcans who joined amurican slavery are now dumped by green toilet paper dreaming to became new Monaco when going down into total debt. Serbia will getting its gas from Russia now almost for 60% of world market price.
>>52404010
well, some deep draft ships visiting Swinemünde may accidentally break some pipes.
>What can you do?
>>52404796
>Russiaboo
rolf kek. dem denial of east-european plumber..
>>52404425
No, their leaderships are just sellouts who are scamming their population.
>>52404796
How about Jirinovski takes the rule, what will be your excuse then, or the same things will be repeated for any of their leaders by propaganda shills and phobs
>>52404895
well, actually we don't care much whether germany gets monopoly and profit over europe energy supply or not. in fact it's easier to negotiate with single big nation than with numerous tiny ones and besides one cannot have anything done in EU without german approval in the first place.
it's a scam
EU prime ministers don't launch accuses without proper reasons
>>52404705
>Shlomo
But we like Russia and Putin regardless of what the leftist papers say
>>52404010
>having a monopoly inside a monetary union
if EU approves this, it's fucking disgusting
>>52404850
Build a pipeline, while you must indulge in your dreams, apparently.
>>52405552
Can you elaborate?
>>52406339
What monopoly? Gas can come from various sources, including gas terminals for LNG ships. Germany gets some its supply this way via Rotterdam. And Italy has several such terminals, e.g. the Panigaglia LNG Terminal in La Spezia or the Rovigo LNG Terminal in the North Adriatic.
Boy i am glad we are not in the EU.
>>52404923
That's the beauty of it. Nobody has to fear Russia even though by landsmass an resources it's the richest an most powerful country in the world because it has only idiots as leaders and can't get a decent political system.
>>52404422
You cucks need to get out of EU, its doing shit agaisnt ur national interests
>>52407565
>>52407456
>gas comes from russia at price "X"
>passes through germany
>italians pay it "X+epsilon" (epsilon being taken by the germans companies who operate the piping)
>multiply that by all the gas consumed by italy
>germans gets richer on italian money
not even making shit up, this is the reason brought by our prime minister, i hope Tusk does something good for us, EU is a fucking scam
>>52404425
It can't be canceled the same way as South Stream was. Even though Italians claim South Stream was canceled because of sanctions it wasn't. South Stream was canceled because Putin canceled it as it violated the European Energy Charter that says you can't own the distribution when you're the supplier. Gazprom wanted to own the pipeline while being also the one delivering the gas. That violated European law and that's why it couldn't go on like that. Gazprom could have tried to find investors who would have liked to own the pipeline and it would have been okay. But Gazprom didn't because it was Putin who canceled it. Yes, that's right. Not the EU. Putin canceled it, because he didn't want the compromise.
Nord Stream 2 OTOH is owned by a consortium of different European companies, including German and French. That's why it doesn't violate the Charter and the EU sees therefore no reason to have it stopped like South Stream. Putin canceled South Stream because he didn't want to compromise and didn't want to invest further as long as the ownership problem hadn't been solved. He instead tried to act like he was best buddy with Erdogan in order to make Europeans feel bad for themselves. We all know how well that worked out. HAHAHAHA.
Anyone who doesn't think the EU isn't just a means for continuation of German power is a seriously deluded cvck.
Too bad we're a servile nation and won't even take into consideration the idea of opting out.
>>52404676
Customer is king. I know communists have a hard time grasping this concept.
>>52407375
>in your dreams
Gas port was opened moth ago tho
If they make the north stream and not the south stream we'll veto any new sanction on russia
>>52404813
>Serbia will getting its gas from Russia now almost for 60% of world market price.
I really don't get why the Serbs let themselves fuck by Russia all the time. Do they still believe in all that stupid panslavist talk that was only ever a vehicle of Russia's power poltitics? They got nothing but announcements and empty promises like the one you mentioned. The Serbs are actually paying the highest gas prices in Europe. They better hurry joining the EU so Russia can't fuck them so much anymore.
>>52409188
t. Ciro Esposito
>You must implement severe austerity measures to not make the euro look bad, show some solidarity
>You must impose sanctions on Russia and cut your export to one of your biggest trade partners, show some solidarity
>You must accept refugees Germany brought to europe with our promises, show some solidarity
You'd like the gas pipe to run through your countries so you can have a slice? Fuck solidarity and fuck you you eastern european shit eating niggers!!!!!!
I for one can't wait for germany to outright end. It has been a tumor on europe in the past and it still is a tumor.
>>52409256
t.luca
>>52408481
This senpai knows. EU has been trying to just destroy Italian industry since the beginning, while the French and the Germans kept growing
REMOVE ITALY FROM EU
INSTALL AUTHARKY
GO FULL EZRAT CONVERSION ONCE AGAIN
>>52409582
G*rmans get mad as fuck when we cuck them, but think it's hilarious when they fuck other countries over.
Truly the worst people.
>>52408854
Lol. Where does Italy get its gas from right now? You wanna claim Nord Stream 2 makes all previous Italian pipelines and LNG terminals dysfunctional? Because only then there would be a monopoly. If anything Germany would earn a transit fee on those portions that you consume on top of what you're already consuming now. That's not a monopoly. Why is Italy raging so hard?
Besides, nothing stops you from investing in Nord Stream 2, too, and getting your share of the profits. It's already owned by a consortium. The French e.g. are in, too. Apparently they were smarter than you.
Germans are pretty ruthless recently. I wonder if their position in EU is as strong as they imagine.
>>52409006
>inferiority complex
get your shit together, Mario, and make your economy work more efficiently
>>52409746
>amerilard knowing anything about foreign politics
>>52409058
So why is Poland raging against Nord Stream 2 then? It's independent, right?
>>52409106
t. child throwing a temper tantrum because the other kid got cooler toys
>>52410542
I heard about some issues with
>>52404850
+ some eurocommies rage about monopoly
>>52410591
>sanctions against russia is a good thing
oy vey
>>52409301
The reasons you listed are perfect examples why others show no solidarity.
1) Budget deficits are still extremely high, so they only talk of austerity but don't implement it.
2) Sanctions against Russia are the absolute minimal consensus. Some are trying to sabotage them, including Italy. Greece even tried it openly.
3) The others don't accept to share the refugee burden.
So no solidarity on any of the points you mentioned. But everyone happily accepts German paychecks.
>>52410786
>1) Budget deficits are still extremely high, so they only talk of austerity but don't implement it.
We implemented the most severe austerity measures in EU history.
>2) Sanctions against Russia are the absolute minimal consensus. Some are trying to sabotage them, including Italy. Greece even tried it openly.
We fucked our economy up with sanctioning Russia.
>3) The others don't accept to share the refugee burden.
We built a large facility to house more refugees than we could ever be asked to.
>So no solidarity on any of the points you mentioned.
I beg to differ.
>>52409746
Everyone gets mad getting cucked by you. We don't cuck anyone. We just do solid, honest business and our international trade success shows that others like to do business with us.
We also try to uphold the little law that keeps the EU together while others try to break it for purely national gains.
>>52410786
>>52410906
On a side note, Latvia has a massive good goy problem.
People still want to become "western" and "do the right thing" while not realizing the west if corrupt to the fucking core.
>>52410643
Issues with the gas port?
>>52410701
>nothing wrong with breaking the European peace order codified in several of the most important documents of international law
Sure thing, Ghengis
>>52411041
Irrellevant. Germany is merely into sanctions to make the rest of Warsaw Pact shut up.
>>52410906
>We implemented the most severe austerity measures in EU history.
I never meant you guys with that. The people who scream for more and more money while not getting their budget under control are in the south.
>We fucked our economy up with sanctioning Russia.
More like Russia fucked your economy up by not letting agricultural imports from EU in. That's Putin's decision, not the EU's.
>We built a large facility to house more refugees than we could ever be asked to.
As a small country you can do only so much. It's appreciated but hardly helps. Others like Poland or Hungary and even UK or France have shown remarkable reluctance. No comparison between the numbers we took in and them.
>>52411243
Actually no. Merkel is furious at Putin's breach of international law. It's Pandora's box. A really serious issue.
>>52411254
>More like Russia fucked your economy up by not letting agricultural imports from EU in.
This. Most EU sanctions were against oligarchs
>>52411293
>He believes in whatever politicians say.
Don't let her rhetoric blind you. If the rest of Warsaw Pact, you will be pouring even more money into them. Sanctions are just there because one third of the EU sees Russia in one way, another in another way, and the third ones would rather forget about the issue.
>>52411376
>This. Most EU sanctions were against oligarchs
And now we have to export our sprats to places like japan. Want some sprats Poland? And you Germany? No? Fuck.
>>52411450
It's actually you who is blinded by politician's talk. Your politicians tell you sanctioning Russia is bad because you have hardly any economic ties with them. Thus it would be better not to do anything and just lay low. The Easterners who want these sanctions are also the oney most suffering from them. That's how you can see that it's not just rhetoric from their side but actual and honest concern for their security and international security which is jeopardized by Russia breaking the most important international laws.
>>52411598
I don't care. Trying to convince me about the sanctity of politician is a waste of time. I DO NOT believe in such things in politics. It always the same. Managements of irrational hatred into tangential and obscure objectives.
On Polish side the is caused by the pipe blocking one of our major ports and you guys are consequently ignoring us on that matter. There will be trouble if you guys don't do anything.
>Germans want other countries to stop being reliant on Russian gas
>meanwhile they secure cheap energy for themselves through the Nord stream
I wouldn't be surprised if we were already in some sort of secret deal with Russia, at this point following the EU is just for supreme cucks
>>52411534
don't know anything about Latvian economy but here it's not a first time Russia embargo'd some stuff. And after all it wasn't big catastrophe. Let's face it Russian economy is deeply connected to current tzar, and we should look for more stable markets
>>52411376
Only first (crimean) sanctions were against personalities, latest (MH17) sanctions are sectoral.
>>52411820
>sectoral
It only seems like that because the oligarchs control whole branches in your economy.
>>52404169
are you 10?
>>52410786
>But everyone happily accepts German paychecks.
a couple of days ago Renzi said openly to Merkel: "don't act like you are giving blood to the other nations"
is it clear or not, that germany has the one that gained the most out of this """"""union"""""?
>>52411696
>Trying to convince me about the sanctity of politician
Nobody does that. Being for sanctions doesn't make it wrong just because our politicians happen to want santions, too. Being anti just for the sake of being anti without regard to the topic and its facts is stupidity2
>>52411702
First time I hear about this. Can you give me a link that's in English or German?
>>52411820
Also this. Sanctions were a joke until the whole MH17. The more serious ones only get passed by popular demand after the outrage over MH17, not out ideological conviction anything.
This kind of shit makes me fucking hate Germany.
>>52411707
It's called diversification. Some countries get 100% if their gas from Russia. So they're in a prime position to get cucked. Getting a third of one's gas from Russia is no problem. In this case Russia cannot use gas for blackmail.
>>52404010
>Szczecin
>>52412071
Is it clear or not that Germany is the biggest creditor? A union, like a trade, is always for the mutual benefit. If it weren't it simply wouldn't take place. So pointing out the obvious doesn't constitute an argument.
>>52412211
i'm sure germany will blackmail in some years.
already happened during Berlusconi, Monti and Letta, i will not be surprised if it happens again
>>52412314
How so? The pipeline is owned by private investors not by a country.
>>52412373
it's an infrastructure, like a railway, or a road.
whatever passes through, it pays
see >>52408854
i wonder how much money is worth the businnes of the infrastructure industry
>>52412527
It's owned by investors not a country. How can there be blackmail? A French company invested in it, too. Why didn't the Italians? Why this childish rage?
>>52412615
ENI is one of the main contractors of the Nord Stream, but that's not the point
>>52412952
So explain then how Germany is gonna blackmail Italy when Nord Stream 2 is owned by private people from different countries.
>>52412998
Germans will benefit from cheap Russian gas coming directly to their country, meanwhile all the southern countries will have to buy the same gas at an higher price
>>52413063
That's called a transit fee and it is normal. After all the cost of the infrastructure and the energy it takes to transport the gas through the pipelines must be met. Of course there are profits involved. These go to the owners who are, as I explained multiple times already, private people from five different countries. How does that mean Germany is gonna blackmail Italy? You're just evading the question because you can't aswer it as there's no such possibility. You're just parroting Renzi in his counterfactual rant.
>>52413204
Germany has opposed the south stream, but for some reason the north stream is legit.
You can't have sanctions and trade at the same time, hence Renzi's complaint.
>>52413289
The EU has opposed South Stream because it violated European law which states that supplier and distributor can't be the same. It has nothing to do with sanctions as Renzi tries to imply. Nobody forced the South Stream proponents to not look at what the Eurpean law says. Nobody stopped them from forming a private consortium like the Nord Stream owners.
And you still didn't answer how Germany is gonna blackmail Italy.
>>52413289
>>52413414
And btw the EU didn't really oppose South Stream. It just put it on hold because of its violation of the European Energy Charter. It was then Putin who actually terminated it.
>>52412079
Smoke and Mirrors. Sanctions have been introduced, and going to last for a while, because they are in the middle of the road between the various blocks within the EU menacing with pulling it apart. Eastern members would like to see more EU's money being poured into them and Ukraine as getting paid for military reforms. Other members of the EU wants absolutely nothing to do with Ukraine and the East, and view it as an utter waste of resources and a distraction from far more pressing issues such as sick economies, refugees and terrorism. Don't pretend that there is some kind enlightened purpose for what it is just a management of the inherent divisions within the EU with me.
>>52404010
>>52404010
Don't forget to cry about solidarity in EU when you take too much shitskins.
You fucking Alan piece of shit.
>>52413787
>in the middle of the road between the various blocks within the EU
Yeah the block in the West who couldn't care less because there's buffer states in between who they don't care about and because trade with Russia is limited. And the block in the East who are really honestly concerned about their security and are therefore willing to put sanctions on Russia even thought they're the ones in the EU suffering most from them. So your narrative that politicians talking in favor of sanctions do so for some bullshit reason is just wrong. It's the Western EU countries who spout out the bullshit because for them there's no gain in showing Russia that its actions are wrong.
I never denied the divide in the EU in this matter. But you were the one claiming the pro sanctions people were dishonest. It's actually the other way round.
>>52413879
>Don't forget to cry about solidarity in EU when you take too much shitskins.
Are we actually getting any in this matter?
See...?
>>52414153
You build Nord Stream long before you asked for our help. Where was that solidarity?
You're building the second one now.
>>52414078
You are ignoring the part of wanting fixing real problems within the EU instead of agitating some faraway ghost from the times of the Cold War.
>>52414229
And this thread is abouth Nord Stream 2. Solidarity is pic related.
>>52414412
Is source of this image from Martin Schulz's ass?
EU is the same as Soviet Union.
>>52414399
See? You're the one parroting politicians. Those politicians who head the Western unconcerned block. So you don't get to complain about alleged dishonesty of pro sanctions people.
>>52414412
>you took the monies so shut the fuck up slave
Beside, we must repay it so don't think it's a gift or smth
>>52414468
>Is source of this image from Martin Schulz's ass?
The source is right below the chart. Didn't know Polish schools don't teach basic reading skills.
>EU is the same as Soviet Union.
Yeah right. That's why all the business people wanted to flee the SU and want to get access to the EU.
>>52414566
>Didn't know Polish schools don't teach basic reading skills.
Your education doesn't even come close to our level, so shut up.
>>52414523
>we must repay it
What part of 'net receipt' didn't you comprehend?
>>52414593
Have you found it yet or do you need help by an uneducated German?
>>52414603
Ain't EU have the law that after some time country is obliged to give more monies than it receives ?
>>52414667
No, the net receipts are indeed like a gift. It's like affirmative action from the strong countries for the poor countries.
>>52414468
>EU is the same as Soviet Union.
mfw
>>52414728
So what's the problem? Your companies in return pay lower taxes than polish ones. You basically bought majority of factories after `89.
Anyway
>Why are poles buttmad about Nord Stream?
>Because...
>OMG we are giving you monies and you dare to have opinion?
Thread derailed fast
Evil country strikes again!
>>52415000
What do taxes have to do with intra-EU solidarity?
>derailed fast
I wasn't the one starting the solidarity argument. I just showed that your reasoning is flawed.
>>52415201
I wasn't either. There are different posters here, you know mr Ubermensch.
And what EU net receipt have to do with solidarity? This is "remember 6 gorillion" tier argument
This shitstorm is about Russian embargos. Whole eastern europe get fucked by them. Majority of people don't want it. But whatever EU tells us to go through this together, and we did.
Then out of nowhere Berlin started to discuss business with Russia. We feel betrayed.
And your media tell us to shut up because remember 6 gorillion $ subhuman.
Thread derailed fast, because you asked for our opinion, but thread turned into shitposting instead
The thing is -
I'M RIGHT ABOUT THIS AND YOU ARE ALSO RIGHT ABOUT THIS. This discussion ain't taking us nowhere
>>52415753
>There are different posters here
Well then direct your 'thread derailed' critique to the other Pole who started the solidarity argument.
>And what EU net receipt have to do with solidarity?
Simple: You're getting money for free because we're good to you and recognize that you need to grow faster in order to close the gap in the standard of living compared to us. That's us being solidaric with you. We could instead not care about the difference in standard of living and use that money for ourselves. But we don't because of solidarity.
>This shitstorm is about Russian embargos
>Majority of people don't want it
Got any polls to back that claim up? My impression was that it was especially the Easterners who wish a stronger stance against Russia. In any case it would be a beef you people had with your politicians. Nothing to do with Germany or Nord Stream 2. Germany is trying to moderate between different positions on the sanctions issue and Nord Stream 2 has nothing to do with sanctions whatsoever.
>out of nowhere Berlin started to discuss business with Russia.
Where did you get the impression that the sanctions aim at stopping business with Russia? The sanctions are very mild and specifically targeted against the Russian oligarchic elite that supports Putin. The trade sanctions that forbid you to export agricultural goods to Russia are not EU sanctions. Those are sanctions of Putin. So you have to complain about him, not Germany or Nord Stream 2.
>And your media tell us to shut up because remember 6 gorillion $ subhuman.
Straight up stupidity. So not even worth dealing with.
>Thread derailed fast, because you asked for our opinion, but thread turned into shitposting instead
It's shitposting to show that the assertions of solidarity by that other Pole are wrong? Listing facts is shitposting?
>This discussion ain't taking us nowhere
If you think this and still participate in it you must have some other reason for participation. What is it?
>>52409205
Source amigo.
Serbia is extremely isolated in Europe. Russia likely provides gas for less than Serbia's neighbors would because of politics.
>>52411254
So Russia should just accept sanctions without a response? You are getting cause and effect mixed up.
>>52417117
"As shown on the website www.trademap.org, the world’s most reliable information base for foreign trade, Serbia paid $720 per 1,000 cubic meters of gas last year, which is significantly more than the average price other European countries, such as Germany, Austria, France and the Netherlands are paying. The average price of Russian gas to those countries last year was $574 for 1,000 cubic meters, almost one third lower than the price that Serbia is paying."
-- http://www.slobodnaevropa.org/content/why-does-serbia-pay-the-highest-price-for-russian-gas/26553217.html
>>52417354
It should not invade other countries and annex clay. You are getting cause and effect mixed up.
